Your Experience Betting Horses

[Inner Dirt]

First trip to the track was the quarter horses with my step dad at Los Alamitos when I was 14 in 1975. Bet the Harness horses at Hollywood Park, Fairplex Park, Los Alamitos from 1979-1987, or whenever the last So Cal harness meet was held. Also was betting the Southern Cal Thoroughbred circuit at that same time although it seemed harness racing was profitable for me while I lost it back on the Thoroughbreds. In 1986 became a disciple of Andrew Beyer and made my own figures until 1993 when he put them in the Racing Form.

Oddly enough other than a speed biased few weeks at Santa Anita in late 1986 and early 1987, didn't have any good scores till the early 2000's well after all the information I painstakingly complied myself was all right in the form (speed figures, situational trainer statistics, etc).

My biggest failure is lack of patience as I love action. I am at least even or slightly ahead over my life time. If I just bet the tracks and situations where I had an advantage or played small in the bad situations I probably could have banked $10,000 a year for the last 30 years. At 53 I am getting better at control, but still aren't there. My worst habit was setting a minimum amount I wanted to win. I had a win big or go home even attitude. As an example could be $400 up going into the last race. Even if the last race was a mess, instead of playing $20-$50 of exactas or trifectas I would try to make a bet to get over $1,000, even if it meant making a win bet on a shaky 8-5 favorite that if he was in race #1 would not have bet if he was 7-2.

I could ramble on but just on more thing, I am basically pace handicapper who has developed a great method to predict pace no matter if the participants are locals or shippers. I love fishing out the $20 and up horse who wires the field even though he or she appears 10 or more points short of the highest Beyer figure in the race.
My name reflects my favorite track, Aqueduct Inner Dirt as it is usually kind to speed. Any other speed players and what tracks do you like? I think poly tracks suck and am glad they are getting rid of them.

[thaskalos]

I am also 53 years old...and this is the toughest game that I've ever seriously attempted to "master". In order to have a chance at winning, I have to play as perfect a game as I am capable of playing...and I don't want any disturbances around me at any time during my gambling activity. I firmly believe that distractions are the anathema to serious gambling. The way I play, one race can make all the difference...and complete concentration is a must.

If you see a guy with a mountain of losing tickets heaped on his desk, who is constantly whispering into a mini-recorder...then you've spotted me. You are welcomed to come over and say hello...but please don't be offended if I initially appear inhospitable. I am a much friendlier guy in "normal" surroundings. :)

[raybo]

I've told my story several times here, but it is not typical of your average pony player. I discharged from the military in '77 and took a job as a draftsman for a custom millwork company shortly after. One of the guys who worked in the custom shop had been gambling for years, horses and casino (Las Vegas) games. He was also one of the smartest, most absolutely logical, and most profit motivated people I have ever known. By '78 we had become good friends, in his words, "you are the only one in the company I can have an intelligent conversation with". I didn't even know he was a big gambler at that time, I thought he just did it to have good time. Man, was I wrong, this guy was a devout gambler, and spent almost every waking moment outside of work studying and honing his skills. One day I caught him looking at the Daily Racing Form, on lunch hour. I'd never seen one before, or even known what it was. Well, he refused to give me much info about it, or PPs in general. Later after work I asked him why he was so shut mouth about it, and he told me that the game would chew you up and spit you out if you didn't have the right mental, emotional, and psychological characteristics. I mentioned it a few times after that, just because he had aroused my curiosity, I really didn't care for gambling due to my upbringing, but he wouldn't budge. A couple of months later he came into my office and dropped a stack of subsections from the newpaper in Ft Worth (Times Herald) on my drafting table and said, study them. They were horse racing results, that's all, just results. It was well over a month later before he introduced me to the Form. Well, except for 2 day trips to Louisiana Downs, at which I wagered a total of $100 ($50 bankroll each day), I did nothing but study racing for the next 20 years, and collaborated with my "mentor" that whole time. He kept telling me, don't wager significant amounts until you can make a consistent profit on paper. It took that whole 20 years to reach that point. But, when I finally "went live", I started out profitable and have remained that way ever since.

My mentor became one of my employees eventually, when I was promoted to production manager, and at the age of 50, after working for what you would consider low blue collar wages (never more than $17 per hour), he simply stopped working, with over $350k in various money markets and stocks and bonds (I never knew he was an investor either - LOL). He didn't start drawing Social Security until he reached 65, 15 years later, and never worked that whole time, he just invested and gambled. I was his boss and only 3 years younger than him, making a whole lot more money than he ever made, and I couldn't retire until age 62. That tells you how smart and wise he was, and still is.

If not for him, I have no doubt that I would never have bet a dime on racing, or anything else for that matter. And, if not for him and his philosophy and guidance, never would have become profitable in horse racing. I have never bet any other game, and have only bought 2 lottery tickets in my whole life. Recently I did bet, for the first time, one quarter horse race and one harness race, hitting small superfectas in both of them, straight off the tote board, no handicapping at all, just watching the betting action and structuring my tickets soundly. I have been a superfecta bettor, exclusively, until I created my Black Box program a couple of years ago, which I now use for cash flow in support of my superfecta play. I'm a specialist, and wouldn't have it any other way.

[jahura2]

58 yrs old here and have been going to the track here in Central Ky. since I was 13. Learned from a couple of great mentors that bet full time and are profitable but I do not have the constitution for that, and besides i need to work full time to provide for the family. I will never "master" the game as Thask mentioned, but am constantly learning from experiences and other players. I love the handicapping process, form, Bris, timeform are all in play. I most of all love the solitary aspect and have done much better since eliminating all social distractions. To top it all off, I love the sport itself, spent a year on the backside at Keeneland grooming for John Ward and learned a whole other side of the game. It just drew me in more.
I consider myself a good player with lots of room for improvement. I no longer play "action" bets and stick to WP bets, exactas and and p3's (sometimes). Have finished on the positive side the last 3 years due to my increased patience which has been the key for me.
I don't bet cheap tracks and stick to the likes of GP, AQU, Belmont, KEE,Saratoga, FG and OP. Have never quite got the feel for SA and Del Mar.
As hard as the game is and with as many highs and lows I will play 'til the day I drop!

[Inner Dirt]

Never got the feel for Del Mar and Santa Anita? I lost the feeling for them. I used to live in Southern California. Santa Anita and Del Mar were decent before they put in the poly tracks, but the poly tracks produced too many races where the outcomes were unexplainable. I can handle one or two of those a card but more than that and it is time to stay away. Santa Anita went back to dirt but the place became a graveyard for anyone who was part of the early pace no matter how slow or unpressed they were. They would not lose by a lot but someone would nail them late. Del Mar is scheduled to go back to dirt this year. They used to only race in the summer but have more dates since Hollywood Park closed.

[mountainman]

57...a second generation horseplayer..started handicapping at 10 and wagering at 12

[thaskalos]

57...a second generation horseplayer..started handicapping at 10 and wagering at 12

And your advice to a struggling beginner? :)

[mountainman]

And your advice to a struggling beginner? :)
lol...I've learned more here from guys like you than they could ever learn from me...

