Reality for Luddites

[hcap]

Automation will totally change everything

/7Pq-S557XQU?

[098poi]

His voice sounded like it may have been computer generated.

[Capper Al]

Good video. We are well on the way. Part of this recovery problem has been that while the economy has recovered the jobs haven't followed in a traditional recovery pattern. Let's say a make believe widget manufacturer had sales return to what they were before 2008. And let's say it took 5 employees before 2008 to make 100 widgets a day. Now with automation it takes 3 to make the same amount of widgets, and two of those 3 jobs are oversees.

When we had the PC revolution back in the 90's, the French lowered the work week to 36 hours. This was the far and equitable thing to do, share the wealth with everyone. The French had to give it up because the rest of the world didn't join in.

[classhandicapper]

The US is going through a rough patch because we embraced free trade at a time when communism had just fallen and there were a billion or more people capable of doing manufacturing and other jobs for way less than the inflated union and other wages in the US. We dramatically increased the supply of labor without a corresponding increase in jobs.

Ultimately that giant "sucking sound" (in Ross Perot's words) will end when wages rise everywhere else in the world and ours have fallen to their free market level. At the same time, as others get wealthier they will be in a position to buy more from us. Then the US will become a better value proposition for investment capital in plants and manufacturing etc....again and jobs will grow faster.

The thing I find intellectually curious is why the left is so against this process. Much of the world is getting wealthier and slowly rising out of 3rd world status. IF the left is so concerned about world poverty they should be happy. Personally, I think we moved too fast in the right direction. We sold out a generation of our workers and gutted the country for global corporate profits. That made US investors wealthier, but left quite a mess everywhere else. IMO The world is doing the right thing, but at the wrong pace.

[Tom]

Resistance is futile.
Assimilation is certain.

[magwell]

Hcap, That was great it really shows that technology is evolving much faster than human evolution...........Thank You

[Tom]

This morning, on CNN, they were going on, amazed, that the cop in the St. Louis shooting had no cyber footprint- no one could find things about him.

That is scary.

[DJofSD]

Resistance is futile.
Assimilation is certain.
Bingo!

Next chapter, see "The Matrix."

[DJofSD]

This morning, on CNN, they were going on, amazed, that the cop in the St. Louis shooting had no cyber footprint- no one could find things about him.

That is scary.
That only proves the reporter is a lazy *sshole.

What, actually leave my desk and do things the old fashion way?

[hcap]

Hcap, That was great it really shows that technology is evolving much faster than human evolution...........Thank YouAbsolutely true. This is neither a right or left issue.
Rather a significant change for all of human society. The old ways are not going to work.

[Clocker]

According to a new report that looks at how continuing improvements to artificial intelligence and robotics will impact society, “robotic sex partners will become commonplace” by 2025. A large portion of the report also focuses on how AI and robotics will impact both blue- and white-collar workers, with about 50% of the polled experts stating that robots will displace more human jobs than they create by 2025.

Full story here. (http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/188047-by-2025-sexbots-will-be-commonplace-which-is-just-fine-as-well-all-be-unemployed-and-bored-thanks-to-robots-stealing-our-jobs)

[classhandicapper]

Absolutely true. This is neither a right or left issue.
Rather a significant change for all of human society. The old ways are not going to work.

People have been talking about machines, computers, robots, AI, etc... taking people's jobs for decades. It's all nonsense. These technological advances free humans to do OTHER productive things that create greater wealth and higher standards of living. The only economic constant is change. I have complete faith that idle human brilliance will come up with plenty of new things to do that we can't even imagine now.

[davew]

sad news indeed for people who dropped out of school and/or only capable of doing stuff like looting and protesting.

[hcap]

How about those "people" only capable of missing the point, making useless non-sequitures and are stuck babbling absurd right wing nonsensical rants :rolleyes:

[Tom]

How about those "people" only capable of missing the point, making useless non-sequitures

You could never automate the Senate.

[davew]

How about those "people" only capable of missing the point, making useless non-sequitures and are stuck babbling absurd right wing nonsensical rants :rolleyes:

these posts are made by bots (which are a proud union member of United Bots of America)

http://www.circleid.com/posts/20101017_united_states_is_the_most_bot_infected_co untry_right/

[Clocker]

You could never automate the Senate.

Are you actually claiming that Harry Reid is NOT an automaton?

[Capper Al]

People have been talking about machines, computers, robots, AI, etc... taking people's jobs for decades. It's all nonsense. These technological advances free humans to do OTHER productive things that create greater wealth and higher standards of living. The only economic constant is change. I have complete faith that idle human brilliance will come up with plenty of new things to do that we can't even imagine now.

Yes, we'll make it. However, we'll have to through some troubled times first. In the end, my bet is on the shorter work week and more leisure demand since we'll have more time off.

[badcompany]

People have been talking about machines, computers, robots, AI, etc... taking people's jobs for decades. It's all nonsense. These technological advances free humans to do OTHER productive things that create greater wealth and higher standards of living. The only economic constant is change. I have complete faith that idle human brilliance will come up with plenty of new things to do that we can't even imagine now.

I believe the government should've banned electricity from the start.

Think of how many more jobs we would have in the candle industry.

[Capper Al]

How we learn from the past is important. When the luddies were worried they miss read the facts. There was plenty of other work to get done and, still, the work week was shortened. The mistake that we can make today is to brush over the facts that automation is here and that we don't have to deal with it. It took two world wars, a great depression, and fear of communism to get us down from the 44 hour week to the 40.

[hcap]

The ultimate replacement
This is why everything will change even if we don't reach this final point.

Technological singularity
From Wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technological_singularity

The technological singularity, or simply the singularity, is the hypothesis that accelerating progress in technologies such as artificial intelligence will cause non-human intelligence to exceed human intelligence for the first time in history, causing human civilization to be radically changed or possibly destroyed. Because the capabilities of such an intelligence may be difficult for a human to comprehend, the technological singularity is often seen as an occurrence (akin to a gravitational singularity) beyond which the forthcoming course of human history would be unpredictable or even unfathomable

http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/feb/22/robots-google-ray-kurzweil-terminator-singularity-artificial-intelligence

Are the robots about to rise? Google's new director of engineering thinks so…
Ray Kurzweil popularised the Teminator-like moment he called the 'singularity', when artificial intelligence overtakes human thinking. But now the man who hopes to be immortal is involved in the very same quest – on behalf of the tech behemoth

..And now? Now, he works at Google. Ray Kurzweil who believes that we can live for ever and that computers will gain what looks like a lot like consciousness in a little over a decade is now Google's director of engineering. The announcement of this, last year, was extraordinary enough. To people who work with tech or who are interested in tech and who are familiar with the idea that Kurzweil has popularised of "the singularity" – the moment in the future when men and machines will supposedly converge – and know him as either a brilliant maverick and visionary futurist, or a narcissistic crackpot obsessed with longevity, this was headline news in itself.

[incoming]

Oh, No!!!! I think we are on the road to oblivion....again. What we need is a good government program to cut this thing off at the pass. ;)

[hcap]

Oh, No!!!! I think we are on the road to oblivion....again. What we need is a good government program to cut this thing off at the pass. ;)Too late. Everyone both the private sector and government is moving in this direction. Profit motive up the gazoo.

[incoming]

I'm doomed, between AI and global warming I don't have a prayer.

[Tom]

I think what we have here Artificial Warming and what we lack is Global Intelligence.

[Robert Goren]

You could never automate the Senate.But you can automate your bets at Twinspires provided you aren't from that bastion of freedom, Texas.

[davew]

I'm doomed, between AI and global warming I don't have a prayer.

I predict you will not make it to your thousandth birthday (unless you freeze your head in liquid nitrogen).

[incoming]

I predict you will not make it to your thousandth birthday (unless you freeze your head in liquid nitrogen).

If I did freeze my head, a compassionate liberal would come by and chip me out with an ice pick. ;)

[Clocker]

If I did freeze my head, a compassionate liberal would come by and chip me out with an ice pick. ;)

If you did freeze your head, a compassionate liberal would welcome you to the Democratic Party and offer you some Kool Aid.

[classhandicapper]

You could never automate the Senate.

