View Full Version : What's worse? What he said or what she did?
Jess Hawsen Arown
10-08-2016, 05:50 PM
An easy question to answer.
The desperation of the left is palpable.
PaceAdvantage
10-08-2016, 05:57 PM
It doesn't matter. What matters is how much the media is able to sway the election. And it appears they will get their way.
And some people talk about Russia unduly influencing US elections. What about a biased media that has no problem digging up everything they can on Trump, while sitting by silently on top of a mountain of damning Clinton scandals from current times to decades past.
When will the Washington Post run an expose on how Hillary Clinton treated the poor women who accused Bill Clinton of sexually assaulting them, or worse? The names she called them. How she tried to diminish them and the pain and torment Bill caused them with his predatory ways? How they feared for their very lives after their encounters will WJC and HRC, even when he was a small timer in Arkansas?
It's amazing how far back the media is willing to go to bury Trump, but their long term memory disappears when it comes to HRC. And as far as their short term memory, that isn't in too great a shape either.
Do you think if Trump went before Congress for 11 hours like Clinton did and walked away from it, then was investigated by the FBI...that they would let the FBI's conclusions be the end of the story?
HAH! Good one.
Hell, when it comes to Trump, they put more faith in a proven liar (Miss America - watch her on Megyn Kelly where she completely denies the long quote of hers in the Washington Post in the 1990s that contradicts her claim that Trump's comments caused her to develop an eating disorder) who once, apparently, drove the getaway car for a murderer...tells you a lot.
horses4courses
10-08-2016, 06:00 PM
The desperation of the right is palpable.
Case in point:
Read the title of this thread,
then the content from O/P.
Repeat.
:lol: :lol: :lol:
Desperations of the left....that is a horse for the course.
Trump apologized.
Clinton lied about it.
Hillary lied about the vast right wing conspiracy and then attacked the victims.
You tell ME who the slimeballs are in all of this.
thaskalos
10-08-2016, 07:20 PM
Weren't "what he said", things that he had "done"? Why the distinction between the two?
Native Texan III
10-08-2016, 07:59 PM
Desperations of the left....that is a horse for the course.
Trump apologized.
Clinton lied about it.
Hillary lied about the vast right wing conspiracy and then attacked the victims.
You tell ME who the slimeballs are in all of this.
Trump mouthed some words that he had to, to at least try to save his neck. He did not mean a single one of those words. Who exactly is he "apologising" to in any case? Women? GOP, Fox News, his supporters, for getting caught, his pathological misogyny? What if he now gets arrested for sexual assault?
Any grown up candidate clears all these skeletons long before he stands.
What if this video is just round one and Democrats release a new and even more damning story every few days?
Trump mouthed some words that he had to, to at least try to save his neck. He did not mean a single one of those words. Who exactly is he "apologising" to in any case? Women? GOP, Fox News, his supporters, for getting caught, his pathological misogyny? What if he now gets arrested for sexual assault?
Any grown up candidate clears all these skeletons long before he stands.
What if this video is just round one and Democrats release a new and even more damning story every few days?
Yes, but compared to CLinton's outright lying about it and his slutty wife lying to protect him, give me Trump any day. Keep releasing videos - he has a looooong way to go to match the sexual perversions of the Clinton predators. Nothing he did was done while he was in office. Unlike the POS and Mrs. POS who sold out this country for a little sugar fo' bubba.
Greyfox
10-08-2016, 08:20 PM
As I see it:
1. Both of these candidates are poor and have sleazy backgrounds.
2. Bill Clinton is not running for the Presidency.
3. Hillary can be charged with enabling Bill's predatory behavior, but many women believe in honoring their wedding vows. Charges against her demeaning the women who went to bed with Bill, won't get much traction with other women who've stood by their man through thick and thin.
4. The Audio Tape + Video reveal that Trump indeed has a vulgar mouth and mind.
However, more than that, and the tape is 11 years old,
he is advocating what amounts to be Sexual Assault on women.
Trump is not going to be able to wash that off.
EasyGoer89
10-08-2016, 08:31 PM
As I see it:
1. Both of these candidates are poor and have sleazy backgrounds.
2. Bill Clinton is not running for the Presidency.
3. Hillary can be charged with enabling Bill's predatory behavior, but many women believe in honoring their wedding vows. Charges against her demeaning the women who went to bed with Bill, won't get much traction with other women who've stood by their man through thick and thin.
4. The Audio Tape + Video reveal that Trump indeed has a vulgar mouth and mind.
However, more than that, and the tape is 11 years old,
he is advocating what amounts to be Sexual Assault on women.
Trump is not going to be able to wash that off.
Melania isn't running either yet we had to hear about nude pictures, citizenship and plagiarism.
It really comes down to rude comments and tax returns vs actual illegal activity. Trumps words and taxes aren't illegal yet you wouldn't know it by how the media talks about it.
Seth Rich dies a very mysterious death and all anyone can talk about in 2016 is the OJ case from 20 years ago or the Jon Benet Ramsey murder, also from 2 decades ago.
JustRalph
10-08-2016, 08:32 PM
So, he's a poon hound. Like JFK, Bobby and Bill Clinton.
Big deal
The only democratic president in our lifetime who was not a sexual pervert was Jimmy Carter, but he still screwed the whole country!
JustRalph
10-08-2016, 08:39 PM
The only democratic president in our lifetime who was not a sexual pervert was Jimmy Carter, but he still screwed the whole country!
Don't buy it.....he was trying to screw that rabbit!!
JustRalph
10-08-2016, 09:03 PM
Two more Trump tapes coming. They've been holding them from archives of Trump's TV shows. Rumors maybe even 4 more tapes......
This is going to be incredible......
biggestal99
10-08-2016, 09:40 PM
Trump apologized.
He,s really sorry that he got caught.
He been doing this all his life.
Just like er Bill Clinton.
Allan
PhantomOnTour
10-08-2016, 09:53 PM
As someone on this board who is known to lean to the left, I cannot support Hillary Clinton for President.
She is exactly what we fear in a career politician....willing to go to great scummy lengths in order to win an election, and she's broken the law more than a few times...no thank you.
She moved to New York to win a Senate seat and claimed to represent her constituency...please...she's about as New York as Jimmy Buffet for Chrissakes.
On the other side is Trump, no big prize himself...HOWEVER, if made to choose between the two I would vote for, sigh, Donald Trump.
(in actuality I will vote for neither of them)
davew
10-08-2016, 10:12 PM
As someone on this board who is known to lean to the left, I cannot support Hillary Clinton for President.
She is exactly what we fear in a career politician....willing to go to great scummy lengths in order to win an election, and she's broken the law more than a few times...no thank you.
She moved to New York to win a Senate seat and claimed to represent her constituency...please...she's about as New York as Jimmy Buffet for Chrissakes.
On the other side is Trump, no big prize himself...HOWEVER, if made to choose between the two I would vote for, sigh, Donald Trump.
(in actuality I will vote for neither of them)
I am surprised how all the democrat politicians, newspapers, and television are proudly backing her
pandy
10-08-2016, 10:20 PM
It doesn't matter. What matters is how much the media is able to sway the election. And it appears they will get their way.
And some people talk about Russia unduly influencing US elections. What about a biased media that has no problem digging up everything they can on Trump, while sitting by silently on top of a mountain of damning Clinton scandals from current times to decades past.
