Derby contenders final workouts

[GreenThumbRacing]

Since there is a lot of rain heading into the 'ville many of the contenders got their final work in this morning:


-Destin 5 furlongs, 1:01 1/5 with Stradivari. Splits of :12 3/5, :24 4/5, :37 2/5, :49 3/5. Galloped out six furlongs in 1:14 1/5, seven furlongs in 1:27.

—Discreetness, five furlongs, 1:00 2/5 with workmate (1:01 2/5). Splits of :11 4/5, :23 3/5, :35 4/5, :47 4/5. Galloped out six furlongs in 1:15 1/5.

—Fellowship, four furlongs, :47 with Street Gray. Splits of :12 1/5, :23 3/5, :35. Galloped out five furlongs in 1:00.

—Majesto (jockey Javier Castelano up), five furlongs, 1:01 2/5. Splits of :12 4/5, :24 4/5, :36 4/5. Galloped out six furlongs in 1:15, seven furlongs in 1:28 3/5.

—Mohaymen, four furlongs, :47 2/5. Splits of :12 3/5, :23 4/5, :35 2/5. Galloped out five furlongs in 1:00 4/5.

—Mo Tom, four furlongs, :48 3/5. Splits of :12 1/5, :24 2/5, :36 3/5. Galloped out five furlongs in 1:02 1/5, six furlongs in 1:15 2/5.

—My Man Sam, four furlongs, :49 3/5 with workmate. Splits of :13, :25 3/5, :37 4/5. Galloped out five furlongs in 1:02 1/5 and six furlongs in 1:14 4/5.

—Oscar Nominated, five furlongs, 1:00 4/5 with Hint of Roses.

—Outwork, five furlongs, 1:01 with Azar (1:02). Splits of :13 1/5, :37 2/5. Galloped out six furlongs in 1:14.

—Shagaf, four furlongs, :47 4/5. Splits of :12 2/5, :24 1/5, :35 4/5. Galloped out five furlongs in 1:00 1/5.

—Suddenbreakingnews, five furlongs, :59 3/5 out in 1:13.

—Tom's Ready, five furlongs, :59 2/5 with Forever d'Oro (:59 4/5). Splits of :23 4/5, :36. Galloped out six furlongs in 1:13 1/5, seven furlongs in 1:27 1/5.

—Whitmore, five furlongs, 1:00 with workmate (1:00 2/5). Splits :12 2/5, :24, :35 3/5, :48. Galloped out six furlongs in 1:14.

[SecretAgentMan]

Good info, thanks!

[Grits]

Green Thumb, welcome to Pace Advantage!

Going forward, please, post original link to articles, or only a quote attached to the linked piece. It's a copyright thing that PA asks. ;) Again, welcome.

[OptionalClaimer]

I apologize I got the workout reports from Bloodhorse....

[SecretAgentMan]

I apologize I got the workout reports from Bloodhorse....



Do you type under two names on here?

[whodoyoulike]

We've discussed the value and purpose of workouts on here a number of times.

They are enjoyable to watch but are you guys and gals placing too much emphasis on them?

Enough that some are actually changing their opinions. Not necessarily in this thread but I'm referring to other threads which I've been reading on here.

[fiznow]

Honestly I never care much about workouts. I mainly use them for horses coming back after a lay off to check if the horse shows some fitness.

[Bennie]

I use them to some extent. Mainly to see who is "not" working well. Good works for me can mean the horse is bringing his A-game but his A-game may not be enough in my opinion and will not change my mind.

[glengarry]

If I saw the work myself or had someone I trust see the work, then I am interested. If I get it from the form, then it has little or no value. According to most reports, almost everyone is working well for this derby. Not surprising, as good horses usually work well. But nobody has had the sensational work that Barbaro, Street Sense, Orb, and AP did. Twenty horses, and for one of the few times in the last 15 years, no one is jumping off the page this time. I have negative opinions on a bunch, but less confidence than usual.

[SecretAgentMan]

If I saw the work myself or had someone I trust see the work, then I am interested. If I get it from the form, then it has little or no value. According to most reports, almost everyone is working well for this derby. Not surprising, as good horses usually work well. But nobody has had the sensational work that Barbaro, Street Sense, Orb, and AP did. Twenty horses, and for one of the few times in the last 15 years, no one is jumping off the page this time. I have negative opinions on a bunch, but less confidence than usual.



The horses you listed are all favorites, or close to it, meaning everyone saw what you saw. Thing is, sometimes it's better to see things others don't puck up on.

Horses like Barbaro, Smarty Jones, Funny Cide, Chrome, & Monarchos to me were horses I didn't need to look at workouts to play, in my eyes, they are gonna win no matter what they did in their workouts.

[glengarry]

The horses you listed are all favorites, or close to it, meaning everyone saw what you saw. Thing is, sometimes it's better to see things others don't puck up on.

Horses like Barbaro, Smarty Jones, Funny Cide, Chrome, & Monarchos to me were horses I didn't need to look at workouts to play, in my eyes, they are gonna win no matter what they did in their workouts.

Chrome worked at Los Al, so there wasn't a lot of coverage of his works. Don't remember how FC and Monarchos work.As for Barbaro, Orb, and Street Sense, it is likely they would not have run well if they didn't work well. Why? Because that's how it works. Don't take it from me, take it from Tom Amoss. He said "They play as they practice". While a lot of horses who work well don't show up, very few horses who work poorly run well. Works are not just for entertainment. They are there to bring fitness, maintain fitness, and to tell the trainer how their horse is doing. Barbaro Orb and Street Sense would have been favorites or close to it based on their PPs. They touted themselves the way a Derby horse should. No one, except maybe Outwork, is doing that this year. I'm not leaning towards Outwork at all, for a few different reasons. Trainers don't get on planes to watch their stakes horses work because they like airline food. It is the barometer they use to determine where they are with a horse. If that is not something that matters to you, that's OK. I wouldn't bet Secretariat off a bad work.

[SecretAgentMan]

Chrome worked at Los Al, so there wasn't a lot of coverage of his works. Don't remember how FC and Monarchos work.As for Barbaro, Orb, and Street Sense, it is likely they would not have run well if they didn't work well. Why? Because that's how it works. Don't take it from me, take it from Tom Amoss. He said "They play as they practice". While a lot of horses who work well don't show up, very few horses who work poorly run well. Works are not just for entertainment. They are there to bring fitness, maintain fitness, and to tell the trainer how their horse is doing. Barbaro Orb and Street Sense would have been favorites or close to it based on their PPs. They touted themselves the way a Derby horse should. No one, except maybe Outwork, is doing that this year. I'm not leaning towards Outwork at all, for a few different reasons. Trainers don't get on planes to watch their stakes horses work because they like airline food. It is the barometer they use to determine where they are with a horse. If that is not something that matters to you, that's OK. I wouldn't bet Secretariat off a bad work.



Don't get me wrong, workouts are very important, but I started following workouts in 2006, but not as much as others until recently.

Do you think a jockey flying in from Japan to work his horse is a big deal since a trainer flying in for a workout is a big deal?

[boys at tosconova]

—boys at tosconova, five furlongs, :56 3/5 out in 1:09.

[glengarry]

Don't get me wrong, workouts are very important, but I started following workouts in 2006, but not as much as others until recently.

Do you think a jockey flying in from Japan to work his horse is a big deal since a trainer flying in for a workout is a big deal?

It tells you how important the work is, especially the final work. Just a poor work for Lani. So would you bet a horse off a poor work? I guess you ahve already answered that. If you were a football coach, what would you expect that Sunday if everyone missed their assignments? Would you shrug it off? Coaches gauge their team's development that way. Not every horse is a great work horse. It's about how they usually do, and how are they doing now. Not that complicated.

[horses4courses]

t84FSskCypo

[glengarry]

t84FSskCypo

Thanks. Nice work, but nothing special. O'Neill said a few months ago that he wants a fresh horse for the KD. Either he knows something no one else does, or the light preparation will be his undoing. Can't decide yet.

[davew]

Thanks. Nice work, but nothing special. O'Neill said a few months ago that he wants a fresh horse for the KD. Either he knows something no one else does, or the light preparation will be his undoing. Can't decide yet.

I suspect he is shooting for a triple crown.

[boys at tosconova]

Tom Amoss trains Mo Tom. His colt worked a half-mile in 48 3/5.

"It went fine," Amoss said. "I'll say this: He made good time as many of the others did as well.

"But the track to me was a disappointment. We have a special time (8:30 a.m.) that we're allowed to go out there. The track to me was deep and not taken care of as well as it should have been.

"My horse didn't struggle over the surface, but at the same time, it wasn’t what this track typically is and it's not going to be what this track is on a race day. That puzzles me."

[CincyHorseplayer]

Tom Amoss trains Mo Tom. His colt worked a half-mile in 48 3/5.

"It went fine," Amoss said. "I'll say this: He made good time as many of the others did as well.

"But the track to me was a disappointment. We have a special time (8:30 a.m.) that we're allowed to go out there. The track to me was deep and not taken care of as well as it should have been.

"My horse didn't struggle over the surface, but at the same time, it wasn’t what this track typically is and it's not going to be what this track is on a race day. That puzzles me."

Won't be the last trainer bitching about the track as to what is holding back his mediocre horse!

[SecretAgentMan]

Won't be the last trainer bitching about the track as to what is holding back his mediocre horse!



I don't trust Amoss as far as I can throw him. He puts more time in front of the TVG camera than training.

[PaceAdvantage]

Do you type under two names on here?Ooops... :lol:

[OptionalClaimer]

My son and I have two separate accounts, both of us live in same home and IP






Ooops... :lol:

[PaceAdvantage]

My son and I have two separate accounts, both of us live in same home and IPCool...sorry I came off as a bit of a jerk...I've been known to do that...but I've also been known to admit when I'm wrong. :ThmbUp: