School shooting in Parkland Florida

[Tom]

Another one - senseless shooting in a school about 2:00 today.
Bodies not removed from building yet - suspect has been arrested.
Cell phone volume so high calls not getting through, so parents not knowing about their kids for a couple of hours.

So much for the day of love.
Prayers to all.

[barahona44]

Five confirmed dead so far.Parkland is a fairly upscale community about halfway between Fort Lauderdale and Palm Beach.Suspect was identified as 19 year old Nicholas Cruz , a former student at the school described by people who knew him as "socially awkward", which seems to be a common trait with these school shooters.

[Fager Fan]

17 dead.

No, life wasn't perfect back in the 50s or 60s or 70s, but kids wouldn't dream of doing what is becoming commonplace now.

[fast4522]

There was a report on Fox News he was on the internet looking at how to build bombs and Syrian resistance web sites.

[RunForTheRoses]

This is not a rant and at this point I offer no solutions...but...my left wing colleagues are already all over the guns and the 2nd Amendment (a total idiot I work with is now a legal scholar). Violence in movies and I guess games which I'm not too familiar with, has to be somewhat of a factor. Movies and TV shows have gotten so violent, pornographically violent that thoughts must enter the subconscious of even the most stable individual and for those on the fringe...not saying to ban anything, I'm way too libertarian for that but Hollywood does shove some vile stuff down our throats. I know there's an off switch...

[Tape Reader]

This is not a rant and at this point I offer no solutions...but...my left wing colleagues are already all over the guns and the 2nd Amendment (a total idiot I work with is now a legal scholar). Violence in movies and I guess games which I'm not too familiar with, has to be somewhat of a factor. Movies and TV shows have gotten so violent, pornographically violent that thoughts must enter the subconscious of even the most stable individual and for those on the fringe...not saying to ban anything, I'm way too libertarian for that but Hollywood does shove some vile stuff down our throats. I know there's an off switch...

Way to go!

Sue Hollywood save the world!

[Ocala Mike]

There was a report on Fox News



That fixes it as gospel, then! Anything about Antifa, Isis, or the Illuminati?

[fast4522]

This is not a rant and at this point I offer no solutions...but...my left wing colleagues are already all over the guns and the 2nd Amendment (a total idiot I work with is now a legal scholar). Violence in movies and I guess games which I'm not too familiar with, has to be somewhat of a factor. Movies and TV shows have gotten so violent, pornographically violent that thoughts must enter the subconscious of even the most stable individual and for those on the fringe...not saying to ban anything, I'm way too libertarian for that but Hollywood does shove some vile stuff down our throats. I know there's an off switch...

Blame pornographic films violent movies, or anything you want and it is a cop out. Underlying very systemic things are going on, I believe we are born with love of life and something has eroded and damaged some people's genome. Once a switch is flipped it may not be able to be reset. Combine drug use with poor upbringing the first seven years of life and you have something not human. And if we didn't need to get a handle on this, we want to have people already broken immigrate here so maybe not those who came first generation broken but broken kids they raised and exposed to drugs. Everything preliminary about this new monster it is not going to be good.

[boxcar]

Five confirmed dead so far.Parkland is a fairly upscale community about halfway between Fort Lauderdale and Palm Beach.Suspect was identified as 19 year old Nicholas Cruz , a former student at the school described by people who knew him as "socially awkward", which seems to be a common trait with these school shooters.

Parkland is an upscale community in Broward County fairly close to Coral Springs.

[steveb]

17 dead.

No, life wasn't perfect back in the 50s or 60s or 70s, but kids wouldn't dream of doing what is becoming commonplace now.

may be commonplace now in YOUR country, very very rare in most others.
maybe you could move to australia, but leave your guns at home.

[RunForTheRoses]

Way to go!

Sue Hollywood save the world!

:confused:

Where did I say that? VIP-Yes, Brains-No

[PaceAdvantage]

Biggest school slaughter in the USA happened almost a century ago (1927)

And not with a gun...

[MutuelClerk]

Happening too much. A website that agrees on nothing can hopefully agree on this. Maybe it's time to for the media to stop covering it 24-7 after it happens. Report on it. Give it less attention. Treat it like a KKK rally/parade. Then again were talking about the Get the widow on set media we need dirty laundry.

I'm tired of the gun argument/mental health discussion. Everyone cares for a day then goes about their business again. Were too used to this.

It's going to happen again, sadly probably soon. I hope the media stops glorifying it....

[fast4522]

Biggest school slaughter in the USA happened almost a century ago (1927)

And not with a gun...

Your correct but this one will beat like a drum. Your reference to Bath School disaster?

[porchy44]

Biggest school slaughter in the USA happened almost a century ago (1927)

And not with a gun...

Yes, good thing they do not sell dynamite at sporting goods stores anymore.

[JustRalph]

This guy threatened to do this.

He wAs expelled

He walked right in

Took an hour to catch him

I’m reading on the Internet that the school cops assigned were both off campus when it happened

Somebody needs to get fired......

[Tape Reader]

:confused:

Where did I say that? VIP-Yes, Brains-No

Yes, they were my words and not yours. I apologize.

However, anyone that cannot see the connection to violent movies and videos needs a “brain.”

[fast4522]

Yes, they were my words and not yours. I apologize.

However, anyone that cannot see the connection to violent movies and videos needs a “brain.”

It is something that be said instead of looking into a mirror.

[RunForTheRoses]

Yes, they were my words and not yours. I apologize.

However, anyone that cannot see the connection to violent movies and videos needs a “brain.”

OK, I was trying to not post too boldly...thought my words were twisted. But movies and TV the violence content has been ratcheted up. It effects me when I see the crazy stuff on the tube...and I'm normal :p

[boxcar]

OK, I was trying to not post too boldly...thought my words were twisted. But movies and TV the violence content has been ratcheted up. It effects me when I see the crazy stuff on the tube...and I'm normal :p

The motion picture industry glorifies violence, sex and drugs to the Nth degree. However, the rest of their content is all good...providing you can find it. :coffee:

[Robert Fischer]

desensitized to the shootings

but I was SHOCKED this morning when I happened to see a headline

charged with murder today??

really?

He was too cowardly to complete the suicide??

[FantasticDan]

https://twitter.com/cnn/status/964010097172189184

[oughtoh]

17 dead.

No, life wasn't perfect back in the 50s or 60s or 70s, but kids wouldn't dream of doing what is becoming commonplace now.

We were afraid of what our parents would do to us back then.

[PaceAdvantage]

https://twitter.com/cnn/status/964010097172189184The original George Bush did say there was a new world order coming...and he was right...

It's well on course...getting guns out of the hands of Americans has proven a bit more difficult than was expected, but slowly and surely, it too will come to pass...

[Inner Dirt]

As usual with liberals it is all the gun's fault. How about we get rid of a couple hundred lunatics instead of a couple hundred million guns? It seems every one of these mass shooters left a well marked trail. We need to change a few things and become proactive instead of reactive. This kid's words and actions prior to the shooting should have got him a visit from authorities and a mental evaluation against his will. Funny how the left believes in protecting the civil liberties of lunatics and weirdos, but wants to take them away from law abiding gun owners.

[JustRalph]

We were afraid of what our parents would do to us back then.

Amen! These kids today, their asses are not connected to their brains anymore.

[JustRalph]

Houston , we have a problem?

https://mobile.twitter.com/MAGAPILL/status/964002916708347904

[FantasticDan]

This kid's words and actions prior to the shooting should have got him a visit from authorities and a mental evaluation against his will.And yet, despite his history, and at only 18 years old, he was able to walk into a gun store and legally buy an AR-15.

He can't buy a beer until he's 21, but guns? Open for business.

[boxcar]

There is a huge story behind this big story, so here it is: The FBI knew beforehand about this kid and that he wasn't playing with a full deck. Does anyone remember Sandy Hook in 2012? The FBI back then also had been given advance notice about the shooter. (But of course...the FBI isn't culpable in this, right?)

I was reading on he Freeper sight about member who has relatives who used to live down here in Florida and one of their kids attended Parkland a year ago. When the kid's parent told him what happened, he immediately named who the likely shooter was! (And the kid did know about the shooting before his parents told him.) So...the question here is: If this kid who attended the high school a year ago knew who the culprit was, then we have to think this shooter's social issues were pretty common knowledge.

Another question that must be asked: Has the FBI been told to stand down on these kinds of reports and just take a "wait and see" attitude because the libs love for these kinds of tragedies to happen due to the great political opportunities the present?

[FantasticDan]

Another question that must be asked: Has the FBI been told to stand down on these kinds of reports and just take a "wait and see" attitude because the libs love for these kinds of tragedies to happen due to the great political opportunities the present?
Yep, that's probably what happened. Trump told the FBI to stand down in these cases. We always knew he had "liberal appetites", but didn't know he'd stoop this low.

:bang: :bang: :bang: :bang:

[JustRalph]

Let me meme.......

[boxcar]

Yep, that's probably what happened. Trump told the FBI to stand down in these cases. We always knew he had "liberal appetites", but didn't know he'd stoop this low.

:bang: :bang: :bang: :bang:

No, not Trump! Obama! Sandy Hook was back in 2012. Plus it appears the FBI does pretty much does its own thing to achieve political ends. It's a rogue agency.

[Parkview_Pirate]

The gun grabbers out in full force, as expected, calling for a government based solution, when the evidence indicates the government failed at several levels in this case. Check. The flawed logic of needing more intrusion by penalizing law abiding citizens escapes me.

The media, as usual, provides no depth on the root causes of the problem, but does use the event to promote ratings. They are actually part of the problem, as the shooters are often looking to "be somebody", and get their 15 minutes of fame.

One reporter mentioned many school shootings have the perp going online and "researching" what happened at Columbine. So, gotta believe law enforcement's path to search everyone's browser is on deck. Like the VAST MAJORITY of people who look at the Columbine event on the web are guilty of something, right?

It's pretty clear the kid is unbalanced. He'll be diagnosed with some form of mental illness, and I wouldn't be surprised if he had been treated with SSRIs, and had gone off them - if so, Big Pharma and the AMA will be scurrying to sweep that under the rug. Happens to be another root cause to many mass shootings.

Trump's got the right idea that mental health is an area to explore to prevent these kinds of things, but it's the third rail from a political perspective. The cure could very easily be far, far worse than the symptoms.

In other words, life can be risky. Unless you want draconian measures like you'd find in North Korea, there's a price to pay to live in a semi-free society.

[woodtoo]

Yep, that's probably what happened. Trump told the FBI to stand down in these cases. We always knew he had "liberal appetites", but didn't know he'd stoop this low.

:bang: :bang: :bang: :bang:

You had to bring in POTUS . Why?

