Remarkable Accomplishment By Andy Serling.

[Tara73]

He will have a positive ROI on his top selections in 2016. Amazing accomplishment!!

[EMD4ME]

Way to go TLG ! :ThmbUp:

[098poi]

Wow I can congratulate Andy before the thread takes a U turn.

Congratulations!

[cj]

That is very tough to do making picks in every race...well done indeed.

[horses4courses]

I saw TLG's Twitter post earlier.
A fine accomplishment for a public handicapper.
Even more so, when you consider how contentious the racing is at Saratoga. :ThmbUp:

Andy Serling ‏@andyserling 5h5 hours ago With the win by Hockey School in the #Saratoga 12th, I have guaranteed a positive ROI for my top selection for this meet. Haters rejoice!!!

[Tom]

Nice job Andy. :ThmbUp: :ThmbUp: :ThmbUp:
Tough track to do that at.
Not there is an easy one....

Now, what insights do you have about the Weiner Dog races at Canterbury Monday? :D

[Alwaysonpoint36]

He will have a positive ROI on his top selections in 2016. Amazing accomplishment!!

what was the original post before the cj edit?

:confused:

[EMD4ME]

what was the original post before the cj edit?

:confused:

I think CJ just added that it's for the Saratoga meet.

[KidCapper]

That is a hell of an accomplishment. I've been a hot hit n miss n miss mess at Saratoga this year. Congrats Andy.

[rsetup]

Quite an accomplishment. Well done.

On a related note, I recall reading in one of the forums that one of the NY paper handicappers, from days gone by, also had a positive ROI at some point. Anyone have any info on this?

And, I believe DrugS might've done the same at PID

[illinoisbred]

With all the shippers and super competitive racing,that's a tough task. Excellent work,congrats!

[cj]

what was the original post before the cj edit?

:confused:

Year added. Initial poster wanted that for some reason.

[mannyberrios]

Congratulations, Andy

[reckless]

WTG! Andy.

Also the show on Fox with the gang was/is great.

[Alwaysonpoint36]

I think CJ just added that it's for the Saratoga meet.


cool, thought it was another im an andy serling fan but....

[EMD4ME]

cool, thought it was another im an andy serling fan but....

Uh oh.....don't say that. I hope we still have time before this thread gets closed. :lol: :lol:

[Broad Brush]

Great job by Andy.

With all of the 2yo races with no form included this is really an
amazing thing to do.

I hope he had a winning meet at the windows.

Keep it going at Belmont!

[P Matties Jr]

Congrats Little Andy. All without any Dennis Lalman horses, either. Nice work

[olddaddy]

Very Tough to do. Hope it added some bulk to his billfold not just a pat on the back.

[BMustang]

I have always respected Andy's opinion on horses that have raced in New York. After all he has seen virtually every race run at Aqueduct and Belmont during the past year, with the exception of a few inner track offerings while he had his gig at Gulfstream Park.

He is obviously one of the most knowledgeable persons on the planet of that circuit and as a result was able to plug in enough winners on top to produce a positive ROI - not an easy thing to do.

Congratulations on a great meet and keep up the good work!

[PhantomOnTour]

Nice job Andy

[jefftune]

WTG Andy! Certainly better than I did this meet. Andy does his homework and does a great job.

[the little guy]

Thanks everyone. It was nice to make up for last year's debacle.

[Zydeco]

Great job Andy!

[thespaah]

That is very tough to do making picks in every race...well done indeed.
And the fact that he like other public handicappers have to make their picks well in advance.

[v j stauffer]

I saw TLG's Twitter post earlier.
A fine accomplishment for a public handicapper.
Even more so, when you consider how contentious the racing is at Saratoga. :ThmbUp:

Actually the fact Saratoga is so contentious makes something like this possible.

Imagine trying it at GGF.

That being said.

Anytime a person can show a positive ROI when forced to make a selection in every race.

That person has handicapped brilliantly.

Congrats to TLG on a job well done :ThmbUp:

[EMD4ME]

Actually the fact Saratoga is so contentious makes something like this possible.

Imagine trying it at GGF.

That being said.

Anytime a person can show a positive ROI when forced to make a selection in every race.

That person has handicapped brilliantly.

Congrats to TLG on a job well done :ThmbUp:

Classy Vic.

I am proud of you :ThmbUp:

[horses4courses]

Actually the fact Saratoga is so contentious makes something like this possible

That had crossed my mind.
A major reason why betting Saratoga is so attractive to players.

Still, there aren't many handicappers around who could achieve this.

[v j stauffer]

That had crossed my mind.
A major reason why betting Saratoga is so attractive to players.

Still, there aren't many handicappers around who could achieve this.

Precious few.

[ReplayRandall]

Thanks everyone. It was nice to make up for last year's debacle.

With all sincerity, a remarkable turnaround from last year's results. If you don't mind, what was the catalyst that prompted such a robust turn of events, this year?

[NorCalGreg]

With all sincerity, a remarkable turnaround from last year's results. If you don't mind, what was the catalyst that prompted such a robust turn of events, this year?


I got an order for PACE VIEW from a guy in New York....maybe it was Andy? :D

[cj]

With all sincerity, a remarkable turnaround from last year's results. If you don't mind, what was the catalyst that prompted such a robust turn of events, this year?

Maybe Andy will verify, but pretty sure he did this the year before last too, or at least in the last few years. Maybe last year was the aberration.

[EMD4ME]

I got an order for PACE VIEW from a guy in New York....maybe it was Andy? :D

Nooooooo. That was me :lol:

[NorCalGreg]

Nooooooo. That was me :lol:

LOL...okay I figured it was a professional player :ThmbUp:

Actually..I've gotten at least a dozen NY orders

They all say the same thing:

"YO...SEND ME YOUR SOFTWARE--AND IT BETTER WORK --OR ELSE"

[MONEY]

"YO...SEND ME YOUR SOFTWARE--AND IT BETTER WORK --OR ELSE"

That's not the way a New Yorker would threaten you.
It would be more like this.

You send me the software bro and if it works everything will be copacetic.
If it don't, I'm cool with that, I'll even help you shop for a new eye patch.

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

That's not the way a New Yorker would threaten you.
It would be more like this.

You send me the software bro and if it works everything will be copacetic.
If it don't, I'm cool with that, I'll even help you shop for a new eye patch.

If it's a Sicilian New Yorker don't be alarmed if he screams at you, nothing to worry about as he is not really mad. If he smiles at you run for your life . ha ha I am Sicilian so I can laugh at this!!

[thespaah]

If it's a Sicilian New Yorker don't be alarmed if he screams at you, nothing to worry about as he is not really mad. If he smiles at you run for your life . ha ha I am Sicilian so I can laugh at this!!
I grew up in the NY Metro area. I can attest to this.
Most of the families on my street were of Italian descent. They would scream at their kids, but they never seemed to get punished.

[EMD4ME]

If it's a Sicilian New Yorker don't be alarmed if he screams at you, nothing to worry about as he is not really mad. If he smiles at you run for your life . ha ha I am Sicilian so I can laugh at this!!

Well said Belmont, absolutely true!

[EMD4ME]

With all sincerity, a remarkable turnaround from last year's results. If you don't mind, what was the catalyst that prompted such a robust turn of events, this year?

In no way shape or form am I speaking for TLG but I want to say this:

This year, I don't remember flipping out too much (or often for the record) about rides and peculiar stuff.


Last year, I went ballistic in a few, peculiar races.

So, when things are "normal" of course someone of Andy's talents will show a positive ROI. When pp's are running upside down (2015), even the genius of geniuses will show a negative ROI.

My 2 cents.

[Robert Fischer]

just shows how awesome Serling is, and how awesome Saratoga is.

[thaskalos]

In no way shape or form am I speaking for TLG but I want to say this:

This year, I don't remember flipping out too much (or often for the record) about rides and peculiar stuff.


Last year, I went ballistic in a few, peculiar races.

So, when things are "normal" of course someone of Andy's talents will show a positive ROI. When pp's are running upside down (2015), even the genius of geniuses will show a negative ROI.

My 2 cents.
Excuses, excuses... :)

[EMD4ME]

Excuses, excuses... :)

Very funny my friend but for me to type it, it has validity.

Around the end of the meet in 2015, there was a race where I flipped out and 10 minutes later, TLG was so fuming, Jason Blewitt was too scared to even speak to Andy on air. Andy said : 'What would you do if you read the PP's, handicapped hard, bet your money and then the horses ran backwards to what you read, because you studied the incorrect day's program? Well that's exactly what happened in the race we just saw. Fill in blanks, these jockeys etc etc etc etc '.

I felt exactly the same way as I watched a stone closer take the lead and wire a turf route with many other speeds.

I'm smart enough to know that I don't know AND I'm smart enough to know when some "peculiar crap" happens.


Funny reply though :ThmbUp: :lol:

[thaskalos]

Very funny my friend but for me to type it, it has validity.

Around the end of the meet in 2015, there was a race where I flipped out and 10 minutes later, TLG was so fuming, Jason Blewitt was too scared to even speak to Andy on air. Andy said : 'What would you do if you read the PP's, handicapped hard, bet your money and then the horses ran backwards to what you read, because you studied the incorrect day's program? Well that's exactly what happened in the race we just saw. Fill in blanks, these jockeys etc etc etc etc '.

I felt exactly the same way as I watched a stone closer take the lead and wire a turf route with many other speeds.

I'm smart enough to know that I don't know AND I'm smart enough to know when some "peculiar crap" happens.


Funny reply though :ThmbUp: :lol:

I agree with you...and this "peculiar crap" happens to me too, just as it happens to everyone else who plays this game. The game is what it is...and it won't change just to make the horseplayer's life easier.

