Michael Vick

[sq764]

Am I the only one absolutely sick of hearing how great Michael Vick WILL BE??

He may be the most overrated athlete I have seen in years. He hasn't accomplished anything! He's fast, has a decent arm and is injury prone..

Furthermore, as he gets older, he's not going to be able to run as much and will have to become a pocket passer.. That will be interesting to watch.

Even though I love the Eagles and hate the Packers, I have to say that until Brett Favre retires, he is still the magician right now... Mcnabb has the tools, but hasn't gotten over the hump yet... Vick is just a talented underachiever..

[cj]

IMO, Top 5 QBs in football:

1) Tom Brady
2) Brett Favre
3) Peyton Manning
4) Daunte Culpepper
5) Steve McNair

[JustRalph]

Originally posted by sq764
Am I the only one absolutely sick of hearing how great Michael Vick WILL BE??

He may be the most overrated athlete I have seen in years. He hasn't accomplished anything! He's fast, has a decent arm and is injury prone..

Furthermore, as he gets older, he's not going to be able to run as much and will have to become a pocket passer.. That will be interesting to watch.

Even though I love the Eagles and hate the Packers, I have to say that until Brett Favre retires, he is still the magician right now... Mcnabb has the tools, but hasn't gotten over the hump yet... Vick is just a talented underachiever..

Ever heard of Ken Griffey Jr.? reminds me of him. Although Griffey did get to 500 homers.........the rest of his so called greatness went out the window 5 years ago...............he tears a hamstring every ten minutes.................and don't get me started about his Yacht!

[sq764]

I'd have to say:

1) Favre
2) Brady
3) Manning
4) Mcnabb
5) Trent Green

[Valuist]

My top 5 for Fantasy Leagues, which isn't to be confused w/how I'd rank them in real life:

1. Manning
2. Culpepper
3. McNair
4. Vick
5. Green

In real life, I'd take Manning #1, McNabb # 2 McNair # 3 Favre # 4 and Vick #5. Just look at how bad Atlanta got when Vick was out. I don't put Brady in my top 5 because New England's defense and coaching are the key for them. He's not bad but he's not the real reason they won 2 of the L3 Super Bowls.

[delayjf]

It's easy to admire Vicks athletic abilily, but to play QB in the NFL you have to execute from the pocket. It's great to be mobile, but if you try to live by your feet, you will die by your feet. The best QBs win with their mind, not their feet or even necessarilly their arm strength (Joe Montana).

[Valuist]

His accurary is a bigger question than his decision making. In his only full season, 2002, he only threw 8 interceptions all season. That's pretty impressive for a guy in his first full season of starting. I know Manning threw a ton of picks in his first year, and I believe Favre (and most others) did also. Also a lifetime 7.3 yards per carry. I guarantee you he terrifies defensive coordinators. It would be interesting to see how good he'd be with a good set of wide receivers.

[sq764]

His completion percentage is 52%! That is awful!

[sq764]

28th out of 31 starting QB's in completion percentage..ouch

http://www.nfl.com/stats/playersort/NFL/QB-PASSING/2002/regular?&_1:col_1=7

[Valuist]

I think most of the hype is based on what they expect him to become. You don't see QBs with 2 to 1 TD/Int ratios in their first season as a starter. The expectation is that he'll eventually put up Manning type passing numbers in conjunction with the 4.3 speed. Nobody playing that position has ever had that kind of speed. As for the completion % #s, that can be a deceptive stat. Teams that use the West Coast offense will always put up high completion percentages because they're only throwing the ball 5 yards. I do think Vick will have to work on his touch a bit; probably uses too much of that cannon on the short passes.

[sq764]

He'll be in a West Coast offense this year... So it will be interesting..

[cj]

Originally posted by Valuist
...In real life, I'd take Manning #1, McNabb # 2 McNair # 3 Favre # 4 and Vick #5. Just look at how bad Atlanta got when Vick was out. I don't put Brady in my top 5 because New England's defense and coaching are the key for them. He's not bad but he's not the real reason they won 2 of the L3 Super Bowls.

Brady wins because of defense? Then how is McNabb so high? Doesn't he do the same while putting up lower numbers than Brady, and not winning as much? Brady comes through when the pressure is on, ala Elway and Montana.