[FantasticDan]

https://twitter.com/AdamSerwer/status/964205364907528198

[PaceAdvantage]

The person with the bandanna on his face and the MAGA hat isn't Cruz...but who cares...fake newz rulz

[PaceAdvantage]

Dan, how come Obama wasn't able to eliminate white supremacist hate groups?

Did he increase funding against these groups? He should have, right? He didn't make it a priority?

Why not?

Trump is an incompetent boob...Obama was/is a genius...the one real stable genius...a genius of the highest order...shouldn't he have been able to easily eliminate these white terrorists?

Serious questions, man.

[FantasticDan]

Dan, how come Obama wasn't able to eliminate white supremacist hate groups?

Did he increase funding against these groups? He should have, right? He didn't make it a priority?

Why not?

Trump is an incompetent boob...Obama was/is a genius...the one real stable genius...a genius of the highest order...shouldn't he have been able to easily eliminate these white terrorists?

Serious questions, man.
It's hard to know if you're joking or being purposely obtuse, like you often are.

You're asking me why Obama didn't "eliminate" white supremacy in the US?

Jeez, I dunno. That's a very good question. :ThmbUp: :rolleyes:

[Inner Dirt]

We were afraid of what our parents would do to us back then.


Amen! These kids today, their asses are not connected to their brains anymore.

I was way more afraid of my dad than the cops.

[PaceAdvantage]

It's hard to know if you're joking or being purposely obtuse, like you often are.

You're asking me why Obama didn't "eliminate" white supremacy in the US?

Jeez, I dunno. That's a very good question. :ThmbUp: :rolleyes:Well, you basically just stated that Trump's alleged lack of concern for white supremecists has led to this shooting...so I was just wondering how he compares to his predecessor, Obama, whom you hold in the highest regard.

I would have expected you to tell me Obama had WS on the brink of elimination, but Trump's "racist ways" have allowed them to return with a vengeance.

But we both know this isn't the case...WS has been around for countless centuries, no matter who the President was...

Your propaganda is no better or worse than the right's...yet you somehow always come off as so much more superior to them...that's what I find so comical year after year.

[FantasticDan]

Well, you basically just stated that Trump's alleged lack of concern for white supremecists has led to this shooting...
That's not what the tweet says.

[Clocker]

The FBI says that it investigated the threat that the shooter made on the internet, but was not able to identify the person after the threat was forwarded to them:

https://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/inline-images/shooter%20.jpg

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-02-15/fbi-admits-it-investigated-youtube-school-shooting-threat-failed-identify-person

[FantasticDan]

https://twitter.com/Max_Fisher/status/964141774351536130

[woodtoo]

The FBI were warned 5 months ago about Cruz but were to busy investigating a duly elected President and his staff. Shameful :ThmbDown:

[woodtoo]

https://twitter.com/Max_Fisher/status/964141774351536130

Can you please explain this chart for us imbiciles.:rolleyes:

[steveb]

And yet, despite his history, and at only 18 years old, he was able to walk into a gun store and legally buy an AR-15.

He can't buy a beer until he's 21, but guns? Open for business.

seriously?
if that's true then your country is seriously fugged.

[PaceAdvantage]

seriously?
if that's true then your country is seriously fugged.How so? Everyone going to die to guns? Is that how the US finally falls?

Nobody dies in Oz?

[boxcar]

Can you please explain this chart for us imbiciles.:rolleyes:

Don't waste your time with Fanny. In part, the post he copied said:

This piece making the rounds today, on how we know that gun ownership rates CAUSE mass shootings, doubles as an explainer on how social science works. (emphasis mine)

The above says it all about loony tunes logic.

[Clocker]

seriously?
if that's true then your country is seriously fugged.

That's what happens when you have too much freedom. That's why no one wants to immigrate here any more. :rolleyes:

[Tom]

Let me meme.......

How true.
Hope the libs here find someone to read that to them.

So what we have is an FBI obsessed with Never trump not doing its job. This was 100% preventable is the FBI had done ANYTHING to investigate.

[Tom]

That's not what the tweet says.

That's what happens when you outsource your communications.

[jocko699]

seriously?
if that's true then your country is seriously fugged.

Stop being a wanker mate.

You are comparing an Australia with a population of 25 million living on approximately 2.97 million square miles of land to the United States population of over 325 million living on approximately 3.75 million square miles.

The amount of anger in this country's young population clearly reflects in the mass killings the last 20+ years. Regardless of the weapon used the perpetrators would have killed.

Start addressing the failures of parents in today's society and than you may be able to lower the frequency of these atrocities.

[boxcar]

Stop being a wanker mate.

You are comparing an Australia with a population of 25 million living on approximately 2.97 million square miles of land to the United States population of over 325 million living on approximately 3.75 million square miles.

The amount of anger in this country's young population clearly reflects in the mass killings the last 20+ years. Regardless of the weapon used the perpetrators would have killed.

Start addressing the failures of parents in today's society and than you may be able to lower the frequency of these atrocities.

And the parents are just one part. What about Human Secularism and its primary tenet of atheistic evolution which clearly implies that no one's life is of any value or consequence since there was no purpose, design, intentionaltiy behind evolution, therefore no purpose to life either?

Moreover, our children are taught, at a nice tender young age, mainly in our not-so-mighty-fine public school system, social media, mainstream media, etc. that the murder of the most helpless, vulnerable, innocent humans in the womb is perfectly fine. Totally morally acceptable. This, too, reinforces the message of evolution as to the inconsequential value of human life.

[chadk66]

The number of people shot in schools since the 1800's is trivial compared to any other form of violent murder. From DUI accidents to anything else. To want to flush the 2nd amendment down the shitter over that just proves people are shrills.

[Greyfox]

Do daily TV shows with a steady stream of heroes and villains shooting at each other every hour of the day on multiple channels have a numbing effect on our appreciation of life?

[RunForTheRoses]

The White nationalist angle was a hoax perpetrated by 4chan users but of course the usual FanSuspects fell for it, had to be true:

http://www.tallahassee.com/story/new...say/341751002/

[boxcar]

Do daily TV shows with a steady stream of heroes and villains shooting at each other every hour of the day on multiple channels have a numbing effect on our appreciation of life?

Actually, I think much of the violence in the name of Entertainment and Art has been getting darker and darker in recent years. The violence was so dark and so intense in the last season I watched of the "Walking Dead" that I'm not going to watch what will probably be the final season.

[RunForTheRoses]

Do daily TV shows with a steady stream of heroes and villains shooting at each other every hour of the day on multiple channels have a numbing effect on our appreciation of life?

That's what I posted earlier. Shows/movies nowadays, shots ring out and ultra realistic images of blood and gore are emitted. Sick and getting sicker.

[PaceAdvantage]

Not to mention video games, like my current favorite, PlayerUnknown's Battlegrounds (or PUBG for short), where they drop 100 people on an island with the goal of killing every last person using a wide variety of firearms until you're the last one left alive...

[RunForTheRoses]

Not to mention video games, like my current favorite, PlayerUnknown's Battlegrounds (or PUBG for short), where they drop 100 people on an island with the goal of killing every last person using a wide variety of firearms until you're the last one left alive...

I saw this the other day, very popular:


https://www.reddit.com/r/PUBG/

[RunForTheRoses]

I saw this the other day, very popular:


https://www.reddit.com/r/PUBG/

Ave Maria!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=20&v=Ilk2s6YYE0c
But it looks like it could be fun. Especially if your stable.

[fast4522]

Stop being a wanker mate.

You are comparing an Australia with a population of 25 million living on approximately 2.97 million square miles of land to the United States population of over 325 million living on approximately 3.75 million square miles.

The amount of anger in this country's young population clearly reflects in the mass killings the last 20+ years. Regardless of the weapon used the perpetrators would have killed.

Start addressing the failures of parents in today's society and than you may be able to lower the frequency of these atrocities.

There is a huge difference in kids who actually had good parents the first seven years of life. Drugs are a big problem inside school, take away the movie and game problem and I think a kid who had it rough the first seven then took drugs and the result might be similar to what we are seeing.

In any case I thought your post was better than the rest.

[jocko699]

There is a huge difference in kids who actually had good parents the first seven years of life. Drugs are a big problem inside school, take away the movie and game problem and I think a kid who had it rough the first seven then took drugs and the result might be similar to what we are seeing.

In any case I thought your post was better than the rest.

Fast,

I appreciate your comment.

My bride and I have talked a great deal about these sickening events and conclude that until we all really address the fundamental issues of our society's failures to this youngsters murderous events will continue.

[FantasticDan]

https://twitter.com/theplumlinegs/status/964261329925234694

[PaceAdvantage]

Why does everyone want to keep coming here if it sucks so badly + it's so damn dangerous?

[MutuelClerk]

Bullets don't kill our school children.

Politicians do.

Getting reelected more important than some damn kids.....

[jocko699]

Why does everyone want to keep coming here if it sucks so badly + it's so damn dangerous?

It may be safer here compared to where they are coming from and this is still the greatest country IMO.

[FantasticDan]

https://twitter.com/michikokakutani/status/964252684416159744

[FantasticDan]

^^

https://twitter.com/rushmore8382/status/964285360762060800

[Clocker]

Great @RonBrownstein (https://twitter.com/RonBrownstein) piece detailing the deep, lopsided structural imbalance at play that allows a minority of the country to keep blocking action on immigration and guns supported by huge majorities

He says that Republicans want fewer immigrants, but then implies that most people are opposed to that position with this:

Depending on the poll, up to about 85 percent of Americans say they support legal status for the so-called Dreamers, who have received temporary protection from deportation under former President Barack Obama’s Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals program. Immigration and DACA are two different things. There is no evidence that Republicans want fewer immigrants. There is strong evidence that they want fewer illegal immigrants. And it is clear that the Democrats are trying to use DACA as a lever to get much more sweeping amnesty.

Many on the right are sympathetic to the plight of the DACA kids, and would like to see a clean fix. No one has presented a clean fix yet.

The polling data he presents on guns is suspect. Evidence shows that the results of polls on guns can be greatly manipulated by how the questions are posed. Questions about "assault rifles" are particularly suspect.

But the polls are not relevant. What is relevant is the 2nd Amendment, and that is not going to be changed. End of story.

[Clocker]

https://twitter.com/michikokakutani/status/964252684416159744

Complete nonsense. The major impact of the AWB was to increase the price and the demand for assault weapon lookalikes and their "high capacity" magazines. There were tons of both at any gun show on any weekend.

[johnhannibalsmith]

I don't know how it seems to get more likely instead of less likely with each new addition to the count, but they play video games and watch movies all over the wide wide world.

[Clocker]

That's why the AWB targeted such a configuration of weapon:
- Not a semi-auto weapon = can't fire fast.
- Small capacity clip/magazine = don't have many bullets.
- Non-detachable magazine = can't quickly reload when out of ammunition.
Not perfect, but better than today's rules.

