Mahoning Valley 20 cent Pick 6 - Mandatory Payout on 12/28

[Vinman]

Today's 20 cent payoff in Mahoning Valley's jackpot "Buckeye Pick 6" was $1,502.32, with no horse paying over $16.60. This brings the jackpot carryover up to $56,186.66. If no single winning ticket takes the pool tomorrow, a mandatory payout pool in excess of 60k will be in play for Wednesday, 12/28.

They're also giving out their 2017 calendar at the track on Wednesday.

Vinman

[rrpic6]

Today's 20 cent payoff in Mahoning Valley's jackpot "Buckeye Pick 6" was $1,502.32, with no horse paying over $16.60. This brings the jackpot carryover up to $56,186.66. If no single winning ticket takes the pool tomorrow, a mandatory payout pool in excess of 60k will be in play for Wednesday, 12/28.

They're also giving out their 2017 calendar at the track on Wednesday.

Vinman

A sigh of relief as its still alive with 2 days to go. If the second place horse wins (#11), someone had the sole ticket. The calendars are limited to the first 300 people starting at noon. Come early as the crowds will be near capacity inside this week. On track handle was close to 50K today. 1.1 million nationwide handle very good considering there was lots of competition. Wednesday could be interesting!

RR

[CincyHorseplayer]

Watched some races from there the other day and I could have handicapped them 100 times and never come up with the winner! Don't like to play at places where turds rise to the top! Keep the carryover!

[no breathalyzer]

Watched some races from there the other day and I could have handicapped them 100 times and never come up with the winner! Don't like to play at places where turds rise to the top! Keep the carryover!

agree 100% must be the ultimate in the know race track.. that track is straight lighting my $$$ on fire and cancer to the bankroll

[appistappis]

stay with it guys.....mah valley can get very biased and when it does, the money flows.

[rrpic6]

agree 100% must be the ultimate in the know race track.. that track is straight lighting my $$$ on fire and cancer to the bankroll

Tips from The Postman: Conditions,conditions, conditions. Horses for course. Indiana Grand shippers=YES, Finger Lakes shippers= Yes, after a race on the surface, Woodbine shippers=??? some like MVR dirt, some don't, Mountaineer shippers=NO, unless trained by Clouston or Cox. And there you have it. Easy, peasy at Mahoning Valley.

RR

[rrpic6]

'Capping for the big day, Wednesday. The Pick 6 looks hit-able on a relatively small budget. Possible 2 singles in the sequence. You do have to earn it though as 3 races have 12 entries, one each of 11, 10 and 8. Hint: the 1st leg has 8 horses with an overwhelming favorite, IMO. Fingers crossed we get that far...one day to survive!

RR

[rrpic6]

Tips from The Postman: Conditions,conditions, conditions. Finger Lakes shippers= Yes, after a race on the surface. And there you have it.

RR

Race 2 today. 2nd time Finger Lakes shipper dropping into lifetime conditions wins at 5-1. 2nd time Finger Lakes shipper runs 2nd at 20-1. Exacta pays $167.80. Bingo!

RR

[DeltaLover]

'Capping for the big day, Wednesday.

Are these races handicap-able at all? What are the conditions? The very few times that I have glanced your racing programs (I believe that by the time this track was called Beulah or something like that), I remember that it was full of very cheap horses and inconsistent that were impossible to handicap.

[rrpic6]

Are these races handicap-able at all? What are the conditions? The very few times that I have glanced your racing programs (I believe that by the time this track was called Beulah or something like that), I remember that it was full of very cheap horses and inconsistent that were impossible to handicap.

Since I handicap them every day for the local on site tip sheet, I'm used to the various conditions, trainers, jockeys, bias, etc. Ohio Bred lower level claiming are the hardest and most volatile to decipher. The best Trainers are Radosevich, Sullivan, Zielinski and Cowans. Olivio Iniro, Nabu Morales get hot and cold. Shane Myers, Robert Gorham and Tim Hamm are OK too. The best jockeys are Colon, J. Rodriguez and Pilares (Walter De La Cruz is on his way to Oaklawn). Bermudez can be fearless at times, Sarvis great on closers, Rivera, Rosendo, Feliciano, Houghton and Paucar (hurt now), all are solid. L. Quinones has improved here since last meet. The rest are dicey.

This is the 3rd year Mahoning Valley has run. Beulah horses show up in the PP's once in a blue moon. The fields have been large for most conditioned races. Good Luck in betting there.

RR

[rrpic6]

Carryover to the mandatory payout on Wednesday is over $62K. Over 26K bet into it today. I'm predicting another 150K gets bet into it tomorrow. Nice overall handle of 1.4 million today.

RR

[Vinman]

Regarding Mahoning Valley's desirability as a viable signal to play the ponies, I found Mountainman's comment #33 over at the Mountaineer 2017 topic rather interesting.

"I'm now backed by two separate whales and Mahoning is easy pickings"

You go Mark!

Vinman

[appistappis]

there was a horse in racing seven today that had me drooling at 10-1.....won easily.

all you guys who hate this place, stay away, aquaduct is easy......lol

[rrpic6]

Potential Tickets before scratches:

:5:
:1:,:4:,:8:,:9:,:12:
:1:,:2:,:3:,:9:,
:8:
:4:,:6:,:10:
:4:,:6:,:8:,:10:

$48.00

Add :2:,:5:,:7:,:8: in the 5th leg and its $112.00

Add :1:,:2:,:3:,:10:,:11: in the 4th leg for $672.00 Caveman Ticket
or use just :4:,:6:,:10: in the 5th leg and its $288.00

Good Luck!

RR

[Vinman]

Agreed that the :5: in leg 1 is the only horse you can single in the entire sequence. But If he bounces to the moon today off that huge win, 60-70% of all tix will hit the screen.

I don't think you can hit this thing for a $500 outlay even if the 5 wins as a single. Too many dropdowns throughout these races. Leave one out and that's the one who will beat you. I may play the Pick 4 instead. Late scratches could make a huge difference.

Vinman

[Vinman]

The problem with singling the :8: Hoarder in leg 4....first start at MVR....for a new trainer. But the real problem....dropping to 5K level off a win at 7.5K. Why lose the horse for 5000 if he can win for 7500? I know...the owner...who is now the trainer....is playing a game of chicken with us. On paper he's easily the best in the race. But as we all know, they don't run 'em on paper.

Vinman

[Vinman]

I would use the :11: and :2: in addition to the :8:

Vinman

[Vinman]

Scratches & Changes as of 9:50am

Race 5

:11: first time gelding

Race 7

:5: scratched

Race 9

:4: and :10: scratched

The scratch of the :10: in the finale is a major money saver, IMHO.

Vinman

[Vinman]

Okay, if I was being backed by Sheikh Mohammed, here's my "cave man" play for today's mandatory payout festivities, just for the fun of it.....

Race 4: :5:

Race 5: :12: / :8: / :4: / :1: / :9:

Race 6: :9: / :2: / :3: / :5: / :1: / :8: / :4:

Race 7: :8: / :11: / :2:

Race 8: :10: / :6: / :2: / :7: / :4: / :1:

Race 9: :8: / :6: / :12: / :11:

Total for this fantasy ticket comes to $504. Horses listed in order of preference.


Good luck!

Vinman

[bello]

The problem with singling the :8: Hoarder in leg 4....first start at MVR....for a new trainer. But the real problem....dropping to 5K level off a win at 7.5K. Why lose the horse for 5000 if he can win for 7500? I know...the owner...who is now the trainer....is playing a game of chicken with us. On paper he's easily the best in the race. But as we all know, they don't run 'em on paper.

Vinman

I agree #8 is a must use but there is another point of concern. He was actually sold to Gary Welsh after the last win. Likely the sale price was 5k or less.

As far as winning in 7,500 and dropping to 5k. The 7,500cl was NW 2 LT. Logical next class is 5,000 cl nw 3 LT.

Good Luck today

[Vinman]

My tiered 50 cent Pick 4 play on the last 4 races at MVR, using some horses that hit the cutting room floor on the above Fantasy pick 6 play....

Ticket 1: :2: :3: :9: / :2: :8: :11: / :2: :4: :6: :10: / :6: :8: :11: :12:

Ticket 2: :2: :3: :9: / :2: :8: :11: / :1: :7: / :6: :8: :11: :12:

Ticket 3: :2: :3: :9: / :1: :3: :6: :7: :10: :12: / :2: :4: :6: :10: / :6: :8: :11: :12:

Ticket 4: :1: :4: :5: :8: / :2: :8: :11: / :2: :4: :6: :10: / :6: :8: :11: :12:

Total cost $348

Vinman

[arw629]

there was a horse in racing seven today that had me drooling at 10-1.....won easily.

all you guys who hate this place, stay away, aquaduct is easy......lol

I had that one as well but not as much as I should have ...i was baffled by how cold she was on the board...she was much the best

[Knowclew]

Tips from The Postman: Conditions,conditions, conditions. Horses for course. Indiana Grand shippers=YES, Finger Lakes shippers= Yes, after a race on the surface, Woodbine shippers=??? some like MVR dirt, some don't, Mountaineer shippers=NO, unless trained by Clouston or Cox. And there you have it. Easy, peasy at Mahoning Valley.

RR

This is a great post. I have tried more than once to get a feel for
Ohio racing the past few years, and always feel lost.
Not necessarily a guarantee for success, but a nice guideline
to start with, and form some opinions from there.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

I can't resist a horizontal carryover, so took a little shot:

5/123/12349/8/3510/6812

Good luck everyone, hope a few of us hit it!

[SoCalCircuit]

Anyone still alive? I slipped in a small backup ticket with the 8 singled in R7 but we'll see...

[upthecreek]

Anyone still alive? I slipped in a small backup ticket with the 8 singled in R7 but we'll see...
Yea the clown onTVG went :5: & :6:

[Vinman]

Anyone happen to catch the amount they bet into the P6 today?

Vinman

[upthecreek]

Anyone happen to catch the amount they bet into the P6 today?

Vinman
I have TVG muted, didn't catch it Looked on Twitter didn't see anything

[sjk]

They said the pool is up to $306k.

[upthecreek]

They said the pool is up to $306k.
Thnx :ThmbUp:

[SoCalCircuit]

Anyone have access to the will pays to the 6 8? Not on BetAmerica...

[ReplayRandall]

With the 6 winning the last race....Pick-6 paid- $930.10

[sjk]

Congrats. $930.10

[SoCalCircuit]

Thanks. Unfortunately only about a $100 profit but I'll take it. Thanks for all the handicapping tips - my first time playing Mahoning.

[upthecreek]

Yea the clown onTVG went :5: & :6:






Kevin Grigsby (@kgrigyTVG) tweeted at 4:54 PM on Wed, Dec 28, 2016:
@ChristinaBlackr @ScottTVG here's proof. Nice job Scotty. @TVG https://t.co/Ah3KHdewso
(https://twitter.com/kgrigyTVG/status/814228070613688320?s=09)

[mountainman]

It was hardly a wide-closer's track, but I did think the rail was somewhat dead and speed had the worst of it. Not extreme, but subtle biases.

You wanted to race 2nd or 3rd while buffered out from the wood.

Tuff beat with the front-running 3-horse in that restricted str/alw that drew such a weak field.

[rrpic6]

It was hardly a wide-closer's track, but I did think the rail was somewhat dead and speed had the worst of it. Not extreme, but subtle biases.

You wanted to race 2nd or 3rd while buffered out from the wood.

Tuff beat with the front-running 3-horse in that restricted str/alw that drew such a weak field.

I put all my eggs in one basket in Race 4, the starter Allowance and 1st leg of the Pick 6. I thought for sure Clouston's #5 Za Woodman would stalk the pace and blow by easily. Terrible decision, as I spread too much later on. $930 was a true Christmas gift for the must give away Pick 6. A healthy mix of carryover money, caveman tickets spending over $1000 and unbelievable amount of straight .20 tickets and quick picks added up to the juicy payout. I ended up with 5 of 6 on my 3 tickets, all dead after leg 1.

Early in the meet, inside speed was very good. After the lingering snow and cold rains hit about 2 weeks ago the surface did indeed change. Moisture was still in the track, the result of thaw/freeze/thaw/freeze cycle. This could continue into the new year and meet. Previous meets were similar, as the rail became dead. Refer to my earlier post about conditions, trainers, jockeys, etc. The smart jocks will catch on quickly to any changing biases.

RR

[mountainman]

I put all my eggs in one basket in Race 4, the starter Allowance and 1st leg of the Pick 6. I thought for sure Clouston's #5 Za Woodman would stalk the pace and blow by easily. Terrible decision, as I spread too much later on. $930 was a true Christmas gift for the must give away Pick 6. A healthy mix of carryover money, caveman tickets spending over $1000 and unbelievable amount of straight .20 tickets and quick picks added up to the juicy payout. I ended up with 5 of 6 on my 3 tickets, all dead after leg 1.

Early in the meet, inside speed was very good. After the lingering snow and cold rains hit about 2 weeks ago the surface did indeed change. Moisture was still in the track, the result of thaw/freeze/thaw/freeze cycle. This could continue into the new year and meet. Previous meets were similar, as the rail became dead. Refer to my earlier post about conditions, trainers, jockeys, etc. The smart jocks will catch on quickly to any changing biases.

RR

Most of my notes-and I watch replays everyday- record the track as pro-rail or anti- wide for a near-two week period starting nov 30. Somewhat surprisingly, legitimate speed biases have been somewhat rare-even when wide finishers struggle. That's a big reason why I distinguish between pro-rail and anti-wide trends. Race-conditions, of course, are a staple of my handicapping, a natural offshoot of my day job and place of employment.

Look for more upsets if an anti-rail trend does take hold. That's a bias not conducive to cashing a high percentage of tickets. As far as potent barns, for me that's a function of value, and I always watch closely for emergent outfits flying under the radar.

I do not , by the way, have much faith in the ability of riders to discern and exploit a path bias. Bur given good value, I'm very willing to speculate on prospective trips.

The clocker there, a member of my officiating crew at mnr, did give me a heads-up that some cushion had been added prior to Wednesday's card, and that the rail would be deep.

Tx for the response, Ron, You're an exceptional handicapper, and I value your input.

[bello]

Most of my notes-and I watch replays everyday- record the track as pro-rail or anti- wide for a near-two week period starting nov 30. Somewhat surprisingly, legitimate speed biases have been somewhat rare-even when wide finishers struggle. That's a big reason why I distinguish between pro-rail and anti-wide trends. Race-conditions, of course, are a staple of my handicapping, a natural offshoot of my day job and place of employment.

Look for more upsets if an anti-rail trend does take hold. That's a bias not conducive to cashing a high percentage of tickets. As far as potent barns, for me that's a function of value, and I always watch closely for emergent outfits flying under the radar.

I do not , by the way, have much faith in the ability of riders to discern and exploit a path bias. Bur given good value, I'm very willing to speculate on prospective trips.

The clocker there, a member of my officiating crew at mnr, did give me a heads-up that some cushion had been added prior to Wednesday's card, and that the rail would be deep.

