HSH Software

[kdavis7837]

I am not one to tout a product or service, I have spent thousands on products, software, methods, ect.
I purchased the HSH software last week spent a couple days watching the videos, still have no Idea what I am doing, played with it a bit on Sat. Didn't care all that much for it, but yesterday, sitting around with gout flaring up and 97 degrees with no air, had only 200.00 in racing account decided to just play the software no matter what
Had tons of questions and Dave Schwartz answered every question almost immediately. I was very pleasantly surprised at the great service, anyway
still not knowing what I doing set a self imposed hit rate on bets per race, in other words the numbers of bets was determined by the Hit rate if only one hit it I bet the 1 horse according to software, sometimes it took two or more, which I have never, ever done before and goes against my personal Handicapping rules (whatever that was), it certainly wasn't skill, still millions of features I do not even understand nor did I use. and the biggest win came while conversing with Dave on the users face book page, he was explaining to me how to remove late scratches because in that particular race two of the 3 horses had scratched late, I was only playing 40 dollars a race, horse was at 15 to 1 so put the money on the remaining horse, again not skill but pure dumb luck, but the software had it on top
Bottom line, playing just two tracks, Gulfstream and Delmar I made back software purchase price and 30 days Data fee, first time in a very long time very pleased with a product, any product not just racing, it may go downhill once I tinker with it and think I know what I am doing, who knows, but very impressed with product and Dave

[Dave Schwartz]

I am not one to tout a product or service, I have spent thousands on products, software, methods, ect.
...
still not knowing what I doing set a self imposed hit rate on bets per race, in other words the numbers of bets was determined by the Hit rate if only one hit it I bet the 1 horse according to software, sometimes it took two or more, which I have never, ever done before and goes against my personal Handicapping rules (whatever that was), it certainly wasn't skill, still millions of features I do not even understand nor did I use.

...I was only playing 40 dollars a race, horse was at 15 to 1 so put the money on the remaining horse, again not skill but pure dumb luck, but the software had it on top

Bottom line, playing just two tracks, Gulfstream and Delmar I made back software purchase price and 30 days Data fee, first time in a very long time very pleased with a product, any product not just racing, it may go downhill once I tinker with it and think I know what I am doing...

Ken,

WOW!

Thank you so much for your very kind comments.

Of course, I think our software is the best, but truly I don't think that is the take away for horse players who want to improve their game.

Sure, you got lucky. A one-day test PROVES nothing.

But the main difference is in the fact that you changed your thinking process.

Over the years I've spoken with hundreds of horse players. The great majority of those players feel that they are EXPERT HANDICAPPERS.

And guess what? Most of them actually ARE!

Yet, there are so few success stories. Why is that?

I believe that it's because very few are good at figuring out what to do after the handicapping is finished.

I don't mean "How to bet." It's not about structuring tickets.

It's SOMETHING ELSE.
It's a different outlook.
A different strategy for the final selections.
Sometimes we bet the best and at other times we bet the worst.


It just so happens that DIFFERENT is what the trained HSH user does best.

Because of Ken's wonderful comment, I've decided to put HSH on sale for just $597. (https://store.pacemakestherace.com/horsestreet-handicapper/)


If you have pre-purchase questions, just pick up the phone.
775.853.1234


Dave

PS: If you bought a copy of HSH - even if it was over a decade ago, you still own it. Just call or email to get a fresh install.

*Depending upon how long ago, there might be a small upgrade fee.

[oughtoh]

I have used or tried many systems and HSH has more to it than anything I have ever seen. The things you can do with HSH is incredible, just wish it would have been around 30 years ago when I could do the research. If anyone is serious or just want to be a better player I highly recommend HSH and Dave. I have nothing invested in this, just a comment from using it for awhile.

[kdavis7837]

Didn't get the same results yesterday, The win probabilities remained close to the same, but the payoffs much, much lower. after 7 races was only .80 ahead, better than spending hrs. combing through data though, I am impressed with the amount of race factors included, things I would never think to include. Can already see how some people can really get into this, its like Handicapping on steroids, looking forward to learning more advanced features but having a blast with just the bare Minimum basics, had other software in the past, I don't know, Maybe its the all around service ? But this was just the bump I needed to make handicapping fun again, Looking forward to today, a Tuesday no less, Don't have to dwell on my traditional handicapping issues that have become so boring, thanks Dave

[lefty359]

kdavis, keep us posted with how you do with your HSH adventure...

[kdavis7837]

Well, this is going to be a process, last Sunday was kind of a fluke, the rest of week did not return the same high payouts, not even close, doing the exact same thing, hit or win rate about the same amount of winners but would be a loosing proposition in the long run, So I started looking for ways to separate contenders, I am a pace guy so I watched a Video on Dave's web site, which is one of the great things with this software, never ending amount of videos and instructions, anyway, don't have the product knowledge yet to do it the way Dave was doing it in the video, but with over a dozen ways to look at the pace I am able to find, what he called, a section of the race a horse is able to dominate. Not just a single paceline that may or may not run back to, the software is even capable of looking at class and recession certain pace #s, so much fun
I have always looked at pace as High # = fastest horse, the video explained pace in a different way, or ways so this week I am going to concentrate on finding the sections of the race that a Horse could possibly dominate and apply that to try and narrow down the contenders instead of throwing money at the top rated contenders only. Have not discussed this with Dave or the user page, I may be off in left field here, who knows? But yesterday, while at work (they expect you to do stuff, go figure) I found 2 that jumped off the screen, both won, the payoff on both was small, a 5-2 was the highest but like I said this is going to take a while lefty, but still having a blast with it , its kind of like a new or fresh perspective which I needed so bad, didn't realize just how burnt out I was, BTW spent a couple of Hrs on zoom with one of his long time users, learned a ton that I hope to apply in the near future, that's the type of stuff you don't normally get

[lefty359]

You are right. That's the stuff you don't normally get. Luck and skill to you...

