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Clocker
02-05-2018, 05:44 PM
The elimination of the individual mandate will likely result in major increases in rates for 2019. Those rates will be made public before the election, and insurance companies will certainly put the blame on the Republicans. Some Republicans in Congress are worried that could hurt their reelection chances, and are working with Democrats to throw some big bucks at the insurance companies to minimize rate increases.

The transfusion is expected to be a concoction of two bills. The first, championed by Sens. Lamar Alexander (R., Tenn.) and Patty Murray (D., Wash.), would appropriate cost-sharing-reduction payments to insurers. The second, sponsored by Sens. Susan Collins (R., Maine) and Bill Nelson (D., Fla.), would give insurers an additional $10 billion (and perhaps more) in federal cash.

Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/article/456067/obamacare-gop-republicans-prepare-back-bailout

elysiantraveller
02-05-2018, 05:54 PM
The elimination of the individual mandate will likely result in major increases in rates for 2019. Those rates will be made public before the election, and insurance companies will certainly put the blame on the Republicans. Some Republicans in Congress are worried that could hurt their reelection chances, and are working with Democrats to throw some big bucks at the insurance companies to minimize rate increases.

No one saw that coming... :rolleyes:

chadk66
02-05-2018, 05:59 PM
guess it's no different than subsidies for those that buy insurance with tax payers money

oughtoh
02-05-2018, 06:08 PM
Our insurance tripled under Obamacare this year and that was with my wife taking a $500 a month decrease in her pay.

lamboguy
02-05-2018, 07:27 PM
when they get done taking this S+P apart, no one will be able to pay for health insurance. everyone like to take the credit for good things and blame the other guy if it doesn't go right. i blame Hillary.

elysiantraveller
02-05-2018, 10:26 PM
guess it's no different than subsidies for those that buy insurance with tax payers money

It's different because subsidies are still flowing. This is MORE money to help offset the massive premium hikes by failing carriers due to the removal of the mandate.

Parkview_Pirate
02-05-2018, 10:49 PM
Conservatives have long disagreed among themselves on important details, which is why Republican leaders abandoned repeal efforts after last Julyís disastrous Senate vote. Members who havenít given up on repeal continue to argue over the billís details. In seeking the optimal politically feasible outcome, they should operate with a sense of urgency and a willingness to compromise.

If they donít coalesce behind something soon, they will find themselves bystanders as their GOP colleagues link arms with Democrats to preserve and enlarge Obamacare, not to repeal and replace it.

Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/article/456067/obamacare-gop-republicans-prepare-back-bailout

It's getting more difficult for any politician to convince voters there's any difference between the parties, because well, there's not. They are both out to pick your pockets.

I'm cynical enough to believe removing the individual mandate is simply a method for .GOV to identify the young and/or healthy pool of potential resistors who want to keep more of their earnings, which gets you on yet another "list".

Fun times ahead.

davew
02-05-2018, 11:07 PM
Our insurance tripled under Obamacare this year and that was with my wife taking a $500 a month decrease in her pay.

Is that in addition to the 2-3x rate increase over the last 4 years? or did your insurance company not realize they were bleeding?

OntheRail
02-06-2018, 12:31 AM
Phuck 'em let them cut their pay and bonuses... they post record profits and whine it's not enough. This constant handout shit has to stop. Corporate Welfare plain and simple.

davew
02-06-2018, 12:49 AM
Phuck 'em let them cut their pay and bonuses... they post record profits and whine it's not enough. This constant handout shit has to stop. Corporate Welfare plain and simple.

... but all healthcare related CEOs have multimillion dollar salaries, they need to pay that much to stay competitive with the industry and if they don't pay it the CEOs will go somewhere else....

elysiantraveller
02-06-2018, 12:58 AM
Actually insurance companies have mandated MLRs by law in the ACA. They must hit a 80-85% loss ratio or they have to issue rebates.

The government is going to have to bailout carriers because of the mandate removal... surprised no one on here said that... wait... ;)

Not to get in the way of the YUGE winning going on or anything.

Clocker
02-06-2018, 01:19 AM
Phuck 'em let them cut their pay and bonuses... they post record profits and whine it's not enough. This constant handout shit has to stop. Corporate Welfare plain and simple.

ObamaCare is and always was a money loser without subsidies and mandates. Insurances company rates are regulated by state commissioners, and they are not making obscene profits on OCare. Many insurers have pulled out of the market because they were losing money, even with subsidies and mandates.

OCare is a welfare program disguised to look like private insurance, and it has to be funded like a welfare program. And the Republicans don't have the guts to come out and say it, so they have to continue to prop it up.

davew
02-06-2018, 03:29 AM
they should have just tied welfare health care to VA hospitals and teaching hospitals rather than screwing up health insurance for the majority of americans

fast4522
02-06-2018, 04:13 AM
Actually insurance companies have mandated MLRs by law in the ACA. They must hit a 80-85% loss ratio or they have to issue rebates.

The government is going to have to bailout carriers because of the mandate removal... surprised no one on here said that... wait... ;)

Not to get in the way of the YUGE winning going on or anything.

In 2018 the ACA will be repealed completely, the influx of jobs as a result of tax reform will be constant. Obama will be a white haired old man and there still will be no single payer system. All those who complain will be but just a fart in the wind as time marches on.

elysiantraveller
02-06-2018, 04:17 AM
In 2018 the ACA will be repealed completely, the influx of jobs as a result of tax reform will be constant. Obama will be a white haired old man and there still will be no single payer system. All those who complain will be but just a fart in the wind as time marches on.

Didn't they have all last year to get that done and failed?

I would quote all the times I said gutting wasn't a victory and it would require taxpayer bailouts but I think you remember that. ;)

#yugewinning

You don't take something broken, break it even worse, then get to claim a success.

fast4522
02-06-2018, 04:34 AM
Consider anytime socialist programs enacted jobs suffer for 25+ years. Markets will fluctuate but jobs will increase inside the United States faster than any place in the world, our economy is and always should be the most resultant in the world.

Parkview_Pirate
02-06-2018, 10:35 AM
In 2018 the ACA will be repealed completely, the influx of jobs as a result of tax reform will be constant.

I'll book that bet. Both sides of the aisle answer to the same masters that wanted the ACA for their own nefarious purposes, with bleeding the middle class as a prime objective.

The influx of jobs from tax reform will be offset by the trillion in new debt issued to pay for the tax cut.

Single payer doesn't fix the problem, it just makes the high prices more consistent. Enforcing anti-monopoly laws and cutting the paper-pushing jobs that don't provide any care is the way to fix costs. But that won't happen, 'cause nobody in .GOV is on board with that approach.

Clocker
02-06-2018, 10:51 AM
In 2018 the ACA will be repealed completely

Not going to happen. Repeal of the individual mandate happened because it was part of a tax bill that could not be stopped by a Senate filibuster.

Repeal of ObamaCare can be stopped by a filibuster. This is an election year, and both parties are heavily pandering to their bases. No Dem is going to risk reelection by voting in favor of any further changes to ObamaCare.

Dems also have the edge on this because Trump ran on a platform of "repeal and replace". Neither Trump nor the GOP Congress has proposed any replacement, and it will not be repealed unless there is a replacement that the Dems can live with.

zico20
02-06-2018, 01:45 PM
Looks like Britain's single payer healthcare is in trouble due to immigration. If Democrats had their way the USA would be next.

http://insider.foxnews.com/2018/02/05/trump-tweet-health-care-nigel-farage-give-warning-after-british-protests-against-public

fast4522
02-06-2018, 06:32 PM
Not going to happen. Repeal of the individual mandate happened because it was part of a tax bill that could not be stopped by a Senate filibuster.

Repeal of ObamaCare can be stopped by a filibuster. This is an election year, and both parties are heavily pandering to their bases. No Dem is going to risk reelection by voting in favor of any further changes to ObamaCare.

Dems also have the edge on this because Trump ran on a platform of "repeal and replace". Neither Trump nor the GOP Congress has proposed any replacement, and it will not be repealed unless there is a replacement that the Dems can live with.

