Exacta vs Exacta box vs quinella

[ilzho]

Hi everyone:

Can someone explain or give advice on their own experiences with betting the Exacta, vs Exacta Box and the quinella?
I now live near a race track and want would like to get some real life advice from all of you as to these types of bets.

I not looking to win the lottery, but would like to ease into these type of bets.

Thank you!

David

[lamboguy]

if the shorter priced horse wins the race you are generally better off with the quinella.


these don't exist anymore, but house quinella's were the best bet in all of racing. you could only bet them with bookmakers in Nevada. if you know what you are doing, it is pretty tough to lose betting those things.

[ilzho]

Quinella bets don't exist unless you're in vegas??
I remember my grandfather making these bets at belmont in the 1970/1980's.

[BlueChip@DRF]

Quinella bets don't exist unless you're in vegas??
I remember my grandfather making these bets at belmont in the 1970/1980's.

I made these bets for the first half of the last decade. These paid much better than an exacta box on the west coast tracks, particularly Santa Anita. I don't know why they took it away as I played this bet exclusively at Santa Anita.

[upthecreek]

Belmont(NYRA) still has Quinellas a few times a day
The only thing I learned from ToddTVG was to play the exacta straight and then
play the quinella, instead of an exacta box This way if it comes out straight you cash both as where in an exacta box, you can only cash once

[Prytanis]

The second and fourth at Belmont.
Always!

[davew]

Quinella bets don't exist unless you're in vegas??
I remember my grandfather making these bets at belmont in the 1970/1980's.

quinellas exist

house quinellas in NV do not -> they paid half win price times 2nd place price, and were available on all races

[nellanod]

You can bet them every day at the tracks in N.Y. on the 2nd and 4th race.

[Fingal]

Del Mar still has them. The pools may only be less than 10K vs an exacta poll of 150K+, but they still have them. In other words, it's easy for a large bet to move the payoffs around. What you thought looking at the will pays was going to be around $20 when you went to the window may turn out after the race to be in the low teens instead with late $$$ bets. Remember if you see a discrepancy of the exacta vs quinella there are those who watch that TV with the probables like a hawk, see the same thing you do & bet too hoping to profit off that. So Caveat Emptor, buyer beware.

[Cholly]

Quinella bets don't exist unless you're in vegas??
I remember my grandfather making these bets at belmont in the 1970/1980's.

"house quinella" does not = "quinella"

[Ray2000]

Hi everyone:

Can someone explain or give advice on their own experiences with betting the Exacta, vs Exacta Box and the quinella?
I now live near a race track and want would like to get some real life advice from all of you as to these types of bets.

I not looking to win the lottery, but would like to ease into these type of bets.

Thank you!

David
You might find this thread interesting. It's for Trifecta and Exacta combo comparisons.
It's done for Harness racing but the "Comparison rankings" should apply to small-handle T-Bred play as well.
With Exacta wagers the straight bet A/B is best if you can tolerate the lower strike rates.



http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=96835

[Robert Fischer]

Hi everyone:

Can someone explain or give advice on their own experiences with betting the Exacta, vs Exacta Box and the quinella?
I now live near a race track and want would like to get some real life advice from all of you as to these types of bets.

I not looking to win the lottery, but would like to ease into these type of bets.

Thank you!

David

With Exactas or Exacta Boxes, you have to start with an opinion about the race.
If you love the 2 favorites, that counts, but it's going to be a long-term losing situation.
If you dislike a favorite, and like 2 others equally, it's fine to box them.
Beyond 2 horses, you almost always want make separate bets based on your opinion, rather than boxing.

Example
$1 :1::2::3::4: box = $12
( a box of those four is the same thing as $1 straight exactas on 12, 13, 14, 21, 23, 24, 31, 32, 34, 41, 42, 43)

You gotta have some opinions inside of that 12 bet sequence

say I take those same bets but I don't really think ':4:' can win it and I think :1: or :2: will certainly be in the money as they are my top picks.
(12, 13, 14, 21, 23, 24, 31, 32, 34, 41, 42, 43) red = toss out

now i'm left with (12, 13, 14, 21, 23, 24, 31, 32) for $8 instead of $12 saving 1/3 of the costs. Do this 3 times, and you get to bet an extra race.
OR
I can do a $3 box of my top horses :1::2: and the other combos from above (13, 14, 23, 24, 31, 32) for that same $12
New Bet:
$3 exbx 1,2 = $6
$1 ex 1,2 with 3,4 = $4
$1 ex 3 with 1,2 = $2


Anytime you can bet your opinion, you are doing better than boxing wagers that only include part of your opinion.

[thaskalos]

I like boxing my exactas. The players that I know who are trying to save money by only betting their exactas one way, end up spending even more money on psychiatrist bills.

[AndyC]

I like boxing my exactas. The players that I know who are trying to save money by only betting their exactas one way, end up spending even more money on psychiatrist bills.

To me, an exacta is a leveraged win bet. I don't beat myself up when the exacta comes in the wrong way. I will box if I am betting against a horse and I don't have a strong opinion about any of the contenders.

[thaskalos]

To me, an exacta is a leveraged win bet. I don't beat myself up when the exacta comes in the wrong way. I will box if I am betting against a horse and I don't have a strong opinion about any of the contenders.
I don't like sacrificing bets in order to insure other bets. If I am playing against a favorite, then I'll box or part-wheel the exacta. If I am making a win bet and I feel the need to "leverage"...then I won't take my selection in the second slot of the exacta. I will spread a wider net by part-wheeling the trifecta...or even the superfecta.

