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PIC6SIX
07-10-2015, 06:42 PM
Does anyone on this board play the weekly contests on the websites Horsetourneys, Horseplayer Qualify, Twinspires and others to qualify for the 2016 NHC in Las Vegas? Would like to hear about your efforts, successes and near misses. Also years you qualified and were a participant.

ManU918
07-10-2015, 09:26 PM
I'm shooting for the BCBC right now and then will focus on the NHC. Good thing about playing in the BCBC is that the top 15 get into the NHC.

PIC6SIX
07-10-2015, 11:38 PM
Well Manu918, it looks like you and I are the only ones on this board who are trying to make it to the 2016 NHC in Vegas. Seems very strange to me with all the expert posters on this board with data bases, speed figures, variants, trainer knowledge and etc. who do not play contests. What is up with this picture?????

Robert Fischer
07-11-2015, 12:20 AM
Good info guys.

I am following along and reading this thread.

i have interest in contest play, but little experience.

ManU918
07-11-2015, 07:50 AM
Well Manu918, it looks like you and I are the only ones on this board who are trying to make it to the 2016 NHC in Vegas. Seems very strange to me with all the expert posters on this board with data bases, speed figures, variants, trainer knowledge and etc. who do not play contests. What is up with this picture?????

So I'll answer your question, then I'll go into why IMO the BCBC is structured better than the NHC.

Keep in mind we are on an internet forum and this place is full of trolls. Definitely some good handicappers here who I respect and some I know personally who have participated in the NHC. But honestly I would say 99% of the posters on this forum don't even hold a NHC Tour membership card.

Here's a couple of reasons why my focus is on the BCBC and why I personally think its structured better than the NHC.

1) You have a live $7500 bankroll... not points so you get to keep the money you earn instead of going off of a $2 point system. On top of keeping the bankroll, they use the other $2500 from the buy-in to fund the prize pool.

2) Every player is playing the same track

3) You can place wagers outside of Win bets... Place, Show, Exacta and Trifecta's are also accepted

4) You don't have to be in one specific location to play. You can play in New York, Florida, Las Vegas, California, or Kentucky

5) At any point a participant can jam their entire bankroll on a play they really love. This to me is the biggest differentiator. The NHC gives you a certain amount of bullets to use each day but they are all of the same value. As players we always have our eye on one or two races a day that we really love and should be able to fire when appropriate.

Lemon Drop Husker
07-11-2015, 08:32 AM
Been trying to qualify the last couple of years. Have been eerily close a couple of times, even holding the lead going into the last race when a 20/1 bomb rolled home to keep us out of qualifying earlier this year. :mad: Will also be taking some swings at the BC contest a couple of times this year as well since I'll be in attendance.

Gotta be on your A game, and get some luck to boot. Mad respect for anybody who even qualifies as I've swung and missed on 7 different occasions the last 2 years. You pretty much can't let a single opportunity pass you by, or it will cost you in the end.

The contests are great, and they really help to sharpen your handicapping skills.

I play in some Horse Tourneys events and have won a couple. Entered into one of the Belmont contests today. They provide a nice alternative for some relatively cheap prices to get some play in for a day to test your mettle.

Good luck! :ThmbUp:

PIC6SIX
07-11-2015, 11:33 AM
I wish more on this board would come forward and tell their contest experiences. It surely is a very tuff objective to master. I have played in many HTs and BCQ and NHC feeders. I have many times won or came in the top 10% of the feeder contestants but have drawn blanks in the qualifier which puts you in the big one.

One thing I have learned in contest play is that you must have tuff skin. I mean very tuff skin. You must keep trying until you conquer your objective. I have seen many contest players throw craps and next time come out on top. You have to follow that song title from many years ago called, "Your Day Will Come".

Light
07-11-2015, 11:59 AM
1) You have a live $7500 bankroll... not points so you get to keep the money you earn instead of going off of a $2 point system. On top of keeping the bankroll, they use the other $2500 from the buy-in to fund the prize pool.


I just don't get the logic of playing a contest with a $10K buy in. Wouldn't that money be more useful staying in your pocket and betting the races you want to bet,when you want to bet them and how you want to bet them? If you are looking for a really big payoff just put some of the money in a carryover pk6. Contests that are $100 or less with decent rewards make sense, but $10K is better played on your own terms.

Light
07-11-2015, 12:04 PM
Well Manu918, it looks like you and I are the only ones on this board who are trying to make it to the 2016 NHC in Vegas. Seems very strange to me with all the expert posters on this board with data bases, speed figures, variants, trainer knowledge and etc. who do not play contests. What is up with this picture?????