More utter nonsense. None of those things describe conditions under the AWB. You could still buy a new AR-15 as long as it didn't have 2 or more evil looking features, like a bayonet mount or a folding stock.

You could still buy high capacity magazines holding 20 or 30 rounds, as long as they were manufactured before 1994. There were millions of them in circulation, a lot of them military surplus.

No AR-15 or similar weapon has or had a non-detachable magazine. That does describe a lot of .22 rifles and most shotguns.

Who makes this stuff up? You need to find a new staff of writers.

[JustRalph]

seriously?
if that's true then your country is seriously fugged.

Yeah, we’re so “”fugged” millions try to get in every year. We have to build walls and fences to keep them out. Give me a break.....

[PaceAdvantage]

I don't know how it seems to get more likely instead of less likely with each new addition to the count, but they play video games and watch movies all over the wide wide world.Yeah, but the rest of the world doesn't have all the guns...aren't you following? :lol:

[elysiantraveller]

^^

https://twitter.com/rushmore8382/status/964285360762060800

That post about the AWB is a load of garbage.

If people want to have an educated talk about guns it would help by not demonstrating their complete lack of knowledge with the social media copy and paste stuff.

To this day I've yet to find a decent definition of an assault weapon. HCaps wikipedia link certainly didn't help his case...

An assault rifle is a rifle that uses an intermediate cartridge, has the capacity to switch between semiautomatic/fully automatic fire and a detachable magazine.[1] Assault rifles are currently the standard service rifles in most modern armies.

Using that definition I honestly don't think an assault weapon has been used in ANY mass shooting to date. Maybe that bank robbery in California back in the mid 90s? :confused:

[jocko699]

Dear God, why do you allow such violence in schools?

Signed

A Concerned Student


Dear Concerned Student, I am not allowed in schools.

Signed

God

[JustRalph]

That post about the AWB is a load of garbage.

Amen!

From what I read, and the video going around, this kid had some experience firing whatever he was firing. I personally don’t think it sounded like an AR-15, but cell phones aren’t exactly the right platform for analyzing the sound.

Personally I believe that these guys using AR-15’s are using the wrong weapon for accomplishing what they want to accomplish. A 12 gauge semi auto shotgun with double 00 buckshot would be more effective all things considered. But they would have a magazine limit.

A well trained shooter with a couple of semi auto pistols might even be more effective because of the available magazines.

[Clocker]

To this day I've yet to find a decent definition of an assault weapon.

The story, which seems to be true, is that Hitler was impressed with a newly developed rifle and called it the Sturmgewehr or Storm Assault Rifle. The Allies started calling it an assault rifle, and the term entered common usage, but had no specific definition for our military or for gun manufacturers.

Gun grabbers latched on to the term because it sounded evil, especially given the Nazi connection. In short, it doesn't mean anything.

http://www.historicalfirearms.info/post/45688959145/historical-trivia-how-hitler-coined-the-term

[dlivery]

Will not be that long that the spillover into Canada will be for the good of Canada. Lets hear some good old boy talk Justin "T" to wired to career move

Where amazon is Moving a motion for Massive 1 million acres just for the office space

Plant in U.S.A OF canada

49,999 small business people will suffer.:popcorn::puke:

[jocko699]

Will not be that long that the spillover into Canada will be for the good of Canada. Lets hear some good old boy talk Justin "T" to wired to career move

Where amazon is Moving a motion for Massive 1 million acres just for the office space

Plant in U.S.A OF canada

49,999 small business people will suffer.:popcorn::puke:

WTF are you talking about????????

[Parkview_Pirate]

Amen!

From what I read, and the video going around, this kid had some experience firing whatever he was firing. I personally don’t think it sounded like an AR-15, but cell phones aren’t exactly the right platform for analyzing the sound.

Personally I believe that these guys using AR-15’s are using the wrong weapon for accomplishing what they want to accomplish. A 12 gauge semi auto shotgun with double 00 buckshot would be more effective all things considered. But they would have a magazine limit.

A well trained shooter with a couple of semi auto pistols might even be more effective because of the available magazines.

I'm not an expert, but I believe the .223/5.56MM cartridge was adopted by the military to allow soldiers to carry more rounds, and to wound rather than kill - or at least wound as often as killing - with the idea that wounded soldiers were more overhead than dead ones. That idea doesn't hold true in all parts of the world, of course.

Of course the military held on to the .308/7.62 NATO cartridge for sniper work - when death is the preferred outcome, and round count is less critical.

[Clocker]

WTF are you talking about????????

Have a few Molsons, hoser, it will all become clear to you. :popcorn:

[Mulerider]

I'm not an expert, but I believe the .223/5.56MM cartridge was adopted by the military to allow soldiers to carry more rounds, and to wound rather than kill - or at least wound as often as killing - with the idea that wounded soldiers were more overhead than dead ones. That idea doesn't hold true in all parts of the world, of course.

Of course the military held on to the .308/7.62 NATO cartridge for sniper work - when death is the preferred outcome, and round count is less critical.

Right on all counts. Except I think some of our snipers, particularly in extremely long-range operations, have moved on to more powerful calibers than the 7.62.

[Tom]

Do daily TV shows with a steady stream of heroes and villains shooting at each other every hour of the day on multiple channels have a numbing effect on our appreciation of life?

And that's just on the VIEW! :eek:

[Tom]

Dear God, why do you allow such violence in schools?

Signed

A Concerned Student


Dear Concerned Student, I am not allowed in schools.

Signed

God

OK, you are going to start a lot of trouble with THAT one! :eek:


:ThmbUp::ThmbUp::ThmbUp:

[FantasticDan]

https://twitter.com/humancipator35/status/964015591114752000

[mostpost]

Let me meme.......
Nitwit!! We do all those things with guns carried by people who are trained in their use, trained in when to use them, trained in how to defuse situations, trained in how to recognize when a situation is escalating and when it is not. Handing out guns willy nilly to a bunch of vigilantes is the solution of a fool.

[Lemon Drop Husker]

Is it guns?

Or is it our culture and schools?

We've had mass destructive guns dating back to WWII much like the one this kid used. We've never had mass executions in schools until the Columbine massacre in 1999.

Since then, 35 or so mass exections/attempts have happened.

Every single one of those kids/people are merely kids in the grand structure of conversation.

The real question is why? Not guns, but why is it now different than back in 1945? 1950? 1960?

The same stock, or near, was available.

Why did this kid do what he did?

[PaceAdvantage]

Maybe it's all the pharmaceuticals we consume...big pharma is hitting kids like never before with all kinds of drugs to alter and control them in some way...

Maybe it's global warming...

Maybe it's a lack of discipline since that's been pretty much outlawed these days.

Could be any of a number of things, besides guns of course.

[Clocker]

https://twitter.com/humancipator35/status/964015591114752000

I really don't have a clue what all that gibberish means, and I have no incentive or intention to do a lot of research to find out. How about communicating in plain language without the use of preprocessed propaganda pieces?

English only at the table, please.

[mostpost]

The person with the bandanna on his face and the MAGA hat isn't Cruz...but who cares...fake newz rulz
Who said he was? He is the guy in the middle.
As early as the third post in this thread it was suggested that he was an Islamic terrorist. Turns out he was just another home grown White Supremacist.

What I don't understand is how come all these supreme white guys always turn out to be such losers.

[Lemon Drop Husker]

Maybe it's all the pharmaceuticals we consume...big pharma is hitting kids like never before with all kinds of drugs to alter and control them in some way...

Maybe it's global warming...

Maybe it's a lack of discipline since that's been pretty much outlawed these days.

Could be any of a number of things, besides guns of course.

Won't matter PA. It is all Trump's fault.

Even though Newtown happened under Obama's watch, the entire history of gun violence at our school's is because of Trump and the GOP's 2A defense.

Pure ridiculous madness.

[Lemon Drop Husker]

Who said he was? He is the guy in the middle.
As early as the third post in this thread it was suggested that he was an Islamic terrorist. Turns out he was just another home grown White Supremacist.

What I don't understand is how come all these supreme white guys always turn out to be such losers.

The White Suprecamist BS has already been debunked.

But hey, it is Mosty, so anything goes. :sleeping:

[Clocker]

Could be any of a number of things, besides guns of course.

I think that we have already established here that guns and ammo and magazines and the rest remained essentially unchanged from pre-ban through the AWB and then post-ban.

It's all about guns and people. If mass shootings are on the increase, and the guns didn't change, then the people did.

[PaceAdvantage]

I hope people realize there were just as many "white supremacists" during Obama's tenure...they were doing all the same things too (preaching on the internet, marching, holding klan rallies, meetings, etc etc etc)

Nothing has changed...Obama didn't eradicate them...didn't even try to...

Yet ever since Trump got elected, all we've heard is how all these white supremacists are his fault...:lol:

But I digress (for the second time tonight)...back to the subject matter at hand

[mostpost]

Dear God, why do you allow such violence in schools?

Signed

A Concerned Student


Dear Concerned Student, I am not allowed in schools.

Signed

God
That is one of the dumbest things I have ever read. Did you make that up yourself? Why not ask God why he allows such violence in churches? Or is he no longer allowed there? God is allowed in schools; public, organized prayer is not.

Why does God allow such things? Because we have free will. God does not intervene so that we have the opportunity to better ourselves-to solve our own problems. Although I'm sure he must despair that we will ever get it right.

[Lemon Drop Husker]

That is one of the dumbest things I have ever read. Did you make that up yourself? Why not ask God why he allows such violence in churches? Or is he no longer allowed there? God is allowed in schools; public, organized prayer is not.

Why does God allow such things? Because we have free will. God does not intervene so that we have the opportunity to better ourselves-to solve our own problems. Although I'm sure he must despair that we will ever get it right.

And what is your solution Master Chief Sergeant dipshit?

[mostpost]

https://twitter.com/Max_Fisher/status/964141774351536130
Stop using logic and common sense. Those statistics-270 million guns and 90 mass shootings in the USA compared to 46 million buns and 18 shootings in the rest of the world-are even more stark when you realize that the rest of the world has twenty times the population of the USA.

[PaceAdvantage]

And what is your solution Master Chief Sergeant dipshit?I just want to politely suggest that even though mostpost often calls others names on here, this is a bit over the line...

[Lemon Drop Husker]

Stop using logic and common sense. Those statistics-270 million guns and 90 mass shootings in the USA compared to 46 million buns and 18 shootings in the rest of the world-are even more stark when you realize that the rest of the world has twenty times the population of the USA.

Keep quoting stats, and not even crying.

What is your solutuion?

WE ARE ALL EARS.

[Lemon Drop Husker]

I just want to politely suggest that even though mostpost often calls others names on here, this is a bit over the line...

In a post 2 back he said "one of the dumbest things I ever...".

Legislate right, and don't overextend for the other side.:ThmbUp:

[Parkview_Pirate]

Nitwit!! We do all those things with guns carried by people who are trained in their use, trained in when to use them, trained in how to defuse situations, trained in how to recognize when a situation is escalating and when it is not. Handing out guns willy nilly to a bunch of vigilantes is the solution of a fool.

Who said anything about vigilantes? There's been numerous school districts that have hired armed officers, and there's been others that have considered arming a subset of properly trained teachers.

You can bet for damn sure that residents of Parkland wished one of those steps had been taken.

[FantasticDan]

I really don't have a clue what all that gibberish means, and I have no incentive or intention to do a lot of research to find out. How about communicating in plain language without the use of preprocessed propaganda pieces?.
So Breyer wasn’t speaking in plain language? Funny, I didn’t have a problem following what he meant..

Maybe this will help, I think it’s in English :ThmbUp:

https://www.thenation.com/article/how-the-roberts-court-undermined-sensible-gun-control/

[Lemon Drop Husker]

Stop using logic and common sense. Those statistics-270 million guns and 90 mass shootings in the USA compared to 46 million buns and 18 shootings in the rest of the world-are even more stark when you realize that the rest of the world has twenty times the population of the USA.

What is your solution?

All I hear is your BS. What is your plan?

Or you just gonna keep crying?

[Lemon Drop Husker]

So Breyer wasn’t speaking in plain language? Funny, I didn’t have a problem following what he meant..

Maybe this will help, I think it’s in English :ThmbUp:

https://www.thenation.com/article/how-the-roberts-court-undermined-sensible-gun-control/

As always FD can never 'own' an opinion of his own, but spin more trash like this article to supposeldy "speak" for him, and then deny whatever the repercussions may come.

Which parts do you support Dan? Be very specific.

[Parkview_Pirate]

That is one of the dumbest things I have ever read. Did you make that up yourself? Why not ask God why he allows such violence in churches? Or is he no longer allowed there? God is allowed in schools; public, organized prayer is not.

Why does God allow such things? Because we have free will. God does not intervene so that we have the opportunity to better ourselves-to solve our own problems. Although I'm sure he must despair that we will ever get it right.

Not surprising you've taken the quote out of context, a popular pastime in the Religion II thread. And let's not forget the debate just begins when mentioning free will - as that concept conflicts with an omniscient God. But, wrong thread for that.

And I'm not so sure we should be taking religious advice from someone who capitalizes God, but not the reference pronoun. Of course, Mostpost, we know you consider yourself to be a god of sorts, so your confusion is understandable.

[Parkview_Pirate]

Houston , we have a problem?

https://mobile.twitter.com/MAGAPILL/status/964002916708347904

After the debacle in Vegas, all these mass shootings will be tagged as false flags, whether or not they are - just a new form of misdirection propaganda, to keep the sheep guessing. And on edge.

[Clocker]

So Breyer wasn’t speaking in plain language?

I didn't see any language, plain or otherwise, from Breyer. I saw the following, which is gibberish to me:

Justice Breyer penned the dissent against Scalia and I believe his rebuff is the ONLY way to interpret the 2nd Amendment.
(please pay no mind to the now disgraced interviewer)#GunControlNow (https://twitter.com/hashtag/GunControlNow?src=hash) #Parkland (https://twitter.com/hashtag/Parkland?src=hash) pic.twitter.com/cFF31ntZoI (https://t.co/cFF31ntZoI)If Breyer said something relevant, it is easy enough to quote it here.

[FantasticDan]

I didn't see any language, plain or otherwise, from Breyer. I saw the following, which is gibberish to me:.
There’s a two minute video of Breyer speaking attached to that tweet. Plays fine for me on multiple devices, but I understand some browsers can be fussy about it.

The Nation link spells out what he said in the video.

[Lemon Drop Husker]

There’s a two minute video of Breyer speaking attached to that tweet. Plays fine for me on multiple devices, but I understand some browsers can be fussy about it.

The Nation link spells out what he said in the video.

Did you Derp Derp?

[Clocker]

There’s a two minute video of Breyer speaking attached to that tweet. Plays fine for me on multiple devices, but I understand some browsers can be fussy about it.



Doesn't play fine for me because I don't clink on videos or other links unless someone can tell me in a sentence or two what it's about and why I should watch it.

You post a lot of links without giving a clue as to the content, and I, for one, ignore them.

[Inner Dirt]

Maybe it's all the pharmaceuticals we consume...big pharma is hitting kids like never before with all kinds of drugs to alter and control them in some way...

Maybe it's global warming...

Maybe it's a lack of discipline since that's been pretty much outlawed these days.

Could be any of a number of things, besides guns of course.

Crap like participation trophies, making it pretty much illegal to discipline your kid, basic coddling of kids. They end up being soft and can't handle a bad day. I have seen kids as young as 7 talking about stress. I keep hearing concern over bullying, body shaming, blah,blah, blah. That is all part of life, kids pick on each other. Then you have pathetic dip shits like Dr. Phil on TV making excuses for every rotten kid under the son and projecting like you can fix any problem with therapy and medication.

[Inner Dirt]

Why does everyone want to keep coming here if it sucks so badly + it's so damn dangerous?

A good chunk of people come from a country that has 5 times the USA murder rate, of course they bring that culture with them.

[RunForTheRoses]

The drugs doled out may be a factor. I read somewhere, only one place, that he was on some sort of anti-depressant and then abruptly stopped.

[RunForTheRoses]

Doesn't play fine for me because I don't clink on videos or other links unless someone can tell me in a sentence or two what it's about and why I should watch it.

You post a lot of links without giving a clue as to the content, and I, for one, ignore them.

With the title My Tweets Kill Fascists you didn't have a clue as to what it would be from the young man?

[woodtoo]

On Tuesday a grandmother in Washington State turned in grandson, Joshua Alexander O'Conner 18, after finding journal. Foils mass shooting, bombing.

Called 911 FBI not involved, held on $ 5 million bond.

@ Brietbart

[Inner Dirt]

On Tuesday a grandmother in Washington State turned in grandson, Joshua Alexander O'Conner 18, after finding journal. Foils mass shooting, bombing.

Called 911 FBI not involved, held on $ 5 million bond.

@ Brietbart

Oh no, what about his civil rights? Is there a sarcasm emoji? That kid must be a real pile of crap, grandma is usually the last to give up on someone.

[woodtoo]

She deserves a big hug and a medal.:ThmbUp:

[FantasticDan]

You post a lot of links without giving a clue as to the content, and I, for one, ignore them.
Total horse poop that I do that, and that’s just your out the backdoor excuse for ignoring the content.

[Tom]

What I don't understand is how come all these supreme white guys always turn out to be such losers.
Nothing more pathetic than a WHITE guy trying to pretend he is cool by dissing Whitey. What you guys used to say was "Some of my best friends are Coloreds."

[Tom]

I hope people realize there were just as many "white supremacists" during Obama's tenure...they were doing all the same things too (preaching on the internet, marching, holding klan rallies, meetings, etc etc etc)

Nothing has changed...Obama didn't eradicate them...didn't even try to...



But to his credit, he DID stop sitting in the front pew of one of those racist churches once the TV cameras were following him. :lol:

[Tom]

Doesn't play fine for me because I don't clink on videos or other links unless someone can tell me in a sentence or two what it's about and why I should watch it.

You post a lot of links without giving a clue as to the content, and I, for one, ignore them.

THIS. :ThmbUp:

Never seen anyone resist personal communication as much as this guy. Like Charlie McCarthy out with out Edgar. :rolleyes:

Even "Gary" speaks for himself on those Spectrum commercials! :pound::pound::pound:

[JustRalph]

Nitwit!! We do all those things with guns carried by people who are trained in their use, trained in when to use them, trained in how to defuse situations, trained in how to recognize when a situation is escalating and when it is not. Handing out guns willy nilly to a bunch of vigilantes is the solution of a fool.

You are so stupid........

[NJ Stinks]

THIS. :ThmbUp:

Never seen anyone resist personal communication as much as this guy. Like Charlie McCarthy out with out Edgar. :rolleyes:

Even "Gary" speaks for himself on those Spectrum commercials! :pound::pound::pound:

What about Ralph? Don't hear you guys crying about Ralphy Boy. :rolleyes:

[FantasticDan]

You are so stupid........
Strong retort. :ThmbUp: :lol:

[Clocker]

More liberal nonsense. CNN points out that gun laws in Florida are so lax that you don't need a permit there for concealed carry of an assault rifle. :faint:

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/laurettabrown/2018/02/15/cnn-points-out-that-in-florida-you-dont-need-a-permit-to-conceal-carry-a-rifle-n2449742

[PaceAdvantage]

Crap like participation trophies, making it pretty much illegal to discipline your kid, basic coddling of kids. They end up being soft and can't handle a bad day. I have seen kids as young as 7 talking about stress. I keep hearing concern over bullying, body shaming, blah,blah, blah. That is all part of life, kids pick on each other. Then you have pathetic dip shits like Dr. Phil on TV making excuses for every rotten kid under the son and projecting like you can fix any problem with therapy and medication.I have to pretty much agree with you there...

I too see all these kids with all kinds of problems we never saw en masse when I was a kid...claustrophobia, anxiety, etc. etc. It's insane.

And don't get me started on autism and all these kids who are "on the spectrum"...basically everybody is on the "spectrum" these days...anything to write more prescriptions...

[jocko699]

Stop using logic and common sense. Those statistics-270 million guns and 90 mass shootings in the USA compared to 46 million buns and 18 shootings in the rest of the world-are even more stark when you realize that the rest of the world has twenty times the population of the USA.


Mostie,

Thank you for your response.

[Fager Fan]

Mostie,

Thank you for your response.

Too bad it's so ridiculously factually wrong.

[jocko699]

Too bad it's so ridiculously factually wrong.

I am encouraging him to go back to his "nap" room.

[woodtoo]

I am encouraging him to go back to his "nap" room.

"gun free nap" room with "do not disturb" sign. aaahhhhh!!!

[mostpost]

I just want to politely suggest that even though mostpost often calls others names on here, this is a bit over the line...
I'm not offended, although I do not believe there is such a rank as Master Chief Sargeant.

[mostpost]

Doesn't play fine for me because I don't clink on videos or other links unless someone can tell me in a sentence or two what it's about and why I should watch it.

You post a lot of links without giving a clue as to the content, and I, for one, ignore them.
If you have a tweet, such as the one posted by FanDan and the tweet contains a link to a video, is it not logical to assume that the video further explains the tweet.

In this case, the tweet was about Mr. Justice Breyer's dissent and the video was an explanation of his view of the 2nd amendment.

There are a lot of examples of folks posting links without explanation (most of them by those on the right of the political spectrum) this is not one of them.

[Clocker]

CNN nails it again. This shooting is only getting big media coverage because the victims were a bunch of white kids.

https://pjmedia.com/trending/cnns-nicole-wallace-talking-parkland-white-kids-killed/

[PaceAdvantage]

They just ignore when blacks get killed in Chicago with guns because it doesn't fit the narrative as nicely...CNN only has itself to blame on this one...

