SHOW-A-PROFIT

[John]

RPM, has this pencil method as a software.

anyone have it and would like to share their thoughts on it.

I had the pencil version years ago and felt it was So-So. A lot of action but not much profit. I only played one track back then.

[pasco]

Was that from john worth from near u in RI.

[headhawg]

rocajack,

I was addicted to buying systems for a while, and that was one that I purchased. The trouble is I gave up on systems early on (most were crap, some were very involved to do). I never tested the Show-A-Profit method to any extent.

However, RPM published a system review guide called "The Top 52" authored by Len CZ (who now writes software programs for RPM but did not at the time he authored the book, I don't believe). That system was his highest rated system according the book, and now RPM has the software for it. I was curious about how the software performed but no one here mentioned it, probably because RPM is more marketing than substance.

I don't have the book with me at work, but I will try to let you know the sample size listed in the review when I get a chance.


Pasco,

Yes it is a system from the Worth Company.

HH

[headhawg]

BTW, I should add that some of the systems sold by RPM were trashed by the author in "The Top 52", so on the surface it appeared as if it was an independent review.

I don't know this for sure, however.

[timtam]

Show A Profit was originally written for Maiden races mostly Maiden Claiming races and focused on a few eliminations and mostly concerned itself with speed and trainer %. I have seen the software and it gives a horse in races other than maiden races so I'm not sure if it holds up in these other types of races.
It also includes a method called thoro-cap by ray somma . I happened to see the results of Show A Profit yesterday and at Calder it gave horses for 7 races and it hit in 6 of them. The maiden races,however, it was 3 for 3. The show prices were in the 2nd race 4.20 in the 4th race 4.60 and in the 9th race 3.00
Also at Ft Erie it gave horses for 10 races and hit in 6 races but once again it hit 2 for 2 in the maiden races. The 1st race the show price was 4.30 and the 5th race it was 2.60.
I don't own this software but a friend I see at the off track has it in his arsenal and when I ask him how does it do he says it holds its own with good days and bad days. He did say it rarely misses 3 in a row but I assume thats 3 maiden races. Maybe with some sort of progression you could do something with it but it does recommend show bets only.

[CapperLou]

Do you or does anyone else have a link for Show a Profit software?

Would appreciate it---like to see what it has done with maiden races of varying distances and various tracks.

Thx very much.

All the best,

CapperLou

[John]

LOU

I would think it works better in Sprint races. Maiden claiming only.

[headhawg]

Originally posted by CapperLou
Do you or does anyone else have a link for Show a Profit software?

Would appreciate it---like to see what it has done with maiden races of varying distances and various tracks.

Thx very much.

All the best,

CapperLou

I've only seen it on Ebay and through the RPM Info Systems mailer.

[Alc]

Purchased my copy by contacting the originator ---Tom Worth--401-739-8856.

[timtam]

Alc,

How do you find it working? Is it better on strictly maiden races as I have seen? What kind of wagering do you use with show betting ?

[Alc]

timtam ---used only on a sporadic basis. Have no detailed data. Al

[CapperLou]

I've only noticed the book on the rpm site. Checked the 3 catalogs online. Please direct me if you can. Thx much.

All the best,

CapperLou

[betchatoo]

The show a profit software is actually cheaper through Jon Worth's TIPS publication. He is a first class guy who loves talking to serious handicappers. He can be reached at 401.739.8856

[headhawg]

Originally posted by CapperLou
I've only noticed the book on the rpm site. Checked the 3 catalogs online. Please direct me if you can. Thx much.

All the best,

CapperLou

CapperLou,

RPM updates that site about as often as I hit a Super. :D

If you call them (the toll-free #) I'm sure they have it; I'm on their mailing list so I get the updated catalogs, but typically toss them right away.

The cost I believe was $125 + shipping ($6??). Thirty percent restocking fee and no demo version that I know of. I was tempted based on the review of the paper method, but passed.

