Espn front page article on Florida dog racing vote

[WP1981]

http://www.espn.com/espn/feature/story/_/id/25091795/florida-vote-fatal-blow-us-greyhound-racing

[Augenj]

We've adopted three over the years. Gentle, sweet, and odorless. Love them. :)

Just don't let them out of a fenced area. They be gone. :D

[ReplayRandall]

We've adopted three over the years. Gentle, sweet, and odorless. Love them. :)

Just don't let them out of a fenced area. They be gone. :D


Bless you John!...I loved the greyhounds before the horses, but economics took over and you know the rest.

[Augenj]

Bless you John!...I loved the greyhounds before the horses, but economics took over and you know the rest.
Thanks, Randall. They have a tough life. For several years I transported them between the tracks, adoption groups, and adopters.

[AlsoEligible]

I've tried in vain to find some polling numbers on this, but haven't had any luck. Either the pollsters don't think this prop is important enough to poll on, or it's such a slam dunk that it's not worth the effort.

My money is on the latter. Proponents have outraised opposition by a ridiculous margin ($2.5 million for supporters, only $80k for opposition). So I imagine the Florida airwaves are being bombared with "Yes on 13" ads. Factor in the general consensus among the population that "racing is cruel", and it's hard to see a scenario where this doesn't pass.

I wish the amendment had some sort provision for aftercare, but I still think that in the long-term, passage is the best thing. It's not ideal, but I'd rather see dogs put down now in a humane way, than to watch them keep being bred and dying for years and years to come.

[JustRalph]

We've adopted three over the years. Gentle, sweet, and odorless. Love them. :)

Just don't let them out of a fenced area. They be gone. :D

Damn,,,,,,,, I thought I found a home.... .....missed by one!

[papillon]

I've tried in vain to find some polling numbers on this, but haven't had any luck. Either the pollsters don't think this prop is important enough to poll on, or it's such a slam dunk that it's not worth the effort.

My money is on the latter. Proponents have outraised opposition by a ridiculous margin ($2.5 million for supporters, only $80k for opposition). So I imagine the Florida airwaves are being bombared with "Yes on 13" ads. Factor in the general consensus among the population that "racing is cruel", and it's hard to see a scenario where this doesn't pass.

I wish the amendment had some sort provision for aftercare, but I still think that in the long-term, passage is the best thing. It's not ideal, but I'd rather see dogs put down now in a humane way, than to watch them keep being bred and dying for years and years to come.

I think it will pass easily. We Floridians are a consistent people when it comes to animal welfare and the environment.

Back in 2002, more than 60% of us voted to give sows and piglets the constitutional right to pens that are big enough to allow all of them to stand and turn around and lie down to nurse.

Every environmental initiative has passed since the early 1990s and the Forever Florida fund.

Off the track greyhounds are lovely, the best dogs. I've lived with three over the years.

People get us so wrong, we're not what people think we are.

Vote NO on the Casino Amendment, it is specifically aimed at preventing GP from adding a casino

[iamt]

Last poll I saw saw was 46-36 for a Yes with the remainder undecided.

[zico20]

Last poll I saw saw was 46-36 for a Yes with the remainder undecided.

It needs 60% to pass, so it will fail according to those numbers.

[Ocala Mike]

I voted NO; there's much more in this bill than saving greyhounds, and the thoroughbred industry in this state is against it.

https://www.ocala.com/opinion/20181014/david-s-romanik-amendment-3-could-destroy-horse-racing-in-florida

[georgetkingiv]

A vote on dog racing left myself and several members of my families without a job in 2010 when Wonderland Greyhound Park closed. My mother was the receptionist at Wonderland Greyhound Park since 1980 and worked there over 30 years. My brother was the brakeman that stopped the rabbit / lure and I was the night watchman. I knew everybody down there and aside from working there I grew up only steps away on Kimball Ave.

[AlsoEligible]

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/11/06/us/elections/results-florida-elections.html

Proposition 13 passes. 68.5% voting yes, 31.5% voting no.

RIP greyhound racing.

[Zman179]

Another interesting article:

https://www.miamiherald.com/latest-news/article218244230.html

The time for greyhound racing in the US has come and gone, that is why the stands at many tracks are empty. Best to just get rid of it.

Funny though that the greyhound track owners get to decouple and keep their profitable card rooms, but horse racing cannot decouple. Only logical move is that the horses will be next.

[davew]

Half the dog tracks in country to be closed in next 2 years.

https://floridadailypost.com/florida-votes-ban-greyhound-racing-2021/

I wonder if a NFL player breaking a bone constitutes abuse?

[GMB@BP]

Just a matter of time before we see this happen to tbred tracks in some states, especially the ones....well you can figure that out yourself.

[WP1981]

Just a matter of time before we see this happen to tbred tracks in some states, especially the ones....well you can figure that out yourself.

Who do you figure will be running at that point? Will Tup be the west coast circuit and Oaklawn the east?

Rillito will not be a factor as Tucson will shut it down in solidarity with the other states. A little slice of Los Angeles heaven down here..rampant crime, bleeding hearts, homelessness and potholes.

[ultracapper]

Jut saw this on Yahoo News. Headline reads something like "Voters ban Greyhound racing in FLA,

then they have a picture of a dalmatian under the headline.

HAHAHAHAHA!!

I'm like......WHAT???

[cutchemist42]

The same arguments to get rid of the dogs applied to the horses. I dont think racing has a long future in Florida. With the greyhounds gone, there is no cover now for horse racing to stand behind and avoid critisicm.

[GMB@BP]

Who do you figure will be running at that point? Will Tup be the west coast circuit and Oaklawn the east?

Rillito will not be a factor as Tucson will shut it down in solidarity with the other states. A little slice of Los Angeles heaven down here..rampant crime, bleeding hearts, homelessness and potholes.

If you lose the big markets the sport is dead so not sure it would really matter.

[Afleet]

Who do you figure will be running at that point? Will Tup be the west coast circuit and Oaklawn the east?

Rillito will not be a factor as Tucson will shut it down in solidarity with the other states. A little slice of Los Angeles heaven down here..rampant crime, bleeding hearts, homelessness and potholes.

any feces on the sidewalks yet, like san fran? Thats when you know you made it:rip:

[WP1981]

any feces on the sidewalks yet, like san fran? Thats when you know you made it:rip:

I am sure there is. You couldnt tell the difference between that or the local cuisine. We drive an hour up to Chandler/Gilbert when going out to eat.

Just a dumpster fire of a city they are all so damn proud of. That Old Pueblo charm that has landed it as one of the top 10 worst cities to live in the US.

[papillon]

The same arguments to get rid of the dogs applied to the horses. I dont think racing has a long future in Florida. With the greyhounds gone, there is no cover now for horse racing to stand behind and avoid critisicm.

I disagree.

The lives ot track greyhounds are really bleak. They are crated 24hrs sometime. When you adopt one you have to be very patient, because some are terrified of the world beyond their crates. And dog racing is a tiny part of the economy.

Horse racing is a much larger industry here than dog racing, Ocala is the yearling boot camp of America, plus our breeding programs and one of the major tracks in the nation.

Most people, tbh, don't even know what a high place in the history of horse racing FL holds. Some dont even know there is horseracing here. I live in Ft. Lauderdale, most people have no clue you can drive 20 minutes south to watch one of the premier races for Derby bound 3yos.

As long as they believe the horses are well cared for, people will support it. People love horses, but unlike greyhounds they can't adopt one, so racing fills a gap, esp if you make them proud of FL racing.

If I had the money, or some way to contact Stronach, I would like to build a carousel, where the horses are all of FL's storied statebreds--Fager, Ta Wee, Carry Back, Affirmed, Skip Away, Holy Bull, Foolish Pleasure, Afleet Alex, Needles etc, non-statebreds that won the FL Derby--Nashua, Northern Dancer, the Bid, Alydar, Swale, Unbridled etc., with one horse changed each year for the current winner (I guess the Pegasus too).

We even produced Onion: ride the horse that took down Secretariat.

You could sell tickets that go to a racehorse retirement fund that look like wager slips. Put it at Gulfstream, Stronach's already got the gigantic Pegasus fighting a Dragon statue there, a carousel can't be any worse. Instead of music, it play the race calls of their famous races.

To save racing in FL we need to get ahead of the anti-initiatives--get pro-initiatives that protect the horses. As long as people feel the horses are happy and healthy, racing will not die at the hands of the voters, from no money maybe, but not Floridians.

Anywho, I'm happy for the hounds. If I wasn't surrounded by muskovies, peacocks, egyptian geese, herons, and cats, I'd adopt one or three, but it's really hard to get ones that don't sight on small creatures. I just watched a dog rip a muskovie to shreds today, it was horrible.

[stlseeeek]

Sadly, if people don't hurry, many of the shit head kennels/trainers will just leave them to die, in the woods some where in Central Florida.

We actually were doing to surveying work on a Sunday, and found one of the trucks they haul them in, and a stench we will never forget. Called Cops and let them deal with it, read in paper days later it was a truck full of dogs, left to die, because they couldn't win or run no more, and owner/trainer didn't(reasoning from local dog tracks and people in business) have time to let them get adopted.Wanted them gone, no more meal $, vet bills,etc.

And naturally, truck was registered to some illegal, who had been dead for over 10 years. They eventually got a break and busted owner/trainer. But killing dogs doesn't come with the punishment it should.

Melbourne Dog track(fl), has done a great job of getting the dogs there adopted, but sadly, some in the business of dog racing are POS, same with Horse racing.

[castaway01]

If you read the DRF article, the anti-greyhound side hardly spent any money. Any county where they ran ads with footage of greyhounds breaking down or being locked in small cages, they got more than 70% of the vote. Unlike some of you, to me, the voters have spoken---people don't want racing. And keep in mind this is Florida, which while certainly a state with a lot of problems, is more of a red state than a blue one.

Couldn't the same thing happen to horse racing? I think it's a lot less likely because most people have seen a horse race, even if it's just the Kentucky Derby. They know horses don't break down in every race. There also have been several high-profile breakdowns and horse racing is still here. A lot of people, obviously, own dogs, and don't like the idea of their pet being treated the way some greyhounds are so that a literal handful of people still gambling on greyhound racing can get their thrills.

So what does that mean for us? Probably nothing, because horse racing has a lot more money behind it than greyhound racing, but it's a message that the various controversies recently posted on this site (presumably by people who like horse racing and are fans)---from the horses sent to the killers to whatever happened to Baffert's horses to the former stakes horses now running for pennies---need to be sorted out so there's no reason for anyone to say horse racing is cruel and should be banned.

[Threechimes]

Horse Racing is like a wild animal caught in a snare. It would chew its foot off to escape. While everybody here can rationalize why dog racing is worse and deserved to be shutdown . About 1% of all race horses are treated like royalty. The other 99% are in horrible conditions and are drugged and masked to keep racing . You can deny it all day but if you have been around this game long enough you know in your heart it is populated by criminals and scumbags .

[ultracapper]

Horse Racing is like a wild animal caught in a snare. It would chew its foot off to escape. While everybody here can rationalize why dog racing is worse and deserved to be shutdown . About 1% of all race horses are treated like royalty. The other 99% are in horrible conditions and are drugged and masked to keep racing . You can deny it all day but if you have been around this game long enough you know in your heart it is populated by criminals and scumbags .

And credibility is shot to hell. Hopefully this is hyperbole, because it isn't reality.

[Threechimes]

And credibility is shot to hell. Hopefully this is hyperbole, because it isn't reality.


Really?

Ever walk the backstretch ? Ever see where horses who breakdown are put? If you think that people in the claiming game give a crap about horse flesh you have been duped. They are pawns in a game . They get minimal treatment at best . Stand and sleep in there own piss for 18 hours a day . Get out of there stalls only for it to be cleaned or to exercise for twenty minutes. Get fed cheap grain. Cheap hay.

