2017 Poker Discussion Thread

[proximity]

ok poker fans we're back with another exciting trip to america's playgroud, the place where the sand turns to gold..... wonderful ATLANTIC CITY!!

it's a relaxing and uneventful drive down to the shore and despite the fact that i've spent the year getting cards that would make a pauper out of phil ivey i try to keep my thoughts positive.

eventually i arrive at spectacular bally's by the beach. it's 1:00 am you would think i could just check right in at that time but of course this is the proximity poker tour. the diamond line waits and waits and waits as an ugly couple tries the difficult task of checking into a hotel room.

eventually i get to the desk and 30 seconds later i'm sent to an interesting little suite in the curtis on the bay tower. i don't really need a bar, a jacuzzi, and multiple bathroom sinks..... but hey, i'll take it!

for tonight at least, i'm a winner!

tomorrow: cards in air.


ok poker fans we are back in exciting ATLANTIC CITY where we wake up in some kind of strange add on suite in the Curtis on the bay tower at BALLY'S.

traditionally i'm more of a fan of the boardwalk than I am the marina in this town but I do note that you can actually go for a PEACEFUL morning walk on the path behind marina properties HARRAH'S and the BORGATA. on the boardwalk itself of course your walk is going to be interrupted by panhandlers asking for change..... probably multiple times.

there are 1-1 comps (which is what ALL comps should be:rolleyes:) at the dunkin donuts and we start our day with an oatmeal to keep our immune system strong in its battle against the dirty chips. eventually we make our way down to the poker room in the wild west section of the casino and start our gambling with some 2-4-6 limit hold 'em.

top pair loses twice in the opening moments and KK is beaten about thirty minutes in. about two hours later though we're about to move ahead with 93 from the big blind.

flop 9 8 3.

but a card shark stays in to river a six to complete his gutterball with 7 5.

fortunately he only has $3 left to bet but we're still behind.

a set of fives is rivered by a flush and AQ falls to A5 (AA5 flop, lol) before KK (0-2 day) goes down to J7 to put the cherry on top of this bally's sundae.

the game breaks (for the third time) and i call it quits.

thank you for reading.

game -73
year -2391 (49-57)
bonus 0 (695)

[Red Knave]

where we wake up in some kind of strange add on suite in the Curtis on the Bay tower at BALLY'S.
I don't care where this is or what it looks like, just reading this made me smile. Thanks Prox. :ThmbUp:

[proximity]

I don't care where this is or what it looks like, just reading this made me smile. Thanks Prox. :ThmbUp:

there is a tower at bally's ac called the dennis tower and when cj's dad changed to Curtis on the bay, I started calling that tower the Curtis on the bay tower. :)

dennis is gone from our computers but he lives on in our hearts and minds.

--proximity

[proximity]

ok poker fans, i apologize for the delay in reports, but we are BACK in exciting ATLANTIC CITY at wonderful bally's on the boardwalk.

after dropping $73 in the trip opener we take a break before returning to the world series of poker room for some night action.

we're in humble 2-6 company and i immediately lose twice with 87s to fall behind..... again.

with QJ i raise a Q54 flop and QT (limped early) comes along. no dime comes but the board runs out K 5 for a chop. not the best outcome but at least we're dragging some chips back to our stack. eventually our AQ outkicks a villain's KQ and some solid value betting on the river gets us on victory's doorstep before a set of 8s pushes us ahead.

but KK falls to 0-3 on the day.

and then 0-4.

and AA is cracked by 96 off and we're again behind.

it just hasn't been our year here in atlantic city.... or anywhere else.... but on this night we do have one final surge and finish ahead $13!

thank you for reading!!

game +13 (246 lim)
year -2378 (50-57)
bonus 0 (695)

[proximity]

ok poker fans, continuing with the ATLANTIC CITY trip where we went 1-1 and netted a $60 loss in the first day of action.

day number two finds us up early and ready to head over to HARRAH'S to see if we can get more total rewards points there. (it's the same)

I jump on a list for 2/4 limit and, after a short walk, return to find that the game's ready to go and ALL THE SEATS ARE ASSIGNED!!

approximate bravo:

ken (seat 1)
marge (seat 2)
proximity
Joshua (seat 3)
Curtis (seat 4)
Christopher (seat 5)
joy (seat 6)
Jason (seat 7)
juan (seat 8)
Gertrude (seat 10)

ok? uhh??? I guess i'll take the nine seat then!!!!

this is a new phenomenon for me on our poker tour and a couple hours later i'll drive back to bally's thinking it was all a set up.

with top pair, solid kicker I immediately lose twice to limped aces and once to limped kings.

with ax I flop an ace from the big blind but get outkicked.

