Pats deflationgate - NFL report

[DJofSD]

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/F/FBN_PATRIOTS_DEFLATED_FOOTBALLS?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2015-05-06-13-15-55

NEW YORK (AP) -- An NFL investigation released Wednesday said that New England Patriots employees likely deflated footballs used in the AFC Championship and that quarterback Tom Brady was probably "at least generally aware" of the rules violations.

Now what? PSA? Twitter campaign?

[cj]

I'm sure the penalty will be severe, like only one deflated football per game will be allowed in the future.

[DJofSD]

I'm sure the penalty will be severe, like only one deflated football per game will be allowed in the future.
:lol:

[Clocker]

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/F/FBN_PATRIOTS_DEFLATED_FOOTBALLS?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2015-05-06-13-15-55



Now what?

Thirty day suspension of the Patriot equipment manager.

[Robert Fischer]

It's can't be easy being Tom Brady. And now this?! :rolleyes:

[_______]

I heard someone suggest he'll have to play a year with the Jets as penance.

[JustRalph]

100 hours of community service at Discount Tire

[Robert Goren]

"More likely than not likely" I can't see much happening if that is the best they can say.

[tucker6]

"More likely than not likely" I can't see much happening if that is the best they can say.

you would be mistaken to use that language as being wishy washy. That is what is required by the NFL for a guilty verdict. It has no other meaning.

[Stillriledup]

Here's one thing i haven't heard discussed and that is the double standard in sports (and society) for cheating. Some can cheat, and some cannot. You got guys like A Rod, Bonds, Clemens, Armstrong, Ben Johnson, Pete Rose and others who "broke the rules" and for one reason or another, 'society' came down hard on them and essentially tried to ruin their lives, branded them as cheats.

Why do Belichick and Brady keep getting passes? Same with David Ortiz, nobody ever talks about him either, he's a hero in sports and A Rod is a villian and i don't want to hear that A Rod is a "bad guy" and Ortiz is a loveable teddybear because Ortiz was the one who busted up the dugout phone due to roid rage and in the last few years, he's becoming less and less likeable.

Why the double standard in cheating and how cheaters are perceived?

[PICSIX]

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/suspicious-texts-between-tom-brady-151219208.html

[Rookies]

"The New England Patriots are reportedly bracing themselves for the possibility that they could be without their star quarterback for a significant portion of the 2015 season.According to CSNNE.com, sources within the Patriots organization fear that Tom Brady could be hit with a suspension that is somewhere in the six- to eight-game range."

The NFL has covered up and given inappropriate penalties for far worse human activity than this issue. Notwithstanding, the Cheatriots have been pulling this scam for years and it has little to do with Brady's throwing abilities. It has everything to do with holding onto the ball (a critical factor in Ws) by its Running Backs and Receivers. Just look at the numbers.

I think Kraft, Billy Boy and Brady have embarrassed Goodell in a year, where he has looked like a clown as Commish. Thst's why he will probably lay the lumber here.

Being a betting man, I'd say 4 games, reduced on appeal to 2... which would be fine with me, since the Bills second Game at Home is v.s. the Patsies. :jump:

[DJofSD]

"The New England Patriots are reportedly bracing themselves for the possibility that they could be without their star quarterback for a significant portion of the 2015 season.According to CSNNE.com, sources within the Patriots organization fear that Tom Brady could be hit with a suspension that is somewhere in the six- to eight-game range."

The NFL has covered up and given inappropriate penalties for far worse human activity than this issue. Notwithstanding, the Cheatriots have been pulling this scam for years and it has little to do with Brady's throwing abilities. It has everything to do with holding onto the ball (a critical factor in Ws) by its Running Backs and Receivers. Just look at the numbers.

I think Kraft, Billy Boy and Brady have embarrassed Goodell in a year, where he has looked like a clown as Commish. Thst's why he will probably lay the lumber here.

Being a betting man, I'd say 4 games, reduced on appeal to 2... which would be fine with me, since the Bills second Game at Home is v.s. the Patsies. :jump:
So the ball is made softer for the benefit of the backs and receivers but Brady incurs the wrath of the NFL?

[tucker6]

So the ball is made softer for the benefit of the backs and receivers but Brady incurs the wrath of the NFL?
why not? Brady led the effort to cheat. Doesn't matter who benefited.

[MutuelClerk]

I keep hearing the Pats don't need to cheat yet they constantly do. The commissioner is in bed with owner. But with all the bad publicity the NFL has received lately he'll slap the wrists of the Pats. Brady two games. Bellichik two games, lose a first round pick and a fine. Being a Raider fan I admit my bias against the Patriots. Tuck rule. BS.

[Clocker]

why not? Brady led the effort to cheat. Doesn't matter who benefited.

Luckily for Goodell, he doesn't have to meet any objective burden of proof. He assumes that Brady should have known, therefore not only did he know, but he was the one behind it.

If Brady should have known the balls were underinflated just by handling them, why couldn't the officials be held to the same standard? I agree that Brady probably knew, but there is no proof.

[Stillriledup]

I keep hearing the Pats don't need to cheat yet they constantly do. The commissioner is in bed with owner. But with all the bad publicity the NFL has received lately he'll slap the wrists of the Pats. Brady two games. Bellichik two games, lose a first round pick and a fine. Being a Raider fan I admit my bias against the Patriots. Tuck rule. BS.

Not only do they cheat, but they're arrogant and won't admit it. This is what supposedly got Pete Rose in trouble in the forgiveness dept according to Al in post 102 of the link i list below.

http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=116156&page=7&pp=15

[Robert Goren]

One thing I found out watching an interview with Peter King On Charlie Rose's show was that 3 of the 4 colt balls were also deflated, but not as much as the Pat's balls. Does that mean Andrew Luck should get punished too? Everything that said about Brady applies to Luck too.

[tucker6]

One thing I found out watching an interview with Peter King On Charlie Rose's show was that 3 of the 4 colt balls were also deflated, but not as much as the Pat's balls. Does that mean Andrew Luck should get punished too? Everything that said about Brady applies to Luck too.
Peter King is a shill for the Cheatriots. In reality, the Colts balls were slightly under 12.5 pounds, but very much within the margin you would see with atmospheric temps. The Cheatriot balls were well under 12.5 pounds, and as demonstrated in the Wells report, could not have been due to physics alone. King is pulling a shell game trick. He's diverting your attention from the reality of the situation. The reality is that Brady lied about several things and refused to cooperate because he knew he was cheating.

[Stillriledup]

Peter King is a shill for the Cheatriots. In reality, the Colts balls were slightly under 12.5 pounds, but very much within the margin you would see with atmospheric temps. The Cheatriot balls were well under 12.5 pounds, and as demonstrated in the Wells report, could not have been due to physics alone. King is pulling a shell game trick. He's diverting your attention from the reality of the situation. The reality is that Brady lied about several things and refused to cooperate because he knew he was cheating.

LOVE this post.

:ThmbUp:

[Clocker]

Brady suspended for 4 games, team fined $1 million and 1st pick.

[Robert Fischer]

Brady suspended for 4 games, team fined $1 million and 1st pick.

Thought this was sarcasm until I saw the news.:ThmbUp:

Good move by the NFL.
Nips their image/legitimacy issue in the bud.
Keeps the NFL in the spotlight during the off-season/nba-season

[PhantomOnTour]

He will miss the season opener against the Steelers :jump: :jump:
They're gonna beat us anyway :mad: :mad:

[proximity]

He will miss the season opener against the Steelers :jump: :jump:
They're gonna beat us anyway :mad: :mad:

idk, they have no secondary and now drop arrington?? :confused: can't believe bb thinks bradley fletcher is any kind of answer?? :confused:

[Robert Fischer]

http://i.imgur.com/jHAckAS.jpg

[Robert Fischer]

Can the Bills or Dolphins take advantage of this, or will New England have another cake-walk regular season?

[Stillriledup]

Can the Bills or Dolphins take advantage of this, or will New England have another cake-walk regular season?

I'm sure as we speak they're concocting other ways to cheat, if its not letting air out of balls or spying, there must be some other way they can steal something and use it to their advantage, its the Patriot way.

[TJDave]

I'm sure as we speak they're concocting other ways to cheat, if its not letting air out of balls or spying, there must be some other way they can steal something and use it to their advantage, its the Patriot way.

Wouldn't bother me a bit as long as I was on the right side of the wager.

How can you argue with a culture that proclaims:

Winning isn't everything; it's the only thing.

[Stillriledup]

Wouldn't bother me a bit as long as I was on the right side of the wager.

How can you argue with a culture that proclaims:

Winning isn't everything; it's the only thing.

Exactly. All we wanna do is cash tickets, the rest is just convo. :ThmbUp:

[Robert Fischer]

Bills have been putting good people in place, and Matt Cassell would have to win the job and find a peak season w/ offensive coordinator Greg Roman to make any kind of noise IMO.

Dolphins have been at least mediocre with a fairly solid QB and they add Suh on Defense which figures to help some.

4 games, then Brady Comes back on national TV vs. Luck and the Colts.

Could be a more competitive season, could be business as usual...

[horses4courses]

Chris Andrews retweeted
Will Ferrell ‏@Will___Ferrell 4h4 hours ago
Please everyone pray for Tom Brady as he will have to stay in this prison during his suspension

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CEw0Om4UsAA1eSx.jpg

[Stillriledup]

Thought this was sarcasm until I saw the news.:ThmbUp:

Good move by the NFL.
Nips their image/legitimacy issue in the bud.
Keeps the NFL in the spotlight during the off-season/nba-season

Good move? To me, their image is that they permit cheating, you can cheat your rear end off, win a super bowl and not have that super bowl taken away. Ben Johnson got his "super bowl" taken away, so did Lance Armstrong, but Brady? Super Bowl in tact thank you very much. Its hard to believe that this league is anything more than professional wrestling, its all scripted entertainment.

[MutuelClerk]

And who do the Pats play in the fifth game of the season? Sunday night, must see TV. The team that turned them in. Indianapolis Colts.

[Stillriledup]

And who do the Pats play in the fifth game of the season? Sunday night, must see TV. The team that turned them in. Indianapolis Colts.

LOTS of talking heads are saying the appeal will get the suspension down to 2 games.

[bobbyb]

And who do the Pats play in the fifth game of the season? Sunday night, must see TV. The team that turned them in. Indianapolis Colts.

Should be fun.
The same Colt's that Brady shredded in the second half of that game with the balls under control of the Ref - who couldn't remember which of the 2 WalMart gauges he used to check the balls...................... :bang:

[highnote]

The one thing I haven't heard or seen is if Brady instructed his guys to inflate the balls to 11.5 pounds or if he just wanted his guys to inflate the balls at the low end of the legal limit -- 12.5.

What is the tolerance of the gauges? Maybe the tolerance is +/- 4 oz? If so, a ball could have been inflated to 12.5, but in reality was 12.1 due to the tolerance of the gauge. Then the balls got cold and the atmospheric pressure changed and caused the football to fall to 11.9.

Why didn't the NFL issue a warning to the Patriots before the Colts game instead of running a sting operation?

Seems to me the Colts were trying to get an edge, too.

Too many questions and not enough hard data.

[Clocker]

[QUOTE=highnote]The one thing I haven't heard or seen is if Brady instructed his guys to inflate the balls to 11.5 pounds or if he just wanted his guys to inflate the balls at the low end of the legal limit -- 12.5. QUOTE]

I just heard a rumor that Brady is going to change his jersey number to 12.5 next year.

