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Dahoss9698
09-23-2017, 10:31 PM
I know he got the big money with West Coast....but his ride on Abel Tasman was laughable and he just stopped riding to the wire in the Charlestown stake when he knew he was beat and missed 2nd by a nose.

One of the best riders ever but did gamblers a big disservice today.

JustRalph
09-23-2017, 10:52 PM
I know he got the big money with West Coast....but his ride on Abel Tasman was laughable and he just stopped riding to the wire in the Charlestown stake when he knew he was beat and missed 2nd by a nose.

One of the best riders ever but did gamblers a big disservice today.

Why should he care? There is nobody to call him or any other rider out on it.

There is no racing press

Dahoss9698
09-23-2017, 11:12 PM
Why should he care? There is nobody to call him or any other rider out on it.

There is no racing press

Touché

TiffaniO
09-23-2017, 11:20 PM
I know he got the big money with West Coast....but his ride on Abel Tasman was laughable and he just stopped riding to the wire in the Charlestown stake when he knew he was beat and missed 2nd by a nose.

One of the best riders ever but did gamblers a big disservice today.

Too weird!!! I was going to start a similar thread about the CT race...

In the photo the jocks on the 1 and 11 are down riding to the finish... this guy on the 3 is almost straight up in the irons... barely missing 2nd and barely getting up 3rd...

Question is... do the stewards have the kahunas to fine or suspend him?

I think we know the answer...

chenoa
09-23-2017, 11:54 PM
Too weird!!! I was going to start a similar thread about the CT race...

In the photo the jocks on the 1 and 11 are down riding to the finish... this guy on the 3 is almost straight up in the irons... barely missing 2nd and barely getting up 3rd...

Question is... do the stewards have the kahunas to fine or suspend him?

I think we know the answer...


What happens in Pennsylvania stays in Pennsylvania.

Anything goes!!

:lol::lol:

classhandicapper
09-24-2017, 12:17 AM
I know he got the big money with West Coast....but his ride on Abel Tasman was laughable and he just stopped riding to the wire in the Charlestown stake when he knew he was beat and missed 2nd by a nose.

One of the best riders ever but did gamblers a big disservice today.

That ride on Abel Tasman was comical.

That move is not going to win many races.

Vinnie
09-24-2017, 04:09 AM
I am glad that you guys commented on that Race with Abel Tasman. I know that she has a devastatingly strong late kick, but, Wow, that move was crazy!! Not even Abel Tasman is going to be able to sustain such a long and exhausting move over that distance of ground. In hindsight, and as it worked out in the end, she was damned fortunate to hold on to 2nd if it wasn't for her sheer display of the intestinal fortitude to do so.

Dahoss9698
09-24-2017, 07:21 AM
The weird thing is he moved early on Abel Tasman in the Acorn because he had to and it worked. So he did it again at Saratoga...only earlier and it worked (should have been DQ'd anyway)....so I guess he thought, let me move even earlier this time.

Fager Fan
09-24-2017, 10:03 AM
I am glad that you guys commented on that Race with Abel Tasman. I know that she has a devastatingly strong late kick, but, Wow, that move was crazy!! Not even Abel Tasman is going to be able to sustain such a long and exhausting move over that distance of ground. In hindsight, and as it worked out in the end, she was damned fortunate to hold on to 2nd if it wasn't for her sheer display of the intestinal fortitude to do so.

“She got real rank with him, she took off with him it, and it was unfortunate,” added Abel Tasman's trainer Bob Baffert. “It was a ridiculous run. We might have to take the blinkers off. I guess we just have to turn the page."

Is this 2 races in a row where she breaks sluggishly then is determined to catch up with the front? Baffert isn't blaming Mike. He thinks it's a horse and training issue.

classhandicapper
09-24-2017, 10:26 AM
“She got real rank with him, she took off with him it, and it was unfortunate,” added Abel Tasman's trainer Bob Baffert. “It was a ridiculous run. We might have to take the blinkers off. I guess we just have to turn the page."

Is this 2 races in a row where she breaks sluggishly then is determined to catch up with the front? Baffert isn't blaming Mike. He thinks it's a horse and training issue.

I'm not buying it.

It's possible he asked and then she got away from him, but this horse has always relaxed well and seemed very comfortable behind horses early. It's more likely Baffert knows it was a bad ride but is reluctant to criticize Smith publicly.

Andy Asaro
09-24-2017, 10:43 AM
I know he got the big money with West Coast....but his ride on Abel Tasman was laughable and he just stopped riding to the wire in the Charlestown stake when he knew he was beat and missed 2nd by a nose.

