Cuba

[Tom]

Why?
Is there nothing else more pressing in the world than to waste time on this POS island that has been a nothing for decades?

Other than the idiot in chief trying to change the news cycles and make some kind of a legacy?

How does it help our economy?
How does it help our security?

Why are we worried about the Cuban people?
We have a total breakdown in race relations HERE and people marching in the streets HERE, and an idiot in DC worrying about the Cubans.

Funny how he said in Spanish "We are all Americans" to the Cubans.

No, Berry, they are not, and neither are YOU! :lol::lol::lol:

What a total dipstick Obama is - total jerk.
Watch out Cubans, everything this moron touches goes south fast - prepare yourself for the infection that is Obama.

[TJDave]

Why?

To get Alan Gross out of jail.

[Robert Goren]

Why?Foreign Trade. It opens up a market close to home.
:rolleyes: alert: A dealer in used parts for 1950s cars made a large campaign contribution to Obama in 2012.

[JustRalph]

Being friendly to a communist country

What are the odds

[TJDave]

Being friendly to a communist country

What are the odds

Do you buy stuff made in communist China?

[Tom]

Looking to expand relations with Commy china, too.

Regression to the mean?

[LottaKash]

Being friendly to a communist country

What are the odds

Why would anyone expect less, from an elected "Commie".. ??

Seems pretty plain to see, to me... :eek:

[Clocker]

To get Alan Gross out of jail.

Oh, good. Buying back more hostages. :rolleyes:

[TJDave]

Oh, good. Buying back more hostages. :rolleyes:

He was more than a hostage. ;)

[FantasticDan]

Gosh darn Pope sticking his holy nose in where it don't belong :mad: :D

[DJofSD]

Do you buy stuff made in communist China?
Not if I have a choice.

[TJDave]

Not if I have a choice.

There's always a choice.

[Tom]

Not if you want to buy Chinese Checkers.

[reckless]

Those illiterate, unskilled, diseased future Democrat Party voters and lifelong leeches on the American taxpayer from Central America that was illegally given amnesty will now have a stopover point in Cuba.

All those GOP fan boys that were duped this election will only have the GOP to blame by not stopping the anti-American president Barry Soetoro Obama. I know full well his treasonist actions to date, but I also sadly know that the GOP gave him full reign in his goal to destroy the greatest country on earth.

While the GOP establishment has just begun to promote Jeb Bush -- with equal losers and villains Chris Christie and Mitt Romney in the bullpen as backup -- just remember that baby brother Jeb is an open borders and full unfettered amnesty proponent.

Not to mention other anti-family, anti-citizen views like Common Core.

[Tom]

Bush announcement yesterday, Cuba speech today.

Yeah, uh huh, right.......:lol::lol::lol:

[hcap]

/6LpjoVUCCLE?

[fast4522]

January is going to be one cold ass month for this administration.

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_ARIZONA_ELECTION_CONGRESS?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2014-12-17-12-24-35

[horses4courses]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B5F-fc6CQAExT7b.jpg:large

[Clocker]

He said "normalizing diplomatic relations".

http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-laughing025.gif

[ArlJim78]

Did the US get rolled by Kim Jong Un and Castro on the same day?

[reckless]

Bush announcement yesterday, Cuba speech today.

Yeah, uh huh, right.......:lol::lol::lol:

All this stinks -- immoral GOP budget bill passed basically funding Obama Care and providing funds for the illegal Obama amnesty giving the GOP an imprimateur on unfettered spending and the OK for illegals invading this once great nation.

Now, after these SOBs leave Washington DC, Obama is recognizing the terror state of Cuba -- all for more illegal aliens and cheap uneducated labor -- plus, a nobody named Alan Gross who didn't belong there in the first place! We free three spies, for christ sakes.

You can't tell me that the hate America Chamber of Commerce wasn't behind this in part and that the GOP didn't know this was in the works all the time.

The national GOP gets closer to extinction by the day. And now, I am certain they are dead meat in 2016 and forever.

[JustRalph]

Did the US get rolled by Kim Jong Un and Castro on the same day?


Pretty much sums it up

We lost our first cyber war and kiss a tyrant on the cheek

All in the same week

[classhandicapper]

More words of wisdom from Garry Kasparov today. @Kasparov63


"Pathetic to blame US embargo for Cuba being in economic dark ages. Look at Eastern Europe during & after Communism! It's the system, stupid!"

"If Cuba does not release all political prisoners & give its people freedom, then this is just more Obama appeasement like the Russia Reset."

"Without conditions, Castro regime will do what Putin & others did: take the free world's money & invest it in greater repression at home."

"Criminal regimes like the Castros' in Cuba should take big steps toward reform before being rewarded. If not, this sends terrible message."

"Socialists in western countries, rich from the free market, would stand before Soviet poverty and gulags and tell us how lucky we were."

"People's lives are never as important as a socialist's theories."

[classhandicapper]

Gosh darn Pope sticking his holy nose in where it don't belong :mad: :D

This pope is in danger of cracking my top 10 "possible anti-Crist" list for his views on several issues.

He's got a lot to do to catch up with George Soros, Richard Perle, and the founder of a specific religion, but he's got one of those bullets that indicates he's moving up the charts rapidly.

[Clocker]

All this stinks

Now, after these SOBs leave Washington DC, Obama is recognizing the terror state of Cuba -- all for more illegal aliens and cheap uneducated labor -- plus, a nobody named Alan Gross who didn't belong there in the first place! We free three spies, for christ sakes.



Obama promised that he would put an end to business as usual in Washington. He did. He made it slimier.

Obama has been trying to get one of his insiders, Tony Blinken, confirmed as Deputy Secy. of State. Marco Rubio and others opposed the appointment because Blinken was weak and evasive about Cuba.

U.S. Sen. Marco Rubio today announced he is opposing the nomination of Antony Blinken as deputy secretary of State due to his attitude on Cuba.

During Blinken’s confirmation hearing last month, Rubio, a member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, questioned President Barack Obama’s nominee about future unilateral changes to U.S.-Cuba policy without democratic reforms, as required by law.

Given several opportunities – during both the hearing and follow-up written testimony – the Florida senator and prospective White House candidate said Blinken hesitated to rule out the possibility of unilateral changes to America’s policy on Cuba.