When will the Washington Post run an expose on how Hillary Clinton treated the poor women who accused Bill Clinton of sexually assaulting them, or worse? The names she called them. How she tried to diminish them and the pain and torment Bill caused them with his predatory ways? How they feared for their very lives after their encounters will WJC and HRC, even when he was a small timer in Arkansas?
It's amazing how far back the media is willing to go to bury Trump, but their long term memory disappears when it comes to HRC. And as far as their short term memory, that isn't in too great a shape either.
Do you think if Trump went before Congress for 11 hours like Clinton did and walked away from it, then was investigated by the FBI...that they would let the FBI's conclusions be the end of the story?
HAH! Good one.
Hell, when it comes to Trump, they put more faith in a proven liar (Miss America - watch her on Megyn Kelly where she completely denies the long quote of hers in the Washington Post in the 1990s that contradicts her claim that Trump's comments caused her to develop an eating disorder) who once, apparently, drove the getaway car for a murderer...tells you a lot.
It's ironic, this time they are for Hillary and against Trump. When she ran against Obama, , I.M.O., the media was biased against Hillary and obviously going all out to help Obama win.
letswastemoney
10-09-2016, 12:40 AM
I want Donald Trump to win and will always consider Hillary a despicable excuse for a human being.
It looks over though.
NJ Stinks
10-09-2016, 01:24 AM
As someone on this board who is known to lean to the left, I cannot support Hillary Clinton for President.
She is exactly what we fear in a career politician....willing to go to great scummy lengths in order to win an election, and she's broken the law more than a few times...no thank you.
She moved to New York to win a Senate seat and claimed to represent her constituency...please...she's about as New York as Jimmy Buffet for Chrissakes.
On the other side is Trump, no big prize himself...HOWEVER, if made to choose between the two I would vote for, sigh, Donald Trump.
(in actuality I will vote for neither of them)
I wonder how the heck anybody can be can be enthusiastic about either of these two. Although to be fair I don't see anybody on here raving about Hillary - only Donny has a few genuine backers.
biggestal99
10-09-2016, 06:02 AM
I wonder how the heck anybody can be can be enthusiastic about either of these two. Although to be fair I don't see anybody on here raving about Hillary - only Donny has a few genuine backers.
Each has about 10,000,000 core supporters. The rest well.......
Allan
Ocala Mike
10-09-2016, 06:42 AM
I am surprised how all the evangelicals are proudly backing Trump
FTFY
Jess Hawsen Arown
10-09-2016, 09:18 AM
Case in point:
Read the title of this thread,
then the content from O/P.
Repeat.
:lol: :lol: :lol:
I have to give you credit. Ya got me on the typo. My first grade teacher, Mrs. Kimberly, told me that haste makes waste -- and I didn't listen. First time I can remember that you made a cogent point. :jump:
In the meantime, I believe that this whole episode will backfire on the politically correct, liberal media. The Republican Party insiders will regret abandoning the Trump ship.
Did anyone see that weasel, Geraldo Rivera, on Bill O'Reilly? He REFUSED to talk about all of the disastrous things uncovered about Hillary because he wanted to focus on the jokes Trump said in poor taste 11 years ago when Trump was in the entertainment business. I wrote to O'Reilly and told him that I would turn off the show every time he had that piece of shit, GR, was on the air. Oh do pardon my French.
Inner Dirt
10-09-2016, 10:54 AM
As I see it:
1. Both of these candidates are poor and have sleazy backgrounds.
2. Bill Clinton is not running for the Presidency.
3. Hillary can be charged with enabling Bill's predatory behavior, but many women believe in honoring their wedding vows. Charges against her demeaning the women who went to bed with Bill, won't get much traction with other women who've stood by their man through thick and thin.
4. The Audio Tape + Video reveal that Trump indeed has a vulgar mouth and mind.
However, more than that, and the tape is 11 years old,
he is advocating what amounts to be Sexual Assault on women.
Trump is not going to be able to wash that off.
Who do you think will be running the country when the hag is under the weather? I don't think it will be Kaine.
Greyfox
10-09-2016, 11:01 AM
Who do you think will be running the country when the hag is under the weather? I don't think it will be Kaine.
Bill looks pretty frail these days too.
Robert Fischer
10-09-2016, 11:08 AM
People wear different hats.
when you are a business man promoting a brand based on megalomania, and you do an interview with a shock jock, you are wearing a different hat than when you run for president.
Marshall Bennett
10-09-2016, 12:19 PM
The media is a driving force in the democratic party. It's been that way for a number of years. They've simply cranked the volume up in this election.
Fact, Obama associated himself with known terrorist. Elected president.
Fact, Hillary Clinton broke the law by lying to the FBI. Numerous other charges are pending, put off till after the election to no surprise to anyone. To be elected president.
Donald Trumps comments however are far far worse about a few women, even if said jokingly. Chance of being elected president...zero. Eventually some day historians will see and tell about how liberals took control of the country and brainwashed its citizens to mandate their twisted socialist agenda. This election is the perfect example. There's nothing rocket science about it either, but when the overwhelming majority of voters don't have a clue and believe anything told to them, what difference does it make?
Fager Fan
10-09-2016, 12:30 PM
The media is a driving force in the democratic party. It's been that way for a number of years. They've simply cranked the volume up in this election.
Fact, Obama associated himself with known terrorist. Elected president.
Fact, Hillary Clinton broke the law by lying to the FBI. Numerous other charges are pending, put off till after the election to no surprise to anyone. To be elected president.
Donald Trumps comments however are far far worse about a few women, even if said jokingly. Chance of being elected president...zero. Eventually some day historians will see and tell about how liberals took control of the country and brainwashed its citizens to mandate their twisted socialist agenda. This election is the perfect example. There's nothing rocket science about it either, but when the overwhelming majority of voters don't have a clue and believe anything told to them, what difference does it make?
Exactly. The Dems long-term plan of indoctrination in schools has taken root and it's hard as hell to fight against it.
I just spoke to 2 different people who say they can't support someone who is racist or sexist. Both women. This is what I'm talking about regarding emotions overruling intellect. They don't care about corruption, just that they are "offended".
Greyfox
10-09-2016, 12:50 PM
Both candidates have proven themselves to be unfit for the Presidency.
Unfortunately, there are no "do overs."
Clocker
10-09-2016, 01:07 PM
(in actuality I will vote for neither of them)
I agree. As one political analyst put it, sometimes facing a question of the lesser of two evils is like being asked if you want white or rye bread for your crap sandwich. In that case, the best choice is to skip lunch.
Clocker
10-09-2016, 01:15 PM
Bill looks pretty frail these days too.
A life of debauchery eventually catches up with anyone. :p
thaskalos
10-09-2016, 01:15 PM
I wrote to O'Reilly and told him that I would turn off the show every time he had that piece of shit, GR, was on the air. Oh do pardon my French.
Did you receive a reply? Given the size of the O'Reily audience...your desertion would probably be cause for concern.
EasyGoer89
10-09-2016, 02:19 PM
Both candidates have proven themselves to be unfit for the Presidency.
Unfortunately, there are no "do overs."
So if Trump is unfit how did he beat out 'fit' candidates such as Cruz, Rubio and Jeb?
Each has about 10,000,000 core supporters. The rest well.......
Allan
Blithering idiots.
If we ever find a way to export stupidity, we will be the richest nation on earth because we have the dumbest people here. Laziest, too.
A life of debauchery eventually catches up with anyone. :p
My guess, VD.