Let us know how you like it.

HH

[CapperLou]

Thanks for your input. I called Jon Worth today and ordered it directly from him.

He says it normally takes several days to get to south florida area even though he ships it priority mail. So, I expect it will be here Sat or Mon.

Mr Worth was very pleasant and helpful over the phone and I promised him after I used the program for awhile I would get back to him with my results and any info I could pass on that would have an impact on its success.

I will let you guys know how its doing from week to week for now.

I'm setting up a separate bankroll and want to see if I can actually make a few extra bucks with show plays. It will stand on its own and we will see what it does at several venues!!!

All the best,

CapperLou

[betchatoo]

My personal results have been that if you play maiden claimers and insist that the trainer be 10% plus, it shows a small profit.

In Thoroughbred Investor, the guy who programmed it Len CZy???? said that it shows a very positive ROI if you play maidens and insist on 4-1 or more

[headhawg]

Originally posted by betchatoo
My personal results have been that if you play maiden claimers and insist that the trainer be 10% plus, it shows a small profit.

In Thoroughbred Investor, the guy who programmed it Len CZy???? said that it shows a very positive ROI if you play maidens and insist on 4-1 or more

Betting to win? I know that this was intended to be a show betting system, but Len CZ did discover in his testing (Top 52)that this method hit around 33% to win if I recall. I was wondering if that's what he wrote in the TI, or did he say the the show bets should be on horses 4-1 or greater?

[John]

CAPPERLOU

In your telephone conversaion with Jon Worth. Did he mention
a updated version of Show-A-profit to be out soon.

Good luck with your software.....

[CapperLou]

John did not mention anything about an updated version coming out soon!!!!

All the best,

CapperLou

P.S. On another note: I'll be tracking this software and the plays in my "Bettor Keep Track" so we will find out if it has better results with just playing those that are 4-1 or more against for example those that are no less than 8/5 or 2-1.

I'll try to keep track of as many types of sprints as I can, but initially, I'll be playing ONLY maiden claimers!!!

[John]

Good Luck Capperlou, lets us know how it works for you...

[betchatoo]

Headhawg:

Len's final conclusion was:
For Maiden Claimers with final odds of 3-1 to 11-1, the win R.O.I. was a positive 28% and the place was a positive 15%.

As a throw out question, has anyone else ever used the profit pattern longshot, which is part of The Racetrack Millionare software? It is the only software I've ever used (with a few restrictions) that has consistently shown a solid profit over a long period of time

[betchatoo]

Rocajack:

When I last talked to Jon he did say that Len had promised him a version that would also show what TIPS were used to arrive at the chosen horse.

However, because Len was working on a couple of big projects this might take some time to produce

[John]

BETCHATOO

Yes, that is the part of the software that I am interested in [TIPS and POPS ] I believe that you cannot get a play unless there are several TIPS. [ Horse and trainer angles ]

[CapperLou]

Boy, I'm getting confused!!!! I thought we were talking about "Show A Profit" software.

What is the racetrack millionaire software and where is there info on it---are there many facets to it and who sells it etc?

All the best,

CapperLou

[betchatoo]

LouCapper:

Sorry if I caused confusion. I am a newcomer to this forum. Probably I should have started a new thread when I mentioned new software.

Racetrack millionaire is another software program that was put together by Len Czyzniejewski who also programmed Show A Profit. It is a rare spot play and I have not found the software to be nearly as effective as the P&P method.

Along with that play, Len included a version of Profit Pattern Longshots. After a learning curve and having to make a few adjustments, this part of the program has produced excellent results for me for more than a year and several hundred races.

It's not for everyone. There can be some long runouts. But over the long haul it has produced profits for win, place and show for me (win is a positive 43%)

[betchatoo]

CapperLou

Forgot to mention. Racetrack millionaire is only available through RPM

[CapperLou]

Finally got installed on desktop and laptop after a challenge!!

