Ben Carson Is Correct About Muslims Holding Public Office

[Robert Goren]

Ben Carson is correct when he says that a Muslim has to say out right he that he puts the Constitution, the laws and duties of office over his religious beliefs. This is also true of Christians including the county clerk in Kentucky. An office holder may disagree with the law in regard to duties of his office personally and try change the laws, but until the laws are actually changed, they need to carry out their duties as proscribed by the current law.

[Tom]

Including issuing marriage licenses?

[Robert Goren]

Including issuing marriage licenses? Yes

[Fager Fan]

You'd trust what a devout Muslim says regarding his beliefs and how they'd influence his Presidency? I wouldn't but I'm in the minority apparently. No sooner than we have a horrific terrorist attack, Americans went and voted in a man whose religious beliefs were radical and racist. At best he's a Muslim sympathizer and we see how that's worked for our foreign policy as he's allowed Muslim radicals to rise to new heights.

Maybe we should spend less time worrying about being politically correct and more time studying the Muslim religion and what they want. No one, even an atheist, can condemn the life and teachings of Jesus. On the other hand, this supposed prophet Mohammed was not a good man, yet they will threaten to kill someone for "insulting" this man that they pray to.

[AndyC]

Ben Carson is correct when he says that a Muslim has to say out right he that he puts the Constitution, the laws and duties of office over his religious beliefs. This is also true of Christians including the county clerk in Kentucky. An office holder may disagree with the law in regard to duties of his office personally and try change the laws, but until the laws are actually changed, they need to carry out their duties as proscribed by the current law.

Would that include enforcing current immigration laws?

[classhandicapper]

Ben Carson is correct when he says that a Muslim has to say out right he that he puts the Constitution, the laws and duties of office over his religious beliefs. This is also true of Christians including the county clerk in Kentucky. An office holder may disagree with the law in regard to duties of his office personally and try change the laws, but until the laws are actually changed, they need to carry out their duties as proscribed by the current law.

I don't disagree with you, but it's a little different when you are elected to enforce laws A, B, and C which you are perfectly comfortable with and halfway through they are changed to D, E, F which you are not.

If a Muslim was elected and he was comfortable supporting the constitution over his religious beliefs, there would be no issue. If halfway through we passed a law requiring everyone to eat pork, I think a little carve out for him would not be the end of the world as long as everyone else gets their pork.

It would be kind of like taking someone's name off a license. Everyone still gets married and no one has to do anything they can't do.

[Greyfox]

If a man or woman is prepared to do the job and do it well, faith should not come into the equation.

Calgary has had a Muslim mayor for 5 years and he is extremely popular.

4IGFEs0lQVo

[Fager Fan]

If a man or woman is prepared to do the job and do it well, faith should not come into the equation.

Calgary has had a Muslim mayor for 5 years and he is extremely popular.

4IGFEs0lQVo

Mayor's a far cry from President.

Regardless, a person running for political office should absolutely be scrutinized for all his beliefs and actions.

[Fager Fan]

I don't disagree with you, but it's a little different when you are elected to enforce laws A, B, and C which you are perfectly comfortable with and halfway through they are changed to D, E, F which you are not.

If a Muslim was elected and he was comfortable supporting the constitution over his religious beliefs, there would be no issue. If halfway through we passed a law requiring everyone to eat pork, I think a little carve out for him would not be the end of the world as long as everyone else gets their pork.

It would be kind of like taking someone's name off a license. Everyone still gets married and no one has to do anything they can't do.

Laws change while in office if you're there long enough. The person knows that going in. The woman should resign for not doing her job. It's no different than Obama deciding to not enforce the immigration laws. Libs are just hypocrites for not demanding he do his job just as they demand this woman to do hers

[Greyfox]

Mayor's a far cry from President.



The thread title was about Muslim's holding Public Office.
That would refer to any elected representative, including a Mayor.

[Fager Fan]

The thread title was about Muslim's holding Public Office.
That would refer to any elected representative, including a Mayor.

Carson talked of the President and Canada isn't the U.S., so it seems I'm more on topic than you are.

[Dave Schwartz]

Ben Carson Is Correct About Muslims Holding Public Office
Ben Carson is correct when he says that a Muslim has to say out right he that he puts the Constitution, the laws and duties of office over his religious beliefs. This is also true of Christians including the county clerk in Kentucky. An office holder may disagree with the law in regard to duties of his office personally and try change the laws, but until the laws are actually changed, they need to carry out their duties as proscribed by the current law.

Goren,

Even as a devout Christian, I must completely agree with this statement.

It is the very essence of separation of church and state.

:ThmbUp: :ThmbUp:


Regards,
Dave Schwartz

PS: Will a few of you please protect me from the wrath of Boxcar that is likely on its way?

[Greyfox]

Carson talked of the President and Canada isn't the U.S., so it seems I'm more on topic than you are.

The topic is Muslim's holding Public Office.
If you want to limit it to Muslims running for President, so be it.
My crystal ball doesn't see any person who professes before hand to be a Muslim ever getting elected as the President.

[Tom]

The correct response would have been, "Are you a real reporter?
There is no muslim running for president who favors sharia law. Ask a relevant question about this election or shut up."

The whole thing is a waste to time.

Strong national security
Fiscal responsibility
Smaller government

Do not talk about ANY other subject to ANYONE.

Peri-freaking - od.

[Tom]

Ben Carson is correct when he says that a Muslim has to say out right he that he puts the Constitution, the laws and duties of office over his religious beliefs.

Isn't that the oath of office? (not to be confused with Obama, the OAF of office.)

[NorCalGreg]

Isn't that the oath of office? (not to be confused with Obama, the OAF of office.)

I realize we ARE talking about the POTUS.....but just look at the fine job that muslim creep Rep in Minny, Ellison, has done. Anyone want an ASS-HAT like him running our country?

[TJDave]

My crystal ball doesn't see any person who professes before hand to be a Muslim ever getting elected as the President.


Or a Mormon...
Or A Jew...or
Buddhist
Hindu
Atheist
The list is almost endless.

And after our experience with the likes of Carter and Bush 43 about the only "professed" believer with a shot would be Christian Lite.

[Fager Fan]

Goren,

Even as a devout Christian, I must completely agree with this statement.

It is the very essence of separation of church and state.

:ThmbUp: :ThmbUp:


Regards,
Dave Schwartz

PS: Will a few of you please protect me from the wrath of Boxcar that is likely on its way?

No, it's not the essence of separation of church and state. The only separation we are guaranteed is no state-imposed religion. But that's neither here or there. You are electing someone to make laws etc for this country. That person's actions and beliefs and heart and core are important, very important. That includes his religion or lack of as well as his ethics, morals and integrity.

[Marshall Bennett]

Ben Carson's not intelligent enough to know when to speak and when to shut up. Doesn't even resemble a politician, and not because he's black either. :ThmbDown:

[classhandicapper]

Ben Carson's not intelligent enough to know when to speak and when to shut up. Doesn't even resemble a politician, and not because he's black either. :ThmbDown:

I don't think intelligence is the problem. I think not understanding what is politically correct and what is not is the problem. If you are a conservative politician, you have to filter yourself and be extremely careful about how you say and word things because the left controls more of the media and they are on a seek and destroy mission at all times. There were ways to express reservations about a Muslim president that believed in Sharia Law that would have gotten his point across about the conflicts between that and our constitution without causing all hell to break loose when most people understood what he really meant to begin with.

[Actor]

Ben Carson is correct when he says that a Muslim has to say out right he that he puts the Constitution, the laws and duties of office over his religious beliefs. This is also true of Christians including the county clerk in Kentucky. An office holder may disagree with the law in regard to duties of his office personally and try change the laws, but until the laws are actually changed, they need to carry out their duties as proscribed by the current law.The Constitution of the United States, Article Vi, paragraph 3.The Senators and Representatives before mentioned, and the Members of the several State Legislatures, and all executive and judicial Officers, both of the United States and of the several States, shall be bound by Oath or Affirmation, to support this Constitution; but no religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under the United States.So if the guy/gal can get the votes, swear him/her in. Hopefully the voters will have satisfied themselves as to his/her qualifications. If he/she doesn't do the job, then impeach him/her.

[Tom]

98% of the people have no clue what Ben said.
Typical. (Are you listening, Carly, you dimwit?)

But the upside to Ben is that money is flowing in to him at unprecedented rates.:lol::lol::lol:

[Tom]

Ben Carson's not intelligent enough to know when to speak and when to shut up. Doesn't even resemble a politician, and not because he's black either. :ThmbDown:

Actually, the problem is most people are too stupid to listen to what he really said.

but, why would any sane person go on Meet The Press and be interviewed that light weight nobody host they have.Talk about your JV squad - he is the guy who picks up the jock straps in the JV squad locker room! :lol:

Chuck Todd.....really? :lol::lol:

[hcap]

98% of the people have no clue what Ben said.
Typical.

But the upside to Ben is that money is flowing in to him at unprecedented rates.:lol::lol::lol: I would guess a large portion of conservatives understand and agree with him. The real question is how many people understand just how bonkers he really is?
http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewkaczynski/ben-carson-big-bang-a-fairy-tale-theory-of-evolution-encoura#.ko1by0pla

In a speech delivered in 2012, Ben Carson said the big bang theory was part of the “fairy tales” pushed by “high-faluting scientists” as a story of creation.

Similarly, Carson, a noted creationist, said he believed the theory of evolution was encouraged by the devil.

“Now what about the big bang theory,” said Carson at speech to fellow Seventh-day Adventists titled “Celebration of Creation,” about the theory for the origin of the universe.
ation.

[lamboguy]

http://conservativevideos.com/young-muslim-boy-wants-to-be-an-engineer-so-i-can-blow-up-the-jews/

[Tom]

I would guess a large portion of conservatives understand and agree with him. The real question is how many people understand just how bonkers he really is?

So you think liberal would not agree that the POTUS should go by our laws and not Islam's?

And, as far as bonkers goes, HE did not just give Iran nuclear capability and billions of dollars to fund international terrorism.

Perspective, my boy, perspective. :lol::lol::lol:

[Fager Fan]

I would guess a large portion of conservatives understand and agree with him. The real question is how many people understand just how bonkers he really is?

You do understand, right, that there are problems with both theories?

It doesn't make someone bonkers to question scientific theories (as opposed to scientific facts), particularly when there are problems with the theories that can't be explained. I consider it smart to question instead of just accepting what is spoon fed to you.

[Marshall Bennett]

I would guess a large portion of conservatives understand and agree with him. The real question is how many people understand just how bonkers he really is?
Tell me Hcap, how many times can you recall a liberal trashing another liberal politician?
I'm a conservative and I agree with you, he comes across as an idiot. :)

[_______]

Dr. Carson's viewpoint is one that was debated among the founders. James Madison summarized one of the objections to the constitution on exactly the same grounds. "By prohibiting religious tests (the Constitution would) open a door for Jews, Turks, and infidels".

Jefferson saw opening the door to religious minorities as a positive, the mark of our democracy's success. His 1786 Virginia Statute for Religious Freedom affirmed "that all men shall be free to profess...their opinions in matters of religion, and that the same shall in no way diminish, enlarge, or affect their civil capacities".

Anti-Federalist Henry Abbot argued against ratification of the constitution in the North Carolina legislature stating, "Mahometans (sic) might obtain offices among us, and that the senators and representatives might all be pagans". Federalist James Iredell responded that America's new experiment in democracy had "set an example to mankind...that a man might be of different religious sentiments from our own, without being a bad member of society."

We know that the Federalists eventually won the argument and Article VI is unambiguous in stating "No religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under the United States."

That doesn't preclude Dr. Carson from expressing his own opinion that he would not vote for a practicing Muslim. Or arguing that the election of one would not be a good result for our nation. Expressing those opinions is also protected.

I do find it interesting that this argument isn't new and seeing how little the debate has changed in 230 years.

[classhandicapper]

I do find it interesting that this argument isn't new and seeing how little the debate has changed in 230 years.

I don't think Carson has any issue with the US electing people of various religions.

I think he would have an issue when/if the laws of any religion conflict with the laws of the United States. That would mean you'd have to trust that individual to willingly disobey his own religion in order to uphold the constitution. If they are willing to do so, then he would question their character.

It's similar to the kind of problem we are having with the clerk.

People are screaming that she should uphold the new law on gay marriage despite her religion, but she is refusing.

If she caves, what does that say about her religious convictions and character?

Should we refuse to elect or appoint people to positions like this when their religion conflicts with the constitution?

If you think we should no longer appoint or elect clerks that might not issue gay marriage certificates then Carson makes perfect sense when it comes to the presidency.

[Tom]

Should we refuse to elect or appoint people to positions like this when their religion conflicts with the constitution?

Did she not take an oath that probably had the words "so help you God?" or some variation?

I think we already know about her religious convictions.
Put ass back in jail where it belongs, until she resign the job lied about doing to the best of her abilities. She can discuss her beliefs with Jesus when the time comes. Not the public who she lied about serving.

[PaceAdvantage]

I would guess a large portion of conservatives understand and agree with him. The real question is how many people understand just how bonkers he really is?How come all the parents whose children he performed life saving brain surgery on didn't think he was too bonkers to open their child's skull and fiddle with their brains?

You guys are always trying to play the dumb/crazy card, no matter how smart or sane the Republican candidate happens to actually be.

Cases in point: Ben Carson and Ted Cruz.

[classhandicapper]

Did she not take an oath that probably had the words "so help you God?" or some variation?

I think we already know about her religious convictions.
Put ass back in jail where it belongs, until she resign the job lied about doing to the best of her abilities. She can discuss her beliefs with Jesus when the time comes. Not the public who she lied about serving.

I agree that she is not suited to that job "anymore".

Personally, I am willing to do carve outs for people that are employed either privately or publicly when the rules change mid stream and the carve out won't impact the ability of the customer to get goods or services.

As long as all couples can get a license in a timely fashion, I don't see why her name has to be on it when the governor has already stated the licenses without her name are still legal.

But to my greater point, if the left can conclude that her religious beliefs make her unsuited to her job, why can't Carson conclude that someone that believes in Sharia Law that conflicts with the constitution is not suited to the presidency?

It's the same thing.

[Robert Goren]

How come all the parents whose children he performed life saving brain surgery on didn't think he was too bonkers to open their child's skull and fiddle with their brains?

You guys are always trying to play the dumb/crazy card, no matter how smart or sane the Republican candidate happens to actually be.

Cases in point: Ben Carson and Ted Cruz. Ted Cruz is not crazy, but he is a jerk. Rand Paul on the other hand is loony tunes.
Ben Carson is just in over his head. He has not enough experience dealing with the media and the public. But that does matter in his case because he will fade soon because no matter how much he plays to the base of the GOP, they are not yet ready to vote for black man to president. They may buy his books or pay to hear him speak, but they will not in any numbers vote for him any more than they voted for Herman Cain. They always find a reason to look else where. I think the base of the GOP just doesn't believe that a black man can embraces conservative values and he will turn out to be a liberal after he is elected. Watch you see it happen again.

[ebcorde]

also means you can't be a Muslim and fight for your country, not be allowed to be President. There are American Muslims right now undercover in the middle east. He owes them an apology

[Fager Fan]

Ted Cruz is not crazy, but he is a jerk. Rand Paul on the other hand is loony tunes.
Ben Carson is just in over his head. He has not enough experience dealing with the media and the public. But that does matter in his case because he will fade soon because no matter how much he plays to the base of the GOP, they are not yet ready to vote for black man to president. They may buy his books or pay to hear him speak, but they will not in any numbers vote for him any more than they voted for Herman Cain. They always find a reason to look else where. I think the base of the GOP just doesn't believe that a black man can embraces conservative values and he will turn out to be a liberal after he is elected. Watch you see it happen again.

Total BS. Where do you get this stuff? I and every conservative I know (which is most im close to) don't give a damn what color someone's skin is or what sex they are - only that they're the most competent for the job. We've never been presented with a good black candidate. At one point we loved Powell until he showed himself to be liberal. We still love Rice and she'd be elected tomorrow if she ran. Liberals are the ones who care about sex and skin color. You voted in an incompetent for no reason than his skin color.

[chrisl]

Apology! That is the problem. Why should someone apologize for there beliefs and opinion. You do not like mine, Bummer..Move along

[Tom]

...the base of the GOP, they are not yet ready to vote for black man to president.

Very racist comment, Bobby.
Past your bedtime?

[Tom]

Personally, I am willing to do carve outs for people that are employed either privately or publicly when the rules change mid stream and the carve out won't impact the ability of the customer to get goods or services.

Privately, IF the employers thinks the employee is worthe the bother and expense.

Elected officials - never. Period. You execute your duties according to your oath or you step down.

[Tom]

Apology! That is the problem. Why should someone apologize for there beliefs and opinion. You do not like mine, Bummer..Move along

Especially when you are totally as right as Carson is here. :ThmbUp:

[hcap]

How come all the parents whose children he performed life saving brain surgery on didn't think he was too bonkers to open their child's skull and fiddle with their brains?

You guys are always trying to play the dumb/crazy card, no matter how smart or sane the Republican candidate happens to actually be.
People may excel in one field and still be blind as a bat in others.
Carson, a noted creationist, said he believed the theory of evolution was encouraged by the devil.
I do not want a President who believes the devil is involved in the study of biology, or politics for that matter.

[Robert Goren]

Total BS. Where do you get this stuff? I and every conservative I know (which is most im close to) don't give a damn what color someone's skin is or what sex they are - only that they're the most competent for the job. We've never been presented with a good black candidate. At one point we loved Powell until he showed himself to be liberal. We still love Rice and she'd be elected tomorrow if she ran. Liberals are the ones who care about sex and skin color. You voted in an incompetent for no reason than his skin color.Proof is in the putting as they say. I have heard a lot of bad things come out of the mouths of conservatives about Rice to believe she could run as a republican and get the nomination. I never ever saw any love for Powell even when he was still a general by the right. Your post proves my point, the right always finds a reason not to vote for Black man often voting for a White man who is actually less conservative or down right unelectable. The cry is always if a good black man would just run.......... There is not a black man in the country who could pass the mustard with the GOP base.
You may not like what Obama has done, but he as gotten done more in his term than the last 3 GOP presidents did in theirs and that includes Reagan.
For all whooping and howling about Reagan that conservatives do, the only lasting things Reagan did is sign an immigration bill that put us in the mess we are in today and give aid to the Afghan rebels who showed their gratitude on 9/11. I doubt that anything Obama has done will turn out that badly.

[Greyfox]

You may not like what Obama has done, but he as gotten done more in his term than the last 3 GOP presidents did in theirs and that includes Reagan.


Future generations will remember Obama for the legacy of debt that he has left them and that is about all.
He's mortgaged the nation's Great Grand-children's futures.

[Tom]

Bobby remembers Mussolini only for making the trains run on time. :rolleyes:

[davew]

Ben Carson is correct when he says that a Muslim has to say out right he that he puts the Constitution, the laws and duties of office over his religious beliefs. This is also true of Christians including the county clerk in Kentucky. An office holder may disagree with the law in regard to duties of his office personally and try change the laws, but until the laws are actually changed, they need to carry out their duties as proscribed by the current law.

I kind of agree with you, but Carson was talking about president. I feel many voted positions would not really matter (I would guess Carson would agree on many positions).

They changed the rules on the clerk after she was in the county clerk position. It would be similar if you were a truck driver and the rules changed so that whenever you saw someone hitchhiking, you had to stop and give them a ride, no matter how scary/threatening they looked.

[Robert Goren]

I kind of agree with you, but Carson was talking about president. I feel many voted positions would not really matter (I would guess Carson would agree on many positions).

They changed the rules on the clerk after she was in the county clerk position. It would be similar if you were a truck driver and the rules changed so that whenever you saw someone hitchhiking, you had to stop and give them a ride, no matter how scary/threatening they looked.What is so scary about issuing a marriage license to a gay couple? I have seen a few look strange/funny in a gay pride parade, but never one look threatening physically.
I get it with the clerk. She lived a rather sinful life until a few years ago and then was "born again". She now condemns all the sins she committed and some she didn't. But that does not give her or anyone else the right to pick and choose the laws they obey. A county clerk has one job and only one job, to issue the licenses and permits the state and county require. Somebody has to the job. If she can do that job in conscience then she should resign and find a job she can do. The applies to adherents of any religion or sect.

[Tom]

But that does not give her or anyone else the right to pick and choose the laws they obey....

.

[classhandicapper]

What is so scary about issuing a marriage license to a gay couple? I have seen a few look strange/funny in a gay pride parade, but never one look threatening physically.
I get it with the clerk. She lived a rather sinful life until a few years ago and then was "born again". She now condemns all the sins she committed and some she didn't. But that does not give her or anyone else the right to pick and choose the laws they obey. A county clerk has one job and only one job, to issue the licenses and permits the state and county require. Somebody has to the job. If she can do that job in conscience then she should resign and find a job she can do. The applies to adherents of any religion or sect.

I agree.

Simple question.

If she issues the licenses without her name on them (as she has been) and the governor says that are fully legal and everyone can get married in a timely fashion, is she doing her job or is the point here to destroy her career unless she conforms and gives up her religious beliefs?

Of course, this is a rhetorical question because I already know what the real answer is.

[Tom]

No one is destroying her career - she is abandoning it.
Put her back in jail until she rots or does her job or resigns.

And bill her for her meals.

[boxcar]

Ben Carson is correct when he says that a Muslim has to say out right he that he puts the Constitution, the laws and duties of office over his religious beliefs.

A true Christian could never do that because God's Law trumps any country's constitution.

[Clocker]

A true Christian could never do that because God's Law trumps any country's constitution.

Not in this world. Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's.

[Tom]

Originally Posted by Robert Goren
Ben Carson is correct when he says that a Muslim has to say out right he that he puts the Constitution, the laws and duties of office over his religious beliefs.

No, he is wrong.
We have the oath of office and that ALL that is needed.

Oh, wait, I forgot something....never mind.

[Hoofless_Wonder]

Did she not take an oath that probably had the words "so help you God?" or some variation?

The phrase "so help me God" is optional, whether being sworn in for a court proceeding, political office or another government position of authority. The phrases "to uphold and defend" or "tell the truth and the whole truth" however, are not so optional and are enforceable by various punishments for breaking them.

In theory, this should allow for persons of any faith to hold any office, but does not allow them to project their personal views if violating the current laws.

It's just a theory, kind of like the theory of creation and the theory of evolution.

[classhandicapper]

No one is destroying her career - she is abandoning it.
Put her back in jail until she rots or does her job or resigns.

And bill her for her meals.

No one is actively destroying her career, but it doesn't take a genius to understand that they are unwilling to agree to a compromise that has absolutely no impact on them but a huge impact on her conscience because the goal is destruction or conformity.

[horses4courses]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CP7csHzWcAEK54E.jpg

[davew]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CP7csHzWcAEK54E.jpg


the percentage of americans that went to private catholic school in America as a kid is much higher than those who went to private muslim school (like 0bama in Indonesia)

[Tom]

No one is actively destroying her career, but it doesn't take a genius to understand that they are unwilling to agree to a compromise that has absolutely no impact on them but a huge impact on her conscience because the goal is destruction or conformity.
Sucks to be her.
Fie her or lock her up.

[TJDave]

No one is actively destroying her career, but it doesn't take a genius to understand that they are unwilling to agree to a compromise that has absolutely no impact on them but a huge impact on her conscience.

Her conscience is HER business. She follows the law... or resigns...or goes back to jail.

[PaceAdvantage]

Ted Cruz is not crazy, but he is a jerk. Rand Paul on the other hand is loony tunes.
Ben Carson is just in over his head. He has not enough experience dealing with the media and the public. But that does matter in his case because he will fade soon because no matter how much he plays to the base of the GOP, they are not yet ready to vote for black man to president. They may buy his books or pay to hear him speak, but they will not in any numbers vote for him any more than they voted for Herman Cain. They always find a reason to look else where. I think the base of the GOP just doesn't believe that a black man can embraces conservative values and he will turn out to be a liberal after he is elected. Watch you see it happen again.You just made all that up because you had nothing better to do...right? :lol:

[PaceAdvantage]

People may excel in one field and still be blind as a bat in others.
I do not want a President who believes the devil is involved in the study of biology, or politics for that matter.But you'd be ok with a brain surgeon? :lol:

[davew]

But you'd be ok with a brain surgeon? :lol:
definitely an inner city community organizer

[burnsy]

No, it's not the essence of separation of church and state. The only separation we are guaranteed is no state-imposed religion. But that's neither here or there. You are electing someone to make laws etc for this country. That person's actions and beliefs and heart and core are important, very important. That includes his religion or lack of as well as his ethics, morals and integrity.

Man, where do I start.

1. The President does not make any laws. He's an executive. The media and most of the voters don't have a clue. I guess political science is not important enough to teach anymore.

2. Instead of bitching about that bitch in Kentucky.......as a libertarian, the question for me is.......How the hell does the government get off issuing marriage licenses? Gee, where's all that freedom? The fact that one needs a license is a joke and most likely unconstitutional....its not driving a car, its a personal decision between consenting adults. Religion in this country has no bearing on that...talk about Christian Sharia Law.

3. The republicans are not bonkers or stupid......they are stuck in time and irrelevant due to not keeping up socially. Well, they can't do the math either, that's for sure. A good portion of the social crap they bitch about.....nobody cares. Their looney base runs the party, something the democrats used to experience but they are at least smart enough to blow them off for now...so they will probably win again. The younger people worry about debt and jobs, they could give a shit about who goes to church and that's a positive sign.

4. The whole Muslim thing is mind numbing. Jack asses don't even realize who we protect and free in these other countries. When they say "they're fighting for our freedom." That's just so fools like these don't bitch. When one of our guys dies over there. They are most likely guarding a school, hospital, govt. building or Mosque. The whole idea is to free up the normal Muslims, have them join civilized society and over take the terrorist. That's not my opinion, that's the reason Bush and Cheney started this thing and Obama supports it. Don't trust Burnsy, any General or Admiral will say the same thing I just did. For political people, many don't have a clue. Our blood is being spilled to save these people and fools here ridicule them. Real bright.

Keep betting though........ :)

[TJDave]

But you'd be ok with a brain surgeon? :lol:

If he was running for head brain surgeon. I want an experienced politician to be president. Our most effective presidents were astute politicians. Good and bad. If you're working in a sewer you need to be comfortable dealing with s**t.

[davew]

Man, where do I start.

1. The President does not make any laws. He's an executive. The media and most of the voters don't have a clue. I guess political science is not important enough to teach anymore.

Keep betting though........ :)


The president can make executive orders that go against current laws and constitution. They also apparently can have DOJ and IRS go after certain individuals and / or groups and let other continue to break law.

[Fager Fan]

The president can make executive orders that go against current laws and constitution. They also apparently can have DOJ and IRS go after certain individuals and / or groups and let other continue to break law.

He decides which laws he will or won't enforce like immigration, and his veto power does I effect means he makes laws. Burns knows I was trying to point out his power and instead he gets picky.

[Robert Goren]

How the hell does the government get off issuing marriage licenses? Gee, where's all that freedom? The fact that one needs a license is a joke and most likely unconstitutional....its not driving a car, its a personal decision between consenting adults The government issues marriage licenses because both the government and society gives special privileges to people who are or have been married. Those privileges exist in everything from Social Security to hours you have to work for some companies. A marriage licenses can be worth a great deal of money to people in exactly right position. It also matters in such things in adoption. As person who has been single my whole, I have run into to a lot of situations where have a marriage license mattered. One that set me off pretty good was a conference that I and a fellow manager went to in Chicago. The company paid his wife's expenses , but would not pay for my girlfriend to go with me.

[classhandicapper]

The government issues marriage licenses because both the government and society gives special privileges to people who are or have been married. Those privileges exist in everything from Social Security to hours you have to work for some companies. A marriage licenses can be worth a great deal of money to people in exactly right position. It also matters in such things in adoption. As person who has been single my whole, I have run into to a lot of situations where have a marriage license mattered. One that set me off pretty good was a conference that I and a fellow manager went to in Chicago. The company paid his wife's expenses , but would not pay for my girlfriend to go with me.

As someone that has been unmarried and with the same woman for 30 years (way longer than most marriages) I can relate to what you are saying. Neither of us can get health care coverage for the other and WE LIVE TOGETHER too. But the federal government doesn't have to be in the marriage business. It can be a state function.

[Robert Goren]

As someone that has been unmarried and with the same woman for 30 years (way longer than most marriages) I can relate to what you are saying. Neither of us can get health care coverage for the other and WE LIVE TOGETHER too. But the federal government doesn't have to be in the marriage business. It can be a state function. The feds are not in marriage license business. The Supreme Court however is the business of making sure that states laws do violate the constitutional rights of any citizen of the country. The federal government does use state issued marriage licenses as qualifiers for certain benefits. Most of these qualifiers are close to having out lived their usefulness. The end of the stay-at-home wife/mother by the late 1980s will soon have ended any need for them. But don't expect them to disappear without a fight.

[davew]

As someone that has been unmarried and with the same woman for 30 years (way longer than most marriages) I can relate to what you are saying. Neither of us can get health care coverage for the other and WE LIVE TOGETHER too. But the federal government doesn't have to be in the marriage business. It can be a state function.


make up special term and then file a lawsuit against country

maybe you can be called transcouple and deserve all rights of marrieds

some states call you common law married if you have lived together 7 yrs

[classhandicapper]

The feds are not in marriage license business. The Supreme Court however is the business of making sure that states laws do violate the constitutional rights of any citizen of the country. The federal government does use state issued marriage licenses as qualifiers for certain benefits. Most of these qualifiers are close to having out lived their usefulness. The end of the stay-at-home wife/mother by the late 1980s will soon have ended any need for them. But don't expect them to disappear without a fight.

I'd prefer the Feds not be in the marriage business at all.

At this point I'd prefer judge Wapner too. ;)

[TJDave]

I'd prefer the Feds not be in the marriage business at all.

The Feds would not be in the business if the States had not decided to stick their nose up everyone's culo. They did, so now federal law trumps. Stupid is as stupid does.

[rastajenk]

How are the states being that kind of nosy? It seems to me that in the last 15 years or so several of the states gave their citizens the opportunity to expand the definition of marriage, and the citizens almost always said, "Thanks, but no." How is that "the States'" fault?

[hcap]

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2015/09/ben-carson-conspiracy-theory-cleon-skousen

Ben Carson's Love Affair With a "Nutjob" Conspiracy Theorist

In a July 2014 interview, Carson contended that Marxist forces had been using liberals and the mainstream media to undermine the United States. His source: Skousen. "There is a book called The Naked Communist," he said.

/NO89G2hj2AY

"It was written in 1958. Cleon Skousen lays out the whole agenda, including the importance of getting people into important positions in the mainstream media so they can help drive the agenda. Well, that's what's going on now." Four months later, while being interviewed by Megyn Kelly on Fox News, Carson denounced unnamed Marxists who were presently seeking to destroy American society:

/e_Rn1K5uLzs

[classhandicapper]

The Feds would not be in the business if the States had not decided to stick their nose up everyone's culo. They did, so now federal law trumps. Stupid is as stupid does.

The point is that people have different values and priorities. To maximize the freedom for all Americans to create the life they want for themselves and their families it is better to delegate power to the states so they can do that. On some occasions you may get laws you disagree with, but then you can at least vote with your feet and go somewhere else. Businesses and the other states can also pressure the renegade state to change if an opposing view is widely held. If the Feds impose rules, it guarantees that many people will be unhappy and have no way to escape. That's a recipe for conflict.

You are starting with the presumption that the Feds are always right and whatever they impose on all the states will be correct. IMO, that might be a dangerous assumption and is probably an incorrect interpretation of the constitution to begin with.

[PaceAdvantage]

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2015/09/ben-carson-conspiracy-theory-cleon-skousen

Ben Carson's Love Affair With a "Nutjob" Conspiracy Theorist

In a July 2014 interview, Carson contended that Marxist forces had been using liberals and the mainstream media to undermine the United States. His source: Skousen. "There is a book called The Naked Communist," he said.

/NO89G2hj2AY

"It was written in 1958. Cleon Skousen lays out the whole agenda, including the importance of getting people into important positions in the mainstream media so they can help drive the agenda. Well, that's what's going on now." Four months later, while being interviewed by Megyn Kelly on Fox News, Carson denounced unnamed Marxists who were presently seeking to destroy American society:

/e_Rn1K5uLzsBe careful who you call crazy. I bet a lot of people thought George Washington & Thomas Jefferson were crazy too...as well as a whole lot of other forward thinking individuals throughout history.

Just ask Galileo.

[Tom]

Yeah, Goofy Gally.....who could forget him!:lol:

[horses4courses]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CP_lhE6WUAARNR5.jpg

[hcap]

Be careful who you call crazy. I bet a lot of people thought George Washington & Thomas Jefferson were crazy too...as well as a whole lot of other forward thinking individuals throughout history.

Just ask Galileo. Dan Quayle ? Is that you?

To paraphrase Lloyd Bentsen** when faced with Dan Quayle's idiocy of likening
his political experience to that of John F. Kennedy..

"We all know about George Washington & Thomas Jefferson They both were friends of this country. PaceAdvantage, Ben Carson can not be compared to either."


**("I served with Jack Kennedy. I knew Jack Kennedy. Jack Kennedy was a friend of mine. Senator, you're no Jack Kennedy.") :lol: :lol: :lol:

[Tom]

You can always count on H4C to be totally off the mark whenever his feeble attempts to reply to threads comes in the form of cartoons.

His latest attempt at intelligent discussion once again missed the train

Horsey, hire someone to read the posts to you - you are batting 0% and making an ass of yourself.

Talk about your LI voters.

[classhandicapper]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CP_lhE6WUAARNR5.jpg

Any one of those Muslims would have made a better president than Obama. Heck, anyone in any cemetery in America would do better just be being dead and not doing anything.

[Tom]

Horsey and Cappy know exactly what Ben said and just choose to ignore it so they can be arses.

Be, all you can be.

Plus it is very poor taste to use a dead soldier's tombstone for cartoons and other political BS.

Horsey is a stranger to class.

[PaceAdvantage]

Dan Quayle ? Is that you?

To paraphrase Lloyd Bentsen** when faced with Dan Quayle's idiocy of likening
his political experience to that of John F. Kennedy..

"We all know about George Washington & Thomas Jefferson They both were friends of this country. PaceAdvantage, Ben Carson can not be compared to either."


**("I served with Jack Kennedy. I knew Jack Kennedy. Jack Kennedy was a friend of mine. Senator, you're no Jack Kennedy.") :lol: :lol: :lol:Way to completely miss the point. As if I was comparing Carson to the founding fathers...

[Robert Goren]

I'd prefer the Feds not be in the marriage business at all.