[zico20]

I am 46 years old. I started going to the track when I was 5 with my dad, a lifelong horse player. I never bet every race at Fairmount, my home track. I just fell in love with horse racing at an early age and never felt compelled to bet. I could just go and watch, which still holds true today. I love handicapping races even though I know I won't bet.

I went to college in south Florida in the early 90s. I was poor, like all college kids. I was at Hialeah and had a few hundred bucks in my pocket. I was going to put 200 to win on a horse that I thought could not lose. He was even money. I heard one guy talking to another. He said the trifecta was all 2-4-5 straight. The 2 was my horse. So I put 200 to win and played a 40 tri 2-4-5. The 2 won by 6, the 4 was second by about 7 and the 5 was 3rd by 8 or so lengths. The trifecta paid 51.00 dollars and I walked out of there with over a grand thanks to that guy. I could not believe you could bet 40 dollars and win a grand. Ever since that day I started playing trifectas until the superfecta came about. Today, all I play are supers with some trifecta and the occasional win bet.

My patience level is second to none. I can go to the track at 11.00 AM and stay til midnight and not make a single bet. Unless I love a race I generally do not bet. The only track I follow is Fairmount. There are a few tracks I won't ever bet because I could not pick a winner if they ran 1000 match races. I look over every card and see if there are any potential races where I can play the super numerous times.

My method will never change. I like betting supers, that is where the money is at. Picking 6 winners in a row for me is next to impossible, hence I don't play horizontal wagers.

[ReplayRandall]

Zico, how did Fairmount come up with their 2 day-a-week 2015 racing schedule of Tues and Sat.?

[illinoisbred]

I am 58 years old. I've been going to races since a small child in the early 60's...Arlington, Hawthorne,even a few trips to the extinct Washington Park.Started playing in earnest in 1982 after spending the winter in New Orleans at Fair Grounds in the company of someone who at that time was seriously playing the game. I've made my own speed figures since 82..just for the Chicago area tracks. Probably around 1990,I began making pace figures too after scratching my head why so many big figure horses lose. Pace figures became a work in progress for many years..constantly tweaking them in an attempt to improve them and my results. The last 15 years or so I've been incorporating form cycles into the equation more and have had some good years,bad years,fantastic meets,abyssmal meets. I sincerely believe it's tragic just how far Arlington Park has fallen in stature from what it was in my youth. I detest polytrack..don't play many races on it and am at the point I'm slowly severing the ties that bind..moving away from my comfort zone to play other tracks. I've played Oaklawn for the past 2 seasons and love it! Thinking about taking on Indiana Downs or Grand this year to bump up my activity. Seriously considering a move away from the Illinois product to a different circuit in a year or 2 from now.

[Robert Goren]

I am 66 years old. Started betting between junior and senior year in high school. Picked a winner in the third race I bet and have never been behind since. My Dad went to the track a lot and through him I met some horsemen and a few other gamblers including Roy Landis who raised 8 kids by betting horses on the Nebraska circuit in 1950s and 1960s. I learn quite bit from those old gamblers and horsemen although I had to a lot of separating the wheat from the chaff. I work as part-time teller during college. During those college years I saw some gamblers doing new things that a few years later there were books written about including a guy who did something very close to what Beyer was later to write about. I never thought I could making a living betting the horses. Way too much stress for me to handle and I knew it. It has always been a time intensive hobby for me. I have always been a handicapper as oppose to a system player. The few attempts to develop a system with one or two exceptions were bad. One was a multi-regression I did that work pretty well until training methods changed in the late 1980s. It basically picked horses who ran a lot of times during the year. Nebraska was a pretty good to me when I was making my own speed ratings, because there I believe only one other person doing it, until Beyers got printed in the DRF. I started keep track of trainer moves and that was a lot of my profit. I also developed a knack for spotting something fishy in the PPS. I made a little money when youbet first started with that. I got promotion at work and did not bet the ponies much for several years when online poker was halted and my health force me into retirement.. I now bet a little, very little actually on NYRA races. I am currently working on a project which discovers "smart" money being bet and how it effects the chances of horse to win. It has been slow going. I have always been more of a "theory" man than a bettor.

[Stoleitbreezing]

I'm 31 years old and have been playing the horses since I was 16. I grew up in IL and was hooked on the sport of kings when a school brought in a program from Balmoral Park and told me to pick a winner. He took me to the track a couple of times and I loved the experience. After that I started going by myself and hit my first trifecta before I hit the exacta. I've been a regular horse player since, and enjoy the derby trail every year.

I recently moved to South Eastern Wisconsin after I got married, but I'm still close enough to make the trip to the OTB in Illinois or attend the Arlington Park meeting. I follow the sport daily and just last year got involved in a syndicate and have a minority interest in a 3YO filly set to debut in IL later this year.

I would consider myself more of a speed guy and prefer the longshot front runners then the closers. I continue to try to improve my game researching meetings and reading books, but still have more to explore. My best races are maiden and slop races and look for my key in those races.

Most of my "track buddies" are from the older crowd and its somewhat sad the younger generation is few and far between when I make it to the track or to the parlor. I hope the industry figures out a way to attract and advertise to my generation and younger to keep the game relevant before its too late.

[zico20]

Zico, how did Fairmount come up with their 2 day-a-week 2015 racing schedule of Tues and Sat.?

This is the way they have started out for a while now. Then when summer hits they go to three days a week til then end of August or so when they revert back to two days a week. The IL racing board only give FP so many dates and it needs to be spread out over 6 months. I wish they would have more than 8 races a card, but the horse population doesn't support it.

I don't bet much money during the early part since a lot of horses have not ran in months. Yes, I know which trainers have their horses ready and which ones don't, but hitting tris is tricky at this time of the year. Plus the field sizes get much smaller when they go to three days a week. Same as in Sept. when they drop back down. Field sizes go back up. Hitting tris becomes more difficult.

In the summer, field sizes have averaged 6 horses for quite a few years now. Usually two horses are easily tossed in the summer, leaving 4 horses to contend for three spots. Picking the winner in 4 of 8 races is usually quite obvious. And it isn't always the favorite. Lots of time the second choice looks like a clear winner.

One last thing. Trifectas pay incredible at Fairmount. I hit a ton of tris that pay 25-30 bucks for a two dollar bet. At other tracks these tris would pay 10-15. Mountaineer comes to mind. I don't know why this is. Maybe the barn money doesn't bet tris like they do at other smaller tracks. Yes, there is the occasional 12 tri at FP, but those are generally 5 horse fields with a 1-5 winner. My only regret is that there isn't enough money in the pools to make a killing. I never bet more than 40 dollar straight tris. If Fairmount had bigger pool sizes I would play 200 straight sometimes. Yes, they are that easy if you do the work.

Fairmount runs more 25 trifectas in a week than the entire state of New York runs in a calendar year. I hope it continues this year with Hernandez gone.

[Stoleitbreezing]

This is the way they have started out for a while now. Then when summer hits they go to three days a week til then end of August or so when they revert back to two days a week. The IL racing board only give FP so many dates and it needs to be spread out over 6 months. I wish they would have more than 8 races a card, but the horse population doesn't support it.