People wear different hats.
when you are a business man promoting a brand based on megalomania, and you do an interview with a shock jock, you are wearing a different hat than when you run for president.
I don't think Billy Bob Boy Slob wears "hats."
Greyfox
10-09-2016, 03:04 PM
So if Trump is unfit how did he beat out 'fit' candidates such as Cruz, Rubio and Jeb?
Trumpmania mesmerized supporters and feverishly drew them like moths to a light.
whodoyoulike
10-09-2016, 04:46 PM
Who do you think will be running the country when the hag is under the weather? I don't think it will be Kaine.
It will still be HC just as in all the other cases with the other previous recent Presidents. Unless you have proof otherwise, now is the time to present it unless you're just making crap up.
whodoyoulike
10-09-2016, 04:49 PM
Blithering idiots.
If we ever find a way to export stupidity, we will be the richest nation on earth because we have the dumbest people here. Laziest, too.
This is really amusing because I think you're one of the 10 million core Trump supporters which he was referring.
EasyGoer89
10-09-2016, 04:49 PM
It will still be HC just as in all the other cases with the other previous recent Presidents. Unless you have proof otherwise, now is the time to present it unless you're just making crap up.
He's asking a question, how is raising an inquiry considered making something up? Try reading the post more carefully next time.
FantasticDan
10-09-2016, 05:05 PM
He's asking a question, how is raising an inquiry considered making something up?It was rhetorical, not actually inquiring. He had already insinuated that Bill would be running the country..
Marshall Bennett
10-09-2016, 05:10 PM
If only voters were required to pass a simple 6th grade level exam before they can vote. This isn't racist either as democrats would jump to suggest. To say it is, is to say minorities are not intelligent, that intelligence is dependent on what race one is. That would indeed be racist
What it would guarantee is that the presidency isn't chosen by any majority, or even a large portion of voters that have little clue about much of anything, let alone the importance good leadership.
This is what as a nation we've been reduced to. A system not guided by intelligent decisions, but by sheer numbers of people and the ability to coerce and persuade them. :ThmbDown:
Half would fail.
The other half would be too lazy to show up for it.
This is really amusing because I think you're one of the 10 million core Trump supporters which he was referring.
And I was referring to the rest......
RIF.
Originally Posted by whodoyoulike
It will still be HC just as in all the other cases with the other previous recent Presidents. Unless you have proof otherwise, now is the time to present it unless you're just making crap up.
Where is your proof?
Hillary may spend half her time in intensive care for all we know.
We do know she is far too stupid to do the job and he at least had some
humbling moments after he was rightfully impeached and had to bow to congress to get anything done.
FantasticDan
10-09-2016, 05:22 PM
If only voters were required to pass a simple 6th grade level exam before they can vote.
TcYyx5qEb6U
OntheRail
10-09-2016, 05:26 PM
If only voters were required to pass a simple 6th grade level exam before they can vote. This isn't racist either as democrats would jump to suggest. To say it is, is to say minorities are not intelligent, that intelligence is dependent on what race one is. That would indeed be racist
What it would guarantee is that the presidency isn't chosen by any majority, or even a large portion of voters that have little clue about much of anything, let alone the importance good leadership.
This is what as a nation we've been reduced to. A system not guided by intelligent decisions, but by sheer numbers of people and the ability to coerce and persuade them. :ThmbDown:
Or give them things...BmvLexamrmk
Then Slam... screwed again!
delayjf
10-10-2016, 11:01 AM
If only voters were required to pass a simple 6th grade level exam before they can vote. This isn't racist either as democrats would jump to suggest.
I think its racist for Democrats to assume minorities could not pass such a test. It shows you what they think about minority voters.
HalvOnHorseracing
10-10-2016, 09:22 PM
There are some surreally comical moments on PA. First, no one has suggested giving any sort of education test to voters. Second, since there was no proposed test, no Democrats actually came out against it on the grounds it was racist. Third, after watching the Trump voters this year, as long as EVERYONE had to take the test I'm not so sure the Democrats would come out against the test. Fourth, the idea of a geniocracy would likely get Democrats really excited. Why? Because they are pretty sure they have the market cornered on brain power.
Marshall Bennett
10-11-2016, 02:51 AM
There are some surreally comical moments on PA. First, no one has suggested giving any sort of education test to voters. Second, since there was no proposed test, no Democrats actually came out against it on the grounds it was racist. Third, after watching the Trump voters this year, as long as EVERYONE had to take the test I'm not so sure the Democrats would come out against the test. Fourth, the idea of a geniocracy would likely get Democrats really excited. Why? Because they are pretty sure they have the market cornered on brain power.
I suggested giving the test. It was my opinion as to how democrats would react. Its your opinion that Trump voters are somehow dumber than your party's voters. I'm sure the past 8 years have convinced you of that.
After all the hell your party raised over the idea of making voter ID mandatory, why would any marginally intelligent person not assume the same reaction with mandatory testing?
I suggested giving the test. It was my opinion as to how democrats would react. Its your opinion that Trump voters are somehow dumber than your party's voters. I'm sure the past 8 years have convinced you of that.
After all the hell your party raised over the idea of making voter ID mandatory, why would any marginally intelligent person not assume the same reaction with mandatory testing?I would not suggest (unless I am insulted by some Trump supporters) that there is an intelligence difference between Trump and Clinton voters, but there is a distinct educational contrast.http://www.bloomberg.com/politics/articles/2016-08-12/education-level-sharply-divides-clinton-trump-race
Those with the least number of years of education are far more likely to support Donald Trump, while those who have had the most schooling are much more likely to back Hillary Clinton, according to a Bloomberg Politics national poll released this week.
...“The presence or absence of a college degree is more predictive of the vote in this election than we’ve seen in past elections,” I would predict many more Clinton voters would pass any "qualifying" tests. However it would be a very dark day for democracy if we started testing voters. :( :(
HalvOnHorseracing
10-11-2016, 09:40 AM
I suggested giving the test. It was my opinion as to how democrats would react. Its your opinion that Trump voters are somehow dumber than your party's voters. I'm sure the past 8 years have convinced you of that.
After all the hell your party raised over the idea of making voter ID mandatory, why would any marginally intelligent person not assume the same reaction with mandatory testing?
I know you suggested the test. I should have said there was no real world proposal for testing. My post was actually in jest, with the punch line being the Democrats believe they are smarter than everyone else so the idea of a geniocracy would be appealing to them because they believe they are smarter than everyone else.
I can honestly see why people would not like Trump.
But I cannot fathom how anyone could consider Hillary as a viable alternative.
These are people I would not let go near children or sharp objects.:rolleyes:
chadk66
10-11-2016, 11:19 AM
If we allow the media to elect dip shit Hillary this year we will never see another non liberal president ever in this country. Which will lead to a serious armed revolt.
OntheRail
10-11-2016, 11:37 AM
I would not suggest (unless I am insulted by some Trump supporters) that there is an intelligence difference between Trump and Clinton voters, but there is a distinct educational contrast.I would predict many more Clinton voters would pass any "qualifying" tests. However it would be a very dark day for democracy if we started testing voters. :( :(
Then why are DEMOCRATS opposed to Voter ID... No test require only PROOF you are who you claim to be. But instead claim it will disenfranchise THEIR Black and Latino voters. Lets see could pass a test, but can't apply for ID Card. :rolleyes:
http://www.bloomberg.com/politics/a...nton-trump-race
Those with the least number of years of education are far more likely to support Donald Trump, while those who have had the most schooling are much more likely to back Hillary Clinton, according to a Bloomberg Politics national poll released this week.