Yesterday, as part of Harry Reid's Xmas rush, Blinken was confirmed. Today, Obama announced the policy change that Rubio and others feared.

Not surprisingly, there are serious legal questions about whether Obama can do what he seems to have announced today without Congressional approval. Yet another unilateral executive order by a lame duck, semi-retired president.

[PhantomOnTour]

Levantate' Cubano!.... Buena Vista Social Club

rattle rattle righties....Castro been in power for over 40yrs...definitely Obama's fault

[horses4courses]

As is the case with many issues, conservatives are in
the minority when it comes to US policy regarding Cuba.

Today's developments are welcomed by most people here,
and throughout the world.

[horses4courses]

Levantate' Cubano!.... Buena Vista Social Club

rattle rattle righties....Castro been in power for over 40yrs...definitely Obama's fault

:ThmbUp: :ThmbUp: :ThmbUp:

HaerapRPS64

[Ocala Mike]

Si! Viva la revolucion, and when do we get real Cuban cigars?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXwLBS3yUkA

[horses4courses]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B5GbLGNCIAEcsfI.jpg

[ArlJim78]

Wl9XO7GukQk

let's party

[horses4courses]

Wl9XO7GukQk

let's party

Hate to point this out, but those guys live
further away from Cuba than we do.

[PhantomOnTour]

He thought they were singing,

"GuantanamoBay...Obama...GuantanamoBay"

[alydar]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B5GbLGNCIAEcsfI.jpg

I have to admit that this is a good question.

[JustRalph]

As is the case with many issues, conservatives are in
the minority when it comes to US policy regarding Cuba.

Today's developments are welcomed by most people here,
and throughout the world.

Unless your family members were tortured. Languish in a Cuban prison. Or go hungry every day due to the regime.

How about those shot down by Cuba while flying missions in Cessna aircraft? Dropping leaflets opposing Castro in the water 10 miles outside Cuban Air space?

I'm sure they are jumping up and down today. JFK screwed this up long ago.

Go watch the film about Luis Tiant's return to Cuba and decide if you think Castro should be rewarded

"The Lost Son of Havana" is the title.

[ArlJim78]

Hate to point this out, but those guys live
further away from Cuba than we do.
yes I'm aware of that but not clear why you would think it important to point out. I liked the sound of this version because it was more up tempo and festive than some of the traditional versions.

I'd venture to say that this beautiful song has been done by at least one band in every country on earth at one point or another.

[horses4courses]

Buena Vista Social Club is an album dear to my heart.
Produced by Ry Cooder, one of my all-time favorites,
I played it so many times that my now 18 year old
daughter knows every track by heart.

She was 4 or 5 at the time, and is now a junior at Berkeley.

[ArlJim78]

9QO4aegj-jA

try again.

[horses4courses]

Hate to point this out, but those guys live
further away from Cuba than we do.

My bad.
I thought you were taking a shot, but it's good stuff :ThmbUp:

[PhantomOnTour]

Unless your family members were tortured. Languish in a Cuban prison. Or go hungry every day due to the regime.

How about those shot down by Cuba while flying missions in Cessna aircraft? Dropping leaflets opposing Castro in the water 10 miles outside Cuban Air space?

I'm sure they are jumping up and down today. JFK screwed this up long ago.

Go watch the film about Luis Tiant's return to Cuba and decide if you think Castro should be rewarded

"The Lost Son of Havana" is the title.
As unbelievable as it sounds, I have actually been to Cuba. Grew up outside the USA mainland and made a trip to compete in a swim meet as a young boy (late 70's - early 80's)...scared the s**t out of me.
I left with two thoughts about that place, and I still feel that way today:

Cuba is great - Castro is a barbarian

Yes, he has hung tough all these years in the shadow of the most powerful nation on Earth without wavering...but at a terrible cost to his people and economy, and neither he nor his people have "won".

The question raised earlier regarding China is an interesting one, no?

[BlueShoe]

Did the US get rolled by Kim Jong Un and Castro on the same day?
Li Keqiang and Vladimir Putin also in on the deal, and almost surely gave a little shove.

[Tom]

Three enemies of the US released. they murdered US citizens.
they were spies.

Obama has now release 8 enemies of the country to get two people back.
One of them, probably at least a deserter if not a traitor. Both times for nothing more than politics.


It is not about trade with Cuba.
There is still a LAW about that. BOTH parties have denounced his actions today.

This is about Obama, unilaterally thumbing his nose at the country for REJECTING his policies outright, much like the breakdown of H4C.

As I said earlier, he IGNORES the problems here at home, that HE helped create.

[reckless]

Cuba is one of just four countries designated by the US State Department as State Sponsors of Terrorism.

The Cuban gov't have been enemies of this once-great country and enemies to their own citizens for 55 years or so. It's been a one-party socialist country ever since Fidel Castro became their dictator President.

Trading three assassins/spies for one hapless fool doesn't cut with me. Defending such a stupid move by saying we can now buy Cuban cigars shows an intellectual ineptness by our 'journalists' in the news media.

[Robert Goren]

An end to the "wink and smile" trade between the countries. Nebraskans have been sell ag products for over 20 years. GOP Nebraska governors have been to Cuba trade missions 3 times. Besides the Yankees need a shortstop!

[kingfin66]

Being friendly to a communist country

What are the odds

Nixon - China

Bush - Vietnam

To name a couple.

[reckless]

An end to the "wink and smile" trade between the countries. Nebraskans have been sell ag products for over 20 years. GOP Nebraska governors have been to Cuba trade missions 3 times. Besides the Yankees need a shortstop!

Robert, you convinced me.

Viva Cuba! :jump:

[classhandicapper]

As is the case with many issues, conservatives are in
the minority when it comes to US policy regarding Cuba.

Today's developments are welcomed by most people here,
and throughout the world.

Conservatives would like the same outcome, but actually get a payoff for the normalization of relations in terms of movement towards democracy and human rights instead of just a prisoner swap.

This is appeasement. Ending it this way more or less wasted everything we did before it.

[classhandicapper]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B5GbLGNCIAEcsfI.jpg


Do you want an honest answer?