[lefty359]

Also, I feel that if you can break even or lose very little while waiting for the good days, you're ahead of the game.

[mikesal57]

Well, this is going to be a process, last Sunday was kind of a fluke, the rest of week did not return the same high payouts, not even close, doing the exact same thing, hit or win rate about the same amount of winners but would be a loosing proposition in the long run, So I started looking for ways to separate contenders, I am a pace guy so I watched a Video on Dave's web site, which is one of the great things with this software, never ending amount of videos and instructions, anyway, don't have the product knowledge yet to do it the way Dave was doing it in the video, but with over a dozen ways to look at the pace I am able to find, what he called, a section of the race a horse is able to dominate. Not just a single paceline that may or may not run back to, the software is even capable of looking at class and recession certain pace #s, so much fun
I have always looked at pace as High # = fastest horse, the video explained pace in a different way, or ways so this week I am going to concentrate on finding the sections of the race that a Horse could possibly dominate and apply that to try and narrow down the contenders instead of throwing money at the top rated contenders only. Have not discussed this with Dave or the user page, I may be off in left field here, who knows? But yesterday, while at work (they expect you to do stuff, go figure) I found 2 that jumped off the screen, both won, the payoff on both was small, a 5-2 was the highest but like I said this is going to take a while lefty, but still having a blast with it , its kind of like a new or fresh perspective which I needed so bad, didn't realize just how burnt out I was, BTW spent a couple of Hrs on zoom with one of his long time users, learned a ton that I hope to apply in the near future, that's the type of stuff you don't normally get

First off...Welcome :)

Unfortunately you visited The Twilight Zone that first day....:lol:
There's nothing greater than doing something new and succeeding ...
You just want to shout it out to the world...like you did
Days later , now back on Earth , you see things as they are..
There is nothing great or magical going on....
This is horse racing!!!!
HSH is a complex and confusing program.
Dave guides people to his way of thinking that the Whales has it right and that we all need to go along with them or we are all losers.
Well , I didnt go that way....I couldn't bet low odds horses and be happy.
I believe its a slow and painful death with any of the commercial stuff out there. The Whales has access to the most intelligent and sophisticated information out there which no one can match. Thats why THEY win!!
Instead of quitting , I was determined to learn as much as I can before giving up.
I watched most videos that was available....
The break thru came when I found that I can create Excel reports within HSH. This was information that is hidden from people that most of the members dont even know about and is not divulged.
With this new knowledge I can begin my testing with regression analysis.
The 1000's of factors was reduced to maybe less than 100 factors that were considered significant and not correlated.
Of those handful , the best performing factors are Morning Line and Bris Prime...I'll let you guys figure out how good that is..
I did created some work using exports to Excel but it was time consuming and it just didn't break into profits.
Bottom line , in a nutshell, you can do just as well getting your contenders from the top 4 morning line odds as to using HSH.
If all fails doing it your way there are other options..
1) Buy Dave's time at $125/HR to get one on one lessons..
2) Buy the Seminars that come out every few months on unproven theories that you have to figure out....

This is my opinion and experience in the 1+ years with HSH..

Good Luck!!

Mike

[kdavis7837]

Thank Mike, I understand how you feel, after 40+ yrs handicapping about everyday I was just plain Burned out, It wasn't fun anymore, I didn't contact Dave because I thought he held the secrets to my fortune, been around awhile and know better, nor have I any intention of changing the basic Handicapper part of me, I contacted him because I just simply wanted something different, if I downloaded one more Bris PDF or stared at Timeform was going to rip the few hairs I have left out of my head
The way I see it, I am having fun again, its not all about the money, it helps but more about the game to me but it was to the point that I feel guilty if I didnt have my head buried in PP's.
I was Lucky, I know that but the program paid for itself the first day I attempted to use it. Dumb luck because it sure wasn't skill, I lost a little over the week, less than 100.00 I think, a good week compared to others but today I am up, a lot, not bragging but just saying its fun, more fun than say hrs reading PP's which I was beginning to hate. So its all good, the support is tremendous, I asked and there was no consultation fee, I even interrupted a couple of those guys dinners and they stayed with me, cant help it, still impressed and would recommend the product but then somethings work for some and not for others, who Knows, I developed a little system about play not play based on percentages. So far its working for me but that might change tomorrow, Like you said " Its racing" at least I can honestly say I didn't waste my money (this time anyway) Darn, see what I get just lost the first at Delmar, Inquiry not going to help

[oughtoh]

Thank Mike, I understand how you feel, after 40+ yrs handicapping about everyday I was just plain Burned out, It wasn't fun anymore, I didn't contact Dave because I thought he held the secrets to my fortune, been around awhile and know better, nor have I any intention of changing the basic Handicapper part of me, I contacted him because I just simply wanted something different, if I downloaded one more Bris PDF or stared at Timeform was going to rip the few hairs I have left out of my head
The way I see it, I am having fun again, its not all about the money, it helps but more about the game to me but it was to the point that I feel guilty if I didnt have my head buried in PP's.
I was Lucky, I know that but the program paid for itself the first day I attempted to use it. Dumb luck because it sure wasn't skill, I lost a little over the week, less than 100.00 I think, a good week compared to others but today I am up, a lot, not bragging but just saying its fun, more fun than say hrs reading PP's which I was beginning to hate. So its all good, the support is tremendous, I asked and there was no consultation fee, I even interrupted a couple of those guys dinners and they stayed with me, cant help it, still impressed and would recommend the product but then somethings work for some and not for others, who Knows, I developed a little system about play not play based on percentages. So far its working for me but that might change tomorrow, Like you said " Its racing" at least I can honestly say I didn't waste my money (this time anyway) Darn, see what I get just lost the first at Delmar, Inquiry not going to help

If your having fun again it was well worth it. Any money you make is icing on the top.

[mikesal57]

Thank Mike, I understand how you feel, after 40+ yrs handicapping about everyday I was just plain Burned out, It wasn't fun anymore, I didn't contact Dave because I thought he held the secrets to my fortune, been around awhile and know better, nor have I any intention of changing the basic Handicapper part of me, I contacted him because I just simply wanted something different, if I downloaded one more Bris PDF or stared at Timeform was going to rip the few hairs I have left out of my head
The way I see it, I am having fun again, its not all about the money, it helps but more about the game to me but it was to the point that I feel guilty if I didnt have my head buried in PP's.
I was Lucky, I know that but the program paid for itself the first day I attempted to use it. Dumb luck because it sure wasn't skill, I lost a little over the week, less than 100.00 I think, a good week compared to others but today I am up, a lot, not bragging but just saying its fun, more fun than say hrs reading PP's which I was beginning to hate. So its all good, the support is tremendous, I asked and there was no consultation fee, I even interrupted a couple of those guys dinners and they stayed with me, cant help it, still impressed and would recommend the product but then somethings work for some and not for others, who Knows, I developed a little system about play not play based on percentages. So far its working for me but that might change tomorrow, Like you said " Its racing" at least I can honestly say I didn't waste my money (this time anyway) Darn, see what I get just lost the first at Delmar, Inquiry not going to help

You have a great attitude towards things and life..
have fun and enjoy...
if you need any help , I'm here and not going anywhere...
I was lots of help on his boards but was soon going to be banned because I wasnt a downloader .
He was worried about outsiders gaining crucial ideas from him and his group.

Mike

[PaceAdvantage]

I was lots of help on his boards but was soon going to be banned because I wasnt a downloader .
He was worried about outsiders gaining crucial ideas from him and his group.WAT?

Didn't we just have some long thing where you were very much a downloader? Who got a really sweet deal in fact...

Worried about outsiders gaining crucial ideas?

Who are you? You're like the center of everything...everything is about mikey.

[mikesal57]

WAT?

Didn't we just have some long thing where you were very much a downloader? Who got a really sweet deal in fact...

Worried about outsiders gaining crucial ideas?

Who are you? You're like the center of everything...everything is about mikey.

My God ..you dont stop....:lol::lol::lol:

Yes , I did get a sweet deal but that doesnt mean I have to stay with something that didnt work for me...

As for banning non-downloaders ..its not my idea...its Daves....

You can look for his posts on that subject unless he took it down..

He got what he wanted anyway.....me off his site...

[PaceAdvantage]

My God ..you dont stop....:lol::lol::lol:

Yes , I did get a sweet deal but that doesnt mean I have to stay with something that didnt work for me...

As for banning non-downloaders ..its not my idea...its Daves....

You can look for his posts on that subject unless he took it down..

He got what he wanted anyway.....me off his site...I don't stop? You're right. It's my website. I'll post where I want to. Thanks.

[mikesal57]

I don't stop? You're right. It's my website. I'll post where I want to. Thanks.

yes Master....

[PaceAdvantage]

yes Master....Seems like you're the one trying to tell me how to behave.

Just like you...I'll post what I want, where I want, when I want.

[mikesal57]

Seems like you're the one trying to tell me how to behave.

Just like you...I'll post what I want, where I want, when I want.

Your comment is important to us.
We will give this our fullest attention.

[JimG]

Your comment is important to us.
We will give this our fullest attention.


No reason to crap up this board with posts like this. :pound::pound:

[mikesal57]

No reason to crap up this board with posts like this. :pound::pound:

ROLMAO


I love this place....

[lefty359]

This bickering is taking away the essence of the thread.

[mikesal57]

This bickering is taking away the essence of the thread.

Thats why he injects his unless comments...

Glad you realized that....I wont indulge him anymore..

[PaceAdvantage]

mikey doesn't like it when he's called out for who he actually is...

[46zilzal]

When I first went to an introductory seminar on HSH and had my doubts about its efficacy.

Those ideas dispersed in the first week I used it

[kdavis7837]

When I first went to an introductory seminar on HSH and had my doubts about its efficacy.

Those ideas dispersed in the first week I used it

Do you use the NewPace function in your process ? Been tinkering with it last couple of days trying to find patterns or standards, picks a lot of winners but not exactly a LS machine, what is your take if you do ?

[mikesal57]

Do you use the NewPace function in your process ? Been tinkering with it last couple of days trying to find patterns or standards, picks a lot of winners but not exactly a LS machine, what is your take if you do ?

There were a few NP Videos......