...“The presence or absence of a college degree is more predictive of the vote in this election than we’ve seen in past elections,”
Number of years in School does not translate into Intelligence. It's not like a balance scale. As for more " Educated People" supporting Socialist Democratic Doctrine. Well no surprise when Academia welcomes the likes of Bill Ayers... Bernardine Dohrn... Kathy Boudin. You think these radicals and their ilk are teaching the American Values. :rolleyes: Where the students protest different or opposing views instead of hearing them out and discussing the merits of each or simply defending their learned view.
So once again High Educated is a subjective statement. ;)
JustRalph
10-11-2016, 12:15 PM
If we allow the media to elect dip shit Hillary this year we will never see another non liberal president ever in this country. Which will lead to a serious armed revolt.
Never happen. Americans don't have it in them.
Marshall Bennett
10-11-2016, 12:48 PM
I know you suggested the test. I should have said there was no real world proposal for testing. My post was actually in jest, with the punch line being the Democrats believe they are smarter than everyone else so the idea of a geniocracy would be appealing to them because they believe they are smarter than everyone else.
I thought perhaps you were on that track at first, but rolled the dice anyway because many liberals here actually believe they're masses are generally intelligent voters. :)
I do apologize.
Marshall Bennett
10-11-2016, 12:56 PM
I would predict many more Clinton voters would pass any "qualifying" test.
That's absurd. The major inner cities make up a huge voting block that ensured Obama victory, and most likely will Hillary. Have you ever visited and seen what they're composed of? Your assumption is ridiculous, and I do believe you know better.
chadk66
10-11-2016, 01:03 PM
Never happen. Americans don't have it in them.don't underestimate a large segment of the populace.
That's absurd. The major inner cities make up a huge voting block that ensured Obama victory, and most likely will Hillary. Have you ever visited and seen what they're composed of? Your assumption is ridiculous, and I do believe you know better.Both you and OntheRail should re-read the article I linked. What is so difficult aboyt getting this very simple well documented demographic divide? And why can't you guys get a higher educational level among other things, appears to be that divide?
It's not as though I am expecting you gents to understand human induced global warming :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
ElKabong
10-11-2016, 04:05 PM
I would not suggest (unless I am insulted by some Trump supporters) that there is an intelligence difference between Trump and Clinton voters, but there is a distinct educational contrast.I would predict many more Clinton voters would pass any "qualifying" tests. However it would be a very dark day for democracy if we started testing voters. :( :(
Into stereotyping still, I see... I'll play, only with real life episodes
Yes. When I see people looting and burning down buildings in Missouri, California, Louisiana, I say to myself "Now there goes an educated group of folks... Must be liberal Democrats"
When I read JRs article about the illegal immigrant that was arrested for crimes and it was discovered he voted THREE times, I said to myself,"that guy fits the profile of a Dem. Very much a man about town. Bet he had an advanced degree form a prestigious private institution as well."
When I saw the guy that killed five Dallas law enforcement officers in downtown Dallas this summer, I said to myself "Now look here! Another well educated person. SMU Law, or Trinity? Hell, maybe Rice. He and his buddies running the streets that night all look so well educated."
Info portrayed by the media, and polling for that matter, doesn't reflect reality.
classhandicapper
10-11-2016, 04:20 PM
Did anyone see that weasel, Geraldo Rivera, on Bill O'Reilly? He REFUSED to talk about all of the disastrous things uncovered about Hillary because he wanted to focus on the jokes Trump said in poor taste 11 years ago when Trump was in the entertainment business. I wrote to O'Reilly and told him that I would turn off the show every time he had that piece of shit, GR, was on the air. Oh do pardon my French.
Geraldo Rivera should not be employed by anyone that is serious about anything.
classhandicapper
10-11-2016, 04:23 PM
Never happen. Americans don't have it in them.
I'm too old for this kind of thing, but I'm not too old to help finance it. :lol:
thaskalos
10-11-2016, 04:54 PM
Into stereotyping still, I see... I'll play, only with real life episodes
Yes. When I see people looting and burning down buildings in Missouri, California, Louisiana, I say to myself "Now there goes an educated group of folks... Must be liberal Democrats"
When I read JRs article about the illegal immigrant that was arrested for crimes and it was discovered he voted THREE times, I said to myself,"that guy fits the profile of a Dem. Very much a man about town. Bet he had an advanced degree form a prestigious private institution as well."
When I saw the guy that killed five Dallas law enforcement officers in downtown Dallas this summer, I said to myself "Now look here! Another well educated person. SMU Law, or Trinity? Hell, maybe Rice. He and his buddies running the streets that night all look so well educated."
Info portrayed by the media, and polling for that matter, doesn't reflect reality.
Nice to see that you yourself don't believe in "stereotyping"...
ElKabong
10-11-2016, 04:56 PM
Nice to see that you yourself don't believe in "stereotyping"...
Nice to see your sarcasm meter is broken.
thaskalos
10-11-2016, 04:57 PM
Nice to see your sarcasm meter is broken.
When I want my sarcasm meter fixed...I'll go to somebody with a sense of humor...
Clocker
10-11-2016, 04:57 PM
Geraldo Rivera should not be employed by anyone that is serious about anything.
What if they are serious about attracting viewers and ad money? :p
EasyGoer89
10-11-2016, 05:01 PM
What if they are serious about attracting viewers and ad money? :p
Exactly. They are an entertainment network and they just want viewers and ad dollars. Polarizing people and opinions sell, but then again, so do clowns at the circus.
mostpost
10-11-2016, 05:02 PM
So if Trump is unfit how did he beat out 'fit' candidates such as Cruz, Rubio and Jeb?
The answer to that is simple. Republicans are stupid.
ElKabong
10-11-2016, 05:09 PM
When I want my sarcasm meter fixed...I'll go to somebody with a sense of humor...
Funny, I've always thought of you as John Cleese's assistant from the rat race movie...The guy he proclaimed as having been born with no Personality.
Go back to your passive aggressive self. No original thought, just jumping in and out of threads.
mostpost
10-11-2016, 05:16 PM
If we allow the media to elect dip shit Hillary this year we will never see another non liberal president ever in this country. Which will lead to a serious armed revolt.
I guess this proves who is anti democracy. The will of the people is not what you think, it is what the majority thinks. An armed revolt would be nothing less than overturning the will of the people.
Not that I am actually worried. You guys are nothing but bombast.
thaskalos
10-11-2016, 05:21 PM
Funny, I've always thought of you as John Cleese's assistant from the rat race movie...The guy he proclaimed as having been born with no Personality.
Go back to your passive aggressive self. No original thought, just jumping in and out of threads.
Compared to you...who is the paragon of wisdom around here. :ThmbUp:
Saratoga_Mike
10-11-2016, 05:39 PM
If Trump viewed Bill Clinton as a rapist and Hillary as his enabler, why did he invite them to his 2005 wedding? Why did Trump play golf with Bill post 1998? Ignorance? That can't be the case. Trump is the king of gossip (Page Six is the first thing he turns to in the morning, trust me); he had to know about Bill's skeletons. So Trump played golf with someone he considered a rapist? And he invited Bill and his enabler wife to his wedding? Not to get sidetracked, but it was a great, great wedding. It's almost, just almost, like he didn't really believe any of this before Hillary was his political opponent. Almost. But Trump is a man integrity, might I say of unimpeachable integrity. A virtuous man. Therefore, I don't believe for a second that he would be such a political opportunist.
