christophe soumillon

[SuperPickle]

So I'm kind of shocked he isn't getting more credit for staying on that horse. I watched the replay and there's at least two places where I'm unsure how he stayed in the saddle.

If he falls off it's 50-50 the horse goes the wrong way around the track. Basically everyone's top five nightmare is a loose horse running head into the Derby field. You get a situation like they had at Charlestown a couple years ago and it happens in the Derby you can shut down this site because there's not going to be racing in the morning. It would make the PETA thing look like a trip to Disneyland. The sport would never be considered respectful again.

So hats off to that jockey. He might have saved the sport.

[arw629]

I never thought about what would happen if there was a loose horse running at the field and they had to call a no contest...

[kevb]

Good point.

[EasyGoer89]

Fantastic point. And this was a situation where the horse was frightened vs just a normal situation of clipping heels with an otherwise calm horse, so this specific horse would be more likely to show unpredictable and frantic behavior than any random horse on a random calm day.

[PaceAdvantage]

So I'm kind of shocked he isn't getting more credit for staying on that horse. I watched the replay and there's at least two places where I'm unsure how he stayed in the saddle.

If he falls off it's 50-50 the horse goes the wrong way around the track. Basically everyone's top five nightmare is a loose horse running head into the Derby field. You get a situation like they had at Charlestown a couple years ago and it happens in the Derby you can shut down this site because there's not going to be racing in the morning. It would make the PETA thing look like a trip to Disneyland. The sport would never be considered respectful again.

So hats off to that jockey. He might have saved the sport.I completely disagree that there would be that kind of massive overreaction to a hypothetical tragic accident as you describe.

The site would be here. As would racing.

The space shuttle blew up once, but they still continued to send astronauts into space...on the shuttle even...

[AltonKelsey]

So we get hysteria even when the worst doesn't happen.

Gee, have they shut down auto racing after every horrific crash at the Indianapolis 500 ?

Don't think so.

[SuperPickle]

I completely disagree that there would be that kind of massive overreaction to a hypothetical tragic accident as you describe.

The site would be here. As would racing.

The space shuttle blew up once, but they still continued to send astronauts into space...on the shuttle even...

PA I feel bad that you I aren't on the same page today because I'm a PA fan.

Go look at Joe Harper's talk at last year's UA symposium. He was asked what the biggest threat to horse racing's future is. He didn't say shortages. He did say alternative gaming. He said its animal welfare groups. PETA protests outside the main gate of Del Mar everyday of the meet. He essentially said it has an affect.

So Joe Harper would agree with me.

But go deeper. I know Gab Saez's agent from the Eight Belle's thing. He'll tell you about driving to the airport with him still in the Porter silks because he thought he would be lynched. Or tell Larry Jones you disagree. He walked away from 100 horses because he was literally getting death threats. He handed the stable to his wife because he couldn't cope with the thought of her an employee being harmed by someone wanting to hurt him.

Or you can tell Steve Assmussen you disagree. The PETA thing cost him almost every good horse he had, ended business relationships to this day and might have prevented him from training a Triple Crown winner. Literally if Winchell doesn't stick with him AND Tapit blows up he most likely leaves the sport.

So I respect the fact you disagree. But if you asked the people above who've almost had their careers taken from them by animal rights "activists" if a catostrophic accident like a horse running the wrong way into the Derby field could put horse racing into a death spiral (which by the way it could be in already) I'm fairly certain they'd say "yes."

I'll leave with something paraphrase from Harper's UA talk. People deeply involved in the sport are so down the rabbit they're completely oblivious to the impact of animal rights protesters and the temperature of part of the population toward the sport.

[Fager Fan]

PA I feel bad that you I aren't on the same page today because I'm a PA fan.

Go look at Joe Harper's talk at last year's UA symposium. He was asked what the biggest threat to horse racing's future is. He didn't say shortages. He did say alternative gaming. He said its animal welfare groups. PETA protests outside the main gate of Del Mar everyday of the meet. He essentially said it has an affect.

So Joe Harper would agree with me.

But go deeper. I know Gab Saez's agent from the Eight Belle's thing. He'll tell you about driving to the airport with him still in the Porter silks because he thought he would be lynched. Or tell Larry Jones you disagree. He walked away from 100 horses because he was literally getting death threats. He handed the stable to his wife because he couldn't cope with the thought of her an employee being harmed by someone wanting to hurt him.

Or you can tell Steve Assmussen you disagree. The PETA thing cost him almost every good horse he had, ended business relationships to this day and might have prevented him from training a Triple Crown winner. Literally if Winchell doesn't stick with him AND Tapit blows up he most likely leaves the sport.

So I respect the fact you disagree. But if you asked the people above who've almost had their careers taken from them by animal rights "activists" if a catostrophic accident like a horse running the wrong way into the Derby field could put horse racing into a death spiral (which by the way it could be in already) I'm fairly certain they'd say "yes."

I'll leave with something paraphrase from Harper's UA talk. People deeply involved in the sport are so down the rabbit they're completely oblivious to the impact of animal rights protesters and the temperature of part of the population toward the sport.

