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formula_2002
11-28-2004, 08:48 AM
need to interact with some craps players.. any message boards that you can recommend?.

I have been though the search engines and have not found anything I'm looking for .

thanks

joe m

Pace Cap'n
11-28-2004, 09:16 AM
Here is a place with a few links to get you started:


http://www.dicesetter.com/links/bblinks.htm

This is the home page of that link:

www.dicesetter.com/ (http://www.dicesetter.com/)


Dice setting---something to really boggle the mind. Does the initial orientation of the tossed dice have an effect on the number rolled? Doubt any program could resolve that question.

And one other thing to consider--there are around one hundred separate wagers to be found on a craps layout, and every one of them favor the house. Except for the free odds, but then you have to make a house-favoring wager to take advatage of that.

formula_2002
11-28-2004, 09:27 AM
Thanks Pace.. I scouted that one.. I guess I'm not going to find a board like Paceadvantage out there for craps...

Pace Cap'n
11-28-2004, 09:28 AM
Perhaps there is a reason for that........

formula_2002
11-28-2004, 10:14 AM
Originally posted by Pace Cap'n
Perhaps there is a reason for that........

The thought that comes to mind is this;

A majority of casino players bet and hope to get lucky and win.

A majority of horse players hope to win and say luck has little to do with it.;)

Pace Cap'n
11-28-2004, 11:03 AM
Professional horseplayers do exist.

Except for cardplayers, there are no professional table game players.

Dave Schwartz
11-28-2004, 02:39 PM
If you want to talk dice, I suggest that you catch up with Joe Prunes.

The guy knows his stuff.


Dave Schwartz

joeprunes
11-28-2004, 03:27 PM
http://axispower.proboards12.com
http://bonesboard.proboards4.com/index.cgi?action=recent

Joe these are the best for you. The top shooters in the country and knowledgable.

Dave thanks but I`m just a puppie compared to the top boys but I`m working my way up. Talk about a tough game .

I have a better win % with horses but you can quickly win a ton of money with dice , The secret, money management and dicipline, of of course learn the game well. John Patrick has a good book on craps and anthing else on gambling.

Joe let me know how you make out if you need further help email me..jp

joeprunes
11-28-2004, 03:36 PM
Joe I dont know how to get a sites htt:// and transfer it to our site so if you cant get them then the 2 sites are

Heavys axsis power craps.com

Irishsetter`s precision shooters board .com

....jp

PaceAdvantage
11-28-2004, 09:14 PM
I edited the links so that they should work now....

formula_2002
11-29-2004, 06:08 AM
Originally posted by PaceAdvantage
I edited the links so that they should work now....

Thanks Joe P and thanks PA
.

I had visited these sites already. It's not what I looking for right now. I think I just need to keep working with my own programs for a bit.

Thanks again

Joe M

kingfin66
11-29-2004, 11:42 PM
So what is the bottom line BEST craps strategy? It seems to me the lowest advantage for the house would be playing the pass line and then house odds. But, then again, I don't know much at all about craps.

Pace Cap'n
11-29-2004, 11:55 PM
Originally posted by kingfin66
So what is the bottom line BEST craps strategy? It seems to me the lowest advantage for the house would be playing the pass line and then house odds. But, then again, I don't know much at all about craps.

You got it.

Zaf
11-30-2004, 12:29 AM
Don't forget , Casinos that offer the Field Bet that pays double for both the 2 & 12, have no advantage on the player. Its a 50-50 fair bet :D !

ZAFONIC

formula_2002
11-30-2004, 08:31 AM
Originally posted by zafonic
Don't forget , Casinos that offer the Field Bet that pays double for both the 2 & 12, have no advantage on the player. Its a 50-50 fair bet :D !

ZAFONIC

caesars offers 2-1 for the "2" and 3-1 for the "12"

The probability of winning on the field bet is 53%
the probability of loosing is 56%, when you normalize, the vig is 6.83% ..not a good bet

Zaf
11-30-2004, 11:18 AM
There are casinos which offer 3-1 for both the 2 & 12.
I was told that there is no house edge, am I wrong :confused: ?

ZAFONIC

Zaf
11-30-2004, 11:23 AM
I just ran 30005 rolls with the 2 & 12 field bet both paying 3-1.

$10 Field bet on every roll


Rolls : 30005

Net Win : $2720.00 , 0.91 %



:D

ZAFONIC

Dave Schwartz
11-30-2004, 11:27 AM
36 combinations on the dice...

You wager $1 each time.

Each roll comes up and pays as follows:


2: 1 x 4 = 4
3: 2 x 2 = 4
4: 3 x 2 = 6
9: 4 x 2 = 8
10: 3 x 2 = 6
11: 2 x 2 = 4
12: 1 x 4 = 4


Total return = 36

So, you wager $36 and return $36. No take.