They aren't covering the mass killing of blacks in Chicago with guns because it's not politically advantageous to do so...since Chicago is a pretty strict gun-control city and all...they'd have a tough time explaining away all that needs to be explained away...

[woodtoo]

I always wondered why no coverage of Chicago crime.

[Clocker]

If you have a tweet, such as the one posted by FanDan and the tweet contains a link to a video, is it not logical to assume that the video further explains the tweet.

No, it is logical to assume that the poster thinks it explains the tweet. And if the tweet is nonsense or highly partisan, I am not interested in further explanation.

Any "further explanation" can be easily summarized in a sentence to two to allow the reader to decide if it is worth looking at. In this case, available information led me to concluded it wasn't worth looking at. If you want me to read something, convince me. If you don't, it is your fault, not mine.

[dirt]

https://www.aol.com/article/news/2018/02/16/fbi-got-tip-on-florida-shooter-nikolas-cruz-in-january-but-didnt-follow-protocols/23363722/

[FantasticDan]

If you have a tweet, such as the one posted by FanDan and the tweet contains a link to a video, is it not logical to assume that the video further explains the tweet.

In this case, the tweet was about Mr. Justice Breyer's dissent and the video was an explanation of his view of the 2nd amendment.

There are a lot of examples of folks posting links without explanation (most of them by those on the right of the political spectrum) this is not one of them.
Correct, and I never post links without an explanation, as Clocker purports. It's just his lame, bullshit excuse for ignoring the material in the links.

He's also a hypocrite with his "partisan" claim, since he frequently posts links from Breitbart, the Blaze, Zero Hedge, PJ Media, and various other nutball outlets.

[barahona44]

Article from the Fort Lauderdale paper about how Cruz was able to get around school security.

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/local/broward/parkland/florida-school-shooting/fl-florida-school-shooting-20180215-story.html

Kids are sitting ducks at dismissal time.The high school I worked in had two exits, one for walkers (maybe400-500 kids ) and the other 1200-1300 who rode the bus went out the other.

Impossible to shut it down tight at the end of the day.

[JustRalph]

They just ignore when blacks get killed in Chicago with guns because it doesn't fit the narrative as nicely...CNN only has itself to blame on this one...

They aren't covering the mass killing of blacks in Chicago with guns because it's not politically advantageous to do so...since Chicago is a pretty strict gun-control city and all...they'd have a tough time explaining away all that needs to be explained away...

If the Jimmy Kimmel’s and other whiners of the world really cared about gun violence they would be marching in the streets of Chi town and screaming about the failures of Rahm Emanuel et al on their TV shows. Nope, can’t do that! That would be calling out the Dem leaders of Chicago, Detroit etc. they would be screaming that the most dangerous person in America is a black man between the ages of 13-33. They would be pointing out that illegal aliens commit a hugely disproportionate amount of crime. Yet they can’t do that......THAT WOULD BE CRITICISING THEIR VOTING BASE. CANT DO THAT!

It’s not about dead kids. It’s about controlling their political enemies.

[Clocker]

Correct, and I never post links without an explanation, as Clocker purports. It's just his lame, bullshit excuse for ignoring the material in the links.



I have no obligation to read anything posted here. If you want me to read something, give me a reason.

He's also a hypocrite with his "partisan" claim, since he frequently posts links from Breitbart, the Blaze, Zero Hedge, PJ Media, and various other nutball outlets. I go where I have to for facts, especially if the MSM is ignoring the facts. And I don't dismiss facts based on the source. But if you post a clearly partisan opinion and link to someone else's clearly partisan opinion to "support" it, I'm not interested. That matter is clearly subjective, and my right to decide.

[mostpost]

https://www.aol.com/article/news/2018/02/16/fbi-got-tip-on-florida-shooter-nikolas-cruz-in-january-but-didnt-follow-protocols/23363722/
For the benefit of Clocker and other lazy posters, the above links to a story about the FBI receiving a tip about Cruz's accumulation of weapons, deteriorating mental health, troubling social media posts and erratic behavior.
The FBI acknowledges receiving the material and admits to failing to follow proper procedures to investigate. They are unable at this time to say why this occurred.

[PaceAdvantage]

For the benefit of Clocker and other lazy posters, the above links to a story about the FBI receiving a tip about Cruz's accumulation of weapons, deteriorating mental health, troubling social media posts and erratic behavior.
The FBI acknowledges receiving the material and admits to failing to follow proper procedures to investigate. They are unable at this time to say why this occurred.Too busy chasing Trump ghosts...

[Clocker]

If the Jimmy Kimmel’s and other whiners of the world really cared about gun violence they would be marching in the streets of Chi town and screaming about the failures of Rahm Emanuel et al on their TV shows.

Chicago is notorious for clearing their jammed up courts and over-crowded jails with plea bargains and probation, even for crimes like gun possession.

[Inner Dirt]

I have to pretty much agree with you there...

I too see all these kids with all kinds of problems we never saw en masse when I was a kid...claustrophobia, anxiety, etc. etc. It's insane.

And don't get me started on autism and all these kids who are "on the spectrum"...basically everybody is on the "spectrum" these days...anything to write more prescriptions...

I know families where up to 3 kids were medicated for ADD or whatever they call it. I know two brothers who were medicated for ADD or whatever for 10 years or so each, then they went in the Navy which miraculously cured their ADD.

My favorite is the person with "anger control issues" funny that those issues usually only flair up around someone weaker than they are.

[Inner Dirt]

If the Jimmy Kimmel’s and other whiners of the world really cared about gun violence they would be marching in the streets of Chi town and screaming about the failures of Rahm Emanuel et al on their TV shows. Nope, can’t do that! That would be calling out the Dem leaders of Chicago, Detroit etc. they would be screaming that the most dangerous person in America is a black man between the ages of 13-33. They would be pointing out that illegal aliens commit a hugely disproportionate amount of crime. Yet they can’t do that......THAT WOULD BE CRITICISING THEIR VOTING BASE. CANT DO THAT!

It’s not about dead kids. It’s about controlling their political enemies.

While I was flipping stations on the radio in the DC area a couple Sunday's ago an obvious liberal preacher during a ranting sermon was blaming the "racist" NRA for homicides in the inner cities. Nowhere was he blaming blacks for killing each other. It is always the guns fault.

[Tom]

And Whitey's.

Yadda yadda yadda.
Gets old.

[steveb]

How so? Everyone going to die to guns? Is that how the US finally falls?

Nobody dies in Oz?


i was responding to the bit where he said one can't buy alcohol until 21, but can buy guns.

that is idiotical in the extreme, it it's true, if it's not, then he should not have said it.

so is that the law, and is it as it should be???

[Ocala Mike]

i was responding to the bit where he said one can't buy alcohol until 21, but can buy guns.

that is idiotical in the extreme, it it's true, if it's not, then he should not have said it.

so is that the law, and is it as it should be???

It varies from state to state in the good ole USA - not like Oz, I guess. You have your own crime problems, albeit not primarily with guns.

[Clocker]

so is that the law, and is it as it should be???

There's no law that says that laws have to be as they should be. :p

[steveb]

There's no law that says that laws have to be as they should be. :p

great answer
why bother?

[steveb]

It varies from state to state in the good ole USA - not like Oz, I guess. You have your own crime problems, albeit not primarily with guns.

sure we have problems, what place doesn't.

but to let them have guns at 18, and not alcohol until 21 is obscene.
i guess it's different to somebody looking in(me), than it is to somebody that has always had it so.

i can read all the stuff about don't blame guns, blame the person, and whatever, i just don't understand why people need guns.
from what i read it's a 'god' given right to own one in your fine country.
fine, i just don't understand why one would want to own one in the first place.
for what purpose?


so i guess you would call me a 'liberal' and i certainly lean slighty to the left, but it was a very conservative prime minister in my country that tried to get rid of guns, by buying them back amd making stricter laws.
best thing he ever did to my eyes.

what other first world country has the amount of slaughters as your country?
if it's not guns then what is it?
is there something fundamentally wrong with american society?

[PaceAdvantage]

Oy vey

[jocko699]

sure we have problems, what place doesn't.

but to let them have guns at 18, and not alcohol until 21 is obscene.
i guess it's different to somebody looking in(me), than it is to somebody that has always had it so.

i can read all the stuff about don't blame guns, blame the person, and whatever, i just don't understand why people need guns.
from what i read it's a 'god' given right to own one in your fine country.
fine, i just don't understand why one would want to own one in the first place.
for what purpose?


so i guess you would call me a 'liberal' and i certainly lean slighty to the left, but it was a very conservative prime minister in my country that tried to get rid of guns, by buying them back amd making stricter laws.
best thing he ever did to my eyes.

what other first world country has the amount of slaughters as your country?
if it's not guns then what is it?
is there something fundamentally wrong with american society?

Just stick to kangaroos and koala bears mate because you're clueless.:rolleyes::rolleyes:

[steveb]

Just stick to kangaroos and koala bears mate because you're clueless.:rolleyes::rolleyes:

thanks for your well thought out and reasoned response.
well done.
this is what happens when one can't answer in a meaningful way, they attack the person.

so now can you give a proper resonse or just more puerile nonsense?
how old did you say you were?
was it 10 or 11?

[horses4courses]

Just stick to kangaroos and koala bears mate because you're clueless.:rolleyes::rolleyes:

Here's a small, but telling, example of whats wrong in American society.
Bravado fueled by ignorance.

Did it make you feel good, jocko, to put someone down
with a stereotypical insult? Did you take a deep breath
first - even thump your chest once or twice while typing?

Pathetic douche.......:ThmbDown:

[NJ Stinks]

sure we have problems, what place doesn't.

but to let them have guns at 18, and not alcohol until 21 is obscene.
i guess it's different to somebody looking in(me), than it is to somebody that has always had it so.

i can read all the stuff about don't blame guns, blame the person, and whatever, i just don't understand why people need guns.
from what i read it's a 'god' given right to own one in your fine country.
fine, i just don't understand why one would want to own one in the first place.
for what purpose?


so i guess you would call me a 'liberal' and i certainly lean slighty to the left, but it was a very conservative prime minister in my country that tried to get rid of guns, by buying them back amd making stricter laws.
best thing he ever did to my eyes.

what other first world country has the amount of slaughters as your country?
if it's not guns then what is it?
is there something fundamentally wrong with american society?

There is something fundamentally wrong with about 40% of the population. That's the 40% who claim Donny Boy is just great, rapid fire guns are an American right, and no American should get a government handout.

Oh. And Steve, those are the real Americans just in case you haven't heard. :rolleyes:

[steveb]

Here's a small, but telling, example of whats wrong in American society.
Bravado fueled by ignorance.