[sq764]

CJ, please don't compare Brady to Montana and Elway.. That's ridiculous..

[cj]

I was not saying he is as good a QB as those two guys, its too early to tell.

As for that one trait, he is already there though. The guy is a gamer with ice water in his veins. Who else should I compare him with if not the greatest?

Keep in mind, this guys wins with nobody at running back. For years, the excuse for Marino not winning was the lack of a running game. Elway didn't win the Super Bowl until Terrell Davis came along. This guy has done with a mediocre group that rotates in and out.

The thing I love about Brady is he can win a game 39-38 if that's what it takes. At the same time, he can struggle all day, and still lead a drive at the end of the game to win 10-7.

To not compare them, that would be ridiculous.

[sq764]

He can struggle all day and score win 10-7 because his defense keeps him there..

Most teams would have lost 27-10, rather than win 10-7..

He was around 14th out of 31 QB's in QB Rating last year..

I agree with you that he does what needs to be done to win. But if you asked me who I would want to have on the field down by 6 points with a minute to go, Brady would be about my 20th choice..

[cj]

Originally posted by sq764
But if you asked me who I would want to have on the field down by 6 points with a minute to go, Brady would be about my 20th choice..

Yeah, that's why he has won two super bowls in four years, and the great McNabb, with the vaunted Eagles D, has won NADA, ZIP, ZILCH. He's a winner, Brady that is.

[sq764]

Not quite sure what you obsession with Donovan McNabb is, not even sure where he came into the conversation or why you commented on his non-greatness to 2 different posts, unprovoked.. But I guess we all have our hangups..

Back to my actual comment - I would rather have Elway, Montana, Favre, and several others on the field in that situation..

[cj]

The three you name are all time greats, you'll get no argument from me. But twenty? No way in your lifetime you've seen 20 better at the end of the game.

[sq764]

In my lifetime, just off the top of my head, I would rather have:

Montana
Elway
Marino
Young
Bradshaw
Aikmen
Manning


Those are the ones I have seen..

[sq764]

I think as far as younger QB's in the league now (around 3-5 years of experience), my thoughts:

Manning - Probably one of the purest passers around in a long time. Great composure.. Has a fantastic offensive line and probably the best receiver in the NFL, which helps.

Brady - Effective, a winner, gets the job done. Not flashy, but consistent. Good, not great

Pennington - Personally, I think he could be a great one. Plays on a bad team but has shown massive talent. Incredibly composed and accurate for his age and experience..

McNabb - Great athletic ability, strong arm, big, strong and fast. Will need to win a SB to be taken seriously.. He needs to learn to stay in the pocket longer, has happy feet..

Mcnair - Great athletic ability, strong arm.. Not much compsure, very inaccurate passer, runs too much.. Getting hurt might actually help him in the long run, might teach him to learn to be a better pocket passer. Until then, he's got a lot to learn.

[cj]

Peyton Manning, no way, try winning a meaningful game first. Young, iffy at best. Aikman played for the team of the decade with one of the greatest backs ever. Far cry from 20.

[sq764]

The last comment was meant to be Vick, not McNair... was thinking about something else..

[bettheoverlay]

I agree with CJ that Brady is a near great one no matter what the QB rating says. He's made a lot of big plays when it counted over the last 3 years, and never looks lost when behind, like Manning often does.

I disagree about McNabb though. That vaunted Eagle D stunk at the end of the season the last 2 years. It will be interesting to see how he does with TO, at least before Reid throws him out of the clubhouse.

[sq764]

You got that right about McNabb.. Until this year, he had a horrible receiving crew.. He has a stud receiver now, a solid defense and a decent running game.. No excuses this year.

[Valuist]

So far, Vick hasn't gotten back to his 2002 form.

But where are all the Culpepper-haters now? This guy is having an unreal season. His numbers are absolutely sick:

72.7% completion percentage
335 passing yards a game
13 TDs 1 INT
126.0 QB rating

[sq764]

Well, not to take away anything, but Houston, Chicago and Dallas have 3 of the worst defenses in the entire NFL..

[cj]

Of course, the fact they are among the worse defenses is at least partially caused by the numbers Culpepper put up against them, kind of a chicken/egg situation.

[sq764]

if they had played 1 week or even 2, the lame point might be acceptable.. But they are into week 5 now..

try again

[Valuist]

I notice you forgot to mention Philly's defense. BTW, Dallas was number 1 in pass defense (yardage against) last season and 3rd in QB efficiency against. They've slipped a bit this year (week 1 didn't help) but they still allow less pass yards per game than your beloved Eagles.

[cj]

37/47 343 1 TD 1 INT

Those were his numbers against Philly, despite heavy pressure all night long. He also has only lost one fumble this year. This guy is turning into a really good QB, no doubt. Imagine if he had a steady running back!

[sq764]

Valuist, they're allowing 25 ypg passing less than the Eagles and you seriously bring that up?

The've given up 36 more points than the Eagles and the Eagles are 4-0..

Good stat though..

[sq764]

Cj, the same game Mcnabb was 19/28 for 245 yards, 2 TDs, 0 INTs.

I'll take the clean, effective game over the useless passing yards any day..

[sq764]

Wow, no coments on Culpepper's great performance against a great defense last night?

[cj]

425 yards, 5 TDs, two picks. The guy is having an incredible year. When the year started, I might have picked Pennington over Culpepper if I was a GM starting a team. That would have been foolish...

On another note, I think the talent Vick showed in the 4th Quarter yesterday is what makes people think this guy can be a great one. I have no idea why the coach seems to limit him. Forget the running for a minute, did anyone notice the ease with which he threw that 50 yard bullet to Price. This guy's arm is absolutely incredible.

[Valuist]

Sq-

We've heard every rationalization for your dislike of Culpepper. Simply put, he is THE best player in the NFL. That effortless bomb that was right on the money...the way he dishes out punishment when he runs.....how about that tackle he made where he ran down the DB? Looked like Urlacher or Ray Lewis out there. Reminds me of Walter Payton in his multi talents.

We've heard the easy schedule argument, yet he put up huge #s against your Eagles; we heard the Randy Moss argument, yet he had no problems in the second half when Moss was in street clothes.

And he's not throwing against 8 or 9 man fronts. The reason Minny can run so well is the defenses are terrified of their passing game. This team's offense if freakishly good. Imagine what it will be like when Michael Bennett and Onterrio Smith are back? Too bad they don't have a defense to go with it.

[Valuist]

On the subject of young QBs, the MAC is really turning out some good QBs: Pennington and now Roethlesberger and Leftwich. Leftwich made some bad decisions last year but has picked it up recently. He broke all of Pennington's records at Marshall and he had no Randy Moss to throw to. Compare that to all the bustouts from the PAC 10 in recent years: Ryan Leaf, Akili Smith, Cade McNoun.....Carson Palmer??

[sq764]

Valuist, best player in the NFL?? stay off the crakpipe.. My God, I think you have read too many LJB/Sec posts, they are making you dillusional..

[sq764]

Valuist, I never said the Eagles had a great defense, no one did.. Watch that game again and see how he played.. Stats don't show how he was a confused man.

Who needs Moss when you are facing the lowest rated defense in the entire NFL.. One that gives up over 400 yards per game?

When he ever wins anything, call me.. Until then, he's certainly a fantasy football team's dream.. But if I am starting a team, give me Brady, Mcnabb, Pennington..

And I'll tell you what, Rothersberger (sp??) may be something special.. wow..

[cj]

Have you actually watched the Jets the last few weeks? There is no comparison right now between Pennington and Culpepper.

[sq764]

A few things that I know won't mean a thing to stats-lovers:

4 wins against combined 6-10 teams..

1 game against >.500 record team = loss

The 'HUGE' #'s he put up against the Eagles included 1 touchdown, an INT and 3 field goals..

Tell me, Valuist the expert, which game would you rather have from a QB: (A or B)?


CP/AT YDS TD INT
A 37/47 343 1 1

B 19/28 245 2 0

[sq764]

Pennington is a winner, Culpepper is not.. Give me the winner.

Culpepper has much better stats than Brady. You did say Brady was the best QB in the NFL.. How is that?

[cj]

Before getting too carried away about one game, do you think the outcome might have been a little different if the game were played in Minnesota? Culpepper led his team to the NFC Championship as a rookie, a fact you keep overlooking.

Take a look at the Jets schedule so far. Not exactly the 72 Dolphins and 79 Steelers they have been playing, eh? They haven't faced a playoff team yet, but yet you keep telling us how good Pennington is. I think he is a decent QB, but to say you'd take him over Culpepper is a major reach.

[Valuist]

Last time I checked, there are 11 players on a field at the same time. There is no one player who can make a team win a Super Bowl. Is the QB important? Yeah, but so is a good defense. And a running game...and an offensive and defensive line. McNabb is good, IMO, slightly below Daunte but the other two aren't even close. Are you going to tell me Dan Marino and Dan Fouts were average QBs because they didn't win a Super Bowl. Its the TEAM, not the QBs.

My top 5 players in the NFL: 1) Culpepper 2) Ray Lewis 3) Randy Moss 4) Tomlinson 5) tough call; Priest Holmes or McNabb.

BTW, what has Pennington ever won? They were all out to beat a horrible SF team at home. Their success this year has been due largely to the running of Curtis Martin.

[cj]

What exactly has Pennington won?

What do you want Culpepper to do, play middle linebacker too? I still think Brady is the best, but Culpepper and Manning are right there with him. I've been stuck watching the last two Jets boring ass games, and there is no way Pennington played a major role in those victories. Ray Lucas could have won those games.

[sq764]

I won't tell you Fouts or Marino were average cause they didn't win a SB, but CJ will (and has).. I think a hall of famer is a hall of famer, period..

Valuist, does the best receiver in football even make your top 5? Guess not.. Oh well, opinions are like....

[cj]

Valuist,

I have to disagree on Moss. I can think of 10 guys I'd put ahead of him, easily. Priest Holmes below him? Come on man, that's a reach. He's not even the best Wide Receiver. I'll take TO or Marvin Harrison, they won't quit when things don't go there way. I think TO is a total ass, but the guy will do anything to win a football game, where as Moss will lay down like a dog.

[sq764]

CJ, you're stuck on these stats.. They don't mean shit.. They've played garbage teams so far and the one good team they played, they scored 1 freaking touchdown and he was totally confused..

Curious, why is Brady better than Culpepper in your opinion?

[cj]

I never said Marino or Fouts were average, that's comical. I said they weren't in the top 5 or 10 or whatever, not average. Get real SQ!

Isn't this a lot funner than wasting time talking politics?

[Valuist]

The best receiver IS in the top 5: Moss. And don't go telling me Owens is. He isn't. I'll take Marvin Harrison over him anyday. Maybe even Hines Ward. Ward has just as good hands, is a better blocker, and doesn't run his mouth the way TO does.

Moss is simply The Superfreak. Green Bay altered an entire draft; taking CBs w/their first three picks a few years back because they were so terrified of him. As good as Harrison or Owens are, they won't cause opponents to do that.

I like The Priest but he may be a little product of Vermeil's system. Tomlinson has little help around him; amazing what he's accomplished.

I'd definitely take arguing over football over politics!

[cj]

Originally posted by sq764
CJ, you're stuck on these stats.. They don't mean shit.. They've played garbage teams so far and the one good team they played, they scored 1 freaking touchdown and he was totally confused..

Curious, why is Brady better than Culpepper in your opinion?

I've told you why I think Culpepper is better than Pennington. You have yet to counter the things I've said about him. Jets have played horrible teams, they could have won those last two games with Ray Lucas at QB, Pennington did nothing of note in either. I know, I watched. I couldn't care less about stats, I'm talking Ws and TDs.

Do you think if Philly goes to Minnesota to play the outcome might be different, or is that not a factor. That's another one you didn't address.

Brady is better because he has come through many, many times to win HUGE football games. He has that indefinable Montana quality. No other QB in the NFL can really make that claim. Manning, NO, McNabb, NO, Culpepper, NO, Vick, NO, McNair, NO, etc, etc, etc.

[sq764]

CJ, thank you for some rationale.. I think TO is a massive ass too, but getting the chance to watch this guy every play, you really appreciate what he does.. He catches passes, blocks, just creates a mess for defenses..

Moss is talented, but a big crybaby and like you said, a quitter..

Harrison and Manning are a deadly combo..

Personally, I think the best Qb's in the league right now are:

1) Brady, 2) McNabb, 3) Manning, 4) Culpepper, 5) Pennington

Best Wide Receivers:

1) TO, 2) Moss (when he tries), 3) (you may think I am crazy) Plaxico Burris... (I think if Rothersburger matures, these 2 could be a great combo

[sq764]

Valuist, you put Moss as the top receiver, THEN you say TO is not in there because he runs his mouth too much?

Pot, meet kettle.

It's a shame, you are missing a great receiver in Owens.. You can have your never-win-shit, I'm-not-getting-the-ball-enough, I-ain't-playing little bitch Moss, give me a gamer in Owens..

[cj]

So, Moss' ability to quit on a dime doesn't bother you? For the record, Priest Holmes had a couple 200+ yards games for the Ravens, so it isn't all the system.

Moss might have the most ability, but the intangibles have to count for something, and his are lacking. TO blocks on running plays, Moss does not. TO can go deep or over the middle. Moss does not.

[sq764]

CJ, you are abosolutely 100% correct with your statement about Brady.. I agree with you completely..

Great QB's win.. Stats don't mean shit if you're a loser.. That's the HUGE difference between Brady and Culpepper..

Mcnabb is close.. If he can get over the hump of the NFC Championship game, he goes into another category.. Same with Manning.

[Valuist]

Burress over Ward?? Plaxico is talented but doesn't come to play every day. Ward comes to play every game. For a 3rd down completion, I'd take him over anybody. And he's the best blocking WR in the league.

Here's how I'd rank the QBs:
1. Culpepper 2. McNabb 3. Manning 4. Brady 5. Green

Green doesn't have real high quality WRs to work with although you can argue having the Priest keeps the defenses honest.

Biggest disappointments of the season:
1. Dallas- could see this one coming after the way they closed out 2003.
2. Green Bay- the win yesterday was a mirage. They have some offensive weapons but the D still sux.
3. Tennessee- whatever happened to McNair?
4. Carolina- last year was a bit fraudulent and they stayed healthy; they've been hit hard by injuries.

[cj]

I think you missed the biggest disappointment:

The Bengals. Lots of hope after last year, and now, they are the AFC version of Arizona again.

[sq764]

Well, let's be honest, there really is no way to compare the best blocking receiver in the league.. You think Ward is, I think TO is.. I think he is because I see him every play.. I don't get to see 30 other team';s wide receivers every game, so it's not fair to say who could be a better blocker..

Valuist, I am curious, what is your criteria for rating QB's? I am curious how we each decipher what makes one the best..

Your disappointments:

1) Being an Eagles fan, if Dallas went 0-16 every year..good :-)

2) I feel bad for Favre.. He's got more heart than anyone I've seen play in the NFL, but he's a hurting man

3) Mcnair is a hurting man too.. I don't think he'll be playing many more years

4) They just sucked yesterday.. Watching the Eagles game was quite boring.. They just have nothing..

(I did get some humor in Ricky Manning intercepting McNabb's pass and pointing around, dancing, taunting.. All this even though they were on the wrong side of a 30-8 beating)

[Valuist]

CJ-

ESPN loves to highlight whenever Moss has taken plays off. I've seen him go over the middle plenty off times. I believe he has had 100 catch seasons. And he is flat out faster than TO. I think TO is talented but cares about one thing: promoting TO. Moss is intensely competitive. Last night was the first time I've ever seen him miss part of a game.

[Valuist]

Sq-

Your Eagles look pretty solid so far. TO and Kearse were key acquisitions. They've already beaten the Vikings; Seattle might be the only other top team in the NFC. That 10 pt differential last night was a bit deceptive in the Pats/Hawks game. It was 23-20 fairly late and the Hawks had spotted the Pats a sizable lead.

Why am I so high on Daunte? This isn't the same guy who threw a ton of picks in 2002. I've seen the improvement. Almost every throw is right on the money. And he isn't forcing the issue like he used to. The mind has caught up to the talent. No SBs yet, and it may not happen until they upgrade that defense. But if they lose, I don't think it will be a matter of him choking.

[sq764]

Valuist, I don't think many GM's held your sentiment about Moss's heart..


http://cbs.sportsline.com/nfl/story/5798315

Gee, do you think it had anything to do with Moss saying he "only plays when he feels like it"


This is your intensely competitive guy?? Funny..