[Dark Horse]

Good move? To me, their image is that they permit cheating, you can cheat your rear end off, win a super bowl and not have that super bowl taken away. Ben Johnson got his "super bowl" taken away, so did Lance Armstrong, but Brady? Super Bowl in tact thank you very much. Its hard to believe that this league is anything more than professional wrestling, its all scripted entertainment.

They could, and probably should, have suspended Brady for the Superbowl. That would have send a message. Now the only statement the NFL makes is that rules will be strictly enforced, unless that cuts into their own profits.

[Inner Dirt]

Good move? To me, their image is that they permit cheating, you can cheat your rear end off, win a super bowl and not have that super bowl taken away. Ben Johnson got his "super bowl" taken away, so did Lance Armstrong, but Brady? Super Bowl in tact thank you very much. Its hard to believe that this league is anything more than professional wrestling, its all scripted entertainment.

Do you really believe what you are writing or just trying to get a reaction out of people? The game they supposedly cheated in they won 42-7. They would have won that game if they played with a nerf ball coated with Crisco in a blizzard. Teams have spied on each other and monkeyed with footballs since the beginning of the league, BFD. Brady is convicted on circumstantial evidence that he knew he was playing with an under inflated football and he gets 4 games, Ray Rice is seen on video decking his girlfriend and he originally gets 2 games. Wow, Roger Goodell makes like $40 mil a year for those kinds of decisions?

[Clocker]

It wasn't even circumstantial evidence as the term is normally used.

The report concludes that Brady “more likely than not” was “at least generally aware” of the activities of two low-level Patriots who may have deflated footballs (the report doesn’t prove with any certainty that they did so).

Also, Brady is obviously guilty because he refused to turn over his emails to the league. Who does he think he is, Hillary Clinton?

This whole thing is about the Patriots, and Pats haters are thrilled. What if some other team was caught tampering with balls? This:

Last season, the Carolina Panthers and Minnesota Vikings were caught, on a cold day, using sideline heaters to warm up footballs. That's against the rules. You can argue that it's not the same level as deflating footballs in a bathroom, but it has the same effect: something outside of the rules to make the football easier to grip and catch. The Panthers and Vikings were ... warned. That's it.

Also, in 2012 the San Diego Chargers used towels with an adhesive substance on their game balls and didn't give them up to the NFL immediately when ordered to do so. If you think the Panthers-Vikings thing was just some honest mistake, it's a lot harder to convince anyone that there was no intent by the Chargers to gain an advantage. And the Chargers' punishment? A $20,000 fine. That's it.


http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/five-reasons-why-the-nfl-got-the-deflate-gate-punishment-dead-wrong-233900364.html

I rarely agree with Bob Costas about anything, but he made sense about this. The case will be appealed, but Goodell decides the appeal. Costas said the appeal should go to an independent arbitrator that both side agree on. MLB does this, the NFL does not.

[ronsmac]

I never thought I'd see such a big deal about a little air taken out of a football. If they took air out of the Colts balls without them knowing, then that would be a big deal. Just make every team play with the same balls if it's such a big deal.

[Tom]

$1 million dollar fine.
Wow.

That should straighten out that team!

Oh, just heard, only the defense can beat their wives for the first 8 games.

[Clocker]

$1 million dollar fine.
Wow.

That should straighten out that team!

Brady is suspended for four games without pay. His lost wages are going to save the team a lot more than $1 million.

[proximity]

I never thought I'd see such a big deal about a little air taken out of a football. If they took air out of the Colts balls without them knowing, then that would be a big deal. Just make every team play with the same balls if it's such a big deal.

while it didn't make a difference in our game against them (but maybe it did in baltimore's?), tucker6 has posted stats (and a particularly damning graph) here that showed the patriots fumbling significantly less than every other team in the league over the last couple years. he also posted stats that showed individual players fumbling significantly more with their old (or new) teams than they did with the patriots.

[Stillriledup]

Do you really believe what you are writing or just trying to get a reaction out of people? The game they supposedly cheated in they won 42-7. They would have won that game if they played with a nerf ball coated with Crisco in a blizzard. Teams have spied on each other and monkeyed with footballs since the beginning of the league, BFD. Brady is convicted on circumstantial evidence that he knew he was playing with an under inflated football and he gets 4 games, Ray Rice is seen on video decking his girlfriend and he originally gets 2 games. Wow, Roger Goodell makes like $40 mil a year for those kinds of decisions?

I believe they've been cheating for 7 years at least with deflating footballs, so to point to a lopsided result and say its ok to cheat as long as you win by enough points where we know for sure the cheating wasnt a factor in the result is a bit shortsighted.

There's no circumstantial evidence, all you need to know is in the fumble statistics, outdoor northeast based team should never have that kind of disparity, it should always be an indoor team that leads the way in this category. As far as the "coaching" of Belichick as to why guy's done fumble, players who had great fumble stats w New England went back to the median when they left the Pats, so there's more proof of something 'shady' going on.

I do agree with you that Goodell is a clown, he should have suspended Brady for at least 1 year, same with Belichick and stripped all their Sb titles. That would have been a fair punishment, but the slap on the wrist they got doesn't do justice.

Its like putting a guy who got millions of dollars in a bank robbery in jail for a month, but when he gets out he gets to keep the money he stole. Its the same exact thing.

[Marshall Bennett]

I don't think a suspension was warranted, nor the loss of draft picks. The fine was sufficient.
Every quarterback in the league is probably guilty of the same, and while you might ask where is the evidence of that, I'd say it's somewhere within the circumstantial evidence levied against Brady.
This will be overturned by appeal through an independent arbitrator, thus letting Goodell off the hook as the bad guy for not doing the same as he should have in the first place. He has no balls.