Saratoga_Mike
10-11-2016, 05:42 PM
The answer to that is simple. Republicans are stupid.
Try - Nationalism and populism play well with the GOP base, just like handouts play well with your base.
thaskalos
10-11-2016, 05:42 PM
If Trump viewed Bill Clinton as a rapist and Hillary as his enabler, why did he invite them to his 2005 wedding? Why did Trump play golf with Bill post 1998? Ignorance? That can't be the case. Trump is the king of gossip (Page Six is the first thing he turns to in the morning, trust me); he had to know about Bill's skeletons. So Trump played golf with someone he considered a rapist? And he invited Bill and his enabler wife to his wedding? Not to get sidetracked, but it was a great, great wedding. It's almost, just almost, like he didn't really believe any of this before Hillary was his political opponent. Almost. But Trump is a man integrity, might I say of unimpeachable integrity. A virtuous man. Therefore, I don't believe for a second that he would be such a political opportunist.
Me NEITHER! :ThmbUp:
mostpost
10-11-2016, 05:45 PM
Then why are DEMOCRATS opposed to Voter ID... No test require only PROOF you are who you claim to be. But instead claim it will disenfranchise THEIR Black and Latino voters. Lets see could pass a test, but can't apply for ID Card.
Because it solves a problem that does not exist. The number of persons who attempted to vote as someone else is far less than miniscule; something like one out of every 50,000,000 voters. The effectiveness of such a scheme is non existent.
Because for the typical inner city or poor black or latino, obtaining the proper ID is much more difficult than for a typical white voter. Many don't have cars; many can't get time off from work. Many don't have the documentation necessary to obtain voter ID.
EasyGoer89
10-11-2016, 05:47 PM
If Trump viewed Bill Clinton as a rapist and Hillary as his enabler, why did he invite them to his 2005 wedding? Why did Trump play golf with Bill post 1998? Ignorance? That can't be the case. Trump is the king of gossip (Page Six is the first thing he turns to in the morning, trust me); he had to know about Bill's skeletons. So Trump played golf with someone he considered a rapist? And he invited Bill and his enabler wife to his wedding? Not to get sidetracked, but it was a great, great wedding. It's almost, just almost, like he didn't really believe any of this before Hillary was his political opponent. Almost. But Trump is a man integrity, might I say of unimpeachable integrity. A virtuous man. Therefore, I don't believe for a second that he would be such a political opportunist.
Because he's a smart businessman and if a businessman can play golf and socialize with high powered people, you do it. He could care less about Bills skeletons, all he cared at the time was doing right for his business and brand, he did what 100 pct of us would have done in the same situation.
I did mention in another thread that Trump has pretty strong integrity, if he didn't, your camp wouldn't be talking about Miss Piggy from 20 years ago, if there was anything out there that happened more recently and was damning, that's what would be being discussed.
When I see 20 year old rumors about a comment that he allegedly made but was never verified, I know the guy is pretty clean if that's all they have.
Saratoga_Mike
10-11-2016, 05:51 PM
. The number of persons who attempted to vote as someone else is far less than miniscule; 1) something like one out of every 50,000,000 voters.
Because for the typical inner city or poor black or latino, 2) obtaining the proper ID is much more difficult than for a typical white voter. Many don't have cars; many can't get time off from work. Many don't have the documentation necessary to obtain voter ID.
1) So there were just about 3 fraudulent votes cast in the 2012 presidential election? One of your stupidest claims of all time.
2) Black and Latino voters aren't capable of obtaining IDs -- patronizing and condescending. Well played.
CORRECTION: THE stupidest thing you've ever said, not one of the stupidest. Sorry about that.
mostpost
10-11-2016, 05:53 PM
Number of years in School does not translate into Intelligence. It's not like a balance scale. As for more " Educated People" supporting Socialist Democratic Doctrine. Well no surprise when Academia welcomes the likes of Bill Ayers... Bernardine Dohrn... Kathy Boudin. You think these radicals and their ilk are teaching the American Values. Where the students protest different or opposing views instead of hearing them out and discussing the merits of each or simply defending their learned view.
"American Values" consist of more than just your narrow views. Milton Friedmann did more damage to American than Bill Ayers, Bernadine Dohrn, and Kathy Boudin combined. His economic theories and the attempts to employ them killed thousands in Chile, Argentina, Uraguay and Boliva. Boudin was responsible for four deaths.
Saratoga_Mike
10-11-2016, 05:58 PM
Because he's a smart businessman and if a businessman can play golf and socialize with high powered people, you do it. He could care less about Bills skeletons, all he cared at the time was doing right for his business and brand, he did what 100 pct of us would have done in the same situation.
I did mention in another thread that Trump has pretty strong integrity, if he didn't, your camp wouldn't be talking about Miss Piggy from 20 years ago, if there was anything out there that happened more recently and was damning, that's what would be being discussed.
When I see 20 year old rumors about a comment that he allegedly made but was never verified, I know the guy is pretty clean if that's all they have.
I love it. I had the businessman thing in my last sentence and deleted it, knowing some Trump sycophant would post that. God's honest truth. If Trump were alive during WWII and he sold gas ovens to the Nazis,* it would be just business, too, right? If it's business, it must never, ever be questioned. Never.
And before you reflexively call me an American-hating left-winger. My positions on almost all major issues are equally or more conservative than Trump's.
*I am not comparing Trump to a Nazi. It's an analogy. It's hyperbolic to make a point.
As for the bolded part, wow.
Saratoga_Mike
10-11-2016, 06:01 PM
"American Values" consist of more than just your narrow views. Milton Friedmann did more damage to American than Bill Ayers, Bernadine Dohrn, and Kathy Boudin combined. His economic theories and the attempts to employ them killed thousands in Chile, Argentina, Uraguay and Boliva. Boudin was responsible for four deaths.
You read one Mother Jones or Nation article on Milton Freidman (you made this same silly point before), and you think you're an expert. It's like your knowledge of the healthcare system: superficial at best.
Saratoga_Mike
10-11-2016, 06:09 PM
Boiling down the prior absurd defense of Trump:
"Sure he golfed with a rapist. He had to -- it was good business."
God save the country.
thaskalos
10-11-2016, 06:10 PM
Boiling down the prior absurd defense of Trump:
"Sure he golfed with a rapist. He had to -- it was good business."
God save the country.
But, NO...he can't be "bought"...because he is already "ultra-rich". :)
Marshall Bennett
10-11-2016, 06:26 PM
The answer to that is simple. Republicans are stupid.
A 12 year old couldn't have said it better. A blanket assessment of tens of millions. With all due respect, your post is stupid. :ThmbDown:
mostpost
10-11-2016, 06:34 PM
1) So there were just about 3 fraudulent votes cast in the 2012 presidential election? One of your stupidest claims of all time.
2) Black and Latino voters aren't capable of obtaining IDs -- patronizing and condescending. Well played.
CORRECTION: THE stupidest thing you've ever said, not one of the stupidest. Sorry about that.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2014/08/06/a-comprehensive-investigation-of-voter-impersonation-finds-31-credible-incidents-out
OK, you got me. It wasn't on in 50,000,000. It was one in 32,000,000. 31 incidents of voter ID fraud in 1,000,000,000 votes cast.
