St.Louis Rams

[magwell]

There is no place in the NFL for this kind of action. These 5 players are condoning the violence, they are no better then the thugs that they are representing, sad day for the NFL.......

[horses4courses]

.
The NFL said Monday that it will not take disciplinary action against the players involved in the protest.
“We respect and understand the concerns of all individuals who have expressed views on this tragic situation,” spokesperson Brian McCarthy told USA Today Sports in a statement.

[Robert Fischer]

"The NFL said Monday that it will not take disciplinary action against the players involved in the protest.
“We respect and understand the concerns of all individuals who have expressed views on this tragic situation,” spokesperson Brian McCarthy told USA Today Sports in a statement. "

I would not be surprised if the NFL and Players Association quietly notified players that such demonstration would be ill-advised in the future.

[horses4courses]

I would not be surprised if the NFL and Players Association quietly notified players that such demonstration would be ill-advised in the future.

I would be surprised if such "advice" stayed secret very long.
Especially in this social media age.

[Marshall Bennett]

Seems almost par for the NFL and some of the radical scum within it.

[horses4courses]

Seems almost par for the NFL and some of the radical scum within it.

.....and of what race would those "radical scum" belong to?

Would they be similar to these guys???
How much has really changed in 46 years?

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B3ynCO4CIAABDkd.jpg:large

[JustRalph]

.....and of what race would those "radical scum" belong to?

Would they be similar to these guys???
How much has really changed in 46 years?


This is where you show your Lunacy. You really don't think much has changed?

Get a grip. The Prez is black. The Attorney General is black. There are Congressmen and Senators out the wazoo who are black. Including from southern States.

There is a female Indian Governor of a southern state! For Christ Sakes!

There are very high profile big city Police Chiefs who are black. Tons of other examples, yet you have this built in leftist need to exclaim that racism is rampant. It's how you keep your hold on the black vote.

It's unabashedly diabolical and intellectually dishonest. The fact that it has worked so long is a reflection of your constituency. The fact that the same constituency is starting break away is a bright spot.

[Robert Fischer]

How much has really changed...?

A lot has changed.

It's not hip to openly racist anymore.

People don't dislike blacks, they dislike the brutal ruffians who happen to be black. They dislike the hooligans and the rogues, not the race. The scoundrels and brutes and roughnecks. The thugs.

Police should shoot those thugs dead, those thugs deserve to die.

lol.

And that is hip. 'Thug' has nothing to do with race.
The fact that we rarely if ever? use the term 'thug' to describe non-blacks is irrelevant. The fact that that the term 'thug' is often associated with such things as style of dress, music, and other culture-related associations is also irrelevant.
If you're a police officer, and you see a thug, you assume and prepare for the worst scenario.
We've come a long way.

I know because the old-school people in my town just use the term "blacks".

[burnsy]

Who cares? They won 52-0.

Wow, they put their hands up....end of the world. Grow some hair where it counts get a grip, get a life. This is America, supposedly free until you offend someone that is. Too many old people without a clue. I'm getting old but I'm glad I'm not a bitter know it all. Newsflash, two or mores sides to every story, everything is not black and white. Some of the cops are jack asses and should not be in that position. I don't care what color you are! Its an outrage...blanket, blank.....yeah ok, I won't sleep tonight. How much money/time has the Rams and players donated to the PBA? Change from tighty whiteys to boxers because your panties are in a bunch like an old bitch.......

[thaskalos]

There is no place in the NFL for this kind of action. These 5 players are condoning the violence, they are no better then the thugs that they are representing, sad day for the NFL.......

I didn't see it that way. I saw a peaceful statement being made...and I had no problem with it. Should we all be marching to the same drummer? Give me a break...

[NJ Stinks]

Tons of other examples, yet you have this built in leftist need to exclaim that racism is rampant. It's how you keep your hold on the black vote.



Wrong. Blacks vote Democratic because the Republican party offers so much less to people who aren't wealthy.

Pretty simple to understand from where I sit.

[magwell]

I didn't see it that way. I saw a peaceful statement being made...and I had no problem with it. Should we all be marching to the same drummer? Give me a break...Its obvious you and I march to a different drummer, (not that there's anything wrong with that).....;)

[thaskalos]

Its obvious you and I march to a different drummer, (not that there's anything wrong with that).....;)
Of course there is nothing wrong with that. In fact, difference of opinion should be encouraged in a free society.

[proximity]

There is no place in the NFL for this kind of action. These 5 players are condoning the violence, they are no better then the thugs that they are representing, sad day for the NFL.......

if kenny britt is better than these thugs, it's not by much. the guy gets arrested almost every year. of course he's always innocent. :rolleyes:

[magwell]

So now suddenly the NFL allows 'freedom of speech.' Interesting. They certainly didn't take that approach back in May when Miami Dolphins defensive back Don Jones tweeted 'OMG' and 'Horrible' in reference to Michael Sam kissing his boyfriend when picked late in the draft.

Jones was fined and banned from team activities until he apologized and underwent so-called 'sensitivity training.' These clowns insult law enforcement and no problem, but Jones gets severely punished. How typically hypocritical of the NFL and all the folks who pressured them into this pile of BS.

So which is it NFL? Can players speak out or not? Can they only do it when it doesn't offend certain select groups.........

[horses4courses]

It's how you keep your hold on the black vote.

No compassion, whatsoever.
No concession that black people have any right to feel displeased by Ferguson.
Just another day in the world of US conservatives.
Keep doing what you're doing. Please.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B3z_OxtCMAA7J6f.jpg

[JustRalph]

http://www.ijreview.com/2014/12/210034-st-louis-police-profoundly-disappointed-in-rams/

St Louis cops weigh in........

[horses4courses]

http://www.ijreview.com/2014/12/210034-st-louis-police-profoundly-disappointed-in-rams/

St Louis cops weigh in........

http://media.salon.com/2014/12/wilson_rams.jpg

http://www.salon.com/2014/12/01/ferguson_nightmare_widens_rudy_giuliani_the_nfl_an d_cops_doubling_down_on_their_right_to_kill/?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=socialflow

That trademark arrogance has been taken to an extreme by the St. Louis Police Officers’ Association’s demand that the NFL discipline five St. Louis Rams players who participated in a pre-game “hands up, don’t shoot” protest of Mike Brown’s killing Sunday night. Appropriately, the NFL says no such discipline will be forthcoming; the cops also want an apology.

That a local police association thinks it is somehow bigger than the NFL, and that it has the power to curtail the First Amendment rights of football players, is just another example of the preemptive, aggressive self-defense that keeps police officers unaccountable for their transgressions.

[horses4courses]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/redskins/st-louis-rams-dont-shoot-gesture-was-free-speech-and-the-police-should-know-it/2014/12/01/a55c2656-7995-11e4-9a27-6fdbc612bff8_story.html

the First Amendment only protects free speech against government action. That’s all it does. It doesn’t protect the St. Louis players from NFL owners, or league commissioners, or talk radio hosts who disagree with them. But it does protect them from the government. So the person in danger of abusing the First Amendment here is not the football player with the edgy gesture in a public stadium. Or the NFL owner who might want to tell them to shut up to protect advertising. It’s the governmental agent — like, say, a cop — who seeks to punish someone for expressing certain views.

[horses4courses]

St. Louis County police are claiming that the Rams apologized for five players who made the gesture prior to Sunday's game. The team's VP denies that.

http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2014/12/1/7318029/rams-apologize-police-players-hands-up-gesture-ferguson-michael-brown

[rastajenk]

The op-ed cited in post #19 gets it totally wrong. The policeman's association is not using their position as "government agents" to punish the free expression of the Rams players. They are a collection of individuals exercising their right to respond as well. Not surprising, though, in this day and age, that a journalist whiffs on a First Amendment issue.

Some irony, too, in that the writer claims the cops can't refuse to do their jobs protecting football fans in protest, only days after cops were told not to do their jobs when the rioting was going on.

[burnsy]

Of course there is nothing wrong with that. In fact, difference of opinion should be encouraged in a free society.

You are often the voice of reason around here. We live in a society where you can voice any opinion you want, even if it offends some one (supposedly). There are some that think humans come out of a box and they should all be the same. In what freakin universe is that? These guys are not the scum breaking windows, stealing and burning buildings. That's the point, it's (supposedly) a free country. If black people could not do these things, who knows where they would be today....in a free country (supposedly). If you ask them they may have a different take on the "free country" statement people love to throw around.

I'm 52 years old and white. Last winter I had a run in with an asshole cop. Pulled me over, for a headlight, gave me a bunch of crap, a Breathalyzer which I passed with flying colors. Then he wanted to search my car. I objected and didn't move fast enough and he threatened to tackle me into a snow bank head first.....his words....it was 9 degrees that night, I'm 52, with health issues and a hearing aid. This guy was like maybe 30. Like I'm a real threat. He ran my license, came back I was never in trouble and he got all apologetic. Kind of late for that ass wipe. Guess what? Last month he got caught slapping someone in the face for the same type deal.......tape went viral.....bye, bye jack ass. I'll be looking for you at Price Chopper....paper or plastic? The amazing thing was not one other cop spoke up for this guy when he got in trouble.....he must of been a real beauty...... :rolleyes: If you think that job does not attract people that should not be doing it....you are a fool. It takes a certain type to be a good cop.

[rastajenk]

There are some that think humans come out of a box and they should all be the same. In what freakin universe is that? .The one envisioned by communists, socialists, progressives, statists, you know, the usual crew that supports thwarting individualism for "the greater good."

[MutuelClerk]

I'm not sure what's worse. The players protest or the cops mandating the team apologize. The players have a right to protest, true. I think this was done in poor taste after the facts of the case actually came out. But the cops come off holier than thou in wanting a apology. Once again when both sides screw up it's hard to side with one or the other....

[thaskalos]

You are often the voice of reason around here. We live in a society where you can voice any opinion you want, even if it offends some one (supposedly). There are some that think humans come out of a box and they should all be the same. In what freakin universe is that? These guys are not the scum breaking windows, stealing and burning buildings. That's the point, it's (supposedly) a free country. If black people could not do these things, who knows where they would be today....in a free country (supposedly). If you ask them they may have a different take on the "free country" statement people love to throw around.

I'm 52 years old and white. Last winter I had a run in with an asshole cop. Pulled me over, for a headlight, gave me a bunch of crap, a Breathalyzer which I passed with flying colors. Then he wanted to search my car. I objected and didn't move fast enough and he threatened to tackle me into a snow bank head first.....his words....it was 9 degrees that night, I'm 52, with health issues and a hearing aid. This guy was like maybe 30. Like I'm a real threat. He ran my license, came back I was never in trouble and he got all apologetic. Kind of late for that ass wipe. Guess what? Last month he got caught slapping someone in the face for the same type deal.......tape went viral.....bye, bye jack ass. I'll be looking for you at Price Chopper....paper or plastic? The amazing thing was not one other cop spoke up for this guy when he got in trouble.....he must of been a real beauty...... :rolleyes: If you think that job does not attract people that should not be doing it....you are a fool. It takes a certain type to be a good cop.
I don't remember the last time that I found myself disagreeing with one of your posts, burnsy. :ThmbUp:

I too am a 53 year old white guy...and I am as easygoing a guy as you are ever likely to meet. But I have the worst luck with cops that you can imagine. If only a tiny minority of these cops are a**holes...then I must have met all of them. Arrogant young guys, who think that they have the world's most dangerous job...even though they work in cities where violent crimes are a rarity. Just last night, as I was driving back home from the gym at 1 AM...there were two squad cars parked side-by-side on a side street...effectively closing off the driving lanes, and making it impossible for anyone else to go through. The squad cars were facing in opposite directions...and the two young cops driving them were just chatting with one another, without giving a shit that they were blocking traffic. I pulled up right behind one of them...and I swear to God, it took him 15 minutes to finally move his car and let me through. And the other cop was giving me dirty looks as I went by.

The arrogance of the cops in Niles and Morton Grove is not to be believed. Disgusting. :ThmbDown:

[Robert Fischer]

They are what they are...

It's systemic.

I don't blame the individual officers if they happen to be on a power trip, or arrogant/aggressive/thuggish, and I'm pleasantly surprised when they are fair and reasonable and polite.

There are good policeman who do their best in a high-stress job. There are even some who joined with an idealistic mindset and actually attained some of those ideals. :ThmbUp:

Systemic stuff is what it is. You try to see it clearly, and not be on the unfortunate end of events as best as possible.

Stuff like police warn cameras, and/or the freedom to peacefully(and without aggression) record traffic stops/interactions with your cell phone seems like a fair thing, but it's still a ways off from being a norm.

Same with lots of debatable practices and laws (for example setting up a speed-trap where the lay of the road produces a safe traffic flow faster than the posted limits) still have room for improvement.

But there's not much to do other than stay out of the unfortunate roles as much as possible.

[Tom]

Wrong. Blacks vote Democratic because the Republican party offers so much less to people who aren't wealthy.

Pretty simple to understand from where I sit.

And what do they offer?
Dependency, unemployment?

Funny how you dems always say you are best for the Black Man, but also say we are a racist society and Black have made o progress............guess that is all on your guys.

Not that anyone should give a crap what a stupid football player thinks, but come on.....it was an insult to the cops. It is a given the no hands were ever raised.

[Tom]

Of course there is nothing wrong with that. In fact, difference of opinion should be encouraged in a free society.

So if a cop stand outside the stadium and makes the Bang Bang sign with his fingers, you are OK with that?

[thaskalos]

So if a cop stand outside the stadium and makes the Bang Bang sign with his fingers, you are OK with that?

A cop with a sense of humor? Impossible!

[Robert Fischer]

police warn cameras

"worn" :)

[JustRalph]

Police Departments develop personalities. They come from the top. Take my word for it.

[thaskalos]

Police Departments develop personalities. They come from the top. Take my word for it.

I agree with you, JR. And criminals develop personalities too...which also come from the top.

[horses4courses]

Another spokesperson of the Right:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B34ybIsIMAAwvaZ.png

[proximity]

tavon austin scored a seven on his wonderlic, so maybe mr o'reilly is onto something?

kenny britt scored a 21. a number slightly higher than his career arrests total. a smarter criminal. :rolleyes:

[newtothegame]

No problem here with the right of an individual to express himself.
No problem with a group of individuals expressing their concerns.....
HUGE problem with a group, under the guise of the Rams, to express this.
At that moment, they are employees of the Rams and ultimately the NFL.
They are the face of the business and should act accordingly.

[Stillriledup]

There is no place in the NFL for this kind of action. These 5 players are condoning the violence, they are no better then the thugs that they are representing, sad day for the NFL.......

This was not any kind of support for Mike Brown (not the NBA Coach) and his thuggery,it was more of a statement that said we dont like how the police treat our race.

[upthecreek]

Say it aint so:
http://sportact.net/bar-boycotts-rams-st-louis-sports-bar-stops-happy-hour-rams-games-4948-2014/

[newtothegame]

ohhhh its more then just happy hour......

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/03/sports/football/police-officers-association-condemns-st-louis-rams-players-display.html?_r=0

Now I heard on the radio (not in the above story), that the NY police union is also saying that if and when the Rams visit the Meadowlands, they might want to consider who to call for security as their officers might not wish to provide security for that game......

[Robert Fischer]

This was not any kind of support for Mike Brown (not the NBA Coach) and his thuggery,it was more of a statement that said we dont like how the police treat our race.
Pretty much.

Neither political 'side' that took up the cheering in this case gives a ram's ass about what actually happened.

Their was a market for it, so naturally both sides were opportunists who abused the power of the media.

The black gripe is basically "Stop treating black men like threatening terrorists" "Stop treating those who have an urban culture or fashion as terrorists"
and the gripe of the population as a whole is "Tone down the abuse of police power" "Tone down violence towards citizens as much as possible and wear a camera and have a dash cam on".

Nobody cares that Brown was a definite piece of shit, who quite possibly attacked the officer as alleged.
It's symbolic.

[Dark Horse]

Compared to other first world countries (is the US still among those?), the police is out of control in the US. No question about it. The guy that was shot is just one of many, but most are just shrugged off. Sad to say, I would consider the police in the US today on par with the Nazi SS. They're a militarized form of what they should be, and what they are in other first world countries.

On a sidenote, I'm getting pretty tired of all the nonsensical media hyping of the US military as well. They're not protecting our freedom by waging war in the Middle East or Afghanistan. Who are we kidding? They're there because the US is a corporate fascist regime. Those wars are about corporate profits (and/or protecting the petrodollar). Legal or illegal. Don't believe it? The Taliban had all but wiped out the poppy fields in Afghanistan. That was before the US army entered. Today, the heroin production is the highest ever. Does it really have to be spelled out who is behind that? Stop saluting people just because they wear uniforms. It doesn't make them heroes, and it doesn't even place them on the right side of the law.

"they say that patriotism is the last refuge to which a scoundrel clings,
steal a little and they throw you in jail, steal a lot and they make you king."

[Dark Horse]

Arresting people, in this country, is a business. Because the prison system is for profit. That's why the US has such an absurdly high incarceration rate:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarceration_rate

[thaskalos]

Compared to other first world countries (is the US still among those?), the police is out of control in the US. No question about it. The guy that was shot is just one of many, but most are just shrugged off. Sad to say, I would consider the police in the US today on par with the Nazi SS. They're a militarized form of what they should be, and what they are in other first world countries.

On a sidenote, I'm getting pretty tired of all the nonsensical media hyping of the US military as well. They're not protecting our freedom by waging war in the Middle East or Afghanistan. Who are we kidding? They're there because the US is a corporate fascist regime. Those wars are about corporate profits (and/or protecting the petrodollar). Legal or illegal. Don't believe it? The Taliban had all but wiped out the poppy fields in Afghanistan. That was before the US army entered. Today, the heroin production is the highest ever. Does it really have to be spelled out who is behind that? Stop saluting people just because they wear uniforms. It doesn't make them heroes, and it doesn't even place them on the right side of the law.

"they say that patriotism is the last refuge to which a scoundrel clings,
steal a little and they throw you in jail, steal a lot and they make you king."

Who said this? :ThmbUp:

[Dark Horse]

Who said this? :ThmbUp:

The song is by Bob Dylan, but he quotes Samuel Johnson.

"Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel". - Samuel Johnson, April 7, 1775

[AndyC]

Arresting people, in this country, is a business. Because the prison system is for profit. That's why the US has such an absurdly high incarceration rate:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarceration_rate

Perhaps you might want to redo your math. I am not seeing a big revenue side of this equation.

[JustRalph]

Compared to other first world countries (is the US still among those?), the police is out of control in the US. No question about it. The guy that was shot is just one of many, but most are just shrugged off. Sad to say, I would consider the police in the US today on par with the Nazi SS. They're a militarized form of what they should be, and what they are in other first world countries.

On a sidenote, I'm getting pretty tired of all the nonsensical media hyping of the US military as well. They're not protecting our freedom by waging war in the Middle East or Afghanistan. Who are we kidding? They're there because the US is a corporate fascist regime. Those wars are about corporate profits (and/or protecting the petrodollar). Legal or illegal. Don't believe it? The Taliban had all but wiped out the poppy fields in Afghanistan. That was before the US army entered. Today, the heroin production is the highest ever. Does it really have to be spelled out who is behind that? Stop saluting people just because they wear uniforms. It doesn't make them heroes, and it doesn't even place them on the right side of the law.

"they say that patriotism is the last refuge to which a scoundrel clings,
steal a little and they throw you in jail, steal a lot and they make you king."

utter bullshit............ sad that you feel that way

[Stillriledup]

Say it aint so:
http://sportact.net/bar-boycotts-rams-st-louis-sports-bar-stops-happy-hour-rams-games-4948-2014/

A few people are letting "Time out" have it a bit on Yelp.

http://www.yelp.com/biz/time-out-sports-bar-and-grill-saint-louis

[Dark Horse]

utter bullshit............ sad that you feel that way

The truth hurts. Man, is there a web for you to unravel. If you choose to accept the mission.

Start anywhere. Such as 'heroin afghanistan all time high' in the big google machine.

This message will self destruct in ten seconds.

“I see in the near future a crisis approaching that unnerves me and causes me to tremble for the safety of my country. . . . corporations have been enthroned and an era of corruption in high places will follow, and the money power of the country will endeavor to prolong its reign by working upon the prejudices of the people until all wealth is aggregated in a few hands and the Republic is destroyed.”
—U.S. President Abraham Lincoln, Nov. 21, 1864

[JustRalph]

The first paragraph of your screed is crap. There are two hundred thousand contacts with citizens every day by police officers. Btw, find me a police shooting that was "just shrugged off"

I agree the police using tanks etc, and swat is a joke nowadays, I believe tons of this stuff is over the top and have said so here before. But your first paragraph is a joke. Nazi SS officers? Really? Either you don't know history or you are just prone to hyperbole

[Tom]

Compared to other first world countries (is the US still among those?), the police is out of control in the US. No question about it. The guy that was shot is just one of many, but most are just shrugged off. Sad to say, I would consider the police in the US today on par with the Nazi SS.

This is, without a doubt, the stupidest post EVER on Paceadvantage, if not the whole damn internet.

You have no clue what the SS was like.
And to compare our cops to them, you are a fool.

[Clocker]

Compared to other first world countries (is the US still among those?), the police is out of control in the US. No question about it. The guy that was shot is just one of many, but most are just shrugged off. Sad to say, I would consider the police in the US today on par with the Nazi SS. They're a militarized form of what they should be, and what they are in other first world countries.

Charles Barkley doesn't agree with you:

Speaking to CNN on Tuesday, Barkley stated that if it wasn’t for police, the ghetto would be like the “wild, wild west.”

“The notion that white cops are out there just killing black people – that’s ridiculous. That’s just flat-out ridiculous,” the TNT basketball analyst told CNN. “I challenge any black person to try to make that point. Cops are actually awesome. They are the only thing in the ghetto between this place being the wild, wild west. So this notion that cops are out there just killing black men is ridiculous and I hate that narrative coming out of this entire situation.”

CBS News (http://stlouis.cbslocal.com/2014/12/03/barkley-defends-police-following-ferguson/)

[PaceAdvantage]

Sad to say, I would consider the police in the US today on par with the Nazi SS.Sad to say, I consider you insane, or else wholly and without a doubt somehow 100% ignorant of what life was like under the Nazi SS.

You should be deeply ashamed of what you just wrote. I would get your brain checked out...and I'm not joking or trying to be a smartass.

[rastajenk]

You guys are in for it now. He put me on Ignore :eek: merely for schooling him on racing DQ's.

[Clocker]

You guys are in for it now. He put me on Ignore :eek: merely for schooling him on racing DQ's.

My God man, how can you sleep at night? :rolleyes:

[Dark Horse]

This is, without a doubt, the stupidest post EVER on Paceadvantage, if not the whole damn internet.

You have no clue what the SS was like.
And to compare our cops to them, you are a fool.

Do some research into 'no knock raids'. My guess is that you've never heard of them. http://www.policestateusa.com/tag/no-knock-raid/

To others whom I may have offended. That was not my intent. I believe in a free America, which is a high ideal set forth by the Founding Fathers. It is painful to me to see that the majority of Americans have no clue that this ideal is being flushed down the drain. The earlier Lincoln quote is very meaningful. Today we have corporate fascism. You think your vote counts, but it's already sold to the corporations who funded the election campaigns. For a better understanding of what happened, and a historical account of how our predecessors kept the enemy outside of the gate, read this: http://www.iamthewitness.com/DarylBradfordSmith_Bankers.htm

After you let that sink in, get back to me. If it's too much to ask to read it, don't tell me you're a patriot or even remotely interested in a free America. Without the economic understanding of what made the 'American Dream' possible, you'll completely miss the point.

Remember, there is a difference in what you want to believe, and what is true. I'm assuming everyone here has the maturity to keep those two apart. There is no need to inject emotion, or anger, into the discussion. The only thing that matters are the facts. Even if they contradict deep-seated beliefs.

[Dark Horse]

Sad to say, I consider you insane, or else wholly and without a doubt somehow 100% ignorant of what life was like under the Nazi SS.

Believe it or not, there are seventy to eighty thousand no knock raids per year in this country.

That's where the police breaks down your door, storms into your home, and puts a gun in your face, while you were sleeping. Insane, indeed.

Do you also wish to challenge the insanely high incarceration rate in the US?

More on the rapidly emerging police state: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/john-w-whitehead/life-in-the-emerging-amer_b_4519241.html

[Tom]

Believe it or not, there are seventy to eighty thousand no knock raids per year in this country.

How many were herded into rail cars and sent to the showers?
You started out as ignorant and have graduated to disgusting.

[Spiderman]

Do some research into 'no knock raids'. My guess is that you've never heard of them. http://www.policestateusa.com/tag/no-knock-raid/

To others whom I may have offended. That was not my intent. I believe in a free America, which is a high ideal set forth by the Founding Fathers. It is painful to me to see that the majority of Americans have no clue that this ideal is being flushed down the drain. The earlier Lincoln quote is very meaningful. Today we have corporate fascism. You think your vote counts, but it's already sold to the corporations who funded the election campaigns. For a better understanding of what happened, and a historical account of how our predecessors kept the enemy outside of the gate, read this: http://www.iamthewitness.com/DarylBradfordSmith_Bankers.htm

After you let that sink in, get back to me. If it's too much to ask to read it, don't tell me you're a patriot or even remotely interested in a free America. Without the economic understanding of what made the 'American Dream' possible, you'll completely miss the point.

Remember, there is a difference in what you want to believe, and what is true. I'm assuming everyone here has the maturity to keep those two apart. There is no need to inject emotion, or anger, into the discussion. The only thing that matters are the facts. Even if they contradict deep-seated beliefs.

The full context of the linked exposition of the world banking community, www.iamthewitness.com/DarylBradfordSmith_Bankers.htm, should be read by all. There will be no way to thwart the bankers from world domination unless the population rebuffs the attempts at division and corruption created by the "money changers."

The timeline is a fascinating read. I will re-read it and look to affirm or contradict any anomalies. Open-minded discussion would best serve to foster a departure from the practices that enslave world populations through financial manipulation and control.

[Clocker]

Believe it or not, there are seventy to eighty thousand no knock raids per year in this country.


No knock raids are not the problem, they are the symptom of big government, of politicians who think they know better than you how you should live your life, and of voters who are willing to give up liberty in exchange for perceived security.

[Robert Fischer]

Believe it or not, there are seventy to eighty thousand no knock raids per year in this country.
You seem to have some level of insight into the system and feel very strongly about it emotionally.

The SS comparisons and anything related is not going to 'enlighten' anyone to your opinion that you feel so strongly about. It's only going to close doors, and give a (good) reason for others to ignore all of the points that you present whether some of them are fact-based or not.

This thread has probably graduated to Off-topic or 'closed/start a new thread' fame by now, unless we want to talk about the hapless Rams and their 4-3 record in the last 7 games and resurgence in their running game and defense...

[PaceAdvantage]

Believe it or not, there are seventy to eighty thousand no knock raids per year in this country.

That's where the police breaks down your door, storms into your home, and puts a gun in your face, while you were sleeping. Insane, indeed.

Do you also wish to challenge the insanely high incarceration rate in the US?

More on the rapidly emerging police state: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/john-w-whitehead/life-in-the-emerging-amer_b_4519241.htmlAre those no-knock raids also without a warrant? Something tells me the answer to that question is a big fat no.

I'm not going to disagree with you that law enforcement isn't stepping over the bounds in some cases. And I'm not going to disagree with you that we've given up a lot of freedoms and rights over the years in the name of security.

But to put police in this country on par with the worst Nazi Germany had to offer during WWII...if that's your stance? Then I couldn't apologize to you for my comments even if I wanted to.

[thaskalos]

Compared to other first world countries (is the US still among those?), the police is out of control in the US. No question about it. The guy that was shot is just one of many, but most are just shrugged off. Sad to say, I would consider the police in the US today on par with the Nazi SS. They're a militarized form of what they should be, and what they are in other first world countries.

On a sidenote, I'm getting pretty tired of all the nonsensical media hyping of the US military as well. They're not protecting our freedom by waging war in the Middle East or Afghanistan. Who are we kidding? They're there because the US is a corporate fascist regime. Those wars are about corporate profits (and/or protecting the petrodollar). Legal or illegal. Don't believe it? The Taliban had all but wiped out the poppy fields in Afghanistan. That was before the US army entered. Today, the heroin production is the highest ever. Does it really have to be spelled out who is behind that? Stop saluting people just because they wear uniforms. It doesn't make them heroes, and it doesn't even place them on the right side of the law.

"they say that patriotism is the last refuge to which a scoundrel clings,
steal a little and they throw you in jail, steal a lot and they make you king."
Your SS reference has overshadowed the other excellent points that you have made in this thread. Start another thread, leaving out the SS comparisons...and we'll have a thread which will rival the religious thread, in both length, and longevity.

This is a great topic, and it deserves its own thread...and there is no one better than you to start it.

[Stillriledup]

Your SS reference has overshadowed the other excellent points that you have made in this thread. Start another thread, leaving out the SS comparisons...and we'll have a thread which will rival the religious thread, in both length, and longevity.

This is a great topic, and it deserves its own thread...and there is no one better than you to start it.

But what if he really believes what he wrote? Who are we to not just respectfully disagree with his opinion?

[thaskalos]

But what if he really believes what he wrote? Who are we to not just respectfully disagree with his opinion?
He really believes what...that the police in the United States is like Germany's SS?

[Stillriledup]

He really believes what...that the police in the United States is like Germany's SS?

that's what he said, right?

Or, maybe he doesn't believe it deep down and just let his emotions get in the way, its a hard sell to compare them to the Not-c's, but if you're ever going to make this reference, its here and now with all this Ferguson stuff and the choking situation in NY....American cops not looking good these days.

[thaskalos]

that's what he said, right?

Or, maybe he doesn't believe it deep down and just let his emotions get in the way, its a hard sell to compare them to the Not-c's, but if you're ever going to make this reference, its here and now with all this Ferguson stuff and the choking situation in NY....American cops not looking good these days.
Look, SRU...all of us exaggerate from time to time, in order to make our point. But there have been some evils in this world which have caused unspeakable anguish for many millions of people. And we shouldn't carelessly throw around comparisons involving these evils without first realizing what we are doing.

[Dark Horse]

Are those no-knock raids also without a warrant? Something tells me the answer to that question is a big fat no.

Remember that when unknown intruders break into your house at night, and you reach for a gun in self-defense...

When these things happen to others, they happen to us. When they shoot an innocent grandmother, in the wrong house, that is our grandmother.

I'm not going to disagree with you that law enforcement isn't stepping over the bounds in some cases. And I'm not going to disagree with you that we've given up a lot of freedoms and rights over the years in the name of security.

But to put police in this country on par with the worst Nazi Germany had to offer during WWII...if that's your stance? Then I couldn't apologize to you for my comments even if I wanted to.

You're going to have to decide what's more important. The systematic destruction of 'America' from within, or my using a few words that might piss some people off.

I don't have a stance about our police. A stance would require defending. Mine is an observation. I will soften that observation somewhat. At this point the police in this country is not at the same level as the SS at its height. That takes time, because it's a process, as well as part of a bigger underlying process and problem. From what I've observed in post 9/11 America, I have no doubt that a fascist program is well underway, and that, along with it, police brutality will increase until we, the People, stand up for our freedoms. Unfortunately, as in Nazi Germany, the majority of the people are simply unwilling to believe that such a dark scenario could possibly be upon them. As in Nazi Germany, they are hypnotized by a powerful propaganda machine (and don't even know it). If America, as it was originally intended, is important to us, it is up to each of us to wake up, stand up, and help turn the tide. If we don't, it will just roll on, and go from bad to worse.

[Dark Horse]

Your SS reference has overshadowed the other excellent points that you have made in this thread. Start another thread, leaving out the SS comparisons...and we'll have a thread which will rival the religious thread, in both length, and longevity.

This is a great topic, and it deserves its own thread...and there is no one better than you to start it.

Maybe at some point. I get the sense that could run into a bit of opposition. lol (which is fine, btw). FWIW, the previously linked 'History of the Money Changers' is the most eye-opening publication I've ever read about the economy. Just that one article will get people thinking about what is going on in this country in a much clearer light. I read it years ago and am still letting it fully sink in.

[JustRalph]

when you get done with "no knock" raids.....which are specifically approved by judges btw, move on to " house to house searches under exigent circumstances" or maybe "hot pursuit" I'm sure you can find a bunch of those too........

How about shooting a fleeing felon? There are a million cases out there ......get on it.............

[duncan04]

I would not be surprised if the NFL and Players Association quietly notified players that such demonstration would be ill-advised in the future.


Its funny the NFL is ok with that but made RG III change his shirt?? And those players know all about hands up since they all have rap sheets.

[Spiderman]

Maybe at some point. I get the sense that could run into a bit of opposition. lol (which is fine, btw). FWIW, the previously linked 'History of the Money Changers' is the most eye-opening publication I've ever read about the economy. Just that one article will get people thinking about what is going on in this country in a much clearer light. I read it years ago and am still letting it fully sink in.

The "History of the Money Changers" would certainly be a stand-alone posting. There is a "wealth" (pun intended) of historic information that all who read would find interesting.

[PaceAdvantage]

Why do I cringe when I see the term "Money Changers?"

Is this going to be another thinly-veiled "Jews control the world" rant?

Enlighten me...plus...are we far enough OFF TOPIC yet? :faint:

[Dark Horse]

Why do I cringe when I see the term "Money Changers?"

Is this going to be another thinly-veiled "Jews control the world" rant?

Enlighten me...plus...are we far enough OFF TOPIC yet? :faint:

No idea. Because Christ threw them out?

For an understanding of the US today you would need a historical context and understanding of the financial system. Read up on Benjamin Franklin and his views on the matter.

Not off topic at all, because this police force, and the usual coverup of its brutalities, including cold-blooded murders, is an extension of corporate fascism.

In any case, one of the greater ironies hovering over the human race is that its vast majority is far more offended by a (perceived) attack on personal beliefs than by an actual and persistent attack on their freedom.

[Clocker]

No idea. Because Christ threw them out?

No, it's because the conspiracy theorists used to rant about the "Jew Bankers" and the "Shylocks" controlling the world. As western society became more politically correct, the conspiracy crowd adapted, and switched to the term "money changers".

[Dark Horse]

The "History of the Money Changers" would certainly be a stand-alone posting. There is a "wealth" (pun intended) of historic information that all who read would find interesting.

:ThmbUp:

No, it's because the conspiracy theorists used to rant about the "Jew Bankers" and the "Shylocks" controlling the world. As western society became more politically correct, the conspiracy crowd adapted, and switched to the term "money changers".

People have many defense mechanisms around their unfounded beliefs. This is because the ego is invested in those beliefs (in a scientific environment such lack of objectivity would be quickly revealed as a weakness). The use of the term 'conspirary theorist' is prevalent among these defense mechanisms. This concept revolves around the idea that the approval of others gives credibility to unfounded beliefs. Also, in a subtle manner, it warns people not to step outside of the officially approved theories (similar to the use of 'heretics' in days gone by). As such, the use of the term is almost exclusively reserved to the intellectually lazy.

As suggested before, the only things that should matter, in thought exchanges such as these, are the facts. I simply note that among the objections I have not seen a single reference to the historical concept of what America stands for. If you don't understand what set the original America apart from the rest of the world, you would also lack the awareness to defend that great country. By definition. You wouldn't even know if the enemy was inside or outside of the gates, because you would lack the ability to recognize the opposing forces. Dream on dear friends. It is an interesting interpretation of 'the American Dream', but so be it.

[cj's dad]

Isn't this thread titled "St. Louis Rams"?

[Clocker]

:ThmbUp:



the use of the term is almost exclusively reserved to the intellectually lazy.


As intellectually lazy as dismissing a comment as "defense mechanisms around their unfounded beliefs" without foundation?

I have looked into the "money changer" narrative at length over the years, and it is my personal conclusion, not belief, that it is a conspiracy theory.

Believe what you want. I believe, based on objective evaluation, that it is a conspiracy theory. Sorry I mentioned it, because I don't have the inclination to spend any time or effort here debunking it.

But certainly no one can deny that the "money changer" narrative has been around for centuries, and they were previously referred to as the "Jewish Bankers".

[Robert Fischer]

Looking at the system itself is 'boring', and it raises deep questions, and it takes a lot of thought and reflection to go from systemic insight, to some rational philosophy/opinion about the system.

What the manipulators do instead, is to focus on things like religion, race, ethnicity, emotion, fear, envy, etc...

A lot more fun, and more effective on the public. The dissemination of what is claimed to be 'insight' is generally itself a form of propaganda designed to benefit the author and his group within the same system.

That white cop who choked-out that black man Eric Garner. Those Jewish bankers.

etc etc etc...

telltale signs

[Clocker]

That white cop who choked-out that black man Eric Garner. Those Jewish bankers.

etc etc etc...

telltale signs

Exactly. It's called the Rumpelstiltskin Syndrome, named after the fairy tale. If you can put a name on something, you understand it and have control of the situation.

Edited to add: Having put the name "Rumpelstiltskin Syndrome" on this situation, I now fully understand it. :p

[duncan04]

Isn't this thread titled "St. Louis Rams"?

Yeah but like most threads here, it veers off topic to never return to it. :D

[Dark Horse]

More on the police state that people are closing their eyes to, in the blind hope that it may be a mere theory...

https://www.rutherford.org/publications_resources/john_whiteheads_commentary/the_game_is_rigged_why_americans_keep_losing_to_th e_police_state

[burnsy]

Isn't this thread titled "St. Louis Rams"?

That's a fallacy too......it was never about the Rams. Of course, the morons out there tried to make it about the Rams. It was 5 players......from the Rams. 5 individuals making a statement....that became radio, talk show fodder and contention. People turn it into the biggest deal that it is like a police state because....what? The police are infallible and beyond question? Which is the definition of a police state. Half these people should go back to the "political forum thread" where they belong. If they spent half as much energy actually learning about football maybe they could pick a winner. But they would rather bitch about something....anything...as long as they hear each other bitching about something......... :rolleyes: don't worry the democrats and republicans are going to fix it all too.....give me a freakin break

[Clocker]

http://1-ps.googleusercontent.com/xk/-VEEfGChBP5mgx8qY_eD0fhvW8/www.powerlineblog.com/i2.wp.com/www.powerlineblog.com/admin/ed-assets/2014/12/xPlayoffs-copy.jpg,qresize=500,P2C309.pagespeed.ic.SN_sSdwCJ RRuvf1ww16U.jpg.