WSJ Opinion: welfare state failure

[Dave Schwartz]

http://www.opinionjournal.com/columnists/bminiter/?id=110007250


LBJ's Other Quagmire
Long before Katrina, the welfare state failed New Orleans's poor.

BY BRENDAN MINITER
Tuesday, September 13, 2005 12:01 a.m. EDT


"What the American people have seen in this incredible disparity in which those people who had cars and money got out, and those people who were impoverished died."
The above comment about Hurricane Katrina comes to us from Ted Kennedy, who went on to say that the question for Chief Justice-designate John Roberts is whether he stands for "a fairer, more just nation" or will use "narrow, stingy interpretations of the law to frustrate progress." But why stop there? Sen. Kennedy is onto something and, indeed, the question isn't only for Judge Roberts. It's also one for the national debate now under way in the wake of the most devastating hurricane to hit the U.S. in decades.

[Tor Ekman]

Good ol' Sen. Ted, fighting the fight against "sink or swim" Social Darwinism.

"What the American people have seen in this incredible disparity in which those people who had cars and money got out, and those people who were impoverished died."
Kind of like how those who could swim, and then hide out for days behind a battalion of lawyers and press flaks, could survive driving off a bridge while those who could not drowned to death.

[Bobby]

I used to live in Lake Charles, LA. Its about 2 1/2 hrs west of NO, and I will say one thing. Its out of control down there - the welfare state. Although I believe in the govt helping people especially those who are sincerely disabled or those children whose dads die, I am not for paying for all these women and deadbeat dads having 10 kids each. Its just amazing down there. So many single moms. And very little accountability.

[boxcar]

And the only solutions Libs will offer is the tired old refrain of "well, things aren't good as they could be because we need to pour more money into welfare programs. Just like more money, for endless decades, has been poured into the public school education system, yet all the system is able to turn out in too many cases are dumbed down kids.

According to one lib professor (God help us when one of these "enlightened" ones speak) the reason we have so much poverty in this country is because "monied America lacks moral goodness" (something along the lines of thought of what Suff posted recently on another thread.) What follows is a Neal Boortz commentary that on online buddy sent to me to refute this airheads's premise.

******************

INSIDE THE DARK AND DEPRAVED MIND OF A LIBERAL

Many people from many walks of life have been opining on Hurricane Katrina and its aftermath. We've heard from the likes of Sean Penn and Michael Moore. Robert Kennedy Jr. weighed in to blame Haley Barbour for the whole mess. Katrina, it seems, was born of the failure of the Mississippi governor to single-handedly arrange for the ratification of the hideously flawed Kyoto accords. Aging hippie Nancy Pelosi says its all George Bush's fault, and the NAACP, after having nothing to say following four Florida hurricanes in 2004, is demanding that the Katrina victims get the same cash payments as did the families of the victims of 9/11.

Nowhere, though, will you find a more screwed-up train of thought (if that's what you want to call it) than in this letter which appeared in the Saturday edition of Atlanta's burden, the Atlanta Journal-Constitution:

Monied America lacks moral goodness [bugmenot]

Congratulations, monied America: You wanted your gated communities to keep out the poor, to protect yourselves from crime, to separate yourselves from undesirables. You took the high roads and built your gated communities on them so you would stay dry and clean while the stormwaters of filth and despair flooded their neighborhoods.

You did it. You kept out the poor, you concentrated the crime in the poor neighborhoods, effectively ensuring those neighborhoods would remain poor and broken. You separated yourselves from the undesirables.
And then you left them, to die in attics and on rooftops and in the streets and in the disgusting halls of commerce and sports. The richest nation in the world is the most destitute when it comes to true moral goodness. God could not bless this America at all.