Did it make you feel good, jocko, to put someone down
with a stereotypical insult? Did you take a deep breath
first - even thump your chest once or twice while typing?

Pathetic douche.......:ThmbDown:

thank you for that, but no need.
water off a ducks back.
i am sure he will be fine when he comes of age in about 10 years time

i just would like to say that koalas are not bears!! :confused:

[jocko699]

thanks for your well thought out and reasoned response.
well done.
this is what happens when one can't answer in a meaningful way, they attack the person.

so now can you give a proper resonse or just more puerile nonsense?
how old did you say you were?
was it 10 or 11?

In Australian years? 147. You have no idea what you are talking about. You attempt to compare what goes on in Australia and somehow hypothesize that you have an ffing clue about this country.

The problem here is not guns but the absolute lack of upbringing and failure of parents and communities to stop this BS, Meanwhile, down under you drink piss beer and attempt to give us some BS global insight.

Get back to sucking on lollipops you wanker!!!!

[steveb]

In Australian years? 147. You have no idea what you are talking about. You attempt to compare what goes on in Australia and somehow hypothesize that you have an ffing clue about this country.

The problem here is not guns but the absolute lack of upbringing and failure of parents and communities to stop this BS, Meanwhile, down under you drink piss beer and attempt to give us some BS global insight.

Get back to sucking on lollipops you wanker!!!!

so are you the perfect example of somebody well brought up?

[jocko699]

thank you for that, but no need.
water off a ducks back.
i am sure he will be fine when he comes of age in about 10 years time

i just would like to say that koalas are not bears!! :confused:

Stevie,

Please pass my love onto horsey but I have him on ignore.

[jocko699]

so are you the perfect example of somebody well brought up?

No, only God is perfect. I am human, you?

[incoming]

thanks for your well thought out and reasoned response.
well done.
this is what happens when one can't answer in a meaningful way, they attack the person.

so now can you give a proper resonse or just more puerile nonsense?
how old did you say you were?
was it 10 or 11?

Nothing like worldly advice given from a citizen of a country that doesn't have the technology to produce their own automobiles.
:cool::lol:

[Clocker]

That's the 40% who claim Donny Boy is just great

Actually, the percent that claim that is a lot lower than that. But the number that think that he is preferable to Hillary is meaningfully higher. :jump:

[PaceAdvantage]

but to let them have guns at 18, and not alcohol until 21 is obscene.You actually think 18-21 makes a difference with either alcohol or guns? THAT'S your concern?

We let them have both guns and alcohol at 21 and everything will be peachy? :lol:

[pandy]

You actually think 18-21 makes a difference with either alcohol or guns? THAT'S your concern?

We let them have both guns and alcohol at 21 and everything will be peachy? :lol:

Honestly, you don't think it seems kind of odd that an 18 year old can buy an AR-15 but not a beer? Obviously, in Florida they don't think an 18 year old is mature enough to drink, but mature enough to buy an assault weapon.

[horses4courses]

There is something fundamentally wrong with about 40% of the population. That's the 40% who claim Donny Boy is just great, rapid fire guns are an American right, and no American should get a government handout.

Oh. And Steve, those are the real Americans just in case you haven't heard. :rolleyes:

Read an article today, NJ, that puts forward an interesting theory on this.
It's about the human desire (especially in males) for control from an early age.

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/david-mcwilliams-blue-collar-america-has-lost-control-1.3393812

When blue collar America can't have direct control themselves, they then must appoint someone with whom they are comfortable to make the decisions for them. That decision maker must be someone who they feel has achieved success by earning it (at least in their minds). They despise anyone who becomes successful via intellect or academia, who are the dreaded "elitists".

[steveb]

You actually think 18-21 makes a difference with either alcohol or guns? THAT'S your concern?

We let them have both guns and alcohol at 21 and everything will be peachy? :lol:

that you think that's funny in light of what going on is.......
whatever, but i do note you pull up people when they get personal.......sometimes?
mybe not this time because you agree with him????
not that i care one iota if you do or not, it's just an observation

[steveb]

Nothing like worldly advice given from a citizen of a country that doesn't have the technology to produce their own automobiles.
:cool::lol:

where did i give any advice??

as for the cars, i am struggling to see any relevance to guns and slaughters?
anyway, cars were manufactured here, but once the government stopped heavily subsidising them, then it was uneconomical to do that.

have you any more irrelevances to spout?

[Tom]

Read an article today, NJ, that puts forward an interesting theory on this.
It's about the human desire (especially in males) for control from an early age.

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/david-mcwilliams-blue-collar-america-has-lost-control-1.3393812

When blue collar America can't have direct control themselves, they then must appoint someone with whom they are comfortable to make the decisions for them. That decision maker must be someone who they feel has achieved success by earning it (at least in their minds). They despise anyone who becomes successful via intellect or academia, who are the dreaded "elitists".

You would be seriously scary if your weren't so seriously pathetic.

Intellect and academia?

You confuse your own desire to control everyone's lives with intelligence. Intellect and academia are so far above the liberal "ceiling" you will never what either one is.

Pathetic douche.......
Homebred embarrassment.

[jocko699]

that you think that's funny in light of what going on is.......
whatever, but i do note you pull up people when they get personal.......sometimes?
mybe not this time because you agree with him????
not that i care one iota if you do or not, it's just an observation

I am so sorry, I guess men down under aren't what they used to be.

As far as accusing PA of taking sides that is BS.

[horses4courses]

You would be seriously scary if your weren't so seriously pathetic.

Intellect and academia?

You confuse your own desire to control everyone's lives with intelligence. Intellect and academia are so far above the liberal "ceiling" you will never what either one is.


Homebred embarrassment.

I am truly honored to have your disapproval.
It really means a lot to me. :ThmbUp:

[steveb]

I am so sorry, I guess men down under aren't what they used to be.

As far as accusing PA of taking sides that is BS.

it matters not at all, go for your life.
can't resist another little dig can you?
it's ok though, i am here, and you are there.
how lucky am i?

[jocko699]

it matters not at all, go for your life.
can't resist another little dig can you?
it's ok though, i am here, and you are there.
how lucky am i?

Not as lucky as us Americans are but we can send a postcard if you want.

[incoming]

where did i give any advice??

as for the cars, i am struggling to see any relevance to guns and slaughters?
anyway, cars were manufactured here, but once the government stopped heavily subsidising them, then it was uneconomical to do that.

have you any more irrelevances to spout?

I wouldn't dare try to solve your car manufacturing problems from more then a half of a world away. I would expect the same courtesy with your advice about how to handle our mentally unstable population.

[Clocker]

Read an article today, NJ, that puts forward an interesting theory on this.
It's about the human desire (especially in males) for control from an early age.

That is certainly the biggest piece of pseudo-intellectual clap-trap I have read in a long time. An Irish journalist goes to Disney World and claims to discover there the truth about the psychology of Americans, and in particular that of American blue collar men. Few of whom could afford a week at Disney World for their families. And if they could, they would rather spend the money on a new used truck, and a new rifle for the gun rack in back.

Clearly he has never talked to, let alone worked along side, an American blue collar worker.

We love to be in control, but in truth we rarely are. The average worker’s daily reality is the opposite.

Typically he is taking orders from someone else, and is not only not in control, but under the thumb.

He is sick of taking orders and wants to be the guy who gives the orders.Total nonsense. I have worked a lot of blue collar jobs in my life. A lot of guys don't want to be the boss. I saw a lot turn down foreman jobs. They just want to know what the job is and be left to do it. And as one guy I worked with memorably said, "I just don't like working for no one what's dumber than me."

The average guy votes for the guy who looks like the boss because deep down that’s who he wants to be, not for the money alone, but for the sense of personal sovereignty.The average guy just wants to put in his 40 hours, maybe a little OT once in a while for some extra money for man toys, and be left alone. Your Irish friend also forgets that until the Democrats started screwing up big time, they were the party of the American blue collar workers. How did he miss that at Disney World?

[PaceAdvantage]

that you think that's funny in light of what going on is.......
whatever, but i do note you pull up people when they get personal.......sometimes?
mybe not this time because you agree with him????
not that i care one iota if you do or not, it's just an observationYou might want to make your next reply more comprehensible to those who are fluent in the English language. I can't understand a word of this.

[PaceAdvantage]

Honestly, you don't think it seems kind of odd that an 18 year old can buy an AR-15 but not a beer? Obviously, in Florida they don't think an 18 year old is mature enough to drink, but mature enough to buy an assault weapon.18yo can also go off and fight in a war but can't buy a beer...meh

[barahona44]

18yo can also go off and fight in a war but can't buy a beer...meh

People choose to join the military.Nice try but you need a better example.

The major reason why 18-20 year olds can't buy alcohol is because the Reagan Administration in 1984 reduced federal highway funding to states by 10 per cent every year that they didn't raise the minimum drinking age to 21.As usual money talks and the states all stepped in line.

I don't see why gun rights supporters are worried.Adam Lanza walks into a schoolroom and murders 20 six year olds with a semi automatic rifle and nothing changed.It certainly isn't going to now.

[PaceAdvantage]

You all need way better examples as well...because I haven't seen or heard anything anywhere near convincing yet...

Guns are the problem? Really...I don't think so...

Guns and kids and schools have been around FOREVER...but only now there is a problem...

Wouldn't you say it was something else other than guns? Or are the guns these days some sort of magical beings that have hypnotized these killers into doing their bidding?

You don't actually believe guns are the root cause of all these modern day problems, do you?

[steveb]

You might want to make your next reply more comprehensible to those who are fluent in the English language. I can't understand a word of this.

that was a nice sidestep.

it was perfectly legible except for my bad habit of not using upper case, but the meaning was clear as can be.

[PaceAdvantage]

No sidestep at all...being brutally honest. I don't know what you're trying to say there.

[incoming]

PA....you just don't understand liberal logic. When I see the first gun in jail convicted of killing anything I will take notice. Of course, any slick lawyer could actually get a gun acquitted...it's the bullet that actually does the killing. You really have to love that kind of logic. :rolleyes::lol:

[Clocker]

Guns are the problem? Really...I don't think so...

Guns and kids and schools have been around FOREVER...but only now there is a problem...

There were some posts in another thread claiming that these shootings sky-rocketed after the AWB expired and the evil black guns and hi-cap mags became available again.

The problem with that is that AR-15s and hi-caps were regularly and legally available all through the ban.

The point is that the guns and magazines and ammo were essentially the same before the ban, during the ban, after the ban, and today. Nothing of consequence has changed on the hardware side.

So it seems high likely that something changed on the user side. I just did a quick search and could find no school shootings that occurred in private or charter schools. Perhaps I just didn't search long enough. Or perhaps children are being raised differently in those schools. Are historic standards for raising children being maintained in private schools and "evolving" in public schools? Certainly private schools have always had stricter discipline.