I lose with 77 three (or was it four?) times and miss two four flushes from the blinds.

with KQ in the small blind a flop of JTX bricks out and when the small blind comes around again THE EXACT SAME THING HAPPENS! :bang:

as usual in 2017 EVERYTHING is going wrong. :bang:

eventually about 150 minutes in I FINALLY win a hand when I 3 bet JJ preflop and knock out the remaining queens who sigh after a flop of QQX.

77 finally wins for me when I flop a set.... but that's it.

AQ flops an ace and loses, KK loses like it usually does for me, and a turned flush is overtaken on the river by a boat.

with AsKs I raise and get heads up.

I flop an ace and two spades...... and still lose the hand.

under the gun I raise AA and once again lose to Q9. at least this Q9 is suited (unlike the gutshot I lost to at penn national) but I've had enough and go back to bally's to get a sandwich at sack o subs.

but on a busy Friday night in atlantic city sack o subs is OUT OF ROLLS. :faint:

I wait, and I wait, and I wait, and I wait and seventeen minutes later my (cold, lol) meatball sub is finally ready!

thank you for reading!!

game -149 (2/4 lim)
year -2527 (50-58)
promo 0 (695)

[proximity]

ok poker fans, we continue with our ATLANTIC CITY report.

we last left off with a brutal 2/4 pounding at harrah's and when we returned to bally's we even struggled to get a simple sandwich when sack o'subs ran out of rolls. :faint:

after getting a little relaxation in our cozy little suite in the Curtis on the bay tower we return to the wsop poker room for some night action. (2/4/6 limit)

we start quickly with T2 in the big blind seeing a flop of T 2 8.

I lead out on the flop only to be raised by an obnoxious glutton on my immediate left who promptly turns a queen to give his J9o...... yes, he limped utg with j9 off... the winning straight when no dime or deuce hits the river.

of course then after running out to get an order of fries, the guy immediately hits a high hand.

then he disappears for another thirty minutes, comes back with some cheese fries, and hits ANOTHER high hand. :faint::faint::faint::faint:

meanwhile we're 80 minutes in and (in a recurring proximity poker tour theme) I haven't dragged a single pot.

eventually however I get on the board with our old friend KK and wins with AJ and AK follow to cut my deficit to only $13 for the game.

no high hands or French fries for me but it looks like it's at least going to be a winning session when KQ sees a flop of Q 8 3 and turns a king for two pairs.

but a woman with JT stayed in with her gutterball and the cowboy on the turn made her open ended.

ace on the river seals my fate. :bang:

thank you for reading.

game -52 (2/4)
season -2579 (50-59)
bonus 0 (695)

[Track Collector]

Just finished both a Thursday and Saturday poker session with an accumulated 14+ hours, and they were brutal. Net loss from both days was $577.

Here are some of the specific hands that I can remember:

(a) Went all-in with AA pre-flop. A villain calls with QQ. I am a 80-20 favorite. Q on the flop.
(b) Went all-in with AA pre-flop. A villain calls with 10 10. I am a 80-20 favorite. 10 on the flop, then another 10 on the turn. (If I was going to get beat, at least my opponent was able to win a portion of the high-hand promotion,.).
(c) Went all-in on a flop of 6 Q A rainbow with AQo. Villain calls with AKo. I am an 85-15 favorite. A king appears on the river.
(d) I have AA and go all-in preflop. My opponent calls with K 10 off. I am a 85-15 favorite. Flop comes Q 9 8.
(e) Had QQ. Raise to $20. Flop comes 6 7 3 rainbow. I go all-in, and villain has 6 7 off. To be fair, I probably win if I go all-in pre-flop.
(f,g) Another two hands where I was all-in and had at a minimum a 60+ to 40- advantage.

Pretty depressing, but Peter Clarke in his book "The Grinder's Manual" states that the only "stable" currency in poker is EV (Expected Value). And that over a sufficiently long-enough time period, real-life profits/losses will be equal to one's accumulated EV. So at my current activity rate AND if I continue to play at a +EV level, I should be able to recoup these recent losses in about 50 years. :D

[dlivery]

Just finished both a Thursday and Saturday poker session with an accumulated 14+ hours, and they were brutal. Net loss from both days was $577.

Here are some of the specific hands that I can remember:

(a) Went all-in with AA pre-flop. A villain calls with QQ. I am a 80-20 favorite. Q on the flop.
(b) Went all-in with AA pre-flop. A villain calls with 10 10. I am a 80-20 favorite. 10 on the flop, then another 10 on the turn. (If I was going to get beat, at least my opponent was able to win a portion of the high-hand promotion,.).
(c) Went all-in on a flop of 6 Q A rainbow with AQo. Villain calls with AKo. I am an 85-15 favorite. A king appears on the river.
(d) I have AA and go all-in preflop. My opponent calls with K 10 off. I am a 85-15 favorite. Flop comes Q 9 8.
(e) Had QQ. Raise to $20. Flop comes 6 7 3 rainbow. I go all-in, and villain has 6 7 off. To be fair, I probably win if I go all-in pre-flop.
(f,g) Another two hands where I was all-in and had at a minimum a 60+ to 40- advantage.