[cj]

Originally posted by Valuist
Last night was the first time I've ever seen him miss part of a game.

I don't need ESPN, I watch the games.

Moss missed 3.5 quarters of the NFC Championship against the Giants. He was on the field in body, but trust me, he missed a lot of that game.

[Bubbles]

Welll, this debate has sparked me to think of lists of my own. Here are mine.

QB's

1) Brady (When chips are down, the guy knows how to win.)
2) Manning (Numbers are simply huge.)
3) McNabb (Needs to show he can go beyond the NFC title game to get higher here.)
4) Culpepper (Streaky, but when he's on, your jaw drops.)
5) Green (Injuries plagued the offense until now, was very good yesterday.)

WR's

1) Moss
2) TO
3) Harrison
4) Holt
5) Ward

[Valuist]

That article is 2 years old. And who were the GMs? I wonder if they're still in the league. Passing up on a talent like that could cost a GM his job. Moss has had his problems in his career but so has TO. Who wants to win more? Moss never said he wouldn't play with Daunte, or Jeff George or Randall Cunningham or whoever else has been there since 1998.

Yeah, he didn't come to play in that 2000 game against the Giants. And he took plenty of heat for that. I doubt he would do that again.

[sq764]

Sorry, but if a guy doesn't come to play in a playoff game, that's it for me.. He's tainted goods..

(And I don't remember 16 GM firings in the past 2 years, so I think most of them are still there)

[sq764]

I take it all back about Vick.. Today's game changed my mind, he's a stud.. with 2:53 left in the game


M. Vick 7/21 119 0 td 2 int

[cj]

Culpepper looked good again, though ;)

[sq764]

yeah, MONSTER game..good try though

[sq764]

Originally posted by cj
Culpepper looked good again, though ;)

You rank Favre in your top 5 and don't even have Mcnabb in there.. Your Qb analysis is a little questionable :-)

[cj]

When he throws for 400 and 5 TDs, you say he's a fantasy stud only. When he has a very solid, unspectacular, error free game, without his top receiver, that isn't good enough either.

By the way, I never said good things about Vick, I don't think he's very good.

[sq764]

Originally posted by cj
When he throws for 400 and 5 TDs, you say he's a fantasy stud only. When he has a very solid, unspectacular, error free game, without his top receiver, that isn't good enough either.

By the way, I never said good things about Vick, I don't think he's very good.

No, I am saying Mcnabb hasn't had any receivers for 3 years and got to the NFC Championship game.. Culpepper will never win shit, ever.. He's not a winner..

[cj]

You always ignore the same fact...Culpepper has accomplished just as much as McNabb, they are both NFC Championship game losers. Just McNabb has "accomplished" this feat a few more times.

[sq764]

Culpepper has accomplished more in his career than Mcnabb? I have to laugh at you. Not even worth discussing if you talk ridiculous..

You win.

[cj]

I don't think he'd lose to Jacksonville at home like the golden boy did today either. Side note...Leftwich is a player!

[sq764]

Originally posted by cj
You always ignore the same fact...Culpepper has accomplished just as much as McNabb, they are both NFC Championship game losers. Just McNabb has "accomplished" this feat a few more times.

What is funny though is you called University of Delaware's championship a joke, because they played 'Pop Warner' ball. Do you happen to realize that the QB you're jerking off to also played Pop Warner ball in college?

[Zaf]

What a horrible turnover by the Jets in the NE Red Zone :mad: :mad: :mad:

ZAFONIC

[cj]

Originally posted by sq764
Culpepper has accomplished more in his career than Mcnabb? I have to laugh at you. Not even worth discussing if you talk ridiculous..

You win.

You're right, McNabb has accomplished more. He managed to lose the Championship game at home as the heavy favorite. But he's a winner, right? Talking about any of the teams you root for is a waste of time, your judgement is obviously clouded in that area.

[cj]

Originally posted by sq764
What is funny though is you called University of Delaware's championship a joke, because they played 'Pop Warner' ball. Do you happen to realize that the QB you're jerking off to also played Pop Warner ball in college?

How many Delaware guys are playing QB in the NFL now?

Nice mouth, you're all class SQ. Hope you teach your kid to behave better than you do.

[cj]

Originally posted by zafonic
What a horrible turnover by the Jets in the NE Red Zone :mad: :mad: :mad:

ZAFONIC

As Lee Corso would say, "That's why you are the Jets!" :D:D:D

[Zaf]

I mean the guy wasn't even hit, He just put the ball on the turf.

ZAFONIC

[sq764]

Originally posted by cj
I don't think he'd lose to Jacksonville at home like the golden boy did today either. Side note...Leftwich is a player!
I;ve never mentioned Manning, so you'll have to address someone else with that one..

You forget that Culpepper lost to a pathetic 4-12 Arizona last year to cost them the playoffs.. Almost as big a choke job as the Yankees..

[cj]

Yep, Culpepper should have played CB and broke up that Hail Mary pass, his bad.

[sq764]

Originally posted by cj
How many Delaware guys are playing QB in the NFL now?

Nice mouth, you're all class SQ. Hope you teach your kid to behave better than you do.

CJ, you're a joke. When your points are shot down, you get all whiny and pick at stupid shit..

Are you related to LJB?

[cj]

Originally posted by zafonic
I mean the guy wasn't even hit, He just put the ball on the turf.

ZAFONIC

It looked like one of Eddie George's fumbles when Ray Lewis comes near him!

[Zaf]

Originally posted by cj
As Lee Corso would say, "That's why you are the Jets!" :D:D:D

Now too many men on the field :mad: We lose the ball again.

Its hard to be a JET FAN :eek:

ZAFONIC

[cj]

Originally posted by sq764
CJ, you're a joke. When your points are shot down, you get all whiny and pick at stupid shit..

Are you related to LJB?

The only joke is how easy it is to push your buttons and make you show your true colors. So easy its not even fun any more. Have a nice one, I won't bother with you any more.

[cj]

Originally posted by zafonic
Now too many men on the field :mad: We lose the ball again.

Its hard to be a JET FAN :eek:

ZAFONIC

Only 6 points though, still hope.

[sq764]

Originally posted by cj
How many Delaware guys are playing QB in the NFL now?

Nice mouth, you're all class SQ. Hope you teach your kid to behave better than you do.

Well, there's an NFL MVP QB playing right now.. But I guess he's an exception..

Bryan Westbrook played 1-AA, Randy Moss, Leftwich played at Marshall as well..

But again, I don't want to mess up your opinion with all these factual things..

[sq764]

Originally posted by cj
The only joke is how easy it is to push your buttons and make you show your true colors. So easy its not even fun any more. Have a nice one, I won't bother with you any more.

true colors are green and white.. Another crappy game by loser Mcnabb:

D. McNabb 28/43 376 4 1

Just stop crying when you don't make any sense.. I always thought you were a Republican..

[sq764]

Originally posted by cj
Yep, Culpepper should have played CB and broke up that Hail Mary pass, his bad.

OR, maybe if he could have at least scored in the first half and not been outplayed by CADE MCNOWN!!!!!!

Man, when you are trying to defend someone, you don't even attempt to have a neutral opinion.. How in God's name you defend that choke job blows my mind..

[sq764]

Winners get the job done.. Losers don't :-)


Culpepper 24/42 231 1 2 ints - Loss

Mcnabb 18/33 219 1 0 ints - Win

[Valuist]

Yeah, one bad game in a season means he sucks, right? FYI, winning isn't all about the QB either. You've been watching too much ESPN.

[sq764]

I didn't say he sucked, where did you get that from?

I was just pointing out a seasoned winner versus a fantasy player, stat popping losing QB..

[Valuist]

Atlanta has quietly gone 7-2. Like you said, winners get the job done.

[sq764]

Originally posted by Valuist
Atlanta has quietly gone 7-2. Like you said, winners get the job done.
Culpepper isn't even going to make the playoffs, that's funny..

[Valuist]

I wouldn't be too sure of that. Moss will be back in another week. They won't need him this week.

[sq764]

Originally posted by Valuist
I wouldn't be too sure of that. Moss will be back in another week. They won't need him this week.

So he cannot win without Moss?

[Valuist]

I just said they won't need him (meaning Moss) this week. Nobody is going to win a championship without an excellent defense. That even goes for the high and mighty Tom Brady.

[Valuist]

Without Micheal Vick (aka Ron Mexico), would the world ever have discovered this?

http://ronmexico.kainalopallo.com/