What you do not understand is that the filibuster's days are numbered. It does not matter who is in control, like turf runners when they move the fence the advantage goes to the better horses. Now this is a silly analogy but consider when either side has a majority nothing can be done and on both sides provide cover so the middle class takes it up the you know. Count on when the GOP has all ducks in a row for the filibuster's neck is sliced and they pick off all that has to be done thus having upchuck Schumer balling his eyes out saying no fair no fair.

OntheRail
02-06-2018, 10:30 PM
You don't take something broken, break it even worse, then get to claim a success.

You do if the children are still attached to it... at some point one can only hope they will see it in it's true light and show it to the curb.

elysiantraveller
02-06-2018, 10:42 PM
You do if the children are still attached to it... at some point one can only hope they will see it in it's true light and show it to the curb.

I don't consider being too inept to come up with a solution, screwing over people on premiums, and costing taxpayers more money "teaching the kids a lesson."

Nor a success.

fast4522
02-07-2018, 12:23 AM
Premiums are what they are because of nuclear medicine and what doctor does not want to be rich at retirement. There is NO solution to that, a very real threat to hospitals are the new co-ops opening at a fraction of the cost of your city hospital.

Clocker
02-07-2018, 12:31 AM
What you do not understand is that the filibuster's days are numbered.

That is not relevant. Too many Republicans are opposed to just killing the program without a replacement, and they have no replacement. Trump promised to repeal and replace, and he doesn't have a replacement either. And he isn't going to repeal it until there is something that at least vaguely looks like a replacement.

fast4522
02-07-2018, 01:05 AM
That is not relevant. Too many Republicans are opposed to just killing the program without a replacement, and they have no replacement. Trump promised to repeal and replace, and he doesn't have a replacement either. And he isn't going to repeal it until there is something that at least vaguely looks like a replacement.

I would not bet on that if I were you, when jobs roar better than Y2K it might be all there is.

Parkview_Pirate
05-05-2018, 04:05 AM
The number of uninsured now on the rise. Shocker.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/more-americans-are-going-without-health-insurance/

The reasons for the increase are varied and still a bit speculative, said Sara Collins, Commonwealth vice president for health care coverage and access.

Here's a hint - it's too damn expensive, and the penalties aren't enforced.

http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/blog/2018/apr/health-coverage-erosion

The uninsured rate among working-age people — that is, those who are between 19 and 64 — is at 15.5 percent, up from 12.7 percent in 2016, meaning an estimated 4 million people lost coverage (Tables 1 and 2). Rates were up significantly compared with 2016 among adults with lower incomes — those living in households earning less than 250 percent of poverty (about $30,000 for an individual and $61,000 for a family of four).

The finger-pointing has begun, but it's pointless, pun intended. The one positive aspect that Obamacare supporters could hang their hat on was more people, especially those poor folks, were getting coverage. Now that the squeeze is on, and the economy isn't performing even close to the standard propaganda MSM stream (dig into those employment numbers), folks are having to make choices. And in a country where rule of law is not what it used to be, it's an easy choice to make.

I predict the estimate of 5% of people who drop coverage next year when the individual mandate is dropped is way, way too low. Probably triple it to 15% will be more like it.

And then the debate will begin anew - throw more federal money after bad, or maybe, just maybe, try to cut health care costs via other means....

elysiantraveller
05-05-2018, 09:59 AM
...

The issue is really quite simple to understand.

Sick people can buy insurance which raises premiums.

Healthy people are forced to buy insurance to offset. (Mandate)

Now healthy people don't have to buy insurance so they don't... premiums go up... less people buy insurance because of cost... overall fewer people have insurance... and the death spiral begins.

Until of course States and Regulators step in to bailout insurance companies and the taxpayer suffers.

chadk66
05-05-2018, 10:39 AM
everybody has insurance. some have a policy they can hold in their hands others don't. bottom line is the tax payers insure everybody in some way shape or form.

mrhorseplayer
05-05-2018, 10:01 PM
Since when should a government be allowed to force its citizens to purchase a product they may or may not need?