Pretty depressing, but Peter Clarke in his book "The Grinder's Manual" states that the only "stable" currency in poker is EV (Expected Value). And that over a sufficiently long-enough time period, real-life profits/losses will be equal to one's accumulated EV. So at my current activity rate AND if I continue to play at a +EV level, I should be able to recoup these recent losses in about 50 years. :D

as we go along our known way we will find our way
Let It Ride

[proximity]

sounds like a "proximity" session. :puke:

when did he hit the jack in (d)?

[Track Collector]

sounds like a "proximity" session. :puke:

when did he hit the jack in (d)?

Sorry, it was Q J 9 (not Q 9 8). He flopped the straight. :blush:

[proximity]

ok poker fans we are back in atlantic city at exciting bally's by the beach where we'll wrap up our halloweeen trip with some invigorating 2/4/6 limit hold 'em!!

we checkout of our suite in the curtis on the bay tower and grab an oatmeal at the dunkin donuts. it's been yet another bad trip down to the jersey shore. to recap i'm losing at bally's, got absolutely demolished at harrah's, and endured a long wait at sack o'subs when they ran out of rolls.

whether or not this trip will be better than an earlier 2017 ac trip where a dirty bally's toilet overflowed on me will be determined by today's action.....

we start off losing with our old friend KK but there's a LONG way to go.

99 can't fold out KJ (no flush in play) on a board of 6542.

jack on the river.

next we suffer our second loss of the day with cowboys when KK can't fold out another stroker who hangs around to river a back door flush.

to complicate matters i'm flopping four flushes but whiffing completely.

our boat is once again drifting away from the shore here in atlantic city when an amazing hand gets me right back in the game. i have 33 vs TWO villains with AJ.

flop: A J 3. :cool:

i look to build some momentum when i get KQ in back to back hands.... but i lose both pots.

it's another miserable day at bally's. the table's laughing at a guy who isn't even funny. eveyone's having a good time. everyone but me.

when i look down at QQ though a flop of QQx will turn my frown upside down.

i drag a rare pot and nail a $250 high hand right at the buzzer!!

i'm about to move ahead for the actual poker too when A5s flops trips against limped queens.

QQ hath giveth bountifully with the high hand but this time it takes a little back when a third tudor girl shows up on fifth street.

finally with 99 i raise and get heads up against an animal who stays with J5.

flop: Q 7 2

i bet the flop. he stays.

i bet the turn (blank). he stays.

only ONE card will help him now but that one card sums up our entire 2017 season.

river: J

i retire to noodle village to enjoy one final general tso's before what i plan to be a long break from atlantic city. despite the losing i will miss the city and the hope, nostalgic feelings, excitement, and feeling of freedom that these trips give me. i don't want to go back to poker but i'm not yet ready to leave so i sit down for some blackjack where i get wrapped up in a game with some tourists and a sexy young thing in a skeleton costume.

suddenly it all turns around.

i begin to win and win and win and win.....:)

thank you for reading!!

game -59 (246 lim)
year -2638 (50-60)
bonus 225 (920)

[proximity]

(proximity, sexy young thing, guy who called down with j 5 off--no hearts...)

https://images.hellogiggles.com/uploads/2017/10/29004224/Ariel-Winter-Just-Jared-e1509288158286.jpg

[tucker6]

Anyone heard from Proximity lately? I wrote him a PM a few days ago hoping he was well with no response and I see he hasn't been on the boards since 4/30. Just checking to make sure everything is fine.

[proximity]

I've been busy trying to land a big trainer change analyst position with benter associates. :D

will try to finish up these 2017 reports and hopefully get some new games in here for the 2018 thread!!

hope everyone is well!!

[charm city whizz]

I've been busy trying to land a big trainer change analyst position with benter associates. :D

will try to finish up these 2017 reports and hopefully get some new games in here for the 2018 thread!!

hope everyone is well!!

Hope your well too, Just getting to start ramping up my poker trips

[Track Collector]

Glad to hear from both of you!

No poker for me last week as the wife and I drove down to Florida to see her Dad. Looking to visit him again in about 5 weeks when he turns 100.

Poker-wise I have been doing very well so far this year. If I can keep up the current rate I can think of it as a part-time job (although one currently paying less than minimum wage). :)

I do quite well at Charles Town, but I need to work on my game at places like the Horseshoe and Maryland Live where the average games are somewhat more aggressive. Maybe the player pool is a bit sharper too.

Might finally give Penn National a try too, but I hear there is this sharpie called "The Lion".

[thaskalos]

Glad to hear from both of you!

No poker for me last week as the wife and I drove down to Florida to see her Dad. Looking to visit him again in about 5 weeks when he turns 100.

Poker-wise I have been doing very well so far this year. If I can keep up the current rate I can think of it as a part-time job (although one currently paying less than minimum wage). :)

I do quite well at Charles Town, but I need to work on my game at places like the Horseshoe and Maryland Live where the average games are somewhat more aggressive. Maybe the player pool is a bit sharper too.

Might finally give Penn National a try too, but I hear there is this sharpie called "The Lion".

To what do you attribute your very good results at the poker table this year?

[Track Collector]

To what do you attribute your very good results at the poker table this year?


That is an interesting question. Let me give this some thought before I reply.


Tonight (Friday) on the felt I experienced a very rare occurrence. I think I was in the CO. The UTG raised to $12 pre-flop, and was followed by 3 more calls. When it gets to me I jam for about $140 with pocket Aces. The UTG calls my All-In with pocket Aces. Pretty uncommon by itself, but then add that instead of chopping I get beat by a flush. Now I only have to wait sometime over the next 20-30 years for the same situation where "I" am the one who makes the flush. :)

[thaskalos]

That is an interesting question. Let me give this some thought before I reply.


Tonight (Friday) on the felt I experienced a very rare occurrence. I think I was in the CO. The UTG raised to $12 pre-flop, and was followed by 3 more calls. When it gets to me I jam for about $140 with pocket Aces. The UTG calls my All-In with pocket Aces. Pretty uncommon by itself, but then add that instead of chopping I get beat by a flush. Now I only have to wait sometime over the next 20-30 years for the same situation where "I" am the one who makes the flush. :)

That's why I say that we need a strong stomach in order to play no limit effectively. :)

[proximity]

That is an interesting question. Let me give this some thought before I reply.


Tonight (Friday) on the felt I experienced a very rare occurrence. I think I was in the CO. The UTG raised to $12 pre-flop, and was followed by 3 more calls. When it gets to me I jam for about $140 with pocket Aces. The UTG calls my All-In with pocket Aces. Pretty uncommon by itself, but then add that instead of chopping I get beat by a flush. Now I only have to wait sometime over the next 20-30 years for the same situation where "I" am the one who makes the flush. :)


for awhile (I don't think anymore?) pen had a jackpot for this! :puke:

[Denny]

Hey Thaskalos - and everybody here,

Just found this thread and will start going over it in time.

In the mean time if you have a no-limit poker book to recommend, don't forget to let me know.

Thanks
Denny

[Track Collector]

In another thread Thaskalos asked me for the reasons why I have experienced good results this year (currently north of +$10 / hr excluding promotional wins) after about 175 total playing hours.

After careful consideration here are some factors that "might" be contributors:

-- I have better awareness of my opponent's playing styles.
-- I understand hand textures a little better.
-- I have slowly moved away from an almostly exclusive "nitty" style to one that now has more increased, but calculated aggression. I still have a long way to go in this regard.
-- I seem to be encountering a significant level of "soft" games. Perhaps in part to more frequent high-hand promotions at my home poker room which in turn attracts less-skilled players who stay in hands longer hoping to get lucky.
-- I seem to be paying off players who hold better hands at a decreasing frequency.
-- I have more confidence when I play, and I feel like I understand the game on a more intuitive level than in the past.

So by the end of the year it might be the phrase from the Bad Boys song, "If you get hot then you must get cool", or hopefully, I really have improved on skill level. (Even then, the total number of hands I play each year is relatively small, so my results could vary significantly from year to year.).


I have no aspirations to climb up the poker ladder, so I'm currently enjoying an activity that at the very worst is not costing me to play. :)

[thaskalos]

2-5 no-limit, at about 1:30 am. We are 8 at the table, and from the accents, I can tell that only 1 is American. To say that the game is "wild" is the biggest understatement since General Custer...who reportedly told his men: "Over that hill, I fear that we might meet unfriendly Indians".

"A typical hand"...you ask? Okay!

I am on the button with AK. It gets to me after 2 limpers, and I raise to $35. The big blind and the 2 limpers call. The flop falls:

8-3-8 rainbow

The bespectacled American on the big blind checks, and so does the UTG limper... but the middle-positioned player, who looks distinctly Middle-Eastern, bets $100. I fold... suspecting that I am playing against sane human beings. The big blind calls quickly. The turn is a 6, putting 2 hearts on the board...and the big blind now leads out with a bet of $250...causing the prior bettor to go into the tank. After a full 2 minute contemplation...he calls. The river is a J of clubs...and the big blind thinks for about 20 seconds, and then calls out..."all-in", with about $800 remaining in front of him. The Middle Eastener, who has the bettor covered, now REALLY goes into the tank...and we all wait in silence for what feels like an eternity. "Call", he declares...causing the big blind to wince as he sheepishly turns over the A-Q of hearts. The caller excitedly jumps to his feet, and slams 2 deuces on the felted table...while yelling out, "WHAT HE COULD HAVE"?

About an hour later...the same player goes "all-in" on me...with a 6-7-5-3-2 board, and me holding 8-8. Deciding that this isn't the hand I should be playing for all my chips, I fold...and he turns over an A-6...causing me to order a rare alcoholic drink at the table, as I ask the dealer for an aspirin.

What a town!

[proximity]

The caller excitedly jumps to his feet, and slams 2 deuces on the felted table...while yelling out, "WHAT HE COULD HAVE"?


all the pros are in town for the world series! :)

[mikekk]

Interested in feedback on the following hand.

Middle of a tournament on PokerStars, I'm currently in 71st place; payouts start at pos. 820; there's still 871 left in it.

Blinds 200-400; I pick up 3h-3d in the big blind.

Hijack bets 1000; button calls. I call

Flop is Ah-3c-Ad. I check. HJ bets 2500, button calls. I call

Turn is 3s. I check, HJ checks, button bets 3250. I call. HJ folds.

River is 8h. I bet half pot, button pushes all in, I call. And lose to pocket aces.

Now I realize that this was a massive cooler (DUH!). But, in discussions with friends, everyone says I should have no problem folding the river. I just don't think I can...I lose to exactly one combination!

This tilted me for a couple of weeks...I'm a nice guy, don't understand why the Poker Gods were so upset with me!

Can anyone come up with a lucid reason for a fold here?

Mike

[thaskalos]

Jesus Christ wouldn't have been able to get away alive in that spot.

[mikekk]

Only "good" thing about the hand was that I outchipped the villain. I managed to nurse my meager stack to a min-cash.

Then I tilted.

Mike

[proximity]

But, in discussions with friends, everyone says I should have no problem folding the river.


not saying your friends are bad people but the gambling world (outside of paceadvantage of course) is filled with insecurity and "contrarianism."

what i'm saying is that most of us probably have gambling friends that would say the same thing but i don't think anyone's really folding there. :)

what were stacks btw?

[mikekk]

not saying your friends are bad people but the gambling world (outside of paceadvantage of course) is filled with insecurity and "contrarianism."

what i'm saying is that most of us probably have gambling friends that would say the same thing but i don't think anyone's really folding there. :)

what were stacks btw?

The standard critique was that I should raise the flop to "see where I stand". But:

- it's a 4-way flop and I should be way ahead...I don't want to be scaring anyone into folding just yet...I want to play 3-way for stacks here
- best scenario is if both of them hold an ace...then I'm 80-20 favorite
- only turn and river I'm considering mucking is if an ace shows
- My God, I HAVE to be in good shape on this flop!
- button with aces would be an IDIOT to raise if I bet the flop, so seeing where I stand is meaningless

Other remark, I should fold to the river jam because "you can only beat a bluff". But:

- there's more full houses that I'm beating, and only one hand that beats me.
- any ace has a full house, probably trying to scoop the pot if I have the other one

I would have bet the river as described even if an ace appeared. Probably would have folded to the jam, tho.

Stacks? I had 70 BB's; Hijack had 40, Button had 61.

Yeah, I agree with your last statement. Easier to fold in a conversation than in real life! Unfortunately, Pokerstars doesn't have a bad beat jackpot; that would have salved the wound a bit!

Thanks to you and Thask for the input.

Mike

[thaskalos]

The standard critique was that I should raise the flop to "see where I stand". But:

- it's a 4-way flop and I should be way ahead...I don't want to be scaring anyone into folding just yet...I want to play 3-way for stacks here
- best scenario is if both of them hold an ace...then I'm 80-20 favorite
- only turn and river I'm considering mucking is if an ace shows
- My God, I HAVE to be in good shape on this flop!
- button with aces would be an IDIOT to raise if I bet the flop, so seeing where I stand is meaningless

Other remark, I should fold to the river jam because "you can only beat a bluff". But:

- there's more full houses that I'm beating, and only one hand that beats me.
- any ace has a full house, probably trying to scoop the pot if I have the other one

I would have bet the river as described even if an ace appeared. Probably would have folded to the jam, tho.

Stacks? I had 70 BB's; Hijack had 40, Button had 61.

Yeah, I agree with your last statement. Easier to fold in a conversation than in real life! Unfortunately, Pokerstars doesn't have a bad beat jackpot; that would have salved the wound a bit!

Thanks to you and Thask for the input.

Mike

Mike, do yourself a favor. Avoid any further advice from those who told you that you should have raised the flop to "see where you stand". The guy with the pocket aces would never have revealed the strength of his hand to you that early...so your flop raise wouldn't have gotten the desired result. And the idea of folding to the river jam is too ridiculous to comment on. Your demise was unavoidable in that hand...no matter what anyone else tells you.

[PaceAdvantage]

2-5 no-limit, at about 1:30 am. We are 8 at the table, and from the accents, I can tell that only 1 is American. To say that the game is "wild" is the biggest understatement since General Custer...who reportedly told his men: "Over that hill, I fear that we might meet unfriendly Indians".