Tx for the response, Ron, You're an exceptional handicapper, and I value your input.
Great posts guys. Having a a great mountaineer meet I really want to like Mahoning and so far so good. The day of the cancellation and a coupe of days prior, anything off the rail had no shot. Evened out some the other day. I was a dumbass eaving the Woobine shipper off my ticket leg 2 for all the marbles. Followed up with a 2x3x3x2 P4 which paid pretty well. Keep the comments flowing guys. RRpic, your observations on horses to play or avoid are right on the money. Early in the meet may be the time to play here.

[rrpic6]

Was checking Twinspires Players Pools. They played $4,810 worth of tickets in the Pick 6. Hit twice. Winning tickets cost $1764 and $720. Their BIG ticket cost $2240. Knocked out in 1st leg (as was I) by singleing #5 Za Woodman. I don't feel so bad now, as the ticket I gave out on my tipsheet also singled #5 and had 5 of 6, but only cost $48.00. No sour grapes tho. As you may know, that was my gig back in the day.

RR

[Maximillion]

I dont mind slow horses and the cards here have been better than i expected... but i kinda get the impression the horses here are not only racing against each other but the racetrack itself....sort of like Parx.
The nature of the beast i guess this time of year,and some may like it that way(which I get)....just wondering if they could improve handle even more if things were a little different.(Perhaps not).

[mountainman]

Tuesday's track played slightly in favor of pace-types, but with one caveat: While wide closers had by far the worst of it, some runners finding seams were able to score from behind.

Mark the 11 horse from race #8 as extremely live next start. And the 3 horse from race #9 ran tons the best, but don't expect much price in the wake of that fast-closing second.

[rrpic6]

I dont mind slow horses and the cards here have been better than i expected... but i kinda get the impression the horses here are not only racing against each other but the racetrack itself....sort of like Parx.
The nature of the beast i guess this time of year,and some may like it that way(which I get)....just wondering if they could improve handle even more if things were a little different.(Perhaps not).

Handle has taken off during the Holidays, on site and thru ADW's. 1.4 million was a record for an 8 race card Monday. 1.6 million Tuesday was aided by Parx and Turf Paradise cancelling mid-card. Hopefully Mountainman and myself can continue to supply some nuggets here. Lots of "smart" money being bet somewhere, as horses that are pounded down far below the ML set by John McGary (one of the best in the business IMO) seem to win quite often and easily lately. Ex. Race 1 on Tuesday. #2 Tia Gego ML 6-1. Wins in hand at 3-5. A newly turned 3 year old filly beating older. My 2nd choice on tipsheet BTW, but unbettable when gates opened.

RR

[mountainman]

Handle has taken off during the Holidays, on site and thru ADW's. 1.4 million was a record for an 8 race card Monday. 1.6 million Tuesday was aided by Parx and Turf Paradise cancelling mid-card. Hopefully Mountainman and myself can continue to supply some nuggets here. Lots of "smart" money being bet somewhere, as horses that are pounded down far below the ML set by John McGary (one of the best in the business IMO) seem to win quite often and easily lately. Ex. Race 1 on Tuesday. #2 Tia Gego ML 6-1. Wins in hand at 3-5. A newly turned 3 year old filly beating older. My 2nd choice on tipsheet BTW, but unbettable when gates opened.

RR

Spot on, pal. Two-dollar locals aren't pumping 1.4 mil thru the windows there, and with increased handle has come some well-informed money.

Tia Gego was a horse I made a point of arriving in time to bet, but the low odds were both unexpected and an absolute deal breaker. Having raced very alertly in shorter sprints, Tia Gego figured to shake loose in a 6-furlong race devoid of speed, and had dueled bravely with a much better filly in her recent. Ominously, these nuances were seized upon by a wagering public that seems less stupid by the minute.

Again today, I thought wide trips were at a significant disadvantage.

[Vinman]

With a high temp of 19 forecast at Mahoning Valley, what are the chances they'll run Saturday? Turfway cancelled tonight due to cold.

Vinman

[rrpic6]

With a high temp of 19 forecast at Mahoning Valley, what are the chances they'll run Saturday? Turfway cancelled tonight due to cold.

Vinman

No word yet if MVR will cancel today as of 8:55 AM. Tractors wore working throughout the night. If they do run, Sambucca Steve, #10 in race 6 deserves some attention at ML 6-1. His 2 wins in the Fall '16 meet came on nearly frozen surfaces. He owned the track record at 6 furlongs set on 2-28-15, also on a frozen surface, until it was broken last January on a frozen track, of course.

RR

[Vinman]

No word yet if MVR will cancel today as of 8:55 AM. Tractors wore working throughout the night. If they do run, Sambucca Steve, #10 in race 6 deserves some attention at ML 6-1. His 2 wins in the Fall '16 meet came on nearly frozen surfaces. He owned the track record at 6 furlongs set on 2-28-15, also on a frozen surface, until it was broken last January on a frozen track, of course.

RR

Sambucca Steve easily best on my numbers. Accuweather has Youngstown at a "balmy" 9 degrees, with a projected hight of 17. Fingers crossed. Do they ever run in this temp range?

Vinman

[Vinman]

Mahoning Valley scratches posted on Equibase 10 minutes ago.

Vinman

[Vinman]

Tvg reports cancellation of Aqueduct card today.....this will help betting handle at MVR.

Vinman

[mountainman]

Neither outright front-runners, nor inside trips had any potent advantage today on a very quick surface that ,again, put closers at a big disadvantage.

My handicapping was uninspired and had me in the hole until $13.40 on a horse I loved in the finale pushed things into the black. It was one of the largest bets I've made on a Mahoning race and was based largely on the winner having bid 3-wide on a rail-biased track last start. Very gratifying for my replay watching and bias-notes to pay off.

Just an off-cuff observation..but reasonably fresh horses more and more have the edge on tired runners now nearing the end of long wrap-around campaigns. Be careful, however, to not confuse true freshness that stems from stable intent with repeated interruptions and aborted comebacks that indicate a runner just cant hold up to racing.

I would also favor horses started, say, 12 or fewer times last season to those raced into the ground with no respite. These concerns are particularly important during the winter season.

[bello]

Why did they switch the 6 furlong races to 5/1-2 furlongs and still run the distance races?

[rrpic6]

Why did they switch the 6 furlong races to 5/1-2 furlongs and still run the distance races?

The area by the 6 furlong chute often becomes frozen. The tractors that constantly circle the oval almost non-stop daily don't hit that area. Also the sun rarely hits that section, even when it becomes warm enough to help thaw the ground. A few races that took place in the past under similar conditions were affected as some horses slipped badly coming out of the gate.

RR

[cj]

The area by the 6 furlong chute often becomes frozen. The tractors that constantly circle the oval almost non-stop daily don't hit that area. Also the sun rarely hits that section, even when it becomes warm enough to help thaw the ground. A few races that took place in the past under similar conditions were affected as some horses slipped badly coming out of the gate.

RR

I remember something similar used to happen at Charles Town, the 4.5f races would become 4f races.

[EMD4ME]

Neither outright front-runners, nor inside trips had any potent advantage today on a very quick surface that ,again, put closers at a big disadvantage.

My handicapping was uninspired and had me in the hole until $13.40 on a horse I loved in the finale pushed things into the black. It was one of the largest bets I've made on a Mahoning race and was based largely on the winner having bid 3-wide on a rail-biased track last start. Very gratifying for my replay watching and bias-notes to pay off.

Just an off-cuff observation..but reasonably fresh horses more and more have the edge on tired runners now nearing the end of long wrap-around campaigns. Be careful, however, to not confuse true freshness that stems from stable intent with repeated interruptions and aborted comebacks that indicate a runner just cant hold up to racing.

I would also favor horses started, say, 12 or fewer times last season to those raced into the ground with no respite. These concerns are particularly important during the winter season.


