Anyone bet Australia? (Thoroughbred)

[MadVindication]

Reasons why you like/don't like betting Australia? What tracks do you like/dislike?

I was watching some replays (Mackay) and saw they sure have a a wide array of odds. Looks like fun tho a bit like spitting in the wind. Quite a few long shots each race, 20-1 to 80-1.

[thaskalos]

With foreign racing getting as popular as it is with our ADWs in this country...it's a shock to me that we still have no "Americanized" past performances for this new gambling endeavor. Do our ADWs expect us to bet major money on these races in the DARK?

[jay68802]

With foreign racing getting as popular as it is with our ADWs in this country...it's a shock to me that we still have no "Americanized" past performances for this new gambling endeavor. Do our ADWs expect us to bet major money on these races in the DARK?

yes.

[MadVindication]

With foreign racing getting as popular as it is with our ADWs in this country...it's a shock to me that we still have no "Americanized" past performances for this new gambling endeavor. Do our ADWs expect us to bet major money on these races in the DARK?

So it's basically an overseas dart board at this point.


Trips me up that they "run backwards" too :D

[clicknow]

With foreign racing getting as popular as it is with our ADWs in this country...it's a shock to me that we still have no "Americanized" past performances for this new gambling endeavor.

Are you asking "how do you cap horses and races w/out speed figures and workouts?"

What do you mean by "in the dark"?

You can keep a racebook, learn the track configurations, which ones run counter and clockwise, how the race conditions are written, tightness of turns, learn trainer/jockey combos and colonies, how horses do coming off AW versus turf, who is on way up class ladder, watch replays of prior races, what preferences the horse has, etc.

Anybody just using mostly speed figures never solidly beat this game so maybe better to discuss othere stuff. I have found great benefit wagering in jurisdictions that have a centralized authority like Aus, JAP, HK.


You speak of "in the dark" wagering.....that would be not being able to cap the drugs and injuries that aren't in a database for the bettor to see.....i.e. U.S. racing.

[AltonKelsey]

Even the hong kong pp's they give away are pitiful.



Not sure if its by design or just plain ineptness.


how hard would it be to massage some of the copious data HK produces in the the same codebase they use for US pp's. Instead , they produce something that looks like its from 1950

[MadVindication]

Anybody just using mostly speed figures never solidly beat this game so maybe better to discuss othere stuff. I have found great benefit wagering in jurisdictions that have a centralized authority like Aus, JAP, HK.
.

So how do you find records of reported injuries for Australia? And are you saying you think the regulations in overseas racing create fairer betting conditions?

[chiguy]

The key to Australian racing is usually a few things.



Track condition. Horses like some better than others and generally run to what they like. Good, Soft and Heavy are the three main conditions of the tracks and there are a few grades within each one. So you may see a Good4 or a Heavy10 etc.
Distance. Much like horses here, horses like a particular distances more than others. Nothing earth shattering here.
Track Record - This is THE most important thing I have found in Australian racing. Each racetrack there is unique. If a horse runs well there and is not making some huge class rise they will run well. If they have a bad record at that track, they will run bad. It is the ultimate horses for courses scenario.
Stay away from Maiden races. We generally don't have enough information regarding trainers and their intentions.

There is a great website called racenet.au They also have an app you can download on your phone. Great information on this app, quite unbelievable to be honest with you. Puts TVG and other ADW apps to shame. Check it out.


.20 supers are fun to play there, at least once each night you will see one that pays three out of four. One last night was x-x-x-all for $1048. I believe they also have .20 pick threes and fours.

[clicknow]

So how do you find records of reported injuries for Australia? And are you saying you think the regulations in overseas racing create fairer betting conditions?

HK, not aussie. good database re: vet records. Bettors do have a right to know, can't figure out why they don't realize that here and at EVERY track though.

Aussie does have big fields though at many of the tracks. I do enjoy big fields, can get some pretty nice paying exactas.

I keep my racebook over on racenet. So I know when horses I like are racing.


I also like the simulcasts out of HK and Japan. You really get to see each horse, and for quite enough time to evaluate their conformation, and there aren't sheds and bushes or commpanion ponies in the way, the camera work is VERY GOOD.

[thaskalos]

Are you asking "how do you cap horses and races w/out speed figures and workouts?"

What do you mean by "in the dark"?

You can keep a racebook, learn the track configurations, which ones run counter and clockwise, how the race conditions are written, tightness of turns, learn trainer/jockey combos and colonies, how horses do coming off AW versus turf, who is on way up class ladder, watch replays of prior races, what preferences the horse has, etc.

Anybody just using mostly speed figures never solidly beat this game so maybe better to discuss othere stuff. I have found great benefit wagering in jurisdictions that have a centralized authority like Aus, JAP, HK.


You speak of "in the dark" wagering.....that would be not being able to cap the drugs and injuries that aren't in a database for the bettor to see.....i.e. U.S. racing.

IMO...handicapping without fractional times and length-behind information is the equivalent of the "dark ages" of the handicapping era.

I congratulate you on your success while wagering on these foreign racing jurisdictions, but I wouldn't bet even a thin dime without the detailed past performances that I've gotten used to in this country. The abbreviated PPs that are now available for foreign racing aren't even on par with the sketchy PPs that we had in this country 50 years ago...and I want no part of that sort of game. My hat goes off to guys like you and Nitro, for managing to beat that type of game...but it clearly isn't for me.

[steveb]

IMO...handicapping without fractional times and length-behind information is the equivalent of the "dark ages" of the handicapping era.

I congratulate you on your success while wagering on these foreign racing jurisdictions, but I wouldn't bet even a thin dime without the detailed past performances that I've gotten used to in this country. The abbreviated PPs that are now available for foreign racing aren't even on par with the sketchy PPs that we had in this country 50 years ago...and I want no part of that sort of game. My hat goes off to guys like you and Nitro, for managing to beat that type of game...but it clearly isn't for me.

there is a zillion places to ge that sort of info in australia, you just need to know from where.
the below link is handy spot although i don't know how up to date it is

http://www.trackdata.com.au/

personally, i would not bet australia, because imo it's as corrupt as.

lengths behind winner should go the way of the dodo because it's worthless(certainly in aust. anyway)
that is a function of time, so your margin depends on the conversion factor used.
one joint will use .16s per length, another might use .17 and yet another might use .15.
thus the margin WILL depend on the conversion factor used, and in my country it's all over the shop.
imo if you are using margins.....then YOU are still in the 'dark ages'.

[Tom]

IF you have different time values of a length at different place, I can't see any sense in even trying to make a bet.

That models needs major improvement to get to the Dark Ages.

[thaskalos]

there is a zillion places to ge that sort of info in australia, you just need to know from where.
the below link is handy spot although i don't know how up to date it is

http://www.trackdata.com.au/


This website is no longer active.

[steveb]

This website is no longer active.

if it's up top date i don't know, but it does have recent stuff there.
it's certainly active though, as i tested it before i made my previous post.
maybe something to do with where you are?

[thaskalos]

lengths behind winner should go the way of the dodo because it's worthless(certainly in aust. anyway)
that is a function of time, so your margin depends on the conversion factor used.
one joint will use .16s per length, another might use .17 and yet another might use .15.
thus the margin WILL depend on the conversion factor used, and in my country it's all over the shop.
imo if you are using margins.....then YOU are still in the 'dark ages'.

At least I'm "enlightened" enough not to be recommending dead websites. :p

[thaskalos]

if it's up top date i don't know, but it does have recent stuff there.
it's certainly active though, as i tested it before i made my previous post.
maybe something to do with where you are?

When I click on it...it says that the domain is "parked". Which, of course, means that it isn't going anyplace. :)

[steveb]

IF you have different time values of a length at different place, I can't see any sense in even trying to make a bet.

That models needs major improvement to get to the Dark Ages.

is usa any different?
in australia there is 7 different ruling bodies, mostly one per state or territory.
they all go their own way, which is of course idiotic of them.
they have australian rules of racing, but then each joint will have their own clauses inserted, and there is obviously no standard conversion factor for converting time to margin.
in fact i would bet 99.9% of australian players, would not even know how the margins are calculated, nor that they are derived from time.

australia is probably ever bit as bad as usa for giving a stuff about the people that pay for it all(punters)

the best jusridictions for gambling will be those in asia like japan, hk, korea and to a lesser extent singapore.

[steveb]

When I click on it...it says that the domain is "parked". Which, of course, means that it isn't going anyplace. :)

maybe it's something to do with you isp or location, because it's certainly operating for me...and it ain't dead!

[Pensacola Pete]

You can get all of the free information you need at:

https://punters.com.au

A while ago, I stopped playing Australia. A man told me that there was some blatant drugging going on there, and that I would be wise to not play Australia for a while. I mentioned it here in the forums, without giving the specific reason, since I couldn't prove the allegation. A few days ago, over a dozen people were banned or disciplined for drug misuse, including a lifetime ban for a semi-prominent trainer. If that many got hit initially, I'm guessing that it's widespread. Until the drug situation is cleaned up, I won't be playing Australian racing.

[clicknow]

My hat goes off to guys like you and Nitro, for managing to beat that type of game...but it clearly isn't for me.

Hey, I didn't say I was beating the game. ;) Not always.

However, I highly suggest HK racing if you are looking for an honest game where you have enough information to feel confident making a wager. Again, the camera work is top notch, and so is the paddock analysis.

[MadVindication]

You can get all of the free information you need at:

https://punters.com.au

A while ago, I stopped playing Australia. A man told me that there was some blatant drugging going on there, and that I would be wise to not play Australia for a while. I mentioned it here in the forums, without giving the specific reason, since I couldn't prove the allegation. A few days ago, over a dozen people were banned or disciplined for drug misuse, including a lifetime ban for a semi-prominent trainer. If that many got hit initially, I'm guessing that it's widespread. Until the drug situation is cleaned up, I won't be playing Australian racing.

Oh shit. Well that influences my decision. In no rush to play but will just watch the races and see.

[MadVindication]

Hey, I didn't say I was beating the game. ;) Not always.

However, I highly suggest HK racing if you are looking for an honest game where you have enough information to feel confident making a wager. Again, the camera work is top notch, and so is the paddock analysis.

HK it is. Good camera work is especially appealing. I like how gambling is taken more seriously over there. Unlike in North America ...in ways gambling is treated as a few steps above drug use and not at all a respectable hobby, common as it is.

Are there a lot of tracks in HK?

[lamboguy]

Hong Kong only has 2 tracks.

the Hong Kong Jockey Club is the largest employer in Hong Kong

[PaceAdvantage]

This website is no longer active.Link works for me, for what that's worth...

[steveb]

Link works for me, for what that's worth...

if one was interested in australia, then it's probably the best, because it's basically only lots of links to get you to the information available.
just a spot to guide you to all the other spots.

nevertheless i am in australia and would not touch the joint with a barge pole.

[Nitro]

Well folks, there’s been a lot commentary recently on Overseas racing, and for good reason. No I don’t play Australia (for the many reasons already stated). However, as I’ve mentioned in many previous threads over the years my personal feelings, particularly about racing in Hong Kong. So if you care to venture into those posts here’s just a sampling:

Post #20
http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=144377&highlight=Hong+Kong&page=2

Post #10 & #14
http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=139653&highlight=Hong+Kong

Post #17 & #26 & #30
http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=139653&highlight=Hong+Kong&page=2

Post #33 & #34 & #37 & #39
http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=139653&highlight=Hong+Kong&page=3

You may not agree with everything I’ve mentioned, but again these are just some of the reasons I’ll stay up ALL night (actually mornings on Sat or Sun on the east coast) to play Sha Tin and get up early Wed mornings to play Happy Valley. Of course it’s not for everyone, but for me it’s like the BC twice a week (with O.A. betting pools to match…actually exceed), fields aplenty and potential betting value in nearly every race.
As I’ve reiterated so often I think, “It’s the best racing on the planet”.

But actually the best part is that it offers me much more free time and doesn’t interfere with my daily family life! Yes, believe it or not there is life beyond the many alluring calls of the race track Sirens. ;)

[WP1981]

I use www.australianracing.com which is ran by Sky for us here. You have to complete a free signup but they offer free video for Aus and SA and tons of PP's and stats.

I also use the actual Sky site for various ratings and results http://www.skyracing.com.au/index.php?component=racing&task=results&Itemid=104&id=18 they also have ratings for various other races such as HK and some US races.

It's all I play anymore.

[chiguy]

When I get to the point of retirement I will probably just pay Australia and HK only. Friday night Australia (Saturday in Aus) is the best racing. Few maiden races and most of the racing is from Metro tracks. Those are the big tracks. The rest of the week seems to have many more maiden races which unless you study real well, are hard to get a feel for.

[clicknow]

When I get to the point of retirement I will probably just pay Australia and HK only. Friday night Australia (Saturday in Aus) is the best racing. Few maiden races and most of the racing is from Metro tracks. Those are the big tracks. The rest of the week seems to have many more maiden races which unless you study real well, are hard to get a feel for.

Well just looking in at Bendigo tonight, a $19.80 winner with a $13.00 2nd horse, an $18.80 and $9.30 2nd horse, then a $72.50 winner....that's just 3 races and we're up to race 5.
Sunshine, Nowra and Grafton up to race 4 have several horses win already up over $12.00-16.00....

Compare to wagering at Pimlico today, where my show wager on Tenfold paid more than the winners of 11 races there today. :eek:

But I prefer Sha Tin.....will watch that tonight, love the paddock analysts and the camera work is always stunning. and the racing is HONEST.