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View Full Version : Do Trainers enter bad horses on purpose? to get a bigger payout on their best horses


TheOracle
06-26-2016, 02:03 AM
The reason I ask is because I have seen many instances where a Trainer who is doing well in certain situations all of a sudden makes a change and does the opposite of what was successful in the first place and I always wonder as to why they do this.

In a very recent example, D A Cannizzo has been very successful, in terms of return on investment across the board, with Joel Rosario this year at Belmont on the Dirt Surface.

http://www.insidethenumbers.net/images/comments/canrocombobel.jpg

However, today both of them hooked up with #4 Verger in the 7th race which was on the Turf. Although #4 Verger was able to finish 3rd Cannizzo has not done well at all in Turf races this year at Belmont.

http://www.insidethenumbers.net/images/comments/canallcombotrfbel.jpg

I believe this is where handicapping comes in to play because I don't know why he would switch to Turf when he is having such success on the Dirt surface especially with Rosario.

It makes me wonder if Trainers enter horses in situations that are not favorable in order to throw the betting public off the scent to get a larger payout for their top performers.

I suspect that Trainers are allowed to make wagers and with that being the case it would be in their best interest to get the highest win or across the board prices as possible.

Other sports don't usually do that for example, if a football team is having success running the ball they in most instances continue to run the ball except for the Seattle Seahawks and they paid dearly for their poor decision on the last play of the superbowl in 2015.

If a pitcher is having success getting outs by throwing the fastball he keeps doing it until the other team proves they can hit the pitch. In basketball if a team can't defend the 3 pointer other teams will shoot them until they prove they can defend the 3 pointer.

I guess this is one of the things that makes horseracing different from any other sport.

castaway01
06-26-2016, 09:39 AM
Each horse is different. Some horses specialize in turf and are bred to run on it. Running a horse who is suited for turf on the dirt just because the barn has some good dirt horses would make no sense and would be the opposite of good training. To use your examples, if the trainer made a turf horse run on the dirt, it would be like a guy with a 100-MPH fastball only throwing curves, or the team with a great running back only passing. Now occasionally a trainer will use a turf race for conditioning for a dirt horse, but that's not what's happening here. Verger is a turf horse running on turf because that's what he's best at.

green80
06-26-2016, 03:54 PM
Do Trainers enter bad horses on purpose? to get a bigger payout on their best horses

No, not usually. Trainers are usually more interested in the purse money than what they horse pays.


to get a bigger payout on their best horses?

about never. If a horse is capable, the betting public usually knows it (or enough of the sharps know) and there goes your big payout.

If a trainer enters a horse where he shouldn't it's usually to satisfy an owner that just wants to run his horse.

TheOracle
06-26-2016, 05:21 PM
Do Trainers enter bad horses on purpose? to get a bigger payout on their best horses

No, not usually. Trainers are usually more interested in the purse money than what they horse pays.


to get a bigger payout on their best horses?

about never. If a horse is capable, the betting public usually knows it (or enough of the sharps know) and there goes your big payout.

If a trainer enters a horse where he shouldn't it's usually to satisfy an owner that just wants to run his horse.


Hey Green,

I got you so Trainers are more likely concerned with the purse money than the payouts and they are sometimes trying to satisfy some owner when they enter a horse in a situation that seems a bit odd.

So they might not be necessarily trying to throw the public off course they just might not have a choice in looking for a spot for the horse.

ultracapper
06-26-2016, 06:08 PM
The one I don't get is the horse that breaks his maiden in his 9th lifetime race at 6f on dirt after trying both surfaces and multiple distances in those first 8 races, and then, instead of looking for a 6 or 6 1/2f sprint first race after the win, you find them in a 1 1/8 mile turf race. I see it all the time after a horse has proven where it fits best after much tinkering around, and then the tinkering starts all over.

Elliott Sidewater
06-26-2016, 08:25 PM
No!