Songbird vs. Nyquist

[RacingFan1992]

Since there are posts about Cathryn Sophia vs. Songbird and Nyquist vs. Mohaymen I thought I would start one about the two hot horses in the country. In your opinion who is the better undefeated champion? Both are 7 for 7. It would be amazing if these two won the Derby and Oaks respectively. How often does a horse win the Breeders Cup Juvenile/Juvenile Fillies, be voted Champion 2 Year Old of their gender, and win the Derby/Oaks? To cap it off they both win the Classic and Distaff.

[PowerUpPaynter]

It would be better if they meet in the Preakness.

[Rex Phinney]

Songbird easily.

After she wins in the Kentucky Oaks the rules will be changed for fillies getting Derby points, just watch.

[RacingFan1992]

Songbird easily.

After she wins in the Kentucky Oaks the rules will be changed for fillies getting Derby points, just watch.

If a filly wants to get in the Derby then they are gonna have to face colts prior to the Derby. Regret did it in the Sanford, Hopeful, and Saratoga Special in 1914/1915 Derby win, Genuine Risk faced them in the Wood with which she came in third but won in 1980 and Winning Colors beat them in the Santa Anita Derby with a win in the Derby in 1988. I am so sick and tired of hearing people want it to be easy for a filly to get an easy pass for Derby entry. Hell while we are at it why not let colts compete in the Oaks? If you include the fillies in the Derby why not the colts in the Oaks (Sarcasm).

[ribjig]

?BETTER QUESTION?
:ThmbUp: :ThmbDown: :ThmbUp: :ThmbDown: :ThmbUp: :ThmbDown: :ThmbUp: :ThmbDown: :ThmbUp: :ThmbDown: :ThmbUp: :ThmbDown: :ThmbUp: :ThmbDown: :ThmbUp: :ThmbDown:

Define "fairest-to-both" fantasy match race conditions:
a. how many days from now? (current commitments ignored)
b. track?
c. surface conditions?
d. distance?
e. PPs?
f. other variables to "unbias"?

Same Q for CalChr vs. AmPhar????? :eek: :eek: :eek:

[Lemon Drop Husker]

If a filly wants to get in the Derby then they are gonna have to face colts prior to the Derby. Regret did it in the Sanford, Hopeful, and Saratoga Special in 1914/1915 Derby win, Genuine Risk faced them in the Wood with which she came in third but won in 1980 and Winning Colors beat them in the Santa Anita Derby with a win in the Derby in 1988. I am so sick and tired of hearing people want it to be easy for a filly yo get into the Derby.

Yep.

People are ripping on the "competition" Nyquist has faced along with a number of other horses that will make it in the gate on 5/7.

Can you imagine the complaints that would be heard if Nyquist faced the tomato cans that Songbird has seen as a 3YO?

If you want in the Kentucky Derby, race in a Derby prep that hands out qualifying points. No special treatment given. Earn your way in.

[Secondbest]

The while point is moot. Songbirds owner never wanted to run in the derby.

[RacingFan1992]

Keep in mind my question was not about Songbird and the Derby but rather who do you think is better? Songbird or Nyquist.

[SecretAgentMan]

The while point is moot. Songbirds owner never wanted to run in the derby.



If the owner wanted to run in the KD, they could have ran her in the Spiral. Could have stayed away from the treacherous prep races.

[PowerUpPaynter]

Yep.

People are ripping on the "competition" Nyquist has faced along with a number of other horses that will make it in the gate on 5/7.

Can you imagine the complaints that would be heard if Nyquist faced the tomato cans that Songbird has seen as a 3YO?

If you want in the Kentucky Derby, race in a Derby prep that hands out qualifying points. No special treatment given. Earn your way in.



im not gonna rip the quality of competition nyquist has faced. the entire crop sucks so far - possibly minus nyquist

[olddaddy]

If a filly wants to get in the Derby then they are gonna have to face colts prior to the Derby. Regret did it in the Sanford, Hopeful, and Saratoga Special in 1914/1915 Derby win, Genuine Risk faced them in the Wood with which she came in third but won in 1980 and Winning Colors beat them in the Santa Anita Derby with a win in the Derby in 1988. I am so sick and tired of hearing people want it to be easy for a filly to get an easy pass for Derby entry. Hell while we are at it why not let colts compete in the Oaks? If you include the fillies in the Derby why not the colts in the Oaks (Sarcasm).

Agree, The way things stand, all a filly has to do is have either a win or place in one major derby prep. Polar River did this in uae derby and can get in this year.

[Lemon Drop Husker]

Keep in mind my question was not about Songbird and the Derby but rather who do you think is better? Songbird or Nyquist.

Would depend upon field size and distance.

8 1/2 panels and under, I'd lean towards Songbird, unless we had a 10+ horse field and at least some kind of speed in the race.

9F and further, I'm going with Nyquist.

Songbird is a great looking filly, and I don't want to take anything away from her, but we really haven't seen her even the slightest bit contended with on the front end. A lot of that has to do with her abilities, but I think we all want to see her at least taken to a challenge at some point in time.