That's not true regarding Eight Belles. There have been a ton of articles on it, and Jones left for awhile due to health problems which he discovered was aluminum in his body due to deodorant use.

I commend the rider for staying on the horse, particularly given the short stirrups, but I have no idea how you imagine him coming off the horse would've resulted in the horse running clockwise into the field. The gate was still behind him, so he wasn't getting past that. We can think up a lot of scenarios, including a jock hurt when he came off and unable to get off the track on his own accord before the field came around, but it's a lot of what-ifs.

[sour grapes]

PA I feel bad that you I aren't on the same page today because I'm a PA fan.

Go look at Joe Harper's talk at last year's UA symposium. He was asked what the biggest threat to horse racing's future is. He didn't say shortages. He did say alternative gaming. He said its animal welfare groups. PETA protests outside the main gate of Del Mar everyday of the meet. He essentially said it has an affect.

So Joe Harper would agree with me.

But go deeper. I know Gab Saez's agent from the Eight Belle's thing. He'll tell you about driving to the airport with him still in the Porter silks because he thought he would be lynched. Or tell Larry Jones you disagree. He walked away from 100 horses because he was literally getting death threats. He handed the stable to his wife because he couldn't cope with the thought of her an employee being harmed by someone wanting to hurt him.

Or you can tell Steve Assmussen you disagree. The PETA thing cost him almost every good horse he had, ended business relationships to this day and might have prevented him from training a Triple Crown winner. Literally if Winchell doesn't stick with him AND Tapit blows up he most likely leaves the sport.

So I respect the fact you disagree. But if you asked the people above who've almost had their careers taken from them by animal rights "activists" if a catostrophic accident like a horse running the wrong way into the Derby field could put horse racing into a death spiral (which by the way it could be in already) I'm fairly certain they'd say "yes."

I'll leave with something paraphrase from Harper's UA talk. People deeply involved in the sport are so down the rabbit they're completely oblivious to the impact of animal rights protesters and the temperature of part of the population toward the sport.

are you debbie downwe from SNL?

[biggestal99]

I never thought about what would happen if there was a loose horse running at the field and they had to call a no contest...

They would just call a no contest and race it later.

They did that with the Sydney Cup (Australia) this year.

Allan

[PaceAdvantage]

PA I feel bad that you I aren't on the same page today because I'm a PA fan.

Go look at Joe Harper's talk at last year's UA symposium. He was asked what the biggest threat to horse racing's future is. He didn't say shortages. He did say alternative gaming. He said its animal welfare groups. PETA protests outside the main gate of Del Mar everyday of the meet. He essentially said it has an affect.

So Joe Harper would agree with me.

But go deeper. I know Gab Saez's agent from the Eight Belle's thing. He'll tell you about driving to the airport with him still in the Porter silks because he thought he would be lynched. Or tell Larry Jones you disagree. He walked away from 100 horses because he was literally getting death threats. He handed the stable to his wife because he couldn't cope with the thought of her an employee being harmed by someone wanting to hurt him.

Or you can tell Steve Assmussen you disagree. The PETA thing cost him almost every good horse he had, ended business relationships to this day and might have prevented him from training a Triple Crown winner. Literally if Winchell doesn't stick with him AND Tapit blows up he most likely leaves the sport.

So I respect the fact you disagree. But if you asked the people above who've almost had their careers taken from them by animal rights "activists" if a catostrophic accident like a horse running the wrong way into the Derby field could put horse racing into a death spiral (which by the way it could be in already) I'm fairly certain they'd say "yes."

I'll leave with something paraphrase from Harper's UA talk. People deeply involved in the sport are so down the rabbit they're completely oblivious to the impact of animal rights protesters and the temperature of part of the population toward the sport.

Respectfully, Joe Harper is wrong, and you are wrong.

PETA has had ZERO impact thus far. I've been hearing about the spooky PETA bogeyman forever now. Every time a horse broke down in a major race (and we had a spate of them not too long ago), everyone would tell us how PETA is going to shut us down.

Asmussen? Come on man...that "scandal" faded quicker than a cheap t-shirt. I almost forgot about it entirely until just the other day. This is the same Asmussen who was inducted into the Hall of Fame last year, right? :lol:

The Kentucky Horse Racing Commission cleared Asmussen and Blasi on January 15, 2015, based on the results of its investigation into PETA's allegations. The commission found that no Kentucky horse racing rules were violated, and no further action was taken.[15] The Kentucky report stated that the PETA allegations "had neither a factual or scientific basis."[13]

The New York State Gaming Commission reviewed seven hours of video provided by PETA in addition to other investigation, and announced its findings on Asmussen in a 176-page report released on November 23, 2015. Of 14 specific allegations made by PETA, four minor infractions were sustained, three based on illegal use of a synthetic hormone, thyroxine as a feed supplement, and one a paperwork violation—resulting in a $10,000 fine. The remaining "more serious" allegations were dismissed.[13]

The public doesn't care much about Thoroughbred racing anymore, except maybe on the biggest of days.

This very fact alone prevents PETA from killing the sport. Because nobody will really give a hoot that PETA is sitting outside the gates with protest signs.

Do you actually think that would become some national headline? PETA protesting racing? I don't. News rooms across the country wouldn't bother to cover something that has no real national interest. Look at how they've dropped racing coverage from all national newspapers. Nobody cares enough anymore. So, "racing's decline" has one major upside, it appears. Nobody would care enough that PETA says it should be shut down completely. It would be a major yawner as far as the public is concerned. There are far more important things to worry about than whether or not a horse accidentally went the wrong way on Derby day and caused a one-time catastrophe.

You guys are giving PETA way more power than they actually have. And that's a fact.

[Grits]

Pickle, why did you say, not one word, about the outrider. All this railing, you've done, for nothing. GO BACK to the replay before ever pulling this kind of foolishness again.

In the video at the start, the outrider is positioned, in place, just beyond the gate, to the left of the screen where one can clearly see him.

They break.... Look closely as Thunder Snow begins his antics. To the upper left of the screen, there's a long shadow, cast, already moving on horseback. The outrider sees the problem and instantly takes off for the horse and rider.

It's all about detail, Pickle. The detail of knowing that outriders are in place, and they're good at their jobs. You, unfortunately, missed all this, opting instead to overreact, here, in a terrific way. I'm surprised this is coming from an industry insider.

PA is dead on about PETA. Who cares? They're nuts and everyone knows it. They have no integrity...primarily a bunch of lunatic women. Of which, I'm no part of.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-iNA-0mRH9w

[onefast99]

Pickle, why did you say, not one word, about the outrider. All this railing, you've done, for nothing. GO BACK to the replay before ever pulling this kind of foolishness again.

In the video at the start, the outrider is positioned, in place, just beyond the gate, to the left of the screen where one can clearly see him.

They break.... Look closely as Thunder Snow begins his antics. To the upper left of the screen, there's a long shadow, cast, already moving on horseback. The outrider sees the problem and instantly takes off for the horse and rider.

It's all about detail, Pickle. The detail of knowing that outriders are in place, and they're good at their jobs. You, unfortunately, missed all this, opting instead to overreact, here, in a terrific way. I'm surprised this is coming from an industry insider.

PA is dead on about PETA. Who cares? They're nuts and everyone knows it. They have no integrity...primarily a bunch of lunatic women. Of which, I'm no part of.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-iNA-0mRH9w
Great observation and yes those outriders saved racing for one more day!
http://tse3.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.3VtVlRWUDybM-n8XuRfxkQEsEJ&w=214&h=177&c=7&qlt=90&o=4&pid=1.7
Look Pickle you need to be nicer to the cat or PETA will chop you up and make firewood out of you!

[Rise Over Run]

Or tell Larry Jones you disagree. He walked away from 100 horses because he was literally getting death threats. He handed the stable to his wife because he couldn't cope with the thought of her an employee being harmed by someone wanting to hurt him.

So the whole story about him getting aluminum poisoning from using too much deodorant was made up?

[Fager Fan]

Pickle, why did you say, not one word, about the outrider. All this railing, you've done, for nothing. GO BACK to the replay before ever pulling this kind of foolishness again.

In the video at the start, the outrider is positioned, in place, just beyond the gate, to the left of the screen where one can clearly see him.

They break.... Look closely as Thunder Snow begins his antics. To the upper left of the screen, there's a long shadow, cast, already moving on horseback. The outrider sees the problem and instantly takes off for the horse and rider.

It's all about detail, Pickle. The detail of knowing that outriders are in place, and they're good at their jobs. You, unfortunately, missed all this, opting instead to overreact, here, in a terrific way. I'm surprised this is coming from an industry insider.

PA is dead on about PETA. Who cares? They're nuts and everyone knows it. They have no integrity...primarily a bunch of lunatic women. Of which, I'm no part of.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-iNA-0mRH9w

He doesn't instantly take off after them. The overhead shot shows him alone and bucking for quite awhile. Sure, we all know the outrider eventually picks him up, but I'd disagree with the harshness directed at Pickle for not mentioning what wasn't there.

[Fager Fan]

What Rise quoted though is worthy of scorn. That's a lot of made up stuff right there.

[nijinski]

So the whole story about him getting aluminum poisoning from using too much deodorant was made up?

I'd like to comment on this . Jones told DRF they discovered this health problem while he took his time off . The Aluminum that is .
I believe the Eight Belles tragedy took a major toll on him as well as the accusations of steroid use rumors etc . He really had a tough time and I believe it led to his leaving the track initially .

[Fager Fan]

I'd like to comment on this . Jones told DRF they discovered this health problem while he took his time off . The Aluminum that is .
I believe the Eight Belles tragedy took a major toll on him as well as the accusations of steroid use rumors etc . He really had a tough time and I believe it led to his leaving the track initially .

He said repeatedly that it didn't. He was feeling ill and forgetful which is why he took time away, and during that time testing showed it was the aluminum.

He took no heat on steroids. Eight Belles necropsy proved she had no steroids in her system. The steroid debate centered around Big Brown.