Suspensions

[karlskorner]

John Sheinman at Thoroughbred Times has an interesting column ( URL won't wrap for me ) about suspensions and Richard Dutrow. Seems Mr. Dutrow placed 3rd for a Stakes race at Monlouth, shipped the horse overnight to Deleware Park and next day placed 2nd in another Stake race, all while under a 60 suspension. Of course Mr. Dutrow stated " has nothing to do with me, I am under suspension ".

Mr. Sheinman brings up an intersting solution, one that I thought should be in place a long time ago. If drugs are found, suspend the HORSE, suspend the TRAINER and more so suspend the OWNER, all for a substantial length of time. There isn't an Owner alive, who's horse is out of contention for 90 days or more, won't think seriously about changing Trainers.

[Ron]

Lukas has suggested the same thing. If you want to clean up the sport, suspend the owners for a year. The crooked trainers will go out of business.

Golden Man ran for Juan at Monmouth and someone else in Delaware. I'm not sure what the point of that statement was. All his horses were transferred to different trainers for the whole suspension.

[karlskorner]

According to the article, Golden Man raced in the name of Dutrow's assistant, Larry Walters at Monmouth and in the name of the " trainers's brother ", Tony Dutrow, the following afternoon in Deleware. If that isn't keepig it in the "family" I don\'t know what is. 10 percent of $162,250 at Monmouth Park and 20 percent of $300,000 at Delaware Park ain't a bad days pay. Juan Rodriguez took over Dutrow's New York-based horses.

[Valuist]

It seems very self serving for Lukas to say that. Who's more likely to provide the injection, the trainer or his staff or the owner?

[chrisg]

It seems very self serving for Lukas to say that. Who's more likely to provide the injection, the trainer or his staff or the owner?

Think about it; if Lukas was injecting illegally & his owners were being suspended, do you think he'd have more owners knocking on his door?

:bang: :bang: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :faint:



:)

[kenwoodallpromos]

"If drugs are found, suspend the HORSE, suspend the TRAINER and more so suspend the OWNER"
Just leave the vets alone to inject trhe competitior's horses!
TTimes has a good vet article right now.
I never see vets suspended- just winked at like the old KY Derby guy.
My vote is to take 5 stalls away from a suspended trainer for each caught horse in the longest meet the trainer goes to next year anywhere in the USA. Give the stall space to trainers with less than 20 horses.

[Valuist]

Chrisg-

My point wasn't Lukas was injecting. He was saying put the blame on the owners. The owners aren't the ones with syringes :bang: :bang: :bang:

[chrisg]

Chrisg-

My point wasn't Lukas was injecting. He was saying put the blame on the owners. The owners aren't the ones with syringes :bang: :bang: :bang:

My point wasn't about injecting either; where did you get that? :bang:

Are you an owner? Maybe you're biased? If you don't think that there are owners in the game that are cheating w/their trainers, I can't help you.

But if you take away a guy's owners, my initial point still stands. Think about it.

[CryingForTheHorses]

John Sheinman at Thoroughbred Times has an interesting column ( URL won't wrap for me ) about suspensions and Richard Dutrow. Seems Mr. Dutrow placed 3rd for a Stakes race at Monlouth, shipped the horse overnight to Deleware Park and next day placed 2nd in another Stake race, all while under a 60 suspension. Of course Mr. Dutrow stated " has nothing to do with me, I am under suspension ".

Mr. Sheinman brings up an intersting solution, one that I thought should be in place a long time ago. If drugs are found, suspend the HORSE, suspend the TRAINER and more so suspend the OWNER, all for a substantial length of time. There isn't an Owner alive, who's horse is out of contention for 90 days or more, won't think seriously about changing Trainers.

Karl..I agree with the suspension for the trainer, I dont think its fair to suspend the owner as lots of them really dont know horses,I think if a horse had a positive for a banned substance,He (The Horse) would be taken away from that trainer, The owner would have to replace the trainer and the horse put on a 2 week list, After that time the horse may race for the new trainer with a blood test the day of the race with only race day medication allowed.In all I do also think bloodtesting every horse before the race will stop a lot of this cheating..Its a very bold and expensive step but its never to expensive to save this sport. The blood tests will be analized by proper people and horses found to have banned drugs can be scratched before the race

[Valuist]

Chris-

I think the real question is have YOU ever owned horses? If not, you really are in no position to make a statement like you did. How many owners know every little going on about their horse? What kind of feed they had? How much Lasix, bute or other medication they've received? Unless you're there seeing it for yourself on the backside, you don't really know. Racing has enough of a problem attracting owners. Why advocate something stupid like penalizing the owner for a trainer related infraction?

[chrisg]

Actually, the question was whether trainers, owners & horses should be suspended. In my opinion yes.

What's up w/the personal attacks. I asked simple questions.

I think my personal life is none of your business, but I'll try to answer your questions anyway.


I think the real question is have YOU ever owned horses? No.

[/QUOTE] If not, you really are in no position to make a statement like you did. [/QUOTE] Actually, I'm entitled to my opinion. In fact, I spent part of my life in racing.

[/QUOTE]How many owners know every little going on about their horse? [/QUOTE] I don't know, do you? But if they think ignorance is an excuse to allow illegal practices to continue in racing, it's not.

[/QUOTE]What kind of feed they had? [/QUOTE] If they care, it's pretty simple to find out where the hay was bought from & grown.

[/QUOTE]How much Lasix, bute or other medication they've received?[/QUOTE] They own the horse, they can make that request. If a trainer doesn't want to answer general questions, that should be a tipoff to the owner that something isn't right.

[/QUOTE]Unless you're there seeing it for yourself on the backside, you don't really know.[/QUOTE] Yeah & on the farm. So I know.

[/QUOTE]Racing has enough of a problem attracting owners. [/QUOTE]I'll give you a chance to take that statement back.

[/QUOTE]Why advocate something stupid like penalizing the owner for a trainer related infraction? [/QUOTE] I'll that that "stupid" slide this time. Owners cheat; I know. Making it difficult for cheating trainers & owners to stay in the game is a good start @ cleaning up the sport.

[karlskorner]

Ken;

4 years ago when I came on the board, I started on the VETS, every 6 months or so I bring it up again, useless to attack them, they are ingrained into the industry. So, the only way to reverse is go after the HORSE/TRAINER/OWNER. Half a dozen 90 day suspensions on the backside will soon enlighten TRAINERS/OWNERS that their time has come to stop the illegal use of drugs. Without a horse to inject, the VET will get to the business of keeping the animal healthy.

Meanwhile, I am preparing for a possible hurricane.

[Tom]

I think "blind" owners is not an excuse. They make the lionshare of the purse and should have the lionshare of the responsibility. JMHYOCO. :D

[kenwoodallpromos]

State govts run track drug policy and also license vets for on and off the track business. I assume most illegal drugs are supplied by the vets.
What % of horse's vets are questioned when banned drugs are found?
As time goes on and betting $$ competition increases, the racing indutsry knows they have to tighten up the rules of all types. So keep trying!

[andicap]

At the Jockey Club Roundtable the guy who runs the consortium that is trying to standardize medication rules -- they claim 26 states now have common drug rules -- said the next goal was the stiffen the penalties for trainers caught with drugs that have no medincal value in horses. That would mean suspension of the horse as well and stiffer ones for the trainer.

I hope I get more assignments to cover this beat -- met some very interesting people there.