I don't bet much money during the early part since a lot of horses have not ran in months. Yes, I know which trainers have their horses ready and which ones don't, but hitting tris is tricky at this time of the year. Plus the field sizes get much smaller when they go to three days a week. Same as in Sept. when they drop back down. Field sizes go back up. Hitting tris becomes more difficult.

In the summer, field sizes have averaged 6 horses for quite a few years now. Usually two horses are easily tossed in the summer, leaving 4 horses to contend for three spots. Picking the winner in 4 of 8 races is usually quite obvious. And it isn't always the favorite. Lots of time the second choice looks like a clear winner.

One last thing. Trifectas pay incredible at Fairmount. I hit a ton of tris that pay 25-30 bucks for a two dollar bet. At other tracks these tris would pay 10-15. Mountaineer comes to mind. I don't know why this is. Maybe the barn money doesn't bet tris like they do at other smaller tracks. Yes, there is the occasional 12 tri at FP, but those are generally 5 horse fields with a 1-5 winner. My only regret is that there isn't enough money in the pools to make a killing. I never bet more than 40 dollar straight tris. If Fairmount had bigger pool sizes I would play 200 straight sometimes. Yes, they are that easy if you do the work.

Fairmount runs more 25 trifectas in a week than the entire state of New York runs in a calendar year. I hope it continues this year with Hernandez gone.

I like playing this track as it generally plays to my strength which is early speed and it also seems to be one of the most formful tracks i've handicapped. Like the previous poster you can get a lot of value playing the 2nd or 3 favorite. If betting heavy on a 3-1 or 7/2 is your thing, playing Fairmount is a good idea.

I only played this track live a couple of times on my way back from a trip to Churchill downs. Its been a few years since then, but I remember there being bars on the teller windows and the place being sort of a mess. Hopefully that has changed since then. Still a fun time though.

[Ocala Mike]

I'm 73 years old, and I placed my first bet through my older brother at Jamaica Race Course, 1957. Couldn't get in the track because minors weren't allowed in those days, and I was only 15. The horse was ridden by "Irish" John Ruane, and it won and paid $15.00. Quit for the day, and I've been struggling for 58 years to duplicate that ROI!

I used to watch the races there from my bicycle through the fence gates. Jamaica closed in 1959 when the "Big A" opened.

[lamboguy]

i can't believe its been this long, i have been a full time horse bettor for about 45 years. i actually had a Chevy dealership before the FTC closed me up and then a national car leasing business before i sold it in the early 80's and i also promoted rock shows and theatre for awhile, and rented out portable dressing rooms in outdoor venues including Belmont Park. other than that i was a pinhooker and a bettor. i did great the times that i spent in the race books in nevada before they went pari mutuel. i did ok with the advent of comingled simulcast for awhile too. i started betting from my house in 2000 and did ok for about 5 years. i only started to consistently lose the last 4 years. for sure the game has fast forwarded to much for my weak brain cells and i probably will never win at it again. i backed way up too, i am now only about $1 million a year player from some very small bets. at this point, i really don't know to much else, so that's why i still go through the motions every single day.

[arno]

I am 63 so you can say I am of average age on this forum.
Started at 17 in 1968.
How many can say their first bet was on a driver born in the 19th century.
Earl Avery was born in 1894.
He won the first race that night and Loosh won the 2nd 3-8 double that paid 83.

[thaskalos]

I am 63 so you can say I am of average age on this forum.
Started at 17 in 1968.
How many can say their first bet was on a driver born in the 19th century.
Earl Avery was born in 1894.
He won the first race that night and Loosh won the 2nd 3-8 double that paid 83.
And yet...you probably don't remember what you had for breakfast yesterday morning. :)

[Inner Dirt]

I thought I would at least run into one person who had something in common with me by now. The closest one is the guy who played in the Vegas books before OTB. I usually played Black Jack when I drove the 250 miles to Vegas back then. They didn't book the California harness racing I liked at the time and the odd payout limits were pretty restrictive if you played long shots.
Wonder how long it will take someone to show up that went to Tijuana, Mexico and played at Agua Caliente (Thoroughbred track closed in 1991, still running dogs) they had a lot of simulcasting and you could bet sports, before OTBs hit California.

[Stoleitbreezing]

I thought I would at least run into one person who had something in common with me by now. The closest one is the guy who played in the Vegas books before OTB. I usually played Black Jack when I drove the 250 miles to Vegas back then. They didn't book the California harness racing I liked at the time and the odd payout limits were pretty restrictive if you played long shots.
Wonder how long it will take someone to show up that went to Tijuana, Mexico and played at Agua Caliente (Thoroughbred track closed in 1991, still running dogs) they had a lot of simulcasting and you could bet sports, before OTBs hit California.

That's a long drive for sure. Wow.

I complain now because I drive 35 minutes now to get to an OTB since moving to Kenosha Wisconsin last year. lol. I guess I don't realize how difficult it used to be to make a wager.

I'm wondering if there is anyone in there 30s here like me?

[thespaah]

I really got going when the Meadowlands opened in 1976.
I started going to the Big M when the harness meet opened, I was hooked.
Then that summer I got my first taste of Saratoga.
I've never been a huge winner or loser at the track. I learned early that sticking to a budget and managing my money properly was the best way to keep from getting killed even on days when I all I did was toss losing tickets into the trash.
I have never hit a signer. The only time I had one, I got pulled down in a pick 4 at Roosevelt.
Others here have described their style/methods. I am an angles player. I am the person who sees things that other people overlook.
I am usually with others when I go to the track, but my best handicapping is done when I'm solo.
One of my best evenings was during the Thoroughbred meet at Meadowlands.
I was attending classes at Bergen Community College. We got out at 8:30 so i decided to head down the road 15 mins to the track. I walked in with like $25 bucks in my pocket. I was going to bet just a couple races I had looked over earlier in the day.
I walked out with a few hundred. Weird.
Anyway, I'm right in the middle of the demo here at age 54.

[zico20]

I like playing this track as it generally plays to my strength which is early speed and it also seems to be one of the most formful tracks i've handicapped. Like the previous poster you can get a lot of value playing the 2nd or 3 favorite. If betting heavy on a 3-1 or 7/2 is your thing, playing Fairmount is a good idea.

I only played this track live a couple of times on my way back from a trip to Churchill downs. Its been a few years since then, but I remember there being bars on the teller windows and the place being sort of a mess. Hopefully that has changed since then. Still a fun time though.

In the grandstand there are still bars on the windows. During live racing the floor is littered with tickets. However, the clubhouse 2nd and 3rd floors do NOT have bars on the teller. But the ironic thing is now you don't have to pay extra to get into the clubhouse. People freely move back and forth.

Fairmount is the most formful track in the country. EMD4ME calls Emerald the most formful. This year I will scrutinize Emerald on a daily basis to check it out.

For a small track there is basically no track bias. All last summer there was only about two days where there was a faster track that really favored speed.

As far as handicapping goes, what I find remarkable is that almost every race every horse is where they should be after the first 1/4. None of this crap like at other tracks where 2 speed horses are figured at 45 flat and one is out there all alone in 46 flat. Fairmount has terrible jockeys, lets be honest, but somehow they pretty much all know where to place a horse at the start of the race.

