Poll tax, literacy test et al needed?

[JustMissed]

Everywhere I look I read about some sort of voter fraud going on.

Just yesterday they caught a lady registering 35 times.

They are signing up folks at malls and shopping centers without any identity checks.

In an effort to register as many DemLibs as possible our registration is being to look like that of a banana republic or third world country.

I hope our new preident whether Bush or Kerry will encourage states to change that registration laws and somehow get rid of those liberal court descisions that got us into this mess.

Some suggestions are:

1. Can only register at Supervisor of Elections Office or by Deputy Clerk if off-site.

2. Charge a small poll tax.

3. Have some sort of literacy test to prove person capable of reading.

4. Have some sort of test to demonstrate person knows the mechanics of voting.

5. Require proof of citizenship.

The system we have envolved to is horrible. Something has got to be done.

JM

[OTM Al]

Sorry, but I've got to say you are completely off base here. None of these things you mention will stop determined individuals from trying to vote multilple times. Proof of citizenship is a given, but the rest of the things you mention are things that have been done over time to stop legitimate voters from being able to cast their ballot. Literacy tests were a common way to exclude black voters in the south many years ago. A poll tax is the worst of these. All it does is insure that the poor are never heard at the polls. Voter registration should be even more automatic than it is. Any citizen that sends in a federal tax form, gets a drivers license (over 18 of course), registers for selective services, or any other such interaction with the government should be automatically registered. Yes, there will be flaws and attempts at abuse of the system, but tell me one system that is so perfect that these things can't happen. The ability to vote is a constitutional right and any attempt to restrict it is just as wrong if not even worse than the things you cite.

[JustMissed]

Al, I totally disagree with you. Voting should be made more difficult, not easier.

Voting is a privlege, not a right you know.

As far as literacy test, everyone in USA should be able to read. If not, why are we spending all those billons on public education?Literacy test may have been racist after the civil war but not in 2004.

Poll tax. At one point in our history only landowners paid taxes and there was a tax imported goods. In order to have the people that paid no tax(ie-non land owners)they were asked to kick in a few bucks to pay for the election.

I'm actually talking about a few bucks to help cover admin costs and give the voter a feeling that voting is serious business. What kind of impression does it leave on a first-time voter who is signed-up by "some dude" at the mail.

I swear if you guys keeping being so soft on citizenship issues and voting issues, we are going to wake up some morning looking like a third-world country. Or maybe that is what you want?

JM

[OTM Al]

No, its a right. Having a drivers license is a privledge. Voting is a right. The 15th amendment to the constitution is titled "The Right of Citizens to Vote" and states

Section 1. The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall
not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on
account of race, color, or previous condition of servitude.

That doesn't say privledge , it says right.

Then we have the 19th amendment. "Women's Suffarage Rights"

Section 1. The right of the citizens of the United States to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on account of sex.

Again that funny word "right"

As for poll taxes, here's the 24th amendment

Section 1. The right of citizens of the United States to vote in any primary or other election for President or Vice President, for electors for President or Vice President, or for Senator or Representative in Congress, shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or any State by reason of failure to pay any poll tax or other tax.

Poll taxes are an abridgement of the right to vote because they cause exclusion of the poor. They didn't ask the non landowners to kick in a few bucks, the landowners told them they had too knowing full well that they could not.

And finally the 26th amendment which reduced the voting age to be uniformly 18

Section 1. The right of citizens of the United States, who are eighteen years of age or older, to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on account of age.

Again that nutty word "right".

Yeah I agree that everyone should know how to read, except of course the blind, dyslexic, and those with other handicaps, physical as well as social, that are unable to, but then why should they have the same rights as the rest of us. The ability to read or write is not required to be a citizen of this country.

And that "some dude at the mall" is doing one fine public service by spending his day out there helping his fellow citizens. I think it would give a first time voter a very positive experience in knowing that people are out there volunteering their time to help and work for their causes rather than standing in line to hand some form to another bureaucrat.

Your third world comment is the part that really bugs me though. This is and hopefully always will be a country created and made great by immigrants. One branch of my family has been here a long time but the rest of it got here little more than 100 years ago. So maybe I shouldn't have these rights either? What is the difference between me and a man from Pakistan who got his citizenship 10 years ago or a woman from Ghana who got it yesterday? The answer is nothing in terms of our rights. I believe we should have tough citizenship rules. We shouldn't just give it away to anyone, but those who do the work to qualify often make much more concientious citizens than some of us who are born into it.

[JustMissed]

Hey AL, they are getting $2 per application:

"

I-Team investigation uncovers voter registration fraud
written by: Deborah Sherman (I-Team Reporter) and Nicole Vap (Executive Producer Investigative)
Created: 10/11/2004 7:29 PM MDT - Updated: 10/11/2004 10:55 PM MDT



The I-Team has uncovered some disturbing evidence of voter registration fraud. 10 p.m. Oct. 11, 2004.



DENVER - With just 21 days left until an election in which every vote will count, the 9News I-Team has uncovered voter registration fraud that could cause chaos on Election Day for hundreds, possibly thousands of Colorado voters.

9News has discovered a record number of fraudulent voter-registrations across the state. Secretary of State Donetta Davidson tells 9News she is concerned about what the I-Team has uncovered and wants those responsible prosecuted. "It has just gone rampant," she told reporter Deborah Sherman in an interview Monday afternoon.

Most of the fraud has come from registration drives, where people at grocery stores or on the streets ask you to sign up. 9News has learned many workers have re-registered voters multiple times by changing or making up information about them. 9News has documented 719 cases of potentially fraudulent forms at county election offices show fraudulent names, addresses, social security numbers or dates of birth in Denver, Douglas, Adams, Boulder and Lake counties. Information from other counties is still coming in.

Some voter registration application forms are completely bogus. Others belong to legitimate voters, who have had one or two facts changed that could affect their registration when they show up at the polls November 2nd. Tom Stanislawski registered to vote six years ago. But this summer, someone signed him up again and changed his party affiliation. "My concern would be I'd walk in November 2nd and be unable to vote," he said.

Some of the registration drive workers earn $2 per application or about $10 an hour. One woman admitted to forging three people's names on about 40 voter registration applications. Kym Cason says she was helping her boyfriend earn more money from a get-out-the-vote organization called ACORN or Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now. ACORN works with low or moderate-income families on housing issues. Cason said her extra registrations earned her boyfriend $50.

Gerald Obi says workers pressured him to keep registering to vote so they too could earn extra cash. When asked how many times he had registered this year, Obi said, "about 35 times."

ACORN's state director said they are victims of the fraud as well and told 9News the group is cooperating with local investigators. Ross Fitzgerald says the group has fired workers for the fraud. "Our goal is to register as many people as we can," said Fitzgerald. "If they're fraudulent, that hurts our numbers."

Clerk and Recorders from several counties met Monday with Secretary of State Donetta Davidson to discuss this problem, and the problem of felons registering to vote. "I have to question whether we should be allowing people to accept money for voter registration," said Douglas County Clerk and Recorder Carole Murray.

Colorado Secretary of State Donetta Davidson agreed and said she will be looking at ways to reform the system."

AL, THAT'S WHAT I MEANT ABOUT THE 'DUDE AT THE MALL".

JM

[OTM Al]

That's called fraud and those responsible should pay the stiffest penalties. Seriously how idiotic is this county clerk person "I have to question whether we should be allowing people to accept money for voter registration,". No sh*t Sherlock. Frankly I can't see anybody who is so short sighted being able to be the sole registrar of voters, as she would be according to one of your position points, being able to do any better a job. What the hell does she think will happen if you get money for each one you turn in. I must point out here though that automatic registration would help eliminate such drives as they would be unnecessary. Whoever was in charge of this ACORN organization should be prosecuted for this kind of crap.