[Robert Fischer]

Thaskalos brings up one of the challenges of playing the races:

I like boxing my exactas. The players that I know who are trying to save money by only betting their exactas one way, end up spending even more money on psychiatrist bills.
and that is fine.

behavioral finance is real, and knowing yourself is better than, doing something that will trigger irrational behavior while following what looks like a perfect gameplan "on paper".:ThmbUp:


so if you were take my approach and adapt it to allow for Thaskalos' good point about gambler's remorse, then you would do the following

original crude box = $1 exacta box :1::2::3::4: = $12

That box written out as separate straight bets (12, 13, 14, 21, 23, 24, 31, 32, 34, 41, 42, 43)

Your opinion of those bets: "I don't think that :4: can win, and I feel that one of my top choices (either :1: or :2: or both) will be in the exacta.

Your Dilemma: "The players that I know who are trying to save money by only betting their exactas one way, end up spending even more money on psychiatrist bills." or "I don't want to miss having the exacta because I tried to be too frugal".


solution: Wager all your combos, but weight them according to your opinion.

once again all combos = (12, 13, 14, 21, 23, 24, 31, 32, 34, 41, 42, 43)

your strongest combos reflect your opinion (either :1: or :2: or both) = these are
12 and 21 (super strong opinion)
13, 14, 23, 24, 31, 32 (strong opinion)
34, 41, 42, 43 (weak opinion, but you know yourself well enough that it's better to cover these.)

*(note a backslash "/" means "with" in spoken words with a teller)
Now we write these out in wager form:
12 and 21 (super strong opinion) = exacta box 1,2
13, 14, 23, 24, 31, 32 (strong opinion) = exacta 1,2 with 3,4
34, 41, 42, 43 = exacta box 34 , and exacta 4/1,2

FINALLY, we "weight our wagers according to our opinion.
Multiplier..... opinion....wager.... cost
x5! 12 and 21 (super strong opinion) = $5 exacta box 1,2 = $10
x3! 13, 14, 23, 24, 31, 32 (strong opinion) = $3 exacta 1,2 with 3,4 = $12
x1! 34, 41, 42, 43 = $1 exacta box 34 =$2 , and exacta 4/1,2 = $2

Total bet = $26 :ThmbUp:


Now you crush if your 1,2 comes in
you hit a good one if you 1 or 2 make up any part of the exacta with your contenders.
and You stay sane if ANY of your four contenders make up the exacta.



This isn't the ONLY set of specific wagers that could fit such an opinion, but the general idea is one that I believe in.
You should almost always be able come up with an opinion that is superior to simply boxing your contenders.

In this thread I've shown 3 approaches:

1 budget (tossing those you oppose)
2 leverage (toss those you oppose, double down on you strength for the price of a standard box)
3 weight lifting (crush your opinion and save insanity for the women)


possibilities are endless

[Hoofless_Wonder]

My thoughts are:

I rarely bet an exacta box. It's more efficient to bet an exacta part-wheel or weighted exactas of varying amounts.

If I like a longshot with the chalk and I can bet a quinella instead of an exacta, I'll do that - especially if I believe the chalk wins. If I think the two horses are close, then I bet a both a Q and small exacta with the longshot on top. If I think the longshot wins, I play the Q and EX in roughly equal amounts. The idea here is that the Q pays more than half of the "chalk over longshot" exacta, and the "longshot over chalk" exacta often pays more significantly more than the odds would suggest.

Hong Kong offers quinellas and quinella place (omni) wagers. I never much cared for the omni when Keeneland offered it, but based on my (surprisingly very) positive ROI with the QP at Hong Kong, I think that pool may have more "dumb" money - some of the QP payoffs amaze. I hardly play Qs there any longer.

[horses4courses]

House quinellas still exist in Nevada - barely.

William Hill racebooks still offer them at certain tracks.
I play them in certain situations, and they normally pay
from 10-30% higher than a boxed exacta on the same race.
Picking my spots, I can still make a few bucks on them annually.

Wouldn't want to try to get a large bet down on one, though.
It's been a long time since I have wagered more than $50 on one.
Not sure if they would take $100+, unless you are a regular big player.
I'm not, and play mostly online these days.

[burnsy]

I like boxing my exactas. The players that I know who are trying to save money by only betting their exactas one way, end up spending even more money on psychiatrist bills.


Talked about this before and he is right on. Its one thing if you are going chalky but if its a full field or better yet, a turf race ....you are nuts not to box the exacta or at least put something the opposite way. Don't be the dim wit that has it the wrong way when its a great number. This comes from the hard headed, dim wit that thought he knew it all when he was younger. You watch a couple big ones come in and sit there tearing up tickets, you will need psychological help and learn a painful lesson. People that don't agree are lying if they say its never happened to them.....its horses........running on an oval.

Lambo is right too. If you like one of the lower priced horses stick to quinellas it usually pays more than a box. Race 2 and 4 in NY, like everyone is saying . Its one of my favorite bets, this guy is not going to sit there breathing fire when it comes out the other way and I get nada. Been there, done that....don't like the therapy sessions. Things that anger you or try your patience can give you bad Juju for a duration of time...I don't pretend to be that good just to get frustrated. Gambling is not just the money, or trying to cut corners because you think you can predict a horse race. Keeping your cool and avoiding situations like that go a long way towards building confidence which carries over to the next bet you make. I've watched people lose their cool, when I was younger I was one of them at times. People can go out of their mind and out of their way to ruin the whole card by doing moves like betting them one way. That lesson is worth more than the money because once you "lose it mentally" I can almost bet that the person will lose the rest of the day too.

[TJDave]

The only time I box an exacta is when I'm rushed or too lazy to compute the best return on my investment.