Downloaded only Calder today. It had only one play in md clm which was 13th race #3 Mr Samson which won and paid 4.40-2.40-2.10. Played to win only due to short price!!!

For all races at CRC it had 9 plays out of 13 races and picked 4 winners at 8.00, 3.40, 5.20, & 4.40 and 5 place horses and 6 show horses.

Not too shabby!!!! Interesting for first day and just one card!!
I'll look at a few cards Sunday and see how it does.

A winner overall in win position today ---($2 unit) bet $ 18 and returned $ 21.

If played maiden claimer only--one play won at 4.40.

All the best,

CapperLou

[CapperLou]

It should be pointed out that the losers were all around even money odds.

I should also point out that if you stuck to playing just 3-1 to 11-1 odds plays you would have had one play which won and paid 8.00-3.60-3.00--Fast Tracker!! That would go along with some research that had been done by Len C.---but the research was done on maidens if I recall the earlier post.

Also the only maiden claimer play of the day won at 4.40-2.40-2.10.

Hope this helps!!!!

All the best,

CapperLou

[CapperLou]

The Top 52---A booklet in spiral form by Len Czyzniejewski

I would be interested in purchasing this booklet from anyone on the board if you have one and wish to dispose of it. It must be in "good condition" and not marked up with notes etc.

You can PM me at your convenience. Thank you!!

There is a part on "Show A Profit" in the book.

All the best,

CapperLou

[timtam]

I saw my friend on Monday at the OTB and he had his picks from Show-A Profit for the following tracks. Philly Suffolk and the Ohio 7/7. Note it was raining and the track was sloppy at Ohio

Here goes Maiden Claimers only and only the show prices

Philly

1. Marius $2.60
10. One Bad Sister $ 2.80

Suffolk

1. Special Ops $5.00
5. Poco Dinero $ 3.00

Ohio

3. Fishies Boy OUT
8. Fast Escape OUT
15. Prince Ballet $3.40 this horse won $5.60 3.60 3.40

[CapperLou]

Well, it was a crazy day today with not much success for Show A Profit, but boy how it ended!!!!! EXCEPTIONAL SUNSET!!!

11th LAD Picked the trifecta IN ORDER!!!!!

#11 Exceptional Sunset 6.80 4.20 3.20

12 Fine Tuner 9.40 5.60

10 Bet On a Star 9.80

$2 Exacta 11-12 49.20

$2 Trifecta 11-12-10 888.40

$2 Superfecta 11-12-10-8 3,483.40


The #8 on super was the favorite!!! I said after such a frustrating day with Show A Profit (not the usual) I'm going for it here!!!!

I played the 11 to win when it was 4-1. I boxed the exacta 11-12. I played the #11 over the 8-10-12 in the trifecta AND the Superfecta!!!

What a way to end the day!!!! A PACKAGE!!!!!!

Hope some of you who use this software had this ticket!!!

All the best,

CapperLou

[JimG]

CapperLou,

I've always wondered, what is it that makes us dive in at the right time? I've done the same a few times in my day and I would love to know what is guiding me at those times. Divine intervention, perhaps. Congrats on the nice hit and a word of advice, play light tomorrow.

Jim

[CapperLou]

Hi Jim:

It was just my instincts--I always listen to them!! I had done very well in the first two races at SAR and then lost a couple of plays there.

I have a separate bankroll for Show A Profit and it has been doing OK since I got it. Today there were a few plays at over 3-1 and this one was 4-1 when I made the various plays. I was frustrated and said to myself--let's try to make a lot with a little--I did make a good win bet and boxed the exacta 10 times. I normally do not play tri's or supers, but my instincts were telling me to take a shot and I had made a good score already in my session at Saratoga today. So that's how it happened!!!

All the best,

CapperLou

P.S. I was a little behind with Show A Profit for the day going into this last play of the day. I play only maiden claimers with it!!!

