Monmouth Park taking sports bets Sun Sept 14.

[Stillriledup]

BKS mentions this in the sports betting thread, but i thought this deserved a thread of its own and to ask this question:

Will sports betting at Monmouth Park help the attendance and horse racing handle, or will it just help the attendance?

At any rate, i'd predict Breeders Cup standing room only type crowds for Sunday if indeed sports betting is really going to be in play.

2nd week of NFL, why would the place not be jam packed if you can bet NFL?

[Shemp Howard]

Know you know why the Haskell was sponsored by William Hill, the London bookmaker, and is also the name on the new bar area at Monmouth.

[horses4courses]

Know you know why the Haskell was sponsored by William Hill, the London bookmaker, and is also the name on the new bar area at Monmouth.

Rest assured, if they are allowed to open for business on Sunday, they will do a good job.
I'm not their biggest fan when it comes to their business strategy in Nevada,
but I realize what their obstacles have been, and what their goals ultimately are in the US.
I applaud them for taking the risk to get established
in the US market, primarily in Nevada.
It remains to be seen if their efforts will succeed.

Other bookmaking companies could have attempted a similar venture.
They did not, and Will Hill deserves to get a strong foothold, should expansion ever be possible over here. They have run a reputable bookmaking company for close to a century now. Customer satisfaction is something they strive for, and they have always been highly regarded within the UK bookmaking industry. They seldom shy away from taking a large wager, either - on just about any competitive event.

[Mineshaft]

damn wished i lived in Jersey.

[Hoofless_Wonder]

The novelty of betting the NFL will probably attract a pretty good crowd on Sunday. Six weeks should flush out many of the squarres and wannabes.

I gotta believe the handle on the ponies will go up a smidge, especially around 4:30 PM....

[Canarsie]

BKS mentions this in the sports betting thread, but i thought this deserved a thread of its own and to ask this question:

Will sports betting at Monmouth Park help the attendance and horse racing handle, or will it just help the attendance?

At any rate, i'd predict Breeders Cup standing room only type crowds for Sunday if indeed sports betting is really going to be in play.

2nd week of NFL, why would the place not be jam packed if you can bet NFL?

Once again because you can pick up a phone and there's no need to drive, wager, and then being held hostage staying there till you can cash.

First week at Monmouth how about a friendly $25 donation to the Permanently Disabled Jockeys Fund loser pays. Lets set the number at 1/4 of Breeders Cup day say 10,000.

https://www.pdjf.org/

Balls in your court. Plus you can bust my balls till eternity.

[1st time lasix]

damn wished i lived in Jersey. ****** that's something I never thought i would ever hear.....

[RunForTheRoses]

damn wished i lived in Jersey.

Lol that might be the first time someone has said that

I do live in jersey and I hadn't read that MP will be open Sunday for SB but I'll be there at least briefly Sunday. Wonder if it will be full Vegas type book with straight bets and MLB etc or more like Delaware

[RunForTheRoses]

****** that's something I never thought i would ever hear.....
Beat me to it

[Mineshaft]

Lol that might be the first time someone has said that

I do live in jersey and I hadn't read that MP will be open Sunday for SB but I'll be there at least briefly Sunday. Wonder if it will be full Vegas type book with straight bets and MLB etc or more like Delaware




If its parlays card then screw that. If it straight bets, parlays, teasers, 1st half bets, 2nd half bets then you might have something.

[wiffleball whizz]

They will be taking EVERYTING.....

First half second half, money lines the whole 9 yards

I'm assuming they will have EVERYTING on the William hill website.....will be great

[onefast99]

The type of bets at MP will not be limited to the Delaware Racino platform. Hill will allow as many types of wagering he can.

[RunForTheRoses]

They will be taking EVERYTING.....

First half second half, money lines the whole 9 yards

I'm assuming they will have EVERYTING on the William hill website.....will be great

Great so I can parlay NYY UN to Packers ML to ...
Finally some sanity in the world

[cj]

Matt Hegarty ‏@DRFHegarty (https://twitter.com/DRFHegarty) 14m (https://twitter.com/DRFHegarty/status/509715393540157440) Dennis Drazin, head of Monmouth Park, says track will not offer sports wagering until at least mid-Oct.