At this point I'd prefer judge Wapner too. ;)If the Supreme Court and the Feds did enforce equal treatment under the law, Nebraska would be in a race with several other states to outlaw interracial marriages. I kid you not. It really is that bad here. Not so much with blacks, but with Hispanics even the legal ones.

[zico20]

If the Supreme Court and the Feds did enforce equal treatment under the law, Nebraska would be in a race with several other states to outlaw interracial marriages. I kid you not. It really is that bad here. Not so much with blacks, but with Hispanics even the legal ones.

How does anyone know which Hispanics are legal and which ones are not. Even the ones that are legal usually don't speak English or don't want to speak English. Most of the legal ones still refuse to fly the American flag, preferring the one that they originally came from. It is shameful. :ThmbDown:

[woodtoo]

Home of the Cornhuskers, says a lot.

[classhandicapper]

If the Supreme Court and the Feds did enforce equal treatment under the law, Nebraska would be in a race with several other states to outlaw interracial marriages. I kid you not. It really is that bad here. Not so much with blacks, but with Hispanics even the legal ones.

There have always been ethnic groups, religions, and nationalities that prefer their children to marry within their own group. I saw that in my own family decades ago when the preference of the people from the "old country" was that their kids marry another Italian. Then my uncle married an Irish girl and it all changed. They loved her to death and realized that was the only thing that mattered. People grow out of that crap eventually. And while you are waiting, they could always go to another state and get married.

[Tom]

Not so much with blacks, but with Hispanics even the legal ones.

You mean citizens?

[horses4courses]

You know, this is without doubt the dumbest thing
ever said by a presidential candidate.
Spoken by the brilliant brain surgeon with zero common sense. :rolleyes:

http://news.yahoo.com/ben-carson-suggests-holocaust-less-likely-jews-were-220504283.html

http://l2.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/of1VNi718I5LG1HWAQSe2Q--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3NfbGVnbztmaT1maWxsO2g9NTQwO2lsPXBsYW 5lO3B5b2ZmPTA7cT03NTt3PTk2MA--/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/gma/us.abcnews.go.com/ap_ben_Carson_lb_150929_16x9_992.jpg

On CNN, Carson was asked: "But just to clarify, if there had been no gun control laws in Europe at that time, would 6 million Jews have been slaughtered?"

In response, the candidate suggested that Hitler may not have been as effective in carrying out his plot if the victims were armed.

“I think the likelihood of Hitler being able to accomplish his goals would have been greatly diminished if the people had been armed,” Carson said. “I’m telling you there is a reason these dictatorial people take guns first."

Yeah, you know, Ben....I bet they wished they'd thought of that.
All six million of them.

What a dork...... :ThmbDown:

[elysiantraveller]

You know, this is without doubt the dumbest thing
ever said by a presidential candidate.
Spoken by the brilliant brain surgeon with zero common sense. :rolleyes:

http://news.yahoo.com/ben-carson-suggests-holocaust-less-likely-jews-were-220504283.html

http://l2.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/of1VNi718I5LG1HWAQSe2Q--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3NfbGVnbztmaT1maWxsO2g9NTQwO2lsPXBsYW 5lO3B5b2ZmPTA7cT03NTt3PTk2MA--/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/gma/us.abcnews.go.com/ap_ben_Carson_lb_150929_16x9_992.jpg



Yeah, you know, Ben....I bet they wished they'd thought of that.
All six million of them.

What a dork...... :ThmbDown:

Needs to stop reading viral political facebook posts as fact... Hitler didn't disarm the populace. I'm very much in favor of the Second Amendment but even I'm doing this :faint: :faint: :faint:

[AndyC]

Needs to stop reading viral political facebook posts as fact... Hitler didn't disarm the populace. I'm very much in favor of the Second Amendment but even I'm doing this :faint: :faint: :faint:

Didn't he disarm the Jews?

[elysiantraveller]

Didn't he disarm the Jews?

No.

Jews were disarmed by abuse of a loophole in Germany's 1928 gun law that had a trustworthiness clause built in. On paper Germany's gun laws became much less strict from 1919 through 1938 when they became the most lax.

Hitler didn't really "disarm" anyone. His followers used existing laws to marginalize the Jews but he didn't really do anything legally to enable it.

[TJDave]

No.

Jews were disarmed by abuse of a loophole in Germany's 1928 gun law that had a trustworthiness clause built in. On paper Germany's gun laws became much less strict from 1919 through 1938 when they became the most lax.

Hitler didn't really "disarm" anyone. His followers used existing laws to marginalize the Jews but he didn't really do anything legally to enable it.

Let's be clear. The Nuremberg laws stripped Jews of citizenship, property, economic benefits and rights of association. The fact that a few Jews owned weapons had nothing to do with it. They were made a pariah. Then the nazis arrested and killed them.

[elysiantraveller]

Let's be clear. The Nuremberg laws stripped Jews of citizenship, property, economic benefits and rights of association. The fact that a few Jews owned weapons had nothing to do with it. They were made a pariah. Then the nazis arrested and killed them.

I don't disagree but for some 2nd Amendment rights groups to use Nazi Germany as an example of the need for an armed citizenship is wholly innaccurate. Gun laws laxed under the Reich.

[Saratoga_Mike]

I don't disagree but for some 2nd Amendment rights groups to use Nazi Germany as an example of the need for an armed citizenship is wholly innaccurate. Gun laws laxed under the Reich.

I agree - unless the subject matter is mass genocide (e.g., Rawanda), I find analogies to Nazi Germany highly inappropriate.

[elysiantraveller]

I agree - unless the subject matter is mass genocide (e.g., Rawanda), I find analogies to Nazi Germany highly inappropriate.

I can't totally agree with that because I recently, and regrettably, used one to demonstrate slippery slope, however, on this issue there was no slope.

[Saratoga_Mike]

I can't totally agree with that because I recently, and regrettably, used one to demonstrate slippery slope, however, on this issue there was no slope.

Such references diminish the Nazi atrocities, which I'm certain is/was not your intention.

[Tom]

While we can't diminish the acts of the nazis, we certainly can use their evolution of evil as a lesson for today. They did not start out with death camps and trains and mass murder....the began politically and evolved. We must recognize and react early one when we see history beginning to repeat, even on the smallest scale.

[rastajenk]

They did not start out with death camps and trains and mass murder....they began politically and evolved.Very quickly. Comparisons to the Nazis need not always be taboo.

[Tom]

Calling someone a nazis and comparing someone's actions to nazis is not the same thing.

[PaceAdvantage]

You know, this is without doubt the dumbest thing
ever said by a presidential candidate.
Spoken by the brilliant brain surgeon with zero common sense. :rolleyes:Another republican scaring the shit out of the left.

A successful, brilliant, conservative black man/brain surgeon. How do you handle that one? Oh, you call him names and call him stupid... :lol: :lol: :lol:

Let's see...the left is running a bunch of OLD WHITE GUYS and one old white woman....the right is running two young Hispanics, a black man and a white woman.

Who exactly is the party of diversity and inclusiveness this time around?

I know, how do you deal with this kind of paradigm shift?

[elysiantraveller]

PA and Tom...

The guy is wrong on his factual understanding of history. What he is saying IS NOT true. Our legislative debate on gun control has ZERO correlation with what happened to the Jews under the Reich.

This is coming from a staunch supporter of the Second Amendment.

[Tom]

Oh, I agree 100%.
The Jews in Poland had guns and more.
Lot of good it did them.

Ben might has said something stupid, but is no the same as being stupid, as is certainly the case with the democrats. :lol:

OK, en got it wrong.
But Hillary lied, repeatedly.
In fact, I am pretty sure Hillary has NEVER told the truth.

[Robert Goren]

Another republican scaring the shit out of the left.

A successful, brilliant, conservative black man/brain surgeon. How do you handle that one? Oh, you call him names and call him stupid... :lol: :lol: :lol:

Let's see...the left is running a bunch of OLD WHITE GUYS and one old white woman....the right is running two young Hispanics, a black man and a white woman.

Who exactly is the party of diversity and inclusiveness this time around?

I know, how do you deal with this kind of paradigm shift?We see how many votes this "successful, brilliant, conservative black man/brain surgeon" gets when the primaries start. I have said it before and I will say it again, there is no way the base of the GOP will allow a black man to be their nominee. I might be wrong, but until I see it actually happen, that is what I think after watching what happened to Herman Cain in 2012. The GOP had a brief love affair with him and then moved on because he was black. The same thing is/will happen to Carson. Mark my words.

[Clocker]

I have said it before and I will say it again, there is no way the base of the GOP will allow a black man to be their nominee. I might be wrong, but until I see it actually happen, that is what I think after watching what happened to Herman Cain in 2012.

Race is not the issue. Carson, like Cain, is a political neophyte with no strategy to get elected, weak policy, and not a clue as to how to run a huge public bureaucracy. All of this is obvious to those not charmed by his image, as was the case with Cain. And with a host of white empty suits.

[classhandicapper]

Race is not the issue.

Absolutely agree.

The very fact that he's as popular as he is despite a limited understanding of economics and foreign policy is screaming that when the time comes and the republicans put up a qualified black candidate he'll win.

The same can be said about the growing popularity of Rubio (Cuban) and Fiorina (woman). The republicans have a very diversified field and no one (at least from the left wing media that dominates) seems to have noticed.

[Tom]

Originally Posted by Robert Goren
I have said it before and I will say it again, there is no way the base of the GOP will allow a black man to be their nominee.

You've wrong before and you are wrong now, and Bobby, I have no doubt you will always be wrong.

Take off your racist glasses you use to view the world.
As PA pointed out yesterday, look the candidates the two parties are offering. The GOP, obviously, has nothing but pale white old people. while the Dems have a smorgasbord candidates, young, old, men, women, Black, White, Latino.......a true party of the people.



.......reality sucks, huh Bobby? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[horses4courses]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CQpfj6oUwAALzz2.png

[PaceAdvantage]

We see how many votes this "successful, brilliant, conservative black man/brain surgeon" gets when the primaries start. I have said it before and I will say it again, there is no way the base of the GOP will allow a black man to be their nominee. I might be wrong, but until I see it actually happen, that is what I think after watching what happened to Herman Cain in 2012. The GOP had a brief love affair with him and then moved on because he was black. The same thing is/will happen to Carson. Mark my words.You're officially out of your mind.

It's the LEFT that will make sure this man doesn't get a fair shake...not Republicans...

Stop with your nonsense.

[PaceAdvantage]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CQpfj6oUwAALzz2.pngYou're another racist. Don't think I didn't notice your "Is Ben on crack?" wiseass comment. As racist a comment as I've seen in the last 5 minutes.

What's with all you Democrat racists? I thought you guys elected Obama?

[horses4courses]

You're another racist. Don't think I didn't notice your "Is Ben on crack?" wiseass comment. As racist a comment as I've seen in the last 5 minutes.

What's with all you Democrat racists? I thought you guys elected Obama?

Tell me now, what would make that comment racist in any way?
Just your anti-liberal brain on overdrive again, I would suggest.

All races use crack, in case you didn't realize.
I was merely pointing out that this guy is looney tunes.

[Tom]

I was merely pointing out that this guy is looney tunes.

You are clearly the resident expert.
Got a link to that comment in context, it it exists at all, or are cartoons all you got?

[PaceAdvantage]

Tell me now, what would make that comment racist in any way?
Just your anti-liberal brain on overdrive again, I would suggest.

All races use crack, in case you didn't realize.
I was merely pointing out that this guy is looney tunes.It's racist because you immediately jump to the conclusion he might be on crack because he happens to be a black man. Don't tell me racism when I see it...

And if you haven't figured it out yet, I'm not being serious...I'm merely parroting left-leaners such as YOURSELF who would jump to the RACIST label at any hint of Obama criticism over the years from known right-wingers on here...

But you guys never learn your lesson, no matter how many times I have to teach you...

[horses4courses]

You are clearly the resident expert.
Got a link to that comment in context, it it exists at all, or are cartoons all you got?

As long as the cartoons get the predictable reactions from you,
they are more than effective.

[horses4courses]

It's racist because you immediately jump to the conclusion he might be on crack because he happens to be a black man.

I ask the same question about Rush Limbaugh.
Regularly.

[Tom]

As long as the cartoons get the predictable reactions from you,
they are more than effective.

I see your cartoon and I think doesn't this kid's parents ever make him do his homework?

[Clocker]

As long as the cartoons get the predictable reactions from you,
they are more than effective.You are trying to portray the left as a bunch of party line spouting Kool Aid drinkers? :eek:

[Tom]

Nothing scares the left more than a successful Black man who did it on his own.
Carson and others just prove that the left is flat out wrong.

[horses4courses]

Nothing scares the left more than a successful Black man who did it on his own.
Carson and others just prove that the left is flat out wrong.

His early background shows he was a welfare recipient.
How might he have turned out had his mother not gotten assistance?
I'm sure the family is greatly indebted to the GOP for all their help. :rolleyes:

No doubt, he has accomplished much since then.
He would be a very scary president, though.

[Tom]

So you hate him because he was able to escape the Democrat Plantation.
How do you explain his decision to joint the REPUBLICAN party? :lol: :lol: :lol:

[PaceAdvantage]

I ask the same question about Rush Limbaugh.
Regularly.No...for him you use Oxy...the white man's drug of choice... :lol:

[PaceAdvantage]

His early background shows he was a welfare recipient.
How might he have turned out had his mother not gotten assistance?
I'm sure the family is greatly indebted to the GOP for all their help. :rolleyes:

No doubt, he has accomplished much since then.
He would be a very scary president, though.There are always statistical outliers...when it comes to welfare success stories, this is one of them...don't make it seem like this is a regular occurrence among welfare recipients and how amazing the current system is...

[PaceAdvantage]

He would be a very scary president, though.Why? Because of his skin color? Don't see any other way someone would be scared by one of the most mild-mannered men in politics...

Maybe you're a racist after all?

[davew]

Why? Because of his skin color? Don't see any other way someone would be scared by one of the most mild-mannered men in politics...

Maybe you're a racist after all?


Any president will be 'scary' because of the pile of crap they have to start with.

[Robert Goren]

It's racist because you immediately jump to the conclusion he might be on crack because he happens to be a black man. Don't tell me racism when I see it...

And if you haven't figured it out yet, I'm not being serious...I'm merely parroting left-leaners such as YOURSELF who would jump to the RACIST label at any hint of Obama criticism over the years from known right-wingers on here...

But you guys never learn your lesson, no matter how many times I have to teach you...We tend to think that way about republicans because of things like four of the GOP presidential hopefuls, Walker, Cruz, Santorum and Paul took money from an avowed white supremacist and noted racist, Earl Holt, and nobody in the republican party even bothered to call them out. It was only after the SC church shooting where the shooter was linked to Holt's group did they give the money to charity or return it. As it turns out, a lot of republican politicians had taken money from him or his group, Council of Conservative Citizens, including Mitt Romney and Michele Bachmann and last year's Tea Party sweetheart, Iowa Sen. Joni Ernst.

[horses4courses]

Why? Because of his skin color? Don't see any other way someone would be scared by one of the most mild-mannered men in politics...

Maybe you're a racist after all?

Nothing to do with his skin color.
Just his unpredictable mind.
He's a loose trigger, as are many of the GOP candidates.

[PaceAdvantage]

We tend to think that way about republicans because of things like four of the GOP presidential hopefuls, Walker, Cruz, Santorum and Paul took money from an avowed white supremacist and noted racist, Earl Holt, and nobody in the republican party even bothered to call them out. It was only after the SC church shooting where the shooter was linked to Holt's group did they give the money to charity or return it. As it turns out, a lot of republican politicians had taken money from him or his group, Council of Conservative Citizens, including Mitt Romney and Michele Bachmann and last year's Tea Party sweetheart, Iowa Sen. Joni Ernst.If only the media would have vetted all of Obama's donors and friends as closely...he probably wouldn't have made it out of the primaries...but we all turned a blind eye, even when folks like Reverend Wright and Bill Ayers managed to worm their way into the spotlight, somehow...

So please, stop your duplicitous baloney. You ain't foolin' anybody.

[PaceAdvantage]

Nothing to do with his skin color.
Just his unpredictable mind.
He's a loose trigger, as are many of the GOP candidates.Well, if only you would have extended the same courtesy to those who were/are critical of Obama instead of immediately painting them as racists, as if there were no other reasons to disagree or dislike this man's policies and political beliefs.

Maybe you personally never wrote or implied such things on this board, but plenty of those in your corner have since 2008....

Now maybe you all can see how ridiculous this sounded to those of us being called racists simply because we didn't applaud Obama's every move.

[Tom]

Bobby, ever vet a list of HILLARY donors?

[Saratoga_Mike]

Bobby, ever vet a list of HILLARY donors?

Do you mean direct donors or indirect foreign donors who curried favor with Sec. Clinton by making huge donations to the Clinton Foundation while she was in office?

[PaceAdvantage]

Do you mean direct donors or indirect foreign donors who curried favor with Sec. Clinton by making huge donations to the Clinton Foundation while she was in office?Well, come on. This is normal and accepted in politics. Except when you have the (R) next to your name. Then they'll dig and dig until they hit bottom, then dig some more to see if anyone racist ever gave money to your campaign...

Yeah...as if all the political candidates out there, no matter the party, hardly EVER get donations from racists...

Is everyone brain dead on here? :bang:

Do some of you actually think you're posting things of substance?

[Saratoga_Mike]

Well, come on. This is normal and accepted in politics. Except when you have the (R) next to your name. Then they'll dig and dig until they hit bottom, then dig some more to see if anyone racist ever gave money to your campaign...

Yeah...as if all the political candidates out there, no matter the party, hardly EVER get donations from racists...

Is everyone brain dead on here? :bang:

Do some of you actually think you're posting things of substance?

There's absolutely a double-standard, which I appreciate. But the Clinton Foundation donations were beyond the typical K Street influence peddling, imo. Imagine a Rep helping the Russians gain control of 20% of the US uranium supply. They'd be accused of selling out the US. Then there were the related donations from human-rights abusing Kazakhstan.

[Tom]

Do you mean direct donors or indirect foreign donors who curried favor with Sec. Clinton by making huge donations to the Clinton Foundation while she was in office?

The foreign ones.

[ebcorde]

with their opposition to the civil rights bill. The numbers are different now, they're more minorities. This will be the last election the right wing will be relevant in a Presidential election. The 21st century will be governed by the left and moderates.

[Tom]

We gotta fix our school systems.

[PaceAdvantage]

with their opposition to the civil rights bill. The numbers are different now, they're more minorities. This will be the last election the right wing will be relevant in a Presidential election. The 21st century will be governed by the left and moderates.I've been hearing this forever...hasn't happened yet...after 2006 when Dems took Congress and all those governor seats, I heard how the Republicans would be dead for the next 100 years...

But low and behold, Republicans took back Congress less than a decade later...

So pardon me if I put little stock in your prognostications.

And for the record, it was DEMOCRATS who opposed the civil rights bill.

"The House of Representatives passed the bill by 289 to 126, a vote in which 79% of Republicans and 63% of Democrats voted yes. The Senate vote was 73 to 27, with 21 Democrats and only 6 Republicans voting no. President Johnson signed the new Civil Rights Act into law on July 2, 1964."

Keep spouting your baloney revisionist history.

Democrats have been and always will be in favor of racism. It supports their party and fills their coffers with donations. Eradicating racism would be VERY BAD BUSINESS for the democrats.

[ebcorde]

I've been hearing this forever...hasn't happened yet...after 2006 when Dems took Congress and all those governor seats, I heard how the Republicans would be dead for the next 100 years...

But low and behold, Republicans took back Congress less than a decade later...

So pardon me if I put little stock in your prognostications.

And for the record, it was DEMOCRATS who opposed the civil rights bill.

"The House of Representatives passed the bill by 289 to 126, a vote in which 79% of Republicans and 63% of Democrats voted yes. The Senate vote was 73 to 27, with 21 Democrats and only 6 Republicans voting no. President Johnson signed the new Civil Rights Act into law on July 2, 1964."

Keep spouting your baloney revisionist history.

Democrats have been and always will be in favor of racism. It supports their party and fills their coffers with donations. Eradicating racism would be VERY BAD BUSINESS for the democrats.

you look at the result of Gerrymandering. I look at the Popular vote.

Fox News pundits got it wrong the last 2 elections. Republican pundits are confused about Trump and Carson. Well Watch, Hillary will romp for the same reason the people choose Trump, Carson over the media's choice Bush.
The media has been trying to take the Clinton's down since 1992. and yet they keep winning.

[Saratoga_Mike]

1) I've been hearing this forever...hasn't happened yet...after 2006 when Dems took Congress and all those governor seats, I heard how the Republicans would be dead for the next 100 years...

Democrats have been and always will be in favor of racism. It supports their party and fills their coffers with donations. 2) Eradicating racism would be VERY BAD BUSINESS for the democrats.

1) The ever-growing welfare state doesn't help, though.

2) Sad but true.

[Saratoga_Mike]

you look at the result of Gerrymandering. I look at the Popular vote.

Fox News pundits got it wrong the last 2 elections. Republican pundits are confused about Trump and Carson. Well Watch, Hillary will romp for the same reason the people choose Trump, Carson over the media's choice Bush.
The media has been trying to take the Clinton's down since 1992. and yet they keep winning.

States aren't gerrymandered. Ergo, your point is irrelevant to recent GOP Senate/gov wins.

Hillary will not romp. Learn something about politics. Government dependency is on your side, but likeability is on the side of the Reps. If you think likeability doesn't matter, you really don't know much (Bill Clinton thinks it matters - see Steven Spielberg article in the NY Times from a few weeks ago, which you didn't read). Your every post reminds me of a Mark Twain saying.

[ebcorde]

I've been hearing this forever...hasn't happened yet...after 2006 when Dems took Congress and all those governor seats, I heard how the Republicans would be dead for the next 100 years...

But low and behold, Republicans took back Congress less than a decade later...

So pardon me if I put little stock in your prognostications.

And for the record, it was DEMOCRATS who opposed the civil rights bill.

"The House of Representatives passed the bill by 289 to 126, a vote in which 79% of Republicans and 63% of Democrats voted yes. The Senate vote was 73 to 27, with 21 Democrats and only 6 Republicans voting no. President Johnson signed the new Civil Rights Act into law on July 2, 1964."

Keep spouting your baloney revisionist history.

Democrats have been and always will be in favor of racism. It supports their party and fills their coffers with donations. Eradicating racism would be VERY BAD BUSINESS for the democrats.

ha ha ha yeah the South is the Party of Lincoln. ha ha ha ha ha obviously you know 0 minorities or immigrants. I work mostly with Asians, They do not like the republicans. you people are always US vs THEM whether it's gays, muslims, blacks. hispanics, women, chinese, russians, french, etc etc. never fails. and they funny thing you think no one sees it. I talk to people that just got here and they see it.

[PaceAdvantage]

ha ha ha yeah the South is the Party of Lincoln. ha ha ha ha ha obviously you know 0 minorities or immigrants. I work mostly with Asians, They do not like the republicans. you people are always US vs THEM whether it's gays, muslims, blacks. hispanics, women, chinese, russians, french, etc etc. never fails. and they funny thing you think no one sees it. I talk to people that just got here and they see it.You do nothing of the sort. Almost everything you've posted here has been nothing but tripe.

But keep going...eventually guys (or gals) like you blow up...and it's sometimes fun to watch.

[PaceAdvantage]

Let's say it again:

"The House of Representatives passed the bill by 289 to 126, a vote in which 79% of Republicans and 63% of Democrats voted yes. The Senate vote was 73 to 27, with 21 Democrats and only 6 Republicans voting no. President Johnson signed the new Civil Rights Act into law on July 2, 1964."

[Tom]

"Popular vote" in Congress???

[ebcorde]

Let's say it again:

"The House of Representatives passed the bill by 289 to 126, a vote in which 79% of Republicans and 63% of Democrats voted yes. The Senate vote was 73 to 27, with 21 Democrats and only 6 Republicans voting no. President Johnson signed the new Civil Rights Act into law on July 2, 1964."

By 2000 All those Democrats lost their seats in the South, all the Republicans in the North lost their seats. Tell the entire story.

Social Security DEMOCRATS
Medicare DEMOCRATS
Civil rights DEMOCRATS
FMLA DEMOCRATS
health care DEMOCRATS
Rebuild Europe DEMOCRATS

Iraq , Afghanistan. REPUBLICANS (lol had to throw that in)

does not matter, Democrats have won the popular vote 5 out the last 6 elections. But you can call that tripe.

[PaceAdvantage]

BTW, how long was Robert Byrd a sitting senator with the (D) next to his name? Oh, that's right...until the day he died.

I doubt you could imagine a Republican with a similar background being allowed that privilege. You know the damn media, at the very least, would have run him out of town LONG LONG ago...

You guys are nothing but a joke.

[FantasticDan]

BTW, how long was Robert Byrd a sitting senator with the (D) next to his name? Oh, that's right...until the day he died.Hey PA, this author mentions you in her article! :lol: :ThmbUp:

If there is a more fatuous right wing trope than “Martin Luther King was a Republican” it has to be the utterly nonsensical line that Democrats are the true racists because they were the southern party during Jim Crow. Inevitably, in any discussion of race, some smart-aleck troll smugly interjects the irrelevant fact that the departed Democratic Senator Robert Byrd was a member of the KKK and some very clever boy or girl shares the astonishingly obvious fact that Republican Abraham Lincoln freed the slaves. Case closed, Democrats are the racists and the Republicans are the African Americans’ true allies.

http://www.salon.com/2015/07/10/democrats_are_the_real_racists_inside_the_gops_pat hetic_insulting_response_to_charges_of_bigotry/

[ebcorde]

BTW, how long was Robert Byrd a sitting senator with the (D) next to his name? Oh, that's right...until the day he died.

I doubt you could imagine a Republican with a similar background being allowed that privilege. You know the damn media, at the very least, would have run him out of town LONG LONG ago...

You guys are nothing but a joke.

He repented so it's A-okay. good banjo player on Hee Haw. We call all our people democrats . as usual you guys and your US vs THEM hangup it's RINO's , Tea party, Trump's not a conservative, too many names to name

[Tom]

We call all our people democrats

We have another name for them.......

[ebcorde]

here. Although I am glad Horseplayers have a forum. I do not understand why there is support for the Republican Party.

1. George Bush made it illegal to bet offshore. Did conservative Britain's David Cameron shut down the Gambling stores in England? No.

2. The conservative states in the Midwest and South hate Horse racing is there racing in Tennessee, Alabama, Mississippi, North Carolina, Georgia, Kansas?
where's the racing? States like New York, California! Texas strangles racing. Big State like that filled with 5k claimers.

If the religious republicans had their way Racing would be finished in America

[PaceAdvantage]

here. Although I am glad Horseplayers have a forum. I do not understand why there is support for the Republican Party.

1. George Bush made it illegal to bet offshore. Did conservative Britain's David Cameron shut down the Gambling stores in England? No.

2. The conservative states in the Midwest and South hate Horse racing is there racing in Tennessee, Alabama, Mississippi, North Carolina, Georgia, Kansas?
where's the racing? States like New York, California! Texas strangles racing. Big State like that filled with 5k claimers.

If the religious republicans had their way Racing would be finished in AmericaHey, genius, the DEMOCRATS CONTROLLED THE WHITE HOUSE AND BOTH HOUSES OF CONGRESS FOR YEARS STARTING IN JANUARY 2009...

DID GAMBLING FLOURISH? DID THEY DO AWAY WITH ALL THOSE GEORGE BUSH RESTRICTIONS AND ALL THOSE THINGS THE NASTY EVANGELICALS AND SOUTHERN STATES TOOK AWAY FROM YOU?

No, they did not.

So don't give me this bullshit that George Bush, Republicans and Evangelicals are the reason why you can't gamble your balls off.

[ebcorde]

Hey, genius, the DEMOCRATS CONTROLLED THE WHITE HOUSE AND BOTH HOUSES OF CONGRESS FOR YEARS STARTING IN JANUARY 2009...

DID GAMBLING FLOURISH? DID THEY DO AWAY WITH ALL THOSE GEORGE BUSH RESTRICTIONS AND ALL THOSE THINGS THE NASTY EVANGELICALS AND SOUTHERN STATES TOOK AWAY FROM YOU?

No, they did not.

So don't give me this bullshit that George Bush, Republicans and Evangelicals are the reason why you can't gamble your balls off.


ha ha ha your Location is NY. Back up your talk and move to a red state that has no racing. Like get a real taste of Red State living.

you've never lived in a red state, have you? I lived in 4 of them (Iowa, Arizona, Texas, Virginia). Arizona was the only good one. But You can forget racing and a good salary. Your a freaking New Yorker , if it's so bad there leave man. Why punish yourself?

[PaceAdvantage]

ha ha ha your Location is NY. Back up your talk and move to a red state that has no racing. Like get a real taste of Red State living.You could have saved yourself a lot of typing and just wrote "You know, you're right."

[ebcorde]

You could have saved yourself a lot of typing and just wrote "You know, you're right."

Maybe, like I'm here to argue with the moderator. Look I hated Bush for the war and I could not play my college football and soccer games anymore. The Canadian sites offer no good opportunities. I have no place to bet my games since 2006. Where can I bet that's safe and does not take the easy bets off the board?

And don't expect congress to do anything, once they pass a bill, it's not overturned a few years later.

as "red" as you are even you have to admit Republicans are not Horse racing friendly, come on man "fatso" Christie trying to kill Jersey Racing. I lived in Iowa , those dudes go crazy about gambling of any kind. They killed VLT's when I lived there after 3 months. I lived in Texas, near Sam Houston race track and gulf greyhound, thank god. The only game in town, 5k claimers back then and still today (come on man admit it 5k claimers suck).

oh and Virginia , please last time i was there a cop (with a big ole gun) told me to stop using the little $2.00 TV's if I was not paying and added in a "get your foot off the table" too. Dude, I never ever saw a cop with a gun enforce a TV rule in a OTB. Talking about "a turnoff" Every OTB in Virgina has an armed Cop walking around, don't get too loud, don't turn on a TV without paying, they send the cop after you. Talking about ruining the vibes! See they expect the bettors to start shooting and robbing patrons of their $2 winning tickets. That's red state thinking. I never went to a Horse race or OTB in Virgina after that.

[PaceAdvantage]

One would think the "freedom loving Democrats who embrace everyone and everything" could have easily opened up the gambling floodgates sometime after January 2009.

Are you telling me the evangelicals have a death grip on the Democrats too? :lol:

Or was it really something else pulling the strings behind the online gambling ban? Like maybe the casino lobby? Oh now...that couldn't be? And who is one of the biggest water carriers for the Casino lobby? The top Dem at the time back in 2009...Harry Reid? Oh no, that couldn't have had ANYTHING to do with it, could it?

But keep blaming George Bush and the evangelical right-wingers for preventing you from being able to bet everything online...I get a good laugh every time one of you lefties brings this up on here...

[ebcorde]

One would think the "freedom loving Democrats who embrace everyone and everything" could have easily opened up the gambling floodgates sometime after January 2009.

Are you telling me the evangelicals have a death grip on the Democrats too? :lol:

Or was it really something else pulling the strings behind the online gambling ban? Like maybe the casino lobby? Oh now...that couldn't be? And who is one of the biggest water carriers for the Casino lobby? The top Dem at the time back in 2009...Harry Reid? Oh no, that couldn't have had ANYTHING to do with it, could it?

But keep blaming George Bush and the evangelical right-wingers for preventing you from being able to bet everything online...I get a good laugh every time one of you lefties brings this up on here...

I'm done with this conversation I won't win you over.

[PaceAdvantage]

There's nothing to win over. The facts aren't on your side.

I am talking specifically about this false notion that has been repeated here over and over again that Republicans and Evangelicals are the one responsible for our dearth of online gambling choices these days.

The fact that the Democrats were in pretty much complete control for years and nothing changed regarding this proves the point.

[Clocker]

The fact that the Democrats were in pretty much complete control for years and nothing changed regarding this proves the point.

Democrats are highly conflicted by legalized gambling, so it is hard to get a consensus on the issue. They are opposed to gambling because people don't know what is good for them, so the libs have to protect them from their own stupidity. On the other hand, they like legalize gambling because it provides more money for the libs to spend. Most libs can strongly support both views at the same time, and their vote depends on which way the wind is blowing at the moment.

[ebcorde]

Democrats are highly conflicted by legalized gambling, so it is hard to get a consensus on the issue. They are opposed to gambling because people don't know what is good for them, so the libs have to protect them from their own stupidity. On the other hand, they like legalize gambling because it provides more money for the libs to spend. Most libs can strongly support both views at the same time, and their vote depends on which way the wind is blowing at the moment.


yada yada yada. let's stay n the real world. why are there no racetracks in Virgina(Colonial closed), North Carolina, South Carolina, Mississippi, Alabama, Georgia, Tennessee, Kansas?

[ebcorde]

complaining about democrats and social security. Do what my Amish neighbors do. Opt out of social security. They don't pay it.

[Clocker]

why are there no racetracks in Virgina(Colonial closed), North Carolina, South Carolina, Mississippi, Alabama, Georgia, Tennessee, Kansas?

Bible Belt, where folks have historically liked their drinking and gambling under cover, unregulated, and untaxed.

[ebcorde]

David Brooks is fed up with today's Republican Party.

In a blistering New York Times column, Brooks accuses today's Republican Party of betraying the actual tenets of conservatism. "By traditional definitions," he writes, "conservatism stands for intellectual humility, a belief in steady, incremental change, a preference for reform rather than revolution, a respect for hierarchy, precedence, balance and order, and a tone of voice that is prudent, measured and responsible."

Over the past 30 years, or at least since Rush Limbaugh came on the scene, the Republican rhetorical tone has grown ever more bombastic, hyperbolic and imbalanced. Public figures are prisoners of their own prose styles, and Republicans from Newt Gingrich through Ben Carson have become addicted to a crisis mentality. Civilization was always on the brink of collapse. Every setback, like the passage of Obamacare, became the ruination of the republic. Comparisons to Nazi Germany became a staple.

This produced a radical mind-set.


Let me clear my throat. uhh hmmm.

[PaceAdvantage]

It probably started when every Republican or slightly right-leaning white person was branded a racist by Democrats...every Republican was branded "borderline brain-dead," John McCain, we were told, would be dead before his first term ended if he were elected, because he was TOO OLD, and all the other bullshit garbage that the left and its sycophantic media rammed down our throats ever since poor Al Gore had the election "stolen" from him back in 2000.

Or maybe it started when poor, poor Willie J. Clinton was being railroaded because of his poor choice in philandering partners.

David Brooks can suck it nonetheless.

[Clocker]

Let me clear my throat. uhh hmmm.

Maybe when you finish clearing your throat you can cite the author and source of the unattributed material you posted there. :rolleyes:

[NJ Stinks]

Democrats are highly conflicted by legalized gambling, so it is hard to get a consensus on the issue. They are opposed to gambling because people don't know what is good for them, so the libs have to protect them from their own stupidity. On the other hand, they like legalize gambling because it provides more money for the libs to spend. Most libs can strongly support both views at the same time, and their vote depends on which way the wind is blowing at the moment.

You haven't a clue. Big, bad, and Blue NJ passes every gambling referendum put before it. Even legalized sports betting received over 60% of the votes cast.

"highly conflicted" - hope you don't pay anybody to write this drivel for you. :rolleyes:

[ArlJim78]

When is David Brooks not upset with the Republican party? what else bothers him? If you polled conservatives not many would identify with his definition from a by gone era. "Respect for hierarchy"? yeah right.

[Tom]

Let me clear my throat. uhh hmmm.

Very good.
Now try your head.

[Tom]

You haven't a clue. Big, bad, and Blue NJ passes every gambling referendum put before it. Even legalized sports betting received over 60% of the votes cast.

When you live in New Jersey, that stuff just doesn't seem like a gamble.....

[Clocker]

Very good.
Now try your head.

Call Roto-Rooter. :p

[Clocker]

You haven't a clue. Big, bad, and Blue NJ passes every gambling referendum put before it. Even legalized sports betting received over 60% of the votes cast.

I was talking about politicians. You are talking about voters. Try to keep up.

[Robert Goren]

BTW, how long was Robert Byrd a sitting senator with the (D) next to his name? Oh, that's right...until the day he died.

I doubt you could imagine a Republican with a similar background being allowed that privilege. You know the damn media, at the very least, would have run him out of town LONG LONG ago...

You guys are nothing but a joke.How long did Strom Thurmond serve with that (R) behind his name?

[ebcorde]

How long did Strom Thurmond serve with that (R) behind his name?

ha ha Robert, forget about it. you have a better chance convincing ISIS to put down their weapons. Their handicapping is rigid too. :lol: I'll get my Jollies watching corporate Fixed News Nov 1 or 8th 2016. As they explain a 3rd time why their corporate polls were wrong.

[PaceAdvantage]

Good ol Strom...another Democrat (at least former).

Also he was never a member of the KKK...so he's not as distinguished as Mr. Byrd.

But nice try.

[NJ Stinks]

I was talking about politicians. You are talking about voters. Try to keep up.

Guess what. There are no referendums unless politicians allow one to be held in NJ.

[hcap]

FrqShRhxJBM

[TJDave]

FrqShRhxJBM

In all fairness, that was from seventeen years ago. His thinking has probably evolved since then. :rolleyes:

[hcap]

In all fairness, that was from seventeen years ago. His thinking has probably evolved since then. :rolleyes:You would think so......

http://www.politico.com/story/2015/11/ben-carson-violence-pyramids-215562

[FantasticDan]

In all fairness, that was from seventeen years ago. His thinking has probably evolved since then. :rolleyes::D :ThmbUp:

[Tom]

Speaking of evolution.....from bad to worse!

[horses4courses]

Speaking of evolution.....from bad to worse!

Be afraid.......be very afraid

Muuhahahaaaa........ :lol:

[Saratoga_Mike]

Lied about West Point (admits it) - bad move. He had likability and integrity going for him.

[Tom]

Didn't lie about a video.
He is STILL far better than anything the dems have this year or any of the last 20 years.

[Saratoga_Mike]

Didn't lie about a video.
He is STILL far better than anything the dems have this year or any of the last 20 years.

Hillary Clinton should not be the standard we set for ourselves.

[classhandicapper]

It's been time to move past Carson for quite awhile, but not because he lied or embellished in his story about West Point. I mean come on. It's hard to find something that Hillary has told the truth about on things that actually matter and the left looks the other way. How can you care that much about this.

Carson is simply not qualified on either economic/business or foreign policy. He might be a good guy to be involved in health care reform. He's not a president or vice president.

[Tom]

Carson is far more qualified that Hillary or the old commie.

You what the standard for economics is?
Don't add 15 trillion to the debt.

Anything else is a step up from the current jerk.

[Tom]

http://www.politico.com/story/2015/11/ben-carson-west-point-215598

The full story, as usual, has been doctored.
He did not lie.

"What difference – at this point, what difference does it make?"

[Saratoga_Mike]

http://www.politico.com/story/2015/11/ben-carson-west-point-215598

The full story, as usual, has been doctored.
He did not lie.

"What difference – at this point, what difference does it make?"

His own camp is saying his previous version of the story was incorrect (I do appreciate the detail in the Politico story) - just bizarre to me.

[AndyC]

His own camp is saying his previous version of the story was incorrect (I do appreciate the detail in the Politico story) - just bizarre to me.

Detail is meaningless when it is false. Carson never stated that he had either tried for an appointment or went to West Point. He said that Gen Westmoreland told him that him that he would be able to go if he was interested.

[classhandicapper]

Carson is far more qualified that Hillary or the old commie.

You what the standard for economics is?
Don't add 15 trillion to the debt.

Anything else is a step up from the current jerk.

The current president is less qualified than a bazaar wheel that gets spun every day to make decisions and Clinton is excrement. I still don't want Carson even though I like him. I want someone else to break out from the field. My favorite at this point is Cruz, but I see redeeming qualities in a few others and want to see more.

[redshift1]

Maybe when you finish clearing your throat you can cite the author and source of the unattributed material you posted there. :rolleyes:

Brooks:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/13/opinion/the-republicans-incompetence-caucus.html

Carson has yet to square up the ball at Politifact:

http://www.politifact.com/personalities/ben-carson/statements/

.

[reckless]

David Brooks is fed up with today's Republican Party.

In a blistering New York Times column, Brooks accuses today's Republican Party of betraying the actual tenets of conservatism. "By traditional definitions," he writes, "conservatism stands for intellectual humility, a belief in steady, incremental change, a preference for reform rather than revolution, a respect for hierarchy, precedence, balance and order, and a tone of voice that is prudent, measured and responsible."

Over the past 30 years, or at least since Rush Limbaugh came on the scene, the Republican rhetorical tone has grown ever more bombastic, hyperbolic and imbalanced. Public figures are prisoners of their own prose styles, and Republicans from Newt Gingrich through Ben Carson have become addicted to a crisis mentality. Civilization was always on the brink of collapse. Every setback, like the passage of Obamacare, became the ruination of the republic. Comparisons to Nazi Germany became a staple.

This is the very same David Brooks that thought Obama would be a great president because Brooks liked the crease in his pants.

More Obama-fawning thoughts from Brooks, the resident 'conservative Republican' for the New York Times.

“I don’t want to sound like I’m bragging,” Brooks recently told me, “but usually when I talk to senators, while they may know a policy area better than me, they generally don’t know political philosophy better than me. I got the sense he knew both better than me.”

That first encounter is still vivid in Brooks’s mind. “I remember distinctly an image of -– we were sitting on his couches, and I was looking at his pant leg and his perfectly creased pant,” Brooks says, “and I’m thinking, a) he’s going to be president and b) he’ll be a very good president.” In the fall of 2006, two days after Obama’s The Audacity of Hope hit bookstores, Brooks published a glowing Times column. The headline was “Run, Barack, Run.”…

“Obama sees himself as a Burkean,” Brooks says. “He sees his view of the world as a view that understands complexity and the organic nature of change.” Moreover, after the Bush years, Brooks seems relieved to have an intellectual in the White House again. “I divide people into people who talk like us and who don’t talk like us,” he explains. “Of recent presidents, Clinton could sort of talk like us, but Obama is definitely–you could see him as a New Republic writer. He can do the jurisprudence, he can do the political philosophy, and he can do the politics. I think he’s more talented than anyone in my lifetime. I mean, he is pretty dazzling when he walks into a room. So, that’s why it’s important he doesn’t f--- this up.”

Now, there's something to clear your throat on, ebcorde.

http://hotair.com/archives/2009/08/31/the-obligatory-david-brooks-really-impressed-with-obamas-pants-post/

[reckless]

His own camp is saying his previous version of the story was incorrect (I do appreciate the detail in the Politico story) - just bizarre to me.

I'd appreciate it if racist rags such as Politico went after presidential coke heads such as Barack Obama or blatant serial rapists such as Bill Clinton with the same 'journalistic fervor' as they did against Dr. Ben Carson and Herman Cain.

Getting it correct is what's really important, right down to the detail.

http://www.breitbart.com/big-journalism/2015/11/06/politico-edits-ben-carson-hit-piece-drops-claims-of-fabrication/

[Robert Goren]

Good ol Strom...another Democrat (at least former).

Also he was never a member of the KKK...so he's not as distinguished as Mr. Byrd.

But nice try. it has been reported in numerous places that he was a member of the KKK in the 1930s although he denied it in later life. In 1948, He ran as third party candidate whose whole candidacy and stated goal was to promote and continue racism. He left the democratic party in 1964 before many Dixiecrats did because as he stated, the republican party under Barry Goldwater was a better place for segregationist like himself than the democratic party of LBJ and Hubert Humphrey. He was merely the first of many. By 1980, all but a few of the hard core segregationists had made the party switch. You could count on one hand the ones like Byrd and George Wallace who stayed with the democrats.

[ebcorde]

to believe he's stabbing(so hard the knife breaks :lol: ) , hammering people, swinging baseball bats at people's heads and no one says a thing. BULLSHEET!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

surely people would have said "stay away from THAT guy, he's a maniac"

[ebcorde]

it has been reported in numerous places that he was a member of the KKK in the 1930s although he denied it in later life. In 1948, He ran as third party candidate whose whole candidacy and stated goal was to promote and continue racism. He left the democratic party in 1964 before many Dixiecrats did because as he stated, the republican party under Barry Goldwater was a better place for segregationist like himself than the democratic party of LBJ and Hubert Humphrey. He was merely the first of many. By 1980, all but a few of the hard core segregationists had made the party switch. You could count on one hand the ones like Byrd and George Wallace who stayed with the democrats.


and the point is Ben Carson is a POS too?

[Marshall Bennett]

Carson's appearing more and more unintelligent every passing day. His choice of what details he volunteers about his past life is bizarre. I'd say this about a candidate of any party, has nothing to do with being racist or conservative.
He's a strange character and I don't like him. :cool:

[TJDave]

His choice of what details he volunteers about his past life is bizarre.

Evangelicals eat that stuff up. So he's on track to solidify 20-25% of republican votes. Those numbers couldn't get him elected dog catcher.

If the party runs off the rails with an anti-establishment candidate it will be Clinton 45. Think about it.

[classhandicapper]

IMHO, far and away the most important issue facing this country is the debt load, the promises that have been made related to Social Security, Medicare, pensions, etc... and the fact that the Fed and other central banks have veered off into uncharted monetary territory with all this quantitative easing.

People are not quite grasping that in addition to the 19 trillion we are already and in debt, there's another 200 trillion of debt coming due from all those UNFUNDED liabilities. All the money printing has done is prop up the debt and push the problems further out.

We DESPERATELY need a president that understands business, finance, monetary policy, and that has the leadership skills to get government spending and these promises under control.

We need competency or all is lost for our grandchildren and we are going to face some serious shit storms in our lifetimes.

That all but eliminates every democrat in America. Every single one of them is understandably focused on all the problems of the poor they would like to fix. But their solution is even more spending and promises. People like that should have restraining orders against them, not be put in power. They don't just have a different opinion. They are either suicidal or have no understanding whatsoever of our economic position and how the system works long term.

Carson is not the right guy.

No matter what you think of him as a person, his religious views, his intelligence, his integrity etc... it's all meaningless when we have problems like this.

