Republicans Fail to Override Obama Veto of Keystone XL Measure

[maddog42]

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/republicans-fail-override-obama-veto-194454762.html;_ylt=AwrBT_wVpPdUACkAakhXNyoA;_ylu= X3oDMTExZzQ0YmY1BGNvbG8DYmYxBHBvcwMxBHZ0aWQDVUlDMV 8xBHNlYwNzYw--

[ArlJim78]

eight democrats voted to override the veto yet the headline is how Republicans failed.

[Tom]

Hey, all those jobs not created will people time at home to clean their computers that have malware because of people like maddog.

Anyone wanna bet he doesn't even have a clue what Keystone is?

[Clocker]

Anyone wanna bet he doesn't even have a clue what Keystone is?

It's the budget brand of beer made by Coors. Any 20-something slacker living in his mother's basement knows that.

[horses4courses]

eight democrats voted to override the veto yet the headline is how Republicans failed.

I agree entirely - it's very "glass half empty"
Should be a more positive tone, like

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B_TR2OlUsAAk_4m.jpg:medium

[Tom]

All those families with no income thank them, too.

And I bet you are proud that he lied through his teeth about it.
Keystone equaled jobs. REAL jobs.

H4C, just why do you hate real American families so much?
What did they do to you?

“I’ve already said I’m happy to look at how we can increase pipeline production for U.S. oil, but Keystone is for Canadian oil to send that down to the Gulf,” Obama told a North Dakota reporter. “It bypasses the United States and is estimated to create a little over 250, maybe 300 permanent jobs. We should be focusing more broadly on American infrastructure for American jobs and American producers, and that’s something that we very much support.” But, as the Post points out, the oil that would flow through Keystone would also come from the North Dakota oil fields. And while construction wouldn’t keep any permanent jobs – few construction projects ever do – it would keep Louisiana refineries busy. Instead, Obama repeated an untruth to stick with his environmentalist dogma.

[maddog42]

Hey, all those jobs not created will people time at home to clean their computers that have malware because of people like maddog.

Anyone wanna bet he doesn't even have a clue what Keystone is?

Intelligence Study Links Low I.Q. To Prejudice, Racism, Conservatism

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/01/27/intelligence-study-links-prejudice_n_1237796.html

[davew]

they should have 2 sets of gas stations

the tree huggers who would gladly pay $6 / gallon or walk

and everyone else who would prefer $2 / gallon

[Hank]

Intelligence Study Links Low I.Q. To Prejudice, Racism, Conservatism

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/01/27/intelligence-study-links-prejudice_n_1237796.html

They could have saved themselves a considerable amount of time and effort by simply observing PA.OT.

[Tom]

Hank, you don't post here enough for that.

[rastajenk]

Yeah, hcap and postieboy and Zilzal and all the other token loons here have been linking to those kinds of reports for years; it's as if there's an agenda to be maintained or something.

[HUSKER55]

as soon as the payoffs are made the project will be back on.

Can the states affected declared states rights and drill anyway?

[JustRalph]

Yeah, hcap and postieboy and Zilzal and all the other token loons here have been linking to those kinds of reports for years; it's as if there's an agenda to be maintained or something.


It's laughable. In the extreme sometimes you have to shake your head. Guys like Ted Cruz get hammered for being a loon even after his Harvard Profs describe him as brilliant. Yet Al Gore and John Kerry are huge figures on the Dem side and they cringe when asked about transcripts etc.

Sheila Jackson Lee is a stalwart of the CBC and gets tons of press. Case closed

[Tom]

UpChuck Schumer yesterday whined that trains hauling oil through the state are dangerous and we need to make critical changes to the way the oil is hauled. Two 100-car trains pass through Rochester every day, hauling oil from Dakota to the Port of Albany.

This came an hour after he voted AGAINST the pipeline.
This oil he is whining about would have gone through the pipeline.


Idiot.

