Brisnet Misleading Advertising

[garyoz]

Does anyone besides me find it misleading that Bris is claiming that 17 of the top 20 finishers in the NTRA Handicapping Tournament were "Brisnet customers." What Bris products were they using? Does the ad imply that they were successful because of Brisnet? Hmmm...that's how I took it. I think that the claim is really cheezy. They probably also are DRF customers. It costs nothing to be a brisnet customer.

Will Bris ever put facts behind all their hype? Let's hear exactly how the 17 used Bris products.

[GMB@BP]

Does anyone besides me find it misleading that Bris is claiming that 17 of the top 20 finishers in the NTRA Handicapping Tournament were "Brisnet customers." What Bris products were they using? Does the ad imply that they were successful because of Brisnet? Hmmm...that's how I took it. I think that the claim is really cheezy. They probably also are DRF customers. It costs nothing to be a brisnet customer.

Will Bris ever put facts behind all their hype? Let's hear exactly how the 17 used Bris products.

Since you specifically mention Bris I think its fair to comment that what they are doing is misleading. They do say "Bris Members", which says they have an account there, I have not read it saying they specifically used the product. I know the winner used Tgraph for his handicapping.

[gillenr]

Having been a "member" for over 15 years, & having just gotten off the phone with tech support - quickly solving my problem in American English - I must say in their defense that IT IS AN AD!
All PPs come from the same data source - it is their price, presentation and customer service that satisfy me. Try DRF customer service - look at their formulator forum on their web site.

[GMB@BP]

Totally off subject since you are talking product and service, which we all agree is not DRF strong point over the years, but it does appear new management is trying to improve it,

but on the subject,

it is an add, and it is misleadeing. I bet DRF can say that just about every handicapper either purchased a form that day or is a member on their site, its a rather dubious claim that for the most part is misleading.

[gillenr]

As I said, it is an AD - all ads for everything are misleading; have you ever seen a fat guy in a beer ad!

[ceejay]

Now I'm not claiming that anyone is lying or attempting to mislead here, but The problem with the BRIS claim (and any others like) is that these claims are difficult to assess.

I am a BRIS member, a DRF member, a Turfday user and have a Thorograph account (which I used during their free promo week in Dec but couldn't use effectively). If I went to either of the big vegas tourneys this month and won these (and maybe other) services could claim me as a member, but that does not mean that I used their data/sevice to win the event.

[Valuist]

Thorograph is doing something similar, saying the past 3 winners were customers who had accounts there. I've got a Brisnet account myself but I rarely use it.

[karlskorner]

Couple years back, BRIS in their newsletter announced that I had won a contest using BRIS. I dont't enter contests, but it was nice to know that I won.

[GMB@BP]

I dont know about the two previous years, but I know this years winner IS a tgraph product user on a regular basis.

[cj]

Careful, JB might come here and threaten to take you to court! :D

[hracingplyr]

yea but the guy that won the contest actually used the thorograph's to win the contest so no false advertising on thorographs part

[GR1@HTR]

If you subscribe to Bris...even thier tote services they will claim you as one of their own...I was fortunate enough to play in the NTRA tourney and they sent me (and all bris subscribers) a letter saying to stop by and pick up their PP's for free...A nice gesture but they just want to be able to stake a claim that if you win, you were a BRIS subscriber (even though you may not of used their stuff for the tourney).

[Zaf]

Yeah, I played in a few contests at the Albany Teletheater, and they always had a rep handing out free ultimate PP's, (out of the goodness of their heart) :D

ZAFONIC

[MV McKee]

We recieved a letter in the mail about a week prior to the NTRA from Brisnet.
They referred to us as BRISNET users, and offered free PP's (of various types) etc., the only catch being that we had to get the PP's by going to Harry Furlong's room at Bally's (that is not a joke).
My guess is that the 17 contestants they refer to in the advertisment have purchased product(s) from BRISNET at some point in the past 5(?) years.
I am only guessing at the timeframe based on the fact that I have not purchased anything from BRISNET since October of 2000, yet (for purposes of the NTRA tourney) was still referenced as a BRISNET customer.
Based on the number of "sheets" I saw scattered on the floor at day's end, I would guess that there were a significant number of T-Graph and Ragozin users in the contest as well, obviously current customers.

[NoDayJob]

yea but the guy that won the contest actually used the thorograph's to win the contest so no false advertising on thorographs part

:D Then all data was processed by the Slicker, Quiker, Hoss Piquer. $1.99 + S&H. :D

[GMB@BP]

The stat I saw that Tgraph made about the contest was they have a 2% marketshare in the industry and like 30% of the players in the contest used Tgraph. I dont know if that is true but its what I read.

[andicap]

I thoroughly disagree with those who say advertising is entitled to be misleading because people know it's "only advertising and they should realize companies lie."
That goes against everything the Federal Trade Commission is supposed to regulate about advertising. You can't go on TV and say, "My ice cream will prevent heart disease," and defend it because "well, it's only advertising and people expect you to lie."
The First Amendment does NOT cover advertising in its totality. There are exceptions. It is illegal to lie or deceive in your advertising for a product, (although granted the government has loosened those limits in the last few years so that almost anyone can claim they're product is healthy.)

If BRIS' statements are technically true -- I download the BRIS PP for free (as a brisbet.com customer) and only use the PPs as I would any track program, they still have a right to say their "customer" won the betting contest because I was in fact a customer. They have no idea how I'm using the program. For all they know, maybe I was using their pace/speed figures.

But if I am a customer only in the general sense, that I have IN THE PAST used BRIS, -- but did not do so for that day in question -- then they are being misleading, if not outright lying, in counting me as a customer for their promotional purposes in regard to that contest.

If they are talking generally, 80% of handicapping contests are won by BRIS customers, that would probably ge general and non-specific enough to get by since it is true and they have no way of knowing when, where, and how the winners were using their product.

Just my opinion -- if my interpretation of federal statutes here is incorrect, please set me straight. In addition, many states have much tougher consumer regulations than the federal government, so it could differ from place to place.

[GMB@BP]

I thoroughly disagree with those who say advertising is entitled to be misleading because people know it's "only advertising and they should realize companies lie."
That goes against everything the Federal Trade Commission is supposed to regulate about advertising. You can't go on TV and say, "My ice cream will prevent heart disease," and defend it because "well, it's only advertising and people expect you to lie."
The First Amendment does NOT cover advertising in its totality. There are exceptions. It is illegal to lie or deceive in your advertising for a product, (although granted the government has loosened those limits in the last few years so that almost anyone can claim they're product is healthy.)

If BRIS' statements are technically true -- I download the BRIS PP for free (as a brisbet.com customer) and only use the PPs as I would any track program, they still have a right to say their "customer" won the betting contest because I was in fact a customer. They have no idea how I'm using the program. For all they know, maybe I was using their pace/speed figures.

But if I am a customer only in the general sense, that I have IN THE PAST used BRIS, -- but did not do so for that day in question -- then they are being misleading, if not outright lying, in counting me as a customer for their promotional purposes in regard to that contest.

If they are talking generally, 80% of handicapping contests are won by BRIS customers, that would probably ge general and non-specific enough to get by since it is true and they have no way of knowing when, where, and how the winners were using their product.

Just my opinion -- if my interpretation of federal statutes here is incorrect, please set me straight. In addition, many states have much tougher consumer regulations than the federal government, so it could differ from place to place.

great post.....i think it needs to pointed out at the carefull wording that Bris used "brisnet members", that dont even say that their information was used, just that the stats represent members. its an accurate, although misleading add

[garyoz]

I think that andicap is spot on. The fact is that there is little recourse except to try to shame Bris through public forums such as PA.

An additional comment on the Thorograph and The Sheets market share. There are many ways to measure market share, one is users, a second would be on handle. I doubt that TGraph and The Sheets only account for 2% of the handle market. I remember that in the 1980's there used to be an estimate that The Sheets accounted for more than 50% of the handle at NYRA.

If you are betting serious dough, at a minimum, you are going to want to know what Tgraphs or The Sheets show because you know that serious players are using them. That is, unless you are betting with knowledge on a performance enhanced horse.

[alysheba88]

Its one of the reasons I dont enter the Brisnet contests. Those claims are totally misleading. If you are registered they count you even if you never use their stuff.

[Big Bill]

garyoz,

I discussed your concern with my contact at BRIS who sent this reply:

"Bill, thanks for the notice. I appreciate that. Just so you know, the winner (and his Dad) were both using Ultimate PPs and credited us at the awards banquet!"

Big Bill

[garyoz]

Confirmation on one user anyway. Even though we know he was also using Thorograph.