They were lost when his web site went down and out about 5 months ago...
I asked him a few times to put them back.....did he?

[46zilzal]

Do you use the NewPace function in your process ? Been tinkering with it last couple of days trying to find patterns or standards, picks a lot of winners but not exactly a LS machine, what is your take if you do ?

everyday...I find patterns specific to certain tracks, distances

The marvelous thing about HSH there is no ONE WAY to use it, only what works via your feedback records

I find LOTS of longshots, particularly on the PSR screen with early horses that don't stop

[kdavis7837]

everyday...I find patterns specific to certain tracks, distances

The marvelous thing about HSH there is no ONE WAY to use it, only what works via your feedback records

I find LOTS of longshots, particularly on the PSR screen with early horses that don't stop
Ha, thought I saw something like that but wasnt quit sure what I was looking at, a couple of times horses in the 100's (using raw) when others in low 90's in F1 and EP, seem to dominate pretty easily, something for me to keep track of...LOL, Been a couple of weeks, still having fun but haven't figured out a process or any type of consistency that works for me, what I like about FP is it works on all race types
thanks 46zilzal

[mikesal57]

Ha, thought I saw something like that but wasnt quit sure what I was looking at, a couple of times horses in the 100's (using raw) when others in low 90's in F1 and EP, seem to dominate pretty easily, something for me to keep track of...LOL, Been a couple of weeks, still having fun but haven't figured out a process or any type of consistency that works for me, what I like about FP is it works on all race types
thanks 46zilzal

Just dont let all that FUN ruin your retirement fund....:pound:

Did you find those old videos?

[Appy]

I enjoy checking out different software programs, although if they're real expensive that doesn't qualify for a "check it out" thing.
What pps can you use with HSH, and can you create custom filters to use with the database?

[mikesal57]

I enjoy checking out different software programs, although if they're real expensive that doesn't qualify for a "check it out" thing.
What pps can you use with HSH, and can you create custom filters to use with the database?

DATA PLAN required to use program @ $140+ per month...

PP's look like this....running lines and added pace figures after it...

[PaceAdvantage]

140+? You mean $138. Don't know where you got the "+" from.

[mikesal57]

140+? You mean $138. Don't know where you got the "+" from.

Thxs...I thought it was around there

Others charge $119

[kdavis7837]

Just dont let all that FUN ruin your retirement fund....:pound:

Did you find those old videos?
Not a Chance, I have a wife destined to fulfill that particular purpose
So many Videos, just kind of viewing as I run across them

[mikesal57]

140+? You mean $138. Don't know where you got the "+" from.

The "+" is that its raised $2 each year in JULY

This year I guess the "guilt" forced him to not raise it.....

[Speed Figure]

DATA PLAN required to use program @ $140+ per month...

PP's look like this....running lines and added pace figures after it...
Pretty basic looking PP's WOW!:eek:

[mikesal57]

Pretty basic looking PP's WOW!:eek:

Yep.....no workouts or jockey listings either.....thats why I needed PP's to go along with this...

I asked if an up-grade could be made...

But

I got the same answer to almost every request......It will cost me.....$$$$


Its amazing , everything was more money...

But now with HTR , Ken listens and sees if its applicable without a blink and no cost ....

[Dave Schwartz]

Pretty basic looking PP's WOW!:eek:

There are plenty of places to get PPs.

HSH users rarely use or need PPs. The goal is to get away from the "story handicapping" approach that is not verifiable via data.

The concept is to build systems that are either automatic or semi-automatic.



Salony: Yep.....no workouts or jockey listings either.....thats why I needed PP's to go along with this...


Not true. The important jockey factors are directly accessible to be used in your own custom reports or handicapping objects.


I asked if an up-grade could be made...
But
I got the same answer to almost every request......It will cost me.....$$$$

That's because you always asked for stuff that was difficult and only you wanted.

If you're the only one that wants it that is called, "Custom Programming."

[mikesal57]

There are plenty of places to get PPs.

HSH users rarely use or need PPs. The goal is to get away from the "story handicapping" approach that is not verifiable via data.

The concept is to build systems that are either automatic or semi-automatic.

Not everyone thinks like you.
I wanna know if I'm betting that horse that has good numbers all the time but is 0 for 22.
I wanna see if the trainers intention is good or bad for his horse in this race..
numbers cant tell you that



Not true. The important jockey factors are directly accessible to be used in your own custom reports or handicapping objects.
Jockey and trainer info needs improvement...those were your words many months ago.



That's because you always asked for stuff that was difficult and only you wanted.

If you're the only one that wants it that is called, "Custom Programming."
That was your answer to anyone that asked for something.



Your program needed a face lift for years to get rid of stuff that didnt work or you passed on because it was old....
Instead of being on Social Media all day you should devote time to fixing and advancing your software like all the other developers do.

[46zilzal]

Ha, thought I saw something like that but wasnt quit sure what I was looking at, a couple of times horses in the 100's (using raw) when others in low 90's in F1 and EP, seem to dominate pretty easily, something for me to keep track of...LOL, Been a couple of weeks, still having fun but haven't figured out a process or any type of consistency that works for me, what I like about FP is it works on all race types
thanks 46zilzal

It takes a LONG time to be comfortable...Just keep good records of what works for you and patterns will be apparent...

Try it at several tracks...I find that in a quick survey when three analysts: PSR, Magic, and Bet z agree, your chances increase dramatically.