[tanner12oz]

First bet..smarty Jones Belmont loser of course. Had no clue wtf I was doing and think I made like 2 $10 straight tri bets.

first live race...afleet Alex preakness

first big score...blame beating zenyatta

[EMD4ME]

I am also 53 years old...and this is the toughest game that I've ever seriously attempted to "master". In order to have a chance at winning, I have to play as perfect a game as I am capable of playing...and I don't want any disturbances around me at any time during my gambling activity. I firmly believe that distractions are the anathema to serious gambling. The way I play, one race can make all the difference...and complete concentration is a must.

If you see a guy with a mountain of losing tickets heaped on his desk, who is constantly whispering into a mini-recorder...then you've spotted me. You are welcomed to come over and say hello...but please don't be offended if I initially appear inhospitable. I am a much friendlier guy in "normal" surroundings. :)

Do you remember when Tony Calo would say "He's Anti-Social on the front end today" when describing a horse who was committed to the lead and repulsed all pace challenges?

I am the same way as you at the track. I have my tablet out, after the race is over, I am scribbling notes in preparation of watching the replay (pan and head on) and I'm taking notes, ready to be implemented into formulator.

God forbid, someone comes over and wants to have a conversation with me, I'd ignore them 3x until I have to say SHUT UP, IM BUSY LOL.

Here's a long story in reply to your 'distractions'. April 19, 2010. I for once decided to play from home as the on track distractors are annoying the Sh@t out of me. I have 18 pick 6 tickets (similar to the way Christ plays) ready. I was singled in the first leg and wanted to see if the horse would take money (Lukewarm ML chalk). 5 min to post. I start punching. At 3 min to post, the doorbell rings. Unbeknownst to me, it's my aunt with a surprise visit. In a 1/2 a second, I already see what would happen if I A)open the door or B) Make her wait. There is no decision. I keep punching, stay focused. She rings the loud bell 50 times. I stay focused. 3 tickets left, half the field loaded. I get the last bet in as the last horse loads.


6 races later, the 18th ticket wins, $52,000 sole winner of pick 6.

Yes, I opened the door but only AFTER the single crossed the wire first. :lol:

If I would've taken 2 seconds to think about answering the door, I am $52,000 poorer. :bang:

You can not be distracted while playing horses. PERIOD.

[lamboguy]

That's a long drive for sure. Wow.

I complain now because I drive 35 minutes now to get to an OTB since moving to Kenosha Wisconsin last year. lol. I guess I don't realize how difficult it used to be to make a wager.

I'm wondering if there is anyone in there 30s here like me?do they still have dog racing in Kenosha?

[EMD4ME]

That's a long drive for sure. Wow.

I complain now because I drive 35 minutes now to get to an OTB since moving to Kenosha Wisconsin last year. lol. I guess I don't realize how difficult it used to be to make a wager.

I'm wondering if there is anyone in there 30s here like me?

38 here pal. I started handicapping at 4. Was a math child. Saw a program, did turn times at CT's 4 1/2 F races in 1980. The good old days!

[EMD4ME]

In the grandstand there are still bars on the windows. During live racing the floor is littered with tickets. However, the clubhouse 2nd and 3rd floors do NOT have bars on the teller. But the ironic thing is now you don't have to pay extra to get into the clubhouse. People freely move back and forth.

Fairmount is the most formful track in the country. EMD4ME calls Emerald the most formful. This year I will scrutinize Emerald on a daily basis to check it out.

For a small track there is basically no track bias. All last summer there was only about two days where there was a faster track that really favored speed.

As far as handicapping goes, what I find remarkable is that almost every race every horse is where they should be after the first 1/4. None of this crap like at other tracks where 2 speed horses are figured at 45 flat and one is out there all alone in 46 flat. Fairmount has terrible jockeys, lets be honest, but somehow they pretty much all know where to place a horse at the start of the race.

Hey Zico. I wouldn't mind if FP is the most formful track and EMD is 2nd. I thank you for trying to turn me on to it. We all need bankroll building tracks and I love a small track that is formful.

[River11]

Fairmount has terrible jockeys, lets be honest, but somehow they pretty much all know where to place a horse at the start of the race.

Guess the days of David Gall, Ray Landing and Emide Hinohosa are long gone.
In the 70's I was a regular at Cahokia Downs a track about 10 miles from Fairmont, it was a 3/4 mile track and love playing it.

[EMD4ME]

Guess the days of David Gall, Ray Landing and Emide Hinohosa are long gone.
In the 70's I was a regular at Cahokia Downs a track about 10 miles from Fairmont, it was a 3/4 mile track and love playing it.

Tom Durkin started there!!!!!!!!

[Inner Dirt]

Used to go to what was called Pomona (California fair circuit) at the time in the early 80's before OTB in the state. They held a 3 week meet at the end of summer and admission to the track was free with fair admission. Probably the pools had the largest shares of novice money anywhere. It was a 1/2 mile track they later lengthened it to 5/8 and called it Fairplex, it recently closed.

[thaskalos]

Tom Durkin started there!!!!!!!!

Who?

[Stoleitbreezing]

do they still have dog racing in Kenosha?

It closed back in 2009 due to decreased handle and attendence. They haven't done any construction there yet so you never know what can happen in the future. I went there with my father before it closed and had a nice time watching the dogs race.

[Stillriledup]

Who?

The name sounds vaguely familiar....he might have been an employee in the racing industry recently but now he's no longer working in game? Not sure.

[Stoleitbreezing]

I really got going when the Meadowlands opened in 1976.
I started going to the Big M when the harness meet opened, I was hooked.
Then that summer I got my first taste of Saratoga.
I've never been a huge winner or loser at the track. I learned early that sticking to a budget and managing my money properly was the best way to keep from getting killed even on days when I all I did was toss losing tickets into the trash.
I have never hit a signer. The only time I had one, I got pulled down in a pick 4 at Roosevelt.
Others here have described their style/methods. I am an angles player. I am the person who sees things that other people overlook.
I am usually with others when I go to the track, but my best handicapping is done when I'm solo.
One of my best evenings was during the Thoroughbred meet at Meadowlands.
I was attending classes at Bergen Community College. We got out at 8:30 so i decided to head down the road 15 mins to the track. I walked in with like $25 bucks in my pocket. I was going to bet just a couple races I had looked over earlier in the day.
I walked out with a few hundred. Weird.
Anyway, I'm right in the middle of the demo here at age 54.

