Making a Murderer question

[Redboard]

Who do you think killed Teresa Halbach?
(you can vote for more than one, if you suspect conspiracy)

I noticed there was a thread about Making a Murderer on Netflix, a month ago, here :

Link to PA Thread (http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=127932&page=1&pp=40)

I just finished watching this series last night. Absolutely riveting. I can see why many people watch the whole 20 hours in a few sittings, I watched it over the course of five weeks.

Spoiler alert! If you haven’t seen it, you have been warned, and what are you waiting for? Crime of the century. Where is Columbo when we need him? The evidence of the bloodstains, keys and bullet seem definitely planted. Was Avery that stupid that he killed the woman and kept her remains/car on his property, when he had three days (and nights) to get rid of them? This was a guy who was due to get a $35 million dollar check from the government.

As an armchair sleuth, here are some things you might want to consider in addition to the evidence presented in the series.

Alternatives Theories

http://www.popsugar.com/entertainment/Making-Murderer-Theories-39585210#photo-39585210

-A Local Man Called "The German"
-A Different Member(s) of the Avery Family
-Members of the Manitowoc County Sheriff's Department
-Teresa's Ex-Boyfriend, Ryan Hillegas
-Teresa Halbach Herself (Suicide)
-An Unknown Stalker


Questions We still Have

http://www.looper.com/7218/major-questions-still-watching-making-murderer/

-Who was deleting Teresa Halbach’s voicemails?
-What Was Up With Her Ex-Boyfriend Being So Involved Anyway?
-What Happened To Lenk And Colborn
-Has The FBI's EDTA Test Been Validated By An Outside Agency?
-Has the Manitowoc County Sheriff's Department offered any explanation for why the evidence seal on Avery's blood sample package was broken and why there would be a puncture hole in the cap?
-Have Any Of The Other Jurors Spoken Out?
-Were Any Other Avery Family Members Investigated?

Evidence Omitted by the producers of making a Murderer

(got these from a few sites)
-Avery Had Been Suspected Of Sexual Assault Prior To 1985
-Avery's Sister-In-Law Claimed He Was Physically Abusive
-Avery's Fiancée, Jodi Stachowski, Also Claimed He Was Abusive
-Avery Allegedly Wrote Threatening Letters To His First Wife
-Avery *67 Dialed Halbach's Phone On The Day She Was Murdered
Halbach Had Allegedly Said She Was Uncomfortable Visiting The Avery Residence
-Avery Allegedly Wanted Halbach To Be His Photographer
-Jurors In the Avery Case Allegedly Had Connections With Law Enforcement
-Avery had purchased handcuffs and leg irons like the ones Dassey described holding Halbach only three weeks before (Avery said he's purchased them for use with his girlfriend, Jodi, with whom he'd had a tumultuous relationship -- at one point, he was ordered by police to stay away from her for three days).
-Teresa's camera and palm pilot were found in Avery's burn barrel.
In this phone conversation with his mother (which is not entirely included in the docuseries), Brendan told his mother that he did it, that Steven made him do it, and that Steven had touched him (and others) inappropriately in the past.


The documentary suggests that the investigator peppered Brendan with leading questions and basically fed him the answers. From the full transcript, that is not the case at all. Brendan not only confessed, he gave a very detailed account of what happened. They had sex with Teresa on the bed, then they carried her out to the garage, where they cut her throat, and that's where Steven shot her five times with the .22 Brendan said he pulled from above his bed. Then they threw her in the fire. She begged for her life through the entire ordeal. Brendan even cut off some of her hair. Then they cleaned up with bleach and burned all the clothes in the bonfire. Brendan mother did state that Brendan had bleach on his jeans later that day.

Brendans phone conversation with his mother (https://www.dropbox.com/s/lr7iif6ca3xp5sa/Transcript%20-%20May%2013%2C%202006%20(Dassey%20to%20Mother).pdf ?dl=0)

[Stillriledup]

Isn't this all fiction? Do you really think Avery might be innocent?

[MJC922]

The thing I found most disturbing was what they did to that poor kid Brendan. I have two special needs kids myself and it's troubling to think they could be manipulated into giving a false confession and put away for life. That was completely wrong.

[ManU918]

Great thread. I was the creator of the original thread and I love to talk about this case.

I want to add a few things:

- I think Brendan's entire confession should have been thrown out. They didn't find any bleach or blood in the house. They even drilled through the garage floor in hopes of finding bleach or blood that might have fallen through cracks. There was not one spec of DNA or blood found in the bed/bedroom where the rape apparently took place. Nor was there any hair found that he supposedly cut off. That kid just told them what they wanted to hear so he could get out of there in hopes of handing in his school project. Then he starts asking his mom once arrested if he's going to make it home for Wrestlemania... ARE YOU KIDDING ME? WRESTLE FREAKING MANIA? You just supposedly raped, stabbed and murdered someone and now you think you're going to be home next month for Wrestlemania? This kid is not all there. I don't think it should be legal for a kid of that age with a clear leaning disability to talk to police without a minimum of parental supervision if not legal counsel. They cornered him, told him what they wanted him to say... which he eventually did then signed off on it. Unfortunately this happens a lot in our country. Its a disgrace.

- The idea that the ex boyfriend just randomly started pulling Teresa's passwords out of thin air is some of the biggest bullshit I've ever heard. I think I might have said this in the other thread but I can elaborate on it a little more now. I've been with Miss ManU918 for almost 9 years. A few weeks ago her phone bill arrived. She uses AT&T and I use Verizon. Therefore I have no clue what her password is. So I said what the hell... Lets try to crack this sucker. I tried so many times that her ****ing account was locked. Her password ended up being something that a hacker would've had to retrieve for me because I could have never come up with it.

Could Steve Avery have done it? Sure but so could the other 14 people you listed. There just wasn't enough evidence for a conviction. Therefore he should have walked. In a normal setting without all the hoopla before the case with 12 normal jurors who didn't have any knowledge about the case prior to stepping into that court room. Avery walks 10 times out of 10.

I can go on and on and on about this case but I'll stop here before I write an entire thesis.

[ManU918]

The thing I found most disturbing was what they did to that poor kid Brendan. I have two special needs kids myself and it's troubling to think they could be manipulated into giving a false confession and put away for life. That was completely wrong.

Agree 100%

[johnhannibalsmith]

I voted other because the option for Steven Avery included the comment "the jury got it right". I don't think they got it at all right based upon what we saw in the show, but I still believe that Avery is the most likely to have committed the act.

[Redboard]

I voted Chuck:

-A couple weeks after the murder, in the Netflix docuseries, Chuck said that “at this point I thought my brother did it.” He’s the only Avery that ever made a statement like that. Although, I believe he may have said something later about changing his mind.

-From his jail cell, Steven was purported to say, in one of his phone calls, that he thinks Chuck did it. Now, Steven could have said this because he was pissed at Chuck’s statement.

-A few weeks ago, the local news cast visited the Avery location. They were interviewing Barb Dassey and in the background Chuck was mad and screaming that the media people should get the hell off the property. Why would he act like this? Think about it. If your brother were sitting in jail for a crime he didn’t commit, wouldn’t you want all the media attention you could get to help right the wrong?

-There is also a rumor of a falling out between the brothers over Steven's expected settlement of his $35 million lawsuit. Apparently, Chuck wasn't going to get one dime.

-Chuck had a police rap sheet with multiple charges of harassment and assault on women. One things for sure, the Averys are trailer-park trash.

[Redboard]

Great thread. I was the creator of the original thread and I love to talk about this case.

I want to add a few things:

- I think Brendan's entire confession should have been thrown out. They didn't find any bleach or blood in the house. They even drilled through the garage floor in hopes of finding bleach or blood that might have fallen through cracks......

That is one thing I'm confused about. I'm not sure, but I believe Steven admitted that he did wash the floor of the garage that day with bleach, and Brendan helped him. And he did burn a fire that day too, although it couldn't have been when Bobby Dassey said he saw him because the bus driver testified that she saw Halbach alive at sometime past 3:30pm. Unless he started the fire before she got there, which would incriminate him more.

Maybe this was the reason why Steven didn't testify. The prosecutor would have asked about stuff like this.

Maybe you have some thoughts about why he didn't testify.

[kingfin66]

I think Avery is very guilty; however, it does appear that the Manitowac County Sheriff helped the case along. I never understood why the defense did not discuss the key more. They said that it contained only Avery's DNA, but none of the victim's. The most damning evidence, IMO, is that his blood was in her car. In the absence of of another independent test for the blood preservative, the FBI's test is the only one to rely on. It came back negative. The defense expert testified that only a positive test would be conclusive, but it does not appear that the jury was convinced. Avery had a cut on his hand, but he is in the salvage business, so that could be the cause.

If I was an individual being held in jail awaiting trial I would be seriously pissed off. If I were convicted of a crime that I did not commit, I would be way beyond pissed....emotional. Where were Avery's emotions? I would not have been able to speak at my sentencing. I would be shaking. He seemed devoid of emotion before, during and after the trial. What is worse is that he has the opportunity to fess up and possibly exonerate his nephew, but chooses not to.

I did actually read an interesting theory that suggested that Scott Tadych and Bobby Dassey did it together, but it seemed too far-fetched to me.

[Redboard]

Brendan Dassey, who was featured in the documentary series, Making a Murderer, saw his conviction overturned after spending years in jail for a crime he (says he) did not commit. Brendan was 16 when he was interrogated alone by police.

https://www.theguardian.com/culture/2016/aug/12/making-a-murderer-brendan-dassey-retrial-release

He has not been released yet.