First-time gelding announcements after doubles and other horizontals wager are in

[BCOURTNEY]

Turf Paradise Race 6 - :5: Joyeux

First-time gelding announcements after doubles, pick tickets are placed.
What do the rules surrounding reporting say? Did the trainer withhold or otherwise delay this information from being made available?

Most states require trainers or owners to report that a horse has been gelded, but those reports sometimes do not get filed in a timely manner - so what will the penalty be?

[Dave Schwartz]

My understanding is that sometimes reporting of such procedures is extremely inaccurate in terms of timing.

[jay68802]

And of course wins. I quit playing Turf P in 2012 after the the late announcement was made of a jockey change on a horse I singled in the last race of the Pick 5. I had 1 of 2 live tickets, I ran second with one of the most questionable rides I have seen. Trainer will get two weeks with no cell phone.

[johnhannibalsmith]

...so what will the penalty be?

2-5 favorite is:

$100 fine + 5% ($5) surcharge for horse rescue/adoption = $105

[BCOURTNEY]

My understanding is that sometimes reporting of such procedures is extremely inaccurate in terms of timing.

Maybe the requirement should be on the Vet doing the procedure not the owners and trainers part of state licensing requirements.

[Dave Schwartz]

Maybe the requirement should be on the Vet doing the procedure not the owners and trainers part of state licensing requirements.

Absolutely.

Then there should be a penalty with some pain involved for people who don't follow.

Oh, wait. We couldn't possibly do that because it might cost someone their livelihood. We'll just continue to allow them to defraud the betting public.

Of course, in the scheme of things, this is relatively minor, but you get the point.

which is... the integrity of the game is only important to the bettors.

[BCOURTNEY]

Absolutely.

Then there should be a penalty with some pain involved for people who don't follow.

Oh, wait. We couldn't possibly do that because it might cost someone their livelihood. We'll just continue to allow them to defraud the betting public.

Of course, in the scheme of things, this is relatively minor, but you get the point.

which is... the integrity of the game is only important to the bettors.

I'm right now trying to figure out if the horse was gelded prior to the JAN 30 2018 race as well since that was nearly 2 months ago.

I agree Dave some Hong Kong like transparency on vet records, meds, etc. would be great for the perceived integrity of this game. :ThmbUp:

[Tom]

2-5 favorite is:

$100 fine + 5% ($5) surcharge for horse rescue/adoption = $105

:rolleyes:
+ the WPS, exacta and P4 tickets the dumb-ass trainer made on the horse.

What I always say, this game is freaking rocket science for the morons who run it. the way they time races, the idiot trainer probably counted the "ball" and got 2. Duh.

the integrity of the game is only important to the bettors
...Huh? When did it get any? What happened, some get spilled over from the casino and track pick it up?
One thing I never associate with this game is integrity.

It doesn't make the tracks money, and it benefit the bettors.
Why the hell would they bother to try to get it right?

[Dave Schwartz]

:rolleyes:
+ the WPS, exacta and P4 tickets the dumb-ass trainer made on the horse.

What I always say, this game is freaking rocket science for the morons who run it. the way they time races, the idiot trainer probably counted the "ball" and got 2. Duh.

...Huh? When did it get any? What happened, some get spilled over from the casino and track pick it up?
One thing I never associate with this game is integrity.

It doesn't make the tracks money, and it benefit the bettors.
Why the hell would they bother to try to get it right?

Tom,

Of course, you are right.

These days even casinos lack the integrity that they used to have. I recall that in mid-70s Las Vegas we had a saying: "Everybody is entitled to one shot."

One time I was dealing craps at the Golden Nugget. A guy walks up to the table and calls, "$600 on the 8," and six rolls. He insisted that he said "$600 on the 6." The floorman paid him anyway.

He took his $700 profit and left.

Later that night (when I was off) I saw him walk up to a table at the Fremont and say the same thing. The dice rolled 3 or 4 times and then there was a 7-out. The guy says, "HEY! I told you to move my bet to the come."

They paid him and he walked out with his $1,200.

I seriously doubt that would happen today because it has gone from "The customer is always right" to "The customer is NEVER right."

But, then... I am old. LOL - I remember seeing Col. Parker be such a sucker that they'd give him TWO balls on the roulette wheel ON THE SAME SPIN occasionally.

Oy... I could tell you such stories. LOL


Dave

[Elliott Sidewater]

Absolutely.

Then there should be a penalty with some pain involved for people who don't follow.

Oh, wait. We couldn't possibly do that because it might cost someone their livelihood. We'll just continue to allow them to defraud the betting public.

Of course, in the scheme of things, this is relatively minor, but you get the point.

which is... the integrity of the game is only important to the bettors.
Dave, what integrity? Racing hasn't learned its lesson in 4 decades; this same gripe about first time gelding is the same as the one bettors had about first time lasix in the late 70's. Things have gotten worse over the years because they never got better, and probably never will. The primary customer is viewed with disdain, like the annual house visit from a relative who doesn't know when it's time to leave.

[cj]

This happened in SoCal a few times last year. I think they finally changed the rule where the horses are scratched if this happens.

[dilanesp]

Is it possible that there was a guy with a knife loose in the receiving barn?

[Tom]

Oy... I could tell you such stories. LOL

Would love to sit in a bar with you for a few dozen hours! :cool:

[Tom]

Is it possible that there was a guy with a knife loose in the receiving barn?

Not likely, but there sure are a few with a screw loose in the office!

[Niko]

This is gambling...entertainment. Thus it doesn't matter if you know that information or not and it doesn't matter if the connections took advantage of the loophole for their profit vs their customer base.

It's part of the plot? :confused:

Reminds me of an old joke told in my wife's big catholic family - short version - gentleman wanted his dog buried next to his plot when the dog died, priest said they don't bury animals, animals don't go to heaven etc, gentleman said he had $100,000 to donate to the church, priest says "why didn't you tell me the dog was catholic"

Horse racing seems to work the same way when it comes to information and ethics. It's just the way the world works. *Helps to know a good betting stable on occasion.

I've just become a cynical bastard when it comes to horse racing, not good for fans of the game - peace out

[fmhealth]

This situation gets more interesting by the minute. First of all, there was a first time gelding in the race, but it was the one horse who finished OTM. This information was clearly listed on the equibase site earlier in the day.

The horse in question here was NOT a first time gelding. At least according to the chart of his race on 1/30 which he wins & is clearly listed as a gelding in the footnotes.

So, I find myself in my usual state of affairs which is total confusion. Any actionable insights would be greatly appreciated.

Be Well,
fmhealth

[betovernetcapper]

This situation gets more interesting by the minute. First of all, there was a first time gelding in the race, but it was the one horse who finished OTM. This information was clearly listed on the equibase site earlier in the day.

The horse in question here was NOT a first time gelding. At least according to the chart of his race on 1/30 which he wins & is clearly listed as a gelding in the footnotes.

So, I find myself in my usual state of affairs which is total confusion. Any actionable insights would be greatly appreciated.

Be Well,
fmhealth

So Joyeux was not a 1st time gelding on 3/28 & was not listed as a 1st time gelding. He presumable did not sprout wings & also wasn't listed as a 1st time Pegasus. I'm missing how you were wronged in this issue.