PA gov proposes $204 million cut to horse racing subsidies

[Al Gobbi]

Pennsylvania Governor Seeking to Raid Slots Money That Goes to State Tracks

Pennsylvania Governor Tom Wolf submitted his 2020-2021 budget Tuesday, which called for a massive cut in the amount of money that goes to horse racing from slots proceeds. Wolf is seeking to take $204 million away from the Race Horse Development Fund, which totals about $250 million.

Such a move would prove devastating to racing and breeding industries, as slot money accounts for 88% of the total purses.


https://www.thoroughbreddailynews.com/pennsylvania-governor-seeking-to-raid-slots-money-that-goes-to-state-tracks/

[ultracapper]

Do it for the kids. Whenever any government entity in this country, from state governments to little one horse towns, want money, it's always for the kids. Lottery era politics.

[Tom]

Que up the Law & Order sound......

This day was bound to come....it will not be the last one like it.
Hope someone at the tracks has come with a contingency plan, when racing has to stand on its own.

[castaway01]

Que up the Law & Order sound......

This day was bound to come....it will not be the last one like it.
Hope someone at the tracks has come with a contingency plan, when racing has to stand on its own.

I imagine the plan will be to greatly cut purses back to 1990s levels. I mean, 88% of the purse money was casino money, that's crazy.

[Afleet]

Do it for the kids. Whenever any government entity in this country, from state governments to little one horse towns, want money, it's always for the kids. Lottery era politics.

exactly; we already spend more on education per student than anywhere in the world and we are not ranked in the top 10 in most educational categories. An objective person would argue that we are not getting our moneys worth now. Throwing money at something without accountability is how you arrive at the failing education system we have now.

[GMB@BP]

The most predictable thing ever.

[Secondbest]

How big is their breeding industry? If there are 40- 50 thousand jobs at stake it may not happen. Something similar was proposed a while back for NY. It was stopped dead because upstate NY has a lot of farms both harness horses and flat. I could be wrong but I think 100K jobs were at stake

[porchy44]

It has always felt a "little weird", watching $5,000 claimers running for $20,000

[AndyC]

exactly; we already spend more on education per student than anywhere in the world and we are not ranked in the top 10 in most educational categories. An objective person would argue that we are not getting our moneys worth now. Throwing money at something without accountability is how you arrive at the failing education system we have now.

Does racing have accountability? What return has the state gotten out of the subsidy of racing?

[Appy]

Sounds like horse racing (and sports betting?) is targeted by state governments in numerous places around the country. I just got a newsletter from my state senator outliningg a plan for the state to impose a NEW 7% tax on all online betting.
They previously (upon election of Brownback as governor) imposed a loophole law which levied a tax on race tracks of approx 20% more than the same tax levied against the state owned casinos, which required the race tracks to close their doors for lack of means to operate at a profit. That also put trainers like me (specializing in state bred competition) out of business, in addition to flushing all our investment down the drain overnight.

[stlseeeek]

If you needed slots to survive, this was always going to be the ending.


Slots are a band aid that leaks, leaks, and leaks, till finally the whole wound is still bloody.

Tracks that can run w/o slots and gaming machines are thriving because of added revenue. When it's your life and blood, you should of closed up shop years ago.

[thaskalos]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5clHY8mdf5U

[Afleet]

Does racing have accountability? What return has the state gotten out of the subsidy of racing?

I can't verify this as accurate. Also, remember reading a study that determined Philadelphia as the poorest big city in the US.

Wolf's proposal, which would require legislative approval, is for the next fiscal year, which begins on July 1. Sanfratello said Wolf's proposed $200 million cut represents more than 80% of the development fund that raises about $240 million annually. Of that $240 million, $18 million goes to breeders' awards, Sanfratello said, with the balance to purse revenue.

“We're going to make sure all the people in the industry get to their legislators and explain exactly what this means,” Sanfratello said. “It's about 20,000-plus jobs in the breeding and racing industry, hundreds of thousands of acres of open space, and $1.6 billion in economic impact that will be leaving the state.”

https://www.paulickreport.com/news/the-biz/pennsylvania-governor-proposes-200-million-cut-from-horse-racing-development-fund/

[Afleet]

Parx came out with a reduced racing schedule recently. That would reduce the breeders awards funding/spending as well

https://www.parxracing.com/pdf/live-racing-calendar.pdf

[thaskalos]

The money goes into what they've called the "Horse Racing Development Fund". By the fund's very name a strong argument can be made that the horse racing industry no longer deserves this money. After all...in which way has this money helped in the "development" of the sport?

[Tom]

I imagine the plan will be to greatly cut purses back to 1990s levels. I mean, 88% of the purse money was casino money, that's crazy.

That woudl be great!
Racing was much better in the 1990s than today.
Maybe if owners are not making enough money, they will race more often.

[JustRalph]

Of all the places that deserve to have their funds cut off......

I think this is a bullseye

[castaway01]

That woudl be great!
Racing was much better in the 1990s than today.
Maybe if owners are not making enough money, they will race more often.

It wouldn't be great if you like to bet on Parx. Racing there sucked 20 years ago. However, the track is almost entirely propped up by casino subsidies, and other than jacking up purses they have done little to justify that.

Parx/Philadelphia Park has always been good at making money and giving little back to racing or horseplayers. They developed a great OTB system and while I won't go into stuff from 20 years ago, it was well documented how they funneled that money overseas while not paying any taxes here. When they got their casino windfall, they could have cut their ridiculous takeout and never did a thing to benefit horseplayers.

From the chart with the Paulick Report article, it's amazing how much handle has declined despite the massive increase in the quality of racing. What that says about horse racing as a whole isn't pretty.

[cj]

Big purses have done absolutely nothing to help the sport. If anything, it has been the exact opposite. I'd argue it has led to horses being treated more like commodities than living animals. This has brought on plenty of problems by itself. They have ruined the claiming game and they have also greatly increased the incentive to cheat while at the same time making it more affordable to do just that with illegal meds. They have made bettors minor customers since it isn't betting dollars creating the big purses.

I have no idea if racing can survive without all the subsidies any longer, but we'll find out in coming years, that is a certainty. It isn't a matter of if but when.

[Tom]

It wouldn't be great if you like to bet on Parx. Racing there sucked 20 years ago. However, the track is almost entirely propped up by casino subsidies, and other than jacking up purses they have done little to justify that.

Parx/Philadelphia Park has always been good at making money and giving little back to racing or horseplayers. They developed a great OTB system and while I won't go into stuff from 20 years ago, it was well documented how they funneled that money overseas while not paying any taxes here. When they got their casino windfall, they could have cut their ridiculous takeout and never did a thing to benefit horseplayers.

From the chart with the Paulick Report article, it's amazing how much handle has declined despite the massive increase in the quality of racing. What that says about horse racing as a whole isn't pretty.

I loved Parx since it was Keystone, Philly Park.....since Tony Black was an apprentice!

One of the highlights of my racing life was when OTB would take Keystone on Tuesdays.

[lamboguy]

the higher the purses lead to higher prices for horses and bigger vet bills and day rates which lead to fewer people owing horses which leads to less people interested in racing.

[cj]

I loved Parx since it was Keystone, Philly Park.....since Tony Black was an apprentice!

One of the highlights of my racing life was when OTB would take Keystone on Tuesdays.

Some of the best racing days in my life were spent on the apron freezing my butt off in January after betting speed on frozen tracks at Philly Park and watching them wire and win off by many lengths! Some days was literally so cold I couldn't make it the whole race if it were two turns.

[alydar]

Bottom line:

Any business that cannot support itself needs to readjust and not look for handouts. Anyone who didn't see this coming is blind. More to come as states look for more money. Racing needs to find a way to survive on its own two feet.

[Redboard]

The PA horsemen have had a lot of time to get their act together. We all knew purse supplements wouldn’t last forever. They’ve had a “window of opportunity” to put a decent product on the track that would interest horse players and make ends meet. And maybe threw in a couple of ideas we kicked around in the “Incentives for Track Attendee” thread.

First of all, there is no logical reason why PA’s three tracks can’t operate sequentially, instead of simultaneously. Penn National, Parx, and Presque Isle do not have to have overlapping meets. Southern California, for many years, ran three tracks (Hollywood, Santa Anita, and Del Mar) that way. With no purse supplements. Why can’t PA do the same?

Parx and Penn National run 12 months a year. For who? For what? From May to October, all three of them are running simultaneously. The three tracks run about 450 days a year combined, around 3,600 races.

As the new czar of PA racing, here’s what I’d do:
Penn National : March, April, May.
Presque Isle: June, July, August.
Parx: September, October, November.

Four days a week, 10 races per day. Take December, January, February off. That would equal around 480 races per meet, with three meets, that’s 1,440 races per year. I’m sure the governor would settle for a 50% cut in supplements ($125 million) rather than the 80% cut he proposed($204 M).
So you’d have 1,440 races to supplement with $125 million (rather than 3,600 races with $250 million). That’s about $87k per race rather than $69k(or about $18k more). You could offer higher purses which would attract better trainers/connections, and have better fields. Get rid of the statebreds, if these people can’t breed a decent horse that can compete, that’s their problem. I didn’t say “fuller” fields. The concept of larger fields being “better” fields for the horse player, is not always true.

The meets would be more “special,” since each track would have live racing only 12 weeks of the year. Attendance would be better.

[Redboard]

the higher the purses lead to higher prices for horses and bigger vet bills and day rates which lead to fewer people owing horses which leads to less people interested in racing.

You'll have to explain why higher purses lead to this. I can understand why higher purses lead to better competition, but don't the summer Saratoga and Del Mar meets have the highest purses and the best fields?

[GMB@BP]

You'll have to explain why higher purses lead to this. I can understand why higher purses lead to better competition, but don't the summer Saratoga and Del Mar meets have the highest purses and the best fields?

I dont think the purses at those meets mean much in drawing fields, they have history and prestige that attract people to participate.

[castaway01]

You'll have to explain why higher purses lead to this. I can understand why higher purses lead to better competition, but don't the summer Saratoga and Del Mar meets have the highest purses and the best fields?

It certainly doesn't apply to Parx because their main defense for not having their casino funds taken is the massive increase in PA breeding (and jobs) from breeders going after those big purses and how the whole state would be devastated if that ended. Which obviously isn't true, but casino subsidies are the only reason there is still racing at Parx and Penn National. Those purses led to a gravy train for a select few for a number of years, but horseplayers were never in that group (but I will admit having the big slot-fueled race days a half-hour from me was cool...it was fun to see those horses up close).

[cj]

You'll have to explain why higher purses lead to this. I can understand why higher purses lead to better competition, but don't the summer Saratoga and Del Mar meets have the highest purses and the best fields?

I don't think Del Mar is really in the same class as Saratoga any more. The purses aren't that great and the fields aren't that good.

[Big Peps]

I don't think Del Mar is really in the same class as Saratoga any more. The purses aren't that great and the fields aren't that good.


Agreed. I think there are 4 premier meets at this point where racing is actually a solid attraction.

Keeneland ( spring/ fall) Saratoga and Oaklawn. That's it, IMO.

Everything else is pretty much tumbleweed filler

[therussmeister]

Agreed. I think there are 4 premier meets at this point where racing is actually a solid attraction.

Keeneland ( spring/ fall) Saratoga and Oaklawn. That's it, IMO.

Everything else is pretty much tumbleweed filler

So you are not a fan of Kentucky Downs?

[cj]

So you are not a fan of Kentucky Downs?

I'd say at this point it isn't really a meet, not even a week of racing. Of course the racing is great during that time, not trying to say otherwise.

[Tom]

Some of the best racing days in my life were spent on the apron freezing my butt off in January after betting speed on frozen tracks at Philly Park and watching them wire and win off by many lengths! Some days was literally so cold I couldn't make it the whole race if it were two turns.

There was a time when you could blindly bet the 1 and 2 horse in every race and make a profit. For long periods of time. Inside was pretty much all that mattered.

My track-Buddy and I used to drive down to Penn and Key/Philly a few times a year....winter for sure when FL was closed. I still feel the cold some days!

God, those were the days!:headbanger:

[Redboard]

I'd say at this po....
Of course the racing is great during that time, not trying to say otherwise.

And why do you think the racing is great there?

Never mind.

[cj]

And why do you think the racing is great there?

Never mind.

They have used subsidies the right way, though the track wasn't given much choice as the other tracks fought hard against giving them more days.

[Afleet]

The money goes into what they've called the "Horse Racing Development Fund". By the fund's very name a strong argument can be made that the horse racing industry no longer deserves this money. After all...in which way has this money helped in the "development" of the sport?

foal numbers increased in Pennsylvania-one of the very few in the nation

[alhattab]

There was a time when you could blindly bet the 1 and 2 horse in every race and make a profit. For long periods of time. Inside was pretty much all that mattered.

