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dilanesp
12-01-2017, 11:18 PM
http://www.santaanita.com/press-releases/santa-anita-park-announces-new-innovative-race-conditions-in-an-effort-to-stimulate-entries-boost-pari-mutuel-handle/#.WiHx67pFxPY

BrentT
12-02-2017, 01:25 AM
Thats great news. They need to do something to help the smaller barns, or racing will be gone

lamboguy
12-02-2017, 06:25 AM
its the smartest move i have seen racing make ever. its a way to re-organize the game without shutting down completely.

GMB@BP
12-02-2017, 12:24 PM
I am unsure how this will work out, I can see some other issues.

But trying something new is probably better than doing nothing.

What about homebreds? most of them are not high class and have the same issues.

elhelmete
12-02-2017, 01:13 PM
I like this and it helps explain, I think, something I thought I've been seeing since Ritvo came west: trainers who I rarely see filling the entry box. He must have promised the little guys some help if they help first.

cj
12-02-2017, 01:39 PM
Restricting races generally results in smaller field sizes, not bigger. We'll see I guess.

biggestal99
12-02-2017, 03:04 PM
Restricting races generally results in smaller field sizes, not bigger. We'll see I guess.

Maiden auctions do well in the uk. Drawing large fields.

Wonder if it will work with less of a horse population to draw from.

Allan

GMB@BP
12-02-2017, 03:07 PM
Restricting races generally results in smaller field sizes, not bigger. We'll see I guess.

I agree, and the regular mdn races are going to have 4-5 entries.

dilanesp
12-02-2017, 03:41 PM
I agree, and the regular mdn races are going to have 4-5 entries.

So they will be just like our stakes races then. 5 entries, all trained by Baffert.

Prioress Ply
12-02-2017, 08:00 PM
Big FU to Baffert. Let's see if they continue to write special Allowance and overnight stakes races for him too. Maybe not. Love it.

JustRalph
12-02-2017, 08:21 PM
Restricting races generally results in smaller field sizes, not bigger. We'll see I guess.

First thing I thought of....

Itís at least 3 years too late

Fager Fan
12-03-2017, 10:40 AM
First thing I thought of....

Itís at least 3 years too late

Ditto, but you'd also think the racing secretary has his ear to the ground well enough to know the population, the complaints, and what the probable results would be here. That said, it seems like welfare for lower level horses that doesn't strike me right, but I'm also for new conditions that allows for more protections than claiming races offer. If some small outfit adores their horse and doesn't want to lose it, why can't there be conditions for low level horses that don't allow for claiming? It's not hard to restrict based on speed figures and similar.

linrom1
12-03-2017, 01:16 PM
Ditto, but you'd also think the racing secretary has his ear to the ground well enough to know the population, the complaints, and what the probable results would be here. That said, it seems like welfare for lower level horses that doesn't strike me right, but I'm also for new conditions that allows for more protections than claiming races offer. If some small outfit adores their horse and doesn't want to lose it, why can't there be conditions for low level horses that don't allow for claiming? It's not hard to restrict based on speed figures and similar.

And Rick Hammerle though this up? The racing secretary who screwed up Santa Anita stakes schedules beyond redemption and can't card a race card.

This is nothing more than a way to screw the bettor even more to the advantage of insiders. Some homebreds can easily fetch millions of dollars if their owners were willing to part with their favorite pets(but we don't know this), and now they will run exclusively against completely outclassed stock?

theiman
12-03-2017, 01:17 PM
For DM's last week of racing these were the trainers who had horses in the $20K claimers or less fields.

11/24 $20K Claimer
D'Amato
Truman
Hess Jr
Blacker
Sadler
Miller
Lopez, Juan
Desormeaux
Only Lopez would qualify.