Because China can buy a trillion dollars of the US bonds we issue to support the bankrupt welfare state and extended warfare state. I can afford to buy more bonds than Cuba.

[DJofSD]

The main reason for the regime's policy change towards Cuba is so Obama can hire the Cuban health officials to fill departments with jobs that Americans can not or will not do the work.

[woodtoo]

The main reason for the regime's policy change towards Cuba is so Obama can hire the Cuban health officials to fill departments with jobs that Americans can not or will not do the work.

Good to see someone gets it, they should be arriving by the boatload just in time for Christmas.

[burnsy]

Do you want an honest answer?

Because China can buy a trillion dollars of the US bonds we issue to support the bankrupt welfare state and extended warfare state. I can afford to buy more bonds than Cuba.

Of course that's the truth. So when people wave the flag with their bullshit and so called "principles"....its a real laugher. Something that should of happened 30 years ago.....if you are allowed to move Wal Mart to China what's some puke island 90 miles away matter? Threat to us? What a joke that is. Gee, why do some hate us? We never talk out of both sides of our mouths. No hypocrisy in the good old USA. And of course China will buy the bonds......now they got us by the balls. But people keep backing democrats and republicans. They've been running things so well, sticking to our founding principles and all...just read it around here and listen to Fox and Frauds or MSNBC...they'll tell you how its everyone else's fault and make you feel warm and safe. Did you hear? There's a war on Christmas too..... :lol: You can't even make up stuff this stupid. But people eat it up.

[alydar]

:ThmbUp: Of course that's the truth. So when people wave the flag with their bullshit and so called "principles"....its a real laugher. Something that should of happened 30 years ago.....if you are allowed to move Wal Mart to China what's some puke island 90 miles away matter? Threat to us? What a joke that is. Gee, why do some hate us? We never talk out of both sides of our mouths. No hypocrisy in the good old USA. And of course China will buy the bonds......now they got us by the balls. But people keep backing democrats and republicans. They've been running things so well, sticking to our founding principles and all...just read it around here and listen to Fox and Frauds or MSNBC...they'll tell you how its everyone else's fault and make you feel warm and safe. Did you hear? There's a war on Christmas too..... :lol: You can't even make up stuff this stupid. But people eat it up.

:ThmbUp: :ThmbUp:

[Spiderman]

Hate to point this out, but those guys live
further away from Cuba than we do.

The spirit is the important thing. Viva Cuba! Viva Mexico!

[LottaKash]

The spirit is the important thing. Viva Cuba! Viva Mexico!

And, Viva Central and South Amerika !, and Viva Western Hemisphere !, and Viva New World Order ! (gubmint and church)...!!!! :jump: :jump: :jump:

[dartman51]

Cuba is one of just four countries designated by the US State Department as State Sponsors of Terrorism.

The Cuban gov't have been enemies of this once-great country and enemies to their own citizens for 55 years or so. It's been a one-party socialist country ever since Fidel Castro became their dictator President.

Trading three assassins/spies for one hapless fool doesn't cut with me. Defending such a stupid move by saying we can now buy Cuban cigars shows an intellectual ineptness by our 'journalists' in the news media.

Just 3 months ago, Obama affirmed Cuba's enemy status, and extended the embargo for one year. Now this? :D What a phreakin joke we have for a President. :faint:

[dartman51]

Just 3 months ago, Obama affirmed Cuba's enemy status, and extended the embargo for one year. Now this? :D What a phreakin joke we have for a President. :faint:


Not to mention the fact that Cuba was caught sending arms to North Korea, earlier this year. Which, according to the U.N., violates the embargo on North Korea.
http://www.centerforsecuritypolicy.org/2014/03/11/un-cuba-violated-arms-embargo-on-north-korea/

[horses4courses]

Which, according to the U.N., violates the embargo on North Korea.

:lol:

Suddenly, the U.N. actually matters to someone on the Right.

Stop....I can't take it........ :lol:


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B5KZqTRCQAAWxmw.jpg:large

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B5KPCJQCQAEfgVd.jpg:large

[ArlJim78]

Obama Bailout of a Dictator

Carter couldn’t save Castro, but Obama did. This was not a prisoner exchange. This was a Communist bailout.

Obama boasted that he would increase the flow of money to Cuba from businesses, from bank accounts and from trade. When he said, “We’re significantly increasing the amount of money that can be sent to Cuba”, that was his real mission statement.

The Castro regime is on its last legs. Its sponsors in Moscow and Caracas are going bankrupt due to failing energy prices. The last hope of the Butcher of Havana was a bailout from Washington D.C.

And that’s exactly what Obama gave him.

Obama has protected the Castros from regime change as if Communist dictators are an endangered species.

http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/dgreenfield/obamas-bailout-for-communist-dictators/#.VJNuPcu5-ng.twitter

[thaskalos]

Cuba is one of just four countries designated by the US State Department as State Sponsors of Terrorism.

The Cuban gov't have been enemies of this once-great country and enemies to their own citizens for 55 years or so. It's been a one-party socialist country ever since Fidel Castro became their dictator President.

Trading three assassins/spies for one hapless fool doesn't cut with me. Defending such a stupid move by saying we can now buy Cuban cigars shows an intellectual ineptness by our 'journalists' in the news media.

The only reason Cuba is on that list is because Cuba opposes the U.S.-led "war on terror". Otherwise...Cuba wouldn't be on the same list with Iran, Sudan and Syria. We invaded Iraq and Afghanistan while citing terrorism concerns; why haven't THOSE countries ever been on the list?

[horses4courses]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B5G_GlqCQAAbrIg.jpg:large

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B5KO_mkCcAAMrTO.jpg:large

[dartman51]

:lol:

Suddenly, the U.N. actually matters to someone on the Right.

Stop....I can't take it........ :lol:




Another stupid response complete with stupid pictures. Not just no, but HELL NO, the UN doesn't matter to me. I personally think they should be booted out of the U.S. and disbanded. I only used that example because you lefties put so much stock in what they have say. But, then, as usual, they only matter when they say something you agree with. :eek: :eek:

[Clocker]

Another stupid response complete with stupid pictures.

Totally mindless pictures that are apparently totally ignorant of the issues. Rubio and others are not opposed to normal relations with Cuba, they are opposed to relations with a dictatorship that is probably the greatest violator of human rights in this hemisphere.

And Obama just gave that dictatorship strength and credibility without gaining the slightest concession in return. Obama's decision was unilateral as regards this country and the bargain was unilateral as regards benefits to the Cuban dictatorship. We got nothing, the Cuban people got nothing, and Obama got a warm and fuzzy feeling because there is one more government leader in the world that pretends to respect him.

How about a nice, stupid cartoon of the big bully Castro brothers stealing nerdy Obama's lunch money on the playground. That would be funny AND truthful.

[horses4courses]

Did someone say human rights violations?

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B5Hz096CcAAmRAh.jpg:large

[RunForTheRoses]

http://www.vdare.com/articles/obama-throws-fidel-a-rope

[RunForTheRoses]

Those comparing the treatment of China and Cuba have a woeful lack of understating of the history of these two nations. We SLOWLY normalized relations with China, going back to the Nixon years, China had had difficulties with the USSR and did not support North Vietnam (in fact they went to war with Vietnam in the late 70s).
Deng Xiaoping led a turn for China to a more capitalist system. I would agree that it has not met all democratic issues head on but to compare it with Cuba es muy loco. Cuba has been defiant ever since Castro has been in power. They may very wel have played a part in the assassination of JFK. They are also in OUR hemisphere, a mere 90 miles from Florida, so there is NO comparison.

[Clocker]

http://www.vdare.com/articles/obama-throws-fidel-a-rope

The same rope he just used to hang himself as far as credible, effective foreign policy for the rest of his administration. And maybe that of his successor.

The American collapse with respect to Cuba will have repercussions in the Middle East and elsewhere in Asia, for the nations facing a rising China, and in Europe, for those near Putin’s newly aggressive Russia. What are American guarantees and promises worth if a fifty-year-old policy followed by Democrats like Johnson, Carter, and Clinton can be discarded overnight? In more than a few chanceries the question that will be asked as this year ends is “who is next to find that America is today more interested in propitiating its enemies than in protecting its allies?”

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/castro-cuba-obama-and-iran_821771.html

[Clocker]

Those comparing the treatment of China and Cuba have a woeful lack of understating of the history of these two nations. We SLOWLY normalized relations with China, going back to the Nixon years, China had had difficulties with the USSR and did not support North Vietnam (in fact they went to war with Vietnam in the late 70s).
Deng Xiaoping led a turn for China to a more capitalist system. I would agree that it has not met all democratic issues head on but to compare it with Cuba es muy loco. Cuba has been defiant ever since Castro has been in power. They may very wel have played a part in the assassination of JFK. They are also in OUR hemisphere, a mere 90 miles from Florida, so there is NO comparison.

You are preaching to the choir. Perhaps you could jazz that up with some cartoon characters and some pretty graphics to grab the short attention spans of the youngsters.

[RunForTheRoses]

You are preaching to the choir. Perhaps you could jazz that up with some cartoon characters and some pretty graphics to grab the short attention spans of the youngsters.

I'm deficient in that skill unfortunately.

I do remember watching the French movie A Grin Without a Cat which was excellent if not head up the behind left wing, and Castro is portrayed as a hero to the 1968 folks. He says some quite wild and revolutionary stuff while he was living high off the hog but his people were suffering.

Also, China does have many issues which may one day come to the fore. I feel sorry for the people of Hong Kong, they have many great capitalist, freedom things (including righteous Horse Racing) and to have to give it up and be Communist Authoritarian ?

http://preview.tinyurl.com/lrlwq52

Bad China
http://www.bbc.com/news/business-30540538

[Tom]

Did someone say human rights violations?

Yes, CUBA.
Are you really stupid enough to think Cuba is a free country that respects the rights of its citizens?

[thaskalos]

Those comparing the treatment of China and Cuba have a woeful lack of understating of the history of these two nations. We SLOWLY normalized relations with China, going back to the Nixon years, China had had difficulties with the USSR and did not support North Vietnam (in fact they went to war with Vietnam in the late 70s).
Deng Xiaoping led a turn for China to a more capitalist system. I would agree that it has not met all democratic issues head on but to compare it with Cuba es muy loco. Cuba has been defiant ever since Castro has been in power. They may very wel have played a part in the assassination of JFK. They are also in OUR hemisphere, a mere 90 miles from Florida, so there is NO comparison.
This is a gag...right? Are you sure you haven't gotten this backwards?

[Tom]

I don't recall boatloads of people fleeing to get into Cuba.
I do remember nukes in Cuba pointed at us.

[Robert Goren]

Yes, CUBA.
Are you really stupid enough to think Cuba is a free country that respects the rights of its citizens? If we only dealt with free countries that respect the rights of its citizens, we would not be dealing very many countries.

[Clocker]

If we only dealt with free countries that respect the rights of its citizens, we would not be dealing very many countries.

You say that like it's a bad thing. :rolleyes:

[ReplayRandall]

You say that like it's a bad thing. :rolleyes:

Clocker, in your lifetime, do you think the US has made a difference in the world, by changing former enemies into allies?

[Clocker]

Clocker, in your lifetime, do you think the US has made a difference in the world, by changing former enemies into allies?

Hey, we have had some of the best friends money can buy!

We do have a good record with former enemies that we have defeated, and not kicked when they were down, like Germany and Japan.

The new and improved "smart power" of Obama and Hillary Clinton (understanding and empathizing with our enemies in order to “define the problems”) doesn't have a real good track record. :rolleyes:

[ReplayRandall]

Hey, we have had some of the best friends money can buy!

We do have a good record with former enemies that we have defeated, and not kicked when they were down, like Germany and Japan.

The new and improved "smart power" of Obama and Hillary Clinton (understanding and empathizing with our enemies in order to “define the problems”) doesn't have a real good track record. :rolleyes:

I posed this question as a way of determining what do we do with the 37,000 troops we have stationed on the DMZ in Korea? Why are we still there after 60 years? Why so many military bases still in Europe after 70 years? What is our final intention in the Middle East? When is a balanced thinking leader going to come forth and connect all the dots for the American people? Is this even possible? Is Capitalism and Americanism one in the same, or is there actually a difference? The sooner we ALL find out the answers to these questions, the sooner our nation will solidify and rise again to its former Superpower status and LEADER of the free world.....BTW, I'm a conservative Independent who is waiting for the emergence of a balanced thinking Major Third party....

