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VigorsTheGrey
12-12-2017, 05:00 AM
Caymus Kat, a 5 yr mare will run in Portland Meadows 1st race tomorrow, #3, a 1 mile affair. Now 2 races back she ran 870 yards and earned a 72 number shown where a Beyer number is usually placed. It is a different font and unbolded. These numbers appear for QH race distances in QH races...
What is the numerical equivalent of this number to a Beyer number....and how is it formulated since it appears to be different from the mare's speed rating of 77.

cj
12-12-2017, 09:53 AM
Caymus Kat, a 5 yr mare will run in Portland Meadows 1st race tomorrow, #3, a 1 mile affair. Now 2 races back she ran 870 yards and earned a 72 number shown where a Beyer number is usually placed. It is a different font and unbolded. These numbers appear for QH race distances in QH races...
What is the numerical equivalent of this number to a Beyer number....and how is it formulated since it appears to be different from the mare's speed rating of 77.

I'm going to take an educated guess and say this is the Speed Index. It has nothing to do with Beyer numbers and I highly doubt they correspond in any way.

https://www.aqha.com/racing/pages/racing-and-wagering/q-racing-aces-and-handicapping-information/speed-indexes-vs-beyer-figures/

VigorsTheGrey
12-12-2017, 02:32 PM
I'm going to take an educated guess and say this is the Speed Index. It has nothing to do with Beyer numbers and I highly doubt they correspond in any way.

https://www.aqha.com/racing/pages/racing-and-wagering/q-racing-aces-and-handicapping-information/speed-indexes-vs-beyer-figures/

Thanks CJ...an interesting article....a lot of what is discussed I thought applied to the Speed Rating/ Variant system as well...so I'm a little confused about why they use both for QH races...good read...

thaskalos
12-12-2017, 02:54 PM
https://www.aqha.com/racing/pages/racing-and-wagering/q-racing-aces-and-handicapping-information/speed-indexes-vs-beyer-figures/

The thoroughbred game, which attracts many billions of wagered dollars annually, employs an archaic timing system whereby the final running times of non-winning horses are crudely "approximated"...whereas the quarter-horse game, whose mutuel handle is a tiny fraction of its thoroughbred counterpart, provides the precise final times of every single horse in the race. How does that make any sense at all?

Clocker
12-13-2017, 01:48 PM
The thoroughbred game, which attracts many billions of wagered dollars annually, employs an archaic timing system whereby the final running times of non-winning horses are crudely "approximated"...whereas the quarter-horse game, whose mutuel handle is a tiny fraction of its thoroughbred counterpart, provides the precise final times of every single horse in the race. How does that make any sense at all?

Those times are not as precise as they appear. They also are calculated by adjusting the leader's time by lengths behind. They just use a finer gradation in adjusting.

When Thoroughbred handicappers look at past performances, they see a horse's fractional and final times listed in fifths of a second. Quarter Horse races are timed in hundredths of a second. The educated Thoroughbred handicapper knows that one length corresponds to one-fifth of a second. Thus, if a horse wins a 1-1/16 mile race by one length in 1:42-4/5, then the handicapper knows that the runner-up was timed in 1:43. And, if a horse leads by two lengths after an opening quarter-mile is clocked in :21-4/5, the rival running in second gets a :22-1/5 mark.

But how does the Thoroughbred handicapper compute a horse's time in Quarter Horse racing? The American Quarter Horse Association, the governing body of Quarter Horse racing, has devised the following formula for time--one length is equal to .16 seconds, three-quarters of a length is equal to .12, a half-length equals .08, a neck is equal to .04, a head is equal to .02 and a nose is .01.

So, if a horse is second by three-quarters of a length behind a winner's final 350-yard clocking of :18.02, the runner-up gets a final time of :18.14. In a Quarter Horse's past performances, both the winning and individual times are listed.
http://www.portlandmeadows.com/horse-racing/handicapping/handicapping-quarter-horse

thaskalos
12-13-2017, 07:21 PM
Those times are not as precise as they appear. They also are calculated by adjusting the leader's time by lengths behind. They just use a finer gradation in adjusting.

http://www.portlandmeadows.com/horse-racing/handicapping/handicapping-quarter-horse

The link that Cj provided flatly contradicts your argument.

Tom
12-14-2017, 11:12 AM
And....you were trying to argue a technical point through all this? ;)

VigorsTheGrey
12-14-2017, 02:15 PM
In the original post, I was just trying to figure out why the QH pps use BOTH a speed rating (without a variant, unlike in TBreds) and a Speed Index number also....the definitions given for Speed Index sound very much like those given for Speed Rating, but the numbers are always different from one another...so what is the rational here....? Are you supposed to use them separately, or together...? What does one tell you that the other does not...?