View Full Version : Please tell me this isn"t for real!
schweitz
03-25-2005, 10:45 PM
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/050325/480/cho10603251929
I am reminded of a term from the 60's....PIGS!
What a bunch of losers.
boxcar
03-26-2005, 01:17 AM
It's for real, Schweitz. And he wasn't the only kid either.
Boxcar
Equineer
03-26-2005, 06:14 AM
What we have here is a North Carolina ten-year-old being brainwashed and exploited by a Florida mob of adult anarchists and sectarian zealots... a future schoolyard shooter in the making... this poor child needs new custodial guardians.
schweitz
03-26-2005, 11:35 AM
What we have here is a water-toting 10 yr old desperado in HANDCUFFS!
My Guesstimate is that 6 of 10 people arrested do not "deserve" nor 'warrant" physical restraint. And this is certainly a Jolting commentary on where we've gone, not only in this case, but as a country.
But lets go back two weeks ago to the Killings in Atlanta. Law enforcement nowadays have strict guidlines on the handling of persons taken into custody. They are not felxible... not because of Alanta.. But you can rest assured every Cop and court officer was reminded by thier superiors on the FIXEd Procedures for handling persons in custody. Old people, Young People, Violent offenders, Drunk Drivers, People behind on thier child support, People that don't pay a Civil fine.. all of them. Get restrained.
and I'd be willing to bet you.. Had this officer not Restrained him. he risked a Repimand from a Policy wonk Suprvisor.
Picture bothers me...a lot. I'm just making Commentary
Kreed
03-26-2005, 11:47 AM
Yeah, cops are A-Holes. They forgot to shackle his legs. That kinda oversight
is gonna get some innocent guy killed.
Flori-DUH cops nail Baby Face Nelson! :D
betchatoo
03-26-2005, 02:16 PM
I thought that was the notorious outlaw "Billy the Kid"
This child's parents are the ones that should be in cuffs. Some people have no dignity at all. To use a 10 year old child in an attempt to promote one's political goals is almost as bad as trying to defeat the wishes of a persistant vegative state person for political gain.
kingfin66
03-27-2005, 12:20 AM
I am reminded of a term from the 60's....PIGS!
What a bunch of losers.
I agree with you 100% on this one Tom. Parents who put their kid in a situation like that, telling him to intentionally get arrested, are LOSERS.
The cops end up looking like the bad guys in situations like this, but they are really just doing their jobs.
Steve 'StatMan'
03-27-2005, 12:53 AM
It is good that one none of those kids tries pouring that water down Terri's mouth. Since she can't swallow, unless it slowly drains into her throat somehow, it would likely back up into her windpipe and make her choke. Then the kid would feel even worse.
JustRalph
03-27-2005, 03:02 PM
But lets go back two weeks ago to the Killings in Atlanta. Law enforcement nowadays have strict guidlines on the handling of persons taken into custody. They are not felxible... not because of Alanta.. But you can rest assured every Cop and court officer was reminded by thier superiors on the FIXEd Procedures for handling persons in custody. Old people, Young People, Violent offenders, Drunk Drivers, People behind on thier child support, People that don't pay a Civil fine.. all of them. Get restrained.
right on target Suff...........whenever something goofy happens in the country, and it makes the national news.........Sgt. Somebody is going to stand up at roll call and deliver a speech and recite the latest department stance on these type of issues relating to the latest big news story. Worse than that, a city council type or a mayor might "order a review of related policies" just because of some news story. That always ends up with somebody making unneccessary changes .................
Lefty
03-27-2005, 11:55 PM
lbj, did you ever stop to think that maybe there was no political agenda here at all? Of course you didn't.
lbj, did you ever stop to think that maybe there was no political agenda here at all? Of course you didn't.
No, Lefty and what did the easter bunny leave for you this morning? :D
Lefty
03-28-2005, 12:40 AM
lbj, you're a child. To think that people would want to give a person dying of thirst water because of politics? A political agenda was prob the furthest thght from their minds. There ARE TRULY compassionate people in this world.
lbj, you're a child. To think that people would want to give a person dying of thirst water because of politics? A political agenda was prob the furthest thght from their minds. There ARE TRULY compassionate people in this world.
Lefty, You are just one of them bleeding heart neocons. Are you reffering to the compassionate conservatives?
Lefty
03-28-2005, 11:45 AM
lbj, you've picked up a buzzword from your liberal blogs; but you really also need to know the meaning of the word neocon before you tag me with it. And no, i'm talking about compassionate people of all ilks.
Look at this photo and tell shat is wrong here????
FOUR!? cops (at least) and handcuffs on a child trying to give a dying woman a drink of water?
