Beverly D, Appeal Likely

[Grits]

By the connections of Secret Gesture.

http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/93780/spencer-beckett-say-beverly-d-appeal-likely

"There is obviously now going to be an appeal," Spencer said. "It doesn't really affect Ralph Beckett or me but it does affect Newells Park Stud and obviously Qatar Racing who jointly own the filly. If she is a group I winner it helps with their prodigy and they have invested a lot of money in the filly so it is a real shame for them. A group I victory would make her paddock value a whole lot higher." Also, the Beverly D. is a Breeders' Cup Challenge "Win and You're In" race to the Filly and Mare Turf (gr. IT).

[Tom]

Is it against the rules to allow a rank amateur rider on your horse in a big race?

The jock was pathetic.

[nijinski]

Is it against the rules to allow a rank amateur rider on your horse in a big race?

The jock was pathetic.
Jock did switch the whip to his right hand , this could be a factor especially since his horse was the best . still hard to win that kind of appeal . The Firestone"s launched a furious one decades back in the Preakness when Cordero mugged Genuine Risk and no such luck.

[NJ Stinks]

Chad Brown gets first and second money for what? :mad:

It was a garbage call. The best horse won the won the race.

[green80]

Is it against the rules to allow a rank amateur rider on your horse in a big race?

The jock was pathetic.

If he/she is a licensed jock, they can ride any horse in any race in the jurisdiction that they are licensed. Is it wise? no, is it legal? yes

Someone, the owner or trainer must have wanted the jock to ride.

[Scanman]

Best horse, worst rider.

Spencer should have switched his stick about 10 strides sooner. His inability to keep his horse straight cost Ortiz's horse a place. The DQ is spot on.

I'm glad to see the UK jocks held to account. They do this stuff back home and get away with it all day long. Maybe the stewards there will finally get the message and get on board with the rest of the racing world and start penalizing this type of riding.

[sammy the sage]

Best horse, worst rider.

Spencer should have switched his stick about 10 strides sooner. His inability to keep his horse straight cost Ortiz's horse a place. The DQ is spot on.

I'm glad to see the UK jocks held to account. They do this stuff back home and get away with it all day long. Maybe the stewards there will finally get the message and get on board with the rest of the racing world and start penalizing this type of riding.

sorry...tit for tat don't work...or we wouldn't have THE drugs we do...at least w/horses...

[thespaah]

By the connections of Secret Gesture.

http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/93780/spencer-beckett-say-beverly-d-appeal-likely
I am not seeing a problem with the DQ....Clearly the :3: was caused to lose a placing....
IMO the appeal with result in bupkis....

[thespaah]

Chad Brown gets first and second money for what? :mad:

It was a garbage call. The best horse won the won the race.
Aw come on.....Do you not believe....Check that.....Ok, the best horse finished first, but did indeed impede a competing horse. In my book, that's interference and therefore a justified DQ...
The Stewards make precisely the correct call.

[Scanman]

sorry...tit for tat don't work...or we wouldn't have THE drugs we do...at least w/horses...Couldn't agree more concerning the drugs, but let's try to stay on point.

In every racing jurisdiction around the world, except the UK and Ireland, it's an easy DQ.

[NJ Stinks]

Best horse, worst rider.

Spencer should have switched his stick about 10 strides sooner. His inability to keep his horse straight cost Ortiz's horse a place. The DQ is spot on.

I'm glad to see the UK jocks held to account. They do this stuff back home and get away with it all day long. Maybe the stewards there will finally get the message and get on board with the rest of the racing world and start penalizing this type of riding.

I've played plenty of races in the UK. And it's true that they don't take horses down most of the time. And I've felt like I was screwed by the almost anything goes attitude over there too. But I'll take the UK's stewards any day over stewards who hand Brown first and second money in the Beverly D because of Irad's theatrics.

Especially when one considers the fact that Irad's theatrics cost him second.


And, for the record, I bet on Euro Charline in the Beverly D Saturday.

[Scanman]

I've played plenty of races in the UK. And it's true that they don't take horses down most of the time. And I've felt like I was screwed by the almost anything goes attitude over there too. But I'll take the UK's stewards any day over stewards who hand Brown first and second money in the Beverly D because of Irad's theatrics.

Especially when one considers the fact that Irad's theatrics cost him second.


And, for the record, I bet on Euro Charline in the Beverly D Saturday.Me too. Most of my play is on UK/Ireland and Australian races. I respect that you're not talking out of your pocket.

The issue isn't the quality of the stewards (all things being equal), it's the rules/guidelines that they are required to enforce.

While we might disagree with Ortiz's ride, he knew what would "play" here and Spencer thought he was still back home. When you consider how much he's ridden here, you would think that Spencer would know better.

[SuperPickle]

I don't get the Irad hate. I'm convinced she comes down if he doesn't check. And I'm convinced any check costs her second.

I'm struggling with finding a scenario bettors cash tickets on her.

[cj]

I don't get the Irad hate. I'm convinced she comes down if he doesn't check. And I'm convinced any check costs her second.

I'm struggling with finding a scenario bettors cash tickets on her.

She lost second by half a head or so...he completely shut the horse down and didn't try. I think he thought he had second wrapped up and overacted for the DQ, but it bit him in the butt. You are right, maybe the horse comes down anyway if he rides to the wire. His ride cost his horse a chance at the win.

[RXB]

If Irad hadn't shut down Stephanie's Kitten, he'd have been in serious danger of clipping heels.

[NJ Stinks]

From the Guardian newspaper website tonight:

Jamie Spencer says he lost Chicago prize as rival jockey ‘took a dive’
• Irishman accuses Irad Ortiz Jr over disqualification at Arlington Park
• Spencer says Secret Gesture demoted due to Ortiz’s ‘ridiculous’ actions

by Chris Cook
Monday 17 August 2015 20.09 BST


Jamie Spencer has broken his silence over the controversial disqualification of his winner in Chicago on Saturday night and poured scorn on the other jockey involved in the incident. Spencer, whose mount Secret Gesture was relieved by the stewards of her victory in the Beverly D Stakes after causing late interference, accused Irad Ortiz Jr of exaggerating the extent of that interference in the way he reacted on board Stephanie’s Kitten.

“What Ortiz did was to take a dive, as much as anything else,” Spencer said through his blog on the Coral website on Monday. “The amount of ground he got his horse to lose in two strides going to [the] line was like a 45-year-old struggling jumps jockey going to an open ditch. It’s just ridiculous.”

Spencer is not the first to accuse Ortiz of overplaying his reaction in this incident but it is most unusual for one jockey to criticise another so publicly, as the Irishman acknowledged. While the two men have the width of the Atlantic between them most of the time, they will have to share a weighing room on Friday when Ortiz is expected to ride the American-trained Acapulco in the Nunthorpe Stakes at York. Spencer does not yet have a booked ride in that race but has others on the same card.

Connections of Secret Gesture say they will pursue an appeal against the decision to demote her to third place. There have been suggestions that she may have kept the race, had Ortiz’s mount finished second, but Stephanie’s Kitten dropped to third place as Ortiz reacted to Secret Gesture crossing in front of them. The race was awarded to the fast-finishing runner-up, Watsdachances, a stablemate of Stephanie’s Kitten with the trainer Chad Brown.

Spencer added that he had watched the video of the race “hundreds of times” and felt sure that Stephanie’s Kitten was “more than a length behind me” as Secret Gesture crossed her. But he insists he has now “moved on” from the incident and has directed his thoughts towards this week’s Ebor meeting at York, where he will ride The Grey Gatsby in Wednesday’s highly anticipated Juddmonte International.

link: http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2015/aug/17/jamie-spencer-irad-ortiz-jr-arlington-park-secret-gesture

[NTamm1215]

Isn't this all just a ploy for people involved in European racing to look down their nose at us even more?

This was one of the easiest DQs in years. Probably since The Apache was taken down in the Million and arguably easier.

[rastajenk]

If Irad hadn't shut down Stephanie's Kitten, he'd have been in serious danger of clipping heels.
Why couldn't he have maintained his momentum by drifting out as well, especially that close to the end? It's not like he couldn't see it happening in front of him for a hundred yards.

I think the concept of the leader being entitled to any part of the track should trump dogged stubbornness by a faster moving closer. I'd have left her up.

[ronsmac]

Isn't this all just a ploy for people involved in European racing to look down their nose at us even more?

This was one of the easiest DQs in years. Probably since The Apache was taken down in the Million and arguably easier.Easiest in years? That's funny. I've seen a lot of DQs that were easier than that.

[BIG49010]

She lost second by half a head or so...he completely shut the horse down and didn't try. I think he thought he had second wrapped up and overacted for the DQ, but it bit him in the butt. You are right, maybe the horse comes down anyway if he rides to the wire. His ride cost his horse a chance at the win.

I agree 1000 %, if he didn't do what he did, he gets drifted out, and there is no change by the stewards! Stephenie's Kitten couldn't have caught the winner if they went around for a 2nd time.

