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View Full Version : Arizona loses/ Ginsburg a hypocrite


zico20
06-29-2015, 10:14 PM
The Arizona legislature lost the supreme court ruling 5-4 with Kennedy siding with the four liberals. Roberts was fuming in his dissent. Justice Ginsburg must have caught dementia in the last few days it seems. Her quote on the ruling:

“The animating principle of our Constitution [is] that the people themselves are the originating source of all the powers of government,” Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg wrote for the majority.

Just days earlier she voted to take away the power of the people with her ruling on gay marriage, striking down numerous state elections against gay marriage. She needs to go the minute a Republican is inaugurated as the next president.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/courts_law/justices-rule-5-4-that-independent-panels-can-draw-election-district-lines/2015/06/29/c91269aa-1ae6-11e5-ab92-c75ae6ab94b5_story.html

horses4courses
06-29-2015, 10:17 PM
Like a lil cheese with that whine ? :lol:

zico20
06-29-2015, 10:29 PM
Like a lil cheese with that whine ? :lol:

No, I would just like the justices to follow the Constitution, something you obviously don't.

horses4courses
06-29-2015, 10:30 PM
Any justice that votes contrary to your beliefs
isn't following the constitution, I take it?

zico20
06-29-2015, 10:34 PM
Any justice that votes contrary to your beliefs
isn't following the constitution, I take it?

No, not at all.

NJ Stinks
06-29-2015, 10:35 PM
Fix the districts....Restrict voting....I'm beginning to think the GOP doesn't dig living in a democracy. :rolleyes:

zico20
06-29-2015, 10:40 PM
Fix the districts....Restrict voting....I'm beginning to think the GOP doesn't dig living in a democracy. :rolleyes:

Democrats were masters at gerrymandering districts long before the Republicans became good at it.

Clocker
06-29-2015, 11:00 PM
Democrats were masters at gerrymandering districts long before the Republicans became good at it.

You don't understand. The Democrats know what is best for the people of Arizona, even if they live thousands of miles away.

Rookies
06-29-2015, 11:56 PM
Gerrymandering is a complete perversion of democracy.

Always has been, always will be, regardless of who performs the fix.

If there is a way to block it, as per this case- great.

Clocker
06-30-2015, 12:38 AM
Gerrymandering is a complete perversion of democracy.

Always has been, always will be, regardless of who performs the fix.

If there is a way to block it, as per this case- great.



The issue here is not gerrymandering or redistricting. The issue is the US Constitution, and the power of the state legislature to determine the election process in its state.

Article 1, Section 4, Clause 1 of the US Constitution says:

The Times, Places and Manner of holding Elections for Senators and Representatives, shall be prescribed in each State by the Legislature thereof; but the Congress may at any time by Law make or alter such Regulations, except as to the Places of chusing [sic] Senators.

That means that the state legislature has the power to draw districts. SCOTUS now says that the people of the state can take that power away from the legislature with a simple vote and give it to a state election commission. Again, SCOTUS has rewritten the Constitution because 5 people on the court don't like the current outcome when the Constitution is followed.

And there are no safe guards to insure that this change will have any better results than the present system. And it appears that the proposed system is much less democratic. Currently, the members of the legislature are elected by the people. In the proposed system, the voters would have no say in either the candidates for, or the final membership of, the election commission. There is nothing to prevent the majority of the election commission from gerrymandering the districts.

reckless
06-30-2015, 07:43 AM
Fix the districts....Restrict voting....I'm beginning to think the GOP doesn't dig living in a democracy. :rolleyes:

Typical empty talking points belched from the lunatic fringe of PA.

The Democrat Party is the party with the democracy issue. Just ask all of our black American citizens about those Democrats such as Robert Byrd, Al Gore Sr., Lester Maddox, J. W. Fulbright that fought tooth and nail to deny them basic voting and civil rights.

Ask those American citizens of Japanese descent that were illegally and immorally interred thanks to Democrat icon president FDR.

And today, we have a Democrat party that wants convicted felons and murderers to have the right to vote; the Democrats want to give illegal aliens the right to vote, and the Democrats wants our national elections to be counted and certified by foreign entities in foreign countries!

This is your Democrat Party. A party of hate, racism, segregation, lawlessness and corruption.

Tom
06-30-2015, 08:51 AM
Very well put! :ThmbUp:

Robert Goren
06-30-2015, 09:34 AM
Republicans especially conservative like to ignore the 14th Amendment . The last line of Section I gives them a great deal trouble.
"nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws." Equal protection means all citizens, not just White heterosexual males. Yes, it even includes them. Passed in 1868, it is perhaps the most important amendment.

Tom
06-30-2015, 09:51 AM
Yes, and the dems have been ignoring it since it passed.

Robert Goren
06-30-2015, 10:38 AM
Yes, and the dems have been ignoring it since it passed.Until the 1970s, what you said was true. Since then, we have been trying to change. It is the GOP who developed the "Southern Strategy" after the liberal democrats made the Southern democrats feel unwelcome in the party. They basically trade the bigots for the Rockefeller wing of the republican party. I proud to say that no democrat I know of took money from the White Supremacist group, Council of Conservative Citizens. At least 4 GOP presidential hopefuls have, Walker, Cruz, Paul and Santorum, have. In addition, Romney took money from them in 2012. It is not like the CCC has made a secret of their racist views. If you support any of those four, you are supporting a person who doesn't have problem with racism today. It is today I am concerned about. There is nothing anyone can do change history, but there is plenty we can do to change what is happening today. How well those four do in the coming months, will say a lot about how GOP feels about racism today.

Tom
06-30-2015, 10:42 AM
And Hillary has sold her services while in the State Dept to foreign interests.
Where's your outrage over that.

Is the dems who have had the racist leaders in Congress, even KKK members, so I think the GOP views on racism are better than your side's.

But keep posting...it is amusing.

dartman51
06-30-2015, 10:51 AM
Until the 1970s, what you said was true. Since then, we have been trying to change. It is the GOP who developed the "Southern Strategy" after the liberal democrats made the Southern democrats feel unwelcome in the party. They basically trade the bigots for the Rockefeller wing of the republican party. I proud to say that no democrat I know of took money from the White Supremacist group, Council of Conservative Citizens. At least 4 GOP presidential hopefuls have, Walker, Cruz, Paul and Santorum, have. In addition, Romney took money from them in 2012. It is not like the CCC has made a secret of their racist views. If you support any of those four, you are supporting a person who doesn't have problem with racism today. It is today I am concerned about. There is nothing anyone can do change history, but there is plenty we can do to change what is happening today. How well those four do in the coming months, will say a lot about how GOP feels about racism today.

Bill Clinton and Al Gore were unwelcome? :confused: Who knew. :eek:

:D Did the Council of Conservative Citizens OFFER any money to any Democrats?? How do you know they wouldn't take it if offered. Very rare for a politician, of any stripe, to turn down money. Unless they get caught and it might be a negative. How many Dems have taken money from the Muslim Brotherhood? Other than Obama, that is.

Robert Goren
06-30-2015, 10:56 AM
Bill Clinton and Al Gore were unwelcome? :confused: Who knew. :eek:What White Supremacist groups did Clinton and Gore take money from?

dartman51
06-30-2015, 11:06 AM
What White Supremacist groups did Clinton and Gore take money from?

I don't know, you tell me.

Tom
06-30-2015, 11:25 AM
What White Supremacist groups did Clinton and Gore take money from?

Communist Chinese come to mind as not exactly a good deal for America.

NJ Stinks
07-01-2015, 01:12 AM
Typical empty talking points belched from the lunatic fringe of PA.

The Democrat Party is the party with the democracy issue. Just ask all of our black American citizens about those Democrats such as Robert Byrd, Al Gore Sr., Lester Maddox, J. W. Fulbright that fought tooth and nail to deny them basic voting and civil rights.

Ask those American citizens of Japanese descent that were illegally and immorally interred thanks to Democrat icon president FDR.

And today, we have a Democrat party that wants convicted felons and murderers to have the right to vote; the Democrats want to give illegal aliens the right to vote, and the Democrats wants our national elections to be counted and certified by foreign entities in foreign countries!

This is your Democrat Party. A party of hate, racism, segregation, lawlessness and corruption.

Could be a real challenge finding that elusive black man or woman who remembers Bird, Gore, Sr., Maddox or Fulbright. But JFK and LBJ should be no problem.

As for Japanese, FDR did what he thought he had to to win the war. But it's nice to know the GOP of today is so concerned about the plight of minorities. Now if you can just convince somebody who is actually a minority.

And thanks for bringing up the Democrats position on ex-cons being given back the right to vote. No restricting the vote on the Dem side!

From the USA Today website:

In a speech to the Leadership Conference on Civil and Human Rights at Georgetown University Law Center, Holder said it is "time to fundamentally re-think laws that permanently disenfranchise people who are no longer under federal or state supervision.''

"These restrictions are not only unnecessary and unjust, they are also counterproductive,'' the attorney general said. "By perpetuating the stigma and isolation imposed on formerly incarcerated individuals, the laws increase the likelihood they will commit future crimes.''

The proposal is an extension of a broader plan first announced by Holder last year to revamp the U.S. criminal justice system, including the re-integration of thousands of former offenders who are returning to communities every year from prison.

Holder said former offenders "continue to face significant obstacles,'' citing laws in 11 states that bar millions from voting.

"Across this country today, an estimated 5.8 million Americans … are prohibited from voting because of current or previous felony convictions,'' Holder said. "That's more than the individual populations of 31 U.S. states. And although well over a century has passed since post-Reconstruction states used these measures to strip African Americans of their most fundamental rights, the impact of felony disenfranchisement on modern communities of color remains both disproportionate and unacceptable.''

He said 2.2 million African Americans, or nearly one in 13 African-American adults, are banned from voting because of the laws. In three states — Florida, Kentucky and Virginia — that ratio is one in five. In Florida, Holder said, 10 percent of the entire population is disenfranchised as a result of the state's prohibitions on ex-offenders.

"The history of felony disenfranchisement dates to a time when these policies were employed not to improve public safety, but purely as punitive measures intended to stigmatize, shame and shut out a person who had been found guilty of a crime,'' Holder said.

Since 1997, Holder said 23 states have enacted changes, including in Virginia where last year the voting rights of former inmates with non-violent felony convictions began to be restored.

link: http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/02/11/holder-voting-rights-ex-felons/5377119/

reckless
07-01-2015, 02:17 PM
Could be a real challenge finding that elusive black man or woman who remembers Bird, Gore, Sr., Maddox or Fulbright. But JFK and LBJ should be no problem.

As for Japanese, FDR did what he thought he had to to win the war. But it's nice to know the GOP of today is so concerned about the plight of minorities. Now if you can just convince somebody who is actually a minority.

And thanks for bringing up the Democrats position on ex-cons being given back the right to vote. No restricting the vote on the Dem side!

From the USA Today website:

In a speech to the Leadership Conference on Civil and Human Rights at Georgetown University Law Center, Holder said it is "time to fundamentally re-think laws that permanently disenfranchise people who are no longer under federal or state supervision.''

"These restrictions are not only unnecessary and unjust, they are also counterproductive,'' the attorney general said. "By perpetuating the stigma and isolation imposed on formerly incarcerated individuals, the laws increase the likelihood they will commit future crimes.''

The proposal is an extension of a broader plan first announced by Holder last year to revamp the U.S. criminal justice system, including the re-integration of thousands of former offenders who are returning to communities every year from prison.

Holder said former offenders "continue to face significant obstacles,'' citing laws in 11 states that bar millions from voting.

"Across this country today, an estimated 5.8 million Americans … are prohibited from voting because of current or previous felony convictions,'' Holder said. "That's more than the individual populations of 31 U.S. states. And although well over a century has passed since post-Reconstruction states used these measures to strip African Americans of their most fundamental rights, the impact of felony disenfranchisement on modern communities of color remains both disproportionate and unacceptable.''

He said 2.2 million African Americans, or nearly one in 13 African-American adults, are banned from voting because of the laws. In three states — Florida, Kentucky and Virginia — that ratio is one in five. In Florida, Holder said, 10 percent of the entire population is disenfranchised as a result of the state's prohibitions on ex-offenders.

"The history of felony disenfranchisement dates to a time when these policies were employed not to improve public safety, but purely as punitive measures intended to stigmatize, shame and shut out a person who had been found guilty of a crime,'' Holder said.

Since 1997, Holder said 23 states have enacted changes, including in Virginia where last year the voting rights of former inmates with non-violent felony convictions began to be restored.

link: http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/02/11/holder-voting-rights-ex-felons/5377119/

First off, I stand by my historically-proven assessment of the Democrat Party being the party of racism, segregation, hate, lawlessness and corruption.

Reminding everyone --especially liberals, progressives, Democrats and their like-minded sycophants-- that their heroes: Woodrow Wilson, Hugo Black, Robert KKK Byrd, Al Gore Jr., J. W. Fulbright, mentor of impeached sex deviant Bill Clinton, FDR, segregationist Lester Maddox... oh the list goes on and on, and never ends, is part of my duty and societal responsibility to bringing truth and justice to all my friends here at PA.

Anything Holder says is discredited because he has violated his Constitutional duties as US Attorney General. But as a reminder, when a person commits a crime against society, and legally convicted in justice and court system, said persons rightfully lose basic rights such as voting. Spin this all you want but I have no sympathy for people who have demonstrated that they are indeed, an enemy of the state.

Tom
07-01-2015, 03:46 PM
Holder is a gunrunner, too.

Tom
07-01-2015, 03:54 PM
As for Japanese, FDR did what he thought he had to to win the war. But it's nice to know the GOP of today is so concerned about the plight of minorities. Now if you can just convince somebody who is actually a minority.

Far too many Blacks have abandoned the shackles of the democrats and rose up to become successful, independent people to use that tired old and untrue excuse. What the dems have done to the Black community is criminal at its best. They destroyed the family unit and created mass dependency on Uncle Sugar.

Nothing is holding back Blacks who really have the desire to rise above it and become fully participating Americans. In spite of the dem's continual degrading them as not able to do so on their own. That is the worst racism out there. Conservatives, at least all the ones I know, have faith that Blacks are fully capable of taking care of themselves and not need to be nannied into submission.

I guess the downside to the repubs is that they are not out there trying to get illegals registered to vote illegally.

JustRalph
07-01-2015, 06:41 PM
The soft bigotry of low expectations.......

Robert Goren
07-01-2015, 06:43 PM
Far too many Blacks have abandoned the shackles of the democrats and rose up to become successful, independent people to use that tired old and untrue excuse. What the dems have done to the Black community is criminal at its best. They destroyed the family unit and created mass dependency on Uncle Sugar.

Nothing is holding back Blacks who really have the desire to rise above it and become fully participating Americans. In spite of the dem's continual degrading them as not able to do so on their own. That is the worst racism out there. Conservatives, at least all the ones I know, have faith that Blacks are fully capable of taking care of themselves and not need to be nannied into submission.

I guess the downside to the repubs is that they are not out there trying to get illegals registered to vote illegally.Are you sure about that?