[Clocker]

It's laughable. In the extreme sometimes you have to shake your head. Guys like Ted Cruz get hammered for being a loon even after his Harvard Profs describe him as brilliant. Yet Al Gore and John Kerry are huge figures on the Dem side and they cringe when asked about transcripts etc.


And it's racist to ask about Obama's school records. But Scott Walker left school to go to work, and is thus unqualified for elected office.

[dartman51]

It's laughable. In the extreme sometimes you have to shake your head. Guys like Ted Cruz get hammered for being a loon even after his Harvard Profs describe him as brilliant. Yet Al Gore and John Kerry are huge figures on the Dem side and they cringe when asked about transcripts etc.

Sheila Jackson Lee is a stalwart of the CBC and gets tons of press. Case closed


That shows how low the bar is to be a Democrat. Funny how they expect more from a Republican. Well, maybe not so funny, as I expect more from a Republican. Having been in the Democrat party for many years, I learned not to expect too much from them. :D

[davew]

That shows how low the bar is to be a Democrat. Funny how they expect more from a Republican. Well, maybe not so funny, as I expect more from a Republican. Having been in the Democrat party for many years, I learned not to expect too much from them. :D


If you don't expect much, feel lying and deceit for the greater good is fine, and don't mind that many of your 'leaders' should be in jail, then the democratic party is the best choice.

[dartman51]

If you don't expect much, feel lying and deceit for the greater good is fine, and don't mind that many of your 'leaders' should be in jail, then the democratic party is the best choice.

Actually, what drove me away, as much as anything else, was the constant hatred and vitriol. They like to claim that it's all Repubs, that are that way, but the Dems have had that market cornered for years. You attack a person's policies, and they attack you personally. :eek:

[davew]

and another oil train of 100+ cars derail and catches on fire - this time Illinois.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/freight-train-carrying-crude-oil-derails-near-illinois-city/ar-BBihCaD?ocid=iehp

[reckless]

The train is owned by Warren Buffett, the billionaire poster child for all left wing nuts and phonies. Truth be told, he's the epitome of crony capitalism of the worst order.

People who know the score know that Buffett is the primary mover and shaker behind stopping the Keystone pipeline from being built.

[Tom]

What say yee now, OP? :lol::lol:

[davew]

it looks like after 7 yers of review, 0bamas group is going to reject the application for the keystone pipeline.

it makes since to not use a pipeline when you can use trucks over the road and railroad cars and maybe barges down the Mississippi.

[Tom]

Since when does all this decision making fall into the hand of one single person, of questionable citizenship and shady sexual preferences?

Lots of people NOT going to have jobs, now thank this POS.
I thing this is going to come down to another civil war eventually - deniers vs alarmists.

I hope so....we gots the guns.

[Tom]

it looks like after 7 seconds of review,

More like it.

[_______]

Keystone XL was proposed in 2008 to bypass Midwestern refineries where the original Keystone pipeline continues to deliver about 600,000 bpd of crude originating in Western Canada.

In 2008, there were 9500 carloads of oil on U.S. Class 1 railroads. By 2014 there were more than 493,000. This is the volume equivalent of a 900,000 bpd pipeline. The advantage of rail is the infrastructure is in place and the product can be moved to both east and west coast refineries where new pipelines are not an option. The disadvantage is the high cost compared to pipeline transport.

Other midstream companies have continued projects. Spectra completed its Express pipeline that has been delivering 280,000 bpd from Alberta to pipeline interconnects at Casper, Wyoming since 2013. Enbridge's Alberta Clipper expansion began delivering another 230,000 bpd of Canadian heavy crude to the Midwest this year. KMI's Transmountain expansion will deliver an additional 590,000 bpd to an expanded marine terminal in British Columbia starting in 2018. Enbridge has another pipeline to carry 550,000 bpd to a different terminal in BC also in 2018. And by 2020 TransCanada (of Keystone XL fame) will deliver 1.1 million bpd to Canadian east coast refineries.