IMO...it isn't wise to hold high expectations for a particular race meet...especially when the meet is as abbreviated as the Saratoga meet is. It makes no difference at all to me what my results are during any short race meet...because I know that ANYTHING could happen in the short run. Yes...TLG's performance at Saratoga this year was remarkable and praise-worthy. But, if he has confidence in himself as a handicapper and bettor...he probably did the same handicapping and betting job this year as he did the last...and the differing results are probably attributed to chance.

In this game, the most the horseplayer can do is play his best game. The short-term results are always left up to chance.

[ReplayRandall]

I agree with you...and this "peculiar crap" happens to me too, just as it happens to everyone else who plays this game. The game is what it is...and it won't change just to make the horseplayer's life easier.

IMO...it isn't wise to hold high expectations for a particular race meet...especially when the meet is as abbreviated as the Saratoga meet is. It makes no difference at all to me what my results are during any short race meet...because I know that ANYTHING could happen in the short run. Yes...TLG's performance at Saratoga this year was remarkable and praise-worthy. But, if he has confidence in himself as a handicapper and bettor...he probably did the same handicapping and betting job this year as he did the last...and the differing results are probably attributed to chance.

In this game, the most the horseplayer can do is play his best game. The short-term results are always left up to chance.

Sounds like short-term results are just "chance". If that truly is the case, then TLG's Saratoga performance is unremarkable....You can't have it both ways, Gus...:cool:

[thaskalos]

Sounds like short-term results are just "chance". If that truly is the case, then TLG's Saratoga performance is unremarkable....You can't have it both ways, Gus...:cool:

Remarkable means "unusual or special, and worthy of notice". I don't know about you...but I could never do what TLG accomplished at Saratoga this year. So, this makes his accomplishment "remarkable" to ME. YOUR mileage may vary...

[Norm Gold]

Congrats on a great accomplishment. I had a tough couple months at the spa following a capper that went 0 for last 46. :(

[rsetup]

Congrats on a great accomplishment. I had a tough couple months at the spa following a capper that went 0 for last 46. :(Who would you stay with for that long?

[Zaf]

Great feat ! :ThmbUp: Very few public handicappers ever accomplish that !
Bravo Andy !

Z

[Dahoss9698]

Who would you stay with for that long?
The only person I know of with such a streak was The Fat Man at Derbytrail. Weirdly enough he disappeared right after.

What ever happened him? Hopefully he's using those Fat Charts for something good...like toilet paper

[EMD4ME]

I agree with you...and this "peculiar crap" happens to me too, just as it happens to everyone else who plays this game. The game is what it is...and it won't change just to make the horseplayer's life easier.

IMO...it isn't wise to hold high expectations for a particular race meet...especially when the meet is as abbreviated as the Saratoga meet is. It makes no difference at all to me what my results are during any short race meet...because I know that ANYTHING could happen in the short run. Yes...TLG's performance at Saratoga this year was remarkable and praise-worthy. But, if he has confidence in himself as a handicapper and bettor...he probably did the same handicapping and betting job this year as he did the last...and the differing results are probably attributed to chance.

In this game, the most the horseplayer can do is play his best game. The short-term results are always left up to chance.

I still bitch when I see stuff that shouldn't be happening but what I did was learn to expect it. Especially and predominantly at NYRA. It's a necessary adjustment.

I see us all as baseball players. We know we have talent as we wouldn't be in the big leagues if we couldn't play BUT we all have 1/10 streaks, 4/10 streaks, 0/20 streaks and 11/20 streaks. The important thing is to constantly keep an open mind as to why we won and why we lost. Most importantly we need to keep analyzing as you never know what you might pick up that can get you back on track (pun intended :lol: )

[Tara73]

I find it interesting to know, if Andy made any adjustments in his handicapping, this year, considering how bad he did in 2015.

[VigorsTheGrey]

What were Andy's stats this year? What was his ROI? Are his stats categorized?

[rsetup]

The only person I know of with such a streak was The Fat Man at Derbytrail. Weirdly enough he disappeared right after.

What ever happened him? Hopefully he's using those Fat Charts for something good...like toilet paperLast I heard, he threw you a $20 winner, when you were getting your ass handed to you. Bet your last $20 on it and didn't have to wimper away broke for the day. What, with having missed that $40+ winner a few days earlier. You were quite happy with the handout, from what I remember. ;:lol:

[Dahoss9698]

Last I heard, he threw you a $20 winner, when you were getting your ass handed to you. Bet your last $20 on it and didn't have to wimper away broke for the day. What, with having missed that $40+ winner a few days earlier. You were quite happy with the handout, from what I remember. ;:lol:
Since the Fat Man is you, kind of weird to talk about yourself in the 3rd person. But hey, whatever floats your boat.

Did Charmin offer you a good deal for the fat charts?

[Robert Fischer]

stop mucking up the threads

[cj]

stop mucking up the threads


I've asked this of many lately, so I'll say it to you also. Please no self-appointed moderation.

[Tara73]

I've come to realize listening to Andy has nothing to do with ROI. His rant about jockey Arrieta was beyond intuition today.

[EMD4ME]

I've come to realize listening to Andy has nothing to do with ROI. His rant about jockey Arrieta was beyond intuition today.

What did he say? I missed it. Please give details. I assume it was about race 1. I bet the 2 and Arrieta cost me a few blood vessels to burst. :bang: :bang:

[PaceAdvantage]

I've come to realize listening to Andy has nothing to do with ROI. His rant about jockey Arrieta was beyond intuition today.English please?

[Red Knave]

Kudos to TLG for that stat.

And where is Light to downplay it this year? ;)

[ultracapper]

TLG has been known to have "game" now and then.

Hope you fattened your wallet Andy. You've made it the hard way, you've earned it.

[jahura2]

TLG has been known to have "game" now and then.

Hope you fattened your wallet Andy. You've made it the hard way, you've earned it.

Congrats Andy, your insights were tremendously helpful to me during a profitable Saratoga meet.
One word of advice, be nicer to Gabby, old guys like you and me are fortunate just to be able to talk with an angel like her!

[the little guy]

Congrats Andy, your insights were tremendously helpful to me during a profitable Saratoga meet.
One word of advice, be nicer to Gabby, old guys like you and me are fortunate just to be able to talk with an angel like her!

It's funny to me that many people think I'm not "nice" to Gabby ( or anybody on Talking Horses ). I treat people with respect, respect for their opinions, by debating them, and asking everyone to defend their ideas the same way I am ready to defend mine. It would be disrespectful, and in Gabby's case sexist, to pander to them, and expect more or less from one than another.

Talking Horses is supposed to be informative and entertaining. This will not get accomplished by behaving in the supposed "nice" manner that some people seem to desire.

[Vinnie]

Andy:

I just wanted to echo the sentiments that so many others on the board have expressed when they said congratulations to you on your phenomenal Saratoga meet. I love your Talking Horses segment, and, I often glean some very useful information from you when your doing your show that can greatly assist me in doing my own handicapping. You are indeed quite exceptional at what you do sir..... :)

[jk3521]

It's funny to me that many people think I'm not "nice" to Gabby ( or anybody on Talking Horses ). I treat people with respect, respect for their opinions, by debating them, and asking everyone to defend their ideas the same way I am ready to defend mine. It would be disrespectful, and in Gabby's case sexist, to pander to them, and expect more or less from one than another.

Talking Horses is supposed to be informative and entertaining. This will not get accomplished by behaving in the supposed "nice" manner that some people seem to desire.

Gabby is a tough girl, she can take it, and she can dish it out, too!

[thaskalos]

It's funny to me that many people think I'm not "nice" to Gabby ( or anybody on Talking Horses ). I treat people with respect, respect for their opinions, by debating them, and asking everyone to defend their ideas the same way I am ready to defend mine. It would be disrespectful, and in Gabby's case sexist, to pander to them, and expect more or less from one than another.

Talking Horses is supposed to be informative and entertaining. This will not get accomplished by behaving in the supposed "nice" manner that some people seem to desire.

TLG...in what you do, you are in a league of one. No one packs knowledge, talent and charisma in equal measure, the way YOU do. The more I listen to you...the more impressed I become. :ThmbUp:

[lamboguy]

Gabby is a tough girl, she can take it, and she can dish it out, too!i hate to sound stupid, but who is Gabby?

[PaceAdvantage]

Gabby Gaudet. Laurel/Pimlico/Gulfstream analyst who worked this past Saratoga meet for NYRA.

https://twitter.com/Gabby_Gaudet_?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Ese rp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

[cj]

It would be disrespectful, and in Gabby's case sexist, to pander to them, and expect more or less from one than another.


I said the exact same thing the first time this came up. Your show if fabulous and you shouldn't change a thing. It will grow and get better naturally with time.

[Tom]

Well, if you really want to improve the show, bring back the Rockettes commercial! :cool::p

[v j stauffer]

TLG...in what you do, you are in a league of one. No one packs knowledge, talent and charisma in equal measure, the way YOU do. The more I listen to you...the more impressed I become. :ThmbUp:

Really? One and ONLY one?

As I've said many times, three in this thread alone, TLG does an excellent job. His positive ROI at Saratoga is an accomplishment to be VERY proud of.

But to suggest TLG is the ONLY one who could post such figures and present it well on TV is a bit much don't you think?

I can think of a half dozen or more guys that could do it just as well if not better.

Andy is excellent. But this borders on the Man Crush zone. :blush:

[thaskalos]

Really? One and ONLY one?

As I've said many times, three in this thread alone, TLG does an excellent job. His positive ROI at Saratoga is an accomplishment to be VERY proud of.

But to suggest TLG is the ONLY one who could post such figures and present it well on TV is a bit much don't you think?

I can think of a half dozen or more guys that could do it just as well if not better.

Andy is excellent. But this borders on the Man Crush zone. :blush:

I happened to catch a podcast some time ago...where TLG was "talking horses", and then fielded questions from the audience. To call his performance "flawless" is to put it MILDLY. There may be better handicappers than him, but, from what I've seen...no one is able to convey his horse racing "knowledge" with the dexterity that TLG does. I have seen and heard many horse racing "personalities" in my many years of playing this game....and I have long concluded that NO ONE who has gotten close to an on-air microphone brings as much to the table as TLG brings.

As far as your "man crush" comment is concerned...I'll have you know that TLG has called me "Paceadvantage's most overrated poster". And I am not sure that I disagree with him even on that.

[johnhannibalsmith]

...

As far as your "man crush" comment is concerned...

Not that there's anything wrong with that. :D

[PaceAdvantage]

Really? One and ONLY one?

As I've said many times, three in this thread alone, TLG does an excellent job. His positive ROI at Saratoga is an accomplishment to be VERY proud of.

But to suggest TLG is the ONLY one who could post such figures and present it well on TV is a bit much don't you think?

I can think of a half dozen or more guys that could do it just as well if not better.

Andy is excellent. But this borders on the Man Crush zone. :blush:Wait, I thought Andy was my man crush.

Maybe it's not a man crush. Maybe people are just telling it like it is, as much as that seems to perturb you and a few other select individuals on the interwebs.

[HuggingTheRail]

Is it possible to admire Andy for his handicapping ability and presentation skills on air, but not admire him for an attitude on this message board that can come across as pompous / condescending at times?

If so, put me in that group.

[johnhannibalsmith]

Is it possible to admire Andy for his handicapping ability and presentation skills on air, but not admire him for an attitude on this message board that can come across as pompous / condescending at times?

...

No, you must not pick and choose which parts of a New Yorker you like.

[cj]

Really? One and ONLY one?

As I've said many times, three in this thread alone, TLG does an excellent job. His positive ROI at Saratoga is an accomplishment to be VERY proud of.

But to suggest TLG is the ONLY one who could post such figures and present it well on TV is a bit much don't you think?

I can think of a half dozen or more guys that could do it just as well if not better.

Andy is excellent. But this borders on the Man Crush zone. :blush:

Who are these other people and why haven't they done it? Andy not only does it, he has driven the show to a much higher level. Before he came on board the NYRA broadcast wasn't much to brag about.

[v j stauffer]

I happened to catch a podcast some time ago...where TLG was "talking horses", and then fielded questions from the audience. To call his performance "flawless" is to put it MILDLY. There may be better handicappers than him, but, from what I've seen...no one is able to convey his horse racing "knowledge" with the dexterity that TLG does. I have seen and heard many horse racing "personalities" in my many years of playing this game....and I have long concluded that NO ONE who has gotten close to an on-air microphone brings as much to the table as TLG brings.

As far as your "man crush" comment is concerned...I'll have you know that TLG has called me "Paceadvantage's most overrated poster". And I am not sure that I disagree with him even on that.

I can do it and present it in a way that doesn't come across as condescending and holier than thou.

I can give winners and teach while I do it.

I can make it fun and informative in a way I believe most people enjoy.

So there's one.

Frank Mirahmadi can do it as well.

So there's two.

Want some more?

[v j stauffer]

Who are these other people and why haven't they done it? Andy not only does it, he has driven the show to a much higher level. Before he came on board the NYRA broadcast wasn't much to brag about.

I did it on TVG for 13 years.

[v j stauffer]

Wait, I thought Andy was my man crush.

Maybe it's not a man crush. Maybe people are just telling it like it is, as much as that seems to perturb you and a few other select individuals on the interwebs.

Hey this is the 80's. Nothing wrong with multiple and different Man Crushes! :p

[thaskalos]

I can do it and present it in a way that doesn't come across as condescending and holier than thou.

I can give winners and teach while I do it.

I can make it fun and informative in a way I believe most people enjoy.

So there's one.

Frank Mirahmadi can do it as well.

So there's two.

Want some more?

Yeah...but you'd be the sort of "company man" who would never shine a light on any sort of development which might prove detrimental to the "reputation" of the game. TLG, on the other hand, has the integrity to ruffle the occasional feather.

[v j stauffer]

Yeah...but you'd be the sort of "company man" who would never shine a light on any sort of development which might prove detrimental to the "reputation" of the game. TLG, on the other hand, has the integrity to ruffle the occasional feather.

You're right I would and was a company man. TVG isn't a news organization it's an ADW bet taking company.

When I was on TVG if I thought a jock gave a horse a bad ride I had the latitude to say that. I rarely chose though to point it out as such as an excuse why I was wrong. I've always said bad rides help much as they hurt. They become a wash over the long run. I have ALWAYS preached against searching for excuses. Instead hoping the player will own their mistakes. Figure out what happened. Why was I or they were wrong? What can I do better next time. Work harder. Be introspective. Fix the problem.

NYRA just like TVG is in the business of making commissions from people betting on their races. IMO having a member of the staff criticizing the jockeys is counterproductive to the business plan.

An independent journalist doing this is fine. But not a representative of the association. Even if he's correct, which Andy at times is, it's IMO not his place to be making excuses for losing bets by ripping the horsemen.

Evidently NYRA upper management either doesn't care or isn't listening. Probably a little of both.

That's their prerogative. It's their racetrack.

People will always flock towards TLG's shtick because it's the lazy way out. Couldn't have been my fault. It's those dam pinheads. They're the ones to blame. Much easier than figuring what went wrong and working harder. To say he has courage to point out what others won't it misguided. I just fosters more whining that people are being cheated.

[cj]

I did it on TVG for 13 years.

Shocking answer, made it about you.

[PaceAdvantage]

You're right I would and was a company man. TVG isn't a news organization it's an ADW bet taking company.

When I was on TVG if I thought a jock gave a horse a bad ride I had the latitude to say that. I rarely chose though to point it out as such as an excuse why I was wrong. I've always said bad rides help much as they hurt. They become a wash over the long run. I have ALWAYS preached against searching for excuses. Instead hoping the player will own their mistakes. Figure out what happened. Why was I or they were wrong? What can I do better next time. Work harder. Be introspective. Fix the problem.

NYRA just like TVG is in the business of making commissions from people betting on their races. IMO having a member of the staff criticizing the jockeys is counterproductive to the business plan.

An independent journalist doing this is fine. But not a representative of the association. Even if he's correct, which Andy at times is, it's IMO not his place to be making excuses for losing bets by ripping the horsemen.

Evidently NYRA upper management either doesn't care or isn't listening. Probably a little of both.

That's their prerogative. It's their racetrack.

People will always flock towards TLG's shtick because it's the lazy way out. Couldn't have been my fault. It's those dam pinheads. They're the ones to blame. Much easier than figuring what went wrong and working harder. To say he has courage to point out what others won't it misguided. I just fosters more whining that people are being cheated.I must have missed something. Are you saying every time Andy criticizes a ride, he's made a losing bet on that horse?

I doubt very much if that's the case...but that's what you're saying here.

Ridiculous.

[johnhannibalsmith]

Or maybe it reassures the guy in the stands that did everything right with his handicapping not to burn his racing form, declare himself a hopeless mess that needs to find Jesus, and instead is able to shrug it off as a case of getting beat by a bad ride and move along to the next race.

[thaskalos]

You're right I would and was a company man. TVG isn't a news organization it's an ADW bet taking company.

When I was on TVG if I thought a jock gave a horse a bad ride I had the latitude to say that. I rarely chose though to point it out as such as an excuse why I was wrong. I've always said bad rides help much as they hurt. They become a wash over the long run. I have ALWAYS preached against searching for excuses. Instead hoping the player will own their mistakes. Figure out what happened. Why was I or they were wrong? What can I do better next time. Work harder. Be introspective. Fix the problem.

NYRA just like TVG is in the business of making commissions from people betting on their races. IMO having a member of the staff criticizing the jockeys is counterproductive to the business plan.

An independent journalist doing this is fine. But not a representative of the association. Even if he's correct, which Andy at times is, it's IMO not his place to be making excuses for losing bets by ripping the horsemen.

Evidently NYRA upper management either doesn't care or isn't listening. Probably a little of both.

That's their prerogative. It's their racetrack.

People will always flock towards TLG's shtick because it's the lazy way out. Couldn't have been my fault. It's those dam pinheads. They're the ones to blame. Much easier than figuring what went wrong and working harder. To say he has courage to point out what others won't it misguided. I just fosters more whining that people are being cheated.

What you state here is the company line...which company employees are paid to toe. "Never bite the hand that feeds you"...and "let the customer beware". Why shine a light on the unpleasant side of our game...when allowing the "sweeping under the rug" process to go on unabated is more "enriching" for the company...and, consequently, more beneficial to those employed there? Although an "independent", Andy Beyer has a vested interest in the stability of the game too...and it would have been "better" for him if he kept his mouth shut and his typewriter idle...and just collected his speed-figure paychecks from the DRF. But he has the balls to take the bull by the horns...and do what his heart tells him to do. TLG is cut from the same cloth...IMO.

We only have one rather short life...and some of us don't care to spend it kissing ass.

[v j stauffer]

What you state here is the company line...which company employees are paid to toe. "Never bite the hand that feeds you"...and "let the customer beware". Why shine a light on the unpleasant side of our game...when allowing the "sweeping under the rug" process to go on unabated is more "enriching" for the company...and, consequently, more beneficial to those employed there? Andy Beyer has a vested interest in the stability of the game too...and it would have been "better" for him if he kept his mouth shut and his typewriter idle...and just collected his speed-figure paychecks from the DRF. But he has the balls to take the bull by the horns...and do what his heart tells him to do. TLG is cut from the same cloth...IMO.

We only have one rather short life...and some of us don't care to spend it kissing ass.

Very similar cloths.

Difference is Beyer is paid by The Washington Post and subcontracted by DRF.

Andy is being paid by NYRA.

I think that makes a VERY big difference.

Just one man's opinion.

[thaskalos]

Very similar cloths.

Difference is Beyer is paid by The Washington Post and subcontracted by DRF.

Andy is being paid by NYRA.

I think that makes a VERY big difference.

Just one man's opinion.

True integrity has no boundaries, Vic.

[v j stauffer]

Shocking answer, made it about you.

You're drinking that Kool Aid now too?

It is about me. Thask said nobody could do what TLG does.

I responded by saying I can and have done the same thing.

Who the **** should I have made it about?

PA is moderating right know. Which means you don't get to sit at the adults table.

Hush, have some pumpkin pie and watch the game.

[v j stauffer]

True integrity has no boundaries, Vic.

There are ALOT of dead martyrs.

I prefer to pay my mortgage.

[thaskalos]

There are ALOT of dead martyrs.

I prefer to pay my mortgage.

And that's why, although your house will eventually get paid off...you'll never be a "legend of the game"! Some men are destined for horse racing "immortality"...and others aren't.

[PaceAdvantage]

PA is moderating right know. Which means you don't get to sit at the adults table.

Hush, have some pumpkin pie and watch the game.Wow...and to think I kicked a guy off the board today who didn't come close to this level of insult to cj...

[ReplayRandall]

The game is so bad, I started reading this thread.....But wait, a Frasier re-run is on, I'll watch that...carry on.

[thaskalos]

The game is so bad, I started reading this thread.....But wait, a Frasier re-run is on, I'll watch that...carry on.

What channel?

[kingfin66]

You're drinking that Kool Aid now too?

It is about me. Thask said nobody could do what TLG does.

I responded by saying I can and have done the same thing.

Who the **** should I have made it about?

PA is moderating right know. Which means you don't get to sit at the adults table.

Hush, have some pumpkin pie and watch the game.

I hate to say this because I have always really liked you, but whatever credibility you had left on this board is likely gone for good.

[v j stauffer]

Wow...and to think I kicked a guy off the board today who didn't come close to this level of insult to cj...

Did CJ bait him with an unsolicited troll?

[v j stauffer]

I hate to say this because I have always really liked you, but whatever credibility you had left on this board is likely gone for good.

King. It's internet message board histrionics. You're about the 20th person. Probably more that's said I've lost credibility on this board forever.

C'mon man. I've taken 1000 times more shit on these pages than I've ever put out.

I'm still here trading punches.

CJ got involved in something that he wasn't a part of. He used someone else's take. Then flat out trolled me.

And as a result now you and I aren't buddies anymore.

Oh well. I still like and respect your contributions to PA.

If you wish to jump on the Vic is a POS bandwagon. Better hurry there aren't many seats left.

[v j stauffer]

And that's why, although your house will eventually get paid off...you'll never be a "legend of the game"! Some men are destined for horse racing "immortality"...and others aren't.

There are many ways to become a legend or immortal.

I have no illusions at either.

I'll be very satisfied with real racing fans saying he was a stand up guy, promoted and loved our sport and never tried to hide his passion.

This may come as a huge surprise to you. But PA is not exactly a cross-section of TRUE racing fans.

I'm comfortable with my resume and reputation in our sport.

What a handful of losers and haters think doesn't spend much time in my thoughts.

Can't make everybody happy.

[v j stauffer]

I must have missed something. Are you saying every time Andy criticizes a ride, he's made a losing bet on that horse?

I doubt very much if that's the case...but that's what you're saying here.

Ridiculous.

No of course I'm not saying that.

As I've said at least 100 times on these boards I think Andy does an excellent job. One of the very best at what he does.

Having done that same job myself he makes some editorial choices I wouldn't make and don't agree with.

I also think his "hit and run" holier than thou visits to these pages don't represent him or NYRA very well.

But he has his game and I have mine.

It's all good.

[castaway01]

No of course I'm not saying that.

As I've said at least 100 times on these boards I think Andy does an excellent job. One of the very best at what he does.

Having done that same job myself he makes some editorial choices I wouldn't make and don't agree with.

I also think his "hit and run" holier than thou visits to these pages don't represent him or NYRA very well.

But he has his game and I have mine.

It's all good.

Pot meet kettle.

[Tom]

Once again, it's all about Vic.
Must be compensating for something else he lacks......personality maybe?

[Tom]

I'm still here trading punches.

Vic, and STDs are hard to get rid of.

[EMD4ME]

5cZN7snwP9Y

There's only 1 solution to all this :cool:

[sammy the sage]

5cZN7snwP9Y

There's only 1 solution to all this :cool:

I just got 20 yrs younger...thanks....loved that back in the day.. :lol: :cool: :ThmbUp:

[cj]

...But PA is not exactly a cross-section of TRUE racing fans...



This couldn't be further from the truth.Did CJ bait him with an unsolicited troll?

I asked an honest question. You made it about you. That was far from an unsolicited troll. It wasn't a troll, and it certainly wasn't unsolicited.

You're drinking that Kool Aid now too?

It is about me. Thask said nobody could do what TLG does.

I responded by saying I can and have done the same thing.

Who the **** should I have made it about?

PA is moderating right know. Which means you don't get to sit at the adults table.

Hush, have some pumpkin pie and watch the game.

You said several could do it. I asked you to name them and you only name yourself. Comparing what you did on TVG to what Andy does at NYRA is, frankly, laughable.

I know Andy Serling. Andy Serling is a friend of mine. Vic, you are no Andy Serling.

[Tall One]

Well...this thread has taken a surprising turn..:eek:

-Before the lock, congrats Serling..:ThmbUp:

[CincyHorseplayer]

Wow. Outrage over complimenting a guy. What a douchebag!

[Alwaysonpoint36]

PA is moderating right know. Which means you don't get to sit at the adults table.

Hush, have some pumpkin pie and watch the game.

Hahahaha that was some coldblooded ish right there. :D

Billy Bats was put in a trunk for telling Tommy to go get his shinebox. What's your fate here going to be? :confused:

[OTM Al]

Anyone know who has the inside track on the track announcer's job at Oaklawn.....

[reckless]

This couldn't be further from the truth.

I asked an honest question. You made it about you. That was far from an unsolicited troll. It wasn't a troll, and it certainly wasn't unsolicited.



You said several could do it. I asked you to name them and you only name yourself. Comparing what you did on TVG to what Andy does at NYRA is, frankly, laughable.

I know Andy Serling. Andy Serling is a friend of mine. Vic, you are no Andy Serling.

He isn't Andy Serling, of course, he's much closer to Andy Dick. :)

[johnhannibalsmith]

If he stops messing around with that dang NYRA job and Stronach one and the FOX gig and just heeds the great career advice, hey who knows, after a few years of layoff it could just be Serling one day.

[ReplayRandall]

Wow...and to think I kicked a guy off the board today who didn't come close to this level of insult to cj...

Just curious, who did you "86" from the board, yesterday?

[cj]

Just curious, who did you "86" from the board, yesterday?


Lets just say I guess he told him.

[v j stauffer]

This couldn't be further from the truth.

I asked an honest question. You made it about you. That was far from an unsolicited troll. It wasn't a troll, and it certainly wasn't unsolicited.



You said several could do it. I asked you to name them and you only name yourself. Comparing what you did on TVG to what Andy does at NYRA is, frankly, laughable.

I know Andy Serling. Andy Serling is a friend of mine. Vic, you are no Andy Serling.

Best news I've heard all day.

I didn't name only myself. I added Frank Mirahmadi and offered to include others.

And you're right. What Andy does at NYRA and what the analysts do at TVG isn't comparable.

NYRA is nine 2 minute hits over the course of a race card.

TVG is 4 hours in studio juggling multiple racetracks. With lights, make up, suit and tie, and everything else live television entails.

I've done both and TVG is about 50,000 times tougher.

As I will say again, which you never acknowledge, I think Andy does a great job. Perhaps best in the business. But believe it or not there are others with skill sets just as talented.

[v j stauffer]

Hahahaha that was some coldblooded ish right there. :D

Billy Bats was put in a trunk for telling Tommy to go get his shinebox. What's your fate here going to be? :confused:

If they call and tell me I'm being made. I'M NOT GOING! :eek:

[v j stauffer]

Wow. Outrage over complimenting a guy. What a douchebag!

You can't be speaking of me.

I've complimented TLG a hundred times on these pages.

The next positive thing he says about me, or anyone else, for that matter will be his first.

Andy and I have never met. From what I hear him say about handicapping, most of which I think is spot on, ironically I think we could be friends.

If not certainly have some heated debates about the intricacies of making money betting on horses.

But that can't happen. Because Andy was told by a third party that I was not a good person and decided to blindly accept that.

That's how people like him. And especially Mr. Third Party. Who more people hate than any 10 people in the business roll.

Oh well. I stopped worrying about him and his mediocrity many years ago.

When I was trying for the announcers job at NYRA. I had already decided that if I got it. I was going to approach Andy. Shake his hand and see if we could go forward with respect and a sense of teamwork. Alas I didn't get that opportunity. But should I see him at Oaklawn or the BC that's exactly what he can expect from me.

Do you people actually think there's any correlation between this site and the real racetrack world?

C'mon man! :lol: :lol: :lol:

[thaskalos]

Best news I've heard all day.

I didn't name only myself. I added Frank Mirahmadi and offered to include others.

And you're right. What Andy does at NYRA and what the analysts do at TVG isn't comparable.

NYRA is nine 2 minute hits over the course of a race card.

TVG is 4 hours in studio juggling multiple racetracks. With lights, make up, suit and tie, and everything else live television entails.

I've done both and TVG is about 50,000 times tougher.

As I will say again, which you never acknowledge, I think Andy does a great job. Perhaps best in the business. But believe it or not there are others with skill sets just as talented.

Here is the thing though, that you don't seem to understand. It is up to the AUDIENCE to decide whether an on-air personality is "just as talented" as someone else. And...if a poll were taken here between you, Mirahmadi and TLG, in the "handicapping presentation" department...I am fairly certain on what the outcome of the poll would be.

When the World Series Of Poker was first instituted...the intention was for the winner to be selected by a vote taken among the tournament's participants. But this practice had to be scrapped...because the entrants simply voted for THEMSELVES. It seems that we aren't very competent at judging our own level of skill/talent.

[thaskalos]

Do you people actually think there's any correlation between this site and the real racetrack world?

C'mon man! :lol: :lol: :lol:

From the looks of things...what you say here may turn out to be quite a compliment...for this SITE.

[castaway01]

Do you people actually think there's any correlation between this site and the real racetrack world?



It's good to hear you're not as big of a jackass in real life as you are here. Why you want to be a jackass to horse racing fans on the Internet is a whole other question for you and your therapist to work out.

[OTM Al]

Do you people actually think there's any correlation between this site and the real racetrack world?

Of course not. From what I've seen and heard people here think much more highly of him than those in the "real racetrack world"....

[jahura2]

It's funny to me that many people think I'm not "nice" to Gabby ( or anybody on Talking Horses ). I treat people with respect, respect for their opinions, by debating them, and asking everyone to defend their ideas the same way I am ready to defend mine. It would be disrespectful, and in Gabby's case sexist, to pander to them, and expect more or less from one than another.

Talking Horses is supposed to be informative and entertaining. This will not get accomplished by behaving in the supposed "nice" manner that some people seem to desire.

Andy, what I said was in jest, notice the smiley face at the top of the post. Just poking fun, dont take it so seriously. I am fully aware of your mutual respect for Gabby, she wouldnt have got the job if she wasnt any good.

[the little guy]

Andy, what I said was in jest, notice the smiley face at the top of the post. Just poking fun, dont take it so seriously. I am fully aware of your mutual respect for Gabby, she wouldnt have got the job if she wasnt any good.


I'm a little slow...thanks.

A lot of people do seem to be confused about this. I have the greatest respect for Gabby and think she does a terrific job.

[v j stauffer]

Here is the thing though, that you don't seem to understand. It is up to the AUDIENCE to decide whether an on-air personality is "just as talented" as someone else. And...if a poll were taken here between you, Mirahmadi and TLG, in the "handicapping presentation" department...I am fairly certain on what the outcome of the poll would be.

When the World Series Of Poker was first instituted...the intention was for the winner to be selected by a vote taken among the tournament's participants. But this practice had to be scrapped...because the entrants simply voted for THEMSELVES. It seems that we aren't very competent at judging our own level of skill/talent.

I didn't vote for myself. I simply stated there were others who were also adept at performing the job. One of which was me.

You said you are fairly certain you know what the outcome would be. What do you think the outcome would be?

Do you think the outcome would be different if the poll was taken only here on PA or incorporating a much wider cross section of racing fan?

Honestly I don't know how those numbers would turn out.

[v j stauffer]

It's good to hear you're not as big of a jackass in real life as you are here. Why you want to be a jackass to horse racing fans on the Internet is a whole other question for you and your therapist to work out.

I don't think I'm being a jackass.

You're certainly entitled to your opinion.

I sincerely hope it's not one held by the majority..

Even on this internet site which BTW is the only one I consistently frequent.

If you think standing up for myself, fighting back against untruths both about myself and more importantly the game I love make me a jackass then so be it.

People say such outlandish things here. Once upon a time I took the offensive and tried to crush those who were clearly doing it to troll or forward their agenda of hate. Or were just good old fashioned ignorant.

I backed off that quite a ways back. I'm a kinder/gentler Vic these days. But I'm still allowed to have my own opinions. Refute complete rubbish posted by people who know ZERO about horse racing. And worse yet people who hate so much their only relief is to make others feel just as miserable as they do.

[cj]

NYRA is nine 2 minute hits over the course of a race card.



If you think that is all NYRA is doing you haven't been paying attention. There is WAY more to the current broadcasts than that.

[v j stauffer]

It's good to hear you're not as big of a jackass in real life as you are here. Why you want to be a jackass to horse racing fans on the Internet is a whole other question for you and your therapist to work out.

Tell ya what.

The LAST thing I want to do is force myself or my opinions on people who don't want them.

Let me remind you only a very small % of people who read PA post. Some only very occasionally. Some never.

However the number of people who are signed up is immense. A testament to not only PA but his excellent staff.

I propose he put up a poll.

Very simple question..........

Is Vic a jackass? YES or NO.

If the YES'S carry the day everyone wins. Those of you that want me to shut up and go away will get your wish. And I will know I've been mistaken in the belief many people who rarely post are on my side. If the YES'S prevail I'll admit I was a self serving, delusional narcissist. Walk away forever and apologize for wasting your time. If the NO'S win though we start at square one with a clean slate on both sides and we see if the conversations on this site can be done with dignity, respect, class, open mindedness and good will.

Deal?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6jpwqWPKAUc

[v j stauffer]

If you think that is all NYRA is doing you haven't been paying attention. There is WAY more to the current broadcasts than that.

You are very correct on that. And Andy plays an integeral role. Much of the programming direction is under Tony Allevato who hired me and was my boss at TVG for over a decade.

The NYRA overall presentation is excellent and getting better every day.

Tony and the entire staff should hold their heads high.

IMO it's the model all racetracks should aspire to.

[EMD4ME]

Tell ya what.

The LAST thing I want to do is force myself or my opinions on people who don't want them.

Let me remind you only a very small % of people who read PA post. Some only very occasionally. Some never.

However the number of people who are signed up is immense. A testament to not only PA but his excellent staff.

I propose he put up a poll.

Very simple question..........

Is Vic a jackass? YES or NO.

If the YES'S carry the day everyone wins. Those of you that want me to shut up and go away will get your wish. And I will know I've been mistaken in the belief many people who rarely post are on my side. If the YES'S prevail I'll admit I was a self serving, delusional narcissist. Walk away forever and apologize for wasting your time. If the NO'S win though we start at square one with a clean slate on both sides and we see if the conversations on this site can be done with dignity, respect, class, open mindedness and good will.

Deal?

I DON'T want you to go away.




Disclaimer: Regardless of his abuse of me :lol: , this statement is not an endorsement of Vic J Stauffer, his statements against TLG or any statement of that nature or any nature. They are solely based upon the belief that Vic, regardless of what one feels about him, is good for business. What business specifically? Who cares? Overall business!

[EMD4ME]

You are very correct on that. And Andy plays an integeral role. Much of the programming direction is under Tony Allevato who hired me and was my boss at TVG for over a decade.

The NYRA overall presentation is excellent and getting better every day.

Tony and the entire staff should hold their heads high.

IMO it's the model all racetracks should aspire to.

10000% True, best in the business!!!

Good initial statement for all of us to hug and get back to needling eachother harmlessly.

[v j stauffer]

I DON'T want you to go away.




Disclaimer: Regardless of his abuse of me :lol: , this statement is not an endorsement of Vic J Stauffer, his statements against TLG or any statement of that nature or any nature. They are solely based upon the belief that Vic, regardless of what one feels about him, is good for business. What business specifically? Who cares? Overall business!

Why do you think my holding you responsible for the offers and claims you make are abuse?

In my eyes it's someone asking you to substantiate the wild claims you make. And not slither away from the offers you've made.

I just don't buy your BS. I don't think that qualifies as abuse.

Perhaps others do. I so I will try to listen and back off.

Absent that. I strongly believe 90% of what you espouse on this site is very counterproductive to people who are here to learn and hopefully eventually rejoice in our great game.

[EMD4ME]

Why do you think my holding you responsible for the offers and claims you make are abuse?

In my eyes it's someone asking you to substantiate the wild claims you make. And not slither away from the offers you've made.

I just don't buy your BS. I don't think that qualifies as abuse.

Perhaps others do. I so I will try to listen and back off.

Absent that. I strongly believe 90% of what you espouse on this site is very counterproductive to people who are here to learn and hopefully eventually rejoice in our great game.

1) You created good entertainment in our interactions. That was good for PA getting views.

2) You didn't know me. I didn't and don't blame you for questioning me. You helped me come out of my internet shell and prove who I am. I thank you for that.

3) This IS NOT about me, you or US.

I am trying to help you mend the wound that is out there right now. "we" can discuss any differences we have off line.

I believe you are not the guy that many, including ME, thought you were.

As everyone avoids you, as you sink into the PA ocean, I am reaching out to help you create the dialogue to kiss and make up here with PA nation.

Not acting as a moderator but as someone you view as a foe, who is really a friendly friend.

P.S. I give you a THUMBS UP and all you get out of my post is : EMD said I abused him? :lol: Shoot, OK, you didn't abuse me. Please reread what I read above or the opportunity is lost.

[NorCalGreg]

Why do you think my holding you responsible for the offers and claims you make are abuse?

In my eyes it's someone asking you to substantiate the wild claims you make. And not slither away from the offers you've made.

I just don't buy your BS. I don't think that qualifies as abuse.

Perhaps others do. I so I will try to listen and back off.

Absent that. I strongly believe 90% of what you espouse on this site is very counterproductive to people who are here to learn and hopefully eventually rejoice in our great game.


You aren't alone Vic....I'll enjoy the day someone finds out who he really is. Out of all the NY people here....NO ONE sees him regularly at Belmont? No one even knows who he is---yet he's one of the most well-known people at the track?

No one has ever been in the bank he supposedly was the Vice President of?

No one has seen him taunt lesser horseplayers by pulling out $10,000 cash and waving it in their face? In a public place like Belmont? And the thugs literally quake in fear --even knowing he has thousands in cash in his pockets---while he walks to his car alone?

When someone "assures" he is telling the truth 100%...like someone strangely did the other day...I just have to laugh. My picture, name and address are posted on my website--I don't have anything to hide.

He posts phantom ADW screen captures---yet no one knows him.

Strange huh?

This will be deleted--but I had to speak up---tired of posting on here and having myself and my customers repeatedly bashed.

And believe it or not--I actually PAY for this priviledge.

[MonmouthParkJoe]

This has become quite the entertaining thread :D

[EMD4ME]

You aren't alone Vic....I'll enjoy the day someone finds out who he really is. Out of all the NY people here....NO ONE sees him regularly at Belmont? No one even knows who he is---yet he's one of the most well-known people at the track?

No one has ever been in the bank he supposedly was the Vice President of?

No one has seen him taunt lesser horseplayers by pulling out $10,000 cash and waving it in their face? In a public place like Belmont? And the thugs literally quake in fear --even knowing he has thousands in cash in his pockets---while he walks to his car alone?

When someone "assures" he is telling the truth 100%...like someone strangely did the other day...I just have to laugh. My picture, name and address are posted on my website--I don't have anything to hide.

He posts phantom ADW screen captures---yet no one knows him.

Strange huh?

This will be deleted--but I had to speak up---tired of posting on here and having myself and my customers repeatedly bashed.

And believe it or not--I actually PAY for this priviledge.

WOW. I did as you asked and posted 2 winners in another thread, in races that you lost and you went Apeshit.


http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=133428&page=3&pp=15

You are sad.

To answer your question: TLG has met me and knows me (via visiting the NYRA VIP room for years).

Delta Lover knows me for over a decade.

Delta bets money that could buy a house (IN NY!), a real horseplayer.

I offered to have Class vouch for me.

Nothing is enough for you.

You are sad and pathetic. I really pray to Jesus for you sir.

[rsetup]

Here's my take: Serling IS the NYRA show. Honestly, I don't really pay much attention to anyone else, either muting or turning off the show when he's not on. If you're in the game for a while, you realize how much better than everyone else he is. Not even considering the people he works with, he's better, by a lot, than Beyer, better than Crist, except maybe ticket construction, and, probably, better than Salvatore. Why listen to anyone else? They're all saying the same things, the same way. And they think they have everyone fooled. Please

[EMD4ME]

This has become quite the entertaining thread :D

Like the

I'm an Andy Serling fan but....................


Thread :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


Dont you know anything involving the amazing TLG, generates entertainment???!!!

Like him, hate him, Love him, he is a POLARIZING figure!

Crap, my mother gets worried when she watches talking horses and Andy is NOT there!

[v j stauffer]

Here's my take: Serling IS the NYRA show. Honestly, I don't really pay much attention to anyone else, either muting or turning off the show when he's not on. If you're in the game for a while, you realize how much better than everyone else he is. Not even considering the people he works with, he's better, by a lot, than Beyer, better than Crist, except maybe ticket construction, and, probably, better than Salvatore. Why listen to anyone else? They're all saying the same things, the same way. And they think they have everyone fooled. Please

I have strengths and weaknesses as a horse player. Paddocks and warm ups are a definite weakness.

Maggie helps me a great deal in this regard. Not so much by telling me who looks great. Being good looking doesn't assure present or future ability. I live with that reality every day ;)

What she does for me that is invaluable is subtly say who she thinks is not cranked up. A race or two away. And she's rarely wrong.

Remember too kids this is a very delicate egg shell walk because of the ego's and insecurity of the trainers and owners.

Andy is excellent. But remember his contributions are handicapping opinions. Most of us are not likely swayed no matter what he says.

Maggie on the other hand, while also offering an opinion, helps with an expertise I'm not nearly as confident with. Especially because I'm not on track at NYRA.

Without her the presentation would not be nearly as good. :ThmbUp:

[no breathalyzer]

:ThmbUp: I just caught up reading this thread .. boy did i almost miss out on a ton of valuable stuff... i really learned a lot reading the last 30 post or so :rolleyes: Honest question for Vic.. have you ever been checked out for that bipolar disorder?

:) I still like you race calls tho..

[PaceAdvantage]

You aren't alone Vic....I'll enjoy the day someone finds out who he really is. Out of all the NY people here....NO ONE sees him regularly at Belmont? No one even knows who he is---yet he's one of the most well-known people at the track?

No one has ever been in the bank he supposedly was the Vice President of?

No one has seen him taunt lesser horseplayers by pulling out $10,000 cash and waving it in their face? In a public place like Belmont? And the thugs literally quake in fear --even knowing he has thousands in cash in his pockets---while he walks to his car alone?

When someone "assures" he is telling the truth 100%...like someone strangely did the other day...I just have to laugh. My picture, name and address are posted on my website--I don't have anything to hide.

He posts phantom ADW screen captures---yet no one knows him.

Strange huh?

This will be deleted--but I had to speak up---tired of posting on here and having myself and my customers repeatedly bashed.

And believe it or not--I actually PAY for this priviledge.Have you missed the many posts where I have VOUCHED for EMD and his claims? I've even done it in YOUR thread...can we put it to rest that EMD's claims about himself are baseless?

[PaceAdvantage]

This thread is now a shit show. Ruined by the usual cast of characters again, who can't help but inject themselves and their GIANT egos into every thread.

Thanks a-holes. You know who you are.

[NorCalGreg]

This thread is now a shit show. Ruined by the usual cast of characters again, who can't help but inject themselves and their GIANT egos into every thread.

Thanks a-holes. You know who you are.

You apparently have missed the many posts where I posted my opinion like any other poster--only to have myself, my software and my customers bashed . F*ck that.

[v j stauffer]

This thread is now a shit show. Ruined by the usual cast of characters again, who can't help but inject themselves and their GIANT egos into every thread.

Thanks a-holes. You know who you are.

Technically if I'm actually Bi-Polar I don't know who I am.

[ReplayRandall]

Technically if I'm actually Bi-Polar I don't know who I am.

But you always know who EMD is...:lol:

[EMD4ME]

People can dislike Andy for many reasons but they need to give him credit for 1 thing (among many), he sticks by his blanken guns when discussing horses. When Amoss was challenging him during the SPA meet, he dug in with his opinions.

In this game, I have many times felt like a psycho, betting a 27/1 shot as a single in a pick 5, pick 4 and pick 6 while everyone gives you a head nod (fake acknowledgement of agreeing that your pic has a shot-deep down they think you're crazy-after they ask you who do you like). Win or lose, the right BET must be made. I respect people who stand by their selections, despite them being unique. (As long as they know what the heck they are talking about).

[sammy the sage]

1st of all...to the ORIGINAL topic...TLG...good job/good work...hope you keep it up...that written...

personally...TLG has taken some cheap shots at me...I've taken some at him....as has Vic, and many others...oh well...it's the net...and THAT probably doesn't justify it EITHER way...

just surprised big boss has allowed this tread to go on...have HAD threads/posts in the past to be deleted/locked for a whole LOT LESS...

climate has changed I guess...more eyeballs...more views...good for business like...WWE.... :lol:

[Lemon Drop Husker]

Technically if I'm actually Bi-Polar I don't know who I am.

Bipolar isn't multiple personalities, or knowing who you are.

It is a person with violent mood swings that are "polar" opposites of one another.

Narcissism on the other hand.....

[Grits]

There is much that could be removed from this thread not the least of which is the disgusting WWE video. Thanks, EMD.

This is a train wreck, a nightmare, when's it going to be straightened out? Please, Mike and Cj, do something.

Congratulations Andy!

[PaceAdvantage]

You apparently have missed the many posts where I posted my opinion like any other poster--only to have myself, my software and my customers bashed . F*ck that.Actually I haven't. But what I have noticed is that you seem to miss my posts to EMD and that he was way out of bounds for going off on you just because you had an opinion on bias or whatever it was. You didn't attack him personally to start all this nonsense between you two, and I pointed that out to him just the other day, and he basically admitted you didn't attack him personally. But he took your comments personally and decided to go off on you and your software.

All this is public record.

It should also be public record that EMD isn't full of shit about the stuff he posts about his play...

[EMD4ME]

Actually I haven't. But what I have noticed is that you seem to miss my posts to EMD and that he was way out of bounds for going off on you just because you had an opinion on bias or whatever it was. You didn't attack him personally to start all this nonsense between you two, and I pointed that out to him just the other day, and he basically admitted you didn't attack him personally. But he took your comments personally and decided to go off on you and your software.

All this is public record.

It should also be public record that EMD isn't full of shit about the stuff he posts about his play...

My apologies again for not handling this "differences in horse racing" opinions with NCG to the best of my abilities.

I am not perfect, always try to be the best person I can be but I let myself down sometimes, especially when I feel like people are questioning my integrity (and I bite back with logic, facts and counters). With that said, I want you to do well. Hope your product kicks ass and more players bet more money AND HAVE FUN with your software.

All my posts, come from passion, if that explains anything for you.

Let's all be healthy and continue posting on!

It's an Andy Serling thread so getting back on topic, I wish we could see TLG's running total ROI for the current meet (whatever meet we are in). I think most here would love to root him on (minus the haters of course).

[EMD4ME]

There is much that could be removed from this thread not the least of which is the disgusting WWE video. Thanks, EMD.

This is a train wreck, a nightmare, when's it going to be straightened out? Please, Mike and Cj, do something.

Congratulations Andy!


Sorry about that. Got caught up in the moment. Vince McMahon has a saying: It's GOOD FOR BUSINESS.

I kinda got caught up in that when I saw Sammy's post.

My apologies Grits. Wasn't the best of videos for this site.

[Maxximus]

Must be nice to pick and post 5 horses in a race (Talking Horses) then when one of them hits the board, its a great achievement. I have great admiration for handicappers but Andy Serling isn't one of them. I dont have to admire him.
He and Bob Badaeker are probably the two worst in the industry.

[thaskalos]

Must be nice to pick and post 5 horses in a race (Talking Horses) then when one of them hits the board, its a great achievement. I have great admiration for handicappers but Andy Serling isn't one of them. I dont have to admire him.
He and Bob Badaeker are probably the two worst in the industry.

Welcome to our board.

[Tom]

That is not it works in the real world.
Any has his picks listed before the races - 1-2-3-4.

Just gave out a nice $19 winner at Belmont.
That means only one thing.....I's eatin' STEAK tonight!!!! :p :p :p

TY TLG

[cj]

Must be nice to pick and post 5 horses in a race (Talking Horses) then when one of them hits the board, its a great achievement. I have great admiration for handicappers but Andy Serling isn't one of them. I dont have to admire him.
He and Bob Badaeker are probably the two worst in the industry.

Yeah, I'm sure that is how Andy calculated his ROI, counted his fifth choice as a winner.

[pandy]

Must be nice to pick and post 5 horses in a race (Talking Horses) then when one of them hits the board, its a great achievement. I have great admiration for handicappers but Andy Serling isn't one of them. I dont have to admire him.
He and Bob Badaeker are probably the two worst in the industry.


Who are the handicappers who you think are good?

[Maxximus]

That is not it works in the real world.
Any has his picks listed before the races - 1-2-3-4.

Just gave out a nice $19 winner at Belmont.
That means only one thing.....I's eatin' STEAK tonight!!!! :p :p :p

TY TLG

If you are chasing his picks to eat steak, then I hate to know what you do for rent.

[Tom]

I threw a fiver on the horse as an action bet, while I'm sitting here watching the races.

I don't chase anyone's pick but my own.
But I had an idea the horse might be live, and then Andy picks him and he is 6-1 at the time, so what the heck?

[Maxximus]

I threw a fiver on the horse as an action bet, while I'm sitting here watching the races.

I don't chase anyone's pick but my own.
But I had an idea the horse might be live, and then Andy picks him and he is 6-1 at the time, so what the heck?


Nice pick on your part!

[PaceAdvantage]

Must be nice to pick and post 5 horses in a race (Talking Horses) then when one of them hits the board, its a great achievement. I have great admiration for handicappers but Andy Serling isn't one of them. I dont have to admire him.
He and Bob Badaeker are probably the two worst in the industry.It's mildly entertaining to see that when you squash one roach in this place, another one magically appears to take its place...the good in all this is that all the roaches tend to appear eventually...

[jk3521]

Must be nice to pick and post 5 horses in a race (Talking Horses) then when one of them hits the board, its a great achievement. I have great admiration for handicappers but Andy Serling isn't one of them. I dont have to admire him.
He and Bob Badaeker are probably the two worst in the industry.


He selects 5 horses on the NYRA website for exotic bets players and late scratches. I wish I had listened to him about that last race winner the other day. He was touting the horse earlier on his Talking Horses show too. It's not just about his selections for each race , but for info on previous races run by the horses, too.

[lamboguy]

Who are the handicappers who you think are good?personally i believe you are one of the better handicappers around.

[pandy]

personally i believe you are one of the better handicappers around.


Thanks!

[Tara73]

I have strengths and weaknesses as a horse player. Paddocks and warm ups are a definite weakness.

Maggie helps me a great deal in this regard. Not so much by telling me who looks great. Being good looking doesn't assure present or future ability. I live with that reality every day ;)

What she does for me that is invaluable is subtly say who she thinks is not cranked up. A race or two away. And she's rarely wrong.

Remember too kids this is a very delicate egg shell walk because of the ego's and insecurity of the trainers and owners.

Andy is excellent. But remember his contributions are handicapping opinions. Most of us are not likely swayed no matter what he says.

Maggie on the other hand, while also offering an opinion, helps with an expertise I'm not nearly as confident with. Especially because I'm not on track at NYRA.

Without her the presentation would not be nearly as good. :ThmbUp:
I think this is an excellent point by Vic. I'm paying more attention to horses that Maggie says 'may need a race. ' I've noticed she's more often right and many of these horses lose at a short price.

[EMD4ME]

I think this is an excellent point by Vic. I'm paying more attention to horses that Maggie says 'may need a race. ' I've noticed she's more often right and many of these horses lose at a short price.

She is FANTASTIC.

Happy she is having a baby but sad as I will miss her genius in that category.

[rsetup]

She is FANTASTIC.

Happy she is having a baby but sad as I will miss her genius in that category.I BELIEVE IT but it is INCREDIBLE

[EMD4ME]

I BELIEVE IT but it is INCREDIBLE

What do you mean by INCREDIBLE? I sense a hidden meaning.

[Maxximus]

It's mildly entertaining to see that when you squash one roach in this place, another one magically appears to take its place...the good in all this is that all the roaches tend to appear eventually...


Heaven forbid someone should have an opinion and especially that one of anti- Andy Serling. Why should I have to like him? I really dont think he is all that great. How is that for entertainment?

[PaceAdvantage]

Heaven forbid someone should have an opinion and especially that one of anti- Andy Serling. Why should I have to like him? I really dont think he is all that great. How is that for entertainment?You don't have to like him. Just don't lie about him.

[zawaaa]

it's probably well past the point of anybody being interested, but, is there some kind of public record breaking down his results at saratoga this year?

[Harvhorse]

Matthews of L.I. Newsday has had positive roi at many meets.

[pandy]

Matthews of L.I. Newsday has had positive roi at many meets.


Yes, he has. I have to, it's good work, but not as remarkable as some made it out to be. What's really good is if a public handicapper's best bets show a positive R.O.I.

[cj]

Clearly if Andy kept his picks private his ROI would be much higher. He has quite the following, especially at Saratoga.

[pandy]

Clearly if Andy kept his picks private his ROI would be much higher. He has quite the following, especially at Saratoga.

From my experience, I doubt it makes much of a difference. Maybe his ROI would be a bit higher, not a lot. The handle in NY is high enough and the people who would bet a horse because Andy touted it are not whales. Plus you have other touts like David, Maggie, Mike Beer, and others, who could all be on a different horse in the same race.

[cj]

From my experience, I doubt it makes much of a difference. Maybe his ROI would be a bit higher, not a lot. The handle in NY is high enough and the people who would bet a horse because Andy touted it are not whales. Plus you have other touts like David, Maggie, Mike Beer, and others, who could all be on a different horse in the same race.

I guess it depends on how much is much, but you are underestimating his following at the Spa IMO.

[EMD4ME]

Just tuned in to talking horses and TLG mentioned something new and something about surprises.

Anyone know what I just missed?

[CincyHorseplayer]

Love that comment Andy made about Saratoga being "...the graveyard of handicappers..". That's great Andy! It's a tough meet for sure. My normal numbers everywhere go down a bit and I often find that if a horse doesn't win they are nowhere to be found! It's a humbling experience. Even on turf my win % is very average but Saratoga compensates with an average mutuel being nearly $3 above my norm so.And I am picking and choosing races. For Andy to give out selections to every single race and do this is, well he is a heavyweight handicapper. Well done.

[pandy]

Saratoga didn't seem that tough this year, for some reason, but that happens once in a while, then the next year is murder.

[EMD4ME]

Just tuned in to talking horses and TLG mentioned something new and something about surprises.

Anyone know what I just missed?

Just got replay up. He said payoffs will be shown to the smallest increment.

[cj]

Just got replay up. He said payoffs will be shown to the smallest increment.

That is great and how all tracks should do it.

[EMD4ME]

That is great and how all tracks should do it.

That's funny. I thought the opposite :lol: I want $2 increments for everything. If someone can't do the math, they are in trouble :lol:

Sick and tired of seeing or hearing that the .10 super paid $1.24 cents :lol:

Either way, irrelevant to me, so if others like it, more power to them.

[thaskalos]

Yes, he has. I have to, it's good work, but not as remarkable as some made it out to be. What's really good is if a public handicapper's best bets show a positive R.O.I.
Let me understand this. It's "good" if ALL the top picks that the public handicapper makes in every race show a profit for the racing season...but it's "VERY good" if the handicapper does this with his "best bets"? It occurs to me that the former is a lot harder to do than the latter.

[rsetup]

Saratoga didn't seem that tough this year, for some reason, but that happens once in a while, then the next year is murder. Come on, man, give the dude some credit for a rare accomplishment

[thaskalos]

Saratoga didn't seem that tough this year, for some reason, but that happens once in a while, then the next year is murder.
Where on your site do you list your "live" picks, Pandy? I've visited your site...but I only find commentary about your results from races already run.

[the little guy]

Let me understand this. It's "good" if ALL the top picks that the public handicapper makes in every race show a profit for the racing season...but it's "VERY good" if the handicapper does this with his "best bets"? It occurs to me that the former is a lot harder to do than the latter.


I was kind of wondering that myself:-)

[pandy]

Let me understand this. It's "good" if ALL the top picks that the public handicapper makes in every race show a profit for the racing season...but it's "VERY good" if the handicapper does this with his "best bets"? It occurs to me that the former is a lot harder to do than the latter.


That's a good question. I personally think that how a public handicapper does on best bets is most important, because people may bet those, but no one is going to bet all of your top picks.

Just to add, I like to watch Andy's Pick 6 analysis that they show on TVG. With his picks for every race, without comments, it's hard to get a feel for which ones he really likes, or why he picked the horse. With the commentary, he actually tells you why he picked the horse and you can get a feel for the races he really likes. That's good stuff.

[pandy]

Where on your site do you list your "live" picks, Pandy? I've visited your site...but I only find commentary about your results from races already run.


On the free page. When I'm testing a new method I post their almost every day, when I'm not, I just put my picks on the page once a week or so.

[pandy]

Come on, man, give the dude some credit for a rare accomplishment


Hey, I'm a big fan of Andy Serling. I think he's great. And Saratoga can be brutal. I'm just saying, some people are acting like no one ever shows a profit on picks, which isn't true. I showed a profit (less steeplechase picks) on all of my top picks at Saratoga this year. Last year I had a lousy meet. I did think that for some reason the races made sense this year.

I remember a meet many years ago when for some reason Finger Lakes shippers were winning regularly. I was about ready to give up the sport.

[EMD4ME]

Just got replay up. He said payoffs will be shown to the smallest increment.

After watching the payoffs being shown to the minimum, I hate it. Seems so California. Don't like it.

If you're going go that far, why not just show WPS to the dollar. :bang:

After so many years of $2 payoffs, Arggghhh. I miss the $2 payoffs already.

Won't change a thing but it irked me watching them come up.

Bigger things in life to worry about, so I'll stop at this point.

[Exotic1]

Yes, he has. I have to, it's good work, but not as remarkable as some made it out to be. What's really good is if a public handicapper's best bets show a positive R.O.I.

You're talking about relevance, right? A casual listener may only bet the host's best bet, but not every race.

But that's what makes this incredible. There could be maybe 40 best bets for the meet, whatever. So you break even or show a profit on your most select choices with many short prices in the mix, obviously. Even I can do that on some very rare occasions. 40 bets to break even or show a small profit, it probably happens pretty often. But how tf do you bet every race and show a profit at Saratoga? infkgpossible.

[EMD4ME]

How far above the $2.00 mark was Andy?

It doesn't matter either way. $2.01 or $2.20 is impressive!

Anyone above $1.68 is succussful against the VIG but I'm just curious.

[pandy]

You're talking about relevance, right? A casual listener may only bet the host's best bet, but not every race.

But that's what makes this incredible. There could be maybe 40 best bets for the meet, whatever. So you break even or show a profit on your most select choices with many short prices in the mix, obviously. Even I can do that on some very rare occasions. 40 bets to break even or show a small profit, it probably happens pretty often. But how tf do you bet every race and show a profit at Saratoga? infkgpossible.


Right, people are actually betting the best bets.

[the little guy]

Right, people are actually betting the best bets.

People are "actually" betting all my top selections, and others.

I have little interest in the minutia of this thread, but you seem to be heading in a strange direction.

[the little guy]

How far above the $2.00 mark was Andy?

It doesn't matter either way. $2.01 or $2.20 is impressive!

Anyone above $1.68 is succussful against the VIG but I'm just curious.


$2.08.

One thing to correct, I only did Talking Horses 36 of the 40 days, so we are not talking about all 40 cards.

[Rise Over Run]

I only did Talking Horses 36 of the 40 days, so we are not talking about all 40 cards.

Slacker. :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[Tara73]

Saratoga Live. Deserving award winning broadcast!

[therussmeister]

That's funny. I thought the opposite :lol: I want $2 increments for everything. If someone can't do the math, they are in trouble :lol:

Sick and tired of seeing or hearing that the .10 super paid $1.24 cents :lol:

Either way, irrelevant to me, so if others like it, more power to them.
I want $1 payouts for everything. That's how I record it in my spreadsheets. Plus I want ROI reported based on a $1 bet, not $2.

I always found it humerous when a track feels obligated to provide both a $1 super payout and $0.10 super payout. If you can't do that math you are really, REALLY in trouble :bang:

[EMD4ME]

I want $1 payouts for everything. That's how I record it in my spreadsheets. Plus I want ROI reported based on a $1 bet, not $2.

I always found it humerous when a track feels obligated to provide both a $1 super payout and $0.10 super payout. If you can't do that math you are really, REALLY in trouble :bang:

Call me a traditionalist....What can I say....

Like I said, I won't make a big deal of it. Story over.

[EMD4ME]

$2.08.

One thing to correct, I only did Talking Horses 36 of the 40 days, so we are not talking about all 40 cards.

Like I said, anything near or above $1.68 is impressive. Way to go TLG :ThmbUp:

Any particular races stick out? Favorite meet winner?

[EMD4ME]

Slacker. :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

HA HA. I wish I could focus on all 40 days of the SPA. Hate being away for a day! You're right :lol: :lol:

[Exotic1]

Right, people are actually betting the best bets.

I shouldn't have phrased my comment to the way I did. I meant to give backdrop to what you were saying but I do not agree with your premise.

[pandy]

I shouldn't have phrased my comment to the way I did. I meant to give backdrop to what you were saying but I do not agree with your premise.


Okay. The reason why I say Best Bets are so crucial is because most people automatically assume that you can't win if you bet every race. However, one thing is for sure, if anyone can show a flat bet profit on picks, the more picks, the better. In other words, say you have one handicapper who comes up with 10 picks a month and over the course of a year shows a flat bet $1.10 ROI based on $1 bets (10% profit per dollar wagered after 120 bets).

Another handicapper makes 100 picks a month with the same ROI, 10% profit per dollar wagered after 1200 bets. Both handicappers did extremely well, but the one who made 100 bets a month is better, and, indeed, would be considered a master handicapper.

Starting this week at Belmont on the free page of my website, I'm listing a set of alternative picks. These are not the horses that I actually selected to win on my service or on the sheet that we sell at Belmont. These are my alternative picks, which must no lower than 4-1 on the morning line. My win % therefore will be lower than my regular picks.

I started working on this concept last summer. I gave out two sets of alternative picks for Del Mar and Saratoga. Saratoga's alternative picks showed a flat bet profit, Del Mar didn't. However, I didn't use a wide criteria for the picks, I just looked at a computer printout from my Diamond System and quickly jotted down some picks. This time I'm using several sets of numbers.

My theory is that many handicappers (not sure of what percentage) can produce better (higher ROI) picks if they simply use their underneath picks more often. For instance, the horses that they don't think have the best chance of winning. I say many handicappers, not all handicappers, because it depends a lot on the type of handicapper you are. For instance, Steve Matthews in Newsday picks a lot of longshots on top, so he's already giving out alternative picks. I'm not sure this would work for him.

In my Power Pace Handicapping book I went into detail about being a public handicapper. The best way to produce a positive ROI on all of your picks is to pick a longshot in every single race. However, if you do that, you will have many terrible days when the chalk wins and you have Zero winners. People who follow the picks of a public handicapper are often fans who go to the track once in a while and they want winners. If they follow your picks and after, say, three trips to the track you only picked a total of 4 winners in 30 races, they'll think you suck, even though you may have picked two $30 horses on top and actually were the only public handicapper who showed a flat bet profit over the course of those three days. This is always the situation that professional handicappers are in. People want winners.

But, in terms of wagering, and for the typical bettor, learning how to think outside of the box is crucial. And a good way to force yourself to get into that way of thinking is to create a set of alternative picks, without any favorites.

[Hapman]

People are "actually" betting all my top selections, and others.

I have little interest in the minutia of this thread, but you seem to be heading in a strange direction.

I'm new here so forgive me, "the little guy" is actually Andy Serling?

[PaceAdvantage]

Yes. Verified and bona fide.

[Alwaysonpoint36]

Yes. Verified and bona fide.

I tested it out 2 years ago at Aqu. Seen Andy and yelled 'yo, the little guy!....he wasn't pleased 😂😂😂

[kingfin66]

I tested it out 2 years ago at Aqu. Seen Andy and yelled 'yo, the little guy!....he wasn't pleased 😂😂😂

Ha ha. I went out to Belmont for the Big Brown Derby in 2008 and tried to say hello to Andy on the Friday before. Snubbed me, but it's okay because he was undoubtedly busy. I still like him!

[the little guy]

Ha ha. I went out to Belmont for the Big Brown Derby in 2008 and tried to say hello to Andy on the Friday before. Snubbed me, but it's okay because he was undoubtedly busy. I still like him!


I only snub people I know. :)

[EMD4ME]

I only snub people I know. :)

You've never snubbed me :lol: Now, I'm honored !

[Maxximus]

You don't have to like him. Just don't lie about him.

What exactly did I lie about?

[NorCalGreg]

What exactly did I lie about?


You called him one of the "worst handicappers in the industry" that's total BS-- and you know it, Maxx.

[Maxximus]

You called him one of the "worst handicappers in the industry" that's total BS-- and you know it, Maxx.


Relax. He is certainly is. Chasing 5 horses in a race is lazy handicapping. My dog can do that.

[NorCalGreg]

Relax. He is certainly is. Chasing 5 horses in a race is lazy handicapping. My dog can do that.

Only posting about Andy is lazy posting. Is this a weird obsession-- is Andy all you care about? Move on son--he's not that important.

[Maxximus]

Only posting about Andy is lazy posting. Is this a weird obsession-- is Andy all you care about? Move on son--he's not that important.

You guys are the one on his nuts and you call me obsessed? You have a NEED to defend him for some reason. Good lord

[Tom]

Relax. He is certainly is. Chasing 5 horses in a race is lazy handicapping. My dog can do that.


How about this post for one your lies?

[jk3521]

Relax. He is certainly is. Chasing 5 horses in a race is lazy handicapping. My dog can do that.

The original post was stating that he had a positive R.O.I. on his TOP selections . Get it ? Not on his top five !!! Madonna mia !

[cj]

You guys are the one on his nuts and you call me obsessed? You have a NEED to defend him for some reason. Good lord

Get lost dude.

[PaceAdvantage]

What exactly did I lie about?Here is what you wrote: "Must be nice to pick and post 5 horses in a race (Talking Horses) then when one of them hits the board, its a great achievement"

There it is, in black and white. Don't think he or anyone else has claimed a great achievement when his 5th pick hits the board.... :lol: :lol: :lol:

We can unlock this thread now, ol' Max won't be back to answer.

[jk3521]

No need to keep it open . There's nothing more to say. Takes all kinds, huh?

[PaceAdvantage]

Good point.