LOVE IT! Great job Mountainman! :ThmbUp:

[rrpic6]

Mark the 11 horse from race #8 as extremely live next start.

Favorite Uncle is entered today. #1 in Race7, ML 8-1 blinkers go back on, jock switch to Quinones. Full field of 12 so price should still be decent. Think he goes off between 7/2 and 6-1.

RR

[Vinman]

Favorite Uncle is entered today. #1 in Race7, ML 8-1 blinkers go back on, jock switch to Quinones. Full field of 12 so price should still be decent. Think he goes off between 7/2 and 6-1.

RR

Ron......Could you put in a request with Mahoning management for some form of advance notification to the betting public as to how many live Pick 6 tickets there are with each runner going into the last race? Yesterday there was the $156.80 winner in leg 2 followed by the 13-1 and 8-1 winners booted home by Jaime Rodriguez. When the 6/5 fave won the 7th, I had a sinking feeling that the pool was going to be scooped by a lone winner if the 5 or 7 won the finale. Fortunately that wasn't the case with the victorious 10 horse at 7/2. I'm sure any ticketholders alive with the 5 or 7 and others would have loved to know if they were alive for the payoff du jour or the whole jackpot pool.

ideally, Mahoning could simply add another will pay screen for the Pick 6 prior to the last race in the same format as they now use for the DD, Pick 3 & Pick 4. If that isn't workable, I can't imagine why announcer, John McGarry can't be provided this info by mutuels to pass on to the betting public before the last race.

It should also be noted that it is now possible to access the Pick 6 will pays via BRIS Supertote for a number if tracks, but this is not the case wth MVR.

It would have been fun to hear how many live tix there were both before and after the $156.80 bomb was dropped yesterday.

"Good luck, we're all counting on you"


Vinman

[rrpic6]

http://www.paulickreport.com/news/ray-s-paddock/the-bad-beat-of-a-lifetime-488000-jackpot-disappears/

This is as good a reason as any. The tote system was posting will pays back in November, but they were not accurate. Possibly due to the 20cent increments.

RR

[MONEY]

HI, rrpic6
Just one question,
I can get stats for all American tracks except Mahoning Valley on Equibase's StatsMaster™. Why?

Here is a link to the page for Aqueduct, in case you've never heard of StatsMaster™.
http://bit.ly/2j6OUua

[lamboguy]

Favorite Uncle is entered today. #1 in Race7, ML 8-1 blinkers go back on, jock switch to Quinones. Full field of 12 so price should still be decent. Think he goes off between 7/2 and 6-1.

RRthe way the inside is today so far, FAVORITE UNCLE looks like a lay down!

[Vinman]

I didn't want to be a "killjoy" earlier re Favorite Uncle's chances, but from his "way off the pace" last running line, it seemed like he was going to have a tough time from the rail today, blinkers or not.

I've pretty much sworn off making win bets on horses breaking from the rail in sprints. I've learned this lesson at Monmouth time and again. When I make an exception, it's like getting hit in the head with a hammer...lol. That said, "Uncle" made it close at the wire today.

I decided to lay in the weeds, or in this case, the mud, until the finale for my lone bet of the day....$60 to win on the victorious She's A Gem. 9/5 with a minute to post....$4.00 to win. Beats a poke in the eye. :)

Vinman

[rrpic6]

HI, rrpic6
Just one question,
I can get stats for all American tracks except Mahoning Valley on Equibase's StatsMaster™. Why?

Here is a link to the page for Aqueduct, in case you've never heard of StatsMaster™.
http://bit.ly/2j6OUua

Sorry, not sure why that is. You'll have to contact Equibase.

RR

[mountainman]

I didn't want to be a "killjoy" earlier re Favorite Uncle's chances, but from his "way off the pace" last running line, it seemed like he was going to have a tough time from the rail today, blinkers or not.

I've pretty much sworn off making win bets on horses breaking from the rail in sprints. I've learned this lesson at Monmouth time and again. When I make an exception, it's like getting hit in the head with a hammer...lol. That said, "Uncle" made it close at the wire today.

I decided to lay in the weeds, or in this case, the mud, until the finale for my lone bet of the day....$60 to win on the victorious She's A Gem. 9/5 with a minute to post....$4.00 to win. Beats a poke in the eye. :)

Vinman

Even with blinks, Fave Unc was always going to drop out of it. And the horse did hit a seam and trip out pretty well. The problem was that closers had no chance today, and deep closers should have stayed in the barn.

And the winner was the LAST horse, given his outfit and route history, that you wanted to see on the lead.

Hello 6/5 when Favorite Uncle runs back.

[mountainman]

Ron......Could you put in a request with Mahoning management for some form of advance notification to the betting public as to how many live Pick 6 tickets there are with each runner going into the last race? Yesterday there was the $156.80 winner in leg 2 followed by the 13-1 and 8-1 winners booted home by Jaime Rodriguez. When the 6/5 fave won the 7th, I had a sinking feeling that the pool was going to be scooped by a lone winner if the 5 or 7 won the finale. Fortunately that wasn't the case with the victorious 10 horse at 7/2. I'm sure any ticketholders alive with the 5 or 7 and others would have loved to know if they were alive for the payoff du jour or the whole jackpot pool.

ideally, Mahoning could simply add another will pay screen for the Pick 6 prior to the last race in the same format as they now use for the DD, Pick 3 & Pick 4. If that isn't workable, I can't imagine why announcer, John McGarry can't be provided this info by mutuels to pass on to the betting public before the last race.

It should also be noted that it is now possible to access the Pick 6 will pays via BRIS Supertote for a number if tracks, but this is not the case wth MVR.

It would have been fun to hear how many live tix there were both before and after the $156.80 bomb was dropped yesterday.

"Good luck, we're all counting on you"


Vinman

I'd gladly settle for sports bar TV's to not be tuned to soap operas, and for the three downstairs monitors closest to my table to not ALL be tuned to Monticello. Jesus CHRIST..is that too much to freakin' ask? For Mahoning to be on a few of the FIFTY tvs along the back wall??????? Who's in charge there?????????

[arw629]

Ron......Could you put in a request with Mahoning management for some form of advance notification to the betting public as to how many live Pick 6 tickets there are with each runner going into the last race? Yesterday there was the $156.80 winner in leg 2 followed by the 13-1 and 8-1 winners booted home by Jaime Rodriguez. When the 6/5 fave won the 7th, I had a sinking feeling that the pool was going to be scooped by a lone winner if the 5 or 7 won the finale. Fortunately that wasn't the case with the victorious 10 horse at 7/2. I'm sure any ticketholders alive with the 5 or 7 and others would have loved to know if they were alive for the payoff du jour or the whole jackpot pool.

ideally, Mahoning could simply add another will pay screen for the Pick 6 prior to the last race in the same format as they now use for the DD, Pick 3 & Pick 4. If that isn't workable, I can't imagine why announcer, John McGarry can't be provided this info by mutuels to pass on to the betting public before the last race.

It should also be noted that it is now possible to access the Pick 6 will pays via BRIS Supertote for a number if tracks, but this is not the case wth MVR.

It would have been fun to hear how many live tix there were both before and after the $156.80 bomb was dropped yesterday.

"Good luck, we're all counting on you"


Vinman

A little off topic but I had the pick 3 that ended with the 156 dollar winner and it only paid 147 for 50 cents...my ticket was 10 bucjs...went 3,5 with the entry with all....2-1 over 7-5 over 70-1. ...the last leg looked like anything could happen and wish I woukd have kept hitting repeat bet but based on the payout it feels like a lot of ppl wheeled that race....