SAM MARIE ENGLE
OK ... we're going to give Engle a pass for misspelling "moneyed" and for her failure to realize that "storm waters" are two words. It goes with the territory. And just what territory might that be, you ask? Well, from reading her screed, haven't you already guessed that Sam Marie Engle stalks the halls of academia? Engle is the director of something called the Kenneth Cole Fellowship in Community Building and Social Change and is the senior program associate in the Office of University-Community Partnerships at Emory University. Emory. That says a lot.

Now let's deal with Engle's rant.

Obviously Engle has a problem with achievement. In a word, she harbors great resentment toward those who have gone the extra mile to achieve success and wealth. Somehow she has convinced herself that the problems that afflicted the poor in New Orleans were due to the existence of gated communities and the presence of the evil rich. If there had been no wealthy neighborhoods in New Orleans the poor, somehow, wouldn't have suffered.

Engle also finds great fault with the idea that people would go to extra lengths to protect themselves from crime. How hideously insensitive of the rich! How very un-American! No doubt were we to locate Ms. Engle's automobile wherever it is parked while she is out there community-building, we would find it to be unlocked; ditto for her home. After all, Engle certainly wouldn't want to do anything to protect herself from crime, would she? That would be a certain indicator of a complete lack of moral goodness on her part. Furthermore, when Engle finally moves on to her well-deserved retirement (and it can't be soon enough) I'm certain that she is going to build her retirement home in a flood zone rather than seek higher and safer ground. After all, if a flood were to occur Ms. Engle wouldn't want to be accused by anyone of actually using her wealth and power of choice wisely in selecting a building location. It's all about demonstrating moral goodness, and you can't demonstrate moral goodness making wise and safe choices in your personal life.

Actually, Engle's letter to the AJC editor is a literary achievement seldom matched in our age. How one woman can get so many things wrong with so few words is something that philosophers and scholars in logic will be studying for years to come.

Shall we do a little picking apart?

Engle feels that the evil rich "kept out the poor" from their high-and-dry gated communities. Sorry, Sam, the poor weren't "kept out" of those gated communities; they just failed to make the decisions in life that would have gained them access. The rich did nothing to them. They did it to themselves. It wasn't the evil rich who decided that the poor would ignore the educational opportunities available to all in America, rich and poor alike. Rich people don't teach poor young blacks that learning is a "white thing." It wasn't some rich family living in their gated community that decided that a poor woman was going to have a child she could not afford to raise at 18, then another at 20 and a third at 21. It wasn't "monied America" that made the choice for the poor that living on the taxpayer's teat was a far more desirable way of life than developing a work ethic and putting it to use in our opportunity-rich free market economy.

And here's something else for you to ponder as you light those votives under your Che Guevara poster, Ms. Engle: It won't be the poor who rebuild those New Orleans neighborhoods, and it won't be the poor who come back to the Big Easy to invest and to provide the job opportunities that some, but certainly not all, of the poor might seek.

Also, Ms. Engle, can you tell us just how those wicked rich people managed to "concentrate(d) the crime in the poor neighborhoods"? Is it because they take precautions to keep the crime out of their neighborhoods? Well, excuse the hell out of them! How dare they sit there in their fancy homes and not accept willingly their fair share of crime? Maybe we need some new kind of bussing program. That can be your next letter to the editor, Ms. Engle; a demand that some court order the bussing of petty thieves, burglars, rapists and murderers to gated communities so that the rich can enjoy the benefits of the culture of predatory crime together with the poor. The culture of the law-abiding should be forced to mingle with the culture of the lawless, don't you think? Isn't that part and parcel of the liberal mantra of multiculturalism?

And now, Ms. Engle, I need to take the gloves off for a moment, you supercilious jerk. How dare you say that "you left them, to die in attics and on rooftops and in the streets and in the disgusting halls of commerce and sports?" You sure told us a lot about yourself with that sentence, didn't you? Commerce is disgusting? This is the label you attach to the one economic system that has lifted more people out of poverty than any other system in the history of civilization? Disgusting? But then, you work in the academic world, don't you? One wonders if you have a job skill that could earn you a comfortable living in the private sectors. My guess would be that you do not.