Yes you could.

First you would need to artificially produce the intelligence of a flea, lower it by 20%, make it corrupt, and then set it loose.

[hcap]

Automation, is accelerating exponentially, as the video I posted originally indicated. The final result may be AI, and I posted the info about the technological singularity to show the extent that even highly skilled computer professionals can be replaced. And business is jumping in.

Profits used to be bandied about here as the God of PA off topic. Why then such a damn stupid reaction here is beyond me.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/innovations/wp/2014/03/25/artificial-intelligence-is-the-next-big-tech-trend-heres-why/

Artificial intelligence is the next big tech trend. Here’s why.

[hcap]

http://dupress.com/articles/from-exponential-technologies-to-exponential-innovation/

From exponential technologies to exponential innovation

SUMMARY

Exponential improvement in core digital technologies is fueling exponential innovation. The cost-performance of three core digital technology building blocks—computing power, storage, and bandwidth—has been improving at an exponential rate for many years. As the rate of improvement accelerates, we are experiencing rapid advances in the innovations built on top of these core “exponential” technologies. The current pace of technological advance is unprecedented in history and shows no signs of stabilizing as other historical technological innovations, such as electricity, eventually did.

The continuing exponential cost-performance improvement of core digital technologies is unprecedented in history. The interactions among these digital pillars amplify their disruptive potential......

[Capper Al]

If you did freeze your head, a compassionate liberal would welcome you to the Democratic Party and offer you some Kool Aid.

You are one of the biggest Kool Aid drinkers that I know and, it's not from the left. It's from the right. Try thinking for a while. Consent of our political system must come from voting. The ruling class needs their citizens to consent to their wishes. They have to give you a stream of reasoning to see things their way. They can't come out and say any of the following:


We don't want to pay for your health care.
We don't want to pay for your children's education.
We don't want to provide you a social safety network.


They have to make it your idea. So thus through efforts made by the likes of Fox news, you get the kool aid and think you understand it your way but in the end it's really their way. :lol:

[Tom]

Thanks for the example of a frozen head, Al.:ThmbUp:

[hcap]

Thanks for the example of a frozen head, Al.:ThmbUp:
The only frozen heads here
http://www.eastravel.co.uk/japan/images/the_famous_snow_monkeys_000.jpg

[classhandicapper]

They have to make it your idea. So thus through efforts made by the likes of Fox news, you get the kool aid and think you understand it your way but in the end it's really their way. :lol:

Suppose you've listened to the Kool Aid from both sides, think almost everyone of FOS, observed how the world really works, and independently came to a rather extreme conclusion one way or the other. I'm a libertarian (which is certainly not mainstream), but no one's Kool Aid got me there. I got there on my own and then started seeking out similar minded people for greater insight.

[hcap]

Suppose you've listened to the Kool Aid from both sides, think almost everyone of FOS, observed how the world really works, and independently came to a rather extreme conclusion one way or the other. I'm a libertarian (which is certainly not mainstream), but no one's Kool Aid got me there. I got there on my own and then started seeking out similar minded people for greater insight.But yet as usual you resort to poloitical cover and deny the evidence for major effects of automation. pretending as you gents do as on AGS, that it all is liberal scaremongering

[Tom]

The only frozen heads here

Nope - that's a hot springs pool.
We cook potatoes in it, too.
mmm mmmmm mmmmmmm!

[hcap]

Nope - that's a hot springs pool.
We cook potatoes in it, too.
mmm mmmmm mmmmmmm! Ice does not equal hot springs.

Once again confused on temps as you are on automation.

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/ca10BuVvWxQ/hqdefault.jpg

[Tom]

Smart bird....must be fracking.

[Clocker]

But yet as usual you resort to poloitical cover and deny the evidence for major effects of automation. pretending as you gents do as on AGS, that it all is liberal scaremongering

Automation is increasing, and it is happening at the cost of jobs. Most of those jobs currently are lower level, low skill jobs. And one of the drivers of that trend is the political policies of those liberals you mention.