[DJofSD]

He has no balls.
Sure he does -- they're just not very big. And he has to ask to use them.

[proximity]

I don't think a suspension was warranted, nor the loss of draft picks. The fine was sufficient.
Every quarterback in the league is probably guilty of the same, and while you might ask where is the evidence of that, I'd say it's somewhere within the circumstantial evidence levied against Brady.
This will be overturned by appeal through an independent arbitrator, thus letting Goodell off the hook as the bad guy for not doing the same as he should have in the first place. He has no balls.

mr goodell is a terrible commissioner and for sure one of the most overpaid people in world history.

tbs, every other team in the league didn't start fumbling significantly less than the league average once the new rules were implemented.

new england is guilty.

[Stillriledup]

I don't think a suspension was warranted, nor the loss of draft picks. The fine was sufficient.
Every quarterback in the league is probably guilty of the same, and while you might ask where is the evidence of that, I'd say it's somewhere within the circumstantial evidence levied against Brady.
This will be overturned by appeal through an independent arbitrator, thus letting Goodell off the hook as the bad guy for not doing the same as he should have in the first place. He has no balls.

I agree with Prox, the fumble stats only point to the Pats cheating with soft balls. No other team is cheating like this, it hasn't even dawned on other teams to cheat like this....Belichick is the only guy who ran that "Trick play" with ineligible receivers, he's a guy thinking outside the box, looking for edges, nobody else does this but him...and he breaks the rules too, i mean, why wouldn't you break the rules if you know the punishment is a slap on the wrist and the commissioner is good buddies with the owner of your team?

[DJofSD]

How do you know that no other team is cheating like that?

[Stillriledup]

How do you know that no other team is cheating like that?

Advanced stats. Its like DNA.

[Marshall Bennett]

Belichick is the only guy who ran that "Trick play" with ineligible receivers, he's a guy thinking outside the box, looking for edges, nobody else does this but him
You can't really believe that no other team has picked up on the tricks of the trade, whether legal or not, and been in a cave behaving like good boys.
Goodell caved into pressure, mostly generated by the media, and used Brady as a scape-goat. Most fans appreciate his decision out of sheer hate of the Patriots, irregardless of whether justice was duly served.

[MutuelClerk]

Brady's last interview and the one with Costas the week of the Super Bowl he sounds like Bill Clinton answering questions about Monica Lewinsky back in the day. Smiling and awww shucks isn't going to work this time. People want answers, he refuses to supply them. He thinks he's above the law. Maybe this will wake him up.

[Marshall Bennett]

Advanced stats. Its like DNA.
And has nothing to do with simply being better or ability?
It's nothing like DNA.

[Marshall Bennett]

Brady's last interview and the one with Costas the week of the Super Bowl he sounds like Bill Clinton answering questions about Monica Lewinsky back in the day. Smiling and awww shucks isn't going to work this time. People want answers, he refuses to supply them. He thinks he's above the law. Maybe this will wake him up.
And what sort of punishment did Bill receive? :D

[highnote]

If Brady gets a two game suspension that would not be a bad thing. The season is too long as it is. So if he gets two games he's only have to play in 14 regular season games and should be fresher for the playoffs.

Plus, if they clinch their division early he can get some extra time off.

This could work in his favor and also work in favor of the NFL because it keeps people talking about football.

The draft ended last week, so this is a great story to keep the NFL in the news during the NHL and NBA playoffs, not to mention MLB.

[Clocker]

And the NFL investigation found Belichick totally innocent, so that will put an end to all the whining about what a cheater he is, right? :p

"We do not believe that the evidence establishes that any other Patriots personnel participated in or had knowledge of the violation of the Playing Rules or the deliberate effort to circumvent the rules described in this Report. In particular, we do not believe there was any wrongdoing or knowledge of wrongdoing by Patriots ownership, Patriots Head Coach Bill Belichick or any other Patriots coach in the matters investigated."

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/five-reasons-why-the-nfl-got-the-deflate-gate-punishment-dead-wrong-233900364.html

[Stillriledup]

And has nothing to do with simply being better or ability?
It's nothing like DNA.

No. He's not better, never has been. Without spygate or deflategate, these guys would have 0 super bowls.

[proximity]

How do you know that no other team is cheating like that?

on the graph tucker6 posted here before, 31 teams were grouped pretty tightly around an average number of offensive plays per fumble.

then there was a precipitous jump to the patriots.

kind of reminded me of some of the graphs from the ultimate poker scandal.

[Rookies]

What I said yesterday to some football Bills buddies:

This is about what I thought it would be, well after appeal to the 2 game mark and with significant financial Penalty.

The NFL has waaaaaay more serious stuff than this to deal with and I don't believe a less inflated ball affected Brady more than 1-2%. The critical part was on the Receiving end of his passes and Running Backs. This little scam clearly, by far, allowed the Cheatriots to fumble less... a lot less than the league average and turnovers change games!

Also Brady, Billy & Kraft are part of the entitled game. They believe, like many skunk politicians, that laws and rules don't apply to them. I guarantee that the biggest part of the penalty here was their collective actions in embarrassing the NFL.

Brady should have admitted guilt immediately, and said:

"Really, that's a big deal to have the ball a little less inflated? I did it to make it more comfortable in my hands, but c'mon, we waxed the Dolts 45-7! It wasn't a factor at all. However, if the Commish thinks it's important, I'll accept my penalty. If he wants my cell phone, here it is."

Result?

A fine... end of story. The lying and refusing cooperation was everything.

At least, he's done for the Bills first game. By coincidence, my BIL was in Vegas and called me about an hour before the decision. I asked him quickly, what the AFC East line was.
Patsies = 4/5. Bills = 9/2. Got down before the decision! 😎

[proximity]

Brady's last interview and the one with Costas the week of the Super Bowl he sounds like Bill Clinton answering questions about Monica Lewinsky back in the day. Smiling and awww shucks isn't going to work this time. People want answers, he refuses to supply them. He thinks he's above the law. Maybe this will wake him up.

brady should be suspended just for his liberal and condescending use of the term "bud" in the text messages. the big "jersey shore" alpha male slap on the back practically oozes out of the equipment manager's phone. :faint:

[Dark Horse]

In a day so cynical that no US politician could dream of doing so, it's interesting that sports has taken it upon itself to uphold a code of honor. The golden boy of the NFL got caught cheating and then lied about it. That's the problem. It's about the image of the NFL, 'the Shield' as Bruschi likes to refer to. I have no idea how good the Patriots really are. I do know that they hold themselves to a political standard, where it's not cheating unless you get caught. And I think there's a Hernandez-size gap between the actual character of the Patriots and the one they like to present to the public through such mouthpieces as Bruschi.

Even so, the NFL shares a large part of the blame. Why on earth would you give the teams the balls for each game long in advance? Forget about the preferences each team or QB may have. Just bring in the balls when the game starts. And have each ball inflated at the same pressure.

[Stillriledup]

In a day so cynical that no US politician could dream of doing so, it's interesting that sports has taken it upon itself to uphold a code of honor. The golden boy of the NFL got caught cheating and then lied about it. That's the problem. It's about the image of the NFL, 'the Shield' as Bruschi likes to refer to. I have no idea how good the Patriots really are. I do know that they hold themselves to a political standard, where it's not cheating unless you get caught. And I think there's a Hernandez-size gap between the actual character of the Patriots and the one they like to present to the public through such mouthpieces as Bruschi.

Even so, the NFL shares a large part of the blame. Why on earth would you give the teams the balls for each game long in advance? Forget about the preferences each team or QB may have. Just bring in the balls when the game starts. And have each ball inflated at the same pressure.

Its. All. Scripted.

No company makes as much money as the NFL does and wields as much power as they do without extensive planning. They don't just show up and let things fall where they may, which is what the fans and customers think for the most part.

They didn't get this powerful by accident.

What i find amazing is that if you listen to the talking heads on tv, most of them unanimously feel like the suspension was too harsh. I know i'm in the minority, but i just don't see it, i don't see how other cheaters in other sports as well as other rules breakers all have sentences more harsh, Belichick walks around like he's a king ruler who's untouchable and nobody says a boo because they're too busy suspending Sean Payton for 1 full year.

Wasn't Bruschi a steroid cheat, or did he just get a stroke due to being at the ripe old age of 30?

[highnote]

It seems clear to me that it's all about the ratings.

[Valuist]

Where's the criticism of the league itself? They are the ones who allowed this to happen. Can you imagine MLB pitchers being allowed to use baseballs they wanted? They'd scuff them, pine tar them, spit on them. What a joke they had no checks & balances in place to prevent this.

[thaskalos]

This isn't sport...it's showbiz. If it really WAS sport...then Brady and Belichick would be hung out to dry. First Spygate...and now this? By the same team? When you have hall-of-fame skills, and you insist on cheating anyway...then you become despicable...as an athlete, AND as a human being. God only knows what other shit this team has been able to get away with for all these years. The most despicable franchise in American team sports, IMO...and nothing but contempt for Smug Bill and Smiley Tom. :ThmbDown:

[Robert Fischer]

The purpose of the NFL is to sell beer, trucks, cars, credit cards, tech gadgets, phones, soda, snacks, and airplane tickets,... promote armed-forces and other state-sponsored propaganda... support a gambling enterprise, and provide a general distraction from our economy.

The NFL is an ad.

[Clocker]

The purpose of the NFL is to... promote armed-forces and other state-sponsored propaganda...

Somebody better tell Goodell about that part.

According to a report from Christopher Baxter and Jonathan Salant of NJ.com, the Department of Defense has paid 14 different NFL teams a total of $5.4 million over the last four years in exchange for patriotic displays at games.


The Jets were joined by the Falcons, Ravens, Bills, Bengals, Browns, Packers, Colts, Chiefs,Vikings and Steelers in receiving multiple payouts, while the Cowboys, Dolphins and Rams were each one-time recipients. The team that has received the most money from this practice is the Falcons, with a total of $1,049,500 coming their way in five payments.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-football/25181085/nfl-teams-received-54-million-from-defense-department-in-last-4-years

[Dark Horse]

Wasn't Bruschi a steroid cheat, or did he just get a stroke due to being at the ripe old age of 30?

Almost certainly roids.

I'm not too familiar with the steroid policy in the NFL, back then and now. Wasn't drug testing opposed, by the players, for the longest time? I do seem to recall that some players more recently were suspended for a season for testing positive for marijuana and its amazing Superman effect.

[Robert Fischer]

Somebody better tell Goodell about that part.



http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-football/25181085/nfl-teams-received-54-million-from-defense-department-in-last-4-years

Not sure if you are agreeing or refuting.


There is certainly a strong relationship between the armed forces and the NFL regarding advertising, recruiting and general patriotism. I personally happen to think it is a great thing.

a general side note to all = My post was attempting to point out reality from one man's perspective. In this case, I'm not trying to be negative about it. I happen to love our country, love our economy and love the system. From my own perspective(right or wrong), I think that the public takes a lot of things literally, and I just happen to see things differently. Sometimes when I perceive a reality that contrasts with the public perception (or the generic message that is broadcast to the public), it's entirely possible that I exaggerate a bit.

[Robert Fischer]

Almost certainly roids.

I'm not too familiar with the steroid policy in the NFL, back then and now. Wasn't drug testing opposed, by the players, for the longest time? I do seem to recall that some players more recently were suspended for a season for testing positive for marijuana and its amazing Superman effect.

The marijuana stuff (in and out of football) certainly seems illogical. :ThmbUp:

You have guys in the NFL with 40lbs of extra muscle and their skulls have even grown out, rewarded with $100million contracts and commercials, yet smoking marijuana is a sin.

It makes no sense, but it's the law. Comes down to discipline from the players.

[Stillriledup]

This isn't sport...it's showbiz. If it really WAS sport...then Brady and Belichick would be hung out to dry. First Spygate...and now this? By the same team? When you have hall-of-fame skills, and you insist on cheating anyway...then you become despicable...as an athlete, AND as a human being. God only knows what other shit this team has been able to get away with for all these years. The most despicable franchise in American team sports, IMO...and nothing but contempt for Smug Bill and Smiley Tom. :ThmbDown:

Unless its show biz. Than, there's no difference between Tom Shady and Sgt Slaughter or Hulk Hogan, they're actors, this isn't 'true sport' and it never has been, but at least back in the day they would make a good attempt and do a good job at hiding the fact that they're really just professional wrestling, nowadays they don't care if you know, they just stick it in your face and say here we are, actors playing a script, take it or leave it.

The key to all of this is polarization. By not suspending Smug Bill and Tom Shady anything close to what Sean Payton and others got for much less "crimes" they create a very polarizing situation and if you're polarized, you're more likely to watch.

[_______]

In a day so cynical that no US politician could dream of doing so, it's interesting that sports has taken it upon itself to uphold a code of honor. The golden boy of the NFL got caught cheating and then lied about it. That's the problem. It's about the image of the NFL, 'the Shield' as Bruschi likes to refer to. I have no idea how good the Patriots really are. I do know that they hold themselves to a political standard, where it's not cheating unless you get caught. And I think there's a Hernandez-size gap between the actual character of the Patriots and the one they like to present to the public through such mouthpieces as Bruschi.

Even so, the NFL shares a large part of the blame. Why on earth would you give the teams the balls for each game long in advance? Forget about the preferences each team or QB may have. Just bring in the balls when the game starts. And have each ball inflated at the same pressure.

:ThmbUp: on last paragraph.

More to the point, once they turned over control of the game ball to the teams, why bother with minimum and maximum pressures? You either control the balls or let the market decide.

[burnsy]

Showbiz yes, the NFL knows outside of New England this plays very well for them. But even in real life, you show up in court once, they will let you off easy. You make it a habit, the judge will get perturbed and take it as an insult. What makes this even dumber is these guys can win on the up and up................Brady, Kraft and crew may have pull but the other owners can and will bury them if given the chance. Plus, they know it plays well with most of the public. A plus, plus for them, no doubt. This is the best thing for them since draft beer..........behind closed doors they are laughing and thanking New England for this foolishness.......

[Inner Dirt]

Where's the criticism of the league itself? They are the ones who allowed this to happen. Can you imagine MLB pitchers being allowed to use baseballs they wanted? They'd scuff them, pine tar them, spit on them. What a joke they had no checks & balances in place to prevent this.

Pitchers have been caught screwing with baseballs for ages, where have you been?

[LottaKash]

Almost certainly roids.

.....marijuana and its amazing Superman effect.

I started to clean my room, and then I got high.... :D

[Clocker]

Where's the criticism of the league itself? They are the ones who allowed this to happen.

The rule for many years now is that each team provides its own balls. And two of the major promoters of that rule change were Peyton Manning and, surprise, Tom Brady. And not only does the team provide them, they use the balls in practice the week before the game.

[DJofSD]

Any one surprised that Brady is appealing the suspension?

[Marshall Bennett]

Any one surprised that Brady is appealing the suspension?
No, and I think he'll win and play against the Steelers. :)

[DJofSD]

http://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/2015/05/14/patriots-issue-response-wells-report-deflategate/As5BoaerbMFai0zCfzbkQI/story.html

The Patriots issued a response to the Ted Wells report on Deflategate and posted it online. The Patriots’ official Twitter account distributed the link.

“The Wells Report in Context” was written by Daniel L. Goldberg, an attorney who represented the Patriots during the Deflategate investigation.

“The conclusions of the Wells Report are, at best, incomplete, incorrect and lack context. The Report dismisses the scientific explanation for the natural loss of psi of the Patriots footballs by inexplicably rejecting the Referee’s recollection of what gauge he used in his pregame inspection. Texts acknowledged to be attempts at humor and exaggeration are nevertheless interpreted as a plot to improperly deflate footballs, even though none of them refer to any such plot. There is no evidence that Tom Brady preferred footballs that were lower than 12.5 psi and no evidence anyone even thought that he did. All the extensive evidence which contradicts how the texts are interpreted by the investigators is simply dismissed as ‘not plausible.’ Inconsistencies in logic and evidence are ignored.”

Rest of the article at the link.

[Stillriledup]

Any one surprised that Brady is appealing the suspension?
Im a little surprised because normally they make the original suspension contingent on 'not appealing' its like a plea bargain in the courts, take a smaller amount and agree not to fight. In other words, if they wanted a 4 game ban, they could have just given him an 8 game ban and then reduced it to 4 after the appeal.

Im guessing that they'll reduce it to 2 games, but i hate the original suspension, i think Brady AND Belichick should have both gotten 1 year suspensions at least, so to me, its all wrist slapping and weak by the NFL.

[Dark Horse]

Any one surprised that Brady is appealing the suspension?

No. He's listening to the wrong people. Everybody knows Brady was behind the deflated balls, but those people want it proven in a court setting and come up with slick lawyer arguments to get him off the hook. Once again, the hypocrite Patriots are demonstrating that they think themselves above the rest of the league. Instead of trying to wiggle out of it, Brady should accept his punishment like a man. I don't think he understands how p*ssed off people are with him. But let the chips fall. It wouldn't surprise me if NFL players were lining up to take him out next season.

[Stillriledup]

No. He's listening to the wrong people. Everybody knows Brady was behind the deflated balls, but those people want it proven in a court setting and come up with slick lawyer arguments to get him off the hook. Once again, the hypocrite Patriots are demonstrating that they think themselves above the rest of the league. Instead of trying to wiggle out of it, Brady should accept his punishment like a man. I don't think he understands how p*ssed off people are with him. But let the chips fall. It wouldn't surprise me if NFL players were lining up to take him out next season.

Its bad. Now they're playing us for fools saying the "deflator" was something to do with weight loss. :D

[highnote]

No. He's listening to the wrong people. Everybody knows Brady was behind the deflated balls,

I still have not heard or seen anywhere where Brady said only inflate the balls to under 12.5 psi. Maybe he just said inflate them to the low end of the legal limit. If that's the case then there was no wrongdoing.


Instead of trying to wiggle out of it, Brady should accept his punishment like a man.

If he thinks he's innocent then why should he accept a wrongful punishment?

I don't think he understands how p*ssed off people are with him. But let the chips fall. [quote]

I'm not pissed off. In fact, I think its almost a non-issue.

[quote]It wouldn't surprise me if NFL players were lining up to take him out next season.

Don't they do that every week to every QB in the league?

[Dark Horse]

Don't they do that every week to every QB in the league?

Today's NFL is orchestrated ballet with a few sumo wrestlers tossed in to keep up appearances. If you stare too hard at the QB it's a fifteen yard penalty.

[Marshall Bennett]

Goodell will officiate the appeal himself. Not good news for Brady.
This wouldn't happen in a typical justice setting. An unbiased arbitrator would oversee the appeal process. Goodall fears if this were the case Brady would certainly win his appeal as real evidence used against him was slim and none.
Goodell worries about his own public image and media appeal. He fears what real justice would do to his position.
Imo, he's a pussy and sets a bad example to Americans on how our justice system really works. He truly sickens me.

[DJofSD]

With all due respect, if you believe people think what the NFL dishes out is the same as how the legal (leave justice out of it) systems works, we're in deep, deep caca.

[Clocker]

Goodell will officiate the appeal himself. Not good news for Brady.

If Goodell had a little more common sense and a lot less ego, he would be happy to let it go to arbitration. No matter what happens, a lot of people are going to be upset. If it goes to arbitration, whatever happens isn't his fault.

[Dark Horse]

Imo, he's a pussy and sets a bad example to Americans on how our justice system really works. He truly sickens me.

The NFL is a world unto itself. Adrian Peterson was wrong to hurt his child, but it wouldn't have cost him his job and millions in the real world. Similar for Ray Rice. NFL players submit themselves to this. It's considered a privilege, not a right, to play in the league. For Brady and co to think that they're above this is the sickening part.

To those who would object that Brady's infraction wasn't too serious, I would say that hundreds of millions of dollars may easily have ended up in the wrong hands because of the deflated balls. One single fumble can decide a game or spread. The NFL may not endorse gambling, but without money bet on the games it would be far less popular. Brady cheated the public, including gamblers. Not a good idea.

[Stillriledup]

The NFL is a world unto itself. Adrian Peterson was wrong to hurt his child, but it wouldn't have cost him his job and millions in the real world. Similar for Ray Rice. NFL players submit themselves to this. It's considered a privilege, not a right, to play in the league. For Brady and co to think that they're above this is the sickening part.

To those who would object that Brady's infraction wasn't too serious, I would say that hundreds of millions of dollars may easily have ended up in the wrong hands because of the deflated balls. One single fumble can decide a game or spread. The NFL may not endorse gambling, but without money bet on the games it would be far less popular. Brady cheated the public, including gamblers. Not a good idea.

Tom Brady is essentially a "false flag" in the sense that he's 1 of thousands and thousands of people who have played in the league before him and thousands who will play after him. If the "Shield" means ANYTHING, and it doesn't seem to mean squat, they would have kicked him out of the sport, same with Belichick. If you cheat, you're gone. If an employee at Office Max stole something from the supply closet, they don't get a "4 game" suspension, they get let go and maybe prosecuted.

WIth this light handed punishment, the NFL has basically said the "Shield" is poppycock, that all the blood, sweat, tears, broken bones and head trauma that is put upon these players isn't worth much, its not worth having fair games and the NFL has never been about fair play and honest games.

[Dark Horse]

The NFL carries at least half of the blame in deflategate. I'm sure that the NFL didn't want the public to know that teams are given the game balls long in advance. I can just imagine tennis players bringing their own balls. And I'm fairly certain that the reason the NFL decided to do this is that it would produce higher scoring games; i.e. better entertainment and tv ratings. Didn't the NFL also adjust the rules to protect the QB and to call pass interference; changes that make it harder to defend and easier to put points on the board? Is there any question that entertainment is a top priority for the NFL? The more people watch, the more money. And cheating, especially by a poster child of the NFL, goes directly against that. It undermines the credibility of the league, and it undermines the profit. Remember, nothing new has come out since before the Superbowl. But they drew it out, because they didn't want to suspend Brady for the Superbowl. The NFL is going to be fair and just, as long as it doesn't cost them money.

The Patriots are the organization that is always looking for loopholes. Spygate is one example. The ineligible receiver plays that they introduced against the Ravens these past playoffs, and that are now no longer legal, are another. The soft game balls fit perfectly in their philosophy. Brady is a smart guy. If he knew he could throw just as well with a softer ball, why would he not pick that option if it lowers the fumble rate? I don't think he did it because he personally prefers softer balls, because he showed that he is just as good with harder balls. I tend to believe that he did it for the team. One fumble less per game is a whole lot of extra W's in the long run. Isn't he also the guy who accepts a lower pay so that the team can be better?

The elephant in the room? Why didn't the refs check the game balls before each game? With a measuring device, that is.

[Stillriledup]

The NFL carries at least half of the blame in deflategate. I'm sure that the NFL didn't want the public to know that teams are given the game balls long in advance. I can just imagine tennis players bringing their own balls. And I'm fairly certain that the reason the NFL decided to do this is that it would produce higher scoring games; i.e. better entertainment and tv ratings. Didn't the NFL also adjust the rules to protect the QB and to call pass interference; changes that make it harder to defend and easier to put points on the board? Is there any question that entertainment is a top priority for the NFL? The more people watch, the more money. And cheating, especially by a poster child of the NFL, goes directly against that. It undermines the credibility of the league, and it undermines the profit. Remember, nothing new has come out since before the Superbowl. But they drew it out, because they didn't want to suspend Brady for the Superbowl. The NFL is going to be fair and just, as long as it doesn't cost them money.

The Patriots are the organization that is always looking for loopholes. Spygate is one example. The ineligible receiver plays that they introduced against the Ravens these past playoffs, and that are now no longer legal, are another. The soft game balls fit perfectly in their philosophy. Brady is a smart guy. If he knew he could throw just as well with a softer ball, why would he not pick that option if it lowers the fumble rate? I don't think he did it because he personally prefers softer balls, because he showed that he is just as good with harder balls. I tend to believe that he did it for the team. One fumble less per game is a whole lot of extra W's in the long run. Isn't he also the guy who accepts a lower pay so that the team can be better?

Legally speaking, the NFL is an "entertainment" company who can essentiallty "fix" their own games. Its a reality show, but they've done a pretty good job convincing a gullible public that its "pure sport" and that the integrity of the games is first and foremost.

This punishment to the Pats and Brady just basically emphasizes that the outcomes of the games being legitimate and honest isn't something that's high on their priority list.

[Robert Fischer]

This punishment to the Pats and Brady just basically emphasizes that the outcomes of the games being legitimate and honest isn't something that's high on their priority list.

Actually it's the opposite.

The punishment actually demonstrates to the general public that the league is serious about such infractions and will penalize them. The average fan is fine with the punishment.

For someone like you, you don't feel the punishment is severe enough. However, you already know that the NFL is not what you call 'pure sport'.

[DJofSD]

http://news.yahoo.com/goodell-called-witness-brady-appeal-223423442--nfl.html;_ylt=AwrXnCYShlZV00wAYADQtDMD;_ylu=X3oDMT Byc3RzMXFjBGNvbG8DZ3ExBHBvcwM0BHZ0aWQDBHNlYwNzcg--

If Goodell doesn't reconsider, "the NFLPA and Mr Brady will seek recusal and pursue all available relief to obtain an arbitrator who is not evidently partial," the union wrote in a letter to the league that it made public on Friday.

[Stillriledup]

Actually it's the opposite.

The punishment actually demonstrates to the general public that the league is serious about such infractions and will penalize them. The average fan is fine with the punishment.

For someone like you, you don't feel the punishment is severe enough. However, you already know that the NFL is not what you call 'pure sport'.

I don't think anyone who has any intelligence thinks that a 4 game ban for Brady means they're serious because fans know Sean Payton was suspended a year and a guy on the Browns was suspended a year also, so it looks like a double standard and that some people can cheat and essentially get away with it, a 4 game suspension is nothing, they have an automatic win vs Jax, so in reality, its only a 3 game ban, certainly not much of a deal for these guys.

[Robert Fischer]

I don't think anyone who has any intelligence thinks that a 4 game ban for Brady means they're serious because fans know Sean Payton was suspended a year and a guy on the Browns was suspended a year also, so it looks like a double standard and that some people can cheat and essentially get away with it, a 4 game suspension is nothing, they have an automatic win vs Jax, so in reality, its only a 3 game ban, certainly not much of a deal for these guys.

Have you read things like ESPN.com comments? They make our sports section look like a mensa meeting.
Sports fans aren't overthinking this stuff. Most are either pats fans(feel penalty too strict) pats haters(" " too lenient) neutral fans(mildly entertained during off-season).

[tucker6]

Bobby Kraft taps out. I guess the other owners weren't too happy with his cheating ways and told him so. And before anyone says this is quid pro quo to reduce Brady's penalty, my feeling is that the NFL will go to the mat to uphold Brady's 4 game suspension. The NFL wants to set an example for any future thoughts of cheating.

[Stillriledup]

Bobby Kraft taps out. I guess the other owners weren't too happy with his cheating ways and told him so. And before anyone says this is quid pro quo to reduce Brady's penalty, my feeling is that the NFL will go to the mat to uphold Brady's 4 game suspension. The NFL wants to set an example for any future thoughts of cheating.

Lets hope. As long as its at least a ONE game suspension, i'm all ready to get my #TomShady shirts i won't be able to do that if he gets 0 games suspension.

[burnsy]

I knew he would bow out................earlier post pointed out he's down 31-1, plus a commissioner that is the owners "boy". The other owners are not going to take that crap even though this circus helped the "NFL Show" by giving and giving. That's the other reason he backed down, the longer he runs his mouth the worst it gets and he's usually a pretty sharp guy........He'll back his boys but he's got no shot vs. the other owners. Time to shut up and take the lumps. Do people really think he wants to go down the path that the Oakland Raiders went down? That really worked out well for them..... :)

[Stillriledup]

Why no FBI involvement? There's legal wagering on these games. Again. pats get a pass while roger Cossack is essentially crying for legal justice for 'hacking'

[Stillriledup]

Brady testifying 'under oath' is this 'nfl oath' (which means absolutely nothing) or a real oath?