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View Full Version : Finger Lakes is talkin' turf for 2019


FantasticDan
01-23-2018, 03:43 PM
The planets seem to be aligning to make a turf course a reality at FL.. Tom's dream may finally be coming true! :jump: :D :jump:

https://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/225698/proposed-finger-lakes-turf-course-gaining-ground#disqus_thread

https://www.democratandchronicle.com/story/news/politics/albany/2018/01/23/finger-lakes-racetrack-considers-big-change/1057613001/

Tom
01-23-2018, 04:20 PM
That will be a lot of work - have to move the tote board, or put in a new one. I remember when that one came in a long time ago.
And the entire inside from the edge of the dirt track slopes downward. Should be worthwhile, though.

Cutting back on dates is a great idea. We used to run mid-May to mid-October. It was alway warm when they ran. I remember standing at the rail on a March 1st freezing in the 80s.

Hope it goes well. Thanks Dan:ThmbUp:

onefast99
01-23-2018, 04:45 PM
That will be a lot of work - have to move the tote board, or put in a new one. I remember when that one came in a long time ago.
And the entire inside from the edge of the dirt track slopes downward. Should be worthwhile, though.

Cutting back on dates is a great idea. We used to run mid-May to mid-October. It was alway warm when they ran. I remember standing at the rail on a March 1st freezing in the 80s.

Hope it goes well. Thanks Dan:ThmbUp:There will be a 60 foot run up and the timing will be by hand...just sayin...:popcorn:

Tom
01-23-2018, 05:39 PM
60 foot runup!?
Half the field would be EASED! :pound:
We lose a couple every day in the post parade.

We hand time all the races here - with calendars! :lol:

Our motto is it's not how fast you run, its how long you can. :cool:

RunForTheRoses
01-23-2018, 05:46 PM
It seems like a good idea as many New York breds run well on turf.

Denny
01-23-2018, 06:43 PM
What's the size of the Finger Lakes oval?

FantasticDan
01-23-2018, 06:50 PM
What's the size of the Finger Lakes oval?
:1: mile

Redbullsnation
01-24-2018, 12:31 AM
Sounds like a good idea. Hopefully, it'll get some more horses on board

NJ Stinks
01-24-2018, 03:01 AM
That is a terrific move for Finger Lakes! :ThmbUp::ThmbUp:

MonmouthParkJoe
01-24-2018, 08:34 AM
Big step in the right direction. Bodes well for NY.

Tom
01-24-2018, 10:37 AM
:1: mile

It only seems like 2 for some horses!:eek:

jeebus1083
01-24-2018, 01:00 PM
If they install a turf course, would they also be best served expanding the dirt oval to 1 1/8m?

cj
01-24-2018, 03:12 PM
If they install a turf course, would they also be best served expanding the dirt oval to 1 1/8m?

Not really. That would (should) limit the route races to 9f and those horses (for the most part) aren't going to want any parts of that distance.

classhandicapper
01-24-2018, 04:43 PM
I've come to like Finger Lakes. If you have a statebred horse at AQU/BEL/SAR and he can't cut it there, you still have options in some of the allowance races there and can do quite well if you get through all the conditions.

Tom
01-24-2018, 04:59 PM
Not really. That would (should) limit the route races to 9f and those horses (for the most part) aren't going to want any parts of that distance.

We have precious few 8.5 furlong races. 9 furlongs is way to long for this track.

I can see a lot of turf sprints.....and endless parade of them!

Hambletonian
01-24-2018, 05:33 PM
and in other breaking news, the Brockton Fair will be installing a 3 furlong turf course inside it's main oval, in order to attract fuller fields and offer better quality racing :)

We can never forget on the high quality $1500 claimers that used to grace the turf at Waterford Park! If there was no turf course, the track would have disappeared! But with a turf course, they were able to attract full fields, better horses, and become one of the finest tracks in the nation LOL.

Finger Lakes is what it is. If not for racino subsidies they would be racing for 4k a race. And racing them on turf, dirt, down pillows or roast beef sandwiches, its the same horses, really slow NY breds.

Yes, there may be a few extremely cheap turf specialists that would be able to race there that currently ship out, but there is no way the track would be spending their own money to do this.

Consider Massachusetts. There would be no interest in building a racetrack, even with the funds available for purses, if the proposing entity had to build the track with it's own money. All plans seem to revolve on one plan or another to use OPM to get the track built. Then with the purse money available, it doesn't even matter if anyone bets on the product.

I have absolutely nothing against Finger Lakes, and I know the breeding industry in NY will suffer greatly if it disappeared, mainly because it seems that 95% of NY breds cannot compete unless running against their homebred brethren.

But to pretend this will lead to a renaissance in upstate NY racing, well, probably not.

Quesmark
01-24-2018, 05:46 PM
When trainers ship horses to Saratoga from outside NY they can bring some horses along,which while they wouldn't be competetive at the Spa,might continue on to FL if there were a condition on turf that suited their abilities.