"A typical hand"...you ask? Okay!

I am on the button with AK. It gets to me after 2 limpers, and I raise to $35. The big blind and the 2 limpers call. The flop falls:

8-3-8 rainbow

The bespectacled American on the big blind checks, and so does the UTG limper... but the middle-positioned player, who looks distinctly Middle-Eastern, bets $100. I fold... suspecting that I am playing against sane human beings. The big blind calls quickly. The turn is a 6, putting 2 hearts on the board...and the big blind now leads out with a bet of $250...causing the prior bettor to go into the tank. After a full 2 minute contemplation...he calls. The river is a J of clubs...and the big blind thinks for about 20 seconds, and then calls out..."all-in", with about $800 remaining in front of him. The Middle Eastener, who has the bettor covered, now REALLY goes into the tank...and we all wait in silence for what feels like an eternity. "Call", he declares...causing the big blind to wince as he sheepishly turns over the A-Q of hearts. The caller excitedly jumps to his feet, and slams 2 deuces on the felted table...while yelling out, "WHAT HE COULD HAVE"?

About an hour later...the same player goes "all-in" on me...with a 6-7-5-3-2 board, and me holding 8-8. Deciding that this isn't the hand I should be playing for all my chips, I fold...and he turns over an A-6...causing me to order a rare alcoholic drink at the table, as I ask the dealer for an aspirin.

What a town!Sounds like you were at a table with people who have more money than brains. Tough spot in that final pre-alcohol hand...if you go by his prior history, you can easily see him having a 4 or 89 or pocket deuces...what you should have done is peg him as the idiot he was and is...no way he goes all in if he has a straight...and he probably wouldn't go all-in if he has trips seeing as there are multiple straight possibilities out there...

But then again, I barely hold my own at no limit poker...so what do I know?

[thaskalos]

Sounds like you were at a table with people who have more money than brains. Tough spot in that final pre-alcohol hand...if you go by his prior history, you can easily see him having a 4 or 89 or pocket deuces...what you should have done is peg him as the idiot he was and is...no way he goes all in if he has a straight...and he probably wouldn't go all-in if he has trips seeing as there are multiple straight possibilities out there...

But then again, I barely hold my own at no limit poker...so what do I know?

An hour earlier...the same guy called a sizable all-in bet on an 8-3-8-6-J board...with pocket dueces. Why wouldn't I expect him to go all-in with a straight, or a set?

[PaceAdvantage]

An hour earlier...the same guy called a sizable all-in bet on an 8-3-8-6-J board...with pocket dueces. Why wouldn't I expect him to go all-in with a straight, or a set?I wasn't thinking clearly when I replied, obviously. He went all in on the river...for some reason, I was replying while thinking he went all-in earlier in the hand.

My bad.

[thaskalos]

I wasn't thinking clearly when I replied, obviously. He went all in on the river...for some reason, I was replying while thinking he went all-in earlier in the hand.

My bad.

The point being...we SAY that we want to gamble with "lunatics"...but are we ready for the consequences when things go awry? The more "crazy" the game is, the more volatile the swings become...even for the better players. These are the occupational hazards of gambling.

[Track Collector]

Mike, do yourself a favor. Avoid any further advice from those who told you that you should have raised the flop to "see where you stand". The guy with the pocket aces would never have revealed the strength of his hand to you that early...so your flop raise wouldn't have gotten the desired result. And the idea of folding to the river jam is too ridiculous to comment on. Your demise was unavoidable in that hand...no matter what anyone else tells you.


Spot On IMHO.


Folding to the river jam with such a strong hand is LOSING poker in the long-run, despite this individual hand loss. Just think about how many more times someone can push you off normally winning hands when you don't have the absolute nuts. That would be crazy and again losing poker. As thaskalos said, your demise was unavoidable in that hand.


And raising on the flop was going to get you either a call or a fold. Even bluffing (because they have position on you) is less likely when one risks busting out or severely damaging their opportunity to cash. So getting a call to that raise had the very high probability that you were significantly behind pre-turn, which is not when you want to get more money in the pot.

[Tee]

There are times when poker hands play themselves & nothing is done incorrectly by either player.

Set over set - in this case quads over quads. Quads vs top full house etc etc

There are hands that people are going to go broke with no matter what. All the talk in the world after the fact is not going to change a thing.

[dilanesp]

If you are going to play no limit hold 'em, you need to carefully watch each hand. Note not only obvious stuff like whether they bluff rivers (which even fish notice), but also non-obvious stuff:

1. Bet sizing. This is really important. Indeed, this bigger than basically ANY physical tell for most players.

Here are some examples:

a. The guy who bets big when he has it and small when he doesn't.
b. The guy who bets small when he has it and big when he doesn't.
c. The guy who sizes bets to try and produce a river shove when he flops huge and never does it on a bluff.
d. The guy who raises pre-flop small with a small pair or suited connectors and big with a big pocket pair or big cards.
e. The guy who has no idea about pot size and will always call $100 and fold to $175 (or whatever numbers).
f. Blocking bets-- small lead-outs on the river with middling hands to prevent having to call a big bet.