I've only hit one signer so far and it was several years ago. I was down a few hundred dollars at the time and I had about $30 left to play one more race at Turfway. I was there for 7hrs plus and clearly frustrated. Till this day I've not done this method of handicapping. It was a field of 9 low level claimers. For some reason as I was handicapping I crossed out completely the 5 horses I didn't like as if they were a true scratch. Usually I will make a much smaller notation so when I take the program home I know they raced. Anyway, a couple minutes to post I box my top 4 in the exacta. $12 for $1. $5 win #4. 0 mins to post I decided to play the super. I never really play the super due to the difficulty and cost, but I felt very confident in my analysis of the race. Before they left the gate I punched in 4, 2, 3, 8

I liked the 2 for his speed, 4 I felt would win, 3 was the longshot that liked to nibble for 3rd and the 8 was the 9/5 chalk ridden by Greta Kuntzweiler. Route race unfolded as I had thought 2 was on the early lead, 4 stalked from 2nd 3 was several lengths back in 3rd and the 8 was in 4th. The rest of the Field was not even in the picture. Like trained pigs my horses followed one another entering the far turn I was not thinking about my super ticket and was just grateful I was going to cash my exacta box for decent money. Near the wire the 4 angled out and appeared to just nail the 2 in the last jump. I mumbled "I think I just hit that super". I agonized the photo for what seemed like forever. They finally put up my numbers 4, 2, 3, 8

I asked another player next to me how much it was going to pay as I never play supers. He thought for a moment and said "about a thousand, you have it for a dollar right?" "No I have it for $2!" He couldn't believe it and thought I played a quickpick and got lucky until I showed him my program and other tickets.

$2 super 2,292.80!

I'm still looking to break my NL2 but admit I don't play the horizontal wagers or have the bankroll to really go for it. Here's to hoping for that next Great Day in the Sun!

[PIC6SIX]

Where do you play, Hawthorne, Arlington or somewhere else? Will you also be at the NHC this weekend?

[Ocala Mike]

Loosh won the 2nd 3-8 double that paid 83.



Ah, yes, we used to call him "linguini lines" Lucien Fontaine. It's all coming back to me now.

[Zaf]

Great thread, love the stories, at 15 years old was exposed to NYC OTB and Aqueduct. Hooked from that point on.

53 years old, What do i love about racing ? EVERYTHING :)

Z

[dnlgfnk]

Tom Durkin started there!!!!!!!!

Durkin was great, but his first call at Cahokia was somewhat effeminate..."And now...they're all in", and everybody around me laughed. Dave Gall could have ridden successfully anywhere- a supreme judge of pace. I dunno...Fairmount pools have been too small for me since intrastate betting became possible there in'88...but my new strategy (on paper) of emphasizing exactas, rather than trying to hit supers or pick 4's once or twice, may make it a possibility again.

57 yrs.

1975-79) Basically slavishly followed Beyer & "Picking Winners" approach. Grinded out a profit the one yr. I kept detailed records but I'm sure the ROI was minute.

'80's) Became fascinated by Beyer's "Charlie", explored all avenues that explained race results in terms of pace and placement on the track (visual judgement, making a visual chart of the DRF charts--plotting positions at each qtr., etc--, retroactively speculating the pace based upon finish) A big figure was theoretically an easy trip--a low fig was a difficult trip.
In Nov. '80, hit a 5 figure double at Fairmount by emphasizing a 7-1 and 50-1 shot. Headed for Hot Springs in Feb. '81...packed my bags for home one month later when Deserving Don blew a daylight lead in the stretch Mar. 7, 1981 at 17-1, burning up my $450. Couldn't pull the trigger trying to be a pro
in '81-'82, too scared.

'90's) Marriage and children. Became much more casual at the window, but intensely speculated about how the dynamics of the early stages determined the finish of races. Quit all sports cold turkey to solidify my knowledge of scripture and apologetics from Aug '98 to Jan. '03.

Feb '03 until discovering this forum) continued speculations about trips determining outcomes. The higher the figure, the more suspicious I am that it was the result of an easy trip. Essentially, "It's not how fast the horse runs. It's how he runs fast that counts".

From this forum, I have gained a far better appreciation for "playing the percentages", mostly due to the various tables presented occasionally which prove the public's expertise at setting the probabilities. I now know that my poor figure (equals bad trip) 15-1 shot who has a potentially better trip today doesn't become the favorite in my mind anymore--he now has perhaps an 8 to 10 % chance, rather than a 5% chance.

The second major factor in adjusting my approach came from the Benter discussions here. Trip handicapping wasn't the be-all and end-all of knowing something the public doesn't know. It was one aspect of a comprehensive approach, and one can win using public data, if only interpreted differently (the favorite loses 65%, etc.), even with a non-technical use of the data.

[raybo]

I didn't mention my age in my original post, I'm 66 (I think! Try not to think about age much - LOL), going on 30! :lol: (still dirt bike on a '97 CR125 MX bike)

[zico20]

I didn't mention my age in my original post, I'm 66 (I think! Try not to think about age much - LOL), going on 30! :lol: (still dirt bike on a '97 CR125 MX bike)

That just leaves Lamboguy to tell us how old he is. He left that out! Raybo, nice to see you are still active at your age. I am 46, look 35, act 25, feel 20. I still can kick almost every 20 yr olds' ass at anything. Yes, I am lucky and I know it!

[Inner Dirt]

Great thread, love the stories, at 15 years old was exposed to NYC OTB and Aqueduct. Hooked from that point on.

53 years old, What do i love about racing ? EVERYTHING :)

Z

OTB in NY in 1976? California didn't have OTB until 1986 or so and they still were basically simulcasting NO Cal races to SO Cal and vice versa.

[Zaf]

OTB in NY in 1976? California didn't have OTB until 1986 or so and they still were basically simulcasting NO Cal races to SO Cal and vice versa.


Yes we had OTB, we stood in the branch and waited for letters to go up, no video , no race call,

Win : A
Place: E
Show: H

:lol:

Z

[raybo]

That just leaves Lamboguy to tell us how old he is. He left that out! Raybo, nice to see you are still active at your age. I am 46, look 35, act 25, feel 20. I still can kick almost every 20 yr olds' ass at anything. Yes, I am lucky and I know it!

LOL, I'm glad I said "I think", I just put my birthdate and my next birthday in Excel, and it told me I will be 66 in May, so I'm only 65 right now, whooppeeee! :faint:

Of course, there's a dark side to that, when you can't remember how old you are, you're getting really old! :bang:

[proximity]

armed with (current track announcer) john bogar's harrisburg patriot news picks i headed out to penn national with some friends in the spring of 1989 to bet "bogar's best bet" stacy's bubbles.

#7 with the then red saddle cloth.

"looks like the one," commented bogar.

in what i think was a 1m 70y race stacy's bubbles broke towards the rear and i expressed concern to a friend, who having experienced his first live card just a week earlier, was the veteran of our group.

"they won't stay like that," my friend reassured me.

they stayed like that. ;)

[thaskalos]

That just leaves Lamboguy to tell us how old he is. He left that out! Raybo, nice to see you are still active at your age. I am 46, look 35, act 25, feel 20. I still can kick almost every 20 yr olds' ass at anything. Yes, I am lucky and I know it!

Gee...I hope you don't hold a grudge against me because of my atheistic views. :)

[PaceAdvantage]

Yes we had OTB, we stood in the branch and waited for letters to go up, no video , no race call,

Win : A
Place: E
Show: H

:lol:

ZRemember having to bet by "letter code" at an OTB? And horseplayers complain about having to jump through hoops TODAY... :lol: :lol: :lol:

We've never really had it so good... :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[plainolebill]

I went to Hollywood Park a few times with family members when I was a teenager in the 50's but didn't really get hooked on racing until the early 1970's going to Longacres pretty regularly and to Portland Meadows in the winter.