[betchatoo]

Good for you CapperLou> I've done alright with show-a-profit (running a positive ROI of 7%), but I haven't used it for gimmicks. May the gods of racing continue to smile on you

[dav4463]

Is the software version of Show-a-Profit the same as the pencil and paper version? I have that method, but never really tried it out. After reading some of these posts, I'm thinking about giving it another look !

[betchatoo]

Originally posted by dav4463
Is the software version of Show-a-Profit the same as the pencil and paper version? I have that method, but never really tried it out. After reading some of these posts, I'm thinking about giving it another look !

Actually he made some changes between the P&P version and the computer version. In the paper version one of the criteria s the horse must be trained by a top trainer. Len has that among the criteria but does not insist on it.

[CapperLou]

Hi:

What does the P & P classify as a top trainer? The Win % shows in the software--but what are we looking for here according to the paper version?

It seems to be doing OK---but I think the trainer requirements should be known. Thx for your help if you can!!!

All the best,

CapperLou

[Richard]

On page 4 of the P&P method,a top trainer wins about 15% of all their races and/or is in the money about 36% of the time and should have at least 20 starts before you start to judge their current form.

[dav4463]

So if I relax the top trainer requirement a bit, I should be close to the software version ? I just read the method again and am planning on giving it a try this week as a complete method, not just a show method. It should be fun as an addition to my own picks. The reason I didn't use it before was because I didn't just want to play show bets.

[CapperLou]

I'm going to check all of the plays I've had this past week (granted a small sample) and see what the rundown looks like by trainers who have at least a 10% or 15% winning percentage.

I am swamped with some other things, but will get back on this within a couple of days or sooner if I can.
There were some nice hits as I mentioned in earlier posts and I will try to condense some of that into some info that is helpful.

I am looking for plays at APX, CRC, DEL, DMR, ELP, LAD, MTH, PHA, & SAR at the present time. I am tracking all of them with "Bettor Keeps Track". After a month's worth of plays, we will find out much from this excellent tracking program put together awhile ago by Gordon Pine of Netcapper. I'm a spot player and this program has helped me a lot since it shows me where my strengths and weaknesses are in my plays!!

Just from what I've noticed off the top of my head it seems to me that you should stick with trainers with around 15% winners or more--but don't take that as gospel just yet!! And of course I'm using certain parameters which I'll get into later.

All the best,

CapperLou

[dav4463]

Thanks so much ! I look forward to your findings....

[betchatoo]

Originally posted by dav4463
So if I relax the top trainer requirement a bit, I should be close to the software version ? I just read the method again and am planning on giving it a try this week as a complete method, not just a show method. It should be fun as an addition to my own picks. The reason I didn't use it before was because I didn't just want to play show bets.

I would not relax the trainer method much (if it all) When I did my tests on the software I had to insist that both trainer and jockey have a 10% plus in order to turn a profit. In maiden claimers (where the software system has worked best) I have had a win ROI of a positive 7% doing this. Also, in his book (The Top 52) Len's original test of the system showed it to have a solid win percentage as well as a show percentage.

[dav4463]

I like the Show-a-Profit method because it is not purely mechanical. It does require the handicapper to make decisions based on value. It is a good guideline to maiden races and I am definitely going to give it a chance.

[dav4463]

One more Show-a-Profit question....."horse must have one of the three highest Beyer speed ratings in the field within his last four races.".......Does this mean one horse could have all three highest ratings or should I take the best of last four for each horse and consider all three horses ?

[Richard]

I personally interpret that to mean the best of the last four Beyer numbers in a horse's PP's.I played two maiden claimers out of DMR today and that's how I did it.In today's 4th race Cooperstown met the methods requirements but did'nt get on the board.In the 8th race,Rusty Nail did also and paid $3.00 to show.I'm not sure yet but I'm inclined to believe that this method will work better with sprints as opposed to routes.We'll see.

