Mohaymen - Where do we go now?

[PowerUpPaynter]

Is he a derby toss or do you give him a pass?

[Speed Figure]

I don't think he's a toss. He had a bad race, but what I'm not buying is this bad trip stuff. His trip in the Fountain Of Youth where he was bumped on the 1st turn and was just as wide in the race was worst then it was today. Today he faced a champion who didn't give way in the stretch.

[minethatbird08]

Toss for me, Greenpointcrusader didn't flatter him either. Even though Nyquist ran a beautiful race he is a toss for me too, fwiw.

[Robert Fischer]

If he gets a good trip he could hit the board. If he gets a good trip and no one runs big, he could win by default.

He's a grade 1 horse.

aside- Frosted fell off a little around this time last year as have some previous precocious Kmacs. Just a possible pattern that bothers me a little.

[Valuist]

Is he a derby toss or do you give him a pass?

I think he's got a big shot in the Derby.....the Iowa or Ohio Derby, that is.

[Stoleitbreezing]

Is he a derby toss or do you give him a pass?

It was a deflating race for me, I know he was wide early and he didn't have the greatest of trips, but you see him win so effortlessly earlier on this year to come up empty at the top of the stretch was disappointing. I'll wait to see how he works leading up to the derby and if he's not working lights out then I'll just leave my futures bets. If he's training super, then I'll wait to see what his odds are on derby day and with a decent post will be keying him up and down on a couple of tickets.

[PaceMasterT]

I don't think he's a toss. He had a bad race, but what I'm not buying is this bad trip stuff. His trip in the Fountain Of Youth where he was bumped on the 1st turn and was just as wide in the race was worst then it was today. Today he faced a champion who didn't give way in the stretch.

He raced wide and probably ran the furthest of any horse in the race. However, this was the first time his "heart" was tested (he had not ever entered a stretch with horses in front of him) and he failed. He can definitely build that mental side of fighting to win every race, but I doubt he develops it by the Derby. In order for him to win the Derby, everything would have to go his way and in a 20 horse field that hardly ever happens.

[SecretAgentMan]

Mohaymen doesn't have it fellas, Nyquist kicked him in the teeth. As for the KD, I hope both are out of the money. Nyquist will get out fast & probably be placed forwardly in the KD.

I hope Nyquist gets post #20 or #1 & doesn't matter for Mohaymen, he's not going anywhere.

[Secondbest]

Finishing fourth in a major prep while losing ground in the stretch is not a good sign.However if he goes in the derby and his odds are high enough Then he might be a bet. Lets say 10-1.

[yankeelpn]

Top 4 probably 2-4 if hes lucky

[The Judge]

I remember that Jim Quinn would say that at some point a good 3 year olds seem to throw in a bad race for "no particular reason". Maybe this was Moheyman's bad race.

To forgive or not to forgive that's the question. I suspect even with this bad race he won't be at odds I can take, if he goes to the Derby.

[boys at tosconova]

I think he's got a big shot in the Derby.....the Iowa or Ohio Derby, that is.

http://s28.postimg.org/9amidadyl/image.jpg

[boys at tosconova]

he raced wide. practically 4/5wide the entire race

people do not want to give him a mulligan because they think he should be good enough to overcome it

he lasted past the 3/4 and flattened.

i don't think the race is as bad as some think..

[yankeelpn]

Losing ground in the stretch isnt a good sign and not gaining any ground.

[boys at tosconova]

Losing ground in the stretch isnt a good sign and not gaining any ground.

well....again..just how was he suppose to gain and not lose after what looks like a much more grueling trip than many want to admit.

more concerning is who beat him,,but he really didn't finish that badly...the horse might be sick, as well

[zico20]

O'neill said that he didn't think Mohaymen handled the track very well.

[SecretAgentMan]

O'neill said that he didn't think Mohaymen handled the track very well.



Mohaymen trainer Kyrian stated today he had no excuse for Mohaymen to winning. The horse is very happy today & ate well. He's his happy go lucky self.

[yankeelpn]

Mohaymen needs a fast dry track

[Hoops McCann]

he ran 54 feet more than Nyquist? big whoop. how much did he lose by? 300 feet? i guess Cali Chrome would've won by 10 lengths if he hadn't raced "wide". i might believe that he didn't like the track or he simply had a bad day...but the trip was fine.

[Mc990]

he ran 54 feet more than Nyquist? big whoop. how much did he lose by? 300 feet? i guess Cali Chrome would've won by 10 lengths if he hadn't raced "wide". i might believe that he didn't like the track or he simply had a bad day...but the trip was fine.

Lost by 7.5 lengths. Appx 60 feet.

[magwell]

In the paddock he was not the same looking colt as I seen the first two times I seen him, he was not a happy colt and didn't gallop out good at all, seemed off in behind...........:confused:

[f2tornado]

Lost by 7.5 lengths. Appx 60 feet.

And I read he ran about that much farther than Nyquist. I thought the trip was reasonable but Mohaymen simply looked done around 7F which was very atypical for the horse. He was getting beat regardless of that trip. Hopefully he is fine which is what the connections are saying.

[CincyHorseplayer]

In the paddock he was not the same looking colt as I seen the first two times I seen him, he was not a happy colt and didn't gallop out good at all, seemed off in behind...........:confused:

Thanks for this. On site observations mean a lot.

[Tall One]

In the paddock he was not the same looking colt as I seen the first two times I seen him, he was not a happy colt and didn't gallop out good at all, seemed off in behind...........:confused:


Nice observation, mag. Didnt bet the FD, but did watch. However, a picture I saw today of him in the walking ring...ears were pricked, but head was down, and his coat was not glistening like I'd seen before.

Whatever was on his mind, it definitely wasn't out there on the track.

[boys at tosconova]

i would have liked to have heard the mo camp to say something other than the horse being "fine" and "happy"

something was clearly wrong imo...fellowship doesn't make up 6/7L on him unless there is

not the way you really want to go into the derby.

[Spiderman]

Super Mario did a bit of professional jockeying by steering Nyquist to the outside at the stretch turn. This caused Mohaymen to lose momentum in his drive. Mohaymen was also outside the entire trip on a portion of the track that may have had a greater depth than where Nyquist was positioned.

just sayin', Nyquist had the better trip. From what I saw, Nyquist looks the part of a Derby winner.

[classhandicapper]

Being relatively close to the pace while losing all that ground couldn't have helped his cause, but I think whether he had a legitimate excuse for coming up that empty or ran a bit subpar is somewhat dependent on how tough you think the pace was. I'm not buying that the literal ground loss alone was enough of an excuse.

[Thomas Roulston]

How often has a horse won the Derby after finishing out of the money in his last race before the Derby?

[SecretAgentMan]

How often has a horse won the Derby after finishing out of the money in his last race before the Derby?




1993 Sea Hero 4th by 2 3/4 lengths

1994 Thunder Gulch 4th by 4 1/2 lengths

2005 Giacomo 4th by 2 lengths

2009 Mine the Bird 4th by 3 1/4 lengths


Those are the only 4 in past 23 years

[Hoops McCann]

maybe he bounces back in Kentucky. i hope so. but not holding my breath. that was a pretty bad performance.

[PowerUpPaynter]

So how are you guys capping Mohaymen Almost like either you have to toss him or give him a total pass on his last race.

[SecretAgentMan]

So how are you guys capping Mohaymen Almost like either you have to toss him or give him a total pass on his last race.



I never give a pass on a horse losing by 9 lengths in his final prep. Good horses run in the slop & at any track, no excuses, he's a toss.