One of the best riders ever but did gamblers a big disservice today.

It was ridiculous and may have changed the outcome of the race by hurting the 2.

GMB@BP
09-24-2017, 02:16 PM
I'm not buying it.

It's possible he asked and then she got away from him, but this horse has always relaxed well and seemed very comfortable behind horses early. It's more likely Baffert knows it was a bad ride but is reluctant to criticize Smith publicly.

Baffert not afraid to criticize a rider publicly, that would be a first.

classhandicapper
09-24-2017, 03:45 PM
Baffert not afraid to criticize a rider publicly, that would be a first.

I hear you, but he has such a good record and relationship with Smith in these big races and that was so obviously a bad move with little evidence that this horse has issues of being rank that it's hard for me to come up with an alternative.

Fager Fan
09-24-2017, 03:49 PM
I hear you, but he has such a good record and relationship with Smith in these big races and that was so obviously a bad move with little evidence that this horse has issues of being rank that it's hard for me to come up with an alternative.

Was he in the dash? Tight hold or loose hold? I haven't looked at the replay to see if I can tell, but I'd tend to believe Mike. He's usually pretty honest in his assessments that I can tell.

JustRalph
09-24-2017, 04:13 PM
If he would have waited another half a furlong, made the same move he would have won. He just ran out of gas

We’d all be wondering why they left the rail so open

GMB@BP
09-24-2017, 09:14 PM
I hear you, but he has such a good record and relationship with Smith in these big races and that was so obviously a bad move with little evidence that this horse has issues of being rank that it's hard for me to come up with an alternative.

I mean maybe Baffert and others are lying, it honestly doesnt matter on some message board but this from Steve Byk

Watched Cotillion with Baffert who is now a little concerned how to solve the Abel Tasman quandary of breaking slow and rushing full throttle into contention. Said once she gets going the way she did, she becomes hard to handle, so he understands Smith just having to let her roll.

Will see what he thinks tomorrow 11:30 on ATR including consideration of F&M Sprint v. Distaff.

Dahoss9698
09-24-2017, 09:59 PM
I mean maybe Baffert and others are lying, it honestly doesnt matter on some message board but this from Steve Byk

Watched Cotillion with Baffert who is now a little concerned how to solve the Abel Tasman quandary of breaking slow and rushing full throttle into contention. Said once she gets going the way she did, she becomes hard to handle, so he understands Smith just having to let her roll.

Will see what he thinks tomorrow 11:30 on ATR including consideration of F&M Sprint v. Distaff.

Weird that her former trainer never seemed to have those issues with her.

GMB@BP
09-24-2017, 10:05 PM
Weird that her former trainer never seemed to have those issues with her.

I would like to see her in a race with a little more pace, but looking at these older distaffers not sure that is in the cards, with songbird out its really a bunch of stalker closers.

cj
09-25-2017, 12:10 AM
Was he in the dash? Tight hold or loose hold? I haven't looked at the replay to see if I can tell, but I'd tend to believe Mike. He's usually pretty honest in his assessments that I can tell.

If that is true he has ridden like 20 "best ever" horses.

Spalding No!
09-25-2017, 12:33 AM
Weird that her former trainer never seemed to have those issues with her.
Even weirder is that after the CCA Oaks, Smith took full credit for the same early move. He "sensed" a slow pace and took it to the rest of the field with a ridiculous 10-length move to the lead. He barely won that race when she looked to tower over the field by open lengths.

Now all of a sudden, she's "hard to handle". Smith certainly didn't seem to try and apply the breaks during that silly rail move.

It's also curious that she only becomes hard to handle down the backstretch. Byk is a bit disingenuous saying she breaks slow and then rushes into contention. She seemed more than content to settle near the back of the field around the first turn in both her last two races.

cj
09-25-2017, 12:55 AM
That move doesn't even work in Gallop Racer.

classhandicapper
09-25-2017, 09:37 AM
I wonder whether making that move in earlier races has now taught her to think that's what she's supposed to do.

outofthebox
09-25-2017, 10:33 AM
I wonder whether making that move in earlier races has now taught her to think that's what she's supposed to do.Maybe so. Especially when you back hand whip leaving the gate to get her into the race. Also he tapped her on the shoulder a few times just entering club house turn. He is definitely turning her engine on a bit...

Road Kill
09-25-2017, 01:16 PM
Or maybe It Tiz Well was just the best horse that day.... 🤷🏼*♀️