Fer chrissakes, if this isn't ridiculous and government trampling on individuals, I don't know what is. I do not understand how anyone can support a governmment that pulls this crap.
We talk about spreading democracy and freedom abroadn and we allow this to happen here?
Hey, remember Columbine? How many kids died while the cops stood outside scared out their shorts to go in? Now this?
If it takes 4 cops to stop 1 kid, how many do we need to stop a real terroroist? This is disgusting.......:mad:
schweitz
03-28-2005, 07:06 PM
Tom,
That was my point in starting this thread---a 10 yr old in handcuffs. I guess it should not surprise me that some posters want to make it about politics.
I heard about another incident today on the raido - a 10 year old girl was arrested for bringing scissors to school, and taken out in handcuffs. This is the kind of behavior by authority that we expect our leaeders to PROTECT us from.
schweitz
03-28-2005, 10:55 PM
Sounds like another school district with a Zero-Tolerance Policy. A policy that treats situations as black or white when they are really different shades of gray.
GameTheory
03-28-2005, 11:22 PM
This child's parents are the ones that should be in cuffs. Some people have no dignity at all. To use a 10 year old child in an attempt to promote one's political goals is almost as bad as trying to defeat the wishes of a persistant vegative state person for political gain.I agree. But I was just wondering -- seriously -- were you up in arms when at the DNC convention that little girl got up and gave a speech? The one that said, "I think Dick Cheney needs a time-out." [Referring to the Cheney expletive that was in the news at the time.] The parents of that one should be regarded the same...
PaceAdvantage
03-29-2005, 02:02 AM
GT, you're on fire! Thank you again! LOL
Well, well, well.
I guess my suggestion of putting the childs parents in cuffs wasn't to far off the mark. Seems the lads father, who brought him down to Florida from North Carolina is a registered sex offender, child molester. Moved to North Carolina a few years ago. Seems to have forgotten to register as a sex offender in North Carolina. Can you imagine anyone you would rather have in your neighborhood other then a bible toting child molester?
I always thought those bible thumping fanatics had something to hide. Either a sordid past or evil activities behind closed doors. We may even have one of them on this board?
I agree. But I was just wondering -- seriously -- were you up in arms when at the DNC convention that little girl got up and gave a speech? The one that said, "I think Dick Cheney needs a time-out." [Referring to the Cheney expletive that was in the news at the time.] The parents of that one should be regarded the same...
Are you saying the current protests concerning Terri Schiavo are the same as a political convention? Was the little girl at the DNC convention arrested and handcuffed on national tv?
There is a difference between being arrested/humilated and giving a speech.
Kreed
03-29-2005, 07:43 AM
How many of you guys think that (a) Little Boys get treated worst for any
mischief than Little Girls and (b) Little Boys are being feminized?
GT, you're on fire! Thank you again! LOL
do you have a position on Police handcuffing a 10 year old boy? For any reason?
Lbj is partisain. Big news? when its pointed out you need to applaud? And I personnaly do not find them comparable at all. Sending an unsupservised child into a Hospice to interact with sick and dying patients is comparable to a child give a speech? at a Poltical convention.
I believe one event is illlegal and one is not.
PaceAdvantage
03-29-2005, 10:04 AM
do you have a position on Police handcuffing a 10 year old boy? For any reason?
Lbj is partisain. Big news? when its pointed out you need to applaud? And I personnaly do not find them comparable at all. Sending an unsupservised child into a Hospice to interact with sick and dying patients is comparable to a child give a speech? at a Poltical convention.
I believe one event is illlegal and one is not.
I have no problem with anyone, of any age, being handcuffed if they break the law.
Yes they are comparable, if we are to believe LJB, that this boy who was trying to get water to Schiavo only because his parents brainwashed him for political gain. It would be comparable to that little girl getting up and giving the cutesy anti-Cheney speech....if we are to believe LJB about the little boy....if.....
I have no problem with anyone, of any age, being handcuffed if they break the law.
Yes they are comparable, if we are to believe LJB, that this boy who was trying to get water to Schiavo only because his parents brainwashed him for political gain. It would be comparable to that little girl getting up and giving the cutesy anti-Cheney speech....if we are to believe LJB about the little boy....if.....
You found absolutely no comparison to Tom Delay's situation, Nor disconnecting the infant in Texas to the Schiavo situation.
But you find a Young girl at a Poltical Convention comparable to an unsupervised 10 year old breaking the law by roaming hospital corridors dispensing fluids in contradiction to Doctors orders...ok? and similiar?
Bit disengenious.
PaceAdvantage
03-29-2005, 10:38 AM
You found absolutely no comparison to Tom Delay's situation, Nor disconnecting the infant in Texas to the Schiavo situation.