The economic argument for Keystone XL did grow weaker over time. But the environmental argument that rejection would diminish development of dirty tar sands has literally fallen in it's face.

Low oil prices (spurred largely by North American Shale a.k.a. fracking) has done more to limit tar sands expansion than blocking a single exit point from a reservoir that is literally spewing oil in all directions.

[reckless]

Since when does all this decision making fall into the hand of one single person, of questionable citizenship and shady sexual preferences?

Lots of people NOT going to have jobs, now thank this POS.
I think this is going to come down to another civil war eventually - deniers vs alarmists.

I hope so....we gots the guns.

Plus the brains and the onions, Tom.

[Robert Goren]

A make work project from the start. It would have had the government take land from its owners and give it to private company with much of the expense of doing it being borne by tax payers, you know the very people whose land was being from them. There was also no real provisions for what would have happened if there was spill. It would been like the BP gulf spill, a mess for everybody as the companies and the government tried to figure out a way to get off as cheaply as possible leaving a lot the victims out in the cold. Furthermore, as it turned out there was never a need for it. There were always better and cheaper alternatives. On top of that the country is moving away from gasoline to power automobiles. In all, the pipeline would have created about 10k temporary jobs. By comparison, legalizing pot in Ohio would have created 30k permanent jobs without any risk to the environment or forcing land owners to sell against their will.

[Tom]

Furthermore, as it turned out there was never a need for it.

There is ALWAYS a need for it.:bang:
You been sampling that Ohio Gold?

[Saratoga_Mike]

There was also no real provisions for what would have happened if there was spill. .

How do pipeline spill rates compare with transporting oil by rail? Right, rail is much riskier. Therefore, your argument is not a good one.

[Greyfox]

Keystone XL was proposed in 2008 to bypass Midwestern refineries where the original Keystone pipeline continues to deliver about 600,000 bpd of crude originating in Western Canada.

In 2008, there were 9500 carloads of oil on U.S. Class 1 railroads. By 2014 there were more than 493,000. This is the volume equivalent of a 900,000 bpd pipeline. The advantage of rail is the infrastructure is in place and the product can be moved to both east and west coast refineries where new pipelines are not an option. The disadvantage is the high cost compared to pipeline transport.

Other midstream companies have continued projects. Spectra completed its Express pipeline that has been delivering 280,000 bpd from Alberta to pipeline interconnects at Casper, Wyoming since 2013. Enbridge's Alberta Clipper expansion began delivering another 230,000 bpd of Canadian heavy crude to the Midwest this year. KMI's Transmountain expansion will deliver an additional 590,000 bpd to an expanded marine terminal in British Columbia starting in 2018. Enbridge has another pipeline to carry 550,000 bpd to a different terminal in BC also in 2018. And by 2020 TransCanada (of Keystone XL fame) will deliver 1.1 million bpd to Canadian east coast refineries.

The economic argument for Keystone XL did grow weaker over time. But the environmental argument that rejection would diminish development of dirty tar sands has literally fallen in it's face.

Low oil prices (spurred largely by North American Shale a.k.a. fracking) has done more to limit tar sands expansion than blocking a single exit point from a reservoir that is literally spewing oil in all directions.

Excellent commentary. :ThmbUp::ThmbUp:

The Alberta Oilsands Oil still flows into the United States every day.
Instead of coming via a pipeline, it comes by rail, which is far more likely to cause an environmental disaster than via pipe.

Earlier this month, the Trans-Canada Pipeline Company, who was supplying the impetus for the pipeline, asked the U.S. State Department to suspend their application for the line.
After 7 years, they'd had enough and the withdrawal was more or less telling Obama to go to hell.
Under Obama's direction, the U.S. State Department refused to allow the Trans-Canada Pipeline Company to withdraw it's application.
They couldn't let the company withdraw the application before Obama took the glory for rejecting it.

Obama's vetoing of the pipeline was not about oil or the environment.
The oil still flows into the United States.
The environment is at greater risk via rail.