We need an alternative to nitwits like Obama, Clinton, Sanders etc.. in government. They want to expand the spending and promises at a rate faster than economic growth. It's practically a matter of self defense to keep assholes like that out of power at this point in time. But we need the right one.

[Marshall Bennett]

Trump imo, is the republicans only hope. That's kinda sad because there are better candidates that simply don't have a chance. The two that do, Carson and Rubio, are no way electable candidates. Carson won't be around because he won't shut up and quit self-destructing.
What's really sad is what the democrats have to offer as their best. It's truly pathetic that Sanders and Clinton are even candidates. I wanted so badly for Biden to run. Yes he's a democrat, but still miles ahead of the alternative.
It's sad that the election process has been reduced to this. That the people, not losers, have no better choices with time running short.
We've lost a lot of respect in the world over the past 7 years with Obama, can you just imagine how much worse it can be with Hilary or Bernie as president?
Scary shit.

[fast4522]

IMHO, far and away the most important issue facing this country is the debt load, the promises that have been made related to Social Security, Medicare, pensions, etc... and the fact that the Fed and other central banks have veered off into uncharted monetary territory with all this quantitative easing.

People are not quite grasping that in addition to the 19 trillion we are already and in debt, there's another 200 trillion of debt coming due from all those UNFUNDED liabilities. All the money printing has done is prop up the debt and push the problems further out.

We DESPERATELY need a president that understands business, finance, monetary policy, and that has the leadership skills to get government spending and these promises under control.

We need competency or all is lost for our grandchildren and we are going to face some serious shit storms in our lifetimes.

That all but eliminates every democrat in America. Every single one of them is understandably focused on all the problems of the poor they would like to fix. But their solution is even more spending and promises. People like that should have restraining orders against them, not be put in power. They don't just have a different opinion. They are either suicidal or have no understanding whatsoever of our economic position and how the system works long term.

Carson is not the right guy.

No matter what you think of him as a person, his religious views, his intelligence, his integrity etc... it's all meaningless when we have problems like this.

We need an alternative to nitwits like Obama, Clinton, Sanders etc.. in government. They want to expand the spending and promises at a rate faster than economic growth. It's practically a matter of self defense to keep assholes like that out of power at this point in time. But we need the right one.

I have to agree with 100% of this post, how rare it is with someone from New York.

[Tom]

Trump is going on SNL tonight.

That disqualifies him.
No one with any integrity would go on SNL.

Speaking of that, did anyone see those commercial the Latinos are playing with the little kids using foul language and flipping the bird about Trump?

Is THIS the quality of people we want to give amnesty to?
I say,find the mother of those kids and take them away from her and then deport her. She is nothing but trash and unfair to raise kids.

[Marshall Bennett]

Trump is going on SNL tonight.

That disqualifies him.
No one with any integrity would go on SNL.

He's a presidential candidate that happens to be in the entertainment business as well. At least he's near his neighborhood.
Many in the past have gone on late night talk shows at one time or another.
What about Jimmy Carter's interview in Playboy magazine?
:)

[Tom]

OK, let me rephrase that.

No one with any talent would go on SNL. :rolleyes:

It is another record-breaking season for SNL, though.
Every season is the WORST one ever.

[Tom]

I'll bet H4C got all excited tonight jut after midnight, when Trump said, "Ladies and Gentlemen......SIA!" :lol:

[therussmeister]

OK, let me rephrase that.

No one with any talent would go on SNL. :rolleyes:

It is another record-breaking season for SNL, though.
Every season is the WORST one ever.
How would one know this except by watching it? And if it is so bad, why are you watching?

[ebcorde]

campaign is about the media. He simply wants to sell books. He has no platform, no plans, no economic policy, He does not belong on the stage.

Now we know why he wanted to change the rules of the debate, his book is being vetted.

[Tom]

How would one know this except by watching it? And if it is so bad, why are you watching?

I hardly ever tune in, and then only for a few minutes. I t is always so bad I leave it quickly.

I only lasted 30 minutes last night, and those where back and forth to the football game. I wanted to see if the pigs in the street would get into the studio.

[woodtoo]

campaign is about the media. He simply wants to sell books. He has no platform, no plans, no economic policy, He does not belong on the stage.

Now we know why he wanted to change the rules of the debate, his book is being vetted.
The media is after him big time over the scholarship to West Point, big deal
he chose Yale.
But he's self imploding with his statement that he stabbed a kid but the belt buckle saved his life and then goes on to say he chased his own mother around with a hammer.

If that's not enough he states he's for the TTP trade deal and for Puerto Rican statehood. WTF.

[ebcorde]

The media is after him big time over the scholarship to West Point, big deal
he chose Yale.
But he's self imploding with his statement that he stabbed a kid but the belt buckle saved his life and then goes on to say he chased his own mother around with a hammer.

If that's not enough he states he's for the TTP trade deal and for Puerto Rican statehood. WTF.

Imagine it, this guy expects to have the power of 50,000 nukes in his hands and we dare not check him out.

[Marshall Bennett]

I wouldn't want him managing a fireworks stand. :cool:

[Tom]

Imagine it, this guy expects to have the power of 50,000 nukes in his hands and we dare not check him out.

Yeah, what he did decades ago really matters.
Try checking out Hillary, a pathological liar.

[woodtoo]

Imagine it, this guy expects to have the power of 50,000 nukes in his hands and we dare not check him out.
Check him out, of course check him out. But vilifying him about a full scholarship from 25 plus years ago? When they dare not ask Obama for a transcript of his college records or who his mentors were ...
God damn America.

[Saratoga_Mike]

I hardly ever tune in, and then only for a few minutes. I t is always so bad I leave it quickly.



Amazing that anyone would argue this point. The show is unwatchable/horrible/"un"funny.

[Tom]

Thank God Ring of Honor Wrestling is on at midnight so I have a choice now!

[ebcorde]

Check him out, of course check him out. But vilifying him about a full scholarship from 25 plus years ago? When they dare not ask Obama for a transcript of his college records or who his mentors were ...
God damn America.



do you actually listen to the guy? see below.

Untie the military's hands; let them destroy ISIS
On Islamic State, Carson says the U.S. should step up its efforts to destroy the Islamic State militant group, and not "tie" the military's hands.
In February, Carson said America must step up its leadership in the effort to combat Islamic State. At CPAC, Carson said he would order the military to destroy the group and would not "tie (the military's) hands."
Untie the military's hands; let them destroy ISIS



Let Dr. Ben go over there and conduct a clinic how to kill ISIS when they have 1,000 women and children hostages I find him despicable.

[woodtoo]

do you actually listen to the guy? see below.

Untie the military's hands; let them destroy ISIS
On Islamic State, Carson says the U.S. should step up its efforts to destroy the Islamic State militant group, and not "tie" the military's hands.
In February, Carson said America must step up its leadership in the effort to combat Islamic State. At CPAC, Carson said he would order the military to destroy the group and would not "tie (the military's) hands."
Untie the military's hands; let them destroy ISIS



Let Dr. Ben go over there and conduct a clinic how to kill ISIS when they have 1,000 women and children hostages I find him despicable.
Is it his grammar and use of "tie,untie" you despise? Or the fact he says
he wants to destroy ISIS, he was a surgeon not a General.

[PaceAdvantage]

Imagine it, this guy expects to have the power of 50,000 nukes in his hands and we dare not check him out.We never checked out Obama...so yeah...par for the course.

As Carson rightly says, Obama's records are still sealed...imagine that?

But the media wanted to pour over a TABLE FULL of John McCain's MEDICAL RECORDS...

What a laugh riot you and your left-leaning friends are...you'll continue to tell us there is no double standard....screw you.

[FantasticDan]

What a laugh riot you and your left-leaning friends are...you'll continue to tell us there is no double standard....screw you.And what a hypocrite and troll you are, always bitching about the tone and "quality" of the discussions here in OT, yet not holding yourself to even a token effort at a higher standard.

You reap what you sow. :ThmbDown:

[horses4courses]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CTTszmlUYAARGDl.jpg:medium

[Marshall Bennett]

yet not holding yourself to even a token effort at a higher standard.
Explain this. And just what is the standard.
A higher moral standard set by liberals? This I gotta hear about. :bang:

[hcap]

We Remixed Ben Carson’s Campaign Rap


http://www.slate.com/articles/video/video/2015/11/ben_carson_s_terrible_rap_radio_song_remixed_with_ music_video.html

....Tomorrow, his campaign plans to begin airing a new radio spot rap anthem targeted at “younger black voters,” who reportedly like the hip hop. The song features choice Carson soundbites, including inspirational messages (“I’m very hopeful that I’m not the only one willing to pick up the baton of freedom”) and dog whistles about “personal responsibility” and “hard work.”

It seems as if Carson forgot to add some of Slate’s favorite soundbites, so we went ahead and fixed it for him. Here ya go, Ben! We even made a little music video for yo

[PaceAdvantage]

You guys are so obviously racist...you don't like Dr. Carson simply because his skin is dark.

[Marshall Bennett]

You guys are so obviously racist...you don't like Dr. Carson simply because his skin is dark.
Is it racist to say he mumbles when he speaks? Is it racist to say Obama is a horrible leader?
Color means nothing at a certain social level, whether it's politics, medicine, or wherever their intelligence takes them. When you look to the lower level and see masses of mostly blacks burning businesses, looting, and killing cops in what is suppose to be a protest of sorts, yeah I am racist towards these scumbags.
Dr. Carson is a poor candidate in my opinion. His color has no bearing on that, no more so than Jeb Bush being white who I find an equally poor candidate.

[Tom]

Carson is a huge problem for the left.
He is the slave who ran away and has given hope to the rest.
Back in the day, plantation owners could now afford to have a slave escape.
they would pay good sums to get them back, and even mutilate them so that they could not do so again.

Carson proves the dem rhetoric about Blacks is not correct. He is a success because of his own actions, not because of affirmative action of hand outs. He got where he is today without needing the democrat nonsense. He send a bad message.

First, we had, "You, uh, you, uh, umm, didn't build that!"
Now,on CNN the other night we had yet another so-called Black leader with a degree from Clown College telling us all that the self made man is a myth.
No one succeeds on his own. :lol:

Carson is a dangerous man - he is honest and successful.
And this time, he has not needed anyone to tell us that he is clean! :lol:

Go Ben!

[ebcorde]

Carson is a huge problem for the left.
He is the slave who ran away and has given hope to the rest.
Back in the day, plantation owners could now afford to have a slave escape.
they would pay good sums to get them back, and even mutilate them so that they could not do so again.

Carson proves the dem rhetoric about Blacks is not correct. He is a success because of his own actions, not because of affirmative action of hand outs. He got where he is today without needing the democrat nonsense. He send a bad message.

First, we had, "You, uh, you, uh, umm, didn't build that!"
Now,on CNN the other night we had yet another so-called Black leader with a degree from Clown College telling us all that the self made man is a myth.
No one succeeds on his own. :lol:

Carson is a dangerous man - he is honest and successful.
And this time, he has not needed anyone to tell us that he is clean! :lol:

Go Ben!

:lol: uh better get your last pony bets in before Carson wins. if that lunatic Carson gets in office world war III begins because of airspace over Syria!!!!!! :lol: Yeah I believe him, he did stab a guy.

[Tom]

There a few more who he could stab and get a pass from me.
Maybe even a medal.

[ebcorde]

There a few more who he could stab and get a pass from me.
Maybe even a medal.

huh? nice. that's real nice

[PaceAdvantage]

huh? nice. that's real niceNot any less nice than some of the garbage you post.

[Marshall Bennett]

I see why more and more are claiming to be independents these days.
Love everyone on the right, hate everyone on the left. Liberals do the same. Character and qualifications out the window. Straight ticket. Never look both ways. It's really stupid if you think about it.