everyone's opinion is welcome EXCEPT

[46zilzal]

those who are not in lock-step agreement...These are really dangerous folks here!

Some in Fargo find they're not wanted at president's speech

Associated Press

City Commissioner Linda Coates says she was shocked to learn she and her husband were among more than 40 area residents on a list of people barred from attending President Bush's speech here Thursday.

The list was supplied to workers at the two Fargo distribution sites, along with tickets and other forms citizens were asked to fill out, The Forum reported.

The list includes critics of Bush or the war in Iraq. It includes two high school students, a librarian, a deputy Democratic campaign manager and a number of university professors.

Coates said she originally was not planning to attend the president's speech, but got a last-minute ticket Wednesday night from Fargo Mayor Bruce Furness, who offered tickets to all city commissioners.

White House spokesman Jim Morrell and Don Larson, a spokesman for Gov. John Hoeven's office, said they knew nothing about a list of people barred from the speech.

"This is the first I'm hearing of it," Morrell said Wednesday.

Coates said she had no idea why she would be on a list, other than the fact that she has been outspoken in her political beliefs.

"I thought that was democracy," she said.

[46zilzal]

http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/02/03/general.shoot/index.html

[Tom]

I'll comment....after you provide proof that this list exists. So far, you have offered nothing but rumours.

[betchatoo]

46

If the first post is true (and the article you quoted doesn't seem to indicate where the proof is), I think it's an outrage to prevent any law abiding citizen from attending an open function

I am confused by your second post. What does that have to do with either the first post or the subject?

[Tom]

He likes pot shots - no connections are needed, just throw out whatever negative thing he can find.

[46zilzal]

46

If the first post is true (and the article you quoted doesn't seem to indicate where the proof is), I think it's an outrage to prevent any law abiding citizen from attending an open function

I am confused by your second post. What does that have to do with either the first post or the subject?
Just look for intersting stuff that's all

[46zilzal]

I wrote to her in Fargo to see what she says about this..When I get the answer, I will print it. Both she and her husband were barred according to the article.

[Tom]

And there is no way they would lie, right?

[46zilzal]

Contact information:
200 North Third Street
Fargo, ND 58102
(701) 793-3763
Fax: (701) 476-4136

[lsbets]

46Sec, you're going to hate hearing this, but that General is right, its fun to shoot some people. Some people just deserve it, and the world is better off without them.

[ponyplayer]

Hoooooorrraaaaaah! ;)

[Secretariat]

46Sec, you're going to hate hearing this, but that General is right, its fun to shoot some people. Some people just deserve it, and the world is better off without them.

Gee, Iz, then you need to get back here, because there's a lot of domestic abuse in this country. You could just take an AK47 and go in and shoot every huisband who abused their wife. So much for due process. And it'd be fun right?

Judge, Jury and Executioner. Who needs a judicial branch?

[Tom]

Ls...shoot Sec! Shoot Sec! :eek:

[PaceAdvantage]

Last time I looked, there is no due process in a climate of war. It's kill or be killed. There's your due process.

[NoDayJob]

Last time I looked, there is no due process in a climate of war. It's kill or be killed. There's your due process.

PA, couldn't have said it better! Here's to my brave comrades of the 31st RCT and especially, Colonel D.C. Faith, who didn't make it home. I salute them for their brave efforts and may they have found everlasting peace.

NDJ

[Secretariat]

Last time I looked, there is no due process in a climate of war. It's kill or be killed. There's your due process.

Ahh, but that's not what the general said. He was relating it's fun to kill some guy abusing his wife. That isn't war, that's domestic abuse. In case you aren't aware there are rules of engagement, even in war, and the general should know that. One doesn't just kill for fun, unless you're a child pretending on the playground.

btw..I thought the mission had been accomplished and we were basically functioning in a police function currently. Saddam has been captured, the WMD's have been found, or at least Rumsfeld has said there are none now, and the election has been held., and Bush declared mission accomplished. Bin Laden is due east fellas.

[lsbets]

Sec, all I can say is I am glad that my children's security doesn't rest on the shoulders of men like you.

[Secretariat]

Sec, all I can say is I am glad that my children's security doesn't rest on the shoulders of men like you.

I was at war before you were born, and I know you're there now so I excuse the ignorant insult.. So, you don't beleive in rules of engagement and believe the general's original comments were correct? Do you beleive the fun the guards were having at Abu Ghraib was also justified?

It amazes me that even after the general apologizes for his remarks, people here continue to advocate the correctness of the original remarks.

[lsbets]

46Sec,

Do I have reason to doubt your claims? Hell yes I do - you have wavered all over the map regarding any military record that you might have.

Who the F said I don't believe in rules of engagement? You are some piece of work. I live with the rules of engagement every day and have to define that gray area that makes the difference in the survival of my soldiers. I said that I agreed with what the general said. When I got attacked in Baghdad on Jan 2nd in the same spot that one of my guys got seriously wounded the day before, guess what? I enjoyed the hell out of shooting the mf'ers. Don't try to play high and mighty with me. You may have been at war, but by your own admission, you never faced fire (if you were telling the truth, which if you are the infamous Dr. Tim, than I doubt you are telling the truth).

The general never said he was wrong, he said his remarks were innapropriate. And I stand by what I said - I am damned glad that the security of my family does not rest on the shoulders of men like you. War is not gentle, war is not kind. It is ugly and brutal. It is real and not some fantasy where everyone plays nice. It requires people to do horrible things under horrible circumstances, and it allows people like you to continue living in your sheltered dreamworld.

[lsbets]

Okay Sec, I was going to edit my last post because I reacted out of anger, but I couldn't find the edit post link. Oh well, take half of what I said with a grain of salt. But, I'll leave it up to you to figure out which half.

[Tom]

AbuGrad is of no improtance to anything. nobody died there, nobody was injured. If it got one pice of valuable info out of captured terrorist, it should be continued. I agree with LS, and I find it somehow aggervating that our troops are also protecting the saftey of bottom feeding traitors like Sec. ALWAYS looking out for the enemy, NEVER misses a change to put down our guys. you don't get much lower then that.

[Secretariat]

There's a real problem when Tom says Abu Ghraib was of no importance to anyone. Obviously, the military disagreed and people were prosecuted. Even President Bush said the actions were a disgrace.

As to the General, he actually stated he should have chose his words more carefully. Perhaps that is not a denial. It is what it is. The guy's a gutsy guy, but he made a mistake.

I tend to side with Vice Admiral Edward Martin.

"I was a little surprised," said retired Vice Adm. Edward H. Martin. "I don't think any of us who have ever fought in wars liked to kill anybody."

If it's getting "fun" to kill people over there I think it's time for a furlough.

And Iz, I don't give a crap what you think of me. I know what I did, where I was, and I don't have to justify my service in Nam to you or anyone. So get the F over it. Sorry, I didn't edit that part, ignore the part that you think I meant to edit.

[Tom]

Bush and the military are caving in to public opinion in an election year.
Direct quesiton Sec: If torturing (non-lethal, non-maiming) got information from a prisoner that pre-empted a car-bombing and saved the lives of innocent civilians and some of our troops, do you honestly mean to tell me you would rather allow the attack to spare some temprorary embarassment to an enemy operative, captured on the battlefield and brought ot AbuGrad?


BTW...interesting how you were right there, Johnny on the spot, to stick up for the rights of the wife-beater and never once even mentioned any concern at all for the wife, the victim. Typical. Do you work for the ACLU?

[ljb]

Some of you dudes ain't gonna like this but Ls's quote sounds like something the terroists would have been thinking of 9/11. For shame, for shame.

[lsbets]

Why am I reminded of A few Good Men - "You can't handle the truth!"

[Equineer]

Tempest In A Teapot

Let's all keep our tunics buttoned... I am confident that crusty Marine General Mattis wasn't using "fun to shoot them" with the psychotic nuance that the same statement would have in civilian life.

Marine Generals are supposed to sound like they eat nails for breakfast... in fact, Marine Colonels are advised to start practicing swagger talk when nomination for that first star becomes remotely feasible.

[lsbets]

Eq, you are exactly right, the phrase has completely different meanings in civilian and military life.

[Tom]

Whatever is means in either life, he is the kind of guy I want protecting me. The image I want the world to have of the US is taht we are a generous people, ready and willing to help anyone anytime, but mess with us and you will find out what "bad day" means.

Remeber the Gulf War, the Iraqi soldieers knocking each other down trying to surrender first?