2) What a ridiculous statement. The difference is I want blacks and Latinos to vote. Clearly you don't.
dartman51
10-11-2016, 07:06 PM
Because it solves a problem that does not exist. The number of persons who attempted to vote as someone else is far less than miniscule; something like one out of every 50,000,000 voters. The effectiveness of such a scheme is non existent.
Because for the typical inner city or poor black or latino, obtaining the proper ID is much more difficult than for a typical white voter. Many don't have cars; many can't get time off from work. Many don't have the documentation necessary to obtain voter ID.
What a phreaking moron. Those SAME people have to have an ID, to collect welfare. Those SAME people have to have an ID, to get their food stamps. Those SAME people have to have an ID to buy alcohol. Those SAME people have to have an ID to buy cigarettes. But you think that they are too stupid, or just plain incapable, of getting an ID. You, sir, are pathetic. :faint:
Clocker
10-11-2016, 07:27 PM
Milton Friedmann did more damage to American than Bill Ayers, Bernadine Dohrn, and Kathy Boudin combined. His economic theories and the attempts to employ them killed thousands in Chile, Argentina, Uraguay and Boliva.
This is absolute nonsense and you are way over your head here. It's not relevant to the discussion, so I won't go into details. The most obvious of this crap came out of Chile. A military junta staged a coup. The junta rationalized the need for the coup in part based on the need for free markets in the country. The economic theory was provided by some former students of Friedman, Chileans who had studied economics at the University of Chicago. These Chilean economists were propped up and funded by the CIA.
So, a junta and the CIA stage a coup, justify it in part on the need for free markets, and it is all Friedman's fault. What a maroon. :rolleyes:
But thank god for the ever alert Hillary Clinton, no doubt saving thousands of American lives by suddenly flip-flopping and opposing free trade.
classhandicapper
10-11-2016, 07:27 PM
If Trump viewed Bill Clinton as a rapist and Hillary as his enabler, why did he invite them to his 2005 wedding? Why did Trump play golf with Bill post 1998? Ignorance? That can't be the case. Trump is the king of gossip (Page Six is the first thing he turns to in the morning, trust me); he had to know about Bill's skeletons. So Trump played golf with someone he considered a rapist? And he invited Bill and his enabler wife to his wedding?
If Trump is the racist, bigot, misogynist, and sexist that the Clintons and everyone in the media is portraying him to be, why did all these enlightened liberals go to his wedding, give him TV shows, take his donations, work for him, and do a ton of business with him?
Perhaps he has legitimate economic and security concerns related to massive illegal immigration and a bunch of leftist douchebags in the media are using his lack of political skills to twist him into Hitler so the lemmings will be afraid of him.
Clocker
10-11-2016, 07:29 PM
What a phreaking moron. Those SAME people have to have an ID, to collect welfare. Those SAME people have to have an ID, to get their food stamps. Those SAME people have to have an ID to buy alcohol. Those SAME people have to have an ID to buy cigarettes. But you think that they are too stupid, or just plain incapable, of getting an ID. You, sir, are pathetic. :faint:
And there are zero white people living in similar circumstances. :D
Clocker
10-11-2016, 07:34 PM
The difference is I want blacks and Latinos to vote. Clearly you don't.
Amazing how you can read minds and intuit intent of people you have never met and know little or nothing about.
And you can sniff out a conspiracy of white supremacist based on the simple fact that they are the only people in this country advocating voter ID.
Clocker
10-11-2016, 07:40 PM
What a phreaking moron. Those SAME people have to have an ID, to collect welfare. Those SAME people have to have an ID, to get their food stamps. Those SAME people have to have an ID to buy alcohol. Those SAME people have to have an ID to buy cigarettes. But you think that they are too stupid, or just plain incapable, of getting an ID. You, sir, are pathetic. :faint:
Obviously, it is racist to require minorities to have IDs to exercise their rights to welfare, food stamps, buying tobacco and alcohol, drive, rent an apartment, etc. When are we going to put an end to this racist persecution?
Only whites should be required to show IDs when asked.
Come to think of it, that would be sexist. So, only white men should be required to have IDs.
thaskalos
10-11-2016, 07:40 PM
Perhaps he has legitimate economic and security concerns related to massive illegal immigration and a bunch of leftist douchebags in the media are using his lack of political skills to twist him into Hitler so the lemmings will be afraid of him.
Perhaps. But it's just as likely that the lemmings on the right are so enamoured with their "White Knight" that they can't objectively see what's right in front of their nose. Lets not forget that only 33 of the members here voted that Hillary won the first debate...while 41 people voted for either Trump, or "neither"...although the first debate's results were rather obvious.
With poll results such as these...one can hardly take the opinions here seriously.
Clocker
10-11-2016, 07:45 PM
I love it. I had the businessman thing in my last sentence and deleted it, knowing some Trump sycophant would post that.
Trump has been a smart businessman as long as the business is the selling of Donald Trump. It doesn't look like he is going to close the deal on his latest big project.
classhandicapper
10-11-2016, 08:11 PM
Perhaps. But it's just as likely that the lemmings on the right are so enamoured with their "White Knight" that they can't objectively see what's right in front of their nose. Lets not forget that only 33 of the members here voted that Hillary won the first debate...while 41 people voted for either Trump, or "neither"...although the first debate's results were rather obvious.
With poll results such as these...one can hardly take the opinions here seriously.
I have no issue with immigration when it's done legally, in numbers that make sense for the communities that are accepting them, where people are screened for illnesses and possible terrorist ties, and where the immigrants are coming to assimilate and help contribute to what the US has long been about. It worked really well for a long time.
I have huge legitimate economic, security, and health concerns about the wide open borders we have now.
No one that has ever known me well could possibly think my concerns have anything to with the ethnicity or religion of the immigrants. It's about security and economics. I trust that you believe me.
Yet if I was running for office I'd be painted as a racist, xenophobe, bigot etc... by the media.
Sure there are some bigots out there that support Trump. They exist at both ends of the spectrum. But there are others like me. Their priorities on this issue, trade, the size of government, the role of the Supreme Court etc... work to override the fact that Trump is an asshole.
I'm still on the fence about who to vote for. I've eliminated Hillary. I'll probably wind up throwing away my vote yet again, but I could easily see someone like me voting for Trump.
I despise the US media and have a very low opinion of people willing to promote policies that raise costs and risks for their own personal political gain.
Clocker
10-11-2016, 08:12 PM
The evil James O'Keefe strikes again. Newly released video shows the Democratic election commissioner from Manhattan stating that there is voter fraud in minority neighborhoods in NY.
He’s the Democratic commissioner from Manhattan. He knows what he’s talking about, and he’s confirming every right-wing suspicion about voter fraud. Yes, voters get bused around to vote multiple times (by local pols, he implies); yes, of course it’s irresponsible not to require something as simple as a state-issued ID to vote; yes, even some voters who do have IDs are suspect because the state doesn’t rigorously demand proof of identity when applying for the ID card. The guy goes so far as to admit that Democratic corruption on voting has made him question his party affiliation.
http://hotair.com/archives/2016/10/11/wow-nyc-election-official-claims-voter-fraud-minority-neighborhoods-new-james-okeefe-video/ (http://hotair.com/archives/2016/10/11/wow-nyc-election-official-claims-voter-fraud-minority-neighborhoods-new-james-okeefe-video/)
MargieRose
10-11-2016, 08:23 PM
Facebook posting: Excellent!
I am still voting for Trump! Angie Hoffman said it best.....I was asked tonight how I could ever support Trump after the comments he made over 11 years ago about women and if I would still support him if he made those comments to my daughter? My response was this....If he had put our nations security at risk, I would not vote for him. If his organization received large donations from countries that killed women and gays, I would not vote for him. If he boasted 30 Years of government experience, but still could not discern if an email was classified or not, without someone letting him know if it was or not, I would not vote for him. If he boasted about how he has defended children his entire life, but is for abortion, (even late term, when the child can feel pain) I would not vote for him. If he wanted my 3 year old Granddaughter to go to restrooms with men dressed as women, I would not vote for him. I have taught my daughter and will teach my granddaughter to disregard sexist remarks and move on, especially when they were made so many years ago and, also to forgive those who say they are sorry. If he caused lives to be destroyed in Benghazi and then lied to the faces of the parents as they stood at their child's casket, I would not vote for him. If people who came against him mysteriously turned up dead, I would not vote for him. If he suddenly developed a southern accent when he was in the South, campaigning, I would not vote for him. If he continually broke the law and that was ignored, I would not vote for him, but right now, the only person who does all these things is Hillary. Right now, the fact that Donald made these remarks over 12 years ago, does not move me. I'm bigger than those remarks and we all have said stupid things throughout our lives. To me, the fact that Hillary lies continuously, is a much bigger problem. ... Rant over... Still voting for Trump.
EMD4ME
10-11-2016, 08:42 PM
Facebook posting: Excellent!
I am still voting for Trump! Angie Hoffman said it best.....I was asked tonight how I could ever support Trump after the comments he made over 11 years ago about women and if I would still support him if he made those comments to my daughter? My response was this....If he had put our nations security at risk, I would not vote for him. If his organization received large donations from countries that killed women and gays, I would not vote for him. If he boasted 30 Years of government experience, but still could not discern if an email was classified or not, without someone letting him know if it was or not, I would not vote for him. If he boasted about how he has defended children his entire life, but is for abortion, (even late term, when the child can feel pain) I would not vote for him. If he wanted my 3 year old Granddaughter to go to restrooms with men dressed as women, I would not vote for him. I have taught my daughter and will teach my granddaughter to disregard sexist remarks and move on, especially when they were made so many years ago and, also to forgive those who say they are sorry. If he caused lives to be destroyed in Benghazi and then lied to the faces of the parents as they stood at their child's casket, I would not vote for him. If people who came against him mysteriously turned up dead, I would not vote for him. If he suddenly developed a southern accent when he was in the South, campaigning, I would not vote for him. If he continually broke the law and that was ignored, I would not vote for him, but right now, the only person who does all these things is Hillary. Right now, the fact that Donald made these remarks over 12 years ago, does not move me. I'm bigger than those remarks and we all have said stupid things throughout our lives. To me, the fact that Hillary lies continuously, is a much bigger problem. ... Rant over... Still voting for Trump.
Extremely well said :3: :ThmbUp: :ThmbUp: :ThmbUp:
Nice to see that you yourself don't believe in "stereotyping"...
See Post #76.
ElKabong
10-11-2016, 09:59 PM
Facebook posting: Excellent!
I am still voting for Trump! Angie Hoffman said it best.....I was asked tonight how I could ever support Trump after the comments he made over 11 years ago about women and if I would still support him if he made those comments to my daughter? My response was this....If he had put our nations security at risk, I would not vote for him. If his organization received large donations from countries that killed women and gays, I would not vote for him. If he boasted 30 Years of government experience, but still could not discern if an email was classified or not, without someone letting him know if it was or not, I would not vote for him. If he boasted about how he has defended children his entire life, but is for abortion, (even late term, when the child can feel pain) I would not vote for him. If he wanted my 3 year old Granddaughter to go to restrooms with men dressed as women, I would not vote for him. I have taught my daughter and will teach my granddaughter to disregard sexist remarks and move on, especially when they were made so many years ago and, also to forgive those who say they are sorry. If he caused lives to be destroyed in Benghazi and then lied to the faces of the parents as they stood at their child's casket, I would not vote for him. If people who came against him mysteriously turned up dead, I would not vote for him. If he suddenly developed a southern accent when he was in the South, campaigning, I would not vote for him. If he continually broke the law and that was ignored, I would not vote for him, but right now, the only person who does all these things is Hillary. Right now, the fact that Donald made these remarks over 12 years ago, does not move me. I'm bigger than those remarks and we all have said stupid things throughout our lives. To me, the fact that Hillary lies continuously, is a much bigger problem. ... Rant over... Still voting for Trump.
Very good!
Burls
10-11-2016, 10:09 PM
Desperations of the left....that is a horse for the course.
Trump apologized.
Clinton lied about it.
Hillary lied about the vast right wing conspiracy and then attacked the victims.
You tell ME who the slimeballs are in all of this.
The word is that things are pretty icy at the Clinton household during mealtimes.
Conversation is pretty much at a standstill.
I imagine it is hard for Bill to carry on a conversation looking at the fly on her face.
horses4courses
10-11-2016, 10:23 PM
The word is that things are pretty icy at the Clinton household during mealtimes.
Conversation is pretty much at a standstill.
How often do you think they actually eat together?
This ain't the Waltons.........
proximity
10-11-2016, 10:45 PM
This ain't the Waltons.........
i did NOT have sexual relations with corabeth godsey or the baldwin sisters? :cool:
OntheRail
10-11-2016, 10:49 PM
Because it solves a problem that does not exist. The number of persons who attempted to vote as someone else is far less than miniscule; something like one out of every 50,000,000 voters. The effectiveness of such a scheme is non existent.
Because for the typical inner city or poor black or latino, obtaining the proper ID is much more difficult than for a typical white voter. Many don't have cars; many can't get time off from work. Many don't have the documentation necessary to obtain voter ID.
It exist... Like Ohio in 12 with a Democratic Pole Worker if you can believe it. An ID from the State is require for MANY MANY transaction including Employment. But if it stops just ONE fraudulent Vote it's valid. Do it for the children.
Many don't have the documentation necessary to obtain voter ID.
Could it be they don't have it cause they are not citizens.... :faint:
This ain't the Waltons.........
It must be hard for Bill to concentrate with a slut under his dining room table on her kness.
mostpost
10-12-2016, 12:29 AM
This is absolute nonsense and you are way over your head here. It's not relevant to the discussion, so I won't go into details. The most obvious of this crap came out of Chile. A military junta staged a coup. The junta rationalized the need for the coup in part based on the need for free markets in the country. The economic theory was provided by some former students of Friedman, Chileans who had studied economics at the University of Chicago. These Chilean economists were propped up and funded by the CIA.
So, a junta and the CIA stage a coup, justify it in part on the need for free markets, and it is all Friedman's fault. What a maroon. :rolleyes:
But thank god for the ever alert Hillary Clinton, no doubt saving thousands of American lives by suddenly flip-flopping and opposing free trade.
I am really tired of you telling me I am in way over my head, you pompous ass. Naomi Klein's "The Shock Doctrine" tells the story very well. If only you have the sense to listen. Pinochet knew nothing about economics.
Freidman and his henchmen had been looking for this opportunity for years. They rushed into the vacuum and persuaded Pinochet to set up their dream of an absolute free market.