RunForTheRoses
01-24-2018, 07:12 PM
When trainers ship horses to Saratoga from outside NY they can bring some horses along,which while they wouldn't be competetive at the Spa,might continue on to FL if there were a condition on turf that suited their abilities.

There's a classic Jacinto Vasquez quote, this is a butchered version, he got off a beaten horse at Saratoga and the trainers asks what he thought, and Jacinto says he needs to run further, "what 7 furlongs?, no he needs to run further away at Finger Lakes.

deathandgravity
01-24-2018, 07:16 PM
Now if EMD will follow follow suit.. I might actually go back. 5 1/2 F 5 horse fields are not my cup of tea

Thomas Roulston
01-24-2018, 09:26 PM
Who has been advocating this for years? :)

Tom
01-24-2018, 11:08 PM
When trainers ship horses to Saratoga from outside NY they can bring some horses along,which while they wouldn't be competetive at the Spa,might continue on to FL if there were a condition on turf that suited their abilities.

We have a class that anyone would be able to race in -

"For horses....."

Thomas Roulston
01-25-2018, 11:32 AM
Not really. That would (should) limit the route races to 9f and those horses (for the most part) aren't going to want any parts of that distance.


Not if a Wilson Mile chute was added - and if it was the turns that were expanded, from the current 1/4 of a mile to 5/16 of a mile (at Saratoga the turns are only 9/32 of a mile long - which is probably why the Wilson Mile chute did not survive). This would give Finger Lakes the same configuration as Ellis Park - plus a Hollywood-style diagonal chute could branch out from the beginning of the backstretch on the turf course, creating a 6-furlong distance on turf.

ultracapper
01-25-2018, 04:07 PM
Now if EMD will follow follow suit.. I might actually go back. 5 1/2 F 5 horse fields are not my cup of tea

EMD is actually designed for an inner turf track. It's all laid out, with the tote board positioned properly, with an infield shoot for a mile on the turf. They even have the infield swamps positioned to keep the turf track relatively dry. I've wondered why they haven't developed it. Just standing in the 3rd floor grandstands you can easily and clearly see the intentions.

Thomas Roulston
01-26-2018, 11:46 AM
Of course there is also the possibility of Green Mountain Race Track making a comeback - which was actually in the pipeline a while back, but then-Governor Howard "The Primal Screamer" Dean put the kibosh on that because "cruel" greyhound racing would be conducted for part of the year, along with both thoroughbreds and trotters. And the configuration of the original track was 6 1/2 furlongs (!) - the circumference of the inner turf course of my proposed track; yes, the no-doubt decaying grandstand and clubhouse (which is located above the grandstand, not beyond the finish line as is the case with most clubhouses), would have to be torn down - but hey, in for a penny, in for a pound, and a local family from nearby North Adams, MA by the name of Tietjen or something like that, in fact purchased the property for a penny (he actually bought it for $1 if I'm not mistaken).

deathandgravity
01-27-2018, 06:11 PM
EMD is actually designed for an inner turf track. It's all laid out, with the tote board positioned properly, with an infield shoot for a mile on the turf. They even have the infield swamps positioned to keep the turf track relatively dry. I've wondered why they haven't developed it. Just standing in the 3rd floor grandstands you can easily and clearly see the intentions.

I was out @ EMD about 10 years ago for a private function in one of their Suites & asked one of the EMD Reps why they never finished the turf course. His answer was: “there are not enough turf horses in the Pac NW”. Laughed & responded… “There are no turf horses because there is no turf racing, finish the turf course & they will probably show up.” No reply.
Shame… they need to do something to improve the product. Been to Del Mar & Saratoga more in the past 10 years then I have to Emerald Downs.

ultracapper
01-28-2018, 02:52 AM
I was out @ EMD about 10 years ago for a private function in one of their Suites & asked one of the EMD Reps why they never finished the turf course. His answer was: “there are not enough turf horses in the Pac NW”. Laughed & responded… “There are no turf horses because there is no turf racing, finish the turf course & they will probably show up.” No reply.
Shame… they need to do something to improve the product. Been to Del Mar & Saratoga more in the past 10 years then I have to Emerald Downs.

In this case, they couldn't possibly think that a population of turf horses will appear, and then they can prepare a turf course. Nobody could be that stupid, could they?

cj
01-28-2018, 12:53 PM
I've always heard the way the track sits and the amount of rain the track gets would make turf racing problematic at Emerald Downs.

kingfin66
01-28-2018, 12:57 PM
I think the configuration would work. The track was laid out to include a turf course and chute. The rainfall could potentially be a problem, although we get most of it during the winter. The infield of the track is used to collect storm water drainage. It creates a huge pool that would definitely encroach on a turf course. The track would have to find a way to redirect that water to another area. The bottom line with Emerald Downs is that if something costs for than $1.58 to do, they won't do it unless it involves a casino. I would not expect turf racing there any time soon.