2. How they play big draws. Do they jam with them or call with them?

3. Do they limp re-raise aces and kings? If they do, their pre-flop raising range first into the pot is capped, which is just absolutely amazingly great information.

4. Will they bet their hand without a flush when a flush comes in, or without a straight when a straight comes in.

5. How strong does their hand have to be to fire three barrels?

6. Obviously, what percentage of hands do they voluntarily come into the pot pre-flop with, and what percentage do they raise and 3-bet with.

Now, put your opponent on a range based on all those things you carefully watched the last 3 hours, and do the math and calculate the pot odds, and you will know whether you can fold a strong hand to a big river bet.

[proximity]

ok poker fans, following our halloween drubbing in atlantic city, we continue our 2017 season with another invigorating contest at the horseshoe baltimore.

we're in 3/6 limit company and taking yet another pounding as i just cannot escape this run of bad cards.

my neighbor tries to entertain me by putting his phone on the table so we can watch a porn convention in new jersey.

a nice gesture indeed, but one that fails to raise my spirits (or anything else) as i only drag one side pot in nearly four hours of play.

finally i score with A9s in a pot that was larger than it should've been thanks to Q6 off raising from the small blind.

but that's all.

i don't win another hand.

thank you for reading.

game -225
season -2863 (50-61)
bonus 0 (920)

[how cliche]

wsop main event final table. some opinions. welcome everyone's thoughts.

really love watching every hand, rather than a highlight show.
once cada was out it was clear that cynn was the most likely winner, despite his 3/5 chip position and a huge gap from the chip lead. when cada and miles flipped for their tournament lives i was rooting for cada so we could watch the two top shelf players go at it. that said, i felt the last 3 year's final tables lacked true world class quality play. two years in a row you had wire to wire chip leaders. and this year you had the potential for a treat but the wrong player won the flip. since they began offering every hand coverage there are two champions that i feel would win these games almost always. greg merson and martin jacobson.

love the break desk team of ali nejad and nick schulman. schulman is a beast. great at articulating the nuances of the game so everyone can understand. if only he could learn to say versus instead of verse. nobody's perfect.

[proximity]

ok poker fans we continue our 2017 season in another small stakes limit hold 'em game in a casino that i will keep anonymous.

i end up winning $21 in this game but suffer a bad experience that i always worried would happen.

we're about 2/3 of the way through the session when i fold a small pocket pair to a raise.

had i called here i would've flopped a boat, rivered quads, AND LOST THE HAND to flopped quads.

in this casino, at this particular time, this would've paid me a bad beat jackpot of slightly more than $30,000.

certainly not "life changing" money but enough to keep my spirits up. i always thought i'd go numb if (when) this happened and i was mildly surprised that i didn't feel much of anything. this particular "loss" however when combined with my overall bad run and declining benefits at the casinos would ultimately dampen my enthusiasm for the game.

thank you for reading.

game +21
year -2842 (51-61)
bonus 0 (920)

[dilanesp]

ok poker fans we continue our 2017 season in another small stakes limit hold 'em game in a casino that i will keep anonymous.

i end up winning $21 in this game but suffer a bad experience that i always worried would happen.

we're about 2/3 of the way through the session when i fold a small pocket pair to a raise.

had i called here i would've flopped a boat, rivered quads, AND LOST THE HAND to flopped quads.

in this casino, at this particular time, this would've paid me a bad beat jackpot of slightly more than $30,000.

certainly not "life changing" money but enough to keep my spirits up. i always thought i'd go numb if (when) this happened and i was mildly surprised that i didn't feel much of anything. this particular "loss" however when combined with my overall bad run and declining benefits at the casinos would ultimately dampen my enthusiasm for the game.

thank you for reading.

game +21
year -2842 (51-61)
bonus 0 (920)

The thing is, it's generally a -EV play.

Here's some calculations that can give you some guidance on it. The California bad beat jackpots tend to be about $40,000, with $16,000 to the losing hand and $8,000 to the winning hand. When the rake was $6 (it is now $7), I did some calculations on something people do, which is play the hand (and pay the rake) when one player has a big ace and the other player has a big pocket pair (three aces, in that situation, produces aces full of tens or better beaten by four of a kind, the easiest type of jackpot). In that situation, KNOWING what your opponent has, it was just slightly +EV to go ahead and play it if you knew that the big ace was AT or better. It was -EV at A9 (because face cards would kill the jackpot).

So it is incredibly unlikely that calling to hit a quads-against-quads jackpot, not even knowing if another pocket pair is out there, is profitable. Especially if it is only $30,000.