I finished 23rd a few years ago when I went. But since then the NHC has changed their format to giving away very few seats in their "free" contests and basically you have to be a full time player and paying for 'tour" contests to qualify. I haven't signed up the last several years because of that. Seems like the organizers for the NHC contests just want you to pay and pay and pay to qualify. Big turn off.

raybo
07-11-2015, 12:36 PM
Well Manu918, it looks like you and I are the only ones on this board who are trying to make it to the 2016 NHC in Vegas. Seems very strange to me with all the expert posters on this board with data bases, speed figures, variants, trainer knowledge and etc. who do not play contests. What is up with this picture?????

As has been mentioned, the costs involved are very high, unless you somehow get lucky and get in through free or inexpensive feeder/qualifying tourneys. The "expert posters" on this forum recognize that tournament play is pretty much a losing proposition and many of those expert posters play the horses to make money, not give it away in tourneys with very restrictive rules of play.

But, if you have the disposable income/bankroll to allow you some quite expensive entertainment, then go for it, but understand that your chances of actually getting there are almost nonexistent, especially if you are not extremely experienced in tournament play.

Like Light said, your $10k (or however much you will spend in the attempt to qualify, and all the ancillary expenses that you will incur along the way) can be much more efficiently used simply betting the tracks and races where you have an edge.

ManU918
07-11-2015, 12:39 PM
I just don't get the logic of playing a contest with a $10K buy in. Wouldn't that money be more useful staying in your pocket and betting the races you want to bet,when you want to bet them and how you want to bet them? If you are looking for a really big payoff just put some of the money in a carryover pk6. Contests that are $100 or less with decent rewards make sense, but $10K is better played on your own terms.

I guess I don't get your logic. Races we want to bet? Who in this game doesn't want to bet on Breeders Cup races? The pools don't get any higher on those two days, fields are great and there is tons of value to be had. The beauty of the BCBC is that you DONT have to bet every race. You can pick and choose 5 races on each day. It's not like these other tournaments that give you 10 mandatory $2 w/p races. That's not a test of great handicapping. IMO that's forced handicapping and in return it forces players to take chances on horses who offer long odds in an attempt to climb the leaderboard.

I've been in tournaments where I'm down to the last race and I'm $40 or $50 away from the top and I am forced to pick a horse I would never bet my own money on because that's my only chance to win and a max payout horse comes in and I win... Does that make me a good handicapper/tournament player? No its luck and honestly it sucks for the people who hit 8 races and get nothing to show for it.

Whereas in the BCBC if you're a chalk player and you want to risk $7500 on a favorite in the first race of the tournament... Go for it... If you're an exacta or trifecta player and you want to bet a $1000 straight exacta or trifecta... Go for it.. It's a live bankroll and your cash so do as you please. That's real handicapping IMO. Nowhere else in horse racing can you find a tournament that offers the structure that the BCBC does but more should follow suit.

Hitting a Pick 6 on $2500 (BCBC Prize Pool Entry fee cost) ticket is extremely hard but even if you did hit one nothing is guaranteed. If it chalks out or no bombs come in the payout isn't going to be anywhere near $230K, $130K, $80K, 60K or even $45K. What the first 5 places paid last year in the BCBC.

ManU918
07-11-2015, 12:42 PM
Like Light said, your $10k (or however much you will spend in the attempt to qualify, and all the ancillary expenses that you will incur along the way) can be much more efficiently used simply betting the tracks and races where you have an edge.

His $10K comment was about the BCBC... $10K is the entry fee but that's a live bankroll tournament and worth every penny of admission.

PIC6SIX
07-11-2015, 09:54 PM
The other thing about the BC is you can play a feeder for $110 or an NHC feeder on HT for less that $100 and possibly earn an entry to the BC in Keeneland this year. That $7500 is your money to bet. So you are already $7,500 ahead in real cash. You just have to manage your bankroll over 2 days and hopefully go home with money in your pocket.

By the way Keeneland is a top flight track run by top flight people. I have been there many times enjoyed the experience every time. It has a great library devoted to horse racing, a great gift shop, a great nature setting and beautiful Calumet Farm is right next door. You know for sure you are in horse country when your visit Keeneland.

appistappis
07-13-2015, 02:57 AM
why are these tourneys always weekend only???

lamboy
07-13-2015, 01:18 PM
thanks, this is a question i've also pondered myself. i caught the nhc bug back in 2008 and qualified 5 times. just missed the final table last year. experience has definitely made me a better handicapper. my only advice is to pick the tournaments which are conducive to your style of handicapping. for ex., if you are a good cash player, enter the on-track tourneys with that format. pick and pray formats are good if u can smoke out a good longshot in any of the mandatories and help protect against hail marys in the late races. while feeder contests offer great value, you can knock it out of the park in the first rd but zero in rd 2. the type of races in rd 2 just might conducive to your hcapping style hence im not a big fan.

lamboy
07-13-2015, 01:23 PM
edit** im reiterating pic6six's question not the question posted about "why only weekends"

PICSIX
07-13-2015, 04:51 PM
Headed to the Gold Coast

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Wednesday, July 22, 2015
Registration 9:00am – 5:00pm
Contest: July 23 - 25, 2015

Tracks:
Thursday: Arlington, Del Mar, Gulfstream & Louisiana
Friday: Arlington, Del Mar, Gulfstream Monmouth, Saratoga & Woodbine
Saturday: Arlington, Del Mar, Gulfstream, Monmouth, Saratoga & Woodbine

For More Information Call the Contest Line at 1-888-566-7223 or 702-365-7420

PIC6SIX
07-14-2015, 11:24 AM
Where is CAPpER AL on this thread? His moniker says, " NHC 2020 or Bust". Seems he is also into contest play but has not replied.

Charli125
07-14-2015, 12:40 PM
I'm shooting for the BCBC right now and then will focus on the NHC. Good thing about playing in the BCBC is that the top 15 get into the NHC.

I'm with him. NHC is an afterthought for me. Not only is live bankroll a much better fit for how I bet, but my ROI is way higher in cash tournaments. My order of preference for tournaments each year is below.

BCBC: The absolute biggest and best cash tournament in my opinion.

Players Challenge: This is hpqualify's tournament. Live bankroll, NHC spots, BCBC spots, etc. $5k live bankroll, $5k to the prize pool. Usually around 80 people.

The Big One: This is horsetourney's tournament. Don't like the format, but the prize pool is juicy with BCBC to the top 5, NHC to the top 10, and HPWS to 11-20th. Limited to <60 entries, 1 per person.

HPWS: I qualify for this one pretty easy each year, and while I don't often make much money, I really enjoy seeing friends and hanging out at this one. I don't take it near as serious as the others, but it's a good time. If they'd change the format to live bankroll, as I've suggested to them, I'd take it a lot more serious and would either win or buy multiple entries.

NHC: The cachet that comes along with winning it is great. The prizes up top are nice. It's just very expensive to qualify, and even more expensive to qualify via tour points.

lamboy
07-14-2015, 07:48 PM
I'm with him. NHC is an afterthought for me. Not only is live bankroll a much better fit for how I bet, but my ROI is way higher in cash tournaments. My order of preference for tournaments each year is below.

BCBC: The absolute biggest and best cash tournament in my opinion.

Players Challenge: This is hpqualify's tournament. Live bankroll, NHC spots, BCBC spots, etc. $5k live bankroll, $5k to the prize pool. Usually around 80 people.

The Big One: This is horsetourney's tournament. Don't like the format, but the prize pool is juicy with BCBC to the top 5, NHC to the top 10, and HPWS to 11-20th. Limited to <60 entries, 1 per person.

HPWS: I qualify for this one pretty easy each year, and while I don't often make much money, I really enjoy seeing friends and hanging out at this one. I don't take it near as serious as the others, but it's a good time. If they'd change the format to live bankroll, as I've suggested to them, I'd take it a lot more serious and would either win or buy multiple entries.

NHC: The cachet that comes along with winning it is great. The prizes up top are nice. It's just very expensive to qualify, and even more expensive to qualify via tour points.


i also share the same sentiments. Those tournaments you mentioned all offer a reasonable chance to make a decent score which IMO would take longer to grind out while playing cash on a weekend basis.

Charli, if you make it to the Big one, shoot me an email - i've already qualified and would like to take the opportunity to share some thoughts on handicapping with you while at LRL. I'm also in the BCBS but will be playing at BEL (moved venue from AQU) if anyone wants to meet up.

ManU918
07-14-2015, 11:36 PM
i also share the same sentiments. Those tournaments you mentioned all offer a reasonable chance to make a decent score which IMO would take longer to grind out while playing cash on a weekend basis.

Charli, if you make it to the Big one, shoot me an email - i've already qualified and would like to take the opportunity to share some thoughts on handicapping with you while at LRL. I'm also in the BCBS but will be playing at BEL (moved venue from AQU) if anyone wants to meet up.

I actually emailed Tim Schram yesterday because on the entry form it says New York TBD... But you're right its in Belmont.

lamboy
07-15-2015, 08:28 AM
I actually emailed Tim Schram yesterday because on the entry form it says New York TBD... But you're right its in Belmont.

got a chance to chat with Tim at Arlington this past weekend - a very nice guy and as u can attest, extremely responsive to any questions or inquiries!!

Charli125
07-15-2015, 11:02 AM
i also share the same sentiments. Those tournaments you mentioned all offer a reasonable chance to make a decent score which IMO would take longer to grind out while playing cash on a weekend basis.

Charli, if you make it to the Big one, shoot me an email - i've already qualified and would like to take the opportunity to share some thoughts on handicapping with you while at LRL. I'm also in the BCBS but will be playing at BEL (moved venue from AQU) if anyone wants to meet up.

I qualified on the weekend, so I'll shoot you an email and we'll meet up. If I qualify for the BCBC(chances are good since I have the Big One and the Players Challenge coming up in Sep.), I'll be playing from the Wynn. Last year I played at Keeneland and it worked out great. I'm not good at dealing with huge crowds, so the host venue isn't for me.

lamboy
07-15-2015, 11:57 AM
I qualified on the weekend, so I'll shoot you an email and we'll meet up. If I qualify for the BCBC(chances are good since I have the Big One and the Players Challenge coming up in Sep.), I'll be playing from the Wynn. Last year I played at Keeneland and it worked out great. I'm not good at dealing with huge crowds, so the host venue isn't for me.

congrats Charlie!! tty @LRL and BOL getting to the BCBS.

cnollfan
07-20-2015, 11:25 AM
I will be playing the Dog Days contest at Canterbury Sept. 12-13 which is an NHC qualifier. Canterbury is a great track to visit.

ReplayRandall
07-27-2015, 12:35 AM
Congrats to Vic Stauffer for punching his ticket to the 2016 NHC via the Del Mar Handicapping Challenge:

The top ten finishers all receive entries in the NHC.

Del Mar Handicapping Challenge Final Standings:

1 MARK STREIFF-- $43,484 plus $60,000 and $10,000 BCBC entry

2 JIM ATWELL -- $19,015 plus $25,000 and $10,000 BCBC entry

3 JEANNIE KING-- $16,055 plus $10,000 and $10,000 BCBC entry

4 CARL GIOIO --$14,011 plus $10,000 and $2,500 BCBC entry

5 VIC STAUFFER--$13,000 plus $7,500 and $2,500 BCBC entry

6 LUCAS VAN ZANDT --$11,772 plus $5,000 and $2,500 BCBC entry

7 BILL CHENVERT--$11,265 plus $5,000

8 TOM NOONE --$11,080 plus $4,500

9 LAWRENCE KAHLDEN--$11,073 plus $4,000

10 TODD CADY--$10,142 plus $3,500

outofthebox
07-27-2015, 11:39 AM
Congrats to Vic Stauffer for punching his ticket to the 2016 NHC via the Del Mar Handicapping Challenge:

The top ten finishers all receive entries in the NHC.

Del Mar Handicapping Challenge Final Standings:

1 MARK STREIFF-- $43,484 plus $60,000 and $10,000 BCBC entry

2 JIM ATWELL -- $19,015 plus $25,000 and $10,000 BCBC entry

3 JEANNIE KING-- $16,055 plus $10,000 and $10,000 BCBC entry

4 CARL GIOIO --$14,011 plus $10,000 and $2,500 BCBC entry

5 VIC STAUFFER--$13,000 plus $7,500 and $2,500 BCBC entry

6 LUCAS VAN ZANDT --$11,772 plus $5,000 and $2,500 BCBC entry

7 BILL CHENVERT--$11,265 plus $5,000

8 TOM NOONE --$11,080 plus $4,500

9 LAWRENCE KAHLDEN--$11,073 plus $4,000

10 TODD CADY--$10,142 plus $3,50020k weekend..Who needs the calling gig..Congrats Vic..and good luck in Vegas..

JimmyQ
07-27-2015, 07:54 PM
VIC STAUFFER SONG I WANNA BE LIKE VIC LYRICS

Sometimes I dream
That he is me
You've got to see that's how I dream to be
I dream I move, I dream I groove
Like Vic
If I could Be Like Vic
Like Vic
Oh, if I could Be Like Vic
Be Like Vic, Be Like Vic
Again I try
Just need to fly
For just one day if I could
Be that way
I dream I move
I dream I groove
Like Vic
If I could Be Like Vic
I wanna be, I wanna be
Like Vic
Oh, if I could Be Like Vic

TonyMLake
07-27-2015, 08:56 PM
Haha... I signed up on Public Handicapper a couple of years ago(?). I made and lost one bet but had every intention of "really getting into it" and never did. However, you've reminded me that it existed and perhaps I'll stop ignoring that weekly email I've been getting for a couple of years now!