IT is FAR better on the main that on the turf to the point that I don't play turf any longer

[mikesal57]

It takes a LONG time to be comfortable...Just keep good records of what works for you and patterns will be apparent...

Try it at several tracks...I find that in a quick survey when three analysts: PSR, Magic, and Bet z agree, your chances increase dramatically.

IT is FAR better on the main that on the turf to the point that I don't play turf any longer

magic and bet Z is not used anymore...its old stuff!!!

unless you want to start showing the newbies

[Dave Schwartz]

Not everyone thinks like you.
That would be precisely right.

I wanna know if I'm betting that horse that has good numbers all the time but is 0 for 22.
I wanna see if the trainers intention is good or bad for his horse in this race..
numbers cant tell you that

And yet, our people do it all the time.
The trainer stats are killer.

Who has stats like...
How the trainer does with horses ranked like today's for speed rating in the last race, or best of last 2, or 2nd best ever, etc?


Jockey and trainer info needs improvement...those were your words many months ago.
Despite the TStats being the best available, they DO need improvement. But not in a 22-year old program. Instead these improvements go in the new program I am developing.

The program that HSH downloaders get for absolutely zero.

And the jockey stats are too basic. They need to be expanded by a full magnitude.

If you're the only one that wants it that is called, "Custom Programming."
That was your answer to anyone that asked for something.
How would you know what EVERYONE asks for?
Sure, I get it. You did lots of unionizing behind the scenes. It is your style. Of course, the people you reached out to unionize generally report back to me.


Your program needed a face lift for years to get rid of stuff that didnt work or you passed on because it was old....
Instead of being on Social Media all day you should devote time to fixing and advancing your software like all the other developers do.


Yep. It really does need a face lift.
But AS-IS, it is far more powerful than anything else out there.


You can use IV Tables.
You can use Objects (i.e. ANY 6 factors weighted together)
Monte Carlo simulation
A couple of types of AI

In fact, you can actually MIX these methods together in a single race!
You can even build "conditional" IV Tables that only fire if a horse has a specific set of conditions. (i.e. more than 5 early speed points or ranks in the top 2 for speed rating in the last race.)

Heck, you can write your own custom reports and tag each column with a weight that sums all the columns to a percentage.

It allows you to control how your own Artificial Morning Line is created.

It manages your day by post time.

It tracks your bets.
Heck, it tracks the horses you DON'T bet and allows you to save those and figure out which of almost 4,000 factors are beating you, or how you could improve your contender process.

You can look at a subset of horses such as the ones that went to the front and determine what pointed to winners or losers.

It also allows you to create an "object" that predicts who will likely go to the front, and then study those horses to determine which factors are likely to get those horses into the winner's circle.

It allows you to isolate on top jockeys (according to the standings) and tell you what factors go with a top (or bottom) jockey winning. Same with trainers.

BTW, trainers are broken down by "circuit," because some trainers have great numbers at small tracks and crappy numbers at big tracks. (Jerry Hollendorfer at GG was a perfect example. He was a near-40% trainer in NoCal and a 13% trainer in SoCal.)

It runs automatic IV demographics so you can tell how your bets (or contenders or not bets) are doing by day-of-week, month-of-year, track, surface, distance, age, sex, field size, track cond, ES pressure and a bunch more.

It allows you to create automatic betting systems for win-place-show based upon things like field size, odds (or projected odds), contender vs non-contender, etc. Allows you to dutch, partial dutch, etc.

It allows you to filter the races on today's cards (across multiple tracks) to tag all the races you are interested in betting (or at least handicapping). You can even run multiple filters against the day with a single click. Really simple examples:
** Claiming races, ALW, HCP, skip maidens, or turf
** Maiden races with 0-3 FTS (or 4, or 7)
** Field size >4 (or 7, whatever)
** races with a certain amount of pace pressure
Just to name a few

You can EASILY grab "races like this one" (using your definition) and analyze Exacta tickets using A-B-C-D-E combinations. (Your definition of each group based upon odds.)
This allows you to instantly see that (say) D-E combinations in "races like this one" are really bad bets.


We have a thing called "Collective Speed." Simple, really. Take all the pacelines for each horse in the race and toss them into a pot. Then you sort them.

I recall a BC race back in the '90s. The issue was Bertrando vs Lure.

If you looked at the last 10 races for each horse, what you saw was that the top NINE speed ratings in the race belonged to Lure. #10 was Bertrando. #11 was Lure.

Thus, in order for Bertrando to win, Lure had to run his WORST speed rating in the last 10 and Bertrando had to run his best.

Lure paid $5.80 as I recall.


We locate races in the database through the use of a "race filter." Then we use the races found to measure/study factors (that we've chosen) to produce "good handicapping objects."

We even have the ability to do this "dynamically (i.e. on-the-fly) for each race! Thus, you open a race and the software will build a custom set of objects to handicap this race.

Oh, and it does this with a single button click.


Okay. So, as much as the software needs a face lift, it is pretty difficult to let go of. HSH has still got a few more years in her.

Oh, wait... almost forgot.
You can still select pacelines.
Or, use one of the built in paceline selection systems. Or create your own automatic paceline system.

There is a form cycle analyzer that produces what Dick Schmidt liked to call, "Those Sheet-Like Things." It will give you a look at form in a graphical format in like 4 seconds.

For many of us, Pace is still a huge part of the game. We do pace modeling without ever selecting a paceline.

HSH also tells you when a horse is over bet.
In fact, in today's World of Whales, where almost 75% of all winners will be bet down, we even predict which horses are LIKELY to be those horses.


Ok, I really am going to stop here.

So, Mike - You are right. HSH is just not a good program for you.

Sorry it did not fit your needs.

Dave
PS: For anyone who took the time to actually read all of this, I've knocked the price of HSH down to $597 (https://store.pacemakestherace.com/horsestreet-handicapper/). That's $1,000 off!

I'll leave that price for a FEW DAYS.

[mikesal57]

Not everyone thinks like you.
That would be precisely right.


numbers cant tell you that

And yet, our people do it all the time.
The trainer stats are killer.

Who has stats like...
How the trainer does with horses ranked like today's for speed rating in the last race, or best of last 2, or 2nd best ever, etc?


Jockey and trainer info needs improvement...those were your words many months ago.
Despite the TStats being the best available, they DO need improvement. But not in a 22-year old program. Instead these improvements go in the new program I am developing.

The program that HSH downloaders get for absolutely zero.

And the jockey stats are too basic. They need to be expanded by a full magnitude.

If you're the only one that wants it that is called, "Custom Programming."
That was your answer to anyone that asked for something.
How would you know what EVERYONE asks for?
Sure, I get it. You did lots of unionizing behind the scenes. It is your style. Of course, the people you reached out to unionize generally report back to me.




Yep. It really does need a face lift.
But AS-IS, it is far more powerful than anything else out there.


You can use IV Tables.
You can use Objects (i.e. ANY 6 factors weighted together)
Monte Carlo simulation
A couple of types of AI

In fact, you can actually MIX these methods together in a single race!
You can even build "conditional" IV Tables that only fire if a horse has a specific set of conditions. (i.e. more than 5 early speed points or ranks in the top 2 for speed rating in the last race.)

Heck, you can write your own custom reports and tag each column with a weight that sums all the columns to a percentage.

It allows you to control how your own Artificial Morning Line is created.

It manages your day by post time.

It tracks your bets.
Heck, it tracks the horses you DON'T bet and allows you to save those and figure out which of almost 4,000 factors are beating you, or how you could improve your contender process.

You can look at a subset of horses such as the ones that went to the front and determine what pointed to winners or losers.

It also allows you to create an "object" that predicts who will likely go to the front, and then study those horses to determine which factors are likely to get those horses into the winner's circle.

It allows you to isolate on top jockeys (according to the standings) and tell you what factors go with a top (or bottom) jockey winning. Same with trainers.

BTW, trainers are broken down by "circuit," because some trainers have great numbers at small tracks and crappy numbers at big tracks. (Jerry Hollendorfer at GG was a perfect example. He was a near-40% trainer in NoCal and a 13% trainer in SoCal.)

It runs automatic IV demographics so you can tell how your bets (or contenders or not bets) are doing by day-of-week, month-of-year, track, surface, distance, age, sex, field size, track cond, ES pressure and a bunch more.

It allows you to create automatic betting systems for win-place-show based upon things like field size, odds (or projected odds), contender vs non-contender, etc. Allows you to dutch, partial dutch, etc.

It allows you to filter the races on today's cards (across multiple tracks) to tag all the races you are interested in betting (or at least handicapping). You can even run multiple filters against the day with a single click. Really simple examples:
** Claiming races, ALW, HCP, skip maidens, or turf
** Maiden races with 0-3 FTS (or 4, or 7)
** Field size >4 (or 7, whatever)
** races with a certain amount of pace pressure
Just to name a few

You can EASILY grab "races like this one" (using your definition) and analyze Exacta tickets using A-B-C-D-E combinations. (Your definition of each group based upon odds.)
This allows you to instantly see that (say) D-E combinations in "races like this one" are really bad bets.


We have a thing called "Collective Speed." Simple, really. Take all the pacelines for each horse in the race and toss them into a pot. Then you sort them.

I recall a BC race back in the '90s. The issue was Bertrando vs Lure.

If you looked at the last 10 races for each horse, what you saw was that the top NINE speed ratings in the race belonged to Lure. #10 was Bertrando. #11 was Lure.

Thus, in order for Bertrando to win, Lure had to run his WORST speed rating in the last 10 and Bertrando had to run his best.

Lure paid $5.80 as I recall.


We locate races in the database through the use of a "race filter." Then we use the races found to measure/study factors (that we've chosen) to produce "good handicapping objects."

We even have the ability to do this "dynamically (i.e. on-the-fly) for each race! Thus, you open a race and the software will build a custom set of objects to handicap this race.

Oh, and it does this with a single button click.


Okay. So, as much as the software needs a face lift, it is pretty difficult to let go of. HSH has still got a few more years in her.

Oh, wait... almost forgot.
You can still select pacelines.
Or, use one of the built in paceline selection systems. Or create your own automatic paceline system.

There is a form cycle analyzer that produces what Dick Schmidt liked to call, "Those Sheet-Like Things." It will give you a look at form in a graphical format in like 4 seconds.

For many of us, Pace is still a huge part of the game. We do pace modeling without ever selecting a paceline.

HSH also tells you when a horse is over bet.
In fact, in today's World of Whales, where almost 75% of all winners will be bet down, we even predict which horses are LIKELY to be those horses.


Ok, I really am going to stop here.

So, Mike - You are right. HSH is just not a good program for you.

Sorry it did not fit your needs.