[dav4463]

I had a race at Retama where one horse had all three best figures recorded by any horse in last four races. If I just used his best, and then took the next two best horses, I had 3 qualifiers, so wasn't sure exactly how it is meant to be played. This horse had a 42, 40, and a 38...these were the three best. Next best horse had a 28 another had a 23, so wasn't sure if I should consider the low Beyer horses also.

[betchatoo]

Originally posted by dav4463
One more Show-a-Profit question....."horse must have one of the three highest Beyer speed ratings in the field within his last four races.".......Does this mean one horse could have all three highest ratings or should I take the best of last four for each horse and consider all three horses ?

You will have at least 3 different horses doing it the way Jon Worth (writer of the system) does it. He puts the horses highest qualified # in the right column. You can actually have more than 3 because he considers a one point difference to be a tie,(if you have a horse with a 71 and one with a 70 they would be considered tied). Like pretty much anyone that uses speed figures, he does pay special attention to double and triple advantage horses.

Particularly if you are a conservative player I recommend subscribing to Jon's TIPS Report. It is full of common sense advice and fine tuning of your game designed to keep your eye on the ultimate goal, making a profit

[CapperLou]

Since I only have the software--I would ask you what does the writer consider a double or triple advantage horse?

Thanks for the help--Jon was supposed to send me something about the TIPS bulletin, but I have yet to receive it. Being a native New Englander, I will be patient about its arrival because I am aware of the tendancy of New Englander's to be very deliberate about following thru with chores!!!!

All the best,

CapperLou

P.S. Never try to rush a New Englander!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[betchatoo]

Originally posted by CapperLou
Since I only have the software--I would ask you what does the writer consider a double or triple advantage horse?

Thanks for the help--Jon was supposed to send me something about the TIPS bulletin, but I have yet to receive it. Being a native New Englander, I will be patient about its arrival because I am aware of the tendancy of New Englander's to be very deliberate about following thru with chores!!!!

All the best,

CapperLou

P.S. Never try to rush a New Englander!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That would be any horse that had 2 or 3 qualified #s higher than any other horse. The example dav4463 gave at Retama would be a triple advantage horse

[CapperLou]

The software short calculation does not show the speed #'s, but it does show the trainer/jockey stats (%). In order to look at the speed numbers one would have to screen the past performance info before printing the short calcs.

I am finding that it is important to look for plays that have a large spread if there is a second horse listed and also wait for a trainer % of 10% or 15% or more. It will take sometime to determine whether it's better to wait for 10%+ or 15%+. We will wait and see!!!

Crazy game this is-----there was one called Rusty Nail in 8th DMR yesterday who was 10-1 ML, bet down to 9/5 & ran second, beaten by a head or neck paying 3.80 to place.

I did not play him to win because I look for 3-1 or more at a couple of minutes to post, but I had Shrimp Cocktail from rich bauer(he had some nice comments about him) so I boxed the exacta with these two and put a small win ticket on #2 S.C. who paid 19.20. Crazy game this is--crazy---instincts, instincts,!!!!!

All the best,

CapperLou

[betchatoo]

CapperLou

I've mentioned before in my research on the software I have found trainer and Jock should be 10% plus to make a profit. But I agree, sometimes instincts take over and put you on a big one.

May the Gods of racing always smile on you

[CapperLou]

There was only one strong play today--1st at PHA #3 Skip My Turn in Md Claimer.

On the software this one had 82 pts--a huge number. 7-2 ML
The second rated horse had 50--#9, but no YES!!!

The public made the #9 even money and when I played the #3 Skip My Turn it was 3-1. The final result was:

#3 Skip My Turn 5.80 3.40 2.80

#10 Paula's Star 14.40 5.80

#4 Hartland Express 9.40


The even money #9 Spooky Girlfriend ran out of money!!!

The winner #3 Skip My Turn 13% & 12% trn/jock win %.

This is a good example of how everything is supposed to work for this software!!!! You cannot control the late simulcast money which knocked the price down to 5.80 and 3.40, but at 3-1 the proper wager based on Len's research is 50%Win & 50% Place.