I don't ever think I said there wasn't a comparison to be made, but in my mind at least, there is a difference between the cases. Many folks just don't see food and water as "extraordinary means" when compared to kidney dialysis.
And for the record, I am all in favor of following the letter of the law in this case. If the law has determined that Terri Schiavo's husband calls the shots, then that is the way it should go.
I don't agree at all with the process. I think it is dispicably BARBARIC, in this day and age, to starve a person over a course of many, many days. One news report likens her to a concentration camp victim at the present time.
I doubt Euthanasia proponents had this kind of slow, cruel death in mind. I don't care what state she is in, we will never truly know what kind of anguish she may be going through inside that body. You take someone off a respirator, they die within minutes. You take someone off of Kidney dialysis, they'll die probably within a couple of days, at most. But here we have Terri Schiavo, in her 12th day without foor or water, being killed in one of the slowest and cruelest ways possible.
No, I don't agree with the process at all. Not in this day and age of science and medicine. It's barbaric.
That's where I stand.
GameTheory
03-29-2005, 11:05 AM
Are you saying the current protests concerning Terri Schiavo are the same as a political convention? Was the little girl at the DNC convention arrested and handcuffed on national tv?
There is a difference between being arrested/humilated and giving a speech.YOU said: "To use a 10 year old child in an attempt to promote one's political goals is almost as bad..." I agree, and the girl at the DNC is an example of the same thing -- using a child to promote one's political goals (I would implicate everyone at the DNC that allowed that to happen, not just the parents). Whether or not the child was arrested is of no matter -- would you have applauded the child if they had not arrested him, but had merely picked him up and returned him to his parents?
As far as whether this is the same as a political convention, no it is not. This is a life or death matter as well as being a political issue, while the DNC case was pure politics. So I would say the girl at the DNC was worse. The fact that you are now backtracking shows you have no intellectual honesty about either issue....
I don't agree at all with the process. I think it is dispicably BARBARIC, in this day and age, to starve a person over a course of many, many days. One news report likens her to a concentration camp victim at the present time.
I doubt Euthanasia proponents had this kind of slow, cruel death in mind. I don't care what state she is in, we will never truly know what kind of anguish she may be going through inside that body. You take someone off a respirator, they die within minutes. You take someone off of Kidney dialysis, they'll die probably within a couple of days, at most. But here we have Terri Schiavo, in her 12th day without foor or water, being killed in one of the slowest and cruelest ways possible.
No, I don't agree with the process at all. Not in this day and age of science and medicine. It's barbaric.
That's where I stand.
I can only surmise from the 200 doctors that have stated so.
She's brain damaged so deeply that she has no cognitive function. Your "barbaric" and "cruelest" description is inaccurate based on the medical evidence.
Remember.. when Kevorkian attempts to allow people to quickly end thier own lives... in what you say might be more humane? And yet still, people want to stick thier nose in it. Its a No win.
and remember.. The whole thing is none of our business to begin with.
Equineer
03-29-2005, 03:36 PM
Here is another photo of North Carolina 10-year-old Joshua Heldreth.
He is being marched around by his bible-waving father, Howard "Scott" Heldreth, listed among absconded sex offenders by the state of Florida (http://www3.fdle.state.fl.us/sexual_predators/OffenderFlyer.asp?keys=38964), while The Charlotte Observer reported on Easter Sunday that Heldreth spent several months in jail in 1992 awaiting trial on rape and kidnapping charges. He pled guilty to sexual battery and served time on probation. Apparently he does not appear in the North Carolina sex offender database as that registration is required only for those who were convicted on or after Jan. 1, 1996.
The embedded link above takes you to Heldreth's smiling mug shot on his Florida FDLE flyers. The photo of him marching his son appears below.
Equineer
03-29-2005, 03:52 PM
And here is another photo of young Joshua, safely in police custody, finally out of the clutches of his father.
schweitz
03-29-2005, 04:50 PM
And here is another photo of young Joshua, safely in police custody, finally out of the clutches of his father.
That is another photo of a ten yr. old in handcuffs---nothing else.
That is another photo of a ten yr. old in handcuffs---nothing else.
No comment on the ole man?
schweitz
03-29-2005, 05:12 PM
No comment on the ole man?
What's to say? It speaks for itself. Doesn't change the fact about a 10 yr. old being put in handcuffs.
What's to say? It speaks for itself. Doesn't change the fact about a 10 yr. old being put in handcuffs.
yes thats "whack" as they say. But I just think it does say something about the "demographics" of the audience outside the Hospice. Also, calls into question his clarity when coaching his children to break the law.
Don't get me wrong.. I'm not judging the guy on that single account of an event in 1992. In my experience, most men come to God by circumstance rather than by virtue anyway. And he maybe right inside now. Although sometimes the depths of one's sins are manifested in the zealousness of one's transformation.
Equineer
03-29-2005, 06:29 PM
Bloggers are reporting appearances all over the country by this itinerant father, who reportedly travels with other religious fanatics and their children. He has been very active in the anti-abortion movement, and the 6/2/99 Chicago Tribune reported he was arrested for threatening a physician in Aurora, where police spokesman Dan Ferrelli confirmed that Heldreth had been convicted of raping minors in Ohio and was originally registered as a sex offender in Naperville.
Furthermore, while masquerading as a Christian youth counselor in Kansas City, "Reverand Scott" was reportedly videotaped counseling schoolgirls to cherish their offspring from rapists as a gift from God. Apparently, "Reverand Scott" must think he is a God.
PaceAdvantage
03-29-2005, 06:30 PM
And here is another photo of young Joshua, safely in police custody, finally out of the clutches of his father.
I'd love to dig around in your closet and see what jumps out at me....rape and kidnapping charges, eh? What were the details?
Lefty
03-29-2005, 07:10 PM
suff, you day she has no cognitive abilities? I guess you mean she feels no pain. Then why in hell are they giving her morphine?
None of our business? Anything that goes on in our courts is the peoples business. When a young lady is being killed by some nutty judge on hearsay testimony, that's the peoples business.
Equineer
03-29-2005, 07:46 PM
I'd love to dig around in your closet and see what jumps out at me....rape and kidnapping charges, eh? What were the details?The bloggers cite details they found at LexisNexis.Com about the Illinois arrest and Aurora police statements about his previous record.
Subjects: Assaults, Threats, Physicians
Locations: Aurora Illinois
People: Heldreth, Howard S
ISSN/ISBN: 10856706
They also cited docket entries for the Ohio rapes and gave this link: http://www.athenscountycpcourt.org/
Heldreth was released from the Pickaway jail and put on probation in Ohio as a sex offender in May 1993.
His probation for the Ohio sex offenses ended on 6/16/97.
I've already got a maid who does laundry and keeps my closet tidy, but she doesn't do windows... is there any chance... :) :) :)
PaceAdvantage
03-29-2005, 07:58 PM
Well then, if the all-knowing court system considers this guy ok to have custody of this kid, then it's ok by me. As I've already stated, I support the law.
So then, what's the problem here? Why are we digging up this guy's past? Nobody likes it when Ted Kennedy's past is brought up....LOL
Yeah, the law is to be respected.
Slavery was once legal.
Black people were once counted in the constitution as 3/5's of a white man.
England once legally taxed us and didn't allow us representation.
Today, we have two houses of congress and the president, and a goveneor, all elected, accountable people being ignored by basically one unelected, unaccountable judge who may actually be breaking the law himself by ingnoring a congressional sophenoea.
We are handcuffing 10 years old kids out of paranoia .
We are allowing illegal aliens to bankrupt our country and refusing to enfore legitimate laws already on the books becase of constant liitgation.
This is not the will of a free people.
I think I'll pass on any repsect for the Ku Kux Kourt system we now have - it
is broken and needs to be changed fast.
Lefty
03-29-2005, 10:04 PM
Tom, I agree completely. Something's wrong when any judge can trump the Gov, the Congress and Pres. Somethings gone seriously askew.
Where are the checks and balances on the Kourts?
boxcar
03-30-2005, 12:46 AM
Suff wrote:
You found absolutely no comparison to Tom Delay's situation, Nor disconnecting the infant in Texas to the Schiavo situation.
Of course, not. But most of us who can think beyond our nose are not surprised that a Lib can't understand the differences.
But you find a Young girl at a Poltical Convention comparable to an unsupervised 10 year old breaking the law by roaming hospital corridors dispensing fluids in contradiction to Doctors orders...ok? and similiar?
Actually, the "Doctors" got their marching orders from Judge Greer.
Bit disengenious.
A whole lot sloppy, on your part.
Boxcar
boxcar
03-30-2005, 12:57 AM
Lefty wrote:
Tom, I agree completely. Something's wrong when any judge can trump the Gov, the Congress and Pres. Somethings gone seriously askew.
The system is wrong. Why? Because even though well-intentioned men drafted the Constitution, they, like all men were fallible. Man's ways are imperfect. And always will be.
As pointed out on the "Let Her Die" thread, the Federal Judges in this country are the most powerful men in the Land; for the proverbial buck stops with them. And don't kid yourselves: Liberals understand this fact all too well, is why they're adamant in stopping as many Bush judicial appointees as possible.
The "Rule of Law" has evolved into meaning the Rule by Jurists. Scary? You bet!
Boxcar
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