[Vinman]

I'd gladly settle for sports bar TV's to not be tuned to soap operas, and for the three downstairs monitors closest to my table to not ALL be tuned to Monticello. Jesus CHRIST..is that too much to freakin' ask? For Mahoning to be on a few of the FIFTY tvs along the back wall??????? Who's in charge there?????????

Mountainman....where is this parimutuel den of iniquity located? Regardless, I'd say you have a bit of pull on the channel selection...lol.

[mountainman]

Just amazing that nearest TWENTY (CONTIGUOUS) monitors (to where pals and I sit) remain stubbornly tuned to ANYTHIING but Mahoning. Whether an intentional policy to discourage play on local races, or some unfathomable oversight, it's inexcusable. In fact, it's THE single most RIDICULOUS THING I'VE EVER SEEN AT A RACETRACK.

[johnhannibalsmith]

...In fact, it's THE single most RIDICULOUS THING I'VE EVER SEEN AT A RACETRACK.

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/TnpxMHOAo1o/hqdefault.jpg

[Bennie]

Is that the Pimlico race from years back where the idiot came from the infield and tried to punch the horse?

[mountainman]

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/TnpxMHOAo1o/hqdefault.jpg

As the annoying would-be coach said in Hoosiers: "There are two kinds of crazy. One kind strips naked and howls at the moon. The other does it in my front yard."

Love old-school Gene Hackman, btw. "Pass it OFF four times before anybody shoots."

[johnhannibalsmith]

...One kind strips naked and howls at the moon. The other does it in my front yard...

Oh I wasn't submitting evidence in the form of rebuttal. Rather, I was helping to put an exclamation point on your statement. :lol:

[johnhannibalsmith]

Is that the Pimlico race from years back where the idiot came from the infield and tried to punch the horse?

Yessir, poor old Artax and Chop Chop.

[mountainman]

Oh I wasn't submitting evidence in the form of rebuttal. Rather, I was helping to put an exclamation point on your statement. :lol:

lol..I simply enjoy working movie quotes into every conversation. In real life I do it all day. Usually, they are tenuously related (at best) to the point I'm trying to make. But I don't care. Just as long as I sound cool.

And I'd never take offense at your considerable wit, sir. You know that.

[mountainman]

Rejoiced today at sight of nearby monitor tuned to Mahoning. If it stays on local station, there's a good chance I'll reach out more to sponsors.

[lamboguy]

Rejoiced today at sight of nearby monitor tuned to Mahoning. If it stays on local station, there's a good chance I'll reach out more to sponsors.

Not certain that Mahoning even WANTS increased handle. Let's just say my jury is out on that.last wednesday they had $50k win pools. today they were around $20k.

uncle lou is starting to heat up and should win another one on monday there.

[mountainman]

last wednesday they had $50k win pools. today they were around $20k.

uncle lou is starting to heat up and should win another one on monday there.

Bet 5 horses today and 4 of them won. Notes on bias, field strength and race-flow are paying off.

[lamboguy]

Bet 5 horses today and 4 of them won. Notes on bias, field strength and race-flow are paying off.
glad to hear it!

get ready for monday now

[Vinman]

Bet 5 horses today and 4 of them won. Notes on bias, field strength and race-flow are paying off.

Had a nice win bet on Grad Bash in the 5th today, at a generous $10.60 to boot! I'm assuming he was one of your 4 winners.

Interesting that the P6 pool was scooped today for the second time this week.

Vinman

[mountainman]

Had a nice win bet on Grad Bash in the 5th today, at a generous $10.60 to boot! I'm assuming he was one of your 4 winners.

Interesting that the P6 pool was scooped today for the second time this week.

Vinman

Bingo , vin. Troubled trip three-back..followed by career number.. then predictable regression at unsuitably long distance. Also felt element of early zip buried deep on horse's form might well resurface given how hot Gorham has been. Plus, the favorite had a perfect trip last start in a race that's proving unproductive.

Also hit 8th race winner (msw). Liked her debut, breeding, barn, and subsequent workout, while the prohibitive chalk up from GP had red-flags on form and paraded in new front wraps.

Apologies..make me 3 of 4 (not 4 of 5) on day. My other winner was No Holdem Poker in race 3. He had skipped a condition recently to set the pace and falter on a track that was killing speed.

[Vinman]

Bingo , vin. Troubled trip three-back..followed by career number.. then predictable regression at unsuitably long distance. Also felt element of early zip buried deep on horse's form might well resurface given how hot Gorham has been. Plus, the favorite had a perfect trip last start in a race that's proving unproductive.

Also hit 8th race winner (msw). Liked her debut, breeding, barn, and subsequent workout, while the prohibitive chalk up from GP had red-flags on form and paraded in new front wraps.

Apologies..make me 3 of 4 (not 4 of 5) on day. My other winner was No Holdem Poker in race 3. He had skipped a condition recently to set the pace and falter on a track that was killing speed.

Interesting observation on the GP shipper's new front wraps. He sure loomed huge on the turn and I'm waiting for him to open up by a pole to collect my $10 DD payoff. The bridgejumpers sure dodged a bullet on that one.

Vinman

[mountainman]

Interesting observation on the GP shipper's new front wraps. He sure loomed huge on the turn and I'm waiting for him to open up by a pole to collect my $10 DD payoff. The bridgejumpers sure dodged a bullet on that one.

Vinman

I didn't like her losing as fave last two starts at the bigs. It tied in with the new fronts. And Doug Cowans, as great as he's been over the last decade, seems decidedly more human these days.

Where are you from, pal? What's your line of work?

If this thread were to stir more interest in Mahoning, I would probably post my bias notes as a service to fellow board members. But I don't get the feeling that Austintown is high priority to players here on PA.

[Vinman]

I just checked the last race WPS pools, which are still up on BRIS Supertote. There was $106,523 bet to show on Coldgreydawn out of a total show pool of $113,598. Yikes.

Would the bettor(s) have collected $2.20 to show on him at the Mountain? Would MNR or in this case, MVR, send a bill to the sending track/ADW for any loss to the track via the minus pool?

Vinman

[mountainman]

Yes, 2.20. And the adw/ simulcast outlet through which the bet is placed stands responsible for minus pools. That's one reason Mnr does not encourage me to recommend specific bridge jumps. Even though it ostensibly boosts our handle.

[lamboguy]

everyone makes a big deal about front wraps the first time because horses tend to underperform with them. i always note them and play the horse second time wraps.. you get a better price and the horse has experience with them on now.

[mountainman]

everyone makes a big deal about front wraps the first time because horses tend to underperform with them. i always note them and play the horse second time wraps.. you get a better price and the horse has experience with them on now.

To me...it's not what the wraps DO, it's what they imply about the horse. Especially a horse with other red flags.

[rrpic6]

Apologies..make me 3 of 4 (not 4 of 5) on day. My other winner was No Holdem Poker in race 3. He had skipped a condition recently to set the pace and falter on a track that was killing speed.

I'll take an educated guess that the only bet you missed on was #8 Jacopotamus in Race 7. He was coming out of a race on Dec. 20 where he stumbled from Post #11. Wide posts didn't fare well that day. He got slammed at the start Saturday and had no chance again. BTW, I had 4-8 boxed till the cows came home.

http://www.equibase.com/premium/chartEmb.cfm?track=MVR&raceDate=01/21/2017&cy=USA&rn=7

RR

[mountainman]

I'll take an educated guess that the only bet you missed on was #8 Jacopotamus in Race 7. He was coming out of a race on Dec. 20 where he stumbled from Post #11. Wide posts didn't fare well that day. He got slammed at the start Saturday and had no chance again. BTW, I had 4-8 boxed till the cows came home.

http://www.equibase.com/premium/chartEmb.cfm?track=MVR&raceDate=01/21/2017&cy=USA&rn=7

RR

Liked him, too..partly because Academic Affair is soooo phony. We think somewhat alike, Ron. Which doesn't bode well for you..lol.

McGary must have stomach flu? I had it 5 weeks ago, and for 44 hours (I counted them) I wanted to die.

[rrpic6]

Liked him, too..partly because Academic Affair is soooo phony. We think somewhat alike, Ron. Which doesn't bode well for you..lol.

McGary must have stomach flu? I had it 5 weeks ago, and for 44 hours (I counted them) I wanted to die.

John (McGary) was very ill when I spoke to him Wednesday night. I was under the weather myself all week with a bad cold. Lots of people around MVR have been ill these past 2 weeks. Matt Hook did a fine job filling in for John.

RR

[mountainman]

John (McGary) was very ill when I spoke to him Wednesday night. I was under the weather myself all week with a bad cold. Lots of people around MVR have been ill these past 2 weeks. Matt Hook did a fine job filling in for John.

RR

Sorry you were sick. ron. But as to other Mahoning employees, it would be difficult to tell, since behind those forced smiles they look like they are being held hostage. I half expect one of the tellers to blink out "help me" in morse code. It's creepy. Flat out creepy.

And the security guys in those yellow coats don't BUDGE when they are blocking your path. Clearly, they see their role as more important than that of patron. It's a very tense place.

I'm sure not holding my breath until a conga line forms...

btw..totally agree about hook's announcing. And he's quite the handicapper and all around wise guy, as well.

And fwiw...I did have the footing pro-rail on dec 20.

[EMD4ME]

Sorry you were sick. ron. But as to other Mahoning employees, it would be difficult to tell, since behind those forced smiles they look like they are being held hostage. I half expect one of the tellers to blink out "help me" in morse code. It's creepy. Flat out creepy.

And the security guys in those yellow coats don't BUDGE when they are blocking your path. Clearly, they see their role as more important than that of patron. It's a very tense place.


OMG :lol: you've actually motivated me to want to take a drive out there to check this out ! Blink out HELP ME in Morse code! I LOVE it! :lol: :lol:

[Vinman]

Today's 8th at MVR marks the return of Za Woodman, who singlehandedly took out perhaps more than half of the 20 cent P6 jackpot tix with a 4th place finish at 6/5 on mandatory payout day, 12/28. His chances today are enhanced by the scratch of Boss Man Bob, who won that 12/28 race at 3-1 to kick off that P6. But before sending it in on the Woodman, notice the 95 BRIS fig for Shirota one race back....his last start on dirt. Good chance Shirota didn't care for the poly at Turfway last out, the class bump to 8000/7000 or both. Should be an interesting contest.

Vinman

[mountainman]

As an official I sympathize with their situation in the racing office, but from a player's perspective, Mahoning's cards have gone from disappointing to EXTREMELY disappointing.

Four mdn/ clmng races today. From a mere EIGHT RACE PROGRAM. Boys, that don't cut it. And I'm growing weary of watching four fields per day made up of the same slow ohio- breds running against each other. That's not racing; it's attrition.

To be honest, with so many restricted races , and a large portion of their season conducted during the brunt of north-eastern ohio winters, I'm not optimistic that the quality of product there can ever improve appreciably. Regardless of potentially escalating slot-infusions.

[CincyHorseplayer]

As an official I sympathize with their situation in the racing office, but from a player's perspective, Mahoning's cards have gone from disappointing to EXTREMELY disappointing.

Four mdn/ clmng races today. From a mere EIGHT RACE PROGRAM. Boys, that don't cut it. And I'm growing weary of watching four fields per day made up of the same slow ohio- breds running against each other. That's not racing; it's attrition.

To be honest, with so many restricted races , and a large portion of their season conducted during the brunt of north-eastern ohio winters, I'm not optimistic that the quality of product there can ever improve appreciably. Regardless of potentially escalating slot-infusions.

I have never cared for winter racing up here. But will look at cards on days where the weather is clear and sunny. While there have been many dismal races and days I have seen some decent cards with fuller fields and have gotten some solid prices at Mahoning. Being from Ohio I've always tried to show some love to my circuit and know it well. Was broken hearted when Beulah closed as I had a lot of memorable days betting their races. Card today looks pretty blah though. The 6 horse field is a killer. I think we all pass probably 80% of those races. But IMO that is most Midwest tracks. Turfway was great til about mid January. Then prices and field sizes plummeted. After a few years of being disenchanted with my hometown and state circuit I attempted a specializing approach. That was even worse! So I have opened my game back up and am embracing all tracks and surfaces again. We have 11 months of live racing in this city. It can be tough at times especially in the winter but I am having a romance with it all again! Fun!

[mountainman]

I have never cared for winter racing up here. But will look at cards on days where the weather is clear and sunny. While there have been many dismal races and days I have seen some decent cards with fuller fields and have gotten some solid prices at Mahoning. Being from Ohio I've always tried to show some love to my circuit and know it well. Was broken hearted when Beulah closed as I had a lot of memorable days betting their races. Card today looks pretty blah though. The 6 horse field is a killer. I think we all pass probably 80% of those races. But IMO that is most Midwest tracks. Turfway was great til about mid January. Then prices and field sizes plummeted. After a few years of being disenchanted with my hometown and state circuit I attempted a specializing approach. That was even worse! So I have opened my game back up and am embracing all tracks and surfaces again. We have 11 months of live racing in this city. It can be tough at times especially in the winter but I am having a romance with it all again! Fun!

tx for responding, dude. I've made good money playing Mahoning and feel very comfortable with horses at that level. In fact, it's the only track I follow , and I put considerable time into it. But their progress has stalled out-even regressed, and I'm starting to realize that due to certain obstacles they face, racing in Austintown will always have a hard ceiling. And not a high one.

[CincyHorseplayer]

tx for responding, dude. I've made good money playing Mahoning and feel very comfortable with horses at that level. In fact, it's the only track I follow , and I put considerable time into it. But their progress has stalled out-even regressed, and I'm starting to realize that due to certain obstacles they face, racing in Austintown will always have a hard ceiling. And not a high one.

The fall meet is usually solid(at least it was at Beu) and when the weather warms up racing is usually better. But that's anywhere. What do you suspect will be more difficult in Austintown vs Grove City? Just curious.

BTW I was thinking about you the other day! I went through and reorganized and threw out old forms and folders and folders worth of info. In my notebooks box I had some articles in an envelope. It was the articles you sent me! One from Horseplayer magazine and an article by Mark Patterson. Can't remember if I ever thank you for mailing them to me. Thanks!

[mountainman]

The fall meet is usually solid(at least it was at Beu) and when the weather warms up racing is usually better. But that's anywhere. What do you suspect will be more difficult in Austintown vs Grove City? Just curious.

BTW I was thinking about you the other day! I went through and reorganized and threw out old forms and folders and folders worth of info. In my notebooks box I had some articles in an envelope. It was the articles you sent me! One from Horseplayer magazine and an article by Mark Patterson. Can't remember if I ever thank you for mailing them to me. Thanks!

TX, pal. Well...for one thing, Beu with its split meet somewhat avoided the worst of winter. Also, with the infusuion of slots, wasn't Mahoning supposed to be Beu on steroids??

Being occupied during fall and spring at Mnr, I can't speak to the warmer parts of Mahoning's season. But the high number of restricted races there will always deter desirable outfits from requesting stalls or competing.

And call me a cynic, but I'm far from convinced that the parent company even WANTS live racing there to succeed.

You do remember that they had drawn up some sort of "mini me" facility which the state nixed and then mandated they construct a genuine big-boy barn area and grandstand??????

[CincyHorseplayer]

TX, pal. Well...for one thing, Beu with its split meet somewhat avoided the worst of winter. Also, with the infusuion of slots, wasn't Mahoning supposed to be Beu on steroids??