"Left them to die?" What in the hell are you talking about? When police and firefighters, the fantastic first-responders we all rely on, went in to rescue the stranded they were fired on by roving gangs of thugs from the poor neighborhoods you so love “ and this started happening on day one. Nurses and doctors (who very well may have lived in gated communities) stayed on duty in their hospitals moving their patients to ever-high floors as the looters and predators worked their way up from below. Helicopters trying to evacuate patients from hospitals and from the Super Dome were fired upon. Left them to die? These people were risking death to rescue the poor, and you write that the poor were left to die?

Then you say that "the richest nation in the world is the most destitute when it comes to true moral goodness." You mindless, hate-filled leftist, anti-capitalist gasbag. Katrina has brought forth the greatest show of American generosity since 9/11. Many believe that the charitable contributions of Americans will far surpass that of four years ago. From the very day that Katrina hit New Orleans people of means from across the country were writing checks, making pledges and taking action. The total giving to date is nearing $800 million, and will most likely surpass one billion dollars within a week's time. This is the America, an America of compassion and giving, that you say God would not bless.

Oddly enough, though, I do want to thank you for your letter to the editor, Ms. Engle. You have done more to demonstrate the moral decadence of the left with your pompous diatribe then I could hope to do with five years of talking about your type on the radio.

Please keep writing your anti-individualist rants. You're the best thing the right has going out there.

AND MOST AMERICANS CAN'T SEE THROUGH THIS?
Now ... think back. Who were the first people to the microphones to start assigning blame for the Katrina disaster. That answer would be Democrats. And who were the Democrats blaming? Anyone Republican, that's who. Louisiana Governor Kathleen Blanco and New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin were virtually immune to any criticisms from Democrats in Washington.
Now here's the best part. The Democrats manage to sharply divide the country with their finger pointing, and then they come up for a solution to that division. (Oh this is rich.) The left's solution to the divide that they caused with their hysterical finger-pointing is for George Bush to (1) appoint a Supreme Court Justice who is "mainstream" (as defined by Democrats) so that the appointment won't cause any rancor on Capitol Hill; and (2) abandon any plans for making the tax cuts permanent or for the repeal of the death tax.
Wonderful -- just wonderful. These Democrats bring this country to turmoil with their "blame Bush" hysterics, then tell Bush that the way to bring the country back together again is to raise taxes and appoint a liberal to the Supreme Court. What gall.

***************

Boxcar

[Secretariat]

I used to live in Lake Charles, LA. Its about 2 1/2 hrs west of NO, and I will say one thing. Its out of control down there - the welfare state. Although I believe in the govt helping people especially those who are sincerely disabled or those children whose dads die, I am not for paying for all these women and deadbeat dads having 10 kids each. Its just amazing down there. So many single moms. And very little accountability.

Just curious Bobby. What would you propose we as a society do with people in those situations? Cause there was a heckuva LOT more people in poverty prior to welfare ever existing. Read some James Agee or the prevailing wage in the early 1900s or 18th century.

[Turntime]

Some interesting welfare stats. Louisiana welfare recipients by percentage of population stands at approx 1.7%. Compare this to New York and California at a whopping 3.5%. The lowest in The Nation is Idaho at less than 2/10 of 1%. The highest is The District of Columbia at 7.6%. How Ironic.

Welfare is a crock a bull. Rather than helping people in the long run it seems to have the opposite effect.

My stats are a few years old, I stand corrected if anyone has more accurate and up to date figures.

[ljb]

I was wondering, rather then have to scroll down through pages of blather by boxcar, should we just all put him on ignore ? ;)

[NoDayJob]

Ah yes, what is needed is mo' money. Mo' money and less work, will solve all of the world's problems. Mo' money fo' da teechers who are turning out stoodents who can't read or write; mo' money fo' da attorneys who sue at the drop of a hat; mo' money fo' youse and meese so we can lay on our 6120 4211314 11212519 and watch TV all day. Dat'al fix everything. Come on now, reach deep and pony up. Mo' taxes please. My neighbors can afford it. They work all day and drive a SUV. :liar:

NDJ [AKA Troll #1]

[Bobby]

Just curious Bobby. What would you propose we as a society do with people in those situations? Cause there was a heckuva LOT more people in poverty prior to welfare ever existing. Read some James Agee or the prevailing wage in the early 1900s or 18th century.


What would I propose to do? I think welfare-to-work by Clinton was a good start. Those people in NO whose houses were destroyed, they're gonna be getting new houses bought and pd for by us the taxpayers. Should they? I donno. The bank forces me to get flood insurance and I don't really live in a flood plain. On the other hand, the govt should have made damn sure a long time ago that something like that flood - where 90% of a huge city is flooded - never happened.

South Louisiana is like single moms and deadbeat dads & it ain't ever gonna change. I knew a couple of guys with 10 kids that terminated (gave up their rights. don't have to pay child support and can't see them) to all of them and wanted more. That shouldn't be allowed to do that b/c those moms then get those "crazy" checks or whatever there called at our expense. So a lot of fraud in that system.

If someone is legitamitely disabled, then they should get a check.
If someone is unemployed, then they should get unemployment. I say for at least 8 months.

[schweitz]

Welfare is a crock a bull. Rather than helping people in the long run it seems to have the opposite effect.



It's the racism of low expectations.

[Big Bill]

I was wondering, rather then have to scroll down through pages of blather by boxcar, should we just all put him on ignore ? ;)

ljb,

Your trivializing Boxcar's post is so like you and your fellow lefties when it comes to anyone expressing their political opinion(s) whenever they they do not fit your political beliefs.

Up until now I have not bothered to jump in and post my opinions but just read and try to appreciate what both sides have to say. But after your snide comment on Boxcar's post, I'm going to post what I feel about you and your fellow lefties on this board.

I think this country is quickly dividing between the left and the right more than ever, aided I suppose, by the Katrina disaster. Much of the blame for this goes to those on the left, who can't stand the fact that they are no longer the "power" in this country. Instead, those on the left, including much of the media, have elected to jump on every political and tragic event that bolster support for themselves rather than show the true American spirit of pulling together.

I think you and your liberal buddies are no different than the Sunnis, who have elected to withdraw from reality rather than participate in the democratization of Iraq.

If the liberals in this country, like the Sunnis, can't have their way, they will do everything in their power to disrupt the normal flow of events. So, you libs and the Sunnis both go ahead and pout and see how far this helps you achieve your goals.

I guess this post will generate a response from ljb, sec, et al, so blast away!

Big Bill

[Secretariat]

What would I propose to do? I think welfare-to-work by Clinton was a good start. Those people in NO whose houses were destroyed, they're gonna be getting new houses bought and pd for by us the taxpayers. Should they? I donno. The bank forces me to get flood insurance and I don't really live in a flood plain. On the other hand, the govt should have made damn sure a long time ago that something like that flood - where 90% of a huge city is flooded - never happened.

South Louisiana is like single moms and deadbeat dads & it ain't ever gonna change. I knew a couple of guys with 10 kids that terminated (gave up their rights. don't have to pay child support and can't see them) to all of them and wanted more. That shouldn't be allowed to do that b/c those moms then get those "crazy" checks or whatever there called at our expense. So a lot of fraud in that system.

If someone is legitamitely disabled, then they should get a check.
If someone is unemployed, then they should get unemployment. I say for at least 8 months.

Well, Bobbi, as Turntime says the welfare rate in New Orleans was 1.9%, below many state, in fact I'd bet it is below the national average. So we're talking of 1 out of 50 people on welfare. The right would like you to believe that this is a product of a liberal welfare state. Truth is many of those people may very well have been hard working people, perhaps working two or three jobs to get by. Working harder than ever for less. We don't know. It's easy to point at poor people and assume welfare. it's a cheap shot with no proof. Were people polled in the Superdome to ask who was on welfare and who wasn't?

Now as to the deadbat dad issue. I worked in child support for a time. Let me tell you it ain't pretty whether they are on welfare or not. First off welfare recipeints receive such a pittance, beleive me it is not like they are making out like bandits, quite the contrary, it is barely survival money. As to the deadbeat dad issue, many are in prison. When you lock up someone, guess what, they don't pay support because there is no income. The child suffers as a result. Would you let the child die because the state refuses to step in? This flies in the face of the entire child support system which is that decisions are based on the best interests of the child. So now you have a single mother who has children to raise, but how can she work if she makes only minimum wage and her day care costs or babysitting costs are higher than her minimum wage?

Because those represent a LOT of the welfare to work jobs. Sounds great, but most pay peanuts. Rick Santorum says women should stay home to take care of thier kids. How do you stay home if you've got to work three jobs to survive? Its a cycle that eventually leads to crime or delinquency

So again, if welfare to work is taking single mothers away from thier children so they can subsist...what as a society do we do for these people?

The options are:

1. Nothing. Let relatives or friends or charities help them. Whatever happens to them will happen. It's not our responsibility. If they turn to crime imprison them and then then we'll pay about $62,000 a person per year to monitor.

2. Continue the current process of giving the lowest possible entitlement to them, and attempt to find them minimum wage jobs, which then confronts Santorum's complaint that mothers aren't at home with their kids -can't work multiple jobs and keep your eyes on a bunch of restless kids. Besides jobs are tight. Most unskilled labor jobs are now heading overseas. How do we know these people can be placed?

3. Execute people who earn below a certain amount.

4. Sterilize women who are below the poverty level and having kids. Put the kids in Foster Care and let the govt. pick up the revenue that way.

See Bobby, the solution is very complex, especially as poverty grows, and it has grown every quarter UNDER this President. Let me repeat that. EVERY QUARTER of his presidency the poverty rate has grown.

So, still looking for solutions. Until someone can offer a solution, it's a bit irresponsible to blame the so-called welfare state. But Bobby, they won't offer solutions. They'll just throw a few slogans because honestly, they don't live with poor people. They're on a different planet from the neighborhoods they live in.

[Secretariat]

ljb,

I guess this post will generate a response from ljb, sec, et al, so blast away!

Big Bill

Sure will. Big Bill, your posts have always been just a little to the left of Boxcar so no big surprise you equate a liberal perspective with Sunnis. So if liberals are like the Sunnis, does that make a conservative like Boxcar an Islamic Shiite?

[lsbets]

Big Bill, your posts have always been just a little to the left of Boxcar

Huh? Where did you come up with that? Attack, attack, attack - you just can't stand it when people point out your rabid partisanship.

[JustRalph]

Ah yes, what is needed is mo' money. Mo' money and less work, will solve all of the world's problems. Mo' money fo' da teechers who are turning out stoodents who can't read or write; mo' money fo' da attorneys who sue at the drop of a hat; mo' money fo' youse and meese so we can lay on our 6120 4211314 11212519 and watch TV all day. Dat'al fix everything. Come on now, reach deep and pony up. Mo' taxes please. My neighbors can afford it. They work all day and drive a SUV. :liar:

NDJ [AKA Troll #1]

Read this again and think of Chris Rock saying it..........is that where it came from? It sounds familiar

[JustRalph]

Bill, Great post.........tell it like it is.


Box......... I am gonna print your post and hang it in my office.........

Great Post!

[JustRalph]

Sec, tell me what you think the recipe for becoming one of these poor people is? No diploma? Little education (secondary etc) Terrible home life ? Fill me in? What causes these people to be who they are........?

You posted a response that is nothing but excuses for the poor.........

[Blackgold]

You can go into any of the many neighboorhood groceries in the New Orleans area and see people using their Welfare debit card.