"So if the vetoing wasn't about oil or the environment, what was it about?" you ask.

"It was about Obama!" I reply.

Yes, Obama is scheduled to speak at a huge Climate Change Conference in Paris next month.
He needed to reject the pipeline as a feather in his hat to show the "greenies" of the world that his legacy has really been about saving the Planet.
It was all about Obama and his narcissistic needs.

[Clocker]

Obama's vetoing of the pipeline was not about oil or the environment.
The oil still flows into the United States.
The environment is at greater risk via rail.



Some of it will come here, but not nearly as much as would have via a pipeline. The rest of it will now go to China, where it will create a lot more pollution than it would have if used here. So again, in ObamaLand image trumps substance.

[ebcorde]

would do nothing for Americans. Rich people need to stop asking the government for freebies, else I propose eminent domain and take away all their money in the name of the war on Terror. Only fair since they want to take YOUR land

[Saratoga_Mike]

1) would do nothing for Americans. 2) Rich people need to stop asking the government for freebies, else 3) I propose eminent domain and take away all their money in the name of the war on Terror. Only fair since they want to take YOUR land

1) It would create jobs for ordinary Americans.

2) I oppose any type of corporate welfare. But the rich still pay a huge portion of the income tax burden.

3) Of course you do. You're envious. Relative to the guy living on the street, you're rich. I propose we take away all of your money and housing and give it to him.

[Tom]

Hear,Hear!
#3!
#3!
#3!

[Clocker]

3) Of course you do. You're envious. Relative to the guy living on the street, you're rich. I propose we take away all of your money and housing and give it to him.

Charity begins at home. :p

[davew]

It would have had the government take land from its owners and give it to private company with much of the expense of doing it being borne by tax payers, you know the very people whose land was being from them. There was also no real provisions for what would have happened if there was spill. It would been like the BP gulf spill, a mess for everybody as the companies and the government tried to figure out a way to get off as cheaply as possible leaving a lot the victims out in the cold.

There is an oil pipeline going through some land my parents own. No one took away their land and the pipeline is roughly 3 feet down. There is a local construction company that overseas this local stretch. They run machines through the pipe to check for weaknesses. Every once in awhile, they need to check a section and dig up a hole around the pipe. Whenever that happens, they are reimbursed for crop loss.

I am so happy that EPA has set stick coal standards for electricity (40% US electricity from coal?). No there are coal cars running by on the railroad a couple times a day. 140+ cars makes for a slow intersection. The coal is going to BC to export to China. Maybe 00bama can save the world by just making it illegal to mine coal, that would really help with everything - jobs, climate, environment, energy costs/availability,...

Hopefully the next president will not be so transparently anti-American.

[MONEY]

Just for your information, here is a link to a list of the recipients of political contributions made by Norfolk Southern Corp. (The company that transports oil via rail out of Canada.)

http://littlesis.org/person/34844/Charles_Moorman/political

Below are the names of people and entities on the list. You can see the amounts contributed by clicking on the link.

Mark R Warner (D)
E Scott Rigell (R)
Barack Obama (D)
Mitt Romney (R)
Tim Kaine (D)
Tom Carper (D)
Tom Perriello (D)
George Allen (R)
Tommy G Thompson
Jon M Huntsman Jr (R)
Norfolk Southern Corporat...
Forward Together PAC I looked it up, it's (D)
Democratic Party of Virgi.

[Robert Goren]

Some of it will come here, but not nearly as much as would have via a pipeline. The rest of it will now go to China, where it will create a lot more pollution than it would have if used here. So again, in ObamaLand image trumps substance.It was never in plans that any the oil would been used in this country. The plan was to transport crude to the refineries in Texas and Louisiana and ship the refine product to Asia, mostly China. The refineries are running now at near capacity refining crude from Mexico rather than Canada. They do not need the Canadian oil. Some of the crude going into the pipeline was suppose to have been North Dakota crude. I have always had my doubts about any American oil would have made it into the pipeline. Some of it is now being shipped by rail, but a lot of it is being put in storage because of the worldwide gut of oil and the price. In fact a lot of US oil is being put in storage. It is a great time to be the oil storage business, but not great time to be in the mining or drilling business. We may never see $90 barrel oil again.