Dave
PS: For anyone who took the time to actually read all of this, I've knocked the price of HSH down to $597 (https://store.pacemakestherace.com/horsestreet-handicapper/). That's $1,000 off!

I'll leave that price for a FEW DAYS.

Glad you stuck your promo in there...LOL

You stated quite a few concepts here...
But how many of your subscribers actually know this...
I'll tell you ...not many if any !!
For the 18 months there it was all paid Seminars you were promoting...
which was based on un-tested theories....
New Cap...Tiers....Shark......all worthless to us but a payday for you.
I proved that your 4000+ factors was knocked down to under 100 with the research I did....but you failed to see it as usual...
20 year old factors dont work anymore...
The best are ML...Bris prime....best 2 of last 3....best 3 of 4.....this is stuff thats in $50 programs.....which I mentioned a few time but as always
you believe that your program is the best out there...

[Dave Schwartz]

Glad you stuck your promo in there...LOL

You stated quite a few concepts here...
But how many of your subscribers actually know this...
I'll tell you ...not many if any !!
For the 18 months there it was all paid Seminars you were promoting...
which was based on un-tested theories....
New Cap...Tiers....Shark......all worthless to us but a payday for you.
I proved that your 4000+ factors was knocked down to under 100 with the research I did....but you failed to see it as usual...
20 year old factors dont work anymore...
The best are ML...Bris prime....best 2 of last 3....best 3 of 4.....this is stuff thats in $50 programs.....which I mentioned a few time but as always
you believe that your program is the best out there...

My handicapping beliefs are clearly different than yours.

My experience indicates that the factors you mentioned correlate way too highly with the tote board to produce profit.

My experience also tells me that using large segments of data just plays into the hands of the whales. Since they are better at analyzing data than I am (and possibly even you), it will not lead to profit.


but you failed to see it as usual...
Yes, I really am not very astute. Thank you for pointing this flaw in my personality out to me.

20 year old factors dont work anymore...
Yes, especially when there are so many NEW factors.

Your responses show that you are on an agenda-based mission.

Conversing with you has reached a point of diminishing returns.

Why don't you give it a rest and move on?

[PaceAdvantage]

I consider this matter now closed between Mike & Dave. Both have been allowed ample opportunity to state their opinions on this matter.

Do not test me further Mike.

[46zilzal]

magic and bet Z is not used anymore...its old stuff!!!

unless you want to start showing the newbies

I don't care if it was 2000 BC but I prove DAILY that it works...

The thing about HSH YOU USE WHAT WORKS FOR YOU...There is no one way to use it

[kdavis7837]

I don't care if it was 2000 BC but I prove DAILY that it works...

The thing about HSH YOU USE WHAT WORKS FOR YOU...There is no one way to use it

Yeah, thats what I am finding out, heck I just learned about a feature yesterday that I absolutely was exited about using, played it yesterday but was not happy about payoffs, not a software problem , they paid what they paid and the software had most of them right. Rather have it that way, the picks come in, instead of a bunch of 15 to 1's that didn't hit the board !
I am sure there are a thousand other things, that's kind of the fun of it, I have tried them all at one time or another but this is the first one I actually like. Will find out over the long haul rather it works for me or not but so far its working just wish I had better product knowledge.
I haven't downloaded PP's in a long time now, subscription coming due and right now probably will cancel it, things that I thought I needed I am finding out really don't matter that much with the software and everyday I am beginning to see the races clearer like with PP's

[mikesal57]

Yeah, thats what I am finding out, heck I just learned about a feature yesterday that I absolutely was exited about using, played it yesterday but was not happy about payoffs, not a software problem , they paid what they paid and the software had most of them right. Rather have it that way, the picks come in, instead of a bunch of 15 to 1's that didn't hit the board !
I am sure there are a thousand other things, that's kind of the fun of it, I have tried them all at one time or another but this is the first one I actually like. Will find out over the long haul rather it works for me or not but so far its working just wish I had better product knowledge.
I haven't downloaded PP's in a long time now, subscription coming due and right now probably will cancel it, things that I thought I needed I am finding out really don't matter that much with the software and everyday I am beginning to see the races clearer like with PP's

Working HSH with limited knowledge and the basics you get from others..

you'll have to be able to live with low price horses...

It will take time to understand the inner workings to be able to go after the priced horses.

[traveler]

Working HSH with limited knowledge and the basics you get from others..

you'll have to be able to live with low price horses...

It will take time to understand the inner workings to be able to go after the priced horses.
Actually the goal is to extract profit from a given race - not bet low or high priced horses.

[mikesal57]

Actually the goal is to extract profit from a given race - not bet low or high priced horses.

Thats a whole different story....:lol:

Morning Line and Bris Prime are the 2 best factors ..

what type horses you think your getting

[JimG]

Thats a whole different story....:lol:

Morning Line and Bris Prime are the 2 best factors ..

what type horses you think your getting


Did you measure "best" by win pct. or ROI? Did you break it down by track, class, distance, or surface? As you know a database can be used many different ways. Having the data and being able to analyze it are potential keys to success, regardless of whatever software someone may use.



Jim

[mikesal57]

Did you measure "best" by win pct. or ROI? Did you break it down by track, class, distance, or surface? As you know a database can be used many different ways. Having the data and being able to analyze it are potential keys to success, regardless of whatever software someone may use.



Jim

I had it for 18 months....I tried many ways....

[PaceAdvantage]

I take it you missed my post where I told you that you're DONE with this topic?