For the first year and a half, Pinochet followed Friedman's rules. He privatized many state owned companies; he allowed cutting edge new forms of speculative finance; he eliminated tariffs; he cut spending drastically;he eliminated price controls.
The results? In 1974 inflation reached 375%. The market was flooded with foreign goods at cheaper prices. Local businesses were unable to compete and were forced to close. Unemployment reached record levels.
Quite the opposite of what you imply above, Milton Friedman was not a disinterested bystander in all of this. In March 1975 he made a trip to Chile. Totally unmoved by the suffering around him, he urged Pinochet to double down on the policies he recommended. Cutting spending by 10% didn't work; cut it by 25%.
Pinochet followed the advice. He appointed Sergio de Castro as economics minister and finance minister. DeCastro cut public spending by 27% that first year and cut it in half in five years. He privatized 500 state owned companies and banks and eliminated even more trade barriers resulting in the loss of 177,000 industrial jobs.
It cost a Chilean family 74% of its income just to buy bread. Which meant they could not buy milk. And the kids could not get milk at school because the junta had eliminated the school milk program. Friedman hates those bleeding heart social programs.
In 1982, after nine years of Friedmanomics, Chile's economy crashed. Its debt explosed, it faced hyperinflation, unemployment reached 30%.
JustRalph
10-12-2016, 01:19 AM
I would guess most of that post is from the book?
EasyGoer89
10-12-2016, 02:43 AM
Change the title to 'what he said vs what she said AND did'
Its debt explosed
Wow, sorry I missed that!
classhandicapper
10-12-2016, 08:06 AM
Mosty,
I don't know the details of what happened in Chile, but if you cut government spending and get flooded with CHEAP IMPORTS that won't cause inflation.
So here's my guess on what really happened (same script everywhere).
It sounds to me like Chile had a massive debt problem, politicians made promises to the people that their economy could not deliver on, and they had become a cesspool of inefficiency that could not compete in the real world.
So they printed a ton of money (as they all do).
They got some some sound advice (privatize some assets to pay down debt, cut spending etc..), but these kinds of reforms are always very painful in the short term. It's hard to undo decades of mismanagement whether we are talking about a company or a country.
What they did was not enough to prevent the inevitable economic catastrophe that comes from making promises you cannot keep and trying to print your way out of it - much like has been occurring in recent years in the US.
What happened in Chile is the future of the US if we stay on the same path.
Clocker
10-12-2016, 08:55 AM
I am really tired of you telling me I am in way over my head, you pompous ass. Naomi Klein's "The Shock Doctrine" tells the story very well. If only you have the sense to listen. Pinochet knew nothing about economics.
Naomi Klein is in way over her head and knows nothing about economics. She is a Canadian "journalist" and a "social activist" who is opposed to globalization and "corporate capitalism". She has no academic or practical credentials in economics or business. The very premise here is nuts and typical conspiracy theory. A military junta and the CIA screw up the economy and she blames it on Milton Friedman.
Apparently, she also blames the Russian constitutional crisis of 1993 on Friedman's teachings. From the WIKI summary, everyone from the Cato Institute to the NY Times says she is clueless.
In the London Review of Books, Stephen Holmes criticizes The Shock Doctrine as naïve, and opines that it conflates "'free market orthodoxy' with predatory corporate behaviour."[16] John Willman of the Financial Times describes it as "a deeply flawed work that blends together disparate phenomena to create a beguiling – but ultimately dishonest– argument."[17] Tom Redburn in the New York Times states that "what she is most blind to is the necessary role of entrepreneurial capitalism in overcoming the inherent tendency of any established social system to lapse into stagnation".[18]
Jonathan Chait wrote in The New Republic that Klein "pays shockingly (but, given her premises, unsurprisingly) little attention to right-wing ideas. She recognizes that neoconservatism sits at the heart of the Iraq war project, but she does not seem to know what neoconservatism is; and she makes no effort to find out."[19] Robert Cole from The Times said, "Klein derides the 'disaster capitalism complex' and the profits and privatisations that go with it but she does not supply a cogently argued critique of free market principles, and without this The Shock Doctrine descends into a muddle of stories that are often worrying, sometimes interesting, and occasionally bizarre."[20]
Economist Tyler Cowen, who called Klein's rhetoric "ridiculous" and the book a "true economics disaster", says that the book contains "a series of fabricated claims, such as the suggestion that Margaret Thatcher created the Falkland Islands crisis to crush the unions and foist unfettered capitalism upon an unwilling British public."[21]
Fred Kaplan said that Naomi Klein's depiction of the 1993 Russian constitutional crisis as a "clash between Chicago-style capitalists and honorable, fledgling democrats" is ludicrous.[22]
Johan Norberg of the Cato Institute criticizes the book, saying that "Klein's analysis is hopelessly flawed at virtually every level". Norberg finds fault with specifics of the analysis, such as with the Chinese government crackdown on the Tiananmen Square protests of 1989. He argues that, rather than crushing opposition to pro-market reforms (as Klein would have it), the crackdown itself caused liberalization to stall for years.[23]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Shock_Doctrine#Favorable (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Shock_Doctrine#Favorable)
Clocker
10-12-2016, 08:56 AM
Wow, sorry I missed that!
I think that was because of global warming.
I also missed the he posted Its instead It's...a big deal for him when someone else does it.
mostpost
10-12-2016, 03:29 PM
I also missed the he posted Its instead It's...a big deal for him when someone else does it.
Except that you are wrong. In this case the possessive does not take the apostrophe. It's is a contraction of it is. "Its debt" refers to the debt possessed by Chile.
Sorry, I was distracted by explosed.
mostpost
10-12-2016, 04:14 PM
Naomi Klein is in way over her head and knows nothing about economics. She is a Canadian "journalist" and a "social activist" who is opposed to globalization and "corporate capitalism". She has no academic or practical credentials in economics or business. The very premise here is nuts and typical conspiracy theory. A military junta and the CIA screw up the economy and she blames it on Milton Friedman.
Apparently, she also blames the Russian constitutional crisis of 1993 on Friedman's teachings. From the WIKI summary, everyone from the Cato Institute to the NY Times says she is clueless.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Shock_Doctrine#Favorable (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Shock_Doctrine#Favorable)
Hmm. Another person you think is in way over her head. I don't know what Ms. Klein's economic bona fides are and I don't think it matters. She isn't arguing economic theory and she isn't writing a text book on economics. What she has done is written a book which documents the abuses of a particular theory of economics. I don't mean capitalism in general. I mean that form of capitalism in which the capitalist is given free rein to whatever he chooses subject only to the strictures of a non existent free market.
The only difference between the economists of the Chicago School in Chile and all those other countries and the Bolsheviks in Russia is that the Bolsheviks shot the dissidents themselves.
As for the reviews of the book; the wikipedia article you link to shows 10 favorable reviews and 8 unfavorable. Somehow you neglected to mention the favorable ones.
mostpost
10-12-2016, 04:18 PM
Sorry, I was distracted by explosed.
You never heard of the word explosed?
Here is an example of someone being explosed.
https://news.grabien.com/story-video-2008-campaign-appears-show-obama-flaunting-erection-fe
EasyGoer89
10-28-2016, 07:20 PM
You never heard of the word explosed?
Here is an example of someone being explosed.
https://news.grabien.com/story-video-2008-campaign-appears-show-obama-flaunting-erection-fe
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