Please 99% might be a high number but if you think these horses are being treated well you are an idiot

At cheap harness tracks I have seen dead horses lay out by the dumpster for days .

[Someday Silent]

I disagree.

The lives ot track greyhounds are really bleak. They are crated 24hrs sometime. When you adopt one you have to be very patient, because some are terrified of the world beyond their crates. And dog racing is a tiny part of the economy.


And I'd have to disagree with you, though my experience is admittedly limited. I worked in animal rescue and as a vet assistant from 2007 to 2011. In January of 2010 we got 5 greyhounds straight off the track. There was one small female who was timid, but even she adapted quickly. All 5 of them soon socialized with a myriad of different dogs and loved to play. All rescued dogs do require patience, but these greyhounds were far from terrified and I don't believe their racetrack lives were bleak or isolated.

[chadk66]

Back in 94' a good friend of mine took me to the inaugural brickyard 400. He was friends with Mary George the owner of the track. She has an enormous kennel at her farm in Terre Haute. She basically takes in any dog that the pound is going to put to sleep. I can't even tell you how many she had there. The facility she kept the dogs in was nicer than the home she was living in. She had one dog that was her personal pet that went wherever she went. It was a retired grey hound. Every morning and evening we had to be at her home at the speedway for catered breakfast and supper. She had quite a few hollywood types there all the time. James Garner, Florence Henderson, Gomer Pyle, etc. Guess who stood and who laid on the couch lol. The dog was high emporer lol. Even the hollywood elites played second fiddle to that dog.

[Augenj]

Back in 94' a good friend of mine took me to the inaugural brickyard 400. He was friends with Mary George the owner of the track. She has an enormous kennel at her farm in Terre Haute. She basically takes in any dog that the pound is going to put to sleep. I can't even tell you how many she had there. The facility she kept the dogs in was nicer than the home she was living in. She had one dog that was her personal pet that went wherever she went. It was a retired grey hound. Every morning and evening we had to be at her home at the speedway for catered breakfast and supper. She had quite a few hollywood types there all the time. James Garner, Florence Henderson, Gomer Pyle, etc. Guess who stood and who laid on the couch lol. The dog was high emporer lol. Even the hollywood elites played second fiddle to that dog.
Great story. :ThmbUp:

[chadk66]

I haven't read this measure but I'm hearing from people I know in the industry that this bill affects horses too. As in it may end horse racing immediately if something isn't changed in it. That can't be the case is it? But many of these measures have unintended consequences

[AlsoEligible]

I haven't read this measure but I'm hearing from people I know in the industry that this bill affects horses too. As in it may end horse racing immediately if something isn't changed in it. That can't be the case is it? But many of these measures have unintended consequences

No, the actual text that would be adopted into the state constitution specifically mentions greyhounds.

New Section of Article X

Prohibition on racing of and wagering on greyhounds or other dogs.—The humane treatment of animals is a fundamental value of the people of the State of Florida. After December 31, 2020, a person authorized to conduct gaming or pari-mutuel operations may not race greyhounds or any member of the Canis Familiaris subspecies in connection with any wager for money or any other thing of value in this state, and persons in this state may not wager money or any other thing of value on the outcome of a live dog race occurring in this state. The failure to conduct greyhound racing or wagering on greyhound racing after December 31, 2018, does not constitute grounds to revoke or deny renewal of other related gaming licenses held by a person who is a licensed greyhound permitholder on January 1, 2018, and does not affect the eligibility of such permitholder, or such permitholder’s facility, to conduct other pari-mutuel activities authorized by general law. By general law, the legislature shall specify civil or criminal penalties for violations of this section and for activities that aid or abet violations of this section.

New Section of Article XII

Prohibition on racing or wagering on greyhounds or other dogs.—The amendment to Article X, which prohibits the racing of or wagering on greyhound and other dogs, and the creation of this section, shall take effect upon the approval of the electors.

There's nothing here that could be applied to horse racing.

[chadk66]

Good deal.