I agree they got screwed, but they shouldn't waste time with an appeal in Illinois. Several years ago, Catalano had a horse taken wide and they did a double DQ that was a complete screw up by the stewards and they didn't do anything on appeal.

http://www.equibase.com/premium/chartEmb.cfm?track=AP&raceDate=09/13/2008&cy=USA&rn=10

The word to the wise, just stay away from Illinois and Churchill Downs Inc.

[Valuist]

I finally got to see the replay for the first time. Interesting that on Twinspires.com, one cannot see the head on. The arlingtonpark.com site has a link to the race & inquiry on You Tube.

In over 30 years of watching horse racing, I've never seen a rider get as many live stakes mounts as Jamie Spencer despite being so incompetent. Is it just incompetence, or recklessness?

Secret Gesture came out a good 5 lanes (maybe more) and Spencer kept flailing away left handed until about the final 20 yards when he tried to switch to RH whipping. I didn't have a bet on the race but I'm glad they took him down. Was it the wrong call? Probably not. Did Ortiz dramatize it? Maybe. Maybe not. It wasn't like Spencer's horse only drifted out one path.

But then for Spencer to come out and blast Ortiz after the fact. What a complete moron. He's clueless about riding on American courses.

[ronsmac]

I finally got to see the replay for the first time. Interesting that on Twinspires.com, one cannot see the head on. The arlingtonpark.com site has a link to the race & inquiry on You Tube.

In over 30 years of watching horse racing, I've never seen a rider get as many live stakes mounts as Jamie Spencer despite being so incompetent. Is it just incompetence, or recklessness?

Secret Gesture came out a good 5 lanes (maybe more) and Spencer kept flailing away left handed until about the final 20 yards when he tried to switch to RH whipping. I didn't have a bet on the race but I'm glad they took him down. Was it the wrong call? Probably not. Did Ortiz dramatize it? Maybe. Maybe not. It wasn't like Spencer's horse only drifted out one path.

But then for Spencer to come out and blast Ortiz after the fact. What a complete moron. He's clueless about riding on American courses.I didn't bet the race, but I would've left him up. I'd be ok with a huge fine and suspension but I hate to see bettors punished. People who bet the 2nd horse couldn't complain, it wasn't winning under any circumstance. I guess if you bet the horse who checked up to place, maybe you have a beef, but how many people did that.

[Valuist]

I didn't bet the race, but I would've left him up. I'd be ok with a huge fine and suspension but I hate to see bettors punished. People who bet the 2nd horse couldn't complain, it wasn't winning under any circumstance. I guess if you bet the horse who checked up to place, maybe you have a beef, but how many people did that.

Apparently the stewards let him do what he wants in Ireland and the UK. He's gonna get somebody hurt. Just seen too many instances of his complete disdain for other horses and riders. His problems here date all the way back to 2004 with Powerscourt.

I understand your point, and if there was no DQs (for betting purposes), I'd have no problem. But we do still have them, so I have no problem with his DQ.

[foregoforever]

Apparently the stewards let him do what he wants in Ireland and the UK. He's gonna get somebody hurt. Just seen too many instances of his complete disdain for other horses and riders. His problems here date all the way back to 2004 with Powerscourt.

Amen to that. Always thought Kitten's Joy would have caught Better Talk Now in the BC Turf had it not been for Spencer weaving down the lane.

[Stillriledup]

The interference wasn't the reason for the guy losing a placing, amazingly bad DQ.

[Stillriledup]

Best horse, worst rider.

Spencer should have switched his stick about 10 strides sooner. His inability to keep his horse straight cost Ortiz's horse a place. The DQ is spot on.

I'm glad to see the UK jocks held to account. They do this stuff back home and get away with it all day long. Maybe the stewards there will finally get the message and get on board with the rest of the racing world and start penalizing this type of riding.

What does the jocks country of origin have to do with it?

Also, Ortiz cost Ortiz a placing, not spencer.

[EMD4ME]

The interference wasn't the reason for the guy losing a placing, amazingly bad DQ.

Chicago stewards were fooled as they don't know the cons of IHERD ORTIZ. YES, the 10 did come out but he is a sharp little pinhead, that IHERD. He knew who was gaining with him (to his inside) he thought quick and took a dive. If it was me, I would have left up the 10, fined IHERD for not persevering, banned him, so he never comes back to ILL and set up a booby trap for him to fall into on the way out of my office.

Sometimes in life, justice is served by breaking the rules (if it was any other jockey, I would never fine him, ban him, set up a booby trap etc.)and I would have been happy to serve it to him if I was the steward.

I didn't watch this race as I don't care about Stakes at tracks like Arl (no offense) but when I saw the thread and looked up the race it LOOKED LIKE 4,989 races that I have seen on the NYRA circuit.

Only difference is this time IHERD was the one BEING herded slightly. HOW IRONIC.... :bang:

I can't prove it but my gut says he had a hand in getting Ramon hurt on that cold day in January 2013. Karma will bite this kid real hard one day.

Real hard.

He is one of the DIRTIEST JOCKS that I have ever seen in 35 years of watching races. DIRTIEST.

[Valuist]

The interference wasn't the reason for the guy losing a placing, amazingly bad DQ.

Amazing bad DQ? Are you kidding me? If Spencer had tried to switch sticks at the 1/16th pole, maybe the stewards cut him some slack. But no, he didn't (or couldn't) until about 20 yards out. But no, he kept flailing away left handed as the filly drifted further and further out.

[thespaah]

The interference wasn't the reason for the guy losing a placing, amazingly bad DQ.
Really? Ok please elaborate..
I watched the video. All angles. I even slowed it down...
Despite the obvious theatrics of the rider on the horse interfered with, it looked like a good takedown.
Look, throughout his career Angel Cordero was the king of embellishment..For Christ's sake, he'd get brushed and made it look like he got hit in the head with a brick.....He'd pull back so hard on the reins, his horses's nose would touch his tail..
On a side note, there have been jockeys who have mastered the art of getting the attention of the Stewards in order to get a favorable ruling on a foul claim made by them.

[Stillriledup]

Really? Ok please elaborate..
I watched the video. All angles. I even slowed it down...
Despite the obvious theatrics of the rider on the horse interfered with, it looked like a good takedown.
Look, throughout his career Angel Cordero was the king of embellishment..For Christ's sake, he'd get brushed and made it look like he got hit in the head with a brick.....He'd pull back so hard on the reins, his horses's nose would touch his tail..
On a side note, there have been jockeys who have mastered the art of getting the attention of the Stewards in order to get a favorable ruling on a foul claim made by them.

Those 'theatrics' cost the jock a placing, but don't fret, the judges handed it back to him for his academy award performance.

You go on to tell me about jocks mastering the art of fooling the judges, this one worked, the stooges bought this nonsense hook, line and sinker.

[EMD4ME]

https://www.nyra.com/saratoga/videos/race-replay/AQD/2014/20140210/8/headon/

This is the type of rider you're dealing with. Has the 3 post (Irad is program #4) and herds his horse 7 wide out of the gate to make sure the favorite gets screwed (Program#10).

Ya can't say his horse broke out as the horse BROKE IN initially.....

[Valuist]

https://www.nyra.com/saratoga/videos/race-replay/AQD/2014/20140210/8/headon/

This is the type of rider you're dealing with. Has the 3 post (Irad is program #4) and herds his horse 7 wide out of the gate to make sure the favorite gets screwed (Program#10).

Ya can't say his horse broke out as the horse BROKE IN initially.....

The Beverly D wasn't about Ortiz. It was about Spencer.

[Stillriledup]

The Beverly D wasn't about Ortiz. It was about Spencer.

Depends who you ask.

[cj]

The Beverly D wasn't about Ortiz. It was about Spencer.

Both played a part in my opinion.

[thespaah]

Those 'theatrics' cost the jock a placing, but don't fret, the judges handed it back to him for his academy award performance.

You go on to tell me about jocks mastering the art of fooling the judges, this one worked, the stooges bought this nonsense hook, line and sinker.
"Working the officials/umpires" is practiced across almost every competitive sport.
This is nothing new.
And please, don't hit me with that tired old line of "well I have money on it"..
There are billions of dollars wagered on sporting events every year.
Horse racing is no different.
It is unfortunate. But part of the game.

[Stillriledup]

"Working the officials/umpires" is practiced across almost every competitive sport.
This is nothing new.
And please, don't hit me with that tired old line of "well I have money on it"..
There are billions of dollars wagered on sporting events every year.
Horse racing is no different.
It is unfortunate. But part of the game.

So you think that Ortiz 'working' the judges means it was a good DQ?

[thespaah]

So you think that Ortiz 'working' the judges means it was a good DQ?
Reread my post...
I stated "depsite".....Meaning, yes there was embellishment. However, in watching the video from all the available angles, it appeared to be a legit DQ....There was interference. There was a lost placing. That's enough for me.
Yes, the embellishment probably tipped the scales even further, but I believe the DQ would have happened anyway.

[Stillriledup]

Reread my post...
I stated "depsite".....Meaning, yes there was embellishment. However, in watching the video from all the available angles, it appeared to be a legit DQ....There was interference. There was a lost placing. That's enough for me.
Yes, the embellishment probably tipped the scales even further, but I believe the DQ would have happened anyway.

But the lost placing was because of the theatrics.