As usual, Europe is ahead of the US socially. As minimum wages increase there, more and more labor is being replaced by machines. A major recent trend is automation in the fast food industry. Many back room jobs, like flipping burgers or filling drinks, are being replaced by machines. And front counter jobs, like taking orders, are also being eliminated. More and more, customers use kiosks to key in their orders and pay for their food. Even traditional "full-service" restaurants are implementing table top consoles to take orders and accept payment.

This technology is starting to appear in this country. We will see more and more of it as minimum wages increase and as labor costs are driven up by ObamaCare and other government mandates.

[classhandicapper]

But yet as usual you resort to poloitical cover and deny the evidence for major effects of automation. pretending as you gents do as on AGS, that it all is liberal scaremongering

Sometimes I wonder if you even read what people say before spouting off your nonsense.

I think future technology will have significant economic and possibly social impacts. I'm just not worried about it because technological advances have been doing that for centuries. There are always SHORT TERM winners and losers with change, but the advances free up human resources to do more productive things and move mankind forward in aggregate. That will happen again this time. You are underestimating the brilliance of the small percentage of motivated human beings we are blessed with. At your core it appears you are afraid of change, be it weather, technology, or anything else, even when it's for the better.

[Capper Al]

Thanks for the example of a frozen head, Al.:ThmbUp:

As usual, nothing said just name calling.

[Tom]

As ye sow, so shall ye reap.

[incoming]

Sometimes I wonder if you even read what people say before spouting off your nonsense.

I think future technology will have significant economic and possibly social impacts. I'm just not worried about it because technological advances have been doing that for centuries. There are always SHORT TERM winners and losers with change, but the advances free up human resources to do more productive things and move mankind forward in aggregate. That will happen again this time. You are underestimating the brilliance of the small percentage of motivated human beings we are blessed with. At your core it appears you are afraid of change, be it weather, technology, or anything else, even when it's for the better.

Well said :ThmbUp:

[TJDave]

So...what's gonna happen to these millions of these displaced workers?

The government will pay their salaries.

That's right boys & girls, the inevitable conclusion to automation is pure socialism.

[Capper Al]

As ye sow, so shall ye reap.

Empty again. When one knocks on your head they can hear an echo. Nothing instead. The sound of a tom-tom drum. So fitting!

[Tom]

Talking to Al is like playing peek a boo with a baby.
He has no clue what is going on, but keeps on playing.:lol:

[Capper Al]

Talking to Al is like playing peek a boo with a baby.
He has no clue what is going on, but keeps on playing.:lol:

Knock, knock, who's there? Tom-tom. Nobody home. It's empty.

[hcap]

Sometimes I wonder if you even read what people say before spouting off your nonsense.

I think future technology will have significant economic and possibly social impacts. I'm just not worried about it because technological advances have been doing that for centuries. There are always SHORT TERM winners and losers with change, but the advances free up human resources to do more productive things and move mankind forward in aggregate. That will happen again this time. You are underestimating the brilliance of the small percentage of motivated human beings we are blessed with. At your core it appears you are afraid of change, be it weather, technology, or anything else, even when it's for the better.I have read your reply. You are wrong. The current acceleration in technological development is very different then what was and will increase exponentially. Your old line approach is a total misunderstanding of what will be in the 21st century. The few that will avoid the total alteration brought about by automation will be either off the grid in self sustainable niche positions, or in less developed third world countries, or the very rich who do not work The labor market as we know it today will almost disappear in the west. The structural changes in human work began in the 90's and is rapidly changing. If you payed attention to any of the evidence posted instead of listening to yourself go on with political truisms-as usual-you would see beyond your cliched thinking.

The moneyed class will of course suffer less.

[Robert Goren]

In the past, technology has created more jobs than it took away. I am beginning to think that in the past few years that it is not creating enough new jobs to keep up with increasing population. This may be why job growth as not been as rapid as in the past in recovering from the recession of 2008.
Like it or not, technology is not a genie that you can put back in the jar

[NJ Stinks]

At your core it appears you are afraid of change, be it weather, technology, or anything else, even when it's for the better.

You remind me of a manager whose pitcher is getting bombed but the manager won't take the pitcher out because the pitcher had a decent ERA going in to the game. :jump: