Our Little Microcosm

[GameTheory]

I was just curious about the demographics around here... is it true that there aren't any young players coming to the game?

[Tom]

Maybe it's becasue kids today can't read?
Ever go to a McDonalds? If that is our fuure, I'm scared.
We are reaping the results of outcome-based education.
No, no one call me a "fuddy-duddy"

Tom

[Lefty]

And you need a little math, too. Not much math with the kids is there when they need the registers to tell you what the change is. I was in a grocery store and the register "went down" the young lady looked at me with panic in her eyes. "you owe me 57 cents, I said. She smiled and looked relieved.

[FortuneHunter]

I have always thought that a handicapping course at the high school or undergrad level would be a good experience. Kids get a $10,000 (mythical) Bankroll and learn about

Decision Making
Reasoning/Logic
Money Management
Hard Work
Intestinal fortitude
Schedule
Basic Math/Statistics

Put Poker in as the next course. Alot to learn there too.

FH

[sq764]

Geez, I was the first 'Under 30' click.. I feel so young..


Scott

[ranchwest]

If it will make you feel better, you'll never again be as young as you are now. :)

[Handle]

I'd like to see statistics on what age people start playing the ponies to a more serious degree than maybe going a few times for the hell of it. For that matter, I don't think there's currently much in the sport for people under 25 years of age, perhaps even under 30 years of age. You need to have "disposable" income in order to participate regularly, which means having a job and being somewhat settled in your life. Also, maybe its just the tracks that are near where I live, but I wouldn't exactly call them the best places to pick up a date (younger people and their hormones, you know). You're also not going to score a lot of points with your friends at work talking about the races the way you might talking about the ball game everyone watched.

Of course, there's an enormous amount of interest in horses from young girls -- but not in horse racing.

Before horse racing really reaches out to a younger demographic I think there needs to be something more participatory (is that a word?) added to it. Certainly this might lie in the realm of software programs. But perhaps something along the lines of a "Fantasy Horse Racing" league... I don't know.

-Handle

[JimG]

Regarding introducing people to the sport of racing...been doing that since I was 16. Now I'm 41. Me and a buddy used to sneak into Tampa Downs in the late 70's. In fact, Scott, having the baby face was once asked by a security guard how old he was (he was 16). Scott replied 18. The guard asked Are you sure? Scott replied, of course I know how old I am! And walked right on in.

As I've gotten older and have work acquaintances that know nothing about the races...I have found the following help when talking about the races. First of all, people will not be interested if you are a loser...or say you are. If you recall winning days, it excites potential fans. When I take someone new, I do not bet for myself much, but bet with them and explain what we are doing and reading. I explain I don't always win, but with hard work breaking even or winning is entirely possible.

Most people who have accompanied me to the track really enjoyed it and many go back again. Almost all that enjoyed it were male and enjoyed sports in general.

In my opinion, advertising gimmicks will not create new race fans. In fact, as someone pointed out, to be a regular you need disposable income and some steadiness in your life. It will never be the place to be for 20 somethings on a regular basis. Naive to think otherwise. However, this is not gloom and doom for the industry. The 40-80 year olds that go today will be replaced by other 40-80 year olds 40 years from now as long as the racetracks work together and not try to kill one another.

Other thoughts on the subject?


Jim

[sq764]

I agree that the disposable income factor is a key to the age groups. I am 28 right now, engaged and saving for a house. Its tough to find a consistent cash flow that is just earmarked for horseracing. (Somehow I seem to find it every single week, but that's another story)

I guess the older you get, the more settled down and financially secure, you have a little more money to lay out.

Just my opinion.

Scott

[Tom]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by FortuneHunter
[B]I have always thought that a handicapping course at the high school or undergrad level would be a good experience. Kids get a $10,000 (mythical) Bankroll and learn about

They would blow it on mythical drugs!
~G~

Tom

[Tom]

Originally posted by sq764
Geez, I was the first 'Under 30' click.. I feel so young..


Scott

Take some advice - don't take tying your shoes for granted.
Someday you will know what I mean. It is a long way down there.

~G~


Tom

[Tom]

One nice thing about getting older, I used to spent a $100 a night on booze, just to catch a buzz. Nowadays, all I have to do
is stand up fast,

~G~ Tom :eek:

[Dave Schwartz]

Tom,

Oh sure... Write each paragraph in a separate post so you get more posts in the PA Posting derby. (Then people will tell you that you need to get a life.) <G>

Dave

[JimG]

Originally posted by Dave Schwartz
Tom,

Oh sure... Write each paragraph in a separate post so you get more posts in the PA Posting derby. (Then people will tell you that you need to get a life.) <G>

Dave


With the lead time has, it may be insurmountable. Looked like Rick Ransom had a shot at one time, but he faded in the backstretch.

Jim

(another post for me <g>...#12 and holding strong.

[GameTheory]

Well,

I turned 32 four days ago, and I've been "doing" horse-racing off and on for about nine years. For a while there, I was going out to Santa Anita every day. (I wish I was there now -- at the moment I'm about 10 minutes from where the Detroit Race Course used to be, and its 15 degrees outside. In fact, I'm sitting in a room re-modeled using mostly supplies gotten from the Home Depot that's there now.) When I first starting going, which was in Sante Fe, New Mexico (free parking, free admission -- those were the days), I was quite surprised by the number of women and families with little kids (and of course Santa Anita has a playground). I usually see a fair number of twenty-somethings at the track, but "the regulars" are generally older....

[sq764]

I think the biggest culture shock (or diversity) came to me when my fiancee and I went to Saratoga. We went to the T-breds during the day, about 30,000 beautifally-clothed patrons, about half of which knew anything about horseracing..

Then we went to the Saratoga harness track that night.. About 30 big fat slobs who could care less who was there, program in one hand and beer and hot dog in the other..

Sadly enough, I think I would rather be around the latter group at the track..


Scott

[JimG]

Originally posted by sq764
I think the biggest culture shock (or diversity) came to me when my fiancee and I went to Saratoga. We went to the T-breds during the day, about 30,000 beautifally-clothed patrons, about half of which knew anything about horseracing..

Then we went to the Saratoga harness track that night.. About 30 big fat slobs who could care less who was there, program in one hand and beer and hot dog in the other..

Sadly enough, I think I would rather be around the latter group at the track..


Scott

Scott

So would I. If your fiance is like my wife, she would prefer neither, but if she had to choose it would definitely be the former and not the latter.

Jim

[gumbo]

Much like Poker, Horse Racing appeals to those of us who have played a lot of games, run a lot of scams (or had them run on us), and, in general, seen a lot of shakedowns.

Though the greedy SOBs that run the sport continually try to kill it, the appeal of testing your skills in a parimutual environment is just too much to resist!!

As one of the "middle of the bell curve" members (45 years old), I find betting on the ponies a fun and mentally stimulating deviation from my job, my Sat AM chores, and watching sitcoms at night. The competitive instincts get a super-charge when you nail the $42 horse, and they forget pretty quickly the five times that you refuse to bet the "class on the lead" horse that you thought was too damn short, and won by 5. Of course, for those of you that do this professionally, these mistakes are a little more costly, but, obviously, you don't make them as often as I do.

It may be true, as has been said about youth, that horse racing would be wasted on the young. Too time consuming, not enough action, and too much work to be good at it. Some things are better enjoyed later in life.

gumbo

[Some_One]

I'm in university still. That should indicate how young I am. But eventhough my bet max is usually 10 bucks, I take it just as serious as the guy next to me who might have a couple of hundred on the race.

[Handle]

Some_one,

No doubt, you don't have to be older to take things seriously.
Just intuition -- but you sound English or Aussie -- or, at least, not American (what you sound like to me is based on my experience only). Most Americans say "I'm still in College", not "University".
I bring up the point because, while I have never had the experience of going to Australia or Great Britain to enjoy the sport, I have spoken to a number of people and have read about it. It seems, to me, that is more of a "mainstream" sport there then it is in the US. By mainstream, I'm talking about its general popularity. The "average" person might be more aware of what goes on in a horse race -- of who the famous jocks are, for example -- then they do in the US. Is this true?

-Handle

[Handle]

Uh oh, I'm just full of ideas today.
How much would the popularity of this sport be increased if a picture of the winning horse in the feature race of the nearest track appeared on the cover of every newspaper in the land -- or at least the front page of the sports section -- every one or two weeks -- and it wasn't because of a betting scandal, but instead, was accompied by some very insightful and gratifying article about playing the horses? Just something to think about. The whole idea reminds of the 3 ex-microsoft employees who just bought the PBA (bowling) for 5 million. They want to re-vitalize the sport -- bring it up to date in terms of the promotion, like the other big professional sports in this country. Most here (as indicated by the poll) are old enough to remember the 70's when bowling was very big on TV.

-Handle

[ranchwest]

>The 40-80 year olds that go today will be replaced by other 40-80 year olds 40 years from now as long as the racetracks work together and not try to kill one another. <

In my region, I've watched Jefferson Downs (New Orleans) and Trinity Meadows (Dallas/Fort Worth) get swallowed up. I think in both cases it hurt racing.

[FortuneHunter]

I am a Saratoga native. I grew up listening to Freddy Caposella (sp?) call the stretch drive and here the roar of crowd from my sandbox in the backyard. I used to play with the children of the stars of the game, John Rotz, Larry Adams, Bill Boland, Angel Cordero, A.P. Smithwick, Allen Jerkins, Laz Barrera. We were neighbors for 24 days a year. Was there the night a Seattle Slew yearling went for 6 Million. I have seen the big show come and go for 40 years.

So, I will hold my opinion for a while.

Last year, on average, 28,000 people bet close to 3.5 Million on track everyday for 36 days at the Spa.

Who are these people and why do they come?

[GR1@HTR]

Me thinks todays young sharpies are more interested in dot com (or used to be) and day trading. Nintendo, playstation and internet take up a lot of disposable time/income. Also when you guys were my age there was no TV...Maybe not even electricity...So there is just more to do now (more options).

;)

[Some_One]

Handle, I'm Canadian, live near Woodbine and was on the rail for both the Atto Mile and Canadian International. And racing just as much (or little) mainstreamed here compared to the US. There is good coverage for the biggies like the Plate/Mile/International...and Woodbine does a lot of advertising as it's take a more entertainment approach to the business. I think it has worked, stands were packed both days I was up last year...I remember a couple years ago, people who were coming to the track on International day didn't realize the the Int'l was being run that day.

[BillW]

Originally posted by Some_One
I think it has worked, stands were packed both days I was up last year...I remember a couple years ago, people who were coming to the track on International day didn't realize the the Int'l was being run that day.

Some_one,

I'm glad to hear people are noticing the races. That seems to be a major flaw in horserace marketing. Tying the main product in with the draw. Here in HOU ,SHRP yearly has a 4th of July fireworks show. I know of at least one year they bragged of having the largest attendance in the nation for that day. Problem was that 75% of the people walked through the turnstile after the 9th race (waiting for those nasty horses to get out of the way of the show). Likewise they draw well for their weekly concerts but I'm not sure they are drawing new racing fans, or people looking for a cheap concert. I hope the trend changes as up in Ont.

Bill W.