What's galling is, you'll often see someone pilling on the counter chips, ice cream, candy and soft drinks- and paying for it with their Welfare debit card.

And the country doesn't seem to have a clue as to why diabetes is increasing among certain ethnic populations.

Everything is broken.

[Secretariat]

Huh? Where did you come up with that? Attack, attack, attack - you just can't stand it when people point out your rabid partisanship.

Isbets,

I am not goingto sit passively by when someone makes a comment to me like this:

"I think you and your liberal buddies are no different than the Sunnis"

"I guess this post will generate a response from ljb, sec, et al, so blast away!"

Basically, Big Bill ws directly taunting me, and was begging for a response. The one being "attacked" was me.

Imagine your response if I came out and in my first post in the thread accused or Jr or Big Bill of being Sunnis.

Talk about rabid partisanship. You'll defend any right wing attack on someone who tilts to the left here, but let a left winger even respond to being attacked, and they're a "rabid partisan".

As Stoessel says, give me a break.

[Secretariat]

Sec, tell me what you think the recipe for becoming one of these poor people is? No diploma? Little education (secondary etc) Terrible home life ? Fill me in? What causes these people to be who they are........?

You posted a response that is nothing but excuses for the poor.........

What is the recipe for these people being poor? At this point I could offer a variety of reasons, but you'd most likely all reject them out of turn.

The larger issue is "what" do you do with what you currently have. If, as outlined here, that it is the result of a "failed welfare state", not one solution has been proposed other than Bobby's expansion of Clinton's welfare to work program, and some of the options I outlined.

What we have is an increase in poverty every quarter since GW took office. Whatever the cause, we have it, hos do you deal with it? Well, we need to examine first is a) WHY is the poverty rate increasing? And we could have a thread just on that.

I'll offer three ideas as to why?

1. Lack of educational capability. (notice I didn't say opportuinities here) Some people simply don't get integrated calculus. They never will. They do not have the skills to get good paying jobs in the work place. This country was at one time primarily a blue collar manufacturing country. now, we don't make anything, and blue collar jobs have exported to other countries for lower wages to increase companies bottom lines. Problem is that those jobs were jobs that a higher education degree was not necessary. Textiles is a prime example. Now with those low skill jobs fewer, and requiring workers to have more than one to get by, there is less opportunity for the poor to climb out of it.

2. Deficits. Deficits weaken the strength of the american economy slowing down the number of new jobs created. They also push inflation because it eventually weaknes the dollar.

3. Outsourcing - I hit upon this in the blue collar comments of the first option creating less living wage jobs for blue collar workers. However, outsourcing is taking its toll on IT jobs (as well as service jobs), and eventually will hit other industries as well such as medicine. In fact it already is a bit.

Those are just three. I did not list racism, but I think it plays a role as well. Why else would we assume that welfare is responsible for all those people at the convention center, especially in lieu of Turntime's revelation that NO had a relatively low overall welfare rate 1.9%. If those were all white faces with white babies, would we assume the welfare had failed? I don't think so.

Anyway, back to my question: what would the right do with the current people on welfare, and what is their solution to perpetual poverty during this adminstration?

[Secretariat]

You can go into any of the many neighboorhood groceries in the New Orleans area and see people using their Welfare debit card.

What's galling is, you'll often see someone pilling on the counter chips, ice cream, candy and soft drinks- and paying for it with their Welfare debit card.

And the country doesn't seem to have a clue as to why diabetes is increasing among certain ethnic populations.

Everything is broken.

So are you asserting that people on welfare should be prohiibited from purchasing chips, and ice cream. It certainly would be easy to add that to law. So if a purchase occurs and someone bought a soft drink, they'd have to pay cash for it. Is that the solution?

[Tom]

Originally Posted by ljb
I was wondering, rather then have to scroll down through pages of blather by boxcar, should we just all put him on ignore ? ;)



I highly reccomned it. I hav e YOU on it and only have to endure snipets from your vast arsenal of blarney.

Since I have you here on a welfare thread, let me ask you why you are not speaking out about the quagmire we are in in the War on Poverty. We entered that war with no exit strategy and have spend trillions of dollars on it to no avail. Our grandchilder will be paying off this liberal atrocity.

[ljb]

ljb,

Your trivializing Boxcar's post is so like you and your fellow lefties when it comes to anyone expressing their political opinion(s) whenever they they do not fit your political beliefs.

Up until now I have not bothered to jump in and post my opinions but just read and try to appreciate what both sides have to say. But after your snide comment on Boxcar's post, I'm going to post what I feel about you and your fellow lefties on this board.

I think this country is quickly dividing between the left and the right more than ever, aided I suppose, by the Katrina disaster. Much of the blame for this goes to those on the left, who can't stand the fact that they are no longer the "power" in this country. Instead, those on the left, including much of the media, have elected to jump on every political and tragic event that bolster support for themselves rather than show the true American spirit of pulling together.

I think you and your liberal buddies are no different than the Sunnis, who have elected to withdraw from reality rather than participate in the democratization of Iraq.

If the liberals in this country, like the Sunnis, can't have their way, they will do everything in their power to disrupt the normal flow of events. So, you libs and the Sunnis both go ahead and pout and see how far this helps you achieve your goals.

I guess this post will generate a response from ljb, sec, et al, so blast away!

Big Bill

Big Bill,
I would urge you to read all of Boxcar's posts. Appearently you have a lot of spare time. If someone cannot make a point in one page they are not very bright.

[ljb]

Originally Posted by ljb
I was wondering, rather then have to scroll down through pages of blather by boxcar, should we just all put him on ignore ? ;)



I highly reccomned it. I hav e YOU on it and only have to endure snipets from your vast arsenal of blarney.

Since I have you here on a welfare thread, let me ask you why you are not speaking out about the quagmire we are in in the War on Poverty. We entered that war with no exit strategy and have spend trillions of dollars on it to no avail. Our grandchilder will be paying off this liberal atrocity.
Kind of like the war on drugs don't you think? Or Bush's medicare law.

[boxcar]

I was wondering, rather then have to scroll down through pages of blather by boxcar, should we just all put him on ignore ? ;)

You couldn't ignore me if you wanted to. You know I'm the only human being who stands between you and the 2,000-foot precipice that you keep eyeing.

Boxcar

[boxcar]

[QUOTE=Big Bill]ljb,

I think you and your liberal buddies are no different than the Sunnis, who have elected to withdraw from reality rather than participate in the democratization of Iraq.

What a fantastic analogy! Why didn't I think of that one? :D

Boxcar

[boxcar]

Bill, Great post.........tell it like it is.


Box......... I am gonna print your post and hang it in my office.........

Great Post!

Better yet, JR, drop a little note to Boortz. I'm sure he'd appreciate it.

Boortz had this little follow-up today on his site:

**************

MORE ON SAM MARIE ENGLE

I'm very gratified by the fantastic email response I received about Monday's rant on the musings of Emory academician Sam Marie Engle. In truth I can say that Web Guy hasn't forwarded one single email taking me to task for taking her to task --- and believe me, if the negative emails were there, Web Guy would make sure that I saw them.

One Nuze reader sent a copy of Engle's letter to the editor and my response to a professor friend of his at an Eastern University. His professor friend responded with an email that I think pretty well opens the door into the minds of people like Sam Marie Engle. Here's the response. I believe that it is one of the most brilliant explanations I have ever read on what happens to someone who decides to make the university their career ... I thought you might like to read it:

Dear ____________

The source of "Sam Engel's" dissatisfaction is one of those things that I think few people have considered. Professors are a relatively small minority of the population and few people think about their oddity. Academic accomplishment in no way relates to being well-adjusted or happy. There are lots of horribly unhappy people teaching at Universities. Universities attract people who are good at school (period). Being good at school takes a real enough but usually a very small talent. All those A's earned through their young lives encourage such people to remain at school, getting more A's and more degrees and signing on for teaching jobs (whether they are any good at teaching or not). They have fantasies of their own importance, leading rich careers of writing important books or doing important research, living out their days in cultivated leisure.

But something, inevitably, goes awry. By the time they turn 40, they notice the students aren't terribly appreciative, the important books haven't been written, the teaching begins to feel repetitive, the collegiality in the department isn't anywhere what they hoped for (they usually want lots of admiring friends who will flatter them a lot--kind of like all those A's they earned in school). Meanwhile, their classmates "back when" who usually got B's in school are driving around in Mercedes, buying million-dollar beachfront properties, enjoying freedom and prosperity in a manner that strikes those good students, now professors, as not only unseemly but something that a "just" society should never permit. So a deep and entrenched unhappiness and dissatisfaction sets in, and they start complaining about every social ill they discover, convinced that their own under-appreciation is proof of the injustice of America. And once they fall into this deep funk I'm describing, they rarely get out. It becomes the mid-life crisis that never ends. This, in spite of the fact that they have more discretionary free time thanany other regular-salaried occupation I can think of. I'd say at least 30% of the faculty wind up there.

A few others cling to the notion that because they are SO SMART they are a kind of social avant-garde, a precursor to the next cool thing because they are so enlightened (yes, most of these grew up during the 60's, and the word then was "hip"). One colleague is so passionate about his backyard bonsai garden that you can hardly talk to him without it coming up in the conversation. He has over 40 trees now, all in pots, in his small backyard. He never talks about his students or his research, just his trees. And yes, you guessed it; he wears a very short beard and ponytail, jeans and "Birkenstocks."

So when I see something like this in the paper, I scan it quickly, dismiss it as another manifestation of the same academic malcontent, and pass on. It's a good lesson to remember the next time you see a headline that some researcher at a university has discovered something--don't react until you can check the validity of the data.

(Name Withheld)

***************

Boxcar

[Big Bill]

Big Bill,
I would urge you to read all of Boxcar's posts. Appearently you have a lot of spare time. If someone cannot make a point in one page they are not very bright.

A point was made! If someone couldn't understand it they are not very bright.

Big Bill

[ljb]

A point was made! If someone couldn't understand it they are not very bright.

Big Bill
Well glad to see you had time to wade through three pages of rhetoric to get the point. I am to busy to spend that much time seeking the point. :D

[ljb]

Originally Posted by ljb
I was wondering, rather then have to scroll down through pages of blather by boxcar, should we just all put him on ignore ? ;)



I highly reccomned it. I hav e YOU on it and only have to endure snipets from your vast arsenal of blarney.

Since I have you here on a welfare thread, let me ask you why you are not speaking out about the quagmire we are in in the War on Poverty. We entered that war with no exit strategy and have spend trillions of dollars on it to no avail. Our grandchilder will be paying off this liberal atrocity.
Tom,
You are right. We should stop feeding the hungry Americans, we must use our money to build bridges to no where and build schools in Iraq and give price gouging oil companies tax breaks and that useless war in Iraq doesn't come cheap and Charles Schwab needs to upgrade his yacht and on and on and on.

[PaceAdvantage]

Hang the rich! (right Ljb?????)

[Bobby]

A point was made! If someone couldn't understand it they are not very bright.

Big Bill


Big Bill, I thought you were from Niceville. Your not supposed to do that. :D

[ljb]

Hang the rich! (right Ljb?????)
How does building a bridge to no where and building schools in Iraq and fighting a senseless war in Iraq and giving tax breaks to price gouging oil companies relate to hanging the rich?

[PaceAdvantage]

I don't know, but it sounded like a good idea at the time.

[ljb]

I don't know, but it sounded like a good idea at the time.
What sounded like a good idea? hanging the rich?