[wiffleball whizz]

Matt Hegarty ‏@DRFHegarty (https://twitter.com/DRFHegarty) 14m (https://twitter.com/DRFHegarty/status/509715393540157440) Dennis Drazin, head of Monmouth Park, says track will not offer sports wagering until at least mid-Oct.

How foolish can I be.....

This will never get off the ground....and I'm walking around pondering going to mth this weekend...

[RunForTheRoses]

How foolish can I be.....

This will never get off the ground....and I'm walking around pondering going to mth this weekend...
It does make sense to wait for the court ruling before charging ahead. I will believe it when I see it but one thing in favor of SB is the dire condition of the Jersey economy with casinos closing left and right. Tax revenues have to be tanking, scary situation.

[onefast99]

Matt Hegarty ‏@DRFHegarty (https://twitter.com/DRFHegarty) 14m (https://twitter.com/DRFHegarty/status/509715393540157440) Dennis Drazin, head of Monmouth Park, says track will not offer sports wagering until at least mid-Oct.
The move was intended to reassure those facilities that they can offer wagering without fear of state reprisal, so long as no betting occurs on college sports or college athletic events in New Jersey, or on any of the state's college teams, regardless of where they play.

But it remains to be seen whether any facilities open up their books to wagering before it's clear the move does not violate a federal ban on sports betting, and before they know whether federal authorities will intervene in the absence of state enforcement.

"I don’t think any [casinos] are going to be taking any sports bets unless they got some ruling from a federal court that says this is OK – and they won’t," said I. Nelson Rose, a law professor and expert in gaming law at Whittier Law School in California. "What Christie is telling the casinos to do is to violate federal law, and it’s a criminal law and the normal remedies for criminal law is to be arrested.”

[Stillriledup]

The move was intended to reassure those facilities that they can offer wagering without fear of state reprisal, so long as no betting occurs on college sports or college athletic events in New Jersey, or on any of the state's college teams, regardless of where they play.

But it remains to be seen whether any facilities open up their books to wagering before it's clear the move does not violate a federal ban on sports betting, and before they know whether federal authorities will intervene in the absence of state enforcement.

"I don’t think any [casinos] are going to be taking any sports bets unless they got some ruling from a federal court that says this is OK – and they won’t," said I. Nelson Rose, a law professor and expert in gaming law at Whittier Law School in California. "What Christie is telling the casinos to do is to violate federal law, and it’s a criminal law and the normal remedies for criminal law is to be arrested.”

So instead, they would rather have people betting with illegal bookies where the biggest bets are not monitored by anyone. Integrity at a much higher standard if a bettor shows up with cash in a casino or racetrack to place that wager. Why sports leagues are allowed to get away with arguing that legal sports betting would hurt their brand is beyond me.

[Redboard]

If you are getting any supplements with this situation, instead of increasing purses why don’t you reduce takeout for the rest of the meet? And not by just a few percentage points, say 15% for ALL bets.

[onefast99]

So instead, they would rather have people betting with illegal bookies where the biggest bets are not monitored by anyone. Integrity at a much higher standard if a bettor shows up with cash in a casino or racetrack to place that wager. Why sports leagues are allowed to get away with arguing that legal sports betting would hurt their brand is beyond me.
The feds are not happy with this move they are requesting more time to evaluate it, such the way gov't works these days. Dennis Drazin will make sure there will be no arrests for those making bets on the much coveted grounds of Monmouth Park. Arrests could also mean another black eye for Christie, who at this point needs no further attention drawn to him!

[onefast99]

If you are getting any supplements with this situation, instead of increasing purses why don’t you reduce takeout for the rest of the meet? And not by just a few percentage points, say 15% for ALL bets.
The meet is almost over. There won't be any purse increases they just cut them on 8-10. Reasons for cutting them were simple, they went with better races that resulted in bigger purses and field size instead of more lower level claiming races with smaller purses.

[Redboard]

The meet is almost over. There won't be any purse increases they just cut them on 8-10. Reasons for cutting them were simple, they went with better races that resulted in bigger purses and field size instead of more lower level claiming races with smaller purses.

There are three weekends left, but, apparently they are going to wait until after the meet before they try instituting sports betting, so the horses aren't carted off to federal prison.

