Republican Senator from Carolina sez We botched it in Iraq

[ljb]

Senator Grahmn on CNN tonight said We made a lot of mistakes in Iraq. We did not do it right. If elections in January are accepted by the Iraqui people we will have turned the corner.
In other words the gang of four screwed this up too!

[Secretariat]

Even Bush said he "miscalculated". Many guys here still defend his choices when he himself says he miscalculated...Hard to beleive. They don't understand that when he says miscalcualted, soldiers are killed.

I heard the brother of a soldier giving a eulogy on the news tonight. He said "My brohter died so that George Bush could pretend he was telling the truth." Says it all.

[JustRalph]

His brother died because he was in an occupation that is one of the first to die when this country goes to war. end of story. Nothing magic about it. No matter the reason for the war. It amazes me that people can actually join the military and think (or their family can think) that they may not be one of the first to be killed should the country have to fight. It should be the first thing on their minds when they take the oath.

Obviously it does come to the minds of some. Right after 9-11 several interviews were conducted with parents of "kids" who were slated to go to basic training. I saw them on the network news channels. Some were trying to get the kids out of the military contracts. A few even verbalized that "they didn't think their child would have to fight a war, they only wanted money for college"

If you take a position that can be on the front lines in a matter of days.........you can't complain when you end up on the front lines. That is just the way it is...............and it doesn't matter why you were put there. There has to be some reasonable expectation of risk. If that soldier were able to communicate with his brother from the grave, I bet he would not condone his actions.

Oh yeah, btw, the brother should have mentioned that Bill Clinton, Al Gore, Mad. Albright, The CIA, The British Intel, Russian Intel and gobs more people and governments were pretending too.......... funny how he didn't bring that up...............

[Tom]

So now you are using "man on the street" interviews to substitute fo facts?
Desperate.
Easily amazed.
Lemmings.

[ljb]

Jr,
Wordy. The fellow died because the gang of four invaded Iraq.
Tom,
Yes, the man on the street still has a voice in this society. The gang of four have not succeded in their efforts to silence all disenters yet!

[JustRalph]

Originally posted by ljb
Jr,
Wordy. The fellow died because the gang of four invaded Iraq.
Tom,
Yes, the man on the street still has a voice in this society. The gang of four have not succeded in their efforts to silence all disenters yet!

yeah, but they might get four more years to try.......keep on pluggin

[Tom]

Originally posted by ljb
Jr,
Wordy. The fellow died because the gang of four invaded Iraq.
Tom,
Yes, the man on the street still has a voice in this society. The gang of four have not succeded in their efforts to silence all disenters yet!


You are proof that this is a lie. In fact, the very fact that a person like you still allowed to walk the streets and post crap is a testement to the toleracne of the current adminsitration. If they were really going to crack down, don't you think you would on page one of the list?

Go FOX yourself!
(great stuff, PA, great stuff! You put the MASTER in webmaster!:D )

[kenwoodallpromos]

Why don't all the libs tell the UN to stop violation their own santions; and tell all the Commie and Socialist countries to stop selling weapons to terrorists?

[delayjf]

Show me any war that went perfectly. Or are you suggesting that we never use military force unless we can assure the world that, A) there will be no casualties, B) no unforseen situations due to intel that comes straight from Gods mouth. C) all our troops will be home within months of being deployed. D) Invaded country accepts our judgement without even a traffic jam of a problem. How realistic is that. Show me one instance were that has happened.

[Secretariat]

Originally posted by delayjf
Show me any war that went perfectly. Or are you suggesting that we never use military force unless we can assure the world that, A) there will be no casualties, B) no unforseen situations due to intel that comes straight from Gods mouth. C) all our troops will be home within months of being deployed. D) Invaded country accepts our judgement without even a traffic jam of a problem. How realistic is that. Show me one instance were that has happened.

E. None of the above.

We have gone to war for many different reasons. My criteria for unilateral action is

a) When we are directly attacked, or B) when a nation is an imminent threat to us.

Neither of those categories applied to Iraq. Any other miltiary operation should involve a multilateral response both in manpower and in funding and only after diplomacy has been exhausted.

[JustRalph]

Originally posted by Secretariat
a) When we are directly attacked, or

This is a given..........why even mention it?

when a nation is an imminent threat to us.

In today's world...........you can't be sure of this.....it is not possible.........you are dreaming......I want a leader who is proactive.

[Secretariat]

Originally posted by JustRalph


Well, you've got a proactive President, and apparently Lugar and Hagel aren't too impressed.

[Tom]

Originally posted by Secretariat
Even Bush said he "miscalculated". Many guys here still defend his choices when he himself says he miscalculated...Hard to beleive. They don't understand that when he says miscalcualted, soldiers are killed.

I heard the brother of a soldier giving a eulogy on the news tonight. He said "My brohter died so that George Bush could pretend he was telling the truth." Says it all.