[steveb]

No sidestep at all...being brutally honest. I don't know what you're trying to say there.


well then i would suggest the problem is yours not mine, 'brutally honest' or otherwise.
it was not an 'attempt', it came out exactly as i meant it to.
and then there is 'oy vey', and i guess that is fluent english too!

[BaffertsWig]

Damn... a true American.

Florida student Emma Gonzalez to lawmakers and gun advocates: 'We call BS'

Florida student to NRA and Trump: 'We call BS'
(CNN)Emma Gonzalez, a senior at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School, addressed a gun control rally on Saturday in Fort Lauderdale, Florida, days after a gunman entered her school in nearby Parkland and killed 17 people.

Below is a full transcript of her speech:

We haven't already had a moment of silence in the House of Representatives, so I would like to have another one. Thank you.

Every single person up here today, all these people should be home grieving. But instead we are up here standing together because if all our government and President can do is send thoughts and prayers, then it's time for victims to be the change that we need to see. Since the time of the Founding Fathers and since they added the Second Amendment to the Constitution, our guns have developed at a rate that leaves me dizzy. The guns have changed but our laws have not.

Read the rest at the link:https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/17/us/florida-student-emma-gonzalez-speech/index.html

[incoming]

They paint a different picture than previously reported. At the link

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/nikolas-cruz-we-had-this-monster-living-under-our-roof-and-we-didnt-know/ar-BBJgp8y?li=BBmkt5R&ocid=spartandhp

[JustRalph]

Oy vey

I’ll add a good ole Midwest “Wow!”

[barahona44]

Broward County sheriff's office had 39 calls over 7 years to Cruz's home address.

https://nypost.com/2018/02/16/deputies-called-to-suspected-shooters-home-39-times-over-seven-years/

[Fager Fan]

Honestly, you don't think it seems kind of odd that an 18 year old can buy an AR-15 but not a beer? Obviously, in Florida they don't think an 18 year old is mature enough to drink, but mature enough to buy an assault weapon.

The AR 15 isn't an assault weapon.

But to the main point, it's more odd that we will send an 18yo to war yet not allow an 18yo to drink. Or that we allow them to vote but not drink.

So think a little on alcohol and driving and how kids do a bad job at being responsible doing either, and you see how maybe our society doesn't want to make it easier for them to combine the two. I haven't looked it up, but I'm going to guess that upping the legal drinking age had resulted in fewer DWI deaths to teens and the innocents in their path on the roads. Upping the drinking age occurred at the same time that MADD had real influence in cleaning up our roads and putting a negative societal opinion on drinking and driving.

[Fager Fan]

it matters not at all, go for your life.
can't resist another little dig can you?
it's ok though, i am here, and you are there.
how lucky am i?

A foreigner insulting our country shouldn't be surprised if it's not received well.

[barahona44]

A foreigner insulting our country shouldn't be surprised if it's not received well.

It's a good thing then that Australia's not a "shithole" country.

[Tom]

Broward County sheriff's office had 39 calls over 7 years to Cruz's home address.

https://nypost.com/2018/02/16/deputies-called-to-suspected-shooters-home-39-times-over-seven-years/

Banning guns will do the job that law enforcement will not do.

[Inner Dirt]

You all need way better examples as well...because I haven't seen or heard anything anywhere near convincing yet...

Guns are the problem? Really...I don't think so...

Guns and kids and schools have been around FOREVER...but only now there is a problem...

Wouldn't you say it was something else other than guns? Or are the guns these days some sort of magical beings that have hypnotized these killers into doing their bidding?

You don't actually believe guns are the root cause of all these modern day problems, do you?

Thanks! I already used that in a morning discussion with my liberal girlfriend, that is a great truth. Sorry I could not credit you as she has browsed this forum and despises most of us, including post election comments by Inner Dirt. She did know it was me.:lol::lol::lol:

[Racetrack Playa]

The AR 15 isn't an assault weapon.

Are you sure?

[mrhorseplayer]

Yes Im sure the AR-15 is not a assault rifle its just a rifle.

[PaceAdvantage]

It looks super scary though...that must mean it's an assault rifle...:rolleyes:

And isn't EVERY firearm an assault weapon?

[Tom]

Jesse James would agree with you, Boss! :lol:

Son of Sam - no automatic weapons - terrorized NYC for over a year - people afraid to go out at night, dying their hair.....

Common sense definition of what the real problem is might be a good place to start.

[woodtoo]

Banning guns will do the job that law enforcement will not do.

Sad.

[Racetrack Playa]

And isn't EVERY firearm an assault weapon?
The phrase/term Assault Weapon is what made me post the question.
You know what I mean. FF just used the wrong word. :coffee:

[Clocker]

Are you sure?

As far as I know, there is no current definition of an assault weapon under federal law. So the general answer is it is not.

Under federal law at the time that the AWB was in effect, some AR-15s were legally defined as assault weapons and some were not, based largely on appearance rather than function. And the average citizen at the time could probably not tell the difference.

A few predictably anal states do have laws defining assault weapons (CA, NY, MA, etc.). The AR-15 is classified as an assault weapon in those states.

[JustRalph]

it matters not at all, go for your life.
can't resist another little dig can you?
it's ok though, i am here, and you are there.
how lucky am i?

How lucky? Your entire country was disarmed by the government.
Look into that a little and you will find people like Stalin, Mao and others did the same thing. Then they wholesale slaughtered millions. Our 2nd Amendment isn’t about hunting, or target shooting. It was placed in our constitution so the people could defend themselves from our government.

It’s backed up in the writings of our founders from the Federalist papers to the sons of Liberty.

You now live in a country that has no recourse but to be subservient to your governments every whim.

You have 23 million people, but only 56k military members. You are ripe for invasion. No way you can protect your own shoreline.
Your population would be sitting ducks for any invading force. Do you think that’s the same here? We have 28 million veterans in this country. 99% of them willing to pull a trigger to protect the country (excluding John Kerry) and that’s not counting the rednecks who have never served:lol:

Are you starting to get the point? Your country relies on the kindness of others and the hope that no tyrants rise up. Americans were endowed with the right to shoot their politicians should it come to that and in no way would we ever hope that someone else would protect us from the forces of evil that pervade this world.

We saved the world and in fact your country especially, in World War II by using GUNS and we are equipped to do it again, unlike your country. So you sit over there with your nose in the air thinking you are more civilized, cultured and such. America will stay on watch. We will endure sad episodes such as school shootings because we have ignorant school leaders, left leaning gun grabbers and the like, but we will not let these events change our underlying foundations and belief systems at the whim of a politician or a political party. Unlike you.

[Fager Fan]

It's a good thing then that Australia's not a "shithole" country.

Boy, that's really the same thing. Amazing how people twist everything these days.

I'm guessing that Australia has some shithole areas of their country just like we do. Neither country is such a disaster that the whole country could be characterized as such. Some could though, and saying so in a private meeting shouldn't have been used for partisan politics.

[Fager Fan]

The phrase/term Assault Weapon is what made me post the question.
You know what I mean. FF just used the wrong word. :coffee:

How did I use the wrong word saying it's not an assault weapon. By definition, it's not.

[Fager Fan]

How lucky? Your entire country was disarmed by the government.
Look into that a little and you will find people like Stalin, Mao and others did the same thing. Then they wholesale slaughtered millions. Our 2nd Amendment isn’t about hunting, or target shooting. It was placed in our constitution so the people could defend themselves from our government.

It’s backed up in the writings of our founders from the Federalist papers to the sons of Liberty.

You now live in a country that has no recourse but to be subservient to your governments every whim.

You have 23 million people, but only 56k military members. You are ripe for invasion. No way you can protect your own shoreline.
Your population would be sitting ducks for any invading force. Do you think that’s the same here? We have 28 million veterans in this country. 99% of them willing to pull a trigger to protect the country (excluding John Kerry) and that’s not counting the rednecks who have never served:lol:

Are you starting to get the point? Your country relies on the kindness of others and the hope that no tyrants rise up. Americans were endowed with the right to shoot their politicians should it come to that and in no way would we ever hope that someone else would protect us from the forces of evil that pervade this world.

We saved the world and in fact your country especially, in World War II by using GUNS and we are equipped to do it again, unlike your country. So you sit over there with your nose in the air thinking you are more civilized, cultured and such. America will stay on watch. We will endure sad episodes such as school shootings because we have ignorant school leaders, left leaning gun grabbers and the like, but we will not let these events change our underlying foundations and belief systems at the whim of a politician or a political party. Unlike you.

Great post, Ralph.

Many people in this country don't understand the purpose of the 2nd amendment.

[PaceAdvantage]

How lucky? Your entire country was disarmed by the government.
Look into that a little and you will find people like Stalin, Mao and others did the same thing. Then they wholesale slaughtered millions. Our 2nd Amendment isn’t about hunting, or target shooting. It was placed in our constitution so the people could defend themselves from our government.

It’s backed up in the writings of our founders from the Federalist papers to the sons of Liberty.

You now live in a country that has no recourse but to be subservient to your governments every whim.

You have 23 million people, but only 56k military members. You are ripe for invasion. No way you can protect your own shoreline.
Your population would be sitting ducks for any invading force. Do you think that’s the same here? We have 28 million veterans in this country. 99% of them willing to pull a trigger to protect the country (excluding John Kerry) and that’s not counting the rednecks who have never served:lol:

Are you starting to get the point? Your country relies on the kindness of others and the hope that no tyrants rise up. Americans were endowed with the right to shoot their politicians should it come to that and in no way would we ever hope that someone else would protect us from the forces of evil that pervade this world.

We saved the world and in fact your country especially, in World War II by using GUNS and we are equipped to do it again, unlike your country. So you sit over there with your nose in the air thinking you are more civilized, cultured and such. America will stay on watch. We will endure sad episodes such as school shootings because we have ignorant school leaders, left leaning gun grabbers and the like, but we will not let these events change our underlying foundations and belief systems at the whim of a politician or a political party. Unlike you.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sSGBct3RgX0

[NJ Stinks]

Thanks! I already used that in a morning discussion with my liberal girlfriend, that is a great truth. Sorry I could not credit you as she has browsed this forum and despises most of us, including post election comments by Inner Dirt. She did know it was me.:lol::lol::lol:

If I have said it already, your girlfriend seems like a real keeper! :cool:

[FantasticDan]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sSGBct3RgX0
I agree, Ralph's stand-up routine is a ridiculous hoot! :lol: :ThmbUp:

[FantasticDan]

Btw, according to Ralph's comical logic, basically every country in the world must be subservient to the whims of their govt and ripe for invasion.. :lol:

So don't feel so weak and vulnerable Australia, you're in excellent company. :p

[NJ Stinks]

Great post, Ralph.

Many people in this country don't understand the purpose of the 2nd amendment.

Ralph is the kind of guy who wonders why we stopped constructing home nuclear fallout shelters in the 1970's. He sees the boogeyman behind every tree. Yet somehow PA thinks we are supposed to be impressed by his brand of paranoia.

Good luck with that. :rolleyes:

[PaceAdvantage]

Ralph is the kind of guy who wonders why we stopped constructing home nuclear fallout shelters in the 1970's. He sees the boogeyman behind every tree. Yet somehow PA thinks we are supposed to be impressed by his brand of paranoia.

Good luck with that. :rolleyes:Speaking of seeing boogeymen behind every tree....TRUMP...BOO! :lol::pound:

[davew]

How lucky? Your entire country was disarmed by the government.
Look into that a little and you will find people like Stalin, Mao and others did the same thing. Then they wholesale slaughtered millions. Our 2nd Amendment isn’t about hunting, or target shooting. It was placed in our constitution so the people could defend themselves from our government.

You have 23 million people, but only 56k military members. You are ripe for invasion. No way you can protect your own shoreline.
Your population would be sitting ducks for any invading force. Do you think that’s the same here? We have 28 million veterans in this country. 99% of them willing to pull a trigger to protect the country (excluding John Kerry) and that’s not counting the rednecks who have never served:lol:



Even though Australia had a gun buyback, it was not a complete success. From an older article ->

https://bearingarms.com/bob-o/2016/10/21/australia-admits-gun-buyback-failure-amnesty/

Australia might have less than 100K in military, but they are a member of ANZUS and their military strength is not that bad.

https://www.globalfirepower.com/country-military-strength-detail.asp?country_id=australia

[Racetrack Playa]

We will endure sad episodes such as school shootings because we have ignorant school leaders, left leaning gun grabbers and the like, but we will not let these events change our underlying foundations and belief systems at the whim of a politician or a political party. Unlike you.
Are you blaming the SCHOOL?
https://tse2.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP._ytucZf6CtsBsvA_f96k_gHaE7&pid=15.1&P=0&w=269&h=180
JustRalph?

[NJ Stinks]

Speaking of seeing boogeymen behind every tree....TRUMP...BOO! :lol::pound:

I jumped! :eek:


:)

[FantasticDan]

I jumped! :eek:

Don't worry, you're not the type he likes to grab. :blush:

[JustRalph]

Are you blaming the SCHOOL?
https://tse2.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP._ytucZf6CtsBsvA_f96k_gHaE7&pid=15.1&P=0&w=269&h=180
JustRalph?

They had shit for security

[woodtoo]

They had shit for security

Generally speaking malls and hotels have better security, seems like a logical place to start- security in these times.

[Fager Fan]

Ralph is the kind of guy who wonders why we stopped constructing home nuclear fallout shelters in the 1970's. He sees the boogeyman behind every tree. Yet somehow PA thinks we are supposed to be impressed by his brand of paranoia.

Good luck with that. :rolleyes:

You are a person who lacks foresight. Our founding fathers were not.

[Fager Fan]

Are you blaming the SCHOOL?
https://tse2.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP._ytucZf6CtsBsvA_f96k_gHaE7&pid=15.1&P=0&w=269&h=180
JustRalph?

Is this a serious question? If there's anyone who can prevent a shooting at a school, it's the school itself, not anyone else. It's not even that difficult. Make limited access points which are guarded for starters.

[Show Me the Wire]

Btw, according to Ralph's comical logic, basically every country in the world must be subservient to the whims of their govt and ripe for invasion.. :lol:

So don't feel so weak and vulnerable Australia, you're in excellent company. :p

Ralph is correct. The error is not understanding the uniqueness of America versus other countries. In basically, in every other country rights, really privileges, come from the government and the polititcians. America is unique in that rights do not come from the government, the government's right to exist comes from the people and its powers are limited. Americans are not subject to the whims of their government, it is the government that is subjected to the whims of the people.

If you want to live in a country were privileges come from the government America is not the place to be.

[davew]

Ralph is the kind of guy who wonders why we stopped constructing home nuclear fallout shelters in the 1970's. He sees the boogeyman behind every tree. Yet somehow PA thinks we are supposed to be impressed by his brand of paranoia.

Good luck with that. :rolleyes:


I feel Ralph is a realist trying to explain how it really is to idealists...

[NJ Stinks]

I feel Ralph is a realist trying to explain how it really is to idealists...

I'm sure Ralph agrees with you.

[FantasticDan]

https://youtu.be/W2_7qEaD4WM

[steveb]

I agree, Ralph's stand-up routine is a ridiculous hoot! :lol: :ThmbUp:

and i had a nice chuckle too.

[Show Me the Wire]

and i had a nice chuckle too.

You need to be careful, Mueller may indict you.

[steveb]

Damn... a true American.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/17/us/florida-student-emma-gonzalez-speech/index.html


that was on the news here, and in the same story they took us to the gun show currently running in florida.

she has some strength of character, more power her.

[PaceAdvantage]

There's a helluva lot of BS being spewed around these days

[jocko699]

There's a helluva lot of BS being spewed around these days

But it must be true because the MSM says it is:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

[thaskalos]

Ralph is correct. The error is not understanding the uniqueness of America versus other countries. In basically, in every other country rights, really privileges, come from the government and the polititcians. America is unique in that rights do not come from the government, the government's right to exist comes from the people and its powers are limited. Americans are not subject to the whims of their government, it is the government that is subjected to the whims of the people.

If you want to live in a country were privileges come from the government America is not the place to be.

Yes, in this country...it's the CITIZENS who tell the politicians what to do. That's why all the politicians are sailing into retirement on "golden parachutes"...while the majority of the citizens are left with hardly any retirement savings at all, after a lifetime of work. :ThmbUp:

[thaskalos]

How lucky? Your entire country was disarmed by the government.
Look into that a little and you will find people like Stalin, Mao and others did the same thing. Then they wholesale slaughtered millions. Our 2nd Amendment isn’t about hunting, or target shooting. It was placed in our constitution so the people could defend themselves from our government.

It’s backed up in the writings of our founders from the Federalist papers to the sons of Liberty.

You now live in a country that has no recourse but to be subservient to your governments every whim.

You have 23 million people, but only 56k military members. You are ripe for invasion. No way you can protect your own shoreline.
Your population would be sitting ducks for any invading force. Do you think that’s the same here? We have 28 million veterans in this country. 99% of them willing to pull a trigger to protect the country (excluding John Kerry) and that’s not counting the rednecks who have never served:lol:

Are you starting to get the point? Your country relies on the kindness of others and the hope that no tyrants rise up. Americans were endowed with the right to shoot their politicians should it come to that and in no way would we ever hope that someone else would protect us from the forces of evil that pervade this world.

We saved the world and in fact your country especially, in World War II by using GUNS and we are equipped to do it again, unlike your country. So you sit over there with your nose in the air thinking you are more civilized, cultured and such. America will stay on watch. We will endure sad episodes such as school shootings because we have ignorant school leaders, left leaning gun grabbers and the like, but we will not let these events change our underlying foundations and belief systems at the whim of a politician or a political party. Unlike you.

If the American citizens are "endowed with such a right"...then, what are they waiting for? Haven't they been screwed by the politicians ENOUGH? When will those "rightful shootings" BEGIN?

[boxcar]

Ralph is correct. The error is not understanding the uniqueness of America versus other countries. In basically, in every other country rights, really privileges, come from the government and the polititcians. America is unique in that rights do not come from the government, the government's right to exist comes from the people and its powers are limited. Americans are not subject to the whims of their government, it is the government that is subjected to the whims of the people.

If you want to live in a country were privileges come from the government America is not the place to be.

Actually, "the government's right to exist comes" down from God in heaven. Human government is a divinely-ordained institution. :coffee:

[steveb]

Actually, "the government's right to exist comes" down from God in heaven. Human government is a divinely-ordained institution. :coffee:

oh fug it.
b u l l s h i t

[Racetrack Playa]

oh fug it.
b u l l s h i t
:lol: tough crowd

[PaceAdvantage]

oh fug it.
b u l l s h i tThis is probably part of the reason the world is so, as you say it, fugged up right now.

[steveb]

This is probably part of the reason the world is so, as you say it, fugged up right now.

b u l l s h i t

[PaceAdvantage]

Just sayin'

You have your opinion...others will differ.

Whether or not God exists, if more people had the "fear of God" in them, half this shit wouldn't be happening.

[steveb]

Just sayin'

You have your opinion...others will differ.

yes and i belive in the tooth fairy too.
i have read enough of boxcar elsewhere, to know he is in serious need of help.
thus i could not help myself.
most 'unchristian' person i have ever read....f u l l s t o p

[Clocker]

Whether or not God exists, if more people had the "fear of God" in them, half this shit wouldn't be happening.

Some people who don't believe in God put the "fear of god" into their children as part of their upbringing.

The result is the same either way.

[thaskalos]

If God exists, then he is the one who is allowing these things to happen. So...the largest part of the blame should go to him.

[woodtoo]

Very jumbled statements, can you splain it.

[thaskalos]

Very jumbled statements, can you splain it.

Who...ME?

[woodtoo]

Who...ME?

No. Just the last couple pages in general.

Actually it was meant for Dan about everything.

[boxcar]

If God exists, then he is the one who is allowing these things to happen. So...the largest part of the blame should go to him.

Two things: First, He could only be morally culpable if he were unjust in allowing "these things" to happen.

Secondly, the fact that He allows "these things" to happen proves that God isn't a liar and is bringing his promise of the curse/penalty for sin to fulfillment, which in turn proves he's righteous.

[Tom]

If God exists, then he is the one who is allowing these things to happen. So...the largest part of the blame should go to him.

You think He sits there guiding our every move?
He doesn't allow or forbid anything - we make those choices.
That's why we are here.

When you're God, death is not a bad thing.

Or, if He doesn't exist, none of it matters anyways.

[Tom]

I agree, Ralph's stand-up routine is a ridiculous hoot! :lol: :ThmbUp:


You do not think that is why the FF put the 2nd amendment into the Constitution?

[thaskalos]

Two things: First, He could only be morally culpable if he were unjust in allowing "these things" to happen.

Secondly, the fact that He allows "these things" to happen proves that God isn't a liar and is bringing his promise of the curse/penalty for sin to fulfillment, which in turn proves he's righteous.

Are you suggesting that God is "justified" in his refusal to stop the killings of these kids...when it's in his power to stop such atrocities? If allowing the slaughter of kids is "just"...then, what do you consider UNJUST?

[Tom]

and i had a nice chuckle too.

And you are some kind of Constitutional expert, I guess?

[thaskalos]

You think He sits there guiding our every move?
He doesn't allow or forbid anything - we make those choices.
That's why we are here.

When you're God, death is not a bad thing.

Or, if He doesn't exist, none of it matters anyways.

Well...the bible does say that "not a hair falls from our heads without God wishing it so...".