Note: If 2 pays only 2/1 then you get back 35 and lose 1/36 or 2.778%.

Zaf
11-30-2004, 11:35 AM
Thanks Dave.

ZAFONIC

formula_2002
11-30-2004, 12:49 PM
Originally posted by zafonic
I just ran 30005 rolls with the 2 & 12 field bet both paying 3-1.

$10 Field bet on every roll


Rolls : 30005

Net Win : $2720.00 , 0.91 %

THE ADVANTAGE HERE TO THE BETTOR IS 4.7%




:D

ZAFONIC

formula_2002
11-30-2004, 01:05 PM
Originally posted by zafonic
Don't forget , Casinos that offer the Field Bet that pays double for both the 2 & 12, have no advantage on the player. Its a 50-50 fair bet :D !

ZAFONIC

I did make an error in for the above.

SORRY. I DID MAKE AN ERROR..
the probability ofr winning is 50% and loosing is 56%
Normalizes to a vig of 5.26%

My origional calculation was based on other conditions.

formula_2002
11-30-2004, 01:08 PM
Originally posted by zafonic
I just ran 30005 rolls with the 2 & 12 field bet both paying 3-1.

$10 Field bet on every roll


Rolls : 30005


if they both pay 3-1, then thats and even game (50-50)

Net Win : $2720.00 , 0.91 %



:D

ZAFONIC

Zaf
11-30-2004, 05:37 PM
I believe the Casinos that offer 3-1 on the 2 & 12 in the field are in the Mid West. So if this bet is a fair bet (no vig) can a betting system turn the edge in favor of the player ??? If we can eliminate a few of the losing rolls for the player we have a positive expectation, right ???

ZAFONIC

formula_2002
11-30-2004, 06:38 PM
Originally posted by zafonic
I believe the Casinos that offer 3-1 on the 2 & 12 in the field are in the Mid West. So if this bet is a fair bet (no vig) can a betting system turn the edge in favor of the player ??? If we can eliminate a few of the losing rolls for the player we have a positive expectation, right ???

ZAFONIC

Its a 50-50 game as you say, but there is no-way to turn the long term edge in favor of the player.

When I play, I play heavy and fast. Win or lose I quit after my roll and come back either that evening or the following day.
I always know the maxium I can loose in any one shooting set. It's not the key to winning but it is the key to managing losses.

Buckeye
11-30-2004, 06:46 PM
So it's not all about "the money" ?

If you want to win money the formula says do not play negative expectation games (which covers most of them) :)

I'm always looking to hear "a new revelation" and I'm wondering how many of you have read Dostoyevsky's "The Gambler" ?

formula_2002
12-01-2004, 03:22 PM
Originally posted by Buckeye
So it's not all about "the money" ?


I'm always looking to hear "a new revelation" and I'm wondering how many of you have read Dostoyevsky's "The Gambler" ?

I just finished reading "A hundred of Solitude" and was looking for a new read.. I bought "The Gambler".. Thanks for the idea.

Zaf
12-01-2004, 07:32 PM
I know each roll has the same expectation ( 50 - 50 ).

But what if we only roll say after the Field bet has lost 2 or 3 times in a row. By doing this aren't we eliminating some of the losing rolls ? I already know the answer to this question, but thought I might throw that out.

ZAFONIC

formula_2002
12-01-2004, 07:46 PM
Originally posted by zafonic
I know each roll has the same expectation ( 50 - 50 ).

But what if we only roll say after the Field bet has lost 2 or 3 times in a row. By doing this aren't we eliminating some of the losing rolls ? I already know the answer to this question, but thought I might throw that out.

ZAFONIC

What sounds interesting may be this.
Bet the pass line AND bet the 50-50 Field. It doesn't change the odds, but it may take longer to lose..

Hey, the longer it takes to lose, the better your chance of winning! (how about that for a Yogi-ism);)

Zaf
12-01-2004, 07:57 PM
What would be the house edge if we bet Pass Line with 5 times odds and the even field bet at the same time ?

ZAFONIC

formula_2002
12-01-2004, 08:10 PM
Z, they are three separate bets. Two having no vig, the other a 1.41 vig.

A lot of tables suggest that you lower the vig when you take odds. That is not correct. They are two separate bets.

I would think a 50-50 field bet is better then taking odds on the pass line. The field bet cost you nothing. Taking odds on the pass line cost you 1.41% of your pass line bet

formula_2002
12-05-2004, 10:03 AM
Originally posted by Buckeye
So it's not all about "the money" ?

If you want to win money the formula says do not play negative expectation games (which covers most of them) :)

I'm always looking to hear "a new revelation" and I'm wondering how many of you have read Dostoyevsky's "The Gambler" ?

Just finished reading the book.

Greed, love, insecurity, leadership,all the human drives well developed and a pleasant read.