When I retired from the service in 1989 I took a few years off from racing but as soon as they opened an OTB nearby I started going there a couple of times a week. Not too long after that I discovered the DRF Online (ITS) and Phonebet.

I've been betting from home for more than 20 years, almost every day they run in Socal. Over the past few years I've slowly changed from win betting longshots and covering them in the exacta to primarily an exacta bettor with about 20% tris. I've learned a lot from this forum, Dave Schwartz' videos, the Equisim group, etc. I'm a better player today than I've ever been.

[Inner Dirt]

Remember having to bet by "letter code" at an OTB? And horseplayers complain about having to jump through hoops TODAY... :lol: :lol: :lol:

We've never really had it so good... :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

A lot changed between 1975 when my step dad took me to Los Alamitos and 1979 when I was 18 and legally old enough to bet the horses. In 1975 you had separate windows for bet denominations and you had to go to a separate window to bet exactas. I think California was the last to allow trifecta wagering. In 1979 you had WPS, exacta, and one daily double on races 1 and 2.

[illinoisbred]

A lot changed between 1975 when my step dad took me to Los Alamitos and 1979 when I was 18 and legally old enough to bet the horses. In 1975 you had separate windows for bet denominations and you had to go to a separate window to bet exactas. I think California was the last to allow trifecta wagering. In 1979 you had WPS, exacta, and one daily double on races 1 and 2.
I remember when the Chicago area tracks offered the daily double on the 1st and 2nd and a trifecta on the 9th. There was a sprinkling of perfectas and quinellas offered on some other races. Same with the windows..a $2,$5,$10,$20. Can't recall at Arlington but Sportsmans had a $100 window.. a boxed off wooden structure for privacy.

[Robert Goren]

I remember when the Chicago area tracks offered the daily double on the 1st and 2nd and a trifecta on the 9th. There was a sprinkling of perfectas and quinellas offered on some other races. Same with the windows..a $2,$5,$10,$20. Can't recall at Arlington but Sportsmans had a $100 window.. a boxed off wooden structure for privacy.I think most tracks had a $50 window boxed off. There were $2, 5, $10 Win Place Show, combo widows. DD were sold before the first race then the DD sellers switched stations and became cashiers. When exacta were first introduced, they were only the last race and they used some of the other sellers to sell them, generally place and show sellers. It was a mess. I was $5 place seller. I had to pay for my shorts and they kept my longs. At $2.20 an hour, I did not want to be short. I believe if you were short 4 times, they fired you. A lot of horsemen's wives worked the windows. You had to know somebody to get the job. Somehow my dad got me on.

[illinoisbred]

I think most tracks had a $50 window boxed off. There were $2, 5, $10 Win Place Show, combo widows. DD were sold before the first race then the DD sellers switched stations and became cashiers. When exacta were first introduced, they were only the last race and they used some of the other sellers to sell them, generally place and show sellers. It was a mess. I was $5 place seller. I had to pay for my shorts and they kept my longs. At $2.20 an hour, I did not want to be short. I believe if you were short 4 times, they fired you. A lot of horsemen's wives worked the windows. You had to know somebody to get the job. Somehow my dad got me on.
You're right...I forgot about the separate windows for place and show betting.

[Overlay]

See the author page at http://www.amazon.com/Tim-Maas/e/B002WRJRT4/ref=dp_byline_cont_pop_book_1

[wisconsin]

I remember when the Chicago area tracks offered the daily double on the 1st and 2nd and a trifecta on the 9th. There was a sprinkling of perfectas and quinellas offered on some other races. Same with the windows..a $2,$5,$10,$20. Can't recall at Arlington but Sportsmans had a $100 window.. a boxed off wooden structure for privacy.

And a guy 2nd floor grandstand that worked in the john barking out "Cleeeaaaaan Seat" Those were the days I truly miss.

[joeprunes]

Be 80 in march ,playing 60 yrs. Love old type capping,the form. I`m a pace close type of player, cj made it easy for my capping. Yeh tough game cant complain done well at times. Golfing is sooo much harder............

[illinoisbred]

And a guy 2nd floor grandstand that worked in the john barking out "Cleeeaaaaan Seat" Those were the days I truly miss.
Remember the guy that sold peanuts in the shell outside of the paddock gate every day.."Get your supper here!"

[thaskalos]

See the author page at http://www.amazon.com/Tim-Maas/e/B002WRJRT4/ref=dp_byline_cont_pop_book_1

I have read the author page, Tim...and I am a little confused.

Let me preface this by saying that I bought your products years ago, and I am very satisfied with my purchase. Yours was the best-presented handicapping material that I've ever gotten through the mail...and it made me think about this game in a new way. But I don't understand how you could think that, since your material is used to create a "line" instead of picking a horse, you don't have to worry about your product losing its effectiveness with the passage of time...as more players get their hands on it.

You say..."And, because my method calculated winning chances for every horse in a race, I no longer had to worry about it ever becoming obsolete or unprofitable through overbetting of any one particular horse, as had happened with all the earlier "pick-the-winner" systems that I had tried. I was now free to offer my findings to other handicappers, with no concerns about whether such distribution would adversely affect their future use by me."

Yes...the nature of your method means that no one individual horse could be overbet, because such an occurrence would mean that some other horse(s) would then become a bargain on the tote board. But your method in the hands of the public also means that bettors will be possessing the same "line" on a given field of horses...and this will find them betting the same way...on the same horses. And this will mean that the "value" on the board will gradually diminish. In the grand scheme of things...selling a "line" brings forth the same result as selling a "pick"...although this result isn't so readily apparent.

Of course you will continue receiving orders (and compliments) for your findings. Heck...I am complimenting your stuff right now. But that's not because your stuff is destined to remain "forever profitable". It's because people compare your work with the other stuff being sold out there...and they are justifiably impressed.

There is always a price to pay when you decide to sell your findings to the general public.

[lamboguy]

i read it for christmas and thought it was great as well.

[wisconsin]

Remember the guy that sold peanuts in the shell outside of the paddock gate every day.."Get your supper here!"

Yeah, he was always outside Arlington's east gate too. Carmel apples and Creamcicles.

[BettinBilly]

Good thread.

It's amazing how many of us are in our 50's. Must be our era I suppose.

Also good to see younger Bettors chiming in.

I was introduced to the horses via my father whom liked harness racing at Pocono and other tracks in Upstate NY. He also liked Quarter Horses. Me? I migrated to Thoroughbred fairly quickly and stayed with it.

I became truly serious when on a company trip we all went to FingerLakes as a company function. Can you imagine a national company doing that today? Actually scheduling a trip to the Race Track? Those days are gone I think. I'm guessing this was 1983. I was a young exec and had some extra cash and went nuts on betting. Luckily, I won enough to really peak my interest. I spent the next 2 or 3 years diving in and asking every older guy at tracks from Aqueduct to Saratoga what they did and how they Handicapped.

Since then? It's been a lifetime of learning and fun. I'm like the OP. I am about even over the decades. But it's been a blast. Truly. I can't imagine not being a Horseplayer. It's as much of a lifestyle as it is a hobby for me. I love the excitement, being at the track, handicapping and seeing the effort pay off, and learning from the losses. If I did not have fun with this sport, I'd have dropped it decades ago.

[Overlay]

I have read the author page, Tim...and I am a little confused.

Let me preface this by saying that I bought your products years ago, and I am very satisfied with my purchase. Yours was the best-presented handicapping material that I've ever gotten through the mail...and it made me think about this game in a new way. But I don't understand how you could think that, since your material is used to create a "line" instead of picking a horse, you don't have to worry about your product losing its effectiveness with the passage of time...as more players get their hands on it.

You say..."And, because my method calculated winning chances for every horse in a race, I no longer had to worry about it ever becoming obsolete or unprofitable through overbetting of any one particular horse, as had happened with all the earlier "pick-the-winner" systems that I had tried. I was now free to offer my findings to other handicappers, with no concerns about whether such distribution would adversely affect their future use by me."

Yes...the nature of your method means that no one individual horse could be overbet, because such an occurrence would mean that some other horse(s) would then become a bargain on the tote board. But your method in the hands of the public also means that bettors will be possessing the same "line" on a given field of horses...and this will find them betting the same way...on the same horses. And this will mean that the "value" on the board will gradually diminish. In the grand scheme of things...selling a "line" brings forth the same result as selling a "pick"...although this result isn't so readily apparent.

Of course you will continue receiving orders (and compliments) for your findings. Heck...I am complimenting your stuff right now. But that's not because your stuff is destined to remain "forever profitable". It's because people compare your work with the other stuff being sold out there...and they are justifiably impressed.

There is always a price to pay when you decide to sell your findings to the general public.
First of all, thank you for the kind words and for your past patronage! (And thank you to lamboguy for his post as well!)

I understand your point, but (in my opinion), as efficient as the betting public has consistently proven to be in the long-term aggregate, and no matter how widely-dispersed my individual handicapping approach may ever become (which I hope has not yet achieved its maximum potential :)), reaching a state where every horse in every race will go off at odds precisely corresponding to its actual probability of winning (however that probability may be assessed) is a practical impossibility, particularly under pari-mutuel wagering, where greater support of any particular horse causes the odds of every other horse to rise. Also, not every race has to be played. A full-field view of winning chances provides the handicapper with maximum flexibility in locating and exploiting those cases where the public has made the greatest misjudgments, especially when the method being used allows the handicapper to identify both where and why those misjudgments have occurred.

Aside from that, my main objectives on my Amazon author page were to contrast the benefits of a full-field, fair-odds perspective with the known built-in obsolescence of "garden-variety" elimination-type, single-selection methods that seek only to isolate the most likely winner of a race, and/or that do not take odds into account as part of the wagering process; and also to pre-empt the common question that can understandably be asked of anyone selling handicapping material as to why a methodology that works as claimed would be offered for sale.

[MJC922]

Yes we had OTB, we stood in the branch and waited for letters to go up, no video , no race call,

Win : A
Place: E
Show: H

:lol:

Z

Yes, remember it well. My stepdad was a branch manager and retired from there in the late 80s. Results would come through as official on a dot matrix printer. I used to watch him post the results, circle the favorite in a red marker, write 2 & 3 over the names of the place and show finishers then pin the results sheet underneath. BTW not the greatest place to grow up, I breathed in way too much second hand smoke sitting in those places as a kid. Always thought the old guys hanging out in there were more fun to be around than kids my own age though. The greatest generation, true. Some funny things still come to mind, the old guys having a laugh shouting out to one another about betting FU. FU too. :) The entry in a race was the letter U as I recall. Someone correct me if I'm wrong on that, I'm getting up there now myself.

[Ocala Mike]

Yeah, the entries were U (1 entry), V (2 entry), W (3 entry), etc.

Plain letters went out to T (corresponding to a #20 horse in the entries). I remember once making a nice score on a horse running in FL in the winter as a letter Q, trained by Azpurua; paid $120 or so straight. In those days, horses getting in off the AE list were almost always huge overlays at OTB, while the A,B,C horses were almost invariably overbet in the "separate pools" situations.

I also seem to remember a time where on Tuesdays in NYC you could bet Finger Lakes, but ONLY QUINELLAS (no WPS, etc.). Must have been something in the law that later changed.

[Prytanis]

The first OTB I've been to was at Grand Central station
One teller and a small TV in the corner. It was in 1974.
The local am radio will broadcast the results of the races along with other sports on 15 and 45 of the hour
Those were the days my friend!!

[Exotic1]

The first OTB I've been to was at Grand Central station
One teller and a small TV in the corner. It was in 1974.
The local am radio will broadcast the results of the races along with other sports on 15 and 45 of the hour
Those were the days my friend!!

Where in GCT was the OTB located - I seem to remember something but can't picture the actual green sign?

[Ocala Mike]

Well, I don't know for sure about 1974, but there was a time when a whole bank of former railroad ticket sales windows (thanks to the disappearing railroad blues) became NYCOTB windows, and I CAN picture the green signs quite clearly.

[cnollfan]

59 years old, started going to the races in the 1960s at Centennial in Denver with my dad and LaMesa Park in Raton, NM with my granddad. Bet $2 across the board on Interest Me in a $2000 claimer in 1968, 23-1 in the field. He had been sprinting, then had three route races, positions 2-2-2-7, 6-8-10-10 in the mud, 2-3-4-5. Back to a sprint, I thought he would run better. 13 years old, I remember running to the winners circle holding the precious green combination ticket as high as I could reach. Hooked after that one, especially since Interest Me turned into a really good sprinter who once ran 5 1/2 furlongs in 1:02 4/5.

An English teacher in high school was the first really good handicapper I met. We went to the races together a lot when I was a junior and senior.

After high school moved to Baltimore where I had relatives, got a downtown apartment and took the bus to Laurel, Bowie or Pimlico to try and make a living at the horses. Summers at AkSarBen in Omaha. Would move back with my folks in Denver working odd jobs until I saved enough for a foray somewhere else -- like Del Mar in 1974, where I cashed one winner in a month. Kirkpatrick at 5-1. Don Pierce rode him.

Went to college in Boulder Colo., spring breaks at Oaklawn in Hot Springs, summers at AkSarBen. Read Picking Winners cover to cover a dozen times, which basically turned my game profitable for a while. Graduated, decided to play full-time, partners with my dad. Off to a great start at Fair Grounds in New Orleans in 1980, fabulous meet for us. The first day of our partnership I picked Fleet Fannie at 30-1 and bet $250 to win on her. She had to withstand a foul claim. While the lights were blinking my dad said if they left her up he would never complain about a DQ again. They left her up. (I didn't make that vow -- I'm still bitter about Butterfield Eight getting taken down at Hollywood Park in 1997. I remember the Liz Taylor movie.)

After the third year I was broke and depressed over a breakup with a girl. Eventually got a real job, albeit low-paying, and made the races my primary hobby.

When the Beyer numbers showed up in Racing Times and then DRF it didn't take me long to decide I couldn't make money off my own figs anymore. Have been searching for an alternative way to handicap for 20+ years. Basically I had won or broke even every year from 1975 - 1993 and lost or broke even every year since. But I am encouraged about some recent developments in my handicapping and bet structure. TimeformUS has some features I really like. I don't expect I'll ever be able to use it as a stand-alone PP tool, too many decades of seeing the Form as it appears in DRF or Brisnet, but the combination is promising.

Love the races at all echelons, but have a soft spot for tracks that still draw a crowd, like Oaklawn and Canterbury. It's definitely a tougher game now that most of the unsophisticated money has left the sport for slots, leaving the sharpies trying to win each other's money. But I still believe in my bones that it is beatable.

[thespaah]

You're right...I forgot about the separate windows for place and show betting.
NYRA had a DD on races 1/2...Exactas on races 3-5-7..Triple on race 9
Back then tracks has sellers and cashiers windows.
there were base bet specific windows. 2/5/10 for the regular folks.
$20/$50 and one or two $100 windows.
Then there were windows for win bets only.
Meadowlands had exactas on all races except 1 and 2 and 10th races.
Trifecta wagering on the 4th and 10th races.
The most significant part of triple/trifecta races that in both NJ and NY coupled entries and mutuel fields were barred from these races.

[thespaah]

The first OTB I've been to was at Grand Central station
One teller and a small TV in the corner. It was in 1974.
The local am radio will broadcast the results of the races along with other sports on 15 and 45 of the hour
Those were the days my friend!!
WCBS News Radio 880....
They also played the stretch call audio for the NYRA tracks as well as Yonkers and Roosevelt.
The OTB shop nearest to me was just across the state line. There was no audio or video.
Bettors went to place their bets and leave. Or, they would hang around and wait for the results to be posted on hand written sheets provided by one of the clerks...

[Sinner369]

It's really sad............not your stories nor history but all your knowledge and experiences will be gone once you (we) are gone.

This type of real experience and knowledge you cannot pass onto your loved ones (i.e., your kids) because not many have the same love for horses and gambling as we do.

It takes a special type to like and play the races as a hobby (or a pro) and one cannot inherit it like a normal business.

[jk3521]

WCBS News Radio 880....
They also played the stretch call audio for the NYRA tracks as well as Yonkers and Roosevelt.
The OTB shop nearest to me was just across the state line. There was no audio or video.
Bettors went to place their bets and leave. Or, they would hang around and wait for the results to be posted on hand written sheets provided by one of the clerks...

And every day Warner Wolff would show the stretch call of the feature race in his sports report on channel 7, I think.

Charlsie Cantey and "Smiling" Frank Wright would have a racing show on Saturdays on channel 9.

[Sunday Silence]

I'm 52. Got my first taste when a group of baseball parents took all their kids for a day at Santa Anita in the infield. I was enamored, and remember the excitement when somebody had a winner. Then in high school a good friend of mine had a Dad in the postal service who was a long time player. Taught me how to read a Form. Very conservative, win bets and the occasional $5 straight exacta.

Really got hooked after that. Grew up in Glendale. Played college baseball close by, and many of us players used to love when it rained and practice got rained out. We'd head to the track and look for mudders (Argentina/Chile horses especially).

John Henry was probably the first super horse (though my first big race I remember seeing live was the Exceller/Vigors/JO Tobin Hollywood Gold Cup. In my 20's it was pretty ridiculous. Made good money in Sales and I had 3 buddies that for stretches would work in the morning and then meet at the track 3-4 days a week. Pretty hooked.

Sunday Silence is still my all-time favorite horse. We used to go to Vegas for the Derby and Sunday over Easy Goer was my greatest rush ever and first big score.

When the OTB's opened up it made it easier as I didn't have to drive out to SA or HP. Fortunately, I've always played beneath my means and kept it in perspective. I've learned a lot over the years. I've hit some big scores with verticals (10K trifecta at Golden Gate) and straight bets but never a big pick 6 or anything.

Now I play TVG a few times a month and go to the OTB down the street about the same. I play more during Triple Crown and Breeder's Cup time. We do a 15 guy boys trip to Del Mar for 3 days every year - freaking blast. Streaky game. For me it's entertainment - I just love trying to solve the puzzle. Good scores here and there and never lose enough to put a dent in family finances. Hope the sport survives.

[Sunday Silence]

Man - how many of us in So Cal turned into the radio to hear Bill Garr's stretch calls?

[Stillriledup]

It's really sad............not your stories nor history but all your knowledge and experiences will be gone once you (we) are gone.

This type of real experience and knowledge you cannot pass onto your loved ones (i.e., your kids) because not many have the same love for horses and gambling as we do.

It takes a special type to like and play the races as a hobby (or a pro) and one cannot inherit it like a normal business.

Interesting perspective.

Most of us grew up in the game at the knee of someone who was already inside the game whether it be a participant or just a fan. The industry hasn't embraced that "process" that most of us went thru...you don't hear too many stories of people saying yeah, i was in my 30s or 40s when i discovered racing, i just drove by a track one day and decided to go inside, that's not how a large portion of current customers in the game were baptized into this sport......and yet, the current leaders of the game not only have no idea how their current customer base came to BE a fan, but it does seem like they could care less. They run the game as though they think the customers have no emotional investment towards the sport..they treat everyone the same, its just brick and mortar, dollars and cents and try and squeeze every last penny out of the pockets of the customers as soon as they can...even if those taken pennies would eventually beget more pennies.

We all have our own stories and our own amazing memories of this game, everyone is unique, reading some of these posts in this thread, you have many of us who remember our first wager, the day of the week, the time of the day, the jockey, the horse's name and lots of other vivid details about that first winner or something that happened in the past. Most people can't remember what they had for breakfast this morning but horseplayers can tell you about a great win they had in 1968 and recall all the detail right down to what the exacta paid to the penny. (if there was even an exacta back then!)

[acorn54]

First of all, thank you for the kind words and for your past patronage! (And thank you to lamboguy for his post as well!)

I understand your point, but (in my opinion), as efficient as the betting public has consistently proven to be in the long-term aggregate, and no matter how widely-dispersed my individual handicapping approach may ever become (which I hope has not yet achieved its maximum potential :)), reaching a state where every horse in every race will go off at odds precisely corresponding to its actual probability of winning (however that probability may be assessed) is a practical impossibility, particularly under pari-mutuel wagering, where greater support of any particular horse causes the odds of every other horse to rise. Also, not every race has to be played. A full-field view of winning chances provides the handicapper with maximum flexibility in locating and exploiting those cases where the public has made the greatest misjudgments, especially when the method being used allows the handicapper to identify both where and why those misjudgments have occurred.




in a previous thread dick schwartz mentioned that everyone is watching and betting at virtually the same time based on the odds of the horses so really nowadays with the disappearance of virtually all the casual players, that bet early it is very difficult.
jeff platt has confirmed with his extensive data base that over the past decade the pari-mutuel market has become much more efficient than the time span between the 1930's to 1990's, of pari mutuel wagering history.

[outofthebox]

Man - how many of us in So Cal turned into the radio to hear Bill Garr's stretch calls?Grew up in the same era. Listened to the stretch calls every half hour on KFI. If it was not the Garr show it was race recreations by Horse n Jockey on a very weak radio station. Hollywood did have the Harry Henson 1/2 hour replay show. And later Santa Anita did have the replays on a UHF station 52 i think.