[proximity]

continuing with our 2017 tour, i'm stumbling towards the finish line and still need to get in some play at horseshoe to make caesars diamond for 2018 but find time to fit in a 1-2 game at pen where i'm dealt QQ in the very first hand.

i raise a couple limpers to $15 and the small blind and another player come along.

j 7 2 rainbow on the flop and i fail to shake the small blind who check raises me all in on the turn when another 7 falls.

no one calls the clock but i apologize to the table for taking a lot of time to think about this; again the very first hand i'm dealt in.

it's been a tough year and now i'm positioned to lose $150 just seconds into a game.

but this time i don't lose.

instead i call and hold off A j when a blank comes on the river.

unfortunately though this ends up being my only win of the session.

i do hold on for a $70 win though and get to play some with our old friend THE LION who finishes the year like 88-18 before getting off to another hot start in 2018.

game +70 (1/2)
year -2772 (52-61)
bonus 0 (920)

[proximity]

continuing with our 2017 tour, we're back on the grind to caesars diamond with a sunday afternoon trip to horseshoe baltimore.

driving down 83 to the shoe i'm trying to find the colts score on the radio but i'm not having any luck (no pun intended). anyhow with only three wins on the season they're doing almost as bad as i am on this poker tour. :mad:

we start the trip in 1/3 no limit where i grind out a quick $118 win before getting called to our traditional horseshoe game of 3/6 where i also get off to a solid beginning.

on one of horseshoe's many tvs the colts appear to be headed to an 8-7 victory with a late td and two point conversion in an absolute blizzard in buffalo. but the ref calls a penalty on the two point conversion and we head to overtime where tonyk@hsh's good buddy shady mccoy ices the contest for the bills. this sucks for the moment but will eventually result in a better draft pick, so......

back on the felt i flop a straight with dilanesp's favorite limit hand 76s but i can't hold off a club flush that comes on the river.

with Ah Kc though i flop an ace and three clubs against the same villain who flops a baby flush. this time though it's me who rivers the club and drags the pot.

three players in the game are repeatedly taking extended breaks. eventually they all depart leaving the game short and i quit too; still with some work to do to pass 15000 tier credits and secure 2018 diamond status.

thank you for reading.

game +118 (1/3)
+128 (3/6)
year -2526 (54-61)
bonus 0 (920)

[proximity]

ok poker fans we're back with one final report for 2017 and it's from our favorite casino the beautiful horseshoe baltimore!!

we have a long day of gambling ahead of us to secure caesars diamond status for 2018 and we start out at the hold 'em tables in 1/3 no limit company.

this game is going back and forth and really i'm ok with that. i just need to grind out my time for diamond and head back to grantville to figure out what the hell to do with the rest of my life.

i'm up $21 when a popular horseshoe dealer, miss aesthetics, deals me kk in the small blind.

the player utg raises to $12 and five players call.

this seems like a situation where they can all be in each other's way (all the aces could be out) but a king or two could be out there too?

i decide to shove my remaining $220 and just take what's out there.

the original raiser calls with AK and everyone else folds.

9 3 5 rainbow flop.

4 turn.

2 river. :puke:

one last time...... THANK YOU FOR READING! :)

game -200 (1/3)
year -2726 (54-62)
bonus 0 (920)

[Track Collector]

ok poker fans we're back with one final report for 2017 and it's from our favorite casino the beautiful horseshoe baltimore!!

we have a long day of gambling ahead of us to secure caesars diamond status for 2018 and we start out at the hold 'em tables in 1/3 no limit company.

this game is going back and forth and really i'm ok with that. i just need to grind out my time for diamond and head back to grantville to figure out what the hell to do with the rest of my life.

i'm up $21 when a popular horseshoe dealer, miss aesthetics, deals me kk in the small blind.

the player utg raises to $12 and five players call.

this seems like a situation where they can all be in each other's way (all the aces could be out) but a king or two could be out there too?

i decide to shove my remaining $220 and just take what's out there.

the original raiser calls with AK and everyone else folds.

9 3 5 rainbow flop.

4 turn.

2 river. :puke:

one last time...... THANK YOU FOR READING! :)

game -200 (1/3)
year -2726 (54-62)
bonus 0 (920)


Simply bad variance on what to me would seem like a +EV move by you. The original raiser probably thought they were "somewhat close" to a coin flip thinking you had an underpair, with the added benefit of some extra dead money in the pot in addition to your shove.

In reality, your opponent was in an even worse position as one of the poker calculators shows you with a 69-31 advance pre-flop, which swelled to 85-15 before the turn and 84-16 before the river.

IMO one of the hardest things to understand and have faith in is that if we continue to play a significant number of hands, future results are going to "gravitate closer" to the expected EV.

Cheer up and keep making those +EV decisions. Money will eventually flow your way. So did you make Diamond status, or is that to be revealed in a future post?