PDA

View Full Version : Ghostzapper: Great-lite to Great-great.


Suff
06-07-2005, 04:58 PM
Seth Morrow at equidaily, rarely writes an opinion piece . I think I've seen him write 5 or 6 in three years time. But he steps up big time to make a statement on Ghost Zapper.
http://www.equidaily.com/bestbet/opinion/50607.html

Ghostzapper: Great-lite to Great-great
Equidaily offers the formula to make it happen

Race record/competition, a closer look

And finally -- and perhaps most importantly -- let's take a look at the competition Ghostzapper has faced in his string of six stakes wins.


9/27/03 G1 Vosburgh 6.5F... A smart field of nine challengers. Running second was Aggadan, a useful sort, but not a solid G1 competitor. Prior to the Vosburgh Aggadan had mainly been knocking around high-priced claimers and allowance company.

7/4/04 G2 Tom Fool 7F... A field of three challengers. Running second, again, Aggadan.

8/21/04 G3 Iselin 9F... A field of three challengers. Running second, by ten lengths, Presidentialaffair. While that one is a very nice runner, he's not a barometer of championship talent. In fact, in his follow-up to the G3 Iselin, Presidentialaffair wound up last of seven -- by thirty-six lengths -- in the G1 Woodward.

9/11/04 G1 Woodward 9F... Six challengers. Running second, by a neck at even weights, Saint Liam. This was Saint Liam's thirteenth career start and first G1. Finishing third was Bowman's Band, this talented stakes-competitor from Allen Jerkens spent 2004 running well in graded stakes company but couldn't find the winner's circle. Seek Gold ran fourth, followed by Newfoundland, Midway Road and Presidentialaffair.

10/30/04 G1 BC Classic 10F... A dozen solid challengers in clearly the most competitive race of Ghostzapper's career. Second was the very talented Roses in May.

5/30/05 G1 Met Mile 8F... Five challengers. Running second, Silver Wagon, a G1 winner as a 2YO in 2003, one win since -- in a NW2. Of the others Forest Danger could be considered a legit G1 competitor off of his April win in the Carter. Sir Shackleton is a G3 winner and was dusted in two previous tries at the G1 level. Love of Money won the G1 Pa Derby but was trounced in a lone G1 attempt against older. And Pomeroy was a G1 winner sprinting against 3YOs.

So when we really take a look at the cream of the handicap division, how many challengers has Ghostzapper faced in his stakes streak? If we use the Daily Racing Form's "Watchmaker Watch", and look at the "Older Males", in the most recent edition's Top Ten we find that Ghostzapper has faced Saint Liam (#2) once, Roses in May (#3) once, Eddington (#4) never, Rock Hard Ten (#5) never, Badge of Silver (#6) never, Southern Image (#7) never, Pollard's Vision (#8) never, Funny Cide (#9) once, Second of June (#10) never.
Of course, since Ghostzapper only has one 2005 start perhaps it's not fair to look at the current Top Ten. So let's go back to the "Watchmaker Watch" from Breeders' Cup day 2004. Ghostzapper was #2 on that list. Of the others, Ghostzapper faced Pleasantly Perfect (#1) once, Medaglia d'Oro never, Pico Central (#6) never, Peace Rules (#7) never, Evening Attire (#10) never (the missing numbers from the 2004 Top Ten are repeats from the 2005 group listed in the paragraph above).

In other words, beyond the 2004 BC Classic Ghostzapper hasn't faced the best of the best. Even if you don't think the "Watchmaker Watch" is a solid accounting of the tops in the division, pick your own names and see how many them Ghostzapper has faced beyond the BC Classic last year.

http://www.equidaily.com/bestbet/opinion/50607.htmlof

Buckeye
06-07-2005, 05:54 PM
He's gotta "zap" of few more decent horses. He's got (1) Breeders' Cup Classic win (against who? :) ) and by the Fall, Alex will be ready for him. If Alex beats him as a 3-year-old, then this joke H.O.Y. will disappear. Looking forward to it.

PaceAdvantage
06-07-2005, 08:15 PM
Suff, what he wrote should be obvious to anyone with sound judgement and an open mind. Some folks are completely blinded by speed figures. I used to be one of those people.

Best horse in 20 years my ass. GZ's got to do a lot more for me to hang that hat on him.

kev
06-07-2005, 09:02 PM
I don't know, but I got my GZ hat from horsehats.com today and wearing right now. ;)

kingfin66
06-08-2005, 01:17 AM
I don't know, but I got my GZ hat from horsehats.com today and wearing right now. ;)

Somehow I have missed out on that site. Until now that is. What a cool site. I must make sure that I show my wife that site before Christmas. Thinking about the Secretariat hat...

