1-74 trainer

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

Tampa Bay 9th race Claiming $6,250 6F

#7 Desert Summer 8/1 ML

Trainer Peter Wasiluk Jr. claimed this horse two races back in a race that he won for $6,250 and then moved him up to $12,500 last race Feb 16 showed early speed and backed off, most likely a workout in a race. Today drops back to $6,250 with the same rider KJ Coa.

MY PROBLEM the trainer is 1-74 for the year and only 4% for 2015. WOW! Here is a horse that is, in my opinion a "live" horse that should have an edge on the race with the class drop and recent wins in 2 out of the last 3 races at todays distance, track. The horse is 6-22 lifetime so it has winning ability, BUT can a 1-74 trainer make this horse a bad proposition????

Any comments? thank you

[ultracapper]

The trainer has gotten them into the winner's circle before. Obviously not at a rapid pace, but he's gotten them there. My question would be, where did he get his winners? Were they at one of the 3 main NYRA tracks? Were they in the bushes? If he's had a winner at Aqueduct before, there's no reason he can't again, if the horse is ready, able, and fits with the company.

Most of these low percentage trainers are just that because they don't put their horses in the right place, or don't take the time to get them ready for a prime effort in a favorable spot. But obviously, he's done it before, and if he has everything where and how it's supposed to be, he'll do it again.

[ultracapper]

Change all the NY references to Florida. I saw your Belmont moniker and mentally went to NY.

[thaskalos]

When it's all said and done...the HORSE does the running, not the trainer.

[ultracapper]

I bet low percentage trainers quite often. It's hard to do it with a bunch of confidence, but if the horse handicaps out, what can you do? Pick a horse that doesn't show what you're looking for simply because of statistics? My statistics show that if a horse is ready to go and placed in the right spot, that horse has a much better chance than one that is entered in the wrong place while definitely off form.

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

The final odds will be the determining factor in the end as that is paramount.

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

I bet low percentage trainers quite often. It's hard to do it with a bunch of confidence, but if the horse handicaps out, what can you do? Pick a horse that doesn't show what you're looking for simply because of statistics? My statistics show that if a horse is ready to go and placed in the right spot, that horse has a much better chance than one that is entered in the wrong place while definitely off form.

I have seen this scenario before where a very low percentage conditioner claims an in form horse and then fails.

[ultracapper]

Haven't we all. Obviously, he handles his horses differently than the high percentage trainers. You somehow have to determine if he's handled this one correctly.

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

Haven't we all. Obviously, he handles his horses differently than the high percentage trainers. You somehow have to determine if he's handled this one correctly.

Ha ha absolutely. This is just such an unique situation as normally my wagers are virtually automatic, once the value factor has been satisfied. Since this horse is owned and trained by Wasiluk the only thing I know for certain is that he won't be disappointing any owners if it is a bad result!! LOL

[ultracapper]

Ha ha absolutely. This is just such an unique situation as normally my wagers are virtually automatic, once the value factor has been satisfied. Since this horse is owned and trained by Wasiluk the only thing I know for certain is that he won't be disappointing any owners if it is a bad result!! LOL

Ha!! Catch-22. You know he wants to win for his favorite owner, but, this owner will just say "Oh well", if things don't go right. No questions that can't be answered, no yelling or threats.

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

Ha!! Catch-22. You know he wants to win for his favorite owner, but, this owner will just say "Oh well", if things don't go right. No questions that can't be answered, no yelling or threats.


LOL LOL who says this game isn't fun!!

[castaway01]

Tampa Bay 9th race Claiming $6,250 6F

#7 Desert Summer 8/1 ML

Trainer Peter Wasiluk Jr. claimed this horse two races back in a race that he won for $6,250 and then moved him up to $12,500 last race Feb 16 showed early speed and backed off, most likely a workout in a race. Today drops back to $6,250 with the same rider KJ Coa.

MY PROBLEM the trainer is 1-74 for the year and only 4% for 2015. WOW! Here is a horse that is, in my opinion a "live" horse that should have an edge on the race with the class drop and recent wins in 2 out of the last 3 races at todays distance, track. The horse is 6-22 lifetime so it has winning ability, BUT can a 1-74 trainer make this horse a bad proposition????

Any comments? thank you

Who did he claim the horse from? If it was a top barn, you're wasting your money 49 times out of 50. If it's another low-percentage barn, maybe it's worth a bet if you get 15-1.

[thaskalos]

What is this trainer's record when he trains AND owns the horse?

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

I don't have access to the trainers individual records pertaining to claims.

[thaskalos]

When a trainer puts his OWN money down to claim a horse...then this changes things, IMO.

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

When a trainer puts his OWN money down to claim a horse...then this changes things, IMO.

I agree 100%. Like the trainer Peter Kazimirus ( probably spelled his name wrong) exclusively owns and trains his horses.

[thaskalos]

I agree 100%. Like the trainer Peter Kazimirus ( probably spelled his name wrong) exclusively owns and trains his horses.
Fellow Greek Peter Kazamias.

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

Fellow Greek Peter Kazamias.

Thanks Thask I knew I screwed up the name. By the way the trainer is 1-36 for the last 365 days dropping a horse down 20% LOL looks like a good percentage play as he is 1-74 total. LOL

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

Wasiluk ran second in the opener at Tampa with his owner/trained 0-23 58/1 shot!

[ultracapper]

Either he shot his wad right there, or this is the day he's been waiting for.

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

Either he shot his wad right there, or this is the day he's been waiting for.

LOL. We will find out.

[Donttellmeshowme]

Tampa Bay 9th race Claiming $6,250 6F

#7 Desert Summer 8/1 ML

Trainer Peter Wasiluk Jr. claimed this horse two races back in a race that he won for $6,250 and then moved him up to $12,500 last race Feb 16 showed early speed and backed off, most likely a workout in a race. Today drops back to $6,250 with the same rider KJ Coa.

MY PROBLEM the trainer is 1-74 for the year and only 4% for 2015. WOW! Here is a horse that is, in my opinion a "live" horse that should have an edge on the race with the class drop and recent wins in 2 out of the last 3 races at todays distance, track. The horse is 6-22 lifetime so it has winning ability, BUT can a 1-74 trainer make this horse a bad proposition????

Any comments? thank you




Heres my question. Why did he run the horse for $12.500 after the claim? Why not run him back for 6250? My opinion but he wasted a race with the horse.

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

Heres my question. Why did he run the horse for $12.500 after the claim? Why not run him back for 6250? My opinion but he wasted a race with the horse.

Could be, but that's what incompetent trainers do they place their charges where they don't belong and some of the times it's because of owners demands, however, he is the owner so???? No published workouts since the claim on January 23, maybe he used the higher classed race to put a workout in a race to darken the horses last line for a possible bet today?? I can only guess.

[ultracapper]

Look at the form of the horse that just finished 2nd. Did he claim that horse? What kind of training regimen has he put that one through? Has he moved that one up and down the class ladder? You can maybe glean something off that one.

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

Look at the form of the horse that just finished 2nd. Did he claim that horse? What kind of training regimen has he put that one through? Has he moved that one up and down the class ladder? You can maybe glean something off that one.

Not much to go on with this career maiden...bottom level maiden, no workouts in three months, very high betting odds.

[no breathalyzer]

Heres my question. Why did he run the horse for $12.500 after the claim? Why not run him back for 6250? My opinion but he wasted a race with the horse.


Because he really like the horse and running the horse for 12.k is a freeroll.. since no buddy is gonna claim.. and gets a good tightener under the belt.. horse is now more fit under the trainers program. The problem is horse is in a bad spot and isn't going to beat the :5: unless that horse shows up lame.

[ultracapper]

Not much to go on with this career maiden...bottom level maiden, no workouts in three months, very high betting odds.

I wouldn't worry about the lack of published workouts for the horse in the 7th then. One variable out of the way.

[Donttellmeshowme]

Because he really like the horse and running the horse for 12.k is a freeroll.. since no buddy is gonna claim.. and gets a good tightener under the belt.. horse is now more fit under the trainers program. The problem is horse is in a bad spot and isn't going to beat the :5: unless that horse shows up lame.



Once a horse is fit it cant get more fitter. I dont buy that excuse that hes using it as a tightner to get more fit. Obvisiously hes 1/51 for a reason and one of those reasons is it looks like he doesnt know how to spot horses consistently.

[no breathalyzer]

Once a horse is fit it cant get more fitter. I dont buy that excuse that hes using it as a tightner to get more fit. Obvisiously hes 1/51 for a reason and one of those reasons is it looks like he doesnt know how to spot horses consistently.


Starts: 8,077
Firsts: 642
Seconds: 884
Thirds: 909
Earnings: $7,285,389

The guy is far from a bozo.. when you run vs better horses you have to work harder to stay in front or maintain a position... he obv. put that horse in that race to leg him up... today its time for a full blast off

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

Starts: 8,077
Firsts: 642
Seconds: 884
Thirds: 909
Earnings: $7,285,389

The guy is far from a bozo.. when you run vs better horses you have to work harder to stay in front or maintain a position... he obv. put that horse in that race to leg him up... today its time for a full blast off

That's what I said initially a 'workout in a race' speed for a half then fade then the drop today. For me, price will be the deciding factor because I have learned the low percentage conditioners fail you more then reward you.

[no breathalyzer]

That's what I said initially a 'workout in a race' speed for a half then fade then the drop today. For me, price will be the deciding factor because I have learned the low percentage conditioners fail you more then reward you.


what odds are you hoping to get today? ..

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

With the two scratches in the race #8 #6 I will be looking for nothing less then 5/1.

[Donttellmeshowme]

Starts: 8,077
Firsts: 642
Seconds: 884
Thirds: 909
Earnings: $7,285,389

The guy is far from a bozo.. when you run vs better horses you have to work harder to stay in front or maintain a position... he obv. put that horse in that race to leg him up... today its time for a full blast off



7% trainer lifetime and 2% this year. I will pass....

[no breathalyzer]

i think the horse runs 3rd

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

I know he won't go to the lead in this set up.

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

He wins but I would not take the 4/1 odds

[no breathalyzer]

nice pick anyways

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

nice pick anyways

thanks and I appreciate all of the well though out comments from all. great to put together a few thoughts on a race together.

[mrhorseplayer]

good job

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

good job


thanks.

[NorCalGreg]

Tampa Bay 9th race Claiming $6,250 6F

#7 Desert Summer 8/1 ML

Trainer Peter Wasiluk Jr. claimed this horse two races back in a race that he won for $6,250 and then moved him up to $12,500 last race Feb 16 showed early speed and backed off, most likely a workout in a race. Today drops back to $6,250 with the same rider KJ Coa.

MY PROBLEM the trainer is 1-74 for the year and only 4% for 2015. WOW! Here is a horse that is, in my opinion a "live" horse that should have an edge on the race with the class drop and recent wins in 2 out of the last 3 races at todays distance, track. The horse is 6-22 lifetime so it has winning ability, BUT can a 1-74 trainer make this horse a bad proposition????

Any comments? thank you


Sorry to have missed this---this one is right in my wheelhouse. Good lookin' out, finding this one, Bel. You have my respect :ThmbUp:

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

Sorry to have missed this---this one is right in my wheelhouse. Good lookin' out, finding this one, Bel. You have my respect :ThmbUp:

thanks

[ultracapper]

I stepped away for a bit, and I know this is after the fact, so take it for what it's worth, but I would have tried to talk you into taking 4. You read the race perfect. Gotta take advantage of that.

Good eye, all the same.

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

I stepped away for a bit, and I know this is after the fact, so take it for what it's worth, but I would have tried to talk you into taking 4. You read the race perfect. Gotta take advantage of that.

Good eye, all the same.

I understand BUT I never waver from my minimums and always leave off with no emotion. no excuses. In the long term this ice cold mentality have kept me void of the should haves etc.

[ultracapper]

I understand BUT I never waver from my minimums and always leave off with no emotion. no excuses. In the long term this ice cold mentality have kept me void of the should haves etc.

A necessary trait, no doubt. "If I would have........" is a death sentence in this game.

Good job.

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

A necessary trait, no doubt. "If I would have........" is a death sentence in this game.

Good job.

The one thing I have learned and etched into my brain is that once the gate opens the 'chaos' factor takes over and we, as bettors cannot control anything. The only thing I can control ( not 100% of the time) is my emotional reaction to the results of wagers or non wagers ( like today). just one result in a never ending wagering process

[deelo]

What is this trainer's record when he trains AND owns the horse?

I'm late to the thread but i'll throw out some stats in case anybody wants em.

Past 5 years as owner/trainer:
26 horses for 370 starts, 40 wins (11%), 135 ITM (36%), $1.44 ($2ROI), $10.89 median payoff

Pertaining to claims past 5 years,
First after claimed by, 11 horses for 2 wins and 7 ITM. The 2 winners were 1/1 and 2/1, the ITM's were single digit with a couple 10/1's

Second after claimed by, 8 horses for 1 win and 6 ITM
Winner: 1/1, ITMs: 17/1, 4/1, 1/1, 9/1, 9/1. The two off the board were both 4th at 10/1

[BELMONT 6-6-09]

I'm late to the thread but i'll throw out some stats in case anybody wants em.

Past 5 years as owner/trainer:
26 horses for 370 starts, 40 wins (11%), 135 ITM (36%), $1.44 ($2ROI), $10.89 median payoff

Pertaining to claims past 5 years,
First after claimed by, 11 horses for 2 wins and 7 ITM. The 2 winners were 1/1 and 2/1, the ITM's were single digit with a couple 10/1's

Second after claimed by, 8 horses for 1 win and 6 ITM
Winner: 1/1, ITMs: 17/1, 4/1, 1/1, 9/1, 9/1. The two off the board were both 4th at 10/1

thanks for the stats, as they say they don't lie. Interesting the ITM % second off the claim 87.5% figure speaks volumes about his intent even though a small sample.