My track-Buddy and I used to drive down to Penn and Key/Philly a few times a year....winter for sure when FL was closed. I still feel the cold some days!

God, those were the days!:headbanger:

I’ve been on a few of those days. Snuck in beers in our winter coats. So cold and windy one day that my friend said the bugle was going to stick to the buglers lips (they still had a live hornblower). Dave Monaci!

[cj]

I’ve been on a few of those days. Snuck in beers in our winter coats. So cold and windy one day that my friend said the bugle was going to stick to the buglers lips (they still had a live hornblower). Dave Monaci!

Didn't he pass away? He was one big dude. Always was nice to me the few times I met him, seemed to be a trainer a had a really good read on when his horses would run well.

[alhattab]

Didn't he pass away? He was one big dude. Always was nice to me the few times I met him, seemed to be a trainer a had a really good read on when his horses would run well.

He did, at 53. The obit is still on legacy.com. Central Jersey guy. When I did the search this gem showed up from a 2006 Pace Advantage Post:

“And then there was Big Dave Monaci, not a very pleasant character. Even when he wasn't running any, Dave would hang near the tunnel all afternoon and bet with both hands. He'd be wearing coveralls big enough to cover the Shea Stadium infield, scaring the women and small children, and sometimes me. Dave also had a nice sprinter back then -- Robyn Dancer, I think. ”

Big guy no doubt. I will remember him for having a horse lose by double digits then come back next out and wire the field. I’m sure he pulled the stunt a few times on that frozen Keystone track.

Anyone else remember the starter handicap star Blue Mug? I loved the Pha, GSP circuit. Marty Fallon, Jeff Kirk, Mark Reid, Camac. Good times!

[proximity]

The PA horsemen have had a lot of time to get their act together. We all knew purse supplements wouldn’t last forever. They’ve had a “window of opportunity” to put a decent product on the track that would interest horse players and make ends meet. And maybe threw in a couple of ideas we kicked around in the “Incentives for Track Attendee” thread.

First of all, there is no logical reason why PA’s three tracks can’t operate sequentially, instead of simultaneously. Penn National, Parx, and Presque Isle do not have to have overlapping meets. Southern California, for many years, ran three tracks (Hollywood, Santa Anita, and Del Mar) that way. With no purse supplements. Why can’t PA do the same?

Parx and Penn National run 12 months a year. For who? For what? From May to October, all three of them are running simultaneously. The three tracks run about 450 days a year combined, around 3,600 races.

As the new czar of PA racing, here’s what I’d do:
Penn National : March, April, May.
Presque Isle: June, July, August.
Parx: September, October, November.

Four days a week, 10 races per day. Take December, January, February off. That would equal around 480 races per meet, with three meets, that’s 1,440 races per year. I’m sure the governor would settle for a 50% cut in supplements ($125 million) rather than the 80% cut he proposed($204 M).
So you’d have 1,440 races to supplement with $125 million (rather than 3,600 races with $250 million). That’s about $87k per race rather than $69k(or about $18k more). You could offer higher purses which would attract better trainers/connections, and have better fields. Get rid of the statebreds, if these people can’t breed a decent horse that can compete, that’s their problem. I didn’t say “fuller” fields. The concept of larger fields being “better” fields for the horse player, is not always true.

The meets would be more “special,” since each track would have live racing only 12 weeks of the year. Attendance would be better.

with the possible exception of the state bred part I think this is probably a pretty good post if we're going to allow this farce to continue in Pennsylvania.

at this point on track bets made with a players card should be rebated 100% to make this palatable to the general gambler.

[TonyK@HSH]

A description from a Pa legislator regarding this issue. Shines light on the overall economic impact to the state as well as the legality of the Governors proposal.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-6v6JODxocw

[PaceAdvantage]

Thought that was Phil Donahue for a second...yeah, I'm old.

[lamboguy]

I’ve been on a few of those days. Snuck in beers in our winter coats. So cold and windy one day that my friend said the bugle was going to stick to the buglers lips (they still had a live hornblower). Dave Monaci!Dave Monaci never met a doughnut he didn't love

[biggestal99]

Agreed. I think there are 4 premier meets at this point where racing is actually a solid attraction.

Keeneland ( spring/ fall) Saratoga and Oaklawn. That's it, IMO.

Everything else is pretty much tumbleweed filler

Agree with keeneland/Saratoga.

Disagree with oaklawn.

No turf course is the obvious drawback.

Allan