How many different ways and times does someone get to post the SAME THING (ie. this software didn't work for me) until you're nothing but a troll and kicked off the board?

Despite your claim that I "have it out" for you, the fact is, you've gotten WAY MORE than your FAIR SHARE of air time on this particular topic.

ENOUGH

We all know your agenda by now and this all-consuming need to "get back" at Dave and make yourself the center of everything.

If you haven't figured out by now what the next step will be, then it's pretty obvious why HSH wasn't for you...

[mikesal57]

I take it you missed my post where I told you that you're DONE with this topic?

How many different ways and times does someone get to post the SAME THING (ie. this software didn't work for me) until you're nothing but a troll and kicked off the board?

Despite your claim that I "have it out" for you, the fact is, you've gotten WAY MORE than your FAIR SHARE of air time on this particular topic.

ENOUGH

We all know your agenda by now and this all-consuming need to "get back" at Dave and make yourself the center of everything.

If you haven't figured out by now what the next step will be, then it's pretty obvious why HSH wasn't for you...

I'm not the one asking questions..I answer them

[PaceAdvantage]

I'm not the one asking questions..I answer themWelp...I tried.

[mikesal57]

Welp...I tried.

my lips are sealed

[PaceAdvantage]

my lips are sealedQuite the contrary. You've said everything already.

[traveler]

incoherent, but....BRIS Prime has nothing to do with HSH and ML is not the "best" factor in HSH. I no longer handicap but am quite familiar with HSH.

[lefty359]

his thread was started by a new HSH user who wanted to tell us about how he was doing with it. Sadly, the thread was quickly hijacked by MikeSal.
For one I like to hear success stories about how people are doing with HSH and other software like JCapper.


I still have hopes that we can get positive reports without someone regurgitating sour grapes all over it.
In short, I want to learn.

[Appy]

From what I can tell by the example posted HSH uses propitiatory pps?

[lefty359]

Appy, like many softwares, HSH uses Data from HDW, but uses it with Dave's formulas and apps. Every software that uses HDW data or any data for that matter, uses it their own way.

[mikesal57]

his thread was started by a new HSH user who wanted to tell us about how he was doing with it. Sadly, the thread was quickly hijacked by MikeSal.
For one I like to hear success stories about how people are doing with HSH and other software like JCapper.


I still have hopes that we can get positive reports without someone regurgitating sour grapes all over it.
In short, I want to learn.

Thank you for your comment.....

Signing up for JCapper and HSH is very easy.....

Then you could tell your own story......:)

[PaceAdvantage]

That's it...you're done...bye bye

You play stupid games...you win stupid prizes

[UnifiedTheory]

That's it...you're done...bye bye

You play stupid games...you win stupid prizes


:headbanger:

[Partsnut]

Thank you for your comment.....

Signing up for JCapper and HSH is very easy.....

Then you could tell your own story......:)

I might be missing something here but in my opinion, I don't think banning MjkeSal was the right thing to do. However, It's your board and you can do as you please even if in my opinion, you're actions were somewhat dictatorial.
The provocation from both parties did not help either.

This is a forum type of bulletin board where everyone's opinion should be heard. The way I see it, there's nothing wrong when someone voices a negative opinion about a product that didn't work for him. From what I'm led to believe, He spent a tidy sum for the software and was dissatisfied with it. When he went to sell it, the provider imposed a penalty on him for a transfer of the license to another party. That to me is like trying to get blood from a stone and adding insult to injury.
I believe there's quite a bit of partiality towards your advertiser here. I completely understand, money talks and BS walks. Additionally,and evidently, your personalities are clashing. I guess you can't mix oil and water.

I suggest that those that want to hear only posiitve things should buy a "yes" machine and listen it all day long.

Mike has helped quite a few people on the Handfast segment of the board, I think you should cut him some slack.:bang:

[NorCalGreg]

his thread was started by a new HSH user who wanted to tell us about how he was doing with it. Sadly, the thread was quickly hijacked by MikeSal.
For one I like to hear success stories about how people are doing with HSH and other software like JCapper.


I still have hopes that we can get positive reports without someone regurgitating sour grapes all over it.
In short, I want to learn.

I agree with Partsnut...don't appreciate someone's comments?-- put them on ignore. I personally thought MikeSal was fine.

I wish there was a way to ELIMINATE CERTAIN POSTERS while I'm on the Forum--so I never see their comments, topics, re-quotes appearing on someone else's post, etc. I don't want them banned, I just don't want to know they exist.

Other than that....I'm just pleased as punch ;)

-NCG

[PaceAdvantage]

You two can get the F out of here with THAT bullshit.

I ALLOWED MIKESAL TONS OF SPACE TO VENT EVERY ONE OF HIS NEGATIVE OPINIONS....MORE THEN ONCE...

THEN I ALLOWED THE UGLY CLASH BETWEEN HIM AND DAVE...

HOW

MUCH

MORE

DO

YOU

TWO

WANT

TO

SEE?!?!?!?

Oh, but that WASN'T ENOUGH for MIKESAL...even after MULTIPLE WARNINGS, both thinly veiled and OUTRIGHT BLATANT, he couldn't STOP REPEATING HIMSELF.

SO F HIM. He got exactly what was coming to him.

[PaceAdvantage]

PS. This wasn't mikesal's FIRST TIME being kicked off this board.

And the last time it happened, it had NOTHING to do with an advertiser or Dave or HSH or anything like that.

So spare me the lecture on this guy.