Being occupied during fall and spring at Mnr, I can't speak to the warmer parts of Mahoning's season. But the high number of restricted races there will always deter desirable outfits from requesting stalls or competing.

And call me a cynic, but I'm far from convinced that the parent company even WANTS live racing there to succeed.

You do remember that they had drawn up some sort of "mini me" facility which the state nixed and then mandated they construct a genuine big-boy barn area and grandstand??????

The restricted races is an Ohio plague. I have sent letters to the powers that be on this to no avail. Meets cannot get better with most races catering to the worst horses that race. Like you said it attracts zero good barns. Open claimers and starter allowances are non existent.

As far as the rest of what you speak, I don't want to go down that road! The way the facility down here was constructed was geared to be as uncomfortable and worthless as possible. To fail.

[Vinman]

As an official I sympathize with their situation in the racing office, but from a player's perspective, Mahoning's cards have gone from disappointing to EXTREMELY disappointing.

Four mdn/ clmng races today. From a mere EIGHT RACE PROGRAM. Boys, that don't cut it. And I'm growing weary of watching four fields per day made up of the same slow ohio- breds running against each other. That's not racing; it's attrition.

To be honest, with so many restricted races , and a large portion of their season conducted during the brunt of north-eastern ohio winters, I'm not optimistic that the quality of product there can ever improve appreciably. Regardless of potentially escalating slot-infusions.

I've been focusing on MVR exclusively over that past few months.....primarily because of their 20 cent Pick 6. I like not having to deal with full field turf races a la Gulfstream. Along the lines of your comments about the quality & field sizes at MVR, I may switch over to Laurel, which has a much higher quality product as well as the 20 cent p6.

Any chance a 20 cent pick 6 could happen at Mountaineer in 2017? I'm looking for an evening track to implement this wager. Hopefully MNR or Evangeline will do it.

Vinman

[tanner12oz]

The on track "grandstand" at mvr is kinda laughable. Maybe my memory is off but I think there's like 20 seats. Place was very very vanilla
needed to add some color, decor or something..looks kinda like they have wedding receptions there on non racing days. I haven't been up since they opened though so maybe its better now. Been meaning to shoot back up on a Saturday.

[rrpic6]

Every racing venue has days where their cards are not totally palatable. Gulfstream carded SIX Maiden races this past Sunday. Mahoning Valley has already run 23 cards with 9 races in the current meet. Only 3 9 race cards have been run since the start of 2017. Still this is a very positive stat, as MVR only had intentions of scheduling 8 race cards EVERYDAY.

The best days to wager on MVR are Mondays and Tuesdays, as the handle has routinely passed $1,000,000 daily. Today's card has only 1 maiden race. The average horses entered per race today is 8.9.

The grandstand has approximately 100 theater style seats, not 20.

RR

[mountainman]

I expected better this season. I should have been more cognizant of the big obstacles they face. That track had two strikes against it before even opening. I'll continue to play there, because the bettors are not real sharp, and Mahoning has been a boon for me. But the cards have been a letdown. And I'm straining to stay focused and interested.

As an experienced official, I see lots of signs that the ceiling is low and the needle not pointed upward. But out of professional courtesy, I'll restrict my critique to that of a bettor.

I like and respect Ron, John (the announcer), and Tim the trackman.

[mountainman]

Mahoning's real competition is Tdn. I'm sure they understand that. But Cleveland holds most of the cards.

[mountainman]

Wall to wall 2L claimers yesterday. Three straight mdn races to start today's card, and the "feature" seems to be a cheap conditioned clmr for ohio breds.

Lousy product. Extremely disappointing season at Mahoning. Live invaders scarce as the cards take on a worn, familiar tone.

If Mahoning has ANY good horses, where ARE THEY?????????????????????????

[Vinman]

Wall to wall 2L claimers yesterday. Three straight mdn races to start today's card, and the "feature" seems to be a cheap conditioned clmr for ohio breds.

Lousy product. Extremely disappointing season at Mahoning. Live invaders scarce as the cards take on a worn, familiar tone.

If Mahoning has ANY good horses, where ARE THEY?????????????????????????

On the flip side, if the results continue to be as "ho hum" as how the races look on paper, the P6 jackpot keeps on building. Having said that, we know it's gonna get hit soon, as Laurel's was last Sunday.

Vinman

[rrpic6]

Despite some lackluster fields, Mahoning Valley is having a stellar meet. Purses will be raised for the 2nd time this year as of Saturday.
https://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/220101/mahoning-valley-plans-another-purse-increase

Handle on the card Mountainman mentions on Wednesday was 1.3 million including 27K wagered into the pick 6. The horse population is obviously decreasing as we see short fields everywhere. Today's average horse per race at select tracks are as follows: Oaklawn 8.55-Turfway 8.22- Gulfstream 7.9-Santa Anita 7.87. Where do you think MVR will rank as far as number of horses per race on Saturday???

If you said more than all you are correct! Mahoning Valley-8.85.

Some man's trash is another one's treasure.

RR

[mountainman]

I would not confuse a few cherry-picked handles with having a good meet. Or compare field size with classy venues like Oaklawn and Gulfstream.

So the slots are well-feeding the purses. To me, that's just a further indictment of Mahoning's low-quality product. Abysmal, just abysmal.

Mahoning is doomed to forever be in Thistledown's shadow. And its ceiling is hard and low. For lots of reasons.

No desire to argue, Ron. I understand you defending your place of employment. I'd do the same. And I want to see Mahoning prosper. I've invested tons of time into learning it's nuances, trainers and horseflesh.

But we do disagree about the place's product and future. And there are conspicuous signs there that a low priority is placed on racing.

[mountainman]

And as an experienced racing official, I see omens there that you would not notice or process. And some are less than positive.

[rrpic6]

Mark, I do understand the strange bed fellows that make the Racino marriage one of necessity not love. The increased purses do make up for some of the negative aspects of this un-holy union. MVR can continue to card low level races with large fields because of it. Look at Turfway, Hawthorne, Turf Paradise and Sam Houston. Their purses for similar type races are less than MVR's. Hawthorne does have some full fields carded as their meet opens. Just like MVR, their field size will decrease quickly until their turf course opens. I'm sure the same will happen with the upcoming season at Mountaineer. Bad horse races are better than no horse races.


RR

[mountainman]

Mark, I do understand the strange bed fellows that make the Racino marriage one of necessity not love. The increased purses do make up for some of the negative aspects of this un-holy union. MVR can continue to card low level races with large fields because of it. Look at Turfway, Hawthorne, Turf Paradise and Sam Houston. Their purses for similar type races are less than MVR's. Hawthorne does have some full fields carded as their meet opens. Just like MVR, their field size will decrease quickly until their turf course opens. I'm sure the same will happen with the upcoming season at Mountaineer. Bad horse races are better than no horse races.


RR

How is your play? I took some brutal beats last week at long odds. That surface often changes a bit (usually when dry) over the course of an afternoon. And that can make things difficult.

[mountainman]

Mark, I do understand the strange bed fellows that make the Racino marriage one of necessity not love. The increased purses do make up for some of the negative aspects of this un-holy union. MVR can continue to card low level races with large fields because of it. Look at Turfway, Hawthorne, Turf Paradise and Sam Houston. Their purses for similar type races are less than MVR's. Hawthorne does have some full fields carded as their meet opens. Just like MVR, their field size will decrease quickly until their turf course opens. I'm sure the same will happen with the upcoming season at Mountaineer. Bad horse races are better than no horse races.


RR

We won't waste much time in bringing turf into play. It's what we have. And we know it.

[rrpic6]

How is your play? I took some brutal beats last week at long odds. That surface often changes a bit (usually when dry) over the course of an afternoon. And that can make things difficult.

Ditto with the brutal beats. I had 5 of the last 6 winners listed as my top pick on the tipsheet yet still didn't hit the pick 6 Tuesday as I singled in the leg where my 2nd choice won.:bang::bang:

I also had the 1st 4 legs in on a small throwaway ticket last week. My 3rd choice won the last 2 legs. BTW it paid $4100 that day.

RR

[DeltaLover]

Bad horse races are better than no horse races.
RR

What you are saying here is probably correct for the horsemen but obviously wrong for the bettor.

[johnhannibalsmith]

Depends on the bettor. I've sure run into plenty of guys and gals that I used to see at the track playing the races all the time when it was open. They aren't ADW players and until just recently, would have been potential felons if they were. So, they stopped playing when the bad racing became no racing. Contraction isn't all upside. Some people stop going, others never get the chance to show up at all.

[mountainman]

No reflection on mnr, mahoning, or any other small track. But there is a huge difference between GOOD racing at cheap levels and BAD racing at similar tracks.

[rrpic6]

The Buckeye Pick 6 carryover has reached $50K. Today might be one of the few chances a solo ticket might hit it. The Pick 6 sequence has an average of 10 horses per race entered. The weather will be unseasonably warm and wet today, adding to the possibility of unlikely long-shots winning some races.

RR

[tanner12oz]

I'll be at the track next weekend..do they have WiFi?

[rrpic6]

I'll be at the track next weekend..do they have WiFi?
I think it is hit or miss. I use 4g on my i-phone to access xpressbet on site due to company policies. Never seen anyone with a laptop there. (Laughing to myself). The crowds are in indeed retro.

RR

[NTamm1215]

The track sure was quite a bit faster today than it was yesterday with the wet, warm weather.

[EMD4ME]

I think it is hit or miss. I use 4g on my i-phone to access xpressbet on site due to company policies. Never seen anyone with a laptop there. (Laughing to myself). The crowds are in indeed retro.

RR


OMG, I'll be right there!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oR0sn8TctT8

[Vinman]

The Buckeye Pick 6 carryover has reached $50K. Today might be one of the few chances a solo ticket might hit it. The Pick 6 sequence has an average of 10 horses per race entered. The weather will be unseasonably warm and wet today, adding to the possibility of unlikely long-shots winning some races.

RR

Ron......Any chance of providing MVR fans with info each day prior to last race as to which horses are live for the the entire P6 pool? We just had a 4/5 shot win after some big prices.....but no way of knowing if the pool is in jeopardy. Hopefully John would be given this information by mutuels to share with the public. I know GP and LRL do this. Seems like a no brainer.....whaddyathink?

Vinman

[rrpic6]

Ron......Any chance of providing MVR fans with info each day prior to last race as to which horses are live for the the entire P6 pool? We just had a 4/5 shot win after some big prices.....but no way of knowing if the pool is in jeopardy. Hopefully John would be given this information by mutuels to share with the public. I know GP and LRL do this. Seems like a no brainer.....whaddyathink?

Vinman

I'm too lazy to look back in this thread to see if I answered this already. They were showing will pays on the Pick 6 earlier in the meet but they were not accurate. Also, in case of late scratches where favorites then win, the payouts would obviously change as happened at Louisiana Downs in the past causing a mess.

RR

[EMD4ME]

I'm too lazy to look back in this thread to see if I answered this already. They were showing will pays on the Pick 6 earlier in the meet but they were not accurate. Also, in case of late scratches where favorites then win, the payouts would obviously change as happened at Louisiana Downs in the past causing a mess.

RR

Do they show # of live tickets after every race?

At the very least you can do that.

[rrpic6]

Do they show # of live tickets after every race?

At the very least you can do that.

Yes its on the monitors after every leg.

RR

[EMD4ME]

Yes its on the monitors after every leg.

RR

I think that is nice :ThmbUp:

Another question, why not show how many tickets are alive for the last race on each horse and how much money is on a scratched horse (if there are any)?

Why is that SO hard for tracks to do? Put a disclaimer up, if there are any late scratches-there may be more than 1 winner.

Am I nuts to think of something so simple?

[tanner12oz]

What's with the north Korean like ban on photography at the track? I know alot of people really dig shooting horses and its very much stated on the website about photography being not allowed. Thought it was kinda odd. Looking forward to heading up again.

[gib]

What's with the north Korean like ban on photography at the track? I know alot of people really dig shooting horses and its very much stated on the website about photography being not allowed. Thought it was kinda odd. Looking forward to heading up again.

I have never been bothered while popping pictures with my phone and observe many others doing the same. I'm guessing that commercial use of pictures might be what they are discouraging.

[gib]

I'll be at the track next weekend..do they have WiFi?

In my experiences the WIFI has been useless with an iPad and slows my phone down a crawl. Betting off of my phone, I usually turn the WIFI off and just use data. Phone reception is generally good inside the building and you are always just a few steps away from the great outdoors.

[mountainman]

In my experiences the WIFI has been useless with an iPad and slows my phone down a crawl. Betting off of my phone, I usually turn the WIFI off and just use data. Phone reception is generally good inside the building and you are always just a few steps away from the great outdoors.


I'll occasionally pull up a chart or replay on my phone there, and the process moves swiftly enough. My trip and bias notes are also in my phone, but not reliant on the net.

Word is the surface took no big hit from last night's snow and should be fine for tomorrow's action. Incidentally, I've had the track playing reasonably fair for 6 of the last 7 cards.

I need kicked for not pummeling Odin Londono's (front-man for Larry Reed) recent claim in that entry-level alw Wed. The horse closed strongly last start when mired along a dead-rail in a race wired by sharp chalk. And in addition, figured prominent early in a race utterly devoid of speed.

But I was way too busy basking in the afterglow of a longshot score on the John Brown horse in that 3x aoc. And pontificating to surrounding wise guys about what a genius I am.

Stupid. Just stupid. A costly indulgence of ego.

[schweitz]

Rainbow Six was hit today for 88 grand.

[tanner12oz]

So much for playing this on Saturday.

Doh!

[mountainman]

It's been fun to revisit my previous life and treat Mahoning like a job. That said, this long stretch of reasonably fair surfaces might make it more difficult to find value for the remainder of the season.

I did think the track played just a bit anti-rail wed.

On a separate note: Pilares sometimes infuriates me with his passive approach and simply isn't a strong finisher. Completely overrated.

[RobertCalifornia]

Look at the architecture, it's built to discourage leaving the slot floor in a big way. People can go there and not even realize there is even a racetrack or pari-mutuel off track betting. The steep escalator/stairs and the narrow walkway downstairs says a lot, along with the small number of seats in the grandstand(which are more than they planned had not been for objections from the horsemen). Of course racing is meant to fail there. If it's your prerogative to go there, quite cozy and comfortable.

[tanner12oz]

Obviously landscaping is a challenge in Ohio winters bit the track needs something. It looks like a work in progress construction site or something. Even some billboards or advertising I think would be an improvement over the drab expanse of dead brown winter grass

[mountainman]

Look at the architecture, it's built to discourage leaving the slot floor in a big way. People can go there and not even realize there is even a racetrack or pari-mutuel off track betting. The steep escalator/stairs and the narrow walkway downstairs says a lot, along with the small number of seats in the grandstand(which are more than they planned had not been for objections from the horsemen). Of course racing is meant to fail there. If it's your prerogative to go there, quite cozy and comfortable.

Their contempt for horseracing permeates the building. But don't blame Bourke or other racing employees, that agenda would come from (much) higher up.

I hope racing does still flourish there. It's an atm machine that dispenses free money.