KingChas
06-08-2005, 01:39 AM
Somehow I have missed out on that site. Until now that is. What a cool site. I must make sure that I show my wife that site before Christmas. Thinking about the Secretariat hat...

Got my Smarty Jones hat there last year........nice site

BTW, I compare Ghostzapper right now to the current heavyweight division in boxing. He's Champ so far :sleeping: He's about the only thing we have right now with so many young horses retiring to the shed so early.He's not bad(fine versitale horse) but I've seen better.The figs coming out these days are ridicolous (BSF... etc-sorry guys).To much kreedence(sic) paid to them.Suff points out his (GZ) glaring weaknesses.Before the year is over if he runs again, this horses history may repeat itself.My condolences to all the bridgejumpers that day. ;)

KingChas
06-08-2005, 02:00 AM
"KingChas-Suff points out his (GZ) glaring weaknesses."


Before I am called before the judge on this let me explain this statement.

It does not take a racing legend to beat this horse.The competiton just is not there-until this so called bad crop of 3 YR old's move on later maybe??.

RXB
06-08-2005, 04:38 AM
He's gotta "zap" of few more decent horses. He's got (1) Breeders' Cup Classic win (against who? :) ) and by the Fall, Alex will be ready for him. If Alex beats him as a 3-year-old, then this joke H.O.Y. will disappear. Looking forward to it.

If you knock Ghostzapper for quality of competition, by what merit can you possibly favour Afleet Alex, who has been running against the Apple Dumpling Gang?

Also, while speed figures aren't everything, they are a pretty useful measurement. Ghostzapper is putting up speed figures that are well beyond what Afleet Alex will be running if he improves by the typical amount between now and October.

I'm not yet 100% sold on Ghostzapper, but he's a very talented horse.

keilan
06-08-2005, 09:36 AM
Serious question – if you had a very talented horse would you wish to race him against Ghostzapper if it could mean your horse might not ever be the same afterwards?

Ghostzapper won the breeders cup race handily, not many races are bigger than that. This horse has the respect of other good trainers and that speaks volumes for the horse when they decide it’s best to keep their horses away from him. Only on this forum would anyone mention Afleet Alex and Ghostzapper in the same sentence.

PaceAdvantage
06-08-2005, 11:37 AM
Only on this forum would anyone mention Afleet Alex and Ghostzapper in the same sentence.


HEY! Whatcha talkin' bout Willis? :eek:

keilan
06-08-2005, 04:47 PM
My mistake PA I thought I was on another board ;)

saratoga guy
06-08-2005, 05:21 PM
Serious question – if you had a very talented horse would you wish to race him against Ghostzapper if it could mean your horse might not ever be the same afterwards?

I don't know if there's any evidence to support the notion that Ghostzapper is running the competitive spirit out of his foes (not a theory I particularly buy into in general anyway).

This horse has the respect of other good trainers and that speaks volumes for the horse when they decide it’s best to keep their horses away from him.

It's even a little hard to support this notion. It was Frankel who avoided the Vanderbilt last summer and a meeting with Speightstown.

But moving beyond the sprints, I don't know if many big guns were pointing towards the G3 Iselin. The whole crew showed up in the BC Classic.

And I don't know which big names were pointed towards the Met Mile, but I can't blame an owner for taking a pass after the reigning HOTY gets assigned 123 pounds.

So pretty much the only race so far where the idea might hold that horses ducked Ghostzapper is last year's Woodward.

toetoe
06-08-2005, 10:52 PM
Do they have headwear celebrating Black Ruby? I could wear it and live up to my monicker --- Asshat.

Suff
06-08-2005, 11:37 PM
Serious question – if you had a very talented horse would you wish to race him against Ghostzapper if it could mean your horse might not ever be the same afterwards?

.


If I was wealthy enough that it was a sport.......yes...I'd want to race my Horse often and every chance I could. If the horse was sound I'd run him.

If I had reservations about harming the Horse, thats a different animal. If he was sound and he could go... He'd go. Why not?

It boils done to... is there a chance he'd get hurt, the same chance any horse takes when he runs, I'd run him. On the other hand , if it was Likely he'd get hurt... I'd take it case by case...Race by race...and only run him when I was confident he was FIT

KingChas
06-09-2005, 01:22 AM
Let's see Ghostzapper carried 126 pds once in his racing lifetime so far.(won)

Afleet Alex 3 times in a row.

Poor Wilko carried it 3 times and 131 pds (won) in (GB) as a 2yr old.
Bet ya didn't know that?

When USA handicap races become true.Then I will truely grade Ghostzapper.

Then we will talk about comparing them in the same sentence! ;)