Most Outlandish Breeders Cup Entry [Archive] - Horse Racing Forum - PaceAdvantage.Com

JustRalph

10-21-2004, 08:15 PM

I have been looking at the Breeders Cup pre-entries.......some of these horses I am not very familiar with. I was wondering who you think is the most outlandish entry? I know some owners enter horses just so they can attend and party with the other owners. But some of these horses seem more than a little out of place.........any comments?

betchatoo

10-21-2004, 08:21 PM

Twice Unbridled is a maiden running against a decent field in the Juvenile. He may still be running come Halloween.

Zaf

10-21-2004, 08:21 PM

Azeri in the classic :eek:

She will finish way back in the pack here. Hope she goes in the distaff.

ZAFONIC

kingfin66

10-22-2004, 01:59 AM

Is Azeri entered in both the Distaff and the Classic? I hope she runs in the Distaff too.

Buddha

10-22-2004, 02:14 AM

Originally posted by kingfin66
Is Azeri entered in both the Distaff and the Classic? I hope she runs in the Distaff too.

For now it is a pre-entry. You can choose multiple BC races, and give a preference. Azeri is pre-entered in both with the Distaff being the preferred one. I think it is like the Wednesday before the BC, this Wed, they will draw the entries, and at that time they have to specify which race they are going to run it. I too would prefer to see her run in the Distaff, as it is what she is more competitive with.

On a side note, I can't believe there are only 8 noms for the Juvenile. That is going to be a small field :)

10-22-2004, 03:23 AM

Bay Marvel? What are his connections smoking?

Valuist

10-22-2004, 10:21 AM

I haven't checked the entries out. Bay Marvel? CJ, I think the answer to your question is definitely crack. When an 88 Beyer can win the BC Sprint, Bay Marvel will be a contender.

What was the name of that rat who ran in the Turf a few years back? The horse was a $4,000 claimer that some nutcase ran and amazingly, was bet down lower than Arl Million winner Marlin. I think he was beaten around 125 lengths.

OTM Al

10-22-2004, 12:33 PM

If it was last year , Twice Unbridled would have a shot. That group of horses was awful. Despite the short field this year in the Juv, there are some solid horses in there and I would think any of the other 7 could win it without a miracle trip.

I would say the biggest joke is in the Sprint. Cuvee was washed up as a 2yo. Putting him back at this level is a joke. He doesn't look ready or even capable of it. Hope he just comes out not hurt if they leave him in.

10-22-2004, 01:49 PM

Originally posted by Valuist

What was the name of that rat who ran in the Turf a few years back? The horse was a $4,000 claimer that some nutcase ran and amazingly, was bet down lower than Arl Million winner Marlin. I think he was beaten around 125 lengths.

Rick's Natural Star! I didn't even have to look it up! (I hope I'm right now :D )

Valuist

10-22-2004, 01:58 PM

That would be him. I remember being shocked that NBC wasted considerable time w/a feature on him. If I was the owner of another horse in one of the races, I'd be insulted he was getting all that publicity.

CryingForTheHorses

10-22-2004, 02:16 PM

Originally posted by cj
Rick's Natural Star! I didn't even have to look it up! (I hope I'm right now :D )

You are correct CJ, Lisa my wife is the girl who rode him, As for being insulted because this horse got lots of attention...The media done this..

Bubbles

10-22-2004, 02:41 PM

What is that Japanese horse doing in the Classic?

Valuist

10-22-2004, 03:21 PM

McShell-

No offense to your wife on that. Since you were closely involved in the Ricks Natural Star incident, what was the trainer/owner thinking? Did he really think he could take a cheap claimer and even remotely compete w/the best grass horses in the world?

ceejay

10-22-2004, 03:43 PM

Originally posted by Bubbles
What is that Japanese horse doing in the Classic?

He is a G1 winner @ 10F (but agianst 3yo's) and did beat elders two back. But he does need to take a step (or leap foward) to win in here....

CryingForTheHorses

10-23-2004, 05:06 AM

Originally posted by Valuist
McShell-

No offense to your wife on that. Since you were closely involved in the Ricks Natural Star incident, what was the trainer/owner thinking? Did he really think he could take a cheap claimer and even remotely compete w/the best grass horses in the world?

Lisa still had the bug when Rick came to town, All the woodbine jocks were laughing and saying they wouldnt ride the horse, Lisa was just there to pickup mounts, The guy did think his horse was a turfer, Lisa galloped him and then took him to the turf course where he ran off with her going 3/4 in 1.11 flat..That was never published in the form.When he did that..We did think he may have had a shot

KirisClown

10-25-2004, 04:40 AM

CryingForTheHorses

10-25-2004, 02:42 PM

Originally posted by KirisClown
Doc Livingston was a lunatic... Durkin did a great feature on the horse for NBC, also interviewed Livingston... watching it still makes me laugh.

DURKIN did nothing but INSULT this man, Doesnt matter what his motive or what he though his horse would/could do, Durkin and the rest of the media made a mockery of this man and his horse, He did put up his money!..What if??.Dr Livingston had a dream and he tried to fulfill it, Funny thing is, The man never raised his voice or winced his words when he tried to explain his reasoning for hs entry.All Durkin and the media did was insult him..

KirisClown

10-25-2004, 05:41 PM

When you enter a horse like RICKS NATURAL STAR in a race like the BC Turf. I think you open the doors to that sort of criticism. The horse had no buiness racing that day.

The media got on him, because Livinsgton was putting his own interests ahead of the horse. It was potentially a dangerous situation, the horse was by no means prepared to run 12F against some of the best turfers in the world.

CryingForTheHorses

10-25-2004, 07:15 PM

Originally posted by KirisClown
When you enter a horse like RICKS NATURAL STAR in a race like the BC Turf. I think you open the doors to that sort of criticism. The horse had no buiness racing that day.

The media got on him, because Livinsgton was putting his own interests ahead of the horse. It was potentially a dangerous situation, the horse was by no means prepared to run 12F against some of the best turfers in the world.

Ok expert!\
Didint see you there as I led him to the track..you wernt there when Lisa rode him in the morn and how he trained , You also didnt see him work 3/4 on the turf in 113 after he galloped a mile (The media NEVER said a word about that work) on the main track..You didnt see him take off and pass "other Breeders cup horses" that were also working that morn,You didnt see himcome back from that work..Hardly puffing at all..So tell me he wasnt fit,Horse got his tongue over the bit and gagged..They said he bled..Funny how people just assume that just because someone has the balls to do what he did..I beg you to differ..LMAO@ best turfers...MARLIN??????

KirisClown

10-26-2004, 05:01 AM

Originally posted by McSchell_Racing
Ok expert!\
Didint see you there as I led him to the track..you wernt there when Lisa rode him in the morn and how he trained , You also didnt see him work 3/4 on the turf in 113 after he galloped a mile (The media NEVER said a word about that work) on the main track..You didnt see him take off and pass "other Breeders cup horses" that were also working that morn,You didnt see himcome back from that work..Hardly puffing at all..So tell me he wasnt fit,Horse got his tongue over the bit and gagged..They said he bled..Funny how people just assume that just because someone has the balls to do what he did..I beg you to differ..LMAO@ best turfers...MARLIN??????

Expert? no.. just someone who differs in opinion from you.

I undertand your defense of this horse, as you had a connection to him, that defense is admirable.

But, wait.....You're laughing at "best turfers"? Are you serious? Please... say you're not. Take a look at that field... If you're unaware of their accomlishments, I'll do a run down.

PILSUDSKI
SWAIN
SHANTOU
WINDSHARP
TALLOIRES
DUSHYANTOR
WALL STREET
AWAD
LUNA WELLS
CHIEF BEARHEART
DIPLOMATIC JET
MARLIN

10-26-2004, 06:37 AM

While I would agree the horse had no shot and really didn't belong in the race, I think it would have been wrong to exclude the horse. The man paid his money, and it was not a full field. To exclude the horse would have been flat out wrong.

Horses are entered in horrible spots every day of the year at every racetrack running, so I don't see how this situation was any more dangerous for the horse or the other horses in the field than any other race.

Valuist

10-26-2004, 09:39 AM

McShell--

There's a ginormous difference between Marlin and Rick's Natural Star. Marlin was a proven commodity; an Arlington Million winner. In most years, the Million is the best non-Breeders Cup grass race run on the continent. A 6f grass work does not make a proven commodity. Even cheap horses can occasionally run a fast 6f.

CryingForTheHorses

10-26-2004, 02:35 PM

Originally posted by KirisClown
Expert? no.. just someone who differs in opinion from you.

I undertand your defense of this horse, as you had a connection to him, that defense is admirable.

But, wait.....You're laughing at "best turfers"? Are you serious? Please... say you're not. Take a look at that field... If you're unaware of their accomlishments, I'll do a run down.

PILSUDSKI
SWAIN
SHANTOU
WINDSHARP
TALLOIRES
DUSHYANTOR
WALL STREET
AWAD
LUNA WELLS
CHIEF BEARHEART
DIPLOMATIC JET
MARLIN

I do agree that it was a stellar field, I have seen 2500 claimers win 100 granders when they have switched to the turf,,Ill give you 1 example. This horse ran and was sold in the test barn for 2500...His Name was John Henry..Another exampe is a horse that ran in Canada..His name was Beau Fasa. Here was another horse who couldnt win on the dirt of 2500..He did win 100 granders on the turf.These may have been the best turfers in the world at the time..But What if??.It was still no reason to make a mockery of the man and his horse, Poor guy didnt even get to go in the breeders cup barn with his horse..No security and no protection from the media, kooks or anyone who had it in for this horse being in that race, That too me showed the ignorance of the Breeders Cup Ass,I thought they had more class. Its run like a old wives club!! This man did pay his money and deserved to run..even if he was outclassed.

Valuist

10-26-2004, 02:51 PM

But still, even if he felt the horse would improve significantly on the grass, why not start out in an easier spot? You mention John Henry; I believe he ran in claiming, but a little higher price. Like $35000. $35000 back then is probably like an open $75000 race now. Open $75000 claiming are pretty good horses. This guy could've picked a ton of ungraded stakes or allowances, even starter allowances, which he was eligible for. He could've run in 15000 or 20000 claiming on the turf and likely wouldn't have been claimed. Why run a horse over its head?

Bubbles

10-26-2004, 02:55 PM

John Henry really doesn't qualify as an example, as he won the Santa Anita Handicap on dirt. He just got better with age, all nine years of it. ;)

10-26-2004, 03:23 PM

The Breeder's Cup people take in a lot of money for horses to be eligible. They charge a ridiculously high fee to enter if not nominated at birth.

Does anyone think for one minute that they would start giving money back to those who want to run but aren't "good enough?" They would go broke.

The horse came out of the race fine. The guy had his five minutes of fame. What was the harm?

CryingForTheHorses

10-26-2004, 07:40 PM

Originally posted by cj
The Breeder's Cup people take in a lot of money for horses to be eligible. They charge a ridiculously high fee to enter if not nominated at birth.

Does anyone think for one minute that they would start giving money back to those who want to run but aren't "good enough?" They would go broke.

The horse came out of the race fine. The guy had his five minutes of fame. What was the harm?

It was huge CJ..Had a lot of fun and laughs,The crowd made the "Hometown" girl feel good..There was a roar when the winner crossed the wire and then a minute later the crowd roared again for Rick as he crossed the wire.Thanks for seeing my view

Mr_Ed

04-01-2011, 11:38 PM

Hard to believe Ricks Natural Star went off at 56-1! WPS pool was 2.7 million. I always found that intriguing.

http://www.equibase.com/premium/eqbPDFChartPlus.cfm?BORP=P&STYLE=EQB&DAY=D&tid=WO&dt=10/26/1996&ctry=CAN&race=9

Who here has a souvenir ticket?

Also, is the horse, or Dr. Livingston, still alive?

Marlin

04-01-2011, 11:50 PM

Just to right a past wrong. Marlin was not a million winner going into this race. He was a 3yo that won the Secretariat. The next year he did win the Million. He also would most likely have went favored in the BC Turf that season had he not been injured in his final prep. I also think he was jobbed for the Turf Eclipse that year, but that is for another thread.:)

KirisClown

04-02-2011, 12:10 AM

From a Daily News article..

"Rick was there because his owner-trainer, veterinarian William Livingston, was convinced the horse would finish no worse than fifth. Livingston developed a cure for leukemia in cats, he said, and could treat navicular disease (lameness) in horses. If Rick ran like a champ, in his first start in 15 months, the publicity would do wonders for Livingston, who wanted to spread the word about other terrific products of his "that can help the world."

Full Article (http://www.nydailynews.com/archives/sports/1997/01/22/1997-01-22__star__grazing___rick__heads.html)

bigmack

04-02-2011, 01:02 AM

Freakish happenings:

- Newly joined Mr. Ed blubs-up a nearly 7 year old thread.

- Vibrant participant, KrisClown is quickly onboard with an article from '97.

- William Livingston claims a cure for feline leukemia, which doesn't exist.

What's next?

http://matellis.com/archives/batchild.gif

Mr_Ed

04-02-2011, 01:07 AM

:lol:

highnote

04-02-2011, 03:07 AM

Rick's Natural Star! I didn't even have to look it up! (I hope I'm right now :D )

The best thing about Rick's Natural Star is that he was 60-1!!!!! Talk about an underlay. The only way he could have possibly won is if every other horse did not finish. The odds of that were at least a million to one.

A great example of the favorite / longshot bias.

JustRalph

04-02-2011, 05:10 AM

A six year old thread comes back to life........

HUSKER55

04-02-2011, 07:32 AM

ok bigmack, now we know what batman did in the batcave:D

Mr_Ed

05-20-2013, 04:15 PM

Rick's Natural Star........15 years later:

http://nmhorseracingnews.com/2011/10/30/ricks-natural-star%e2%80%99s-story-continues-to-amaze-bewilder-15-years-later-thoroughbred-times/

rastajenk

05-20-2013, 04:34 PM

From the linkage:

"He should have been 5,000-to-1,” said Lisa McFarland, who rode Ricks Natural Star in the Turf. McFarland, age 49, now operates a small stable with her husband, trainer Tom Schell , at Calder Race Course in South Florida.

Who knew? That's cool. :cool: