1920 Days off Between Races

[MONEY]

I just saw this.
Today 07/01/14

Tampa R1. #1, ML 3/1, has 1920 days off since last race.
That's 5 years and 3 months.

The horse "Coastal Empire" is 11 years old.

Whatever happens in this race, I think it's wrong to bring
a horse back to racing after that much time off.

[LottaKash]

I just saw this.
Today 07/01/14

Tampa R1. #1, ML 3/1, has 1920 days off since last race.
That's 5 years and 3 months.

The horse "Coastal Empire" is 11 years old.

Whatever happens in this race, I think it's wrong to bring
a horse back to racing after that much time off.

Why would you think that wrong ?...Just curious is all...

From my own opinion tho, some horses love to race, regardless of age... They were born and bred to do it...:jump:

Harness horses "must" retire when they are 14....There were many harness horses that were still winning races when they were forced to retire...

[MONEY]

I think that it's wrong because of the five years off.

Had the horse been running a few races a year, I would have no problem
with his age.

[MONEY]

Finished last of 7 in a $5,000 1y.

[Tor Ekman]

But I'm guessing he had fun romping around the track . . . kinda like when the White Sox brought Minnie Miñoso back for one last game at age 54

[PressThePace]

I think that it's wrong because of the five years off.

Had the horse been running a few races a year, I would have no problem
with his age.

I have the same opinion...what does the horse have to prove at eleven years of age and over 5 years on the sidelines? It would be different if the horse was still producing, but that's obviously not the case.

[whodoyoulike]

And, about $5,500 was bet in W P S of the total $44,000 (12.5%). Final odds were about (5-1) M/L was (3-1), I guess $5,500 doesn't mean much.

[Appy]

11 years old is not old for a horse, depending on how he has lived them. I think the Planet of the Apes mentality that "horses are a commodity" attitude so prevalent today lends itself to burning horses out mentally and physically by the relatively tender age of 3,4, or 5. If conditional racing and drug laws (and enforcement!) were applied with a horse first mindset, there would be built-in incentive to care for horses in such a way as to optimize elongated equine careers, rather than the "most we can get as fast as we can get it" business model.
When I first began studying to become a trainer I was immediately hit with a barrage of advice, headlined by Rule #1; DO NOT FALL IN LOVE WITH YOUR HORSE. In other words, horses are nothing but inventory to turn over. Get whatever you can out of them as quickly as you can, then get some more to ruin. The result of that system is a steady stream of trailer traffic to the killers in Canada and Mexico.

That is why I propose multi-tiered Triple Crown series and trainer barn size limits, among other things, to help change the mindset from people with horses to a horse first attitude.

I have a 26 year old mare who still runs and plays daily just like the youngsters. She once worked as the lead horse for my pack string in the mountains.
Take care of your horse and your horse will take care of you.

[LottaKash]

Finished last of 7 in a $5,000 1y.

In all fairness to the truth, do you honestly believe that he was supposed to win right out of the box after that long hiatus from racing ?...

Even a Lance Armstrong type wouldn't be expected to win either in a similar comeback....

To be fair to the truth, I would say one would have to watch a few races before any fair conclusions could be drawn about the comeback....

As long as the horse in not lame or being abused, what is the harm ?...

[therussmeister]

Finished last of 7 in a $5,000 1y.
He needs to find a race for non-winners of one in the last 5 years.

[nijinski]

He needs a new career , so did this gelding .

Stormy Surge (LA)


DK B/, G, foaled May 2, 2003

( Stormy Atlantic - Miss Fabulous, by Pentelicus)

Unfortunately

he broke down during training in January .
Let's be real, there is no comparing standardbreds and
thoroughbreds .

[Longshot6977]

Harness horses "must" retire when they are 14....There were many harness horses that were still winning races when they were forced to retire...

Is this true? I never heard of the age limit to retire. Ya learn something new every day.
By the way, is there a T-bred age limit?

[JackS]

Of course you could look at like this- The horses feeding and vet bills are probably the same as the 4-5yo in the next stall. Horses like people have to earn their way through this world. If the owner is an unknown, the horse maybe someones pet and an automatic toss. If the horse has been entered by a respected trainer he may deserve a bet although not at 3 or 5-1.

[Knowclew]

Is this true? I never heard of the age limit to retire. Ya learn something new every day.
By the way, is there a T-bred age limit?

Yes, in the US it is 13.

[chadk66]

11 years old is not old for a horse, depending on how he has lived them. I think the Planet of the Apes mentality that "horses are a commodity" attitude so prevalent today lends itself to burning horses out mentally and physically by the relatively tender age of 3,4, or 5. If conditional racing and drug laws (and enforcement!) were applied with a horse first mindset, there would be built-in incentive to care for horses in such a way as to optimize elongated equine careers, rather than the "most we can get as fast as we can get it" business model.
When I first began studying to become a trainer I was immediately hit with a barrage of advice, headlined by Rule #1; DO NOT FALL IN LOVE WITH YOUR HORSE. In other words, horses are nothing but inventory to turn over. Get whatever you can out of them as quickly as you can, then get some more to ruin. The result of that system is a steady stream of trailer traffic to the killers in Canada and Mexico.


That is why I propose multi-tiered Triple Crown series and trainer barn size limits, among other things, to help change the mindset from people with horses to a horse first attitude.

I have a 26 year old mare who still runs and plays daily just like the youngsters. She once worked as the lead horse for my pack string in the mountains.
Take care of your horse and your horse will take care of you.

there is a ton of truth in what you just posted.

[HuggingTheRail]

Some regions, they may have just been waiting for the race to fill....

[pandy]

He needs to find a race for non-winners of one in the last 5 years.


Exactly.

[Dave Schwartz]

But I'm guessing he had fun romping around the track . . . kinda like when the White Sox brought Minnie Miñoso back for one last game at age 54

I remember that game! Don't recall what he did but it was a publicity stunt.

Same with Satchel Page, as I recall.

[therussmeister]

Of course you could look at like this- The horses feeding and vet bills are probably the same as the 4-5yo in the next stall. Horses like people have to earn their way through this world. If the owner is an unknown, the horse maybe someones pet and an automatic toss. If the horse has been entered by a respected trainer he may deserve a bet although not at 3 or 5-1.
Trained by William Grainger for owner Grainger Farms. Mr. Grainger's record this year is 3-0-0-0. Before this year his last starter was in 2007.

[castaway01]

I remember that game! Don't recall what he did but it was a publicity stunt.

Same with Satchel Page, as I recall.

Minoso played three games in 1976 and then had a couple at-bats in 1980 (at age 54) so he could say he'd played in five decades (he debuted in 1949). In 1976 he did get one hit in eight at-bats. He also got one at-bat in the minors in 1993 and again in 2003 (at age 77), so I guess he's up to seven decades.

Paige threw three shutout innings for the Kansas City A's at age 58.

Good memory Dave.

[JohnGalt1]

I have no problem with this as long as the horse healthy and approved by a vet.

What I shake my head at is anybody betting real money on no chance horses like Rick's Natural Star to win the BC Classic and this one.

[iceknight]

I have no problem with this as long as the horse healthy and approved by a vet.

What I shake my head at is anybody betting real money on no chance horses like Rick's Natural Star to win the BC Classic and this one.I looked it up - that's a gem!! It was BC Turf -Gr I, but nonetheless your point is absolutely taken. I am surprised (no completely SHOCKED) they entered the horse into BC after his long lay off and straight from the 3.5k claiming ranks at Ruidoso!
What is worse is that someone entered him into a 870 yd QH Race (http://www.equibase.com/profiles/Results.cfm?type=Horse&refno=1253059&registry=T) after the BC debacle... is that even possible?

[CosmicWon]

There's a 13yo mare entered in R6 ($4k n1y) at ELP Friday. The old girl did the little 4race Ellis stint last yr and ran 2nd by a head 3rd off the bench but was off the board in her other races.

I remember being concerned for her opening day last year but she was ultimately sound and fine though I'll not speculate on her 3 yr layoff from 2009-2012...

She still has no recorded works in 2014--and didn't know about the 13yo retirement "rule"? for tbreds--so wouldn't be surprised if she's a scratch. (Frankly, if there's forced retirement age from racing maybe one for breeding would be appropriate too because pregnant 23yo mares seems unsavory but I digress.)

I like cheering for the old hickory war horses as long as they're sound and not raced to the point of exploitation or disregard. We have 18yo horses jumping 5'5" in the Olympics and no one bats an eye.

It'll all about how well managed and cared for a horse is and I think Texas Gold Digger on Friday is more pet than anything and won't be running if, as we'd say at Hagyard, she's ADR ("ain't doin right").

[nijinski]

CE had five races between 2008 and 2009 . The last was in a 35,000 cl .

He stopped in this last race while in for a 5,000 tag . Stinks to me not
the kind of racing I care to support .

[nijinski]

There's a 13yo mare entered in R6 ($4k n1y) at ELP Friday. The old girl did the little 4race Ellis stint last yr and ran 2nd by a head 3rd off the bench but was off the board in her other races.

I remember being concerned for her opening day last year but she was ultimately sound and fine though I'll not speculate on her 3 yr layoff from 2009-2012...

She still has no recorded works in 2014--and didn't know about the 13yo retirement "rule"? for tbreds--so wouldn't be surprised if she's a scratch. (Frankly, if there's forced retirement age from racing maybe one for breeding would be appropriate too because pregnant 23yo mares seems unsavory but I digress.)

I like cheering for the old hickory war horses as long as they're sound and not raced to the point of exploitation or disregard. We have 18yo horses jumping 5'5" in the Olympics and no one bats an eye.

It'll all about how well managed and cared for a horse is and I think Texas Gold Digger on Friday is more pet than anything and won't be running if, as we'd say at Hagyard, she's ADR ("ain't doin right").

She was in foal during her layoff .