Oh well, it was fun while it lasted.

[SandyW]

As I said before, sports betting in New Jersey has as much of a chance of going into effect as I do of hitting a pix 6 ticket without placing a bet.
IN OTHER WORDS, ZERO CHANCE.

[onefast99]

As I said before, sports betting in New Jersey has as much of a chance of going into effect as I do of hitting a pix 6 ticket without placing a bet.
IN OTHER WORDS, ZERO CHANCE.
You are entitled to your opinion. Hopefully they sort out the details that are preventing this from moving forward.

[SandyW]

You are entitled to your opinion. Hopefully they sort out the details that are preventing this from moving forward.

Nothing will help Atlantic City or New Jersey, they have had a bad business plan from the beginning and now the chickens are coming home to roost.

[onefast99]

Nothing will help Atlantic City or New Jersey, they have had a bad business plan from the beginning and now the chickens are coming home to roost.
Sports wagering is a nice revenue stream. I do understand your disgust with AC that's why their was a meeting recently that discussed casino expansion to Jersey City and the Meadowlands. NJ isn't dead they are just dealing with lots of problems past administrations left untouched!

[SandyW]

Sports wagering is a nice revenue stream. I do understand your disgust with AC that's why their was a meeting recently that discussed casino expansion to Jersey City and the Meadowlands. NJ isn't dead they are just dealing with lots of problems past administrations left untouched!

Governor Christie should issue a directive that casino gambling can start up immediately at the Meadowlands not in 2016 when it will be to late.
The horse is out of the barn with casino gambling expanding in all the states that surround New Jersey.
This is the only thing that can save the gambling revenue stream for New Jersey.
THE GOVERNOR MUST ACT NOW WITHOUT DELAY.

[onefast99]

Governor Christie should issue a directive that casino gambling can start up immediately at the Meadowlands not in 2016 when it will be to late.
The horse is out of the barn with casino gambling expanding in all the states that surround New Jersey.
This is the only thing that can save the gambling revenue stream for New Jersey.
THE GOVERNOR MUST ACT NOW WITHOUT DELAY.
It isn't that easy. You have the southern NJ contingency who oppose any other casinos in the state. That has been the issue for years. Now they see their sand castles crumbling but still think AC is worth bailing out again. The Pegasus was to be the VLT center once the big M got the slots but now Gural has those rights. Should be interesting over the next 3 to 4 weeks.

[Stillriledup]

If NJ opened a full casino in the Meadowlands area about 10 years ago, they would have made so much money they wouldn't be able to count it all. The just left SO much money on the table, BILLIONS were tossed away, all they needed was a 5 star hotel (or 3) and a massive casino offering all casino games as well as full sports betting menu.

[SandyW]

If NJ opened a full casino in the Meadowlands area about 10 years ago, they would have made so much money they wouldn't be able to count it all. The just left SO much money on the table, BILLIONS were tossed away, all they needed was a 5 star hotel (or 3) and a massive casino offering all casino games as well as full sports betting menu.

BINGO !!!!

[Stillriledup]

BINGO !!!!

Right???

Doesn't seem like rocket science.

What these "scientists" did however was assume the general public was stupid and that they would keep patronzing AC, so they kept the "Ac Dream" alive at the detriment of putting a casino where people actually live (imagine that, putting a casino in the vicinity of where many people can take a short drive to)

They weren't visionaries....so, instead of getting all that revenue for THEIR state, they let residents of their state get their gaming fix elsewhere and look at AC now, its in shambles.

[Shemp Howard]

If its parlays card then screw that. If it straight bets, parlays, teasers, 1st half bets, 2nd half bets then you might have something.

Doubt a bookie like William Hill would mess around with parlay cards. That;s for school boys.

[bks]

Sports gambling is coming to NJ, it certainly appears. But not until the middle of October.

http://www.covers.com/articles/articles.aspx?theArt=385979

[Canarsie]

The type of bets at MP will not be limited to the Delaware Racino platform. Hill will allow as many types of wagering he can.

Futures? That would be the one type if bet I would drive to Monmouth for. There is zero chance of William Hill getting shut down via arrest and the money is in limbo a long time.

But if you went with a bookie you wouldn't have to pay off until the wager became a loser.

[Canarsie]

The feds are not happy with this move they are requesting more time to evaluate it, such the way gov't works these days. Dennis Drazin will make sure there will be no arrests for those making bets on the much coveted grounds of Monmouth Park. Arrests could also mean another black eye for Christie, who at this point needs no further attention drawn to him!

I would doubt that the bettor would ever get arrested I can't recall that ever happening. When the feds and NJ do their every other year stings only the bookie side gets popped.

But the question is will Drazin pay the attorney fees for the poor teller taking the bet gets cuffed.

My next question is if someone wants to make a wager will they still have to pay a parking and admission fee. What is their incentive to stay at the track if such a ridiculous policy is still in effect. As previously stated I was really pissed that they still were charging for parking and admission for the last three races. If you wager on a sports bet at least they should refund those taxes they charge. When the Meadowlands had a concert they charged $20 to park but as soon as you entered there were people (most times) readily available to refund the money.

[Canarsie]

Sports wagering is a nice revenue stream. I do understand your disgust with AC that's why their was a meeting recently that discussed casino expansion to Jersey City and the Meadowlands. NJ isn't dead they are just dealing with lots of problems past administrations left untouched!

Its more than "nice" if it was available using the phone or computer. In that case there would be a great chance of the state income tax being slashed along with a reduction in sales tax.

If that was the case I'm sure some of my friends who live out of state would call me (I know it would be illegal) to make wagers especially during football season. I wouldn't be the only one there would be MANY MANY others who will be asked to place bets. Its so easy to send and receive money these days the process would take less than five minutes for all the steps involved.

The phone and computer is a game changer just look how many people wager this way now. I've been to the Meadowlands and sitting next to a guy (not the only time) close to my age who tapped out. He just picked up his cell and I could hear him wagering for a race coming up. When it becomes that easy to deposit funds into your sports account real bookies are in big trouble and not from the feds.

[Canarsie]

If NJ opened a full casino in the Meadowlands area about 10 years ago, they would have made so much money they wouldn't be able to count it all. The just left SO much money on the table, BILLIONS were tossed away, all they needed was a 5 star hotel (or 3) and a massive casino offering all casino games as well as full sports betting menu.

Guess what? I agree with you 100%. Plus its right on Rt 3 people coming or going would say "lets stop there for an hour". Next to Aqueduct this is the best location in the country that would be used.

[onefast99]

If NJ opened a full casino in the Meadowlands area about 10 years ago, they would have made so much money they wouldn't be able to count it all. The just left SO much money on the table, BILLIONS were tossed away, all they needed was a 5 star hotel (or 3) and a massive casino offering all casino games as well as full sports betting menu.
As my signature says, a casino at the Meadowlands would have let NJ build a domed football stadium, bring in a major league baseball team and even bring back an NBA franchise. The money and possibilities were endless, but that ship sailed until the border casino wars took AC down!

[Stillriledup]

As my signature says, a casino at the Meadowlands would have let NJ build a domed football stadium, bring in a major league baseball team and even bring back an NBA franchise. The money and possibilities were endless, but that ship sailed until the border casino wars took AC down!

Its amazing how politics often get in the way of common sense. If big shots can't decide how to split the huge pie, they just leave that money on the table like stubborn brats.

The conversation would be a whole lot different if north jersey got full blown casino with a small portion of that going to the horse racing product. They would only need a very small portion to keep afloat, the pie to split would be massive.

[onefast99]

Its amazing how politics often get in the way of common sense. If big shots can't decide how to split the huge pie, they just leave that money on the table like stubborn brats.

The conversation would be a whole lot different if north jersey got full blown casino with a small portion of that going to the horse racing product. They would only need a very small portion to keep afloat, the pie to split would be massive.
25% of the casino revenue was a number I saw thrown around. Harness and TB split it equally. That would equate to $24m roughly in revenue for the horseman. There is a letter you can read that speaks of several different revenue sharing scenarios at http://www.monmouthpark.com/uploadedFiles/Horsemen/THA_Announcements/Letter%20from%20Dennis.pdf
enjoy.

[Stillriledup]

Guess what? I agree with you 100%. Plus its right on Rt 3 people coming or going would say "lets stop there for an hour". Next to Aqueduct this is the best location in the country that would be used.

I'm going to frame this as proof that you agreed with me once upon a time! :D

You're totally right about "lets stop here for an hour" and then that hour turns into 3, including dinner and souvenirs.

That place would be so packed that they could theoretically charge 10 bucks to park and 10 dollars admission and they would still have a full parking lot.

[Canarsie]

I'm going to frame this as proof that you agreed with me once upon a time! :D

You're totally right about "lets stop here for an hour" and then that hour turns into 3, including dinner and souvenirs.

That place would be so packed that they could theoretically charge 10 bucks to park and 10 dollars admission and they would still have a full parking lot.

I'm not deviating from my point since this topic was being discussed. It's all about location and Monmouth doesn't have that. In fact probably 90% of non horseplayers not familiar with Eatontown would drive by it (near on a highway or road) without noticing. You can't help seeing the Meadowlands and I can only imagine how many billboards would be used.There probably would be shuttles from Manhattan hotels getting you there and back with twice (my guess) an hour service. There would be others that would prefer staying in NJ with a car and take mass transit to the city.

We're back to disagreement on parking. When I used to frequent Yonkers the valet parking option was mandatory for me. Cost was $10 plus a $1 or $2 tip depending how fast they retrieved it. But I was absolutely shocked by the people who I hung out (regulars) with at the bar parked for free across the highway a walk of four or five blocks. Yonkers also has the free parking option but its a brisk walk that's even longer. One time it was so cold I drove one of the guys to his car after getting mine from valet. These were guys who bet fairly heavy yet cut corners on a convenience.

The fact still remains that Monmouth charges for parking and admission for the last three races proving they still don't have a clue. At worst charge $2 and then give you a voucher for the same amount. I really don't like talking about myself but there is no doubt in my mind I could assemble a team just from people on here and we would boost attendance and wagering by a fairly generous amount. The people running that show are only interested in a paycheck imo.

Notice Gural isn't interested in sports gambling, he's not stupid. Unless these Monmouth guys know a raid is coming up in the fall (its been around two years I think) by the feds it's destined to fail miserably. I hope I'm 100% WRONG on this, a Monmouth success story would be great for the state and the industry. I wouldn't mind eating crow on this at all.

[RunForTheRoses]

I'm going to frame this as proof that you agreed with me once upon a time! :D

You're totally right about "lets stop here for an hour" and then that hour turns into 3, including dinner and souvenirs.

That place would be so packed that they could theoretically charge 10 bucks to park and 10 dollars admission and they would still have a full parking lot.
I don't know if that place would be such a lets stop here type place, traffic is a total cluster****.

[onefast99]

I don't know if that place would be such a lets stop here type place, traffic is a total cluster****.
During the summer yes it is as there are several beach destinations as well as shopping and Pier Village that use the same hiway 36 to get there. Once Labor Day has come and gone the traffic isn't as bad. During the week there will be minor traffic up until the Monmouth Mall rt 35 junction after that it is fine.

[thespaah]

It isn't that easy. You have the southern NJ contingency who oppose any other casinos in the state. That has been the issue for years. Now they see their sand castles crumbling but still think AC is worth bailing out again. The Pegasus was to be the VLT center once the big M got the slots but now Gural has those rights. Should be interesting over the next 3 to 4 weeks.
South Jersey politicians who think there is a shred of hope AC will make it in the near future are nuts.
They are holding on. battling for the status quo( keeping gambling in AC only) for purely political reasons.
Those casino workers are a large part of their political constituency.
When they lose their jobs, there go the votes.

[RunForTheRoses]

During the summer yes it is as there are several beach destinations as well as shopping and Pier Village that use the same hiway 36 to get there. Once Labor Day has come and gone the traffic isn't as bad. During the week there will be minor traffic up until the Monmouth Mall rt 35 junction after that it is fine.

I meant Meadowlands which the others were referring to.

[onefast99]

I meant Meadowlands which the others were referring to.
New traffic patterns and wider roads at the Meadowlands didn't work for the super bowl and they won't work for more than one casino.

[dirty moose]

Did they take any bets this weekend?

[cj]

Did they take any bets this weekend?


http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1708207&postcount=14

[dirty moose]

Ty sir.