Now this is a digusting post. I take back my apology the other day. You have now sunk to a new low level.
How dare you accusse the president of intentionally sending men to die so he could look good. You have demonstrated that you all totally without integrity. What about you piece of S*** Kerry, who had the balls to sit in front of congress and tell outright lies that cost our troops not only pain, suffering and death in Vietnam, bit also cost many of them thier self repsect and piece of mind when they came home. I have no doubt in my mind that had you been there, you would have been one of the lowlifes who lines up to spit on our guys when the y got into airports. That seems to be the class you possess. Kerry outright lied about Vietnam like he lies about everything else. Watch Sean Hannity tonight- he has a vertern who will tell how Kerry and the rest of those trairterous winter soldiers pressured other vets - this guy included - to lie to the congress and make up stories about atrocities, that Kerry himself coached them on. There is a big difference between miscalculating and outright casuing death and loss of dignity. Everything John Kerry has ever touched has been tainted. No one ever wages a war on evil and never makes a mistake. Your POS Kerry voted to go to war, and then he claims it was based on wrong intelligence. Was that not a miscalutltion on his part? As US senator, he had the abilit yto investigate, but. like everything else he has ever done in his life, he took the low raod,
the easy way out, relied on som eone else to take care of him. And then he whines about it. And runs home to the rich bitch he is living off of this year. A gigilo, liar, and war criminal. And you have the audacity to call Bush a murderer because he made a mistake while trying to wage a war where innocent people's lives were protected as much as possible, where the enemy was the target and not the country, the most politically correct war in history agains the most murderous regime of this half of the last century and the first decade of this one?
You disgust me.

[Secretariat]

Originally posted by Tom
How dare you accusse the president of intentionally sending men to die so he could look good.

I NEVER SAID THAT. I QUOTED BUSH AS SAYING HE "MISCALCULATED." I NEVER SAID HE INTENTIONALLY SENT MEN TO DIE. THE BROTHER OF THE SOLDIER WHO DIED SAID HIS BROTHER DIED TO MAKE BUSH LOOK GOOD. DON'T PUT WORDS IN MY MOUTH WHEN I NEVER SAID THAT.

Kerry voted to go to war, and then he claims it was based on wrong intelligence. Was that not a miscalutltion on his part?

ANOTHER MISSTATEMENT. KERRY DID NOT VOTE TO GO TO WAR. HE VOTED TO GIVE THE PRESIDENT AUTHORITY TO ENFORCE SANCTIONS IF BUSH WORKED WITH THE UN AND OUR ALLIES TO GIVE THE INSPECTIONS A CHANCE, AND IF A MULTILATERAL COALITION COULD BE BUILT. BUSH FAILED ON BOTH ACCOUNTS. THAT IS WHY WE SUFFER 90% OF ALL CASUALTIES AND US TAXPAYERS ARE PAYING 90% OF THE BILL. READ KERRY'S SPEECH ON THE SENATE BEFORE THE VOTE. HE IS QUITE CLEAR THAT THIS WAS NOT A VOTE TO GO TO WAR.

And you have the audacity to call Bush a murderer

AGAIN, DON'T MISSTATE WHAT I SAID. I NEVER SAID BUSH WAS A MURDERER. QUOTE ME CORRECTLY PLEASE.

[Tom]

You posted: "I heard the brother of a soldier giving a eulogy on the news tonight. He said "My brohter died so that George Bush could pretend he was telling the truth." Says it all."

Says it all says it all for me. You are agreeing with the brother.
Go Fox yourself.

[Secretariat]

Originally posted by Tom
You posted: "I heard the brother of a soldier giving a eulogy on the news tonight. He said "My brohter died so that George Bush could pretend he was telling the truth." Says it all."

Says it all says it all for me. You are agreeing with the brother.
Go Fox yourself.

It does say it all Tom. When family members are giving eulogies about their loved ones and holding a President accountable. I've been there before friend. Bush is accountable for his decisions. The Buck stops there. His "miscalculations" (as he says) have cost lives. He had no real strategy for post war Iraq and now soldeirs and civilians are paying the price.

Does that mean that I said Bush is a murderer or deliberately wanted soldiers to die? Of course not. You're misrepresenting what I said Tom. I have never said anything about Bush murdering anyone in any post I have ever put here and you know it. I never would. He's still the Commander in Chief, but when a Commander in Chief "miscalculates" there is a price to be paid, and that price is a big one. Don't blame that brother. He called it like he saw and felt it. Leadership is accepting responsiblity, and accountability. I would hope you and Mr. Bush would accept that.

[JustRalph]

Originally posted by Secretariat
Well, you've got a proactive President, and apparently Lugar and Hagel aren't too impressed.
Cheney Em!

[Secretariat]

Well, JR...I gotta admit..you made me chuckle on that one...

[Tom]

I don't blame the brother at all. It is YOU who are using his grief and statments to mask your own baseless attack. Go FOX yourself. You have no creditbilty and your are outed for what you are. Happy RAMADAN.

[Secretariat]

Tom,

Thanks for not reading my post.