Hope this helps everyone---only play today!!!! (of trks I'm playing).

All the best,

CapperLou

[John]

There you go Lou... 100% for the day

Lou, how many tracks did you run through before you found a play that fit ?


John

[CapperLou]

As you know from a previous post, I'm only looking at around 8 tracks for plays. Today the tracks running were CRC, DEL, PHA.

The only one that fit the trn/jock 10%+ and a good spread if a second horse was mentioned was Skip My Turn at PHA!!

I'm finding out quickly that it does pay to "filter" these by trn/jock %'s and a good spread between the "YES" #1 and the second if there is one.

This winner at Philly today had a HUGE #82 pts!!!

Here's to seeing you at the short line John!!!!

All the best,

CapperLou

[John]

Lou,

did you get Jon Worth tips check list that I sent you, you might want to keep a record on what tips are picking the winners.


John

[CapperLou]

Yes, I got it. Thank you very much.

All the best,

CapperLou

[dav4463]

Does Jon Worth have a website ?

[betchatoo]

Originally posted by dav4463
Does Jon Worth have a website ?

No, computers are not really his strong point. He is very accessible though by phone or Email

[headhawg]

I saw his phone listed earlier in this thread. Could someone post his email address please? Thanks.

[betchatoo]

tipsreport@aol.com

[trotter]

Show a Profit software is on ebay

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=5116222619&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT

[Doug3312]

Just recieved a new RPM catalog and it has Show-a-Profit, plus software with another of Worth's programs called Place to Win, II. It looks like they have upgraded Show a profit to include other reces as well. If anyone has seen it, do you think that the claims are accurate? From what I have read on this thread, it may be promising. Any comments are appreciated.

[midnight]

I bought both Show a Profit and Place to Win and tested them against a one-year database. I posted about it in this thread:

Thread about these two methods (http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16226)

The two methods did worse than their claims, and with percentage and ROI of 59.6%, 0.88 (Show a Profit) and 51.4%, 0.91 (Place to Win). Playing every post time favorite to show would have returned 59.6% and 0.89, so the two methods just barely beat out playing the toteboard.

All in all, I wasn't impressed, and now that Mr. Worth is associated with RPM, I'm even less impressed.

[Hosshead]

These 2 systems have been around for a long time.
Way before Midnight's 2002 test. I tested them on old racing forms, years ago. Unlike Midnight, I only ran the test on a couple of months of (Ca.) racing. But that was enough for me. Because like Midnight, I came up with results that were all at a Loss. Now, years later, even if they have tweaked the rules into a "new and improved version", I would say forget it !
Especially if it's from RPM.

And by the way. After you've bought, and sent back, several systems from RPM (with a money back guarantee), that don't work, (cause they never do), and even send them a workout with tracks, races etc., showing the loss, Dave Powers (or whatever name he's going by now), will refuse to honor the "guarantee" on future sales to you. Saying that you're just stealing (copying) this valuable information.
But of course if the stuff actually worked, you wouldn't be sending it back.
Don't ask me how I know..... Lessons of life.

[Handiman]

I have a program that's guaranteed. If you will buy it, and try it, and find that it doesn't lose money, then you can return it and I will refund your money.


:lol:

Handi

Couldn't help myself. I have a collection of crazy stuff, plus a very extensive library of handicapping books and software. Started out seriously and became a collector of sorts. Since that is all most of it's worth, is as collectibles.

[timtam]

I purchased Show A Profit/Place to Win based on the system by Jon Worth

and was disappointed. I tested it for about a month at various tracks such

as Calder,Woodbine, and the New York Circuit. My computer crashed a month

ago and I didn't even reload it back into my computer so that alone tells you

my thoughts about it. How come these guys can build a profit up to $1500

from a $500 bankroll in record time and the buyer doesn't even get close?

Thumbs down to Show A Profit/Place to Win :ThmbDown: