American Pharoah

[Donttellmeshowme]

damn he did that easy

[tanner12oz]

That was scary good

[Donttellmeshowme]

he can sit and stalk he has the perfect running style for the Derby

[tanner12oz]

We haven't seen his best yet..appears to be much more in the tank

[comet52]

Very impressive.

[moneyandland]

reminds me of Bellamy Road, impressive and may very well be a tremendous race horse, but cupcake romps don't give 'em the bottom you need to finish that last 1/8th at CD

[Stillriledup]

reminds me of Bellamy Road, impressive and may very well be a tremendous race horse, but cupcake romps don't give 'em the bottom you need to finish that last 1/8th at CD

its not much about "bottom" as it is about the mental ability to handle traffic, being grabbed by the jock, pushed wide, bumped, getting in a stretchlong battle, etc. When Bellamy Rd got "brave" in the Wood, he was on the lead, in the 1 path, running free. Its an entirely different "sport" when a horse is forced to deal with adversity.

[PhantomOnTour]

This colt is owned by Ahmed Zayat.

Karma will inevitably step in and prevent him from winning the Derby.

[chadk66]

if he gets an even remotely decent trip in the derby I can't see anybody beating him. I really like Carpe Diem but I don't think he has a snowballs chance in hell beating American Pharoah if he has any kind of trip at all.

[NY BRED]

This colt is owned by Ahmed Zayat.

Karma will inevitably step in and prevent him from winning the Derby.


quite a statement to make about a brilliant thoroughbred and an owner
who has remained in the game despite some crushing blows.

By the way MR. Z ran a respectable third.

[PhantomOnTour]

quite a statement to make about a brilliant thoroughbred and an owner
who has remained in the game despite some crushing blows.

By the way MR. Z ran a respectable third.
I made no statement disparaging the colt, only the owner.
Remember the 2009 Preakness when Zayat and the owner of Mine That Bird were going to conspire to keep Rachel Alexandra out by entering an overmatched runner or two? This would have oversubscribed the field and 3yr old colts get preference over fillies, so Rachel would have been out.
I don't believe MTB or Pioneerof The Nile ever won another race...hmmmm....in fact, I think Pioneer never even ran again.
How soon some forget - not me....never.

[Donttellmeshowme]

quite a statement to make about a brilliant thoroughbred and an owner
who has remained in the game despite some crushing blows.

By the way MR. Z ran a respectable third.





best race by Mr Z in a long time. You wont be able to find him in the Derby though. As far as karma goes for Zayat im with Phantom on this one.

[Alwaysonpoint36]

I made no statement disparaging the colt, only the owner.
Remember the 2009 Preakness when Zayat and the owner of Mine That Bird were going to conspire to keep Rachel Alexandra out by entering an overmatched runner or two? This would have oversubscribed the field and 3yr old colts get preference over fillies, so Rachel would have been out.
I don't believe MTB or Pioneerof The Nile ever won another race...hmmmm....in fact, I think Pioneer never even ran again.
How soon some forget - not me....never.
:ThmbUp: :ThmbUp:

[Tom]

Surprised me - first time has shown ability to attend a real pace.
Can he repeat it against real race horses?

[Secondbest]

Surprised me - first time has shown ability to attend a real pace.
Can he repeat it against real race horses?
He's The real race horse

[magwell]

He's The real race horse Absolutely .......:cool:

[PhantomOnTour]

I presume Zayat named this colt since he is an Egyptian.

Can't he spell?
the name is American Pharoah, but isn't that last word correctly spelled Pharaoh??

[Tom]

He's The real race horse


Several others have done a lot more than this one so far.
The race yesterday was good, but it is the only one in his record.

[Tom]

I presume Zayat named this colt since he is an Egyptian.

Can't he spell?
the name is American Pharoah, but isn't that last word correctly spelled Pharaoh??

Does it matter if he wins the Darby? :D

[PhantomOnTour]

Does it matter if he wins the Darby? :D
Please God, no!

[Thebigguy]

I made no statement disparaging the colt, only the owner.
Remember the 2009 Preakness when Zayat and the owner of Mine That Bird were going to conspire to keep Rachel Alexandra out by entering an overmatched runner or two? This would have oversubscribed the field and 3yr old colts get preference over fillies, so Rachel would have been out.
I don't believe MTB or Pioneerof The Nile ever won another race...hmmmm....in fact, I think Pioneer never even ran again.
How soon some forget - not me....never.

Who cares? Its like you owned parts or something.....

[Stillriledup]

quite a statement to make about a brilliant thoroughbred and an owner
who has remained in the game despite some crushing blows.

By the way MR. Z ran a respectable third.

Zayat uses Baffert as his trainer, right?

[classhandicapper]

THis is one of the strongest Derby fields I can recall in a long time.

[BlueChip@DRF]

THis is one of the strongest Derby fields I can recall in a long time.

Or most evenly matched.

[Robert Fischer]

THis is one of the strongest Derby fields I can recall in a long time.

I agree, this is a strong crop.

In a normal year, a horse like Carpe Diem, or Dortmund, would be a worthy favorite.

If any horse wins the triple crown again, it will be very special because of the difficulty and rarity alone. If American Pharoah wins the triple crown this year, it will really stamp him among the modern greats.

[classhandicapper]

Or most evenly matched.


I'd vote for evenly matched and very strong. ;)

[chadk66]

A buddy of mine (former trainer) was at Oaklawn for the race. He said this horse was double freaky live and in person.

[codysakic]

That was very impressive. Victor never really asked him for anything. He will be the favorite come Derby day with Dortmund a close 2nd. This is shaping up to be an incredible race. So many good horses in the field.

[BlueChip@DRF]

That was very impressive. Victor never really asked him for anything. He will be the favorite come Derby day with Dortmund a close 2nd. This is shaping up to be an incredible race. So many good horses in the field.

Yeah he did ask AP for something - he asked him to slow down after the 16th pole.

I think he's the only contender that was not whipped in their last prep.

[Wickel]

I made no statement disparaging the colt, only the owner.
Remember the 2009 Preakness when Zayat and the owner of Mine That Bird were going to conspire to keep Rachel Alexandra out by entering an overmatched runner or two? This would have oversubscribed the field and 3yr old colts get preference over fillies, so Rachel would have been out.
I don't believe MTB or Pioneerof The Nile ever won another race...hmmmm....in fact, I think Pioneer never even ran again.
How soon some forget - not me....never.



:ThmbDown::ThmbDown::ThmbDown:

[OTM Al]

I presume Zayat named this colt since he is an Egyptian.

Can't he spell?
the name is American Pharoah, but isn't that last word correctly spelled Pharaoh??

He did spell it right. The Jockey Club evidently transposed the letters when they registered the horse. Zayat decided to roll with it. Was in Bloodhorse article a few days ago I think.

[horses4courses]

Jay Privman , Churchill Downs - DRF Live few seconds ago
Baffert's plan for American Pharoah: "Wrap him in bubblewrap"

AMERICAN PHAROAH is scheduled to arrive at Churchill Downs later today, where in 19 days he will run in the Kentucky Derby, most likely as the favorite following his runaway victory in the Arkansas Derby. With the colt coming back in just three weeks and two preps out of the way, it's not like Baffert will have to do much with American Pharoah. He'll probably have one workout at Churchill. Otherwise, Baffert said, he just wants American Pharoah to stay just as he is. "We're going to wrap him in bubblewrap," he said Monday.

[NY BRED]

Zayat uses Baffert as his trainer, right?

formerly employed Steve Asmussen as his main trainer, then disengaged
after the PETA/Nehro blowup.

Thereafter Zayat hired Wayne Lukas, Dale Romans, Mike Wilson , and
targeted his superstars with Baffert.
.

At this point AP is THE horse to beat in the Derby provided he draws
a decent post and the race is run cleanly, which , as proven in the past
is not always the case.

Not trying to be dramatic, AP could very well be the next Triple Crown
Winner.

[RunForTheRoses]

How has this horse done figure wise? Did he break the 100 Beyer mark in his last start? I believe his best prior was 99. Has any other horse?

[BlueChip@DRF]

How has this horse done figure wise? Did he break the 100 Beyer mark in his last start? I believe his best prior was 99. Has any other horse?

American Pharoah
2YO
75 Maiden Race (finished 5th)
101 Del Mar Futurity-G1 (1st)
101 Front Runner-G1 (1st)
________________________________
3YO
100 Rebel-G2 (1st)
105 Ark Derby-G1 (1st)

And the Derby going to be a 3rd start off the layoff to boot.

~~~~~~~
Dortmund
104 RBLewis-G3 (1st)
104 San Felipe-G2 (1st)
106 SA Derby-G1 (1st)

[RXB]

American Pharoah is a very talented colt but he beat nothing in those Oaklawn races. The Derby is going to be a much bigger jump in class for him than for Dortmund, or Upstart.

[Robert Fischer]

He's more talented than the other horses, and his 'limiting factors' also have higher limits than the other horses.

Stepping up in class will affect him less than pretty much any other horse.

[RunForTheRoses]

[QUOTE=BlueChip@DRF]American Pharoah
2YO
75 Maiden Race (finished 5th)
101 Del Mar Futurity-G1 (1st)
101 Front Runner-G1 (1st)
________________________________
3YO
100 Rebel-G2 (1st)
105 Ark Derby-G1 (1st)

And the Derby going to be a 3rd start off the layoff to boot.

~~~~~~~
Dortmund
104 RBLewis-G3 (1st)
104 San Felipe-G2 (1st)
106 SA Derby-G1 (1st)[/QUOTE

Thanks, he does look fast enough. Handling the poly may imply distance ability.

[RunForTheRoses]

American Pharoah is a very talented colt but he beat nothing in those Oaklawn races. The Derby is going to be a much bigger jump in class for him than for Dortmund, or Upstart.
I know it was a long time ago but what about the Del Mar field? It is a premium meet.

[Stoleitbreezing]

American Pharoah is a very talented colt but he beat nothing in those Oaklawn races. The Derby is going to be a much bigger jump in class for him than for Dortmund, or Upstart.

Who did Dortmund beat other then Firing line? And we don't really know about FL because he trounced the worst KD prep field this year. Bolo? He's a turf horse? Prospect Park, Mr. Z? Allowance class at this stage in there careers? Many questions about dortmund and class. All of the talk about him is the way he's winning and not WHO.

More positives with AP then Dortmund imo. Dortmund may run a big race, but I have to throw out at least one chalk derby day.

[letswastemoney]

Who did Dortmund beat other then Firing line? And we don't really know about FL because he trounced the worst KD prep field this year. Bolo? He's a turf horse? Prospect Park, Mr. Z? Allowance class at this stage in there careers? Many questions about dortmund and class. All of the talk about him is the way he's winning and not WHO.

More positives with AP then Dortmund imo. Dortmund may run a big race, but I have to throw out at least one chalk derby day.I would say the Sunland and Arkansas Derby fields were equal in depth, minus the big star that won them. The speed figures back this up.

[horses4courses]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CDEmJZaUkAAsGzN.png:medium

[tanner12oz]

This horse won't hit the board imo...reminds me of a Bellamy road

[Stillriledup]

This horse won't hit the board imo...reminds me of a Bellamy road

Ut oh!

I was with ya.

[Tom]

Well, I took a stand and left him off all my tickets.
So I cash a few place tickets.

No regrets.

[BMustang]

Got a perfect trip, slow pace, and had gas in the tank down the stretch.

Nice horse.

Even though an 18 horse field played like a 6 horse field for those up front.

[JustRalph]

Got a perfect trip, slow pace, and had gas in the tank down the stretch.

Nice horse.

Even though an 18 horse field played like a 6 horse field for those up front.

Just like I said in another thread.....there was a huge difference in the quality of horses after you got through the first five or six best.

[thespaah]

The top ran very well.
IMO, they could take turns beating each other throughout the remainder of this 3 yo campaign.
My hope is the horses stay healthy and fit. And the connections realize that by pitting them against each other in the better Grade I's for 3yo's, it could conceivably ramp up interest in racing..
Those that run the sport of Horse racing MUST find ways to market these three horses and racing overall.

[davew]

we have someone to root for a Triple Crown (at least for 2 weeks)

[PaceAdvantage]

I didn't believe in this horse. But I said in another thread before the race that if he finds another level and wins this race, he's a freak.

I don't think the final time is going to qualify him as a freak though, so let's just say, he's a relative freak. Not an absolute freak. :lol:

I also predicted before the race that if he wins the Derby, finds that next level and becomes a (relative) freak, that he will win the Triple Crown.

Never in my almost 16 years on this board have I ever predicted that the Kentucky Derby winner will win the Triple Crown (at least I don't think I have).

But this horse should not have won this race. Especially not with Firing Line in such good position to defeat him.

AP showed me a lot today. There isn't another horse who can beat him. The only things that can beat AP on the road to the Triple Crown are AP himself, Baffert or Espinoza.

[Greyfox]

AP showed me a lot today. There isn't another horse who can beat him. The only things that can beat AP on the road to the Triple Crown are AP himself, Baffert or Espinoza.

I was high on American Pharoah before this race and had him as my key player.

Having said that, he labored significantly to get this win.
The pace was pedestrian and the 2:03 time was not impressive.
Depending upon who shows up for the next two races, I'd be inclined to bet against him for the win.
I'd like to be wrong, but I don't think that this good steed is the next Triple Crown winner.

[Stillriledup]

I didn't believe in this horse. But I said in another thread before the race that if he finds another level and wins this race, he's a freak.

I don't think the final time is going to qualify him as a freak though, so let's just say, he's a relative freak. Not an absolute freak. :lol:

I also predicted before the race that if he wins the Derby, finds that next level and becomes a (relative) freak, that he will win the Triple Crown.

Never in my almost 16 years on this board have I ever predicted that the Kentucky Derby winner will win the Triple Crown (at least I don't think I have).

But this horse should not have won this race. Especially not with Firing Line in such good position to defeat him.

AP showed me a lot today. There isn't another horse who can beat him. The only things that can beat AP on the road to the Triple Crown are AP himself, Baffert or Espinoza.

I like that last paragraph and i think i'll add to it by saying there's a lot higher chance that AP, BB or VE could "beat" this horse, this is 2015, horses are fragile and not sturdy, its a long way to the top if you want to rock and roll. Not sure i see this horse going wire to wire in the Belmont, its a LONG way.

My Triple Crown prediction is going to be that when the TC is finally captured, its not going to be by a horse like this, its going to be by someone who is under the radar before the derby, wins a grinding win by a small margin, isn't impressive and isn't the one people are thinking will win the TC< but he will go on to win it. I think nobody was thinking Real Quiet was a Triple Crown horse, but he was REALLY close to pulling it off. That's the kind of horse that will win it imo.

[Dark Horse]

In spite of all the hype surrounding AP, Firing Line almost certainly would have won had he not forgotten to change leads in the stretch. (I held three winning exacta tickets, but 10-18 instead of 18-10 would have made my day).

[ultracapper]

Got a perfect trip, slow pace, and had gas in the tank down the stretch.

Nice horse.

Even though an 18 horse field played like a 6 horse field for those up front.

He ran the exact same race in the Rebel. I know most tossed that race, but I loved the way he finished that race. I just thought he looked very impressive striding home in the Rebel, and he got pretty much the same kind of run in the KD. Had to apply himself a lot more, but I could tell watching him on that sloppy mess a couple months ago that he had finish to him.

[Robert Goren]

He was "used" quite a bit today. He will need an easy race in the Preakness to have a shot at the Triple Crown. The good news is that his prep races were so easy that he was a fresh horse going into the Derby. At this point I would say he is about a 10/1 to win the Triple Crown.

[Frost king]

American Pharoah has to win one more race and he is Champion three year old and HOY. That has been the established pattern now for awhile. With SB out, Chrome doing the tea and crumpets scene, and the debacle Bayern ran yesterday, the bar is quite low.

[Light]

I'd like to be wrong, but I don't think that this good steed is the next Triple Crown winner.

I agree. When 3 horses can go w-w for 1 1/4 miles in an 18 horse field, there is a bias.

[RXB]

I thought the CD main track was quite fair yesterday. Three good horses and a manageable (not slow) pace is why the Derby played out the way it did, not because of any speed bias.

Last time the top three early finished 1-2-3 in the Derby, the two that ran back in the Preakness finished 1st and 3rd (War Emblem and Proud Citizen).

[dilanesp]

I didn't believe in this horse. But I said in another thread before the race that if he finds another level and wins this race, he's a freak.

I don't think the final time is going to qualify him as a freak though, so let's just say, he's a relative freak. Not an absolute freak. :lol:

I also predicted before the race that if he wins the Derby, finds that next level and becomes a (relative) freak, that he will win the Triple Crown.

Never in my almost 16 years on this board have I ever predicted that the Kentucky Derby winner will win the Triple Crown (at least I don't think I have).

But this horse should not have won this race. Especially not with Firing Line in such good position to defeat him.

AP showed me a lot today. There isn't another horse who can beat him. The only things that can beat AP on the road to the Triple Crown are AP himself, Baffert or Espinoza.

How about 1 1/2 miles, and 3 races in 5 weeks, and freshened horses in the Belmont? Those seem to be the basic elements that do in TC attempts.

Someone will eventually win the TC, but I continue to think betting against TC attempts is basically the best bet in racing.

[Fingal]

He was "used" quite a bit today. He will need an easy race in the Preakness to have a shot at the Triple Crown. The good news is that his prep races were so easy that he was a fresh horse going into the Derby. At this point I would say he is about a 10/1 to win the Triple Crown.

Jay Privman in his Twitter feed said he counted Victor hitting the horse about 32 times from the 5/16th to the wire.

At this point I would say he is about a 10/1 to win the Triple Crown.

On Ebay there's a $10 future book ticket bet on him to do that. Your odds are fairly accurate.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Triple-Crown-Future-Wager-American-Pharoah-/131502114379?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e9e23064b

[Valuist]

I agree. When 3 horses can go w-w for 1 1/4 miles in an 18 horse field, there is a bias.

The other dirt races on the day would say otherwise. Closers actually fared pretty good on the CD dirt.

[Relwob Owner]

The other dirt races on the day would say otherwise. Closers actually fared pretty good on the CD dirt.

Totally agree. The track was extremely fair all day long.