Mdn $20K Claimer
Hollendorfer
Miller
Sayler
Hess Jr
Freeman
Truman
Garcia, Antonio
Harrington, Patricia
McCarthy
Herrick
Cassidy

Sayler, Harrington and Herrick would qualify

11/25/17
$12,500 Claimer
Kornier
Gonzalez
Spawr
Hess Jr
Metz
Lobo
Truman
Stute, G

Only Lobo would qualify

$16K Claimer
Spawr
Hess Jr
Blacker
Sierra, J.
Souza F
Hollendorfer
Bonde
Glatt

Only Souza would qualify

11/26/17
$20K Claimer
Miller
Puype
Hess Jr
Knapp
Yakteen
D'Amato
Hess Jr
Glatt

None would qualify

Looks to me like there wont be many to fill these conditions(although this is a small sample and I am sure if you did it for some of the Los Al entries the #'s might go up some.)
The idea to help the small guy is fine. The question is do you have the inventory to fill the fields, or are you looking to attract small stables from GG or Turf Paradise

classhandicapper
12-03-2017, 01:22 PM
The MSW restriction is interesting. The second tier of MSW horses doesn't have much of a shot against the very best bred horses from the best barns. So you sort of have to get beat up for awhile until they all graduate or drop into maiden claiming before you really know what you have. This will split the division into 2 classes. I'm not sure how that helps the field sizes unless a lot of those second tier horses were just sitting in the barn, but it's giving some of the smaller owners and trainers a better chance to win without dropping into the claiming ranks.

mountainman
12-03-2017, 05:47 PM
Horsemen friendly, for sure...but, player friendly?? that's (very) debatable.

I've seen lots of crutches handed out to "the little guy," and it rarely helps the product. Perhaps years down the road-if it really DOES stimulate smaller breeding.

elhelmete
12-03-2017, 07:12 PM
So you sort of have to get beat up for awhile until they all graduate or drop into maiden claiming before you really know what you have. This will split the division into 2 classes. I'm not sure how that helps the field sizes unless a lot of those second tier horses were just sitting in the barn, but it's giving some of the smaller owners and trainers a better chance to win without dropping into the claiming ranks.

According to a handful of people I know well, who are heavily invested in Cali racing, this is exactly the issue and it's been known for years. And not just at the MSW level either. They've always refuted the idea that it's solely a population size issue.

lamboguy
12-04-2017, 08:28 AM
my guess is the idea behind is that you can either get 1 person or a group of 3 or 4 put up money and buy a yearling for about $50,000 or $75,000 and have a chance to win races there. the way it is today, you can't beat Baffert, Hollandorfer, Mandella, or Miller and a few others out there, its like taking your money and pouring down the sewer. so this move should bring new owners and maybe trainer's to the game which will also equate to more betting at the window's, more parking and more attendance.

i have to give Timmy plenty of credit for coming up with the plan and trying it out. i say you will see a positive from it and other tracks will copy the plan.

GMB@BP
12-04-2017, 09:40 AM
my guess is the idea behind is that you can either get 1 person or a group of 3 or 4 put up money and buy a yearling for about $50,000 or $75,000 and have a chance to win races there. the way it is today, you can't beat Baffert, Hollandorfer, Mandella, or Miller and a few others out there, its like taking your money and pouring down the sewer. so this move should bring new owners and maybe trainer's to the game which will also equate to more betting at the window's, more parking and more attendance.

i have to give Timmy plenty of credit for coming up with the plan and trying it out. i say you will see a positive from it and other tracks will copy the plan.

I wonder if they get regular mdn races to fill, Baffert and others may have to ship in those races.

Prioress Ply
12-05-2017, 10:10 PM
my guess is the idea behind is that you can either get 1 person or a group of 3 or 4 put up money and buy a yearling for about $50,000 or $75,000 and have a chance to win races there. the way it is today, you can't beat Baffert, Hollandorfer, Mandella, or Miller and a few others out there, its like taking your money and pouring down the sewer. so this move should bring new owners and maybe trainer's to the game which will also equate to more betting at the window's, more parking and more attendance.

i have to give Timmy plenty of credit for coming up with the plan and trying it out. i say you will see a positive from it and other tracks will copy the plan.

Exactly. Maiden races won with Beyers in the 60s or 70s are nothing but giveaways to big breeders and trainers given the horses by the fatcats who pay the breeders exorbitant prices hoping to catch a Derby prospect, In what other sport is SLOWER or LESS EFFECTIVE talent rewarded with bigger money (than, say, to a $20,000 claimer)?

The entire system needs to be reconfigured. Breed horses to last, pay the purses to those that do last and run fastest. This is a good first step.