[Clocker]

The plan was to transport crude to the refineries in Texas and Louisiana and ship the refine product to Asia, mostly China.

That would have meant more income for US companies and a cleaner product going to Asia. So we have a lose/lose for the supposed administration goals of economic growth and reduction of global warming.

[MONEY]

Do any of you know how the pipeline would affect the 1000s of truck drivers that are now moving the oil from the trains to the refineries and to oil tankers?

I think that the pipeline while creating many temporary construction jobs might cause a loss of many more permanent driving jobs.

[_______]

It was never in plans that any the oil would been used in this country. The plan was to transport crude to the refineries in Texas and Louisiana and ship the refine product to Asia, mostly China. The refineries are running now at near capacity refining crude from Mexico rather than Canada. They do not need the Canadian oil. Some of the crude going into the pipeline was suppose to have been North Dakota crude. I have always had my doubts about any American oil would have made it into the pipeline. Some of it is now being shipped by rail, but a lot of it is being put in storage because of the worldwide gut of oil and the price. In fact a lot of US oil is being put in storage. It is a great time to be the oil storage business, but not great time to be in the mining or drilling business. We may never see $90 barrel oil again.

Robert-

Total U.S exports of refined product was just over 2700 bpd last year. It has been increasing very slightly on a year over year basis but the volume of oil Keystone XL would have transported would be enough to refine 100's of multiples of that figure.

It wasn't going to China or anywhere else outside the U.S. Getting the oil straight to the Gulf Coast would have relieved some of the oversupply in Cushing and solved a problem Canadian producers have with pricing. It sells at a significant discount to WTI because of that bottleneck in Cushing.

[davew]

Do any of you know how the pipeline would affect the 1000s of truck drivers that are now moving the oil from the trains to the refineries and to oil tankers?

I think that the pipeline while creating many temporary construction jobs might cause a loss of many more permanent driving jobs.

The train cars go straight to the refineries - no truck driving loss.

Many refineries are close enough to shipping lanes so that no trucks are involved for export.

[Tom]

Do any of you know how the pipeline would affect the 1000s of truck drivers that are now moving the oil from the trains to the refineries and to oil tankers?

I think that the pipeline while creating many temporary construction jobs might cause a loss of many more permanent driving jobs.

As long as NYS is run by democrats, we will always need truckers to move businesses to other states.

[MONEY]

The train cars go straight to the refineries - no truck driving loss.

Many refineries are close enough to shipping lanes so that no trucks are involved for export.
My son is a truck driver & many times he is assigned to pick up crude that is shipped via trains to deliver a refinery.

[rastajenk]

As long as NYS is run by democrats, we will always need truckers to move businesses to other states.Ditto for California. But there won't be much in the way of backhaul.

[davew]

My son is a truck driver & many times he is assigned to pick up crude that is shipped via trains to deliver a refinery.


The that refinery will not be getting a pipeline, and those trucking jobs will remain intact, but maybe hauling from a hub rather than a railcar.

[Hoofless_Wonder]

.... We may never see $90 barrel oil again.

A bold statement. We're enjoying, in theory, what should be a brief respite from higher prices as OPEC attempts to take market share back. The reality of peak oil will kick in some day, though who knows what the real reserves are? It's pretty much a guess except for the owners of the fields.

But I think there's two ways we see higher prices sooner rather than later:

- the forces behind the rigged prices in the markets want/need/push the prices higher
- those crazy Muzzies light off a nuke in Israel

[JustRalph]

Keystone pipeline permit issued today

Finally......

[reckless]

It's already a matter of time before Donald J. Trump gets his mug chiseled in at Mount Rushmore along with our other great US presidents.

https://goo.gl/images/tUVcA9