[RunForTheRoses]

This is a gag...right? Are you sure you haven't gotten this backwards?

You're right, it was absolutely a lone gunman.

[RunForTheRoses]

This is a gag...right? Are you sure you haven't gotten this backwards?

I think your alluding to the fact that we (the USA) tried to off Castro. We definitely tried from the Bay of Pigs debacle to who knows how many other covert operations. I don't think our shit don't stink, the CIA has been involved in many opaque things. I have a book haven't had a chance to read beyond skimming http://www.amazon.com/Legacy-Ashes-The-History-CIA/dp/0307389006
Big Government has gotten out of control. For conservatives who think the ends justify the means they might be coming after you next time.

[Robert Goren]

50 years of an embargo didn't change Cuba, so maybe it is time to try something else. The politics of Cuba won't change quickly, but like China, the economic system probably will. That has to be a good thing.

[reckless]

Let's see...

Communist dictator takes over Cuba in 1959.

As a good Socialist he nationalizes all the resources and privately-owned businesses of this beautiful island.

He also rounds up the homosexuals, the physically ill and unabled, the intellectuals, artists, writers and assorted free thinkers.

He also rounds up all those that he and his thugs simply think are any of those listed above.

Many, if not all, are imprisioned for life or murdered.

And for the next 55 years, despite getting billions of aid from the Communist government of the USSR up to a few years back or so, the place is a living hell economically and its good citizens live in squalor under the totalitarian dictatorship of a Communist and Socialist regime.

Now we are told by an incapable, inherently stupid clown named Obama that all economic sanctions are now being lifted. It is a 'benefit' for the US and Cuban economy, we are told. This coward in the White House, and the dupes that support him, think this is also all good that we returned to Castro three murderers and spies for a hapless and foolish do gooder who went there on his own accord.

Of course, our little pisher got absolutely nothing in return, especially anything pertaining to a silly notion called 'human rights' towards its' citizens. But why should Obama care about those great unwashed Cubans? He tries to treat his own citizens in the same thuggery manner so what's the problem you right wingers?

A lot of the dopes in this country now say how we've been unfair economically to Cuba these past 55 years, which is why they live in squalor today. The Blame America First crowd, of course.

What these fools don't know nor care is that Cuba has economic and diplomatic relations with just about all the other great powers of the world and they still barely survive thanks to the Socialist dictator Fidel and his communist government, and nothing else.

But now, thanks to Obama, we can now buy Cuban cigars.

Have people already forgotten that in this totalitarian Obama country, the once great USA, you can't even smoke these Cuban cigars, especially within 200 miles of a school. But, so what? We can now sell Che and Fidel tee-shirts to the idiots and punks on our college campuses. That alone should get the unemployment rate way, way down to a spinnable. . . 8-9-10 per cent. Via Cuba!

Finally as an aside, those symbolic and iconic Cuban Cigars have been made mostly in Nicaragua thanks to Castro, but why let the truth interfere with a silly and naive Obama and his left wing spinsters.

[Tom]

We do have a good record with former enemies that we have defeated, and not kicked when they were down, like Germany and Japan.

Fire bombing of Dresden, saturation bombing of Nuremberg, 1-2 nuke punch on Japan.......now, two model allies.

Goes to show what really works in the real word.

[alydar]

Let's see...

Communist dictator takes over Cuba in 1959.

As a good Socialist he nationalizes all the resources and privately-owned businesses of this beautiful island.

He also rounds up the homosexuals, the physically ill and unabled, the intellectuals, artists, writers and assorted free thinkers.

He also rounds up all those that he and his thugs simply think are any of those listed above.

Many, if not all, are imprisioned for life or murdered.

And for the next 55 years, despite getting billions of aid from the Communist government of the USSR up to a few years back or so, the place is a living hell economically and its good citizens live in squalor under the totalitarian dictatorship of a Communist and Socialist regime.

Now we are told by an incapable, inherently stupid clown named Obama that all economic sanctions are now being lifted. It is a 'benefit' for the US and Cuban economy, we are told. This coward in the White House, and the dupes that support him, think this is also all good that we returned to Castro three murderers and spies for a hapless and foolish do gooder who went there on his own accord.

Of course, our little pisher got absolutely nothing in return, especially anything pertaining to a silly notion called 'human rights' towards its' citizens. But why should Obama care about those great unwashed Cubans? He tries to treat his own citizens in the same thuggery manner so what's the problem you right wingers?

A lot of the dopes in this country now say how we've been unfair economically to Cuba these past 55 years, which is why they live in squalor today. The Blame America First crowd, of course.

What these fools don't know nor care is that Cuba has economic and diplomatic relations with just about all the other great powers of the world and they still barely survive thanks to the Socialist dictator Fidel and his communist government, and nothing else.

But now, thanks to Obama, we can now buy Cuban cigars.

Have people already forgotten that in this totalitarian Obama country, the once great USA, you can't even smoke these Cuban cigars, especially within 200 miles of a school. But, so what? We can now sell Che and Fidel tee-shirts to the idiots and punks on our college campuses. That alone should get the unemployment rate way, way down to a spinnable. . . 8-9-10 per cent. Via Cuba!

Finally as an aside, those symbolic and iconic Cuban Cigars have been made mostly in Nicaragua thanks to Castro, but why let the truth interfere with a silly and naive Obama and his left wing spinsters.

It is fine to have an opinion, but please be informed. No embargo has not been lifted. The change is that we will now have diplomatic relations. Let's take a closer look at what is actually happening:

* The two nations will be opening an embassies in each other's capital. Much like we have with and had with the USSR and China. Iran, North Korea and among the very few in the world that we do not have diplomatic relations. We lost 50,000 Americans in Vietnam and we have diplomatic relations and much more with them.

* Travel restrictions and trade restrictions have not changed in any significant way. The reality here is that we have been selling rice and other commodities to the Cubans for sometime.

It is time to move on. This is not 1960. The reality is that closer economic ties will probably have a bigger impact on day to day life in Cuba than all of our sanctions did. The Castro brothers are nearing the end of their lives and change is inevitable.

[horses4courses]

It is fine to have an opinion, but please be informed. No embargo has not been lifted. The change is that we will now have diplomatic relations. Let's take a closer look at what is actually happening:

* The two nations will be opening an embassies in each other's capital. Much like we have with and had with the USSR and China. Iran, North Korea and among the very few in the world that we do not have diplomatic relations. We lost 50,000 Americans in Vietnam and we have diplomatic relations and much more with them.

* Travel restrictions and trade restrictions have not changed in any significant way. The reality here is that we have been selling rice and other commodities to the Cubans for sometime.

It is time to move on. This is not 1960. The reality is that closer economic ties will probably have a bigger impact on day to day life in Cuba than all of our sanctions did. The Castro brothers are nearing the end of their lives and change is inevitable.

Nice to hear from someone thinking clearly for a change :ThmbUp:

[ArlJim78]

It is fine to have an opinion, but please be informed. No embargo has not been lifted. The change is that we will now have diplomatic relations. Let's take a closer look at what is actually happening:

* The two nations will be opening an embassies in each other's capital. Much like we have with and had with the USSR and China. Iran, North Korea and among the very few in the world that we do not have diplomatic relations. We lost 50,000 Americans in Vietnam and we have diplomatic relations and much more with them.

* Travel restrictions and trade restrictions have not changed in any significant way. The reality here is that we have been selling rice and other commodities to the Cubans for sometime.

It is time to move on. This is not 1960. The reality is that closer economic ties will probably have a bigger impact on day to day life in Cuba than all of our sanctions did. The Castro brothers are nearing the end of their lives and change is inevitable.
With the Castro regime in power I highly doubt this. Some corporations and Castro cronies will be better off, but without any other reforms day to day life will still be the same.
We gave away everything for nothing.

[Tom]

Nice to hear from someone thinking clearly for a change :ThmbUp:

Yes, as I said earlier - three enemies of the US - one of them a murdered of a Us citizen, set free for one guy. Add that to 5 high profile Al Qeda types let got for one guy, who is probably a traitor.

Why?
How does that, or this, help us?
What do we get out of this?

Nothing.

[Clocker]

* The two nations will be opening an embassies in each other's capital.

How long will it take for the Senate to confirm an ambassador to Cuba? How long for Congress to allocate the money for an embassy?

Obama unilaterally announced changes in US policy toward Cuba without getting anything in return. Congress is not going to lift the embargo or take any other actions until it is assured of a quid pro quo on human rights and other issues.

And despite mockery from the left about the right still fighting the Cold War, Cuba's relations with Russia are still a concern. Below is a recent photo of a Russian-built Lada taxi with a Russian intelligence (i.e., spy) ship in Havana harbor. With Putin rattling sabers about the West, there is increasing concern about a Russian presence in the Caribbean.



http://www.theblaze.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/russian-ship.jpg

[alydar]

How long will it take for the Senate to confirm an ambassador to Cuba? How long for Congress to allocate the money for an embassy?


This issue is not a clear right vs left issue. There are more than a handful of Republicans that favor this move, and a few Democrats that do not. I suspect that like most things in Washington these days, a few games will be played, but in the end funding for an embassy will be approved.

If the opinion polls I saw yesterday are accurate, (big if) even most Cuban American now favor some kind of change in our relationship.

[Clocker]

This issue is not a clear right vs left issue.

I agree. I think that most people agree in principle that the situation needs to be fixed and that both sides should compromise. If the Cuban government makes some concessions, I see no reason we cannot reach bipartisan support in this country.

[reckless]

It is fine to have an opinion, but please be informed. No embargo has not been lifted. The change is that we will now have diplomatic relations. Let's take a closer look at what is actually happening:

* The two nations will be opening an embassies in each other's capital. Much like we have with and had with the USSR and China. Iran, North Korea and among the very few in the world that we do not have diplomatic relations. We lost 50,000 Americans in Vietnam and we have diplomatic relations and much more with them.

* Travel restrictions and trade restrictions have not changed in any significant way. The reality here is that we have been selling rice and other commodities to the Cubans for sometime.

It is time to move on. This is not 1960. The reality is that closer economic ties will probably have a bigger impact on day to day life in Cuba than all of our sanctions did. The Castro brothers are nearing the end of their lives and change is inevitable.

With all due respect alydar my way of thinking and my knowledge of the facts are far more compelling than the naïve rhetoric I see and hear on TV and what I read here and in the newspapers. It is nice that you suggest it is time to 'move on' and simply forget that it is no longer 1960. And, while I'll agree Fidel's days are numbered, where's the benefit to the American citizen or the Cuban citizen just because we now recognize Cuba?

And how do you think Cubans feel about all this -- and I mean those that lost family and friends thanks to the Communist regime led by Fidel? Obama didn't even 'suggest' that Castro change his evil ways but yet conservatives and patriots have to accept all this without question.

Sadly, this Obama deal will not change much in the real lives of the Cuban people, and there is no reason to believe at this time that they ever will change when Fidel dies.

[Clocker]

And, while I'll agree Fidel's days are numbered, where's the benefit to the American citizen or the Cuban citizen just because we now recognize Cuba?



Good question. The majority of Americans seem to believe that opening relations with Cuba is a good thing, and most of that sentiment seems to be based on concern for the people of Cuba.

I agree with those sentiments, but I also see nothing here for the Cuban people. The details of Obama's imperial decree are vague, but at first glance the only benefit appears to accrue to the Cuban elite. A lot of people were out in the streets of Havana cheering this news, so that will quiet opposition to the government for a while. And in the big picture, the move gives the Cuban government more credibility on the world stage without affecting their policies.

I have yet to see any evidence here or in the media of any benefit to the average Cuban, and any strengthening of the government is to their detriment. The average American will be unaffected unless they benefit from an increase in trade.

[Greyfox]

For some time the Castros and their government have realised that communism doesn't work.

Since 2010 Cuba has slowly been moving towards a free enterprise system allowing for the privatization of business, farms, and whatever.

The Castros will be out of power by 2018.

A cold war against communism there no longer makes much sense, besides they have the best beaches in the world (even if their infrastructure for increased tourism is not in place).

That Obama acted independently on the policy shift towards Cuba is absolutely wrong.
But in the long run, both Cuba and the U.S. could benefit economically.

http://semancha.com/2014/12/17/us-cuba-its-about-time/


http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/15/opinion/cubas-economy-at-a-crossroads.html


http://www.economist.com/node/21551047


　

[JustRalph]

One question

Why are over half of Cuban's living in Miami against this?

What do they know?

[Greyfox]

One question

Why are over half of Cuban's living in Miami against this?

What do they know?

Old hatreds die hard.

[Clocker]

One question

Why are over half of Cuban's living in Miami against this?


Because they all have family back in Cuba who are not going to be helped by this?

[BlueShoe]

The majority of Americans seem to believe that opening relations with Cuba is a good thing, and most of that sentiment seems to be based on concern for the people of Cuba.

I agree with those sentiments, but I also see nothing here for the Cuban people. The details of Obama's imperial decree are vague, but at first glance the only benefit appears to accrue to the Cuban elite.

I have yet to see any evidence here or in the media of any benefit to the average Cuban, and any strengthening of the government is to their detriment. The average American will be unaffected unless they benefit from an increase in trade.
If you have a company that makes and/or distributes vintage automobile parts, you are sitting on a goldmine. Most of Cuba's vehicles are from the 50's and 60's, kept running by back yard mechanics with high skills and few spare parts.

[fast4522]

One question

Why are over half of Cuban's living in Miami against this?

What do they know?

The accurate answer is about half are stone cold Cuban's who had everything stolen from them, houses, businesses, and land that was in their family's for generations.

[horses4courses]

If you have a company that makes and/or distributes vintage automobile parts, you are sitting on a goldmine. Most of Cuba's vehicles are from the 50's and 60's, kept running by back yard mechanics with high skills and few spare parts.

Good point.
Car collectors are going to flock there, too.
Anything in good condition will be in demand.

[Robert Fischer]

One question

Why are over half of Cuban's living in Miami against this?

What do they know?
They would logically figure to be the group most against this.
From what little I do know about them it should come as no surprise whatsoever.
These are people, many of whom apparently moved here based upon an anti-Castro sentiment. Some received funding. Many underwent social pressures in the United States, and have publicly declared commitment against Castro-style-Cuba.
These things are very, very important to them and they have adopted them, as part of their culture and as a vocal political stance.

[Clocker]

T
These are people, many of whom apparently moved here based upon an anti-Castro sentiment.

Many moved here because they fled the country after the government confiscated their homes and businesses.

NBC News (http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/u-s-cuba-relations/recovering-properties-cuba-still-far-dream-some-cuban-americans-n271421)

[Tom]

Many fled in make-shift oats, risking drowning, to escape the evil dictator.
The CIA should have found a way of kill Castro long ago. Even at this late day, a the man deserved a drone.

For what reason would we want to have diplomatic relations with the scum of the Earth? Castro has nothing to offer - he is a taker, a thief, a murdered, a useless life form who is a cancer. There nothing about him that was ever good.

I only pray that he is in severe, constant, unbearable pain as he dies.

[Robert Fischer]

Castro is evil.

I don't know what the deal is?
If we are gaining control over the island, then it makes more sense.

[Tom]

With the loser Obama making the deal, Cuba will end up gaining control over us.

Score so far - them - 8, US - 2.

Not good.
We get to nobody's, they get 8 dangerous, proven enemies to the Us.
Obama is too stupid to know how to negotiate anything.

[horses4courses]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B5Ro1ohCEAEiMSS.jpg:large

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B5RiI8aCQAASCsl.jpg:large

[Tom]

Hey fool, at least learn how to size a photo before you post it.

never mind, I found a technical solution.
Put you on Iggy - then your sloppy posting doesn't screw up threads.

Someone alert me if he ever posts anything intelligent.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[horses4courses]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B5RSfeeCQAARft0.jpg:large

[Clocker]

If you have a company that makes and/or distributes vintage automobile parts, you are sitting on a goldmine. Most of Cuba's vehicles are from the 50's and 60's, kept running by back yard mechanics with high skills and few spare parts.

I think that there are some folks in Mexico that have vintage auto parts. They don't have an embargo, but they aren't doing business with Cuba. We are the only one with an embargo, as far as I know. So why aren't the Canadians or the Brazilians or the Europeans jumping into that prime market, with no Americans to compete with? Maybe some lib that knows all about Cuba could explain that?

[Clocker]

Someone alert me if he ever posts anything intelligent.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

I'd be pleasantly surprised just to see anything that vaguely reflected reality.

[Greyfox]

Senile dementia?

The Castro regime is a dictatorship.
In a recent speech it is obvious old man Real Castro wants to retain power.
His idea of communism is probably quite a distance from the ideals of Marxist communists.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/21/world/americas/castro-thanks-us-but-affirms-cubas-communist-rule.html?_r=0

HAVANA — President Raúl Castro (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/c/raul_castro/index.html?inline=nyt-per) declared victory for the Cuban Revolution on Saturday in a wide-ranging speech, thanking President Obama (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/o/barack_obama/index.html?inline=nyt-per) for “a new chapter” while also reaffirming that restored relations with the United States (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/18/world/americas/cuba-releases-alan-gross-american-it-accused-of-spying.html) did not mean the end of Communist rule in Cuba (http://www.nytimes.com/info/cuba?inline=nyt-geo).

[Clocker]

The Castro regime is a dictatorship.

The Castro bros are pushing the limits of their shelf life. I wonder who is next in line, one of Fidel's kids, or a military junta.

[ReplayRandall]

The Castro bros are pushing the limits of their shelf life. I wonder who is next in line, one of Fidel's kids, or a military junta.

Next in line, Hyman Roth and Michael Corleone...:cool:

[Clocker]

Next in line, Hyman Roth and Michael Corleone...:cool:

It actually sounds like something that would be right up Obama's alley. No Congress to frustrate him, no messy voters to screw up the plans, no reelection to worry about, no hostile media to point out reality.

[fast4522]

The Executive branch has full control of confirmed ambassadors, but only the United States Congress can pay to have an embassy built. Also only the United States Congress can lift trade restrictions in place on Cuba, should the Speaker of the House move to do that his leadership role will implode. Lets watch our Senator from the great state of Texas during the next few months. I prefer a Speaker of the house that does not have pearl onions, it is a disgrace someone in line for the Presidency always weeping.

[ReplayRandall]

I prefer a Speaker of the house that does not have pearl onions, it is a disgrace someone in line for the Presidency always weeping.

That's what happens when you use pickled pearl onions instead of olives in your Vodka Martinis......;)

[fast4522]

I was inferring that he was born that way.

[ReplayRandall]

I was inferring that he was born that way.

I know, just added a little "drinking" humor to the whole scenario...:cool:

[Tom]

I prefer a Speaker of the house that does not have pearl onions, it is a disgrace someone in line for the Presidency always weeping.

Lets be honest here, Boehner possesses NOTHING remotely like onions. Nothing at all.

Girly man wets himself on both ends. :D

[Clocker]

The day before Obama announced his new Cuban policy, a Cuban Coast Guard ship rammed and sank a small boat carrying 32 refugees trying to reach the US. The refugees were imprisoned. Eventually the women and children were released, but the men remain in jail.

Apparently mercy for women and children in prison is part of the new and improved Castro humanitarian policy.

The day before President Barack Obama announced to the world his administration’s unilateral decision to normalize trade and diplomatic relations with Cuba, Cuba’s Coast Guard sunk a small, rickety boat full of refugees attempting to flee to America.

Among the 32 people on the boat seeking to escape the Communist island dump were two children, the Miami Herald reports.

“We were screaming and crying for help as the boat was sinking. But they ignored us,” said Masiel González Castellano, who was on the boat. “Instead, they continued charging against our boat. Some people dove in the water and others stayed aboard as the boat sank.”


Story (http://dailycaller.com/2014/12/22/cuba-rammed-sunk-refugee-boat-one-day-before-obamas-decision-to-ease-sanctions/)

[zico20]

Let us not forget that in the early 1980s the Castro boys asked the Soviet Union to launch a nuclear missile attack against the USA. Nothing in the past 30 years indicates the Castro boys views have changed. Those two are just one rung underneath on the ladder from Stalin and Lenin.

To normalize relations with Cuba will only legitimize the Castro boys decades long reign of oppression on the Cuban people. The Castro boys personal bank accounts will be the only thing that will benefit from this action.

We should wait til all the communists gather together in parliament and then drop a big missile and wipe them out. The Cuban people will continue to suffer forever til democracy is installed and capitalism is in place.

Obama got nothing in exchange for this agreement. No surprise, he is a Marxist sympathizer.

One last detail. The Castro boys owe the USA 100s of millions of dollars from their revolution. They seized US businesses, land, and property. I guess Obama didn't ask for any of that money back, did he.

[PaceAdvantage]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B5RSfeeCQAARft0.jpg:largeOh look at this horses4courses guy..an obvious bigot who hates people of Latin American or Spanish origin...I mean look...he posted something negative about Rubio...clear evidence of his racist ways...

[NJ Stinks]

One last detail. The Castro boys owe the USA 100s of millions of dollars from their revolution. They seized US businesses, land, and property. I guess Obama didn't ask for any of that money back, did he.


Guess how much the Japanese paid us back after World War II? Zip.

The Germans paid us about $100,000.

Just thought you might like to know.

http://history.howstuffworks.com/world-war-ii/war-reparations2.htm

[zico20]

Guess how much the Japanese paid us back after World War II? Zip.

The Germans paid us about $100,000.

Just thought you might like to know.

http://history.howstuffworks.com/world-war-ii/war-reparations2.htm

How much wealth did the Japanese seize from US families and businesses inside of Japan. I reckon very little, if any at all. Probably the same with Germany. Both had regime changes that became our allies. Neither could afford to pay reparations. Besides, it was more important to the US that we rebuild each nation and keep it out of the hands of the communists.

Cuba is totally different. I don't see how this is even relevant. Those two owe us a ton of money, and we should get it back. Better yet, just wipe out the Castro boys one night in their sleep.

[NJ Stinks]

How much wealth did the Japanese seize from US families and businesses inside of Japan. I reckon very little, if any at all. Probably the same with Germany. Both had regime changes that became our allies. Neither could afford to pay reparations. Besides, it was more important to the US that we rebuild each nation and keep it out of the hands of the communists.

Cuba is totally different. I don't see how this is even relevant. Those two owe us a ton of money, and we should get it back. Better yet, just wipe out the Castro boys one night in their sleep.

How much did it cost U.S. taxpayers to finance World War II? One of us is missing or ignoring the point.

But then it's just better to blame Obama. :sleeping:

[Clocker]

Cuba is totally different. I don't see how this is even relevant. Those two owe us a ton of money, and we should get it back. Better yet, just wipe out the Castro boys one night in their sleep.

The country is broke, and I'm sure any money is in off-shore banks where it is untouchable. Cuba got all the benefit out of this and we got nothing. You would think Obama would at least get a worthless promise to discuss the return of property to rightful owners, or a pro forma agreement to lighten up on human rights violations. But there appears to be nothing there.

Just a warm and fuzzy feeling of better international relations.:rolleyes:

[zico20]

How much did it cost U.S. taxpayers to finance World War II? One of us is missing or ignoring the point.

But then it's just better to blame Obama. :sleeping:

What does financing a war have to do with the illegal seizure of Americans property? Nothing at all. I would be just as pissed if it were a Republican president who did this. No, I take that back, I would be more pissed because I would not expect a Republican president to be that stupid. This has nothing to do with Obama being Obama.

[NJ Stinks]

What does financing a war have to do with the illegal seizure of Americans property? Nothing at all. I would be just as pissed if it were a Republican president who did this. No, I take that back, I would be more pissed because I would not expect a Republican president to be that stupid. This has nothing to do with Obama being Obama.

OK, Zico. I made my point and you made yours.

[fast4522]

Makes you feel real good about Cuba Stinks, have you hugged a comrade today?

http://www.worldbulletin.net/world/151671/russia-tests-10-warhead-ballistic-missile