Physicality Observations and Questions Because Of

[whodoyoulike]

I don't know very much about it. Most of my observations and resulting decisions are to eliminate my contenders with a few which I consider is a good sign for the way a horse is feeling for that day's race.

:1: In the post parade (pp), I see the horse placing his neck over the accompanying pony. Is that a good sign?

:2: During the pp, the jockey after passing the stands takes off in a slight trot or gallop. What does that usually mean? Is it good i.e., a dominating personality?

:3: Same as :2: but, the jockey encourages the horse farther away but after the horse has walked up to that point. Why do they do this? I've assumed it was to stretch them but the distance involved is not very far so uncertain how beneficial it is. Is it a good sign?

:4: During the pp, the jockey is seen moving up and down while slowly walking the horse. What does it mean (possible jock itch etc.)?

:5: In the paddock and walking ring, after the horse is led around, the groom usually stops and the horse is standing still. What should we be looking at (or for)? I usually check to see if the horse's ears are pricked and if the horse is not listless but appears aware plus a bunch of other things.

:6: During the pp, what should we be looking for? As far as the jockey and horse's action because most times it appears the horse is just walking up to the gate. I check for how the horse enters the gate i.e., reluctance but, it's too late to change my bet.

[Ruffian1]

I don't know very much about it. Most of my observations and resulting decisions are to eliminate my contenders with a few which I consider is a good sign for the way a horse is feeling for that day's race.

:1: In the post parade (pp), I see the horse placing his neck over the accompanying pony. Is that a good sign?

:2: During the pp, the jockey after passing the stands takes off in a slight trot or gallop. What does that usually mean? Is it good i.e., a dominating personality?

:3: Same as :2: but, the jockey encourages the horse farther away but after the horse has walked up to that point. Why do they do this? I've assumed it was to stretch them but the distance involved is not very far so uncertain how beneficial it is. Is it a good sign?

:4: During the pp, the jockey is seen moving up and down while slowly walking the horse. What does it mean (possible jock itch etc.)?

:5: In the paddock and walking ring, after the horse is led around, the groom usually stops and the horse is standing still. What should we be looking at (or for)? I usually check to see if the horse's ears are pricked and if the horse is not listless but appears aware plus a bunch of other things.

:6: During the pp, what should we be looking for? As far as the jockey and horse's action because most times it appears the horse is just walking up to the gate. I check for how the horse enters the gate i.e., reluctance but, it's too late to change my bet.

Ok . Here you go.

:1: In the post parade (pp), I see the horse placing his neck over the accompanying pony. Is that a good sign?

A. Not a good sign or a bad sign. It is individualistic. Only way to know it's different is if you watch said horse warm up every time and realize it is different. If so, it still means nothing in most cases as far as betting on or against. There are reasons though, in most cases, but it doesn't pertain to the bet.

:2: During the pp, the jockey after passing the stands takes off in a slight trot or gallop. What does that usually mean? Is it good i.e., a dominating personality?

A. No. Typically, if a horse has hind end muscles that are tighter than a trainer or rider might want, the riders will be told to jog the horses a good ways before breaking into a gallop. Especially so in horses asked to show speed or close position.That will help loosen up the hind end for more strength in the push off from the gate , but that is also assuming the trainer has a clue or the rider has a clue. Kind of depends which track you are watching. Not that lesser tracks have all idiots training, but... that is where plenty of idiots do train. Not to slight minor tracks, the smarter trainers and or riders will typically be the high% people as they simply shine over the competition. At bigger name tracks, almost all have a solid idea of right and wrong.
Has little to do with personality of the horse. They are athletes and some need to stretch much more than others, just like people, depending largely on age and confirmation. Again, knowing these horses habits beforehand and seeing progression or regression is a solid indicator but that is a monster commitment time wise. Probably not worth it for anyone but a major daily player.

:3: Same as :2: but, the jockey encourages the horse farther away but after the horse has walked up to that point. Why do they do this? I've assumed it was to stretch them but the distance involved is not very far so uncertain how beneficial it is. Is it a good sign?

They typically walk if the horse gets all hyped up near the gate and does not need to loosen up more than normal. Might see the riders feet out of the stirrups as well if this is the case. Trying to keep the horse mentally cool and kill time before having to get too close to the gate and the horse start to fret, if indeed that is the case.
Trying to save wasted energy. Again, knowing what to anticipate from previous warmups is huge.

:4: During the pp, the jockey is seen moving up and down while slowly walking the horse. What does it mean (possible jock itch etc.)?

No, although it's probably happened. Lol.
They might be deciding if their irons are in the right spot or they need to be jacked up or let down a notch. If so, it's a strap under the skirt of the saddle which is under each riders thigh when they are sitting on the horse. You can see them adjust them if indeed they do.
Other than that, it could mean several things but nothing bad as far as the horses physical state.

:5: In the paddock and walking ring, after the horse is led around, the groom usually stops and the horse is standing still. What should we be looking at (or for)? I usually check to see if the horse's ears are pricked and if the horse is not listless but appears aware plus a bunch of other things.

Good observation. But not only the ears, because they could have heard or seen something that bothered them, and are listening for more to be aware of whatever it was. So DO look at their eyes. There are stories to be told in some horses eyes. Not that often, but often enough for me to tell you to look for it. It might take a while for you to see it, but do give it a shot. And take notes for after the race.

:6: During the pp, what should we be looking for? As far as the jockey and horse's action because most times it appears the horse is just walking up to the gate. I check for how the horse enters the gate i.e., reluctance but, it's too late to change my bet.[/QUOTE]

Reluctance is a big factor but yep, it's generally too late.
If you don't compare from race to race it is tough to spot something because you don't know if it's the norm or out of the ordinary.
It's great that you are looking though. That tells me you want to know more. Always a good sign IMO.

Hope some of this helps.

Good luck.

Follow up if you have any further questions.

[whodoyoulike]

... Hope some of this helps.

Good luck.

Follow up if you have any further questions.

Thanks appreciate your response. I was afraid to understand physicality would depend on how the horses normally goes thru their motions because the time periods between races I've noticed for winners lately has been about 3 - 5 weeks. And, I don't watch the races every day.

I've noticed and agree about the eyes comment when I used to go to the paddock sometimes it was just the way horses looked and held their head up.

[johnhannibalsmith]

... So DO look at their eyes. There are stories to be told in some horses eyes. ...

I liked your whole post but I loved this part. One of my favorite things to look for whether betting or claiming. On the last pass before leg up I love to stare them down. Many talk back and those that have something, but not too much to say, have that cool, calm focus but awareness that I like.

[whodoyoulike]

Hell, I once had Bertrando look straight at me and then he winked. I just didn't realize just how sure he was about the race.

[thespaah]

I don't know very much about it. Most of my observations and resulting decisions are to eliminate my contenders with a few which I consider is a good sign for the way a horse is feeling for that day's race.

:1: In the post parade (pp), I see the horse placing his neck over the accompanying pony. Is that a good sign?

:2: During the pp, the jockey after passing the stands takes off in a slight trot or gallop. What does that usually mean? Is it good i.e., a dominating personality?

:3: Same as :2: but, the jockey encourages the horse farther away but after the horse has walked up to that point. Why do they do this? I've assumed it was to stretch them but the distance involved is not very far so uncertain how beneficial it is. Is it a good sign?

:4: During the pp, the jockey is seen moving up and down while slowly walking the horse. What does it mean (possible jock itch etc.)?

:5: In the paddock and walking ring, after the horse is led around, the groom usually stops and the horse is standing still. What should we be looking at (or for)? I usually check to see if the horse's ears are pricked and if the horse is not listless but appears aware plus a bunch of other things.

:6: During the pp, what should we be looking for? As far as the jockey and horse's action because most times it appears the horse is just walking up to the gate. I check for how the horse enters the gate i.e., reluctance but, it's too late to change my bet.
1...No worries here. Horses have a "herd instinct". In the herd there are horses which dominate. It is possible that is a show of dominance. As far as running the race, it is of no consequence.
2. Just cantering the horse to get him going.
3. Again, just a slow canter. Gets them a bit pumped up. And at times if the horse is acting a bit anxious, this lets the horse blow off a little steam.
4, this is called "posting"....The rider in rhythm with the horse.
5 I like to look at the horses head. If the ears are pinned back or rthe whites of the eyes are prominent, this is a horse that is uncomfortable or even under stress. The next thing I look at is if the horse is lathered up. If it a very hot day, this is less important. But if it is normal day and a horse is sweating profusely, that means it is expending energy unnecessarily. A bad sign. Another thing I look at its the hocks and knees. If i see obvious malformations, I make note. I look at confirmation. I don't like horses with over long pasterns. I also don't care for horses wearing run down bandages. Those two go hand in hand. Another item. If a horse fires back( kicks) while standing still, that horse is under some stress.
Positive signs. If horses ears are pricked. If the horse appears alert. Holds the head up but not throwing his head upward. While the horse is being walked, I like to see them on their toes. But when the groom has them stand, they stand. This is a horse that is in a good frame of mind. And of course I look at the coat and muscle. a shiny coat and good muscle tone is a good sign....I can do this in a couple mins of looking over the horses.....
6...I never put much into the horses actions as they are lead to the gate or they load. If they act up, it's too late to change the bets anyway. So we live with it.

[burnsy]

If the horse is a sprinter, look for tight, large hind muscles. These horses are naturally tight and bulked up, they need to jog a little before the race. Its sort of a negative if you don't see them run a little. On their own! They are built like most human sprinters. They need to stretch first.

In the paddock after the rider is up watch the horse stride from the side. When the horse walks see that the rear hoof is almost touching the front one during the paddock walk. That horse can fully extend its muscles and most likely is not sore. When the horse stops look at the neck, the ears will move because there is all kinds of noise but a fit horse will have a bowed neck and will appear to be a ball of energy waiting to be released. Some will prance on their toes on the track and the neck will be "chin down". Ready to roll.

If its hot and sunny look for some sweat but if its cool the horse should handle it without profusely sweating. If you pay attention you can see who gets the hose and who is actually sweating a lot. The look in the eye it is a good way to see who doesn't want to be there. Some good ones freak out, others stay calm and eye the crowd but avoid the ones that look like they are scared or don't want to be there. There is a difference.

I'm no Maggie but at Saratoga most every horse in the field looks good. I can at least pin point the ones that have negatives and that helps a lot. Almost every horse will appear the way I said, but I look for the ones having a "bad day". If its a favorite or contender that can really help you out come betting time.

The jockey moving up and down is what the other poster said. Its like the pedals on a bicycle and they are timing the gait of the horse while its going slow so they have a feel of the rhythm when the horse gets going during the race. Its just a measurement check and warm up method.

[Fager Fan]

I think #4 is just a matter of riding. Going up and down with every other step is called posting and it's smoother than sitting it the seat and getting bounced. When you're a rider, sometimes you post even though the horse is going slow enough to not bounce you. It may also warm up the jock.

I don't see many jocks adjusting their irons after they're in the post parade. If he's using the same saddle, the irons shouldn't need adjusting.

[whodoyoulike]

1...No worries here. Horses have a "herd instinct". In the herd there are horses which dominate. It is possible that is a show of dominance. As far as running the race, it is of no consequence. ...

4, this is called "posting"....The rider in rhythm with the horse. ...


Regarding :1: if it indicates dominance and you haven't seen how they do in the pp normally, does this dominance indicate aggressiveness in the race e.g., an E/P or a P going for the lead?

:4: I also have read the other two responses after yours but, not all jockeys do this or even do this every time. So, does it mean the horse is not moving normally?

Btw, thanks. I realize we're making interpretations but, I'm seeing these things and now getting other people's ideas because as you can see some of mine are off the wall.

I'm hoping others will post some of their own observations and what they think is occurring.

[Baron Star Gregg]

Many of the responses above are quite good. You may want to check out Jerry Bailey's Inside Track Volume 1 and 2. He shows several examples of positive and negative body language. Once you think you're catching on, test yourself by watching post parades then note the changes of the odds in the next click on horses that you thought looked exceptionally good or bad.
This is an edge that pays dividends especially on low level claimers.
Jockey tells include if he/she keeps looking at a particular leg, brings his mount to the